Need a remedy for a certain situation, but I dont know what to choose

[Oblivion656]

http://www.medhelp.org/posts/Anxiety/In-a-certain-situation-where-my-heart-starts-racing--how-stop-it/show/1258631

This is my problem here in the link(click it for details if you must). There is a certain moment, where my heart starts racing. And I think I need some sort of remedy to take before this event. I just want to know what would be good to take. That is fast activated(if possible), that I shouldn't need to take for all around anxiety, but just for this event (only if that's possible). If not possible, maybe I'll consider taking it two weeks or whatever in advance.

I also read there is "Anxiety Homeopathy" It's where you take a two tablets and put it under your tongue.

"Argentum nitricum "This remedy is indicated when anxiety develops before a big event"

And then something like Panicyl, it said to actually eliminate worry. "Stops Anxiety & Panic Attacks Before They Start" and "promotes feelings of calmness and control"

I'm not sure if these two are good, or if there is something else I should use? In short, I probably need to be extremely tranquilized were I don't care or worry what is going around me. Which should treat the symptom.

[Paxiled]

The theory of cognitive behavioral therapy is that, whatever caused the initial anxiety or depression, the spreading of it is caused by an automatic thinking of negative thoughts.  Trying to stay positive doesn't create more anxiety in everyone, though it apparently does in you.  What's more accurate is that when people have difficult chronic cases, and i'm one of them, it's very hard to do -- you have to suffer a lot of pain before you see the benefits, which only come through a lot of repetition.  Some people are helped by this and some are not, but it's wrong to categorically state learned behavior permanently overrides all other thoughts.  That would mean nobody could ever improve, and lots of people have, but a lot of people haven't as well.  What I've read is that depressed people will have a harder time getting over anxiety using CBT techniques than other people because depression makes a person pessimistic and resistant to change.  The main failing with many therapies for anxiety is not dealing with depression first.  You sound quite depressed, to where you've given up on positive results.  I empathize, because a medication reaction put me there, too.  People who don't suffer from chronic mental disorders just can't put themselves in the shoes of those who do, and that's probably just as well for their personal health because once you're in that hole it's really hard to dig your way out of it.  

[margypops]

Oh sorry maybe it works for some and not others , it did work for me .Hope you find something that does work... Good Luck

[Oblivion656]

I doubt that is true. What he said. Because once the subconscious mind takes over. It don't matter how positive you are or how calm you are. It's learned behavior. It over rides all thoughts.

Trying to stay positive about something, all it does is create more anxiety. Because you are only pretending to. I learned to stop doing that, because I wasn't able to sleep at night.

[margypops]

When I went through an anxious time I took, 5HTP which works well, Sam- E used widely in Europe works , and there is one you can find on the internet called the Serenity formula with Rhodiola  which works quickly. I hope you find something, I also found my best way of coping was to not think too much, its always our thoughts make us feel bad I formed a habit of distracting myself whenever I found that anxiety creeping up. A few years later it still works I can now switch off at will those negative thoughts...I read a really good book at that time by Richard Carlson called 'Slowing down to the Speed of Life" in it he says ....Its impossible to experience any negative feeling without first creating a negative corresponding thought. The truth is our thinking will always create the reality we perceive '  It worked for me ,anythings worth trying ...

[Oblivion656]

The herbs didn't work! I mean, I don't feel anything when I'm on them. I only did once, that is when I used Valerian 6 pills. Then after that, it never worked again. Passion Flower didn't do anything. I even took 60 drops, and it has no effect. Combining Kava Kava with Valerian doesn't work either. Taking 3 pills of Kava Kava doesn't work.

Are herbs usually this useless for everyone?

I took a vitamin pill. I don't know if that works.

And even if they did work, it doesn't matter. Even if I am calm, not stressed out. Once I know I'm going to go through with this. My sub conscience kicks in. And the effects of Adrenalin never stop.

Is it possible to drain this adrenaline gland? So when it has nothing left it wont work? I heard someone doing that. So I did it,  but I don't think I did it properly, either that or he is lying.
This is what he said.

"My blood pressure (untreated) is around 155/95, unfortunately I am a pilot and must maintain it below these numbers to keep my medical. I am taking Atacand 32mg once a day and it keeps my bp down around 130/80-85 at home, but when I go to the doctor, it spikes. I found something that seems to work rather well, before I go to the Dr., I go running or working out. You need to give yourself a pretty good workout, burning all that adrenaline in your body. Finish up about an hour before your visit, shower and go. You may feel nervous, but your BP will not reflect it (at least not in my case). This method keeps my readings at the doctor in line with my readings at home. I don't see it as cheating because I know it is good at home, it is just those darn nerves when I know it is being checked by a doctor. Anyway, I'm new here and like reading the site ( I am obsessed with lowering it now), and would like to hear of any other methods or comments on this one."

[Paxiled]

B5 is pantothenic acid, and will be sold that way, not as B5.  I don't know this as being for your situation, so I defer to the other poster who mentioned it.  I more know B12, B6, niacinamide and folic acid as being related to this, but a balance of B's is more important and a stress B formula has them in the best ratio for anxiety problems.  As for standardized herbs, there is disagreement on this topic among herbalists.  What a standardized herb is a pharmaceuticalized herb, to coin a word.  Scientists try to find a marker chemical they believe is mainly responsible for how the herb works and then alter the natural herb to ensure every pill contains a certain percentage of that marker chemical.  But the name of these marker chemicals tells you nobody really knows how a plant works -- the marker chemical in ginseng is ginsenocides, in St. John's Wort it was originally hypericin, which is just the Latin name of the plant.  And it turned out to be wrong; a better marker for anti-depressant action turned out to be hyperforins.  What this does do is guarantee that each batch will be the same, but it also requires the altering of the natural plant to achieve that.  Other herbalists believe tinctures are the best way to take herbs -- though not standardized, a good herb company will test each batch to make sure it's up to snuff, but don't alter the plant to get there so all the plant's chemicals are in the natural balance.  As for dosage, the usual dosage in pill form for an herb not standardized is two capsules three times a day, but it is of course up to the individual what the best dosage is.  For tea, it's three-six cups a day.  For standardized herbs, the dosage and frequency depend on how many mg of herb are in the capsule -- some are intended for three times a day, some twice a day, some once.  Herbalists generally prefer herbs be taken with meals more than once a day to keep it in the digestive system.  Tinctures are usually dosed 30-40 drops two-three times a day, but valerian, if used as needed, would be taken when you want it to work.  Most people use it for sleep, so they'd only take it a half hour before bedtime.  Some herbs have a better reputation standardized -- St. John's Wort and Kava are two, though Kava is safer not standardized for the liver.  Saw Palmetto is another.  I don't know about valerian -- most people take it in non-standardized form.    

[Oblivion656]

For buying Valerian, someone on Amazon was saying

"This is just the Valerian root product. If you're going to use nature's way brand, I recommend the standardized extract which comes in the purple bottle instead. That one is about 8 times more potent per capsule. So you'd need to down 8 of these or 1 of the standardized extract."

Is this true? Should I get the one with the standardized extract instead? Or is it okay to take 8 , 530 mg pills at one time of Valerian? Do I need to do the same if I'm going to buy Holy Basil? And other herbs? Or should I get the standardized extract versus the root. I'm not sure what the difference is here. What do you think?

Also I couldn't really find Vitamin B5 as "allmymarbles" was suggesting. I looked in some stores , even a vitamin store, I cant find B5. Do I need B5? Or should I just use B6?

[Paxiled]

Taurine is the amino acid the body uses, in combination with cofactors such as B6, to manufacture GABA, the body's relaxant.  NAC is another amino acid, generally used for the liver.  It's a potent antioxidant.  Theanine is a quasi-amino acid found in green tea; it works for some, not for others.  The problem with including it in a formula is that different people require quite different amounts.  And if there are vitamins or minerals in it as well, keep in mind that those probably are better taken with food and the amino acids are best taken now with food.  So that could be a problem, and is a problem with many supplements that combine too many things.  Peggy has a good point when she says she takes her supplements separately; this is often the best course in dosing, but it can be expensive.  Good stuff usually is.  As to the adrenals, racing heart isn't always connected to cortisol.  It often is, but often isn't, particularly with anxiety sufferers.  As an anxiety sufferer myself, I don't get the physiological symptoms many people do, but I've got a huge case of chronic anxiety, and others have a problem with their heart valves or congestion in their blood vessels or a lack of magnesium or potassium.  Could be lots of reasons for everything.  No one answer.  Don't know what your particular situation is, but wish you good luck, and you obviously have some homework to do.

[Oblivion656]

Alright, thanks for the advice so far, everyone. Also to allmymarbles, yeah, I looked it up. It seems that most of the ingredients is vitamins, and then there is 3 main ingredients

L-Taurine, N-acetylcysteine, L-theanine, 5-HTP

I'm assuming the 5-HTP is what Paxil is talking about. That takes a while for it to work. The others I'm not so sure about. So anyways, NeuroScience, are they good or something? I'm just curious, as to why you mentioned them. I'm not sure what this means to me. And also you said they are the same people who test adrenal function? What does that mean to me. I'm not sure what advantage this has. Versus me taking a bunch of separate stuff? Thanks.

[allmymarbles]

I keep forgetting to mention all sorts of things. TravaCor was developed my NeuroScience, the same people who test adrenal function.

[allmymarbles]

I forgot to mention that TravaCor is a natural tranquilizer.

[peggy64]

High cortisol causes the rapid heart beat, and anxiety feelings. I have bad this due to adrenal problems. I would recommend you do a search on Lemon Balm and Holy Basil, and B5. I have taken a variety of natural treatments and these are the 3 that have helped me the most. BTW, this trio that I am taking is single herbs and vitamin. Not saying they can't be purchased as a single unit, but I have not found them.

Vit C is also good for the adrenals, like 5-10,000 u a day. This should be divided as high doses of C can cause diarrhea. But I recommend you research these and see if you think they would be something that would benefit you.

Just remember, herbs and minerals and vitamins, don't work overnight as do Rx meds, so if you do give them a try, please give them a chance before determining if they are or aren't beneficial to you.

You do have my sympathy as this something that is NOT fun.

[allmymarbles]

You might try TravaCor. This was given me for anxiety. All natural. Look it up on the internet. It may take a few days to take effect. Start with only one capsule.

[Paxiled]

I wish I could tell you the best ones, but since it's trial and error, I can't.  Herbs and natural remedies are generally used in combination, not singly.  Here's what a sample regiment might look like:  eleuthero and ashwagandha to support the adrenals, holy basil for cortisol, passionflower for nervous system regulation, kava for quick relief, 5-HTP for long-term relief (this one takes time to work; the others don't), taurine to manufacture GABA.  Will it work?  Don't know.  The easiest thing to do is just take some kava or valerian before you do something stressful and see if it works for you.  And be careful with kava if you have any liver problems.  And be careful with everything if you take medication; there can be contraindications.  Homeopathy would work quickly if it's going to work, but again, it's trial and error. Ironic thing is, natural medicine is actually often more expensive than prescription drugs, but with a lot fewer long-term harmful possibilities.  A naturopath or herbalist would be a lot more helpful than I can be, because he or she would actually see you and talk to you.  But again, if it's just the one stressful thing, try the kava or valerian and see if it works.  I personally suffer from a big chronic anxiety problem; those are harder to deal with.  That's what therapy is for, to keep it from getting to that point.  Human brains have a bad habit of imprinting bad experiences and expecting them to happen again, which is where the lingering fear comes from that it'll happen again.  It's irrational, but who ever said humans were rational?

[allmymarbles]

In addition to Paxiled's suggestions, there is just plain old vitamin B5. The anxiety may be caused by high cortisol. Since cortisol depletes B5, then taking B5 is in order. It works for me. The dose has to be rather high - 500 mg. per day. There are no side effects.

[Oblivion656]

Here is the thing, can I combine some of these remedies and use both? Like Valerian, gelsmnium, Holy Basil, etc. Also, I don't want to buy $100 worth of stuff if I don't know if it will work. I just want to know what is the best maybe? I'll take your word for it. If you wish. Just tell me the top 3 I should use. And then I'll try it. Also can I use all 3 of them at once, or 4 or mix? I know you said, it's trial and error. But you mentioned a bunch, and out of your personal best educated guess opinion, what 3 should I definitely use? If you wish to help please. Thanks.

Also, does some of this stuff work fast acting, such as I do need to take this 2 weeks in advance before it starts working? Or do I just take 30 mins to 1 hour before it starts working? Or does that depend on the herb. Or do they all do that?

On a side note, believe me this is not something I fear. It's more like I'm pissed off that this happened for no reason in the first place(of course I got a little agitated about the incident before this started happening because I thought it was bs, but that doesn't mean my heart should race). It's not like someone has put a gun to my head. Then again, maybe my mind works on its own and it automatically makes me fear something I shouldn't, I don't know.

[Paxiled]

I should also have mentioned Holy Basil, which can help reduce cortisol production.  That's the stimulating factor that causes much of the racing heart and breathing irregularities and such in a panic attack, so it might help as well.

[Paxiled]

I read the thread on the anxiety forum.  Breathing exercises take time to work, but it's not so simple as just holding your breath.  You first learn abdominal breathing, then you move to exercises where you breathe properly from your abdomen and then fill your lungs, then hold it for a certain count, then slowly release the breath.  There are thousands of such exercises, mostly come from yoga and Buddhism.  As for homeopathic remedies, there are many that might help, but it's trial and error and depends on many physiological factors, such as whether you get hot or cold or how your thoughts are.  A homeopathic physician would run through all these.  For permanent relief, constitutional remedies are used, which are more highly diluted.  Again, it's trial and error.  Other possible remedies are ignatia amara and gelsemnium and coffea cruda.  You can easily experiment by just taking one; they're very inexpensive.  As for herbs, the strongest herbal relaxant I know of is kava.  It's not as strong as a benzo, but it might help.  Passionflower, valerian, hops, California poppy -- there's a ton of plants out there that can help relax you, but none will sedate you completely.  Anything that would, how would you give blood?  You have to get there.  Plus, it wouldn't help you get over this fear.  When the heart is involved, another med that is often used are beta blockers, which are used for irregular heart rhythms but also help with specific phobias when a main symptom is racing heart.  But that's a med, not an herb.  The cure route is to get into therapy and work on your anxiety, though nothing is guaranteed to be successful.  Anxiety can be an insidious disease.  Avoiding makes it worse, but not avoiding doesn't always make it better.  You can also try something like 5-HTP if anxiety is a regular problem not just attached to this one event. Taurine can also be useful, as it's what the body uses to make GABA, which is what relaxants target.  There's a book called Natural Highs by Hyla Cass that is a decent overview of what's available naturally, and homeopathic materia medicas have all the list of homeopathic remedies and what they do.  Good luck.