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2 year old won't sleep, need help!
My situation is very similar to the one posted by another member. My nearly 2 year old boy will just not sleep,and I have gotten to that stage of exhaustion where I feel I'm a thin line away from having to be hospitalised myself (even my GP told me this) !
He is very active and appears happy during the day, but as soon as bedtime arrives he will do anything to avoid it: screaming incessantly, climbing out of his crib (he does this so easily it seems pointless putting him in it in the first place), demanding to go to the toilet even when he does nothing once there, demanding to be read to, to see cartoons, to have something to drink, anything that will delay bedtime. We can read him bedtime stories and sing until our throats are dry, but nothing works. Unlike the other mother who said her child fell asleep only when taken on drives (obviously not a long term solution), I can't even try this as I don't drive.
To make things worse, our baby shares our one and only bedroom, so it is impossible to take turns getting rest while the other parent tries to get him to sleep. As he doesn't have a room of his own we can't leave him to roam unsupervised until he eventually falls asleep either, (as I have seen suggested in some forums), since our room is crowded with stuff so that it is not possible to ensure that the environment is totally safe.
It can take several hours to get him to go to sleep, and usually ends up with him climbing into our bed, and us then transferring him to his crib once finally asleep (the only way for him to stay in it is to already be asleep!) . He rarely falls asleep before midnight, even if we start putting him to bed at 8. To make things worse, he wakes up around 3 or 4 am and refuses to go back to sleep, sometimes until 7 am, when we should be getting up.
It takes a toll on my older son too (who does have his own room, thankfully), whom I can rarely see off to school in the morning as this is the one and only time I can catch a few hours rest. Sometimes this leads to him skipping out on school.
Even when our baby does go back to sleep after his nocturnal wake-ups, my body is in such jet-lag mode after a whole year of this hell, that I can't get back to sleep myself for as long as 3 or 4 hrs, even with sleeping pills and no matter how exhausted. Sleep deprivation has caused me to be late for work and to miss days, which will eventually loose me my job. It has made me gain 12 kg as I am too exhausted to cook and have started eating poorly, not to mention at weird hours. Exhaustion has also started making me behave irrationally and irresponsibly, such as bidding on auctions in the middle of the night when I can't sleep and forgetting I even did it the next day because i was in such a trance-like daze, so I have one other stress to add to an already unbearable situation: debts.
I live in a foreign country so I have no family here to escape to for a few days rest and rehabilitation. I am at the end of the rope and don't know what to try anymore.
This discussion is related to 2 year old won't sleep!!!!.
He is very active and appears happy during the day, but as soon as bedtime arrives he will do anything to avoid it: screaming incessantly, climbing out of his crib (he does this so easily it seems pointless putting him in it in the first place), demanding to go to the toilet even when he does nothing once there, demanding to be read to, to see cartoons, to have something to drink, anything that will delay bedtime. We can read him bedtime stories and sing until our throats are dry, but nothing works. Unlike the other mother who said her child fell asleep only when taken on drives (obviously not a long term solution), I can't even try this as I don't drive.
To make things worse, our baby shares our one and only bedroom, so it is impossible to take turns getting rest while the other parent tries to get him to sleep. As he doesn't have a room of his own we can't leave him to roam unsupervised until he eventually falls asleep either, (as I have seen suggested in some forums), since our room is crowded with stuff so that it is not possible to ensure that the environment is totally safe.
It can take several hours to get him to go to sleep, and usually ends up with him climbing into our bed, and us then transferring him to his crib once finally asleep (the only way for him to stay in it is to already be asleep!) . He rarely falls asleep before midnight, even if we start putting him to bed at 8. To make things worse, he wakes up around 3 or 4 am and refuses to go back to sleep, sometimes until 7 am, when we should be getting up.
It takes a toll on my older son too (who does have his own room, thankfully), whom I can rarely see off to school in the morning as this is the one and only time I can catch a few hours rest. Sometimes this leads to him skipping out on school.
Even when our baby does go back to sleep after his nocturnal wake-ups, my body is in such jet-lag mode after a whole year of this hell, that I can't get back to sleep myself for as long as 3 or 4 hrs, even with sleeping pills and no matter how exhausted. Sleep deprivation has caused me to be late for work and to miss days, which will eventually loose me my job. It has made me gain 12 kg as I am too exhausted to cook and have started eating poorly, not to mention at weird hours. Exhaustion has also started making me behave irrationally and irresponsibly, such as bidding on auctions in the middle of the night when I can't sleep and forgetting I even did it the next day because i was in such a trance-like daze, so I have one other stress to add to an already unbearable situation: debts.
I live in a foreign country so I have no family here to escape to for a few days rest and rehabilitation. I am at the end of the rope and don't know what to try anymore.
This discussion is related to 2 year old won't sleep!!!!.
I have to say that reading all you have written, I am getting the impression you have a very bright little boy on your hands. You are so welcome, I just wish I could have been of more practical help to you. I came back to check on this post because what you are going through really tugged on my heart strings, and I truly hope the situation improves quickly.
My little guy refuses to nap at daycare as well, but being that the system is not so strict here I can drop him off and pick him up according to our schedule, which helps a great deal.
Good luck to you, and if you have the time, I would love to read how your situation is going. Please, if you can, update from time to time. All the best to you.
My little guy refuses to nap at daycare as well, but being that the system is not so strict here I can drop him off and pick him up according to our schedule, which helps a great deal.
Good luck to you, and if you have the time, I would love to read how your situation is going. Please, if you can, update from time to time. All the best to you.
I can't tell you how thankful I am for all the support you are giving me! Despite being in a constant daze of exhaustion, I feel a lot better knowing I'm not alone going through this.
Allmymarbles, I can totally see how sleep deprivation nearly led you to a stroke. I often feel like I am about to collapse myself, of what exactly I am not sure. In 2005 I couldn't sleep for 6 months from PTSD after a severe earthquake. I ended up in hospital for 2 months with my autonomic nervous system totally out of whack. I couldn't stand up at the beginning and it took me about a month to be able to cross the street from the hospital to the shop across the road. I lost the ability to sweat and had fainting spells and tremors every time it got too hot. I don't want to go there again, so I am making an exception and staying at a hotel tonight with a few sleeping pills as only company.
Thank you so much adgal for consulting your pediatrician on my behalf. We went to the pediatrician ourselves today who said it was not so unusual, and he suggested we all jump into bed at the same time to encourage him. We've tried that, sometimes it works, sometimes not, and, benjimom, actually sleeping with our baby the whole night is not an option as he kicks our faces, tears the covers off, rolls over us and onto the floor, or just gets up and plays.
We also do our best to give him quiet reading time in a dimly lit room before bedtime, that again takes hours. We've tried leaving him in the room alone, but he climbs out of bed and plays, but at least he eventually ends up asleep on the floor from where we can move him to bed. The other night we went back into the bedroom to find he had made mineral bottle sculptures: we found them balanced upside down on their lids! There is no end to his desire of exploration, he's just flat out till he drops.
But exhausted as we are, whatever strategy we take to put him to bed means going to bed much later than we want to and not getting enough sleep.
His sleeping troubles began when he started daycare, so I totally believe that he is suffering from a combination of overstimulation and over exhaustion, in addition to loneliness from being separated from his parents for too long hours and then wanting to make them up at night. We can't shorten his hours as the system here is very strict: you are obliged to bring him in by a certain time and if not risk losing one's place in daycare. I try and fight it out with them all the time: he needs more time at home when we're not at work, more rest, they don't listen. They say he has to be part of the "community" and do things with, and like, everyone else: Japanese salaryman life starts at age 1 !! They even expect us to participate in community activities on weekends when he has already been at daycare all week, and he isn't even 2! It's like a sect, only it's not, which is the scary part. They simply don't understand the harm they are doing to a child's development by forcing them at such a young age to have a totally overactive social life, and almost no family life to speak of. I've been in this country for 11 years, but am starting to be really fed up.
Apologies for the rant about Japanese daycare. I blame them as he was a good sleeper until he started there.
I really just started off this post wanting to thank everyone for the kind and generous support!! So thank you again.
Allmymarbles, I can totally see how sleep deprivation nearly led you to a stroke. I often feel like I am about to collapse myself, of what exactly I am not sure. In 2005 I couldn't sleep for 6 months from PTSD after a severe earthquake. I ended up in hospital for 2 months with my autonomic nervous system totally out of whack. I couldn't stand up at the beginning and it took me about a month to be able to cross the street from the hospital to the shop across the road. I lost the ability to sweat and had fainting spells and tremors every time it got too hot. I don't want to go there again, so I am making an exception and staying at a hotel tonight with a few sleeping pills as only company.
Thank you so much adgal for consulting your pediatrician on my behalf. We went to the pediatrician ourselves today who said it was not so unusual, and he suggested we all jump into bed at the same time to encourage him. We've tried that, sometimes it works, sometimes not, and, benjimom, actually sleeping with our baby the whole night is not an option as he kicks our faces, tears the covers off, rolls over us and onto the floor, or just gets up and plays.
We also do our best to give him quiet reading time in a dimly lit room before bedtime, that again takes hours. We've tried leaving him in the room alone, but he climbs out of bed and plays, but at least he eventually ends up asleep on the floor from where we can move him to bed. The other night we went back into the bedroom to find he had made mineral bottle sculptures: we found them balanced upside down on their lids! There is no end to his desire of exploration, he's just flat out till he drops.
But exhausted as we are, whatever strategy we take to put him to bed means going to bed much later than we want to and not getting enough sleep.
His sleeping troubles began when he started daycare, so I totally believe that he is suffering from a combination of overstimulation and over exhaustion, in addition to loneliness from being separated from his parents for too long hours and then wanting to make them up at night. We can't shorten his hours as the system here is very strict: you are obliged to bring him in by a certain time and if not risk losing one's place in daycare. I try and fight it out with them all the time: he needs more time at home when we're not at work, more rest, they don't listen. They say he has to be part of the "community" and do things with, and like, everyone else: Japanese salaryman life starts at age 1 !! They even expect us to participate in community activities on weekends when he has already been at daycare all week, and he isn't even 2! It's like a sect, only it's not, which is the scary part. They simply don't understand the harm they are doing to a child's development by forcing them at such a young age to have a totally overactive social life, and almost no family life to speak of. I've been in this country for 11 years, but am starting to be really fed up.
Apologies for the rant about Japanese daycare. I blame them as he was a good sleeper until he started there.
I really just started off this post wanting to thank everyone for the kind and generous support!! So thank you again.
I know it can make you feel like you are going to lose your mind it can cause so many medical issues/emotional issues too.
Would he sleep with you? If he will, then just do it at this time so you can get some sleep. I've had a hard time sleeping with my son too, not that bad, but I did let him sleep with me a lot during the younger years, he would sleeep better and when he was a baby he would not sleep well by himself at all. I know that sleepign with parents is seen as a bad thing by many, but if you don't get your sleep, then bad things may start to happen and it's not worth that and it seems like the whole family is being affected too.
Would he sleep with you? If he will, then just do it at this time so you can get some sleep. I've had a hard time sleeping with my son too, not that bad, but I did let him sleep with me a lot during the younger years, he would sleeep better and when he was a baby he would not sleep well by himself at all. I know that sleepign with parents is seen as a bad thing by many, but if you don't get your sleep, then bad things may start to happen and it's not worth that and it seems like the whole family is being affected too.
HI again. As promised, I ran your situation by my Pediatrician yesterday. She said it was tough without meeting the child, but if she had to guess, she would say a combo of overstimulation and overtired. She briefly explained...she said for some children a routine is super important. So even though in your living situation it can be tough, to get him up and put him to bed at the same time daily, with a bedtime routine. If he naps at daycare, ask the daycare to make sure its the same time, and the same length of time. She also agreed with my thought on the stimulation just before bed. Even though it might be tough, it might help to have you or your partner take him into your bedroom and play or read quietly with him as opposed to having him playing with his big bro and watching tv/video games for the hour or two before bedtime. She also said some kids need to just cry it out and not be taken out of bed, but that doesn't seem possible in your case if he can climb out. She also said a check up is a good idea as obviously your pedi knows him and his history.
Anyway, these were just her thoughts. I know that suggestions don't always work in real life, but I did promise you I would let you know her thoughts. Again, I wish you well and hope you all get some rest soon. I am no expert, but what allmymarbles said sure makes sense to me in that sleep deprivation can make you so ill. I wish you and your family all the best.
Anyway, these were just her thoughts. I know that suggestions don't always work in real life, but I did promise you I would let you know her thoughts. Again, I wish you well and hope you all get some rest soon. I am no expert, but what allmymarbles said sure makes sense to me in that sleep deprivation can make you so ill. I wish you and your family all the best.
P.S. About it almost costing me my life, what happened is that I aborted a stroke. If I had not had any medical knowledge, and had not had an appropriate med in the house, I would have died or been horribly damaged.
It is not uncommon for sleep deprivation to cause short-term memory loss. I know because it happened to me. As to why your son is not sleeping I have a couple of questions. Will he sleep if you let him sleep with you? If that is the case, in the short-term it is not a bad idea. As to why he is not sleeping there might be a medical cause. I am thinking of sleep apnea. This does not occur to a parent. It did not occur to me and the problem was not discovered in my daughter until she was an adult. (Yes, my sleep deprivation came about because of her.) I have not read the other posts and maybe what I have to say has been said by others.
I know personally that you have a terrible problem. Have your son looked at for sleep apnea. If that is not the cause, the only thing I can think of are awful nightmares. By the way, sleeping our toddler with us only helped a little. She was safe between us but she would poke me awake repeatedly. So not much help. She did not suffer nightmares. Good luck. Sleeplessness almost cost me my life. And it wasn't the greatest thing for my little girl.
I know personally that you have a terrible problem. Have your son looked at for sleep apnea. If that is not the cause, the only thing I can think of are awful nightmares. By the way, sleeping our toddler with us only helped a little. She was safe between us but she would poke me awake repeatedly. So not much help. She did not suffer nightmares. Good luck. Sleeplessness almost cost me my life. And it wasn't the greatest thing for my little girl.
Oh I so wish I could help more. I have just started back to work myself after a years maternity leave, and I know the nights my son is up all night are just killers. To have that every night...I cannot even imagine how hard this is on you and your family. I mean, good gosh, in some countries sleep deprivation is used as a form of torture. It is so hard on you. I am seeing my pediatrician tomorrow and see if she has any other helpful hints for you, and I will pass them along. I will tell you one thing she told me....many times a bad sleeper is a sign of a high intelligence level. Hopefully that gives you a little bit of a positive. I do wish you well and I truly wish I could have been more helpful. Hopefully he just grows out of it soon. Take care.
Thank you so much for your quick response and advice! !
We've tried the strict bedtime routine, but it is very difficult to keep up with a teenage older brother in the house, who watches tv and plays video games just when we are trying to put the little one to bed. He also has a very good playful relationship with his older brother who has trouble keeping away from playing and exciting him close to bedtime.
The fact that our baby is overtired himself seems obvious to me as he couldn't possibly be getting enough sleep, and as you say it is pretty certain that being overtired prevents one from sleeping (my case too! ).
At dinner he is so tired he has no appetite which worsens the problem, as I'm sure part of the middle of the night waking up is due to sudden hunger. He is also determined to eat without help and gets angry if we try and spoon or fork feed him, or help in any way, which often results in him not getting enough food into his mouth as he will only be 2 in May. I suspect the Japanese daycare system to be responsible for this as they highly try to encourage kids to be self sufficient at a very young age: so young as to be counterproductive it seems!
I will look into getting a lavender pillow sent over from my parents, as I know of the relaxing properties of lavender, but hadn't thought of it before, so thank you.
As you say, sharing a room is a big part of the problem. We literally have to creep into the room like thiefs to go to bed without waking him up (that is, on the rare occasions we manage to get him to sleep before collapsing ourselves, on the floor next to his crib or whatever).
As the problem seems to have gotten worse lately, not better, a visit to the paediatrician is definitely on the agenda, but judging from how Japanese people react to our stories saying "oh he's so "genki"- (that means well and in good health/energetic in Japanese), as if it were a positive trait to be jumping around all night, we have our doubts about getting any useful advice there.
In Japanese culture getting by on little sleep is seen as a sign of good health and a positive social trait (good prospects for the future if you can work at your office for 18 hrs a day without collapsing....).
Cheers and thanks for the support : )
We've tried the strict bedtime routine, but it is very difficult to keep up with a teenage older brother in the house, who watches tv and plays video games just when we are trying to put the little one to bed. He also has a very good playful relationship with his older brother who has trouble keeping away from playing and exciting him close to bedtime.
The fact that our baby is overtired himself seems obvious to me as he couldn't possibly be getting enough sleep, and as you say it is pretty certain that being overtired prevents one from sleeping (my case too! ).
At dinner he is so tired he has no appetite which worsens the problem, as I'm sure part of the middle of the night waking up is due to sudden hunger. He is also determined to eat without help and gets angry if we try and spoon or fork feed him, or help in any way, which often results in him not getting enough food into his mouth as he will only be 2 in May. I suspect the Japanese daycare system to be responsible for this as they highly try to encourage kids to be self sufficient at a very young age: so young as to be counterproductive it seems!
I will look into getting a lavender pillow sent over from my parents, as I know of the relaxing properties of lavender, but hadn't thought of it before, so thank you.
As you say, sharing a room is a big part of the problem. We literally have to creep into the room like thiefs to go to bed without waking him up (that is, on the rare occasions we manage to get him to sleep before collapsing ourselves, on the floor next to his crib or whatever).
As the problem seems to have gotten worse lately, not better, a visit to the paediatrician is definitely on the agenda, but judging from how Japanese people react to our stories saying "oh he's so "genki"- (that means well and in good health/energetic in Japanese), as if it were a positive trait to be jumping around all night, we have our doubts about getting any useful advice there.
In Japanese culture getting by on little sleep is seen as a sign of good health and a positive social trait (good prospects for the future if you can work at your office for 18 hrs a day without collapsing....).
Cheers and thanks for the support : )
Oh wow, my heart goes out to you. I have a 13 month old that has been a poor sleeper from day one. It is not uncommon for him at this point to wake up at 2 or 3 am and stay awake for several hours.
I spoke to my pediatrician about this and she said that some children just have a really hard time learning to self soothe. Your situation is far worse then mine, but here are a few helpful suggestions given to me. In all honesty, sometimes they work, sometimes not, but perhaps something here might help help you. I hope so.
I have a very strict bedtime routine. Whatever time works best is fine, but it's always consistent and it's bath, story, bedtime. After dinner we always have quiet time...no t.v. or anything. The toys are put away and he gets only 1 toy to quietly play with. I also often use the Johnson and Johnson Bedtime bath lotion. I have been told the lavender scent helps them to relax. Also, I wonder if he is not overtired himself? I know my son just started daycare and refuses to nap there. He just won't. So by the time he is home, he is so overtired I have a much harder time getting him to sleep. My pediatrician did tell me that an overtired child has a far more difficult time sleeping. I have found it to be true with my son.
A couple of books that helped me a lot were Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Baby and Happiest Toddler on the Block. Both gave really helpful tips.
Lastly, I would talk to his Dr. Perhaps there is something more going on here. I also wonder if the room sharing isn't making things tougher for him as well. I know that when I go in to my son's room to check on him, just the noise of me opening the bedroom door wakes him and once awake, that is it. So just wondering if when you and your partner go to bed if that isn't disturbing him?
I sure hope you are able to sort this out. Sleep deprivation is awful and having had many nights like this myself, I can truly sympathize with you. Best of luck to you.
I spoke to my pediatrician about this and she said that some children just have a really hard time learning to self soothe. Your situation is far worse then mine, but here are a few helpful suggestions given to me. In all honesty, sometimes they work, sometimes not, but perhaps something here might help help you. I hope so.
I have a very strict bedtime routine. Whatever time works best is fine, but it's always consistent and it's bath, story, bedtime. After dinner we always have quiet time...no t.v. or anything. The toys are put away and he gets only 1 toy to quietly play with. I also often use the Johnson and Johnson Bedtime bath lotion. I have been told the lavender scent helps them to relax. Also, I wonder if he is not overtired himself? I know my son just started daycare and refuses to nap there. He just won't. So by the time he is home, he is so overtired I have a much harder time getting him to sleep. My pediatrician did tell me that an overtired child has a far more difficult time sleeping. I have found it to be true with my son.
A couple of books that helped me a lot were Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Baby and Happiest Toddler on the Block. Both gave really helpful tips.
Lastly, I would talk to his Dr. Perhaps there is something more going on here. I also wonder if the room sharing isn't making things tougher for him as well. I know that when I go in to my son's room to check on him, just the noise of me opening the bedroom door wakes him and once awake, that is it. So just wondering if when you and your partner go to bed if that isn't disturbing him?
I sure hope you are able to sort this out. Sleep deprivation is awful and having had many nights like this myself, I can truly sympathize with you. Best of luck to you.
I forgot to mention that we get no sympathy from the Japanese community: when we tried to explain to our daycare center that if we were often late it was because it was very difficult to get our child to go to or stay asleep, or get any sleep ourselves partly because of sharing the same bedroom, they just looked at us wide-eyed and said "but everyone shares a bedroom with their baby, they manage..." They expect us to be there every morning at 9 at the latest regardless of the fact that our not even 2 year old has only had a couple of hours sleep!
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