cat just had teeth extracted and some issues followed...

[jackal2001]

Hello,
I'm hoping someone can give me some insight as I want a second opinion to my vets.   My 9 year old cat just got home yesterday from having oral surgery to have some teeth extracted.  He had this done 3 years ago and had no issues then.
1. When I got him back yesterday, his 3rd eyelid was closed in his right eye.  The Dr. told me this could be normal sometimes due to the extractions and should go away in 3 days or so.  My research on the internet only found a few cases of this and it didn't look so good.  They said if it didn't go away they could treat it with pregnazone I think but they didn't want to do it the same day he was released. I am concerned this will not go away as it is 2 days after his actual surgery and he still has it.
2.  If he shakes his head, he immediatly falls over on the right side.
3.  He hasn't eaten or drank anything in almost 24hrs now.

I am going to try and give him his oral antibiotics later today.

I am very concerned with my cats health and I am feeling that he is worse off than when he went in.  He had none of these issues other than licking his nose which indicated to me he was having issues with his teeth again.

[D_Vita]

I know this thread is old, but does anyone know if the kitty with horners recovered and how long it took? My guy also has it as a result of dental work

[krrobu]

I'm not sure if anyone will read this since the original post is several years old, but I want to say how grateful I am that the original post was made. My cat developed Horner's Syndrome after a recent dental cleaning, and if it weren't for this post I never would have known what it was my called. My vet denies it was the result of the cleaning and we're also paying for various tests and visits. While I understand there are risks with any procedure, I would respect my vet more for admitting the possibility. He didn't even mention Horner's Syndrome and seemed surprised when I brought it up. He's thinking toxoplasmosis. I've read the symptoms and only a few of the long list fit. Where'd he get it since he's an indoor cat? Was it latent and present at birth - perhaps (according to the vet). We'll see what the results show. Supposedly it takes 5 days. Interestingly, they recommend treatment for toxo begins as soon as possible (before 5 days). Symptoms present in my cat- won't eat, but wants to, will not drink. His voice is markedly different. He was unbalanced for several days after the cleaning; his third eyelid is prolapsed; pupil in the affected eye is constricted and his eye slightly sunken. My suggestion to anyone reading is to closely monitor your kitty even after just a regular cleaning procedure. Specifically, look at their eyes. If you think something is off, you're probably correct. You know your cat's behavior the best. I like my vet. I didn't accuse him of any "malpractice", but be informed. While I do believe my vet should be covering all the additional expenses for tests, meds and visits (I also went to a pet ER), I doubt any vet would accept responsibility, sadly. It is now 6 days post cleaning and the only improvement is his coordination. He's on prednisone for his eye, and a med to help his appetite (again, he wants to eat, but when he eats the dry food it falls out of his mouth - we've been through numerous brands and types shredded, pate, etc, dry and wet, as well as baby food), and a pain med given by the Pet ER. Anyone experiencing the same with their kitty, DO NOT give up. Question and research. Thank goodness jackal2001 posted. I'm grateful for this post/forum.

[krrobu]

I'm not sure if anyone will read this since the original post is several years old, but I want to say how grateful I am that the original post was made. My cat developed Horner's Syndrome after a recent dental cleaning, and if it weren't for this post I never would have known what it was my called. My vet denies it was the result of the cleaning and we're also paying for various tests and visits. While I understand there are risks with any procedure, I would respect my vet more for admitting the possibility. He didn't even mention Horner's Syndrome and seemed surprised when I brought it up. He's thinking taxoplasmosis. I've read the symptoms and only a few of the long list fit. Where'd he get it since he's an indoor cat? Was it latent and present at birth - perhaps (according to the vet). We'll see what the results show. Supposedly it takes 5 days. Interestingly, they recommend treatment for toxo begins as soon as possible (before 5 days). Symptoms present in my cat- wouldn't eat, but wants to, will not drink. His voice is markedly different. He was unbalanced for several days after the cleaning; his third eyelid is prolapsed; pupil in the affected eye is constricted and his eye slightly sunken. My suggestion to anyone reading is to closely monitor your kitty even after just a regular cleaning procedure. Specifically, look at their eyes. If you think something is off, you're probably correct. You know your cat's behavior the best. I like my vet. I didn't accuse him of any "malpractice", but be informed. While I do believe my vet should be covering all the additional expenses for tests, meds and visits (I also went to a pet ER), I doubt any vet would accept responsibility, sadly. It is now 6 days post cleaning and the only improvement is his coordination. He's on prednisone for his eye, and a med to help his appetite (again, he wants to eat, but when he eats the dry food it falls out of his mouth - we've been through numerous brands, dry and wet, as well as tried baby food), and apain med given by the Pet ER. Anyone experiencing the same with their kitty, DO NOT give up. Question and research. Thank goodness jackal2001 posted. I'm grateful for this post/forum.

[krrobu]

Update - toxoplasmosis test came back negative (as I expected it would). Vet doesn't acknowledge Horner's Syndrome symptoms. Thinks the cat has an aversion to eating (the cat WANTS to eat). The cat's pupil is still constricted, but the third eyelid is not as pronounced as it had been - vet said stop the prednisone eye drops. Still can't eat dry food & eye is still sunken. His voice is getting better, but not quite the same. This is no eating aversion.

[krrobu]

Day 17 - went for a second opinion because my cat is still having trouble ea

[krrobu]

Eating. Horner's Syndrome it is. This vet said it could take 6 months to recover and there is no guarantee it will be 100% complete. We are now on oral prednisolone and not appetite stimulants (the vet agrees the appetite stimulants were frustrating my cat because he doesn't have an appetite problem) he isnt able to use his mouth/tongue effectively to eat due to whatever is going on with the nerves/Horner's Syndrome. Kitty lost weight and the focus is on getting him to ingest enough nutrients to keep him healthy and at least maintain his weight and keep him hydrated.because he has a murmur we have to monitor his breathing while taking the prednisolone.

[krrobu]

Another update to give hope to people who encounter this problem, if anyone comes across this post - We're now 2 months out and kitty is improving. He's picking up weight, finally. Still has a difficult time eating kibble - and dry food is his absolute favorite so it's sad to watch him continue to struggle. His balance is almost normal, but every once in a while (once a day or every other), he misses the target when jumping onto or from something. He no longer appears to have trouble opening his jaw to yawn. Before it seemed to ratchet or hinge when opening and only would open part of the way. I still see minor pupil constriction - I learned it isn't the pupil that looks to be constricted, but it's actually the other pupil that doesn't constrict the same (stays more dilated). Kitty is off meds - no oral prednisolone. The murmur, detected during the earlier Pet ER visit but not by regular vet, is still present. At this point we don't know if it was always present (we used the same vet since we adopted him as a kitten at 8 weeks).

[Jrzcat]

Thank you for sharing your experience. I hope your kitty fully recovered and you found a new vet. I'm here because my guy had extractions and is sneezing and sounding stuffy.  Vet sent us home with 3days of pain meds - this is the start of day two and I wish the cat was more comfortable.  Never schedule surgery on a Friday...

[opus88]

hi...I am so sorry for all that you and your kitty are enduring, what we sometimes think is just a simple surgery can lead to all sorts of problems..not only for our kitties but for us as well :(

I can't offer any explanations as to all what happened but I do just want to mention that quite often when the third eye lid is showing its a symptom of pain and not of anything exactly gone wrong with the eye itself, this is just my opinion but if I were you I would let well enough alone and see if this clears on its own now that he is eating well and no other problems....if it is due to some pain he experienced this too should go away on its own..
don't know what the Vets would do to 'repair' a third eye? I would hate to see him undergo yet another surgery just yet especially when the Vets you are working with "don't seem to have a clue how to treat it"

but when in doubt always seek a second opinion of a qualified Vet. Good luck to poor kitty, keep us posted okay

[Stevie2014]

Wow, I am so glad I stumbled across this blog because I am going through the same thing with my cat. It started with a big bump on his right ear that broke open and had to be cut off. They offered a teeth cleaning with the surgery... They thought it was skin cancer. Then some bumps came back and he got those cut out. After his nose started running and he was sneezing like crazy. Then the left eye starting watering. Well another big bump came back, so under he went again to have the entire ear removed. He came home with his face all jacked up, and his 3rd eye is showing. He's a mess. He went  in for a simple teeth cleaning and to have the tip of his ear removed and now he is a sick cat. Who knows what he got from the other sick animals in there, or if the surgeon screwed up. All I know is he was a perfectly healthy cat of 16 years, with a bump on his ear and now he sufferers from other issues due to the teeth cleaning. I am $3,000 into this mess. He has been on antibiotics twice and this time he's eating like crazy which tells me he is ok, just the eye watering and 3rd eye need repair... I am trying to find a web-site to give me info on why the 3rd eye and how to treat it to go away because the vet doesn't seem to have a clue. I'm with you Jackal2001 they are covering their *** because something went wrong with both are kitties. And you have every right to be angry. The car analogy was perfect.

[Isisells]

Check out the VetBlog at http://tovet.blogspot.com/2007/07/horners-syndrome.html for 51 pages of excellent information on Horner's Syndrome. This Toronto vet considers middle ear infection to be one of the main causes of Horner's Syndrome.  A middle ear infection is not discernable by an ear exam, the vet must order an xray of the bullae, the bones of the middle ear. and if this doesn't show anything, have an MRI or CT scan of the same region and an xray of the chest.  If the pet has staggering and falling as well, the thoractic region of the spine should be xrayed, or scanned by MRI or CT. Horner's Syndrome can also result from bad teeth infecting the middle ear and causing HS.   Get the whole story on this blog;you'll feel much better than you did when you didn't know about this.

[Isisells]

My cat has Horner's Syndrome and won't eat his regular food.  We have run out of Science Diet's a/d for cats in crisis, which should be fed only intermittently anyway, so I had to go back to the regular diet.  I tried making a soup out of his Royal Canin "Intense Beauty" thin slices of meat in gravy by adding water to the food while processing it in a blender.  I'm sure a food processor would work as well.  It reduced to a soup and he ate it!  This is for all the worried owners whose pets won't eat or drink as usual.  

[MommyV35]

I had an 11 year old male Cat that had to be briefly sedated due to an extremely infected anal gland, that would have caused too much pain to clean out the infection without sedation. He was put in a small clear plastic container with a place for an oxygyn tube and a tube for the anesthesia. He was only under for a few minutes but was never able to fully recover. His pupils stayed dilated and he was off balance, lethargic, no appetite, would only walk a couple of feet and fall over and cry out. I took him back to the Vet several days in a row to get IV Fluids etc, but unfortunantly after 5 days I had to euthanize. Sometimes as with humans even with normal labs and bloodwork there can still be serious complications depending on the feline. I have several Cats that have had various procedures that required sedation and that was the only one that ever had such a reaction.

[duranca]

Hi!  Thanks so much for writing.  I had already sent Jackal a direct message in addition to my post.  

My cat, Tigger, is almost 10 and just had 5 teeth extracted.  He was a mess when I picked him up.  Like Jackal's cat, Tigger developed Horner's syndrome, but only in his left eye.  It causes that third (inner) eyelid to rise, and the pupil is constricted. According to some info online, the problem usually resolves itself in a couple of months.  I hope this is true, because Tigger's eye looks droopy and he looks a bit disfigured.  

Also, like Jackal's cat, Tigger won't eat his regular food.  Finally got him to eat a Premium cracker yesterday.  He really reacted when he saw the bag of dry food so I put some of the food in a bowl and let it soften in water for a bit. I was relieved that he ate some of it. Today, I followed the same diet, crackers and moistened dry food.  He's not eating nearly as much as I'd like, but he's eating, so I'll take that for now.      

[opus88]

hi and welcome, you posted a question on an old post, almost from a year ago....maybe if you sent Jackal a private message you would get a reply...I don't think she's a regular on this forum anymore and won't see your question.

I hope your kitty has recovered by now for you?.....the balance issues should have resolved by now and as far as his eyes, do you mean they are dilated? this could be caused by the drug atropine used commonly during surgery to regulate the heart, and if this is the cause the eyes should return to normal as soon as the drug effects have worn off...

I hope her mouth is feeling better now, it will take a few days, give her soft foods that she enjoys...very important to keep her eating at least small amounts, her mouth should feel normal within a few days of the extractions.....is/was she on something for pain?

best to you both♥

[duranca]

Hi Jackal, I've read your discussion and your situation sounds eerily familiar to what I'm going through with my own cat now.  My cat is 9 and 1/2 years of age and I just took him for his first dental and he had to have 5 teeth extracted.  Like your cat, my cat developed Horner's sydrome in his left eye and he is having balancing issues.  I'm not too worried about the balancing issues since it hasn't quite been 48 hours since his dental procedure, but can you please tell me when your cat finally returned to eating normal amounts of food?  Also, please advise if/when your cat's eyes returned to normal.  Any insight you can thrown my way would be greatly appreciated.  I am quite worried.  
-Carole

[Jade59]

I'm so happy to hear your cat is eating!  That's the most important thing right now.  You sound like you know exactly what you're doing.  It's okay kitty doesn't eat hard food anymore.  There's been a lot of discussions about diet on this forum and it seems wet food is much better anyway...kitty needs the moisture and since cats don't normally drink a lot of water, this is a good way to keep those crystals from forming.  

[jackal2001]

We have gotten one can of Hills a/d just incase.  It states right on the can to use intermittently only.  We didn't open it yet.
Yes I know that Science Diet is as bad as all the other brands.

We did go to the store and got him some fancy feast.  He ate a 1/3 can last night with no problems.  This morning I gave him a nother 1/3 can and he ate most of it.

After years of eating nothing but good foods, I would hate to have him go solely back on fancy feast, but I will if I have to.

His solid gold, tiki cat, I also tried avoderm, etc are very soft foods as well.  I just don't know why he isn't eating them anymore.  Maybe because the vet gave him that hills a/d  now he wants the junk food.

Back when he had teeth and was eating dry food, the only good dry food that I was able to have him eat regulary was Taste of the Wild Rocky Mountain:  http://www.tasteofthewildpetfood.com/products/cats/rocky_mountain_feline_formula/

Now he won't be eating dry food anymore, so I will have to feed him whatever he eats and then slowly putting the good food along side of some commercial food later on and see if he starts eating the good stuff again.

[nancyjac]

I don't want to hijack jackal's thread into a discussion of the relative merits of different types of cat foods.  My only intent was to suggest a nutrient and calorie dense food that is easy to chew and digest given the particular's of his cat's current situation.  Different cats have different needs and even the same cat may have different needs under different circumstances.

[opus88]

I too will clarify, I was not talking at all about dry foods, except to make a comparison of how high dry foods are in carbs....besides IMO dry foods are the worst thing we can be feeding our pets.
the protien in dry food which is heavily plant based is NOT equal in quality to the protein in canned food which is meat based...Dry foods are water depleted and cause kidney and bladder diseases among other health problems, they are sprayed heavily with deadly chemicals as preservatives.

But thats another topic, in my original post I was referring to can foods and in the second paragraph I mention that not all can foods are necessarily low in carbs.

Hill's A/D has 15% carbs .(non prescription 24%) Yes the A/D is alot lower than many canned foods on the market.
however there are some that are lower still.
such as EVO or Wysong's Au Jus which have 3%
Wellness Core I believe has 0 grains, but I'm just going on memory here.

As far as amino acids thats included in all cat foods that I'm aware of in the form of Taurine, has to be or cats would be going blind and or have heart problems. And taurine is the most important of all the amino acids, many of the others such as glutamate, glycine, proline & serine are non essential.

Not trying to argue specifics with you Nancy...this is not my intention at all, we can all learn from each other and I value your opinions as I hope you do mine.

I'm sure many kittens do thrive on Hills A/D, because it is lower in carbs than many other can foods on the market you're right...and I'm sure the nutrient content too  would be excellent. also the moisture/fat levels are similar  as with others in the better brands.
and you are very correct when you say when eating a high quality food they only need a very small amount in comparison to what they would need of a lower quality food.

my whole point of adding my post was to state that HILL's isn't necessarily one of the best ones on the market. and as Jade remarked not all cats will eat it, I know none of mine ever would. perhaps if they were started on it as a kitten it would be different (?)

I only hope that Jackal is able to get his kitty eating and healthy once again. And I believe we are all trying to help him out with our suggestions......

[nancyjac]

Let me clarify:

I was referring to the a/d canned food, not a dry food.  All dry foods are high in carbs (which isn't a bad thing btw).  The a/d does have a high protein and moister content with moderate levels of fat.  It is also fortified with amino acids and other nutrients not found in most cat foods.  Carbs are the only macronutrient that feeds brain cells (in any animal).  The sites you quote rightly discuss the issues associated with a ratio that is excessive in carbs and deficient in proteins and fats.  But they are not suggesting that cats do not have a dietary need for carbs.  

I have fed literally hundreds of just weaned kittens.  Those that have trouble eating or gaining weight appropriately, almost always respond best to the a/d formulation.

[opus88]

Jade is right MUST get that kitten eating and fancy feast tho not a great food choice they do like it and will eat it when most other brands fail.

Nancy...I've done alot of reading on pet foods.
The Vets recommend Science Diet because they have been trained to think its a good diet, they mean well they just haven't been trained to put much research into nutrition.
However its not. Science Diet is very high in carbs. (grains)
I quote from info on one site www. catinfo.org
"In the wild, your cat would be eating a high protein, high moisture content, meat-based diet, with moderate level of fat and only 3-5% of their diet consisting of calories from carbs. (just a not here dry food contains 35-50% and some of the cheaper dry foods contain even higher amounts.)

Please note also that NOT ALL can foods are suitably low in carbs.
For instance most of the HILL'S SCIENCE DIET and the HILL'S PRESCRIPTION DIETS are VERY HIGH IN CARBS.

Cats have NO dietary need for carbs. infact a diet high in carbs can be detrimental to their health....grains are a cheap filler in foods, therefore the manufactures make better profits.

this info is is avail on www.catinfo.org on the link
"Feeding your cat: Know the basics" on page 4

cat food has recently become an obsession with me due to health problems in my own cats.
I could quote another very excellent source if interested.

[Jade59]

Hi jackal...do I understand you right?...you're kitty is barely eating Anything?  After so many days of this, this could lead to a crisis and I think you should go out and buy the commercial food just to get your cat to eat something.  While the Science diet is a great idea, from my own experience and others on the forum, not all cats will eat this, plus it's expensive and you have to buy a large bag (you said you were broke) so you might want to get some Fancy Feast and try that just to get kitty eating.  PrettyKitty1 here on the forum went through something similar with her cat barely eating and his organs began shutting down and he ended up in an ER hospital for quite some time and nearly died.  

It sounds like your kitty's mouth might hurt...maybe something has gone wrong with one of the extractions?  It just sounds like too many days that your kitty hasn't really eaten and I'm worried :(

[nancyjac]

You might try Science diet a/d food.  It is ground and formulated to be nutrient and calorie dense.  It is often recommended by vets for developing kittens or for older cats with eating issues.  Even if he only eats a small amount, it will provide him with more calories and nutrients than the same amount of other canned food.  It generally isn't sold in grocery stores but you should be able to find it at a pet supply store.

[jackal2001]

I'm off from work this week so I continue to monitor him.
I've been feeding him Solid Gold Tuna Cat food for well over 2 years now and he always would eat it.  It is very soft and mushy.  It has big chunks of tuna in that but i normally crush them up.  In the past 4 days he has been getting better but has not eaten any of it since then.  I also tried some TikiCat which is soft pieces of fish and same thing.
I'm giving him everyting and anything I could think of.  He won't eat chicken any more no matter how small i make the pieces.  he tries to chew it and can't and I think he gives up.
He won't eat babyfood either.
I don't feet my cat any commercial grade cat food like friskys, fancy feast, etc. but I may have to now.

When I go back to work next week and leave a bowl of food out I guess we'll see what happens.

[nancyjac]

The eating issues could be just learning how to eat with fewer teeth, or it could continue to be a problem for your cat due to the lack of a full set of teeth.  Continue to grind or mince his food as small as need be in order to keep him eating well.  You don't want malnourishment to be added to his list of problems.  The URI most likely is a by product of the stress from all he has been through lately.  The viruses that cause respiratory infections are always in any environment.  It is when the immune symptom is weakened through other illness or stress that the cold like symptoms appear.  You might periodically gently wipe his eyes out with a soft, damp, warm, cloth to keep him from irritating them further by rubbing at them.

[jackal2001]

kitty is doing better today.  he is acting almost like himself again.  i'd say he was at 90% now.
i did see him drink water twice yesterday on his own so i am very happy about that.  he is having some issues eating though.  he doesn't seem interested in his normal food.  i've been feeding him tuna and his human chicken, but he has issues eating his chicken even though i tear it up in very small pieces for him.  he will try and eat it but he acts like he is chewing it and can't, so it comes back out.  he did eat some of it.
i've managed to pill him by putting 1/2 the pill in a 1/2 of a soft hairball treat along with his hard crunchy treats that i break up in pieces for him.  so far so good with that.
he has a runny nose and is starting to sneeze a lot now too.  i don't know if he got a cold from being at the vet.  he did last time he was there 3 years ago.
his rigtht eye still has the 3rd eyelid up and he has been rubbing it a lot because it is tearing up on him.  i really hope that returns to normal.

[opus88]

great news ur making some headway.....and good problem solving solutions..keep up the great job, he'll keep improving I just feel it!!

[jackal2001]

No the vet hasn't given us a break on anything.
He left eye seemed to clear up from being dialated the past few days so that looks ok now.
His right eye still has the 3rd eyelid closed.  He was sleeping on me all day today on the sofa which he noramlly used to do so I am very happy he is doing that.

He didn't eat anything all day until I put some fresh tuna water out and some tuna.  That is the only thing he had today.  He tried to eat his chicken but I don't think he is used to eating with no teeth.
My wife is picking up some baby food and I will try and mix his pill in with that and put it on his paw and hopefully he will lick it off.

[opus88]

I put a new tread up to see if anyone has any experience with this....however sorry I spelled it wrong. its HORNER'S SYNDROME.
I looked up some info on www.veterinarypartner.com

Not necessary to treat Horners syn. in most cases. its not painful and usually resolves on its own in 6-8weeks.
indicates some nerve damage has occurred.

eyes sunk deep into the sockets and 3rd eye showing is usually sign of severe dehydration.....was kitty given iv fluids if not drinking enough?

gosh I hope this does resolve, in the meantime please ensure he is drinking.

[opus88]

they are responsible for the onset of all kitties problems therefore should be covering some at least of the costs!!! would make me 'angry' and
sad' too!!
poor kitty the health problems and all the stress besides......is he at least taking fluids? that is the most important. he may just be off foods due to all the stress?
I don't know anything about honers syndrome is this permanent??