Aa
Parotid Duct Transposition
What are the problems during and after surgery?
My dog had the pds 9 yrs ago... We constantly did EDTA and sodium in his eyes... To make a long story short... He lost most of his vision and spent most of his time in his crate covered under a blanket... I'm not sure how comfortable he ever was... He got an ulcer on his eye last week and we opted to remove both eyes...wow... his personality is different... I know he is comfortable... I had another min pin that lost both her eyes 3 yrs ago to glaucoma... she is happy and has no problem getting around.... You would never know she is blind... If I could do it all over again I would have removed Winston's eyes 9 yrs ago... Eventually they go blind anyway... He will have a few good years of comfort left... Even tho he is blind...
BTY, my dogie medical insurance paid most of eye drops, vet visits, and surgery over the last almost 2 years. Vet secretary said some insurances cover predetermined conditions. It has been a life saver as I could not have done this on my own retirement income.
We went through 1.5 years of every eye drop and genteal, every 2 hours. Her Left eye responded but not her right eye. Sunflower had PDT surgery on her Right eye 7/16/15. The first 2 weeks were a daze! I felt like I was running a hospital with tons more eye drops each day. The e-collar kept her from going through the dog door requiring me to take her out often. The collar scared her so eating and drinking were a problem until she adjusted. She had swelling under her eye which I had to gently press upward to express.
Now it is about 9 weeks later and I am grateful that we did it. Her options were to keep doing drops every 2 hours which still left her miserable, the drops would allow her to eventually develop eye ulcers and the eye drops would allow her to slowly painfully go blind. Her other options included remove the eye or put down a 2 year old Maltese mix.
We go back to the vet tomorrow for adjustment of her drops. Right now she gets several drops 5 minutes apart both AM & PM only. For both eyes: we do Saline solution to flush eyes and chemicals from skin around her eye, then Tacrolimus in Coconut oil. For right eye only: AM& PM EDTA 128%, AM Neomycin & Polymyxin... .
While I am waiting between drops, I use a wash cloth to clean her face. I use warm water and wring the cloth out, then wet the center of the cloth so it is very drippy. I gently wet to soften her crusty fur and eye lashes AM& AP. After using drippy cloth to really wet her eye, nose bridge, chin, under ear and throat fur (move collar up), I use a small hand towel with one hand under each end, I cup her face, ear and neck to gently dry. There is no smell and her fur is fluffy after I dry AM& PM. I also give 1/4 tsp powdered buttermilk [9 lb dog] 2 to 3 times per day.
On my own, for general health I give coconut oil and doggie vitamins and probiotics [needed after antibiotics]. Sunflower was almost dead with pneumonia, at 1/2 her present weight she had ribs and bones sticking out thru a drape of skin. AND they spade her!
Now it is about 9 weeks later and I am grateful that we did it. Her options were to keep doing drops every 2 hours which still left her miserable, the drops would allow her to eventually develop eye ulcers and the eye drops would allow her to slowly painfully go blind. Her other options included remove the eye or put down a 2 year old Maltese mix.
We go back to the vet tomorrow for adjustment of her drops. Right now she gets several drops 5 minutes apart both AM & PM only. For both eyes: we do Saline solution to flush eyes and chemicals from skin around her eye, then Tacrolimus in Coconut oil. For right eye only: AM& PM EDTA 128%, AM Neomycin & Polymyxin... .
While I am waiting between drops, I use a wash cloth to clean her face. I use warm water and wring the cloth out, then wet the center of the cloth so it is very drippy. I gently wet to soften her crusty fur and eye lashes AM& AP. After using drippy cloth to really wet her eye, nose bridge, chin, under ear and throat fur (move collar up), I use a small hand towel with one hand under each end, I cup her face, ear and neck to gently dry. There is no smell and her fur is fluffy after I dry AM& PM. I also give 1/4 tsp powdered buttermilk [9 lb dog] 2 to 3 times per day.
On my own, for general health I give coconut oil and doggie vitamins and probiotics [needed after antibiotics]. Sunflower was almost dead with pneumonia, at 1/2 her present weight she had ribs and bones sticking out thru a drape of skin. AND they spade her!
Good luck! I've no idea whether it will work in your case too, but we are delighted with the progress our dog has made. I apply the ointment last thing at night also and so she wakes up alert and wide eyed. She is in the garden now, chasing magpies, and is a different dog to how she was seven or eight weeks ago. The Protopic has been great.
Thankl you for the information. Blu's doctor said she is going to a meeting next month and will research it.
Check my post!! THe may be an answer that will work for you. We were desperate, and I could barely sleep I was so worried.
We tried everything, including Optimmune and various drops and ointments, but she was getting worse and worse and was starting to fall off the kerb etc when out for a walk. We took her to an ophthalmic specialist who recommended duct surgery but this was really scary when we googled success rates etc. She said there was a very slim chance that a new ointment might work, and it has!!!! It is called Tacrolimus Monohydrate
Or Protopic 0.1% She is so well now. We use it twice a day. I prayed for a miracle as I was so worried for her and thought she might never be ok again. Please speak to your vet. This is about thirty pounds for a tube that lasts approx six months, whereas optimmune was fifty pounds for a tiny tube.
Or Protopic 0.1% She is so well now. We use it twice a day. I prayed for a miracle as I was so worried for her and thought she might never be ok again. Please speak to your vet. This is about thirty pounds for a tube that lasts approx six months, whereas optimmune was fifty pounds for a tiny tube.
There is a cure that has worked for us. I have been trying to post a comment by put have thus far been unable to. Will try this then is if successful will get back to you.
Hi BR!
I had my Jack Russell's eyes done over 2 years (you can scroll up and read my earlier posts). Sophie was one of those dogs that didn't have a 100% success rate according to the vet, but to me, she's perfect. When she was first diagnosed, both her eyes were bad. Her left had a Schirmer reading of 0 and right was 2. We were able to bring her right one up, so she only had surgery on the left one. We were still using Tacrolimus for the right eye, one drop every day. Since then, her right eye has shot up to 30 and we've dialed it back to one drop every 2 days. The left eye gets EDTA every day. She has good days and bad days. Some days, she looks absolutely normal, you'd never know she had issues. Other days, not so much. The biggest problem for her is when she pants a lot (on really hot days, running around the dog park, when good food is cooking, getting a really good treat) her face just gets completely soaked from her own "tears". Usually I just carry napkins with me and soak up some of the excess fluid when she gets really bad. I know this probably doesn't sound reassuring, but I would do it all over again in a heartbeat. I guess what I'm trying to say is that you have to be willing to put up with some potential side effects, but it's worth it in the end. There will still be some growing pains as you figure out how to deal with everything but I think it will be worth it in the end.
As far as the cost, have you called around? I actually travelled for 3 hours to another vet to have the surgery when the local optho wanted $2400 per eye. I found one in Michigan that did it for under $1000. So it was worth the extra travel for me. I live in Canada (an hour west of Toronto), so I looked in Detroit, Buffalo and even KY (where I have some friends). I explained the situation and all of them were willing to help out even without a vet referral (as long as I forwarded all her results to them). I'm just suggesting you look outside your immediate area if possible.
Hope that helps somewhat. Good luck with your puppy! They really make life better.
I had my Jack Russell's eyes done over 2 years (you can scroll up and read my earlier posts). Sophie was one of those dogs that didn't have a 100% success rate according to the vet, but to me, she's perfect. When she was first diagnosed, both her eyes were bad. Her left had a Schirmer reading of 0 and right was 2. We were able to bring her right one up, so she only had surgery on the left one. We were still using Tacrolimus for the right eye, one drop every day. Since then, her right eye has shot up to 30 and we've dialed it back to one drop every 2 days. The left eye gets EDTA every day. She has good days and bad days. Some days, she looks absolutely normal, you'd never know she had issues. Other days, not so much. The biggest problem for her is when she pants a lot (on really hot days, running around the dog park, when good food is cooking, getting a really good treat) her face just gets completely soaked from her own "tears". Usually I just carry napkins with me and soak up some of the excess fluid when she gets really bad. I know this probably doesn't sound reassuring, but I would do it all over again in a heartbeat. I guess what I'm trying to say is that you have to be willing to put up with some potential side effects, but it's worth it in the end. There will still be some growing pains as you figure out how to deal with everything but I think it will be worth it in the end.
As far as the cost, have you called around? I actually travelled for 3 hours to another vet to have the surgery when the local optho wanted $2400 per eye. I found one in Michigan that did it for under $1000. So it was worth the extra travel for me. I live in Canada (an hour west of Toronto), so I looked in Detroit, Buffalo and even KY (where I have some friends). I explained the situation and all of them were willing to help out even without a vet referral (as long as I forwarded all her results to them). I'm just suggesting you look outside your immediate area if possible.
Hope that helps somewhat. Good luck with your puppy! They really make life better.
Hi,
I'm glad I stumbled on this thread. My corgi, Finn, was diagnosed with dry eye last year as well. She was seeing a specialist for months after being wrongly treated for pink eye for a few months. She was on a ton of meds. She still kind of is. But it was determined it would be a life long battle so we are on optixcare and cyclosporine 3 times a day and she has a really greasy antibiotic that is applied right before bed.
I've also been on and off about the surgery. I'm really afraid of it backfiring. We only have one eye specialist in my area. He's actually based out of Denver but comes to my town twice a week. He quoted me at 1900 per eye. He only operates on one at a time. Her left was the first one to go bad. Then the right followed a few months after. So it would be the left eye.
Reading everything about the crystals and the possible eye removal freaks me out. I'd rather continue meds her whole life if it atleast kept her vision fine. He told me it only works 2/3 and I don't want Finn to suffer more than she already is. If anyone still checks this threat, please reply with suggestions.
I'm glad I stumbled on this thread. My corgi, Finn, was diagnosed with dry eye last year as well. She was seeing a specialist for months after being wrongly treated for pink eye for a few months. She was on a ton of meds. She still kind of is. But it was determined it would be a life long battle so we are on optixcare and cyclosporine 3 times a day and she has a really greasy antibiotic that is applied right before bed.
I've also been on and off about the surgery. I'm really afraid of it backfiring. We only have one eye specialist in my area. He's actually based out of Denver but comes to my town twice a week. He quoted me at 1900 per eye. He only operates on one at a time. Her left was the first one to go bad. Then the right followed a few months after. So it would be the left eye.
Reading everything about the crystals and the possible eye removal freaks me out. I'd rather continue meds her whole life if it atleast kept her vision fine. He told me it only works 2/3 and I don't want Finn to suffer more than she already is. If anyone still checks this threat, please reply with suggestions.
My 9 year old maltese was diagnosed in February with Severe Dry Eye (KCS). He has been on Tacrolimus, Cyclosporin, Genteal, Pilocarpine, Interferon, Optixcare, KCS solution, Flurbiprofen, etc.. None of them have worked, his right eye is still at 0. He developed a corneal ulcer 2 weeks ago. His ophthalmologist has suggested the PTD surgery which he is scheduled to have it on August 2. If anyone has any suggestions on whether or not to have the surgery I would greatly appreciate it. I keep going back & forth with my decision. I have read about the potential complications of the surgery which really worry me. Thank you!
I have a 3 year old beagle Boston terrier mix. She had her pdt surgery almost a year ago. She is having now with her eyes. Winter time she doesn't really go for long walks. I'm not sure if it's bc of the nice weather but out of know where her eyes are getting irritated and she will close them for days and actually walk into things, such as doors sofas and walls. Please help I don't know what to do I feel terrible that she is in pain
It is saddening to see the instant distrust that owners adopt when their pets medical/surgical case is not an instant success.
The overwhelming majority of vets are diligent caring professionals. All medical and surgical therapies have failures and this is the same for human medicine.
Do not assume just because your case is complicated and expensive that you have been mistreated. By all means, ask questions and be aware of the risks. Many dogs find relief from the PDT surgery after a long period of experimentation with medical treatments. The fact that a small percentage do not respond well does not mean your vet was negligent/uncaring/uninformed.
Tim
The overwhelming majority of vets are diligent caring professionals. All medical and surgical therapies have failures and this is the same for human medicine.
Do not assume just because your case is complicated and expensive that you have been mistreated. By all means, ask questions and be aware of the risks. Many dogs find relief from the PDT surgery after a long period of experimentation with medical treatments. The fact that a small percentage do not respond well does not mean your vet was negligent/uncaring/uninformed.
Tim
I have a 3 year old Min Pin whom has dry eye. Left eye surgery was about 3 months ago and went wonderful with no problems. Tuesday we have done the right eye, I am really worried about her eye this time being or healing right....the swelling is alot worse this time, she doesn't want to drink or eat very much, and she has gooky looking stuff coming from her incision and mouth area, and she also constantly is licking the collar that is around her head to protect her eye like her mouth is dry. (not sure if casue she is not eating or what). Also this eye does not produce much fluid as did the last one did. We did not have any of this the first time. Just wondering if I am not giving it enough time to heal or if maybe something has went wrong.
Unfortunately, KCS that isn't responsive to cyclosporine or tacrolimus, is a lifelong condition for a dog and it's owner. There is not a surgical "cure." If a veterinarian recommends PDT surgery, it is because the current condition of the patient's eyes would likely improve after the procedure, even with the surgical side effects considered. I know the frustration first hand as I am a veterinary technician who has worked in veterinary ophthalmology. I am also the loving owner to a three year old mix breed dog, diagnosed with KCS at three months of age. She has never been responsive to medications, and my husband and I are currently preparing to have the PDT preformed on her. My best advice to those in this same situation is 1) Sometimes "managing" a condition is the closest thing to a "cure," and 2) Find a veterinarian who doesn't rush you into a decision. One who will take the time to answer questions and give you all of the facts, good and bad, so that you can weigh your current situation against your possible future situation. All patients and owners are individual cases. When a vet tells you The Best Possible Outcome, know that there are also many Gray Areas, as well as A Worst Possible Outcome. There is no way of knowing which area your pet will fall post operatively. When a vet tells you that your pet is A Good Candidate for a surgery, he or she has no way of knowing exactly how things will turn out in the end. The hope is always to bring comfort to your dog, physically, and to you, emotionally.
I just want to tell you that we had the surgery done on my 12 pound miniature schnauzer and I am so thankful every day that we did. I don't know about bulldogs but it definately does work on small dogs. It's been over a year now. Yes, there were complications and trouble at first and he squinted every time he ate for a month or so. Now he's adjusted to it and is the happiest little boy in the world. I have to put EDTA drops in his eyes once a day and that is absolutely no trouble at all. He's not in pain and he isn't going blind as he would have without the surgery.
Natural tears have antibacterial properties, so it is not surprising that bacterial infections are common with dry eye. Cyclosporine /tacrolimus have been shown to decrease ocular bacterial infection because of improved tear production. In severe KCS with poor tear response to the treatment there is a lot of mucus. This mucus is food for bacterial growth . These bacteria may not be disease-causing bacteria but need to be controlled. It’s important to give mild OTC antibacterial drops(et polysporin )every two three days. This will eliminate inflammation and green mucus and also the need for genteal gel application from 6-8 times a day to 2 to 3 times a day.
I have an english bulldog with dry eye since she had surgery to remove her cherry eye 4 years ago. The last 3 years have been very bad. I give tacrolimous 2x and genteal severe.
She always winds up getting infected so every month she goes on antibotics. Her new opthamolgist gives her simiplex antibiotics but cephalexinn 500mg 2x daily always works too. I am so sick of this regiment of giving the poor dog eyedrops, she runs from me and I dont blame her. She always gets treats after the drops. I have spared no expense on Lola. She has been on the best food. I went the raw (BARF) route for many years thinking it was a food allergy. We live in the Wash DC area and I noticed that her best time is winter. Her worst are fall and spring when the molds are growing outside. I also went the holistic route and I do think that acupunture works somewhat. Also, homeopathic remedies worked for a while. Recently I started cooking brown rice and givning lots of it and I noticed she was better. I recently ran out of fish oil and I noticed she is worse, so that definitely helps. Her opthamolgist discussed the surgery but says it does not work on small dogs much, but on big dogs it works. Lola is a medium 50lb dog and the vet never did it on a bulldog. The vet said you are trading one problem for another with the mineral buildup but the dog will be more comfortable. After reading the negatives posted, and the fact that you still have to give drops, makes me decide not to do it.
She always winds up getting infected so every month she goes on antibotics. Her new opthamolgist gives her simiplex antibiotics but cephalexinn 500mg 2x daily always works too. I am so sick of this regiment of giving the poor dog eyedrops, she runs from me and I dont blame her. She always gets treats after the drops. I have spared no expense on Lola. She has been on the best food. I went the raw (BARF) route for many years thinking it was a food allergy. We live in the Wash DC area and I noticed that her best time is winter. Her worst are fall and spring when the molds are growing outside. I also went the holistic route and I do think that acupunture works somewhat. Also, homeopathic remedies worked for a while. Recently I started cooking brown rice and givning lots of it and I noticed she was better. I recently ran out of fish oil and I noticed she is worse, so that definitely helps. Her opthamolgist discussed the surgery but says it does not work on small dogs much, but on big dogs it works. Lola is a medium 50lb dog and the vet never did it on a bulldog. The vet said you are trading one problem for another with the mineral buildup but the dog will be more comfortable. After reading the negatives posted, and the fact that you still have to give drops, makes me decide not to do it.
Hi all,
My 5 yo yorkie was diagnosed with PDT almost a year ago. I debated for that time about whether to have the surgery. We went ahead last week and the verdict is still out whether it was successful. My little one has many of the same symptoms many of you shared, i.e. still squinting his eye, very sedetary, gunk around the eye, etc...and we're still doing the daily meds (at least 7 for the eyes and two oral). I go back tomorrow for a recheck, the 3rd in 7 days. He also developed an ulcer. I was hoping to see some improvement by now but not yet. I'm trying to stay optimistic but it's been very difficult, as many of you know.
My 5 yo yorkie was diagnosed with PDT almost a year ago. I debated for that time about whether to have the surgery. We went ahead last week and the verdict is still out whether it was successful. My little one has many of the same symptoms many of you shared, i.e. still squinting his eye, very sedetary, gunk around the eye, etc...and we're still doing the daily meds (at least 7 for the eyes and two oral). I go back tomorrow for a recheck, the 3rd in 7 days. He also developed an ulcer. I was hoping to see some improvement by now but not yet. I'm trying to stay optimistic but it's been very difficult, as many of you know.
Hi, I'm new to this site but I just wanted to share my experiences with dry eye. My miniature schnauzer was diagnosed at the age of 1.
We tried everything in the way of eye drops but his reading was 0 in the left and 3 in the right and nothing seemed to help. We were told by his opthalmologist that 50% chance the surgery would help. As the only option was surgery or removing his eyes, we tried the surgery. It was hell for abnout 6 weeks as he kept having complications, but finally things settled down. Now I am so glad we had the transposition surgery done. He is a perfectly normal, happy little boy, playing with his toys. Before he was a sad little puppy who walked around squinting or with his eyes shut and never wanted to play. we give him EDTA eye drops once a day but he doesn't seem to form any crystals. Just have to wash his face every time he eats but it's so worth it.
Gale
We tried everything in the way of eye drops but his reading was 0 in the left and 3 in the right and nothing seemed to help. We were told by his opthalmologist that 50% chance the surgery would help. As the only option was surgery or removing his eyes, we tried the surgery. It was hell for abnout 6 weeks as he kept having complications, but finally things settled down. Now I am so glad we had the transposition surgery done. He is a perfectly normal, happy little boy, playing with his toys. Before he was a sad little puppy who walked around squinting or with his eyes shut and never wanted to play. we give him EDTA eye drops once a day but he doesn't seem to form any crystals. Just have to wash his face every time he eats but it's so worth it.
Gale
I ordered the buttermilk powder on line. It has to be pure buttermilk powder. Google it. I'm out of the country and get back Sunday. I'll send the link if you want it
Nancie
Nancie
Hi Mary!
Just a quick question about the buttermilk powder - I went to get her some yesterday and the only type I found said it was made with sweetened cream and sweetened whey. I don't want to cause tooth issues now if there is added sugar in there. I did get it as it was the only one there, but I wanted to know if you had a specific brand that you used that didn't contain sugar. It's not to say that Sophie doesn't like it - she licked the bowl clean at each meal! I just don't want to create another health issue down the road.
Thanks for all your advice so far.
Just a quick question about the buttermilk powder - I went to get her some yesterday and the only type I found said it was made with sweetened cream and sweetened whey. I don't want to cause tooth issues now if there is added sugar in there. I did get it as it was the only one there, but I wanted to know if you had a specific brand that you used that didn't contain sugar. It's not to say that Sophie doesn't like it - she licked the bowl clean at each meal! I just don't want to create another health issue down the road.
Thanks for all your advice so far.
My Brandy had PDT surgery in January 2006. She developed a stone in her duct just over a year ago and had to have it surgically removed. Ever since then, I have given her 1 tsp. of buttermilk powder with each meal. She loves it! I find the buttermilk powder in my grocery, right next to the canned milk section. For Brandy, PDT surgery was the only answer and I am so glad that she had the surgery. She was so uncomfortable that she rubbed an ulcer on her eye and had to have a graft done at the same time as the PDT. Her Opthalmologist's office is just 11 blocks from me and we have been going there many times. She has to take Simplicef with every meal. There is a vet opthalmologist who specializes in PDT surgery. My Opth. vet has been in touch with him regarding Brandy's case. The stone, etc. My opth. vet's name is Dr. Teres Tucci and her practice is called Veterinary Specialists Inc. in Homestead, Florida. She happens to be on Facebook, should you want to get in touch with her.
Well, Sophie (the 2 year old Jack) had her PTD surgery Nov. 22. I'm still extremely glad I went ahead with the surgery, but it hasn't been an easy month. She had complications the day of the surgery and a few hours after the vet called me to tell me everything was OK, they called back to say her face was swelling like crazy and they didn't know why and had to go back in. She basically had the same surgery twice in less than 12 hours! I couldn't go to her as I live 4 hours away from the vet (I'm in Canada, vet is in Michigan - went there for price reasons - Canadian vet wanted $2400 plus tax, US guy did it for $890 including all meds, collar, food, etc - and that includes the dollar conversion). Anyway, I was totally stressed as I was getting updates every 2 hours or so all saying "we have no idea what's going on". Turns out nothing was wrong internally (it is possible for swelling to develop if the duct is damaged during surgery and the cheek can fill up with saliva - that's why they had to put her under again to confirm). I got to pick her up the next day and take her home with me and everything seemed fine, except that she wasn't producing enough saliva (it was supposed to be spilling over her eyelid onto her face and she made just enough to pool at the bottom of the eyelid). It took about 3 weeks for it all to start working and her eye to start looking "normal" when it all went downhill again. I called the US vet and they suspected an eye ulcer, so I had to bring to Canadian vet to get her checked right away and they said, yes, she had one. So back she went on a series of drops and ointments, but her eye didn't get better. She had the same symptoms that Nancie mentioned - the crystals on the lashes and a haze at the centre of the eye. She was keeping the eye shut and squinting again and rubbing at it even though she would produce enough saliva - it wasn't dry eye, it was irritated eye. The US vet made some calls and ordered a new ointment (EDTA - not sure what it stands for) but it's to break up the crystals in her eye. I've had her on that for about 5 days and it seems to be helping. To get rid of the haze, he has me give her another ointment (short form is NPD) every 2 hours for this week. We'll go back Monday to see how it did. He froze her eye too and wiped all the crystals off but there is still a haze in the middle where her eye gets the most exposure to air.
Anyway, I know I'm sounding like there are all these problems, but really, to me, she is a thousand times better than she was pre-surgery. I am still glad I had it done but really do want all the problems to be over. I still see hope with her current condition, I didn't without the surgery. She was on cyclosporin and tacrolimus for months and never went from 0 in the left eye. Her right went from 2 to 25. I hope that now we can control the saliva pH with diet, I just have to find the right food. I haven't tried the buttermilk yet, but definitely will get some. Also, changing her from regular tap water to distilled helped.
Good luck. I will post more later after Monday's appt.
Anyway, I know I'm sounding like there are all these problems, but really, to me, she is a thousand times better than she was pre-surgery. I am still glad I had it done but really do want all the problems to be over. I still see hope with her current condition, I didn't without the surgery. She was on cyclosporin and tacrolimus for months and never went from 0 in the left eye. Her right went from 2 to 25. I hope that now we can control the saliva pH with diet, I just have to find the right food. I haven't tried the buttermilk yet, but definitely will get some. Also, changing her from regular tap water to distilled helped.
Good luck. I will post more later after Monday's appt.
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