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How long should I deal with Incontinence and continuing infections

I have a 14 1/2 yr old bichon friese.  He was originally purchased as a pet for my children and now my children are all grown up.  I thought one of my 4 children would want him but no one did.  3 of the 4 of them got their own "new" dog.  My dog started his incontinence about a year and a half ago.  It is getting progressively worse. He is wet every night, and has to be walked every 2 hours during the day and more often around and after his dinner.  He also gets an infection usually about every other month -- UTIs, ear infections, skin infections, anal gland infections.  Last May he had big lesions on his abdomen where I spent about $700 to get biopsies and nothing was definitive although the dermatologist said the lesions "could" be paraneoplastic indication of some type of cancer.  He gave me a $15 container of prednisone which cleared up the lesions but of course made him thirsty, hungry, and extremely unpleasant.  Now when the lesions recur, which is about every other month, I have to give him more prednisone.  The dermatologist said I needed to go to an internal medicine doctor to get more information.  I have spent about $1500 on medical for him in the last year and a half.  Every morning he is wet and I have to give him a bath.  Does anyone have any suggestions on how to make this easier to deal with?  
Best Answer
612551 tn?1450022175
Yes, your situation is difficult, and normal as far as children go from my personal experience.

I guess we usually decide to put a dog down when it is in pain, that may also be the case.  I believe there are dog gyppers (sp?) you may want to consider while you decide what to do.

We had a 12 year old Golden Retriever that had many old age problems and developed "fat pockets" - one was removed and found to have a low active cancer, I'll call it.  About a year later the pocket came back and while he was able to get around (he had a stroke about two years before that and had weak rear legs, but he was able to walk and toilet by himself) still the prospect of high cost surgery and radiation treatment led to the decision to put him down.  That was long ago, and still hurts as he was a great dog and a good friend.  The other input was 12 years is about life expectancy for the breed.
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1436598 tn?1332896533
Good luck. I know how much you both have been struggling. I hope the Proin helps, it's been wonderful for my female and we've had no problems.

Sending good thoughts your way!
Helpful - 0
1916673 tn?1420233270
Hi. It might be worth re-reading the link to Proin discussion thread I posted earlier, just to refresh your knowledge about it. I'm not saying don't try it, but it is best to be aware of the problems and potential symptoms to look out for. I'm sorry Sammy isn't very well at the moment - and I'm really hoping things improve over a short period of time. Good luck. Tony
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Avatar universal
Yesterday, I had to take Sammy to the vet because he had been harboring a skin infection that wouldn't go away.  The vet felt that Sammy, an old dog, has a lot of problems.  He prescribed Baytril for the skin infection for 14 days.  He also prescribed PROIN for Sammy with the understanding that he thinks it is mostly helpful for females.  So, since it works in some cases for males, we're trying it.  He gave me a 20 day supply, and if it's sucessful, he'll prescribe more.  He said to continue also with the Vetri-science bladder control tablets even though I don't think they're doing anything.  He said the PROIN would take about a week to 10 days before I'd know if it was working.

Here's hoping we can turn back the clock for Sammy!
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Avatar universal
We'll hope for the best.  
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Avatar universal
Thanks.   And I'm thinking that the Vetri-Science tablets are definitely helping.

Tootsie.  
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Avatar universal
I'm so sorry the belly band did not work.
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Avatar universal
I had to give up on the belly band.  It caused a major diaper rash.  Just wasn't worth it.  He is still recovering with little scabs on his sores.  He has always had very sensitive skin.

so I started with the Vetri-Science Bladder Strength Tablets about a week ago.  I know comments suggested it takes a few weeks so I'm still hoping.  He still is wet every night but the amount might be somewhat less.  Still has an accident during the day if I don't take him out every 2 hours or so, particularly after dinner.  

I also talked to my long-time vet from Virginia, and he said don't take his water away in the evening.  I don't think it made any difference anyway. It just made him mad and I'd have to end up giving it to him anyway.

Tootsie
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462827 tn?1333168952
Tootsie, Alot of what you describe (Skin Wise) about Sammy could be caused by food issues.....With the Normal bloodwork last year, I would have to at least consider it........ If you want me to do a background search on the brand you use, I would be glad too...& Yes, I would try the Herbal treatment, too...Karla
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Avatar universal
Sammy had blood work done in 2012 and everything came out normal.  His incontinence hasn't been sudden but just progressing for the last year.  However, I just ordered the herbal remedy for incontinence and I think I'll see how that works first. At almost 15, there could be more serious problems in his future.

Thanks so much.

Tootsie
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Avatar universal
Gosh.  That is all really scary.  Although people on this site have posted good things about PROIN. I was waiting to get some vet to approve it, but now I've ordered the herbal remedy from Amazon, Vetri-Science Laboratories Bladder Strength Tablets for dogs, plus some diaper doublers that my daughter recommended to use for additional absorption.  

Thanks so much for your help.

Tootsie
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675347 tn?1365460645
COMMUNITY LEADER
I read the whole thread here, and it's possible I might have missed it -but has the vet checked his kidney function? (by blood test?)
The reason I ask is my dog had sudden incontinence, was fine in the day, but needed to be taken out to pee 3 times in the evening, and twice or three times during the night as she was wetting the bed. This upset her so the best option was to take her to pee -though I also used doggy diapers as well to be on the safe side.
Anyway she was found to have early stage kidney failure.
Not as bad as it sounded!
We caught it early, and with treatment (ACE inhibitor and new diet) within even a week she was no longer having accidents!
This progressed well, to the point where within 3 months her Blood Urea and Creatinine had come right down to normal, and was staying that way.

I would definitely suggest the vet runs a blood test to find out if this could be the cause.
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1916673 tn?1420233270
I was reading up on Proin and why it has become more difficult to obtain recently ... I think it is worth you reading this, which is contained within a forum I also visit from time to time: http://www.i-love-dogs.com/forums/dog-health-nutrition/21481-your-dog-proin-read.html

Tony
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Avatar universal
Some vets will not cooperate with an owner's buying medicine from anyone but them.
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1436598 tn?1332896533
If the crate is still getting wet maybe you can try one of the 'bed pads' made for humans? I have a few that I used for one of my dogs to sleep on when she was on really high doses of prednisone that caused her to pee in her sleep a lot. You will still have to wash it but it beats having to scrub a crate down.

I really hope you can get the Proin, but if not I would definitely try the herbal remedy. It sure can't hurt. Has your vet given a reason why he will not prescribe the Proin?
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Avatar universal
Can I take it with Proin if I can get a prescription for it?  Or should I just do one?
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Avatar universal
Sammy also chewed and licked his feet raw, and other spots also.  I don't know if I tried everything but I'd tried medication and spraying with bitter apple.  Finally I just put an ecollar on him.  He doesn't seem to mind as it is sized such that he can eat and drink with it on. In a way it's great because his sores always heal up and go away.  Of course, if we take off the collar he starts chewing/licking again.  As I said, it looks funny but he doesn't seem to mind a bit.
On ears, Sammy finally got a little ear infection and I have some Otic ointment I got at the vet.  I used that plus amoxicillin, and it went away.  Now I try to keep them as clean as possible.
If I can't get any Proin this week (I'm going to try another vet), I'll order the herbal remedy on Amazon.
Tootsie
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Avatar universal
Yes, it is totally soaked plus he is still getting it on himself and the crate, so today it was bathe, wash crate, wash pad.  
And I couldn't order Proin from my vet, and I couldn't order from Drs. Foster and Smith because my vet wouldn't sign for the prescription.  

I wish I could leave the dog outside but we live in a TH and I can't put him outside.  
Bottom line.  I don't know what to do anymore.
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462827 tn?1333168952
Vetri-Science is a very trust worthy company......I see this formulation includes Olive Leaf Extract.....This is a natural antibiotic & certainly would be good for potential urinary tract problems.......Karla
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1916673 tn?1420233270
From what I can find through dog owner-review sites, where both Prion and Vetri-Science have been tried ... there seems to be very good results coming from the Vetri-Science Bladder Strength Tablets, in many cases reducing the number of 'accidents' by more than 50%. Some have said it works better than Prion and, being a natural product, has less side-effects and less potential interference with other medications. On that basis, it's certainly worth trying. The best price I can find is on Amazon, $17 for 90 chewable tablets.
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Avatar universal
Youre right about Poise Pads.  I just called the Kotex company since we're still having leakage out of the pad.  She said the Poise would be better since they are designed for urine.  So I'll try that next.  They make the Poise Pads.  I'm just a little nervous about the plastic granules that help the absorption since he has sensitive skin.  I was using the very thin pads with granules last year when he developed some abdominal lesions.  Don't know if it is related.  They never worked because I was using a female dog diaper.  These belly bands are much better for males.
Still waiting on the Prion.  Have you ever heard of "Vetri-Science Laboratories Bladder Strength Tablet for Dogs."  Saw it on Amazon and it's natural so no prescription required.
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1916673 tn?1420233270
Hi Tootsie. I have nothing to add to he excellent comments you have from others above, but just wanted to say that you are doing a great job of caring for Sam in his twilight years. Old age comes with so many issues and I think if you can deal with them one at a time, it's the best way to go. Once you solve the overnight incontinence - or at least make it manageable - it will help ease the other management problems, make you feel less tense or anxious and hopefully, of course, make Sam's life so much better too. This forum is great for advice, so please keep asking any questions you may have and I'm sure you will get a fabulous choice of replies. Once again, well done to you for helping your best friend and doing everything you can to improve his quality (first priority) and quantity of life. Tony
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1436598 tn?1332896533
You might try using pads made for incontinence like Poise. They may be a little thicker.  I still think something like Proin would be a huge help. Have you had any luck at convincing a vet yet? :)
Helpful - 0
612551 tn?1450022175
I buy stuff that has a high score on Amazon - including dog products to treat hot spots, and the chronic yeast problems common in the Westie breed.  I don't consider the rating high unless at least 25 people have rated.  When only a few provide evaluation the results are too dependent on the "Nut factor".

A man of my word, I just ordered from Amazon  Zymox Otic Pet Ear Treatment with Hydrocortisone .  It is unusually high, well above my minimum rating benchmark, it has over 1,000 reviews with a average score of 4.8 or of 5.0.  I have a high confidence this will help my battle with ear yeast problems, both inside and around the base of the ears, both sides.  I also ordered a bottle of BItter Lime to try to stop feet licking... my dog will lick his feet raw.  

Yes my dog has been to the vet at least twice on ear problems, he had an infection determined by examination of a sample taken form the ear, that was treated and cured.  He has an ongoing sensitivity (allergy) to foods and the environment in general, I fear.  So it is routine to shampoo him at least every two weeks with a dog shampoo containing Ketaconazole.  This ear stuff will alllow treating the ear and surrounding every day.  I am hopeful.

In case I rambled on too long to find an answer to your question:  
Yes, I think it has a good chance of working based on the company and the reviews/reviews.
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Avatar universal
Sam was neutered right before he turned 1/2.  And had never had a leakage problem until he turned 13.  They did a few unltrasounds on his bladder last year.  First they thought they saw a tumor but in the 2nd one it was gone.   Do you think this would work?  Vetri-Science Laboratories Bladder Strength Tablet for Dogs.  It's on amazon and people seem to swear by it.
Helpful - 0
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