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Avatar universal

Need Conclusion to this HIV testing

Thank you dr. HH and all.
I had 30min. vag. sex with hiv + woman. No condom. I experienced ARS-like at 2-4weeks after. I had
15lb wt.loss 2nd week, whitish and denuded areas on tongue, 3-4 days of light night sweats around neck/chest area,
several pimple/like eruptions on back for 3-4days, one 2-in. diameter pink blotch on each leg on shin area,
2day type bowel constipation, constant bowel rumbling sounds, eruption of several new black moles on body,
slight nausea and metalic taste on mouth.

I had Elisas done at 1, 2,3,4,5,6,7,8 months Negative. Although 2nd generation by Quest Diagnostics, (Miurex Kit). some Oraquicks. Odered DNA by PCR tests at 3 and 4 months. Negative.
Viral Load test b-DNA 50<copies at 5 months, result 266 COPIES, POSITIVE!
Repeated the v.l with bDNA 75<copies it came Undetectable at 6 months. Western Blot for HIV1 and HIV2;  No bands were reactive, at 6 months. CD4/CD8 ratio is 0.9, (inverted),  CD4 abs is 590. CD4 % is 33.
My whitebloodcount is 4.7 in a normal window of 4-10. (I am low which Means my body is fighting a viral infection, right?)

Wife
10 Responses
239123 tn?1267651214
MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL
You ask the key question toward the end:  "Please give me a scientific explanation why I am not Positive?"  Because your blood tests are negative.  That evidence outweighs all the other things you say, hands down.  You don't have HIV.

It is true that some research suggests that some people can be exposed to HIV, develop an immune reaction to it of the sort you describe, yet are not infected.  That's NOT INFECTED.

You have been grossly overtested.  I believe you are depressed, probably rather seriously.  (I could show your thread to medical students to teach them many of the classical manifestations of that disease.)  Whatever else, you do not have HIV.  The first thing you should do is stop searching the web or elsewhere for arcane immunologic interpretations of your test results and symptoms.  The second thing is to seek mental health counseling.  I suggest it out of compassion, not criticism.

Regards--  HHH, MD
Avatar universal
I'm not the doctor but you do not have HIV.  NO way.  If you were a late converter, and your body is slow to develop antibodies, your viral load would NOT be missed by TWO bDNA's and two DNA pcr's.  NO way.  I think it's time to look elsewhere for a diagnosis.

Good luck to you
Avatar universal
Sorry, I now notice that your first bDNA was at 266 which tells me- due to the low number and the fact your second was undetectable that it was a false positive.  If you suspect your "CTL responses are low resulting in poor antibody response" --your bDNA would be sky HIGH.  Also, these cases are very, very rare and the fact that you AND your wife fall into this category is inconcievable.  

Maybe you caught a wierd strain not picked up by antibody tests?  Not possible, especially if the woman you got it from has tested positive using the standard antibody test.  

As for generation of tests, no matter.  All become positive in over 99 percent of the population after 3 months.
Avatar universal

What is the difference between someone with PEP/haart keeping the v.l. undetectable
and causing a late seroconversion, and an untreated individual with a suppressed
v.l/undetectable v.l. that keeps testing seronegative up to 9 months?

Why one under haart will cause late seroconversion?? Would I also be a late seroconverter?

If I did not have this current dizzy slight pressure/headache with slight pain in
my eyes and what appears like clinical candidiasis on  tongue I would take the negative status
without questions. Unfortunately I am a an analytical type person that tends to rationalize
everything. I have always been king of this way.

There are cases where the CD4 gets depleted to the point of aids yet the person is seronegative and
for this they've come with a name of cd4 lymphod.. deficient of some sort, this proves that the hiv tests are not
always conclusive.
The stress of thinking that one may have infected ones children and wife is terribly overwhelming.

Reaching out to educated individuals who have experience with hiv tests/results/window/probabilities/statistics
and its viral behaviour is the best therapy I can get. Therefore I seek your counsel Dr. HHH and comrades
willing to stretch out their hand to dig me out of this quicksand. This experience has made me a much better
person morally and spiritually, for I have come closer to Him, Jesus Christ.

Any more information is certainly appreciated. How is Johnnyv? Thank you all.
239123 tn?1267651214
MEDICAL PROFESSIONAL
I have neither the time nor the energy to respond to arcane questions that are irrelevant because you do not have HIV.  This is not an emotional support website and you may not use it as such.  See a personal counselor for that purpose.  And everyone please keep religious declarations to yourselves.

This thread is over; I will delete any further responses.

HHH, MD
Avatar universal
If you were positive you would be making medical history.  Impossible.
Avatar universal
I thought I had tested a lot but you have me trumped! I think the issue you have (as I do) is that you had an encounter and had real physicial symptoms afterwards. That combination, along with guilt can lead to irrational thinking. I still have swollen glands six months later but I am trying to determine what the cause is. Continuous HIV testing is not going to make you feel better, believe me.
Avatar universal
Found Jesus did ya?  Don't blame you, so did I.

OK, question 1.
Individuals taking HAART medication due to HIV infection stop HIV from replicating, therefore eventually reaching undectable status,...sometimes.  Mutations can delay or halt this process.
  Individuals taking PEP for a High risk exposure would theoretically take longer to produce antibodies.  If the virus is being supressed or eradicated very early on the body would have no need for a large production of HLA antibodies.
  An individual who is infected and keeps the V.L. undectable without treatment (very rare) has built up a strong immune response to the virus.  And you can be sure HIV antibodies ARE part of that response.  These people DO NOT test antibody Negative.  They are indeed infected.
Avatar universal
"stress of thinking of infecting one's children and wife is overwhelming"

Been there man, I know what you are going through.  Think logically.  Let's say you are that individual who 1. got infected through a one time exposure with an HIV positive person through penile-vaginal sex (.1% chance). 2. continues to test negative after a 6 month test (.001% chance)  3.  continues to test negative with viral load and qualitative DNA PCR tests (.00001%).  NOW ... how do you explain your wife having "HIV symptoms" and not testing positive also.  Dude...NOT POSSIBLE. NO WAY.

The sentence quoted above says it all.  Until you forgive yourself and stop the punishing and hating yourself this will hover over you forever.  Being a man of Jesus, you should no GOD has no patience for the forgiven not forgiving themselves.
Once you do, you'll be able to live again.  

The therapy of looking for conspiracy explanations of HIV boogeymen viremia particles is NOT a good idea.

I'll keep you in my prayers.
Avatar universal
-- Hi

I had the very same symptoms that you have mentioned.
I live in japan , I had protected intercourse and unprotected oral sex with a collegue of mine.
That was the first time to have  sex and I remember it was somewhere in June 2004.
After the first encounter , I did not notice any symptoms other than neck pain and if I try to stetch my body I would get back ache . I ignored it and soon I followed a second one in July 2004 again a protected one !
Thats it. in early august I started getting the symptoms that you have mentioned.
1. I got a mole on my back somewhat brownish in color, it was first slightly painful(sore) and white in colour and turned to purplue brown.

2. I noticed white tongue little furry texture.

3. something white liquid (paste) around my thoat

4. Involuntary body movements in sleep. that would also wake me up.

5. Disturbed sleep with lot of unconnected dreams

6. My face would turn red if I had even little alcohol.

7. I got pimples on my forehead and small tiny white dots around my mouth.

8.Memory problems . I could not concentrate deeply on any subject

9.I felt like I have got some nodes at shoulder, groin , above collar bone

10.Purple tiny dots on my trunc(thies) they still exists come and go ..

11.Bloating and sometimes loose motion

12. blurred vision

13. Folluculitis around my leg

14. Ichy rash on my finger. still present no effect of antifungals
--------------------------------------------------

all these symptoms in 1st 3 months.

I did HIV test Elisa alomost 10 times till date.
HCV test,HBV Test, PCR for HIV test NEGATIVE

Did CBC for almost 8 times till date to monitor my blood count.
CD4 count test
-------------------------------------------------------

My blood test shows Platelet level on the lower side around 160(10000).
RBC and the breakup has always been normal around 5.1 (higher on the normal range spectrum)

WBC - has been varying between 5.1 - 4.9 . which also is normal though on the lower end of the normal.
Lymphocytes have been consistently around 36%.

Monocytes and eosonophils have been on the higher of the normal range.

Other observations have been my Total bilirubin count have been above normal (2.1) on most of occasions , and direct bilirubin has been higher in every case.

-------------------------------------------------------
As of today:-
I still have vision problems .
Memory and concentration problems
I feel lymphnodes still near my collar bone region,shoulder,popliteal,trochlear
I have noticed a node about half to 3/4 inch below lower jaw on both sides and I can only feel it if I bend my head down.
I still have bloating problems
--------------------------------------------------------

I have postponed or rather do not intend to marry anyone until I know what is really happening. this is my story if someone has similar case of mine do tell me experiences .
awaiting for your advice.

Thanks.
Miek





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