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Western Blot Indeterminate.... what to do?
I'm worried about my status and considering getting a PCR test.
On the 19th of November I started to come down with a cold. minor aches. On the 20th and 21st I took dayquil to ward off what I thought was just a cold. I had hung out with a friend on the 18th and 17th who had a cold that made him lose his voice. So the exposure time was right for a cold at 24 to 36 hours. On the 22 and 23rd I had a fever and some chills and decided to basically take a dayquil and sleep it off. I did continue to eat normal food but was eating light. I did have a few instances of waking up all sweaty and so I took a shower to deal with that. I also had the thermostat on 81 and was under the covers, so that would definately make me sweat. The fever cleared after a 2 days and became a sore throat. The sore throat stressed me a bit and my cold sores (aka herpes simplex) became activated. They happened to form on my tonsils which is particularly unpleasant. on the 24th and 25th I was basically taking it easy and pretty worn out. On the 25th I noticed a rash on my chest. The 26th and 27th I was active and able to work but not 100%. On the 29th I decided to go get a HIV and syphillus test after talking to some friends. The counselor at the testing site suggested going to the clinic the next day and getting tested.
Now the interesting part. They did a Oraquick test (elisa) and it came back HIV neg. Previous Negative result August 29th. The doctor seemed to think I was having seroconversion sickness. He also thought I probably had syphillus. I was given two shots of bicillin, bloodwork was drawn and a test for hiv, syphillis, and hep was ordered.
Within 36 hours I felt great and my symptoms vanished. Rash cleared up, etc. I still had a cough that I still have (3 weeks later). Also have a couple of swollen lymph nodes (literally 2). Got another dose of bicillin on the 7th, no test results back yet.
Went in yesterday 14 Dec, and the test results were in. Syphillis was positive, hep was immune (i had been vaccinated previously to hep b) and negative, and they said my western blot was indeterminate. I had a reaction to one band. I don't think they ran an ELISA blood test. However, I'm not certain.
The dr. yesterday wants me to wait 30 days and come back in for another test. It will of course take 2 weeks to get the results. I really don't want to stew on this for another 45 days. I've also taken time to think through my risk factors and I can't find a smoking gun so to speak. In the 14 days prior to my illness I was only with 3 partners. 2 of them were limited to oral sex and jacking off. 1 of them was risky, but I was the top. That encounter was on the 6th. Timing isn't quite right, but still is possible for an hiv exposure.
My problem is that I've been told that seroconversion illness is the worst, nastiest illness you've ever had. I think I was sick, but it wasn't that bad. I've had food poisoning and that was 10 times worse then this. It's within the 14 day window to barely at the end of it, but I was under the impression that seroconversion illness happens almost immediately.
I also have read that past or present syphillis infection can mess up western blot results, resulting in an indeterminate. I've had syphillis before, and I had it at the time the blood was drawn for the western blot. In fact the western blot blood was drawn about an hour after I was given the bicillin. I think I had a cold and syphillus, but not HIV. Yes, I realize it's a bit of denial potentially. But I can't find concrete support for an HIV infection.
I should have been sick a week earlier if it was HIV. It should have been much more severe. The research I've read suggests that a blood test at 21 days should show antibodies. It didn't.
I don't like being in limbo. It's actually worse then being poz or neg. I'm a bit annoyed that the dr didn't suggest a PCR test. But I understand that the clinic has limited funds and needs to do the most with it and that they have a protocol they follow. I still feel like I should have been given the option.
If I am positive, I want to know asap so that I can get on with living with it. Waiting 45 days to figure it out just bothers me. I'm now at 45 days since the suspected exposure and 30 days from the illness. Oh, and my titer score for the syphillus was 1 to 16 which the doctor said was pretty low. That supports a infection at about 2 to 3 weeks and in my mind confirms where I caught it.
I'm hoping for some support and ideas here. Monday I'm going to go back and get a copy of my lab results so I can find out which band I tested positive for in the western blot. I also want to know if the ELISA test was done and if it came back positive or negative. Considering that I had a negative ora-quick (elisa) that would be particularly interesting. I'm also considering have a PCR test done and the biggest factor there is getting the results quickly. I think they can be done for $250 to $300 from what I've seen. And I'm not worried about that cost at this moment.
On the 19th of November I started to come down with a cold. minor aches. On the 20th and 21st I took dayquil to ward off what I thought was just a cold. I had hung out with a friend on the 18th and 17th who had a cold that made him lose his voice. So the exposure time was right for a cold at 24 to 36 hours. On the 22 and 23rd I had a fever and some chills and decided to basically take a dayquil and sleep it off. I did continue to eat normal food but was eating light. I did have a few instances of waking up all sweaty and so I took a shower to deal with that. I also had the thermostat on 81 and was under the covers, so that would definately make me sweat. The fever cleared after a 2 days and became a sore throat. The sore throat stressed me a bit and my cold sores (aka herpes simplex) became activated. They happened to form on my tonsils which is particularly unpleasant. on the 24th and 25th I was basically taking it easy and pretty worn out. On the 25th I noticed a rash on my chest. The 26th and 27th I was active and able to work but not 100%. On the 29th I decided to go get a HIV and syphillus test after talking to some friends. The counselor at the testing site suggested going to the clinic the next day and getting tested.
Now the interesting part. They did a Oraquick test (elisa) and it came back HIV neg. Previous Negative result August 29th. The doctor seemed to think I was having seroconversion sickness. He also thought I probably had syphillus. I was given two shots of bicillin, bloodwork was drawn and a test for hiv, syphillis, and hep was ordered.
Within 36 hours I felt great and my symptoms vanished. Rash cleared up, etc. I still had a cough that I still have (3 weeks later). Also have a couple of swollen lymph nodes (literally 2). Got another dose of bicillin on the 7th, no test results back yet.
Went in yesterday 14 Dec, and the test results were in. Syphillis was positive, hep was immune (i had been vaccinated previously to hep b) and negative, and they said my western blot was indeterminate. I had a reaction to one band. I don't think they ran an ELISA blood test. However, I'm not certain.
The dr. yesterday wants me to wait 30 days and come back in for another test. It will of course take 2 weeks to get the results. I really don't want to stew on this for another 45 days. I've also taken time to think through my risk factors and I can't find a smoking gun so to speak. In the 14 days prior to my illness I was only with 3 partners. 2 of them were limited to oral sex and jacking off. 1 of them was risky, but I was the top. That encounter was on the 6th. Timing isn't quite right, but still is possible for an hiv exposure.
My problem is that I've been told that seroconversion illness is the worst, nastiest illness you've ever had. I think I was sick, but it wasn't that bad. I've had food poisoning and that was 10 times worse then this. It's within the 14 day window to barely at the end of it, but I was under the impression that seroconversion illness happens almost immediately.
I also have read that past or present syphillis infection can mess up western blot results, resulting in an indeterminate. I've had syphillis before, and I had it at the time the blood was drawn for the western blot. In fact the western blot blood was drawn about an hour after I was given the bicillin. I think I had a cold and syphillus, but not HIV. Yes, I realize it's a bit of denial potentially. But I can't find concrete support for an HIV infection.
I should have been sick a week earlier if it was HIV. It should have been much more severe. The research I've read suggests that a blood test at 21 days should show antibodies. It didn't.
I don't like being in limbo. It's actually worse then being poz or neg. I'm a bit annoyed that the dr didn't suggest a PCR test. But I understand that the clinic has limited funds and needs to do the most with it and that they have a protocol they follow. I still feel like I should have been given the option.
If I am positive, I want to know asap so that I can get on with living with it. Waiting 45 days to figure it out just bothers me. I'm now at 45 days since the suspected exposure and 30 days from the illness. Oh, and my titer score for the syphillus was 1 to 16 which the doctor said was pretty low. That supports a infection at about 2 to 3 weeks and in my mind confirms where I caught it.
I'm hoping for some support and ideas here. Monday I'm going to go back and get a copy of my lab results so I can find out which band I tested positive for in the western blot. I also want to know if the ELISA test was done and if it came back positive or negative. Considering that I had a negative ora-quick (elisa) that would be particularly interesting. I'm also considering have a PCR test done and the biggest factor there is getting the results quickly. I think they can be done for $250 to $300 from what I've seen. And I'm not worried about that cost at this moment.
So which exposure do you believe caused Ntjock to contrcted hiv from then Extremestress? If the timing was not right for the highest risk exposure (unprotected anal intercourse -or- dipping) then that means you believe he contracted hiv during the oral sex he engaged in?
look at his first post. it clearly states
"In the 14 days prior to my illness I was only with 3 partners. 2 of them were limited to oral sex and jacking off. 1 of them was RISKY, but I was the TOP. That encounter was on the 6th. Timing isn't quite right, but still is possible for an hiv exposure."
"In the 14 days prior to my illness I was only with 3 partners. 2 of them were limited to oral sex and jacking off. 1 of them was RISKY, but I was the TOP. That encounter was on the 6th. Timing isn't quite right, but still is possible for an hiv exposure."
Exposure was on Nov 6th-(anal intercourse).
Symptoms: fever / rash / fatigue / laringitis / loss of appetite / mouth ulcer / night sweats / cough / persistantly swollen lymph nodes / minor aches / chills / sore throat.
Probably tested positive @ the 6 week mark.
Is this basically correct?
Symptoms: fever / rash / fatigue / laringitis / loss of appetite / mouth ulcer / night sweats / cough / persistantly swollen lymph nodes / minor aches / chills / sore throat.
Probably tested positive @ the 6 week mark.
Is this basically correct?
NTJOCK was having sex with another man, i've learned that being the top means being the one to insert as opposed to the one who recieves the penis during anal intercouse. This how NTJOCK contracted hiv as it was unprotected as extreme has basically stated to you, i hope this clears things up for you Naseeb.
"In the 14 days prior to my illness I was only with 3 partners. 2 of them were limited to oral sex and jacking off. 1 of them was RISKY, but I was the TOP. That encounter was on the 6th. Timing isn't quite right, but still is possible for an hiv exposure."
he is Gay! he was the TOP!!!! he said that was his real risk!!!!!!!! So i am assuming it was unprotected, due to him saying he can't change his mistakes from the past.
Yea, but he only describes symptoms but not the detail of the exposure. Was it protected/unprotected? Was he gay/straight? That's what I wanted to know. It says he was at top. That's it. Can't Understand how he got it though.
I'm syaing he says what his exposure in his original post (at the very top of the page)
I am puzzled, what was ur exposure? Gay or straight? I am scared as hell, I had sore throat for five days and sinus headches which came and go for two days. Then it came again a week later and gone again. I am straight, I had protected sex and unprotected oral. I am scared to get tested though after reading your post.
I think the moral about my testing experience is that it takes time to seroconvert. Each person converts a little differently. I'm glad that I retested when I did instead of waiting the 30 days.
If you have an experience that makes you concerned, you need to wait at least 90 days beyond that exposure before a test can tell you reliably if you caught HIV. In otherwords, if on 1 Dec you have bareback sex, you won't be able to reliably determine if you stayed HIV negative until 1 Mar. If you test on 1 Jan, it will give you an idea, but it may not show yet. In my case I had a negative test on Day 23 and then on approximately day 42 it came back positive. I was lucky in that they did a western blot on day 23. Had they not done that I might have thought I was negative and gone right on with my life. Instead I had an indeterminate test which made me retest alot sooner.
I appreciate all the words of support and encouragement. No matter where you are or who you are you absolutely have to look for the best in your situation. Anger, Bitterness, and Depression are all natural reactions, but I don't see where they improve my status, so I've decided to skip that. I never liked being angry at myself anyhow. At the end of the day the only person you can be angry at for engaging in risky behavior is yourself.
I would encourage anyone who has recently converted to find some heroes. My heroes are my friends who have lived so long with the disease. I know more people than I can count who have lived 10 years with HIV. I know quite a few people who have had it 20 years. They are my heroes because they are proof that if you get adequate healthcare, take care of yourself, and live with a positive attitude and outlook that you can have a fullfilling and enjoyable life.
Our local HIV clinic, Legacy (formerly Montrose Clinic) has a class called NextStep that helps people adjust to life with HIV. That's my next step and tomorrow I'll be arranging to be in that class. My other next step is to figure out what to do about healthcare. I'm unlucky enough to be uninsured. No matter, any insurance company would drop kick you once they find out you have HIV anyway. I had always thought insurance was expensive, it's not. Policies abound at $150/mo for the healthy. The good news in my situation is Texas has a High Risk Insurance pool that guarantees insurance to anyone who pays the premium and is uninsurable elsewhere. I'm lucky enough to be able to afford that option, so I have to check and see if that is a route that is worth pursuing for me. Mind you it's not easily affordable, but I can pay for it.
All any of us can really do is strive to live our lives in the best possible way, being honest with ourselves and others.
As for the Holidays, I'm enjoying them just like I otherwise would have. With one exception. I'm very acutely aware of how wonderful and supportive my friends are. I can't ask for anything more than supportive and caring friends.
If you have an experience that makes you concerned, you need to wait at least 90 days beyond that exposure before a test can tell you reliably if you caught HIV. In otherwords, if on 1 Dec you have bareback sex, you won't be able to reliably determine if you stayed HIV negative until 1 Mar. If you test on 1 Jan, it will give you an idea, but it may not show yet. In my case I had a negative test on Day 23 and then on approximately day 42 it came back positive. I was lucky in that they did a western blot on day 23. Had they not done that I might have thought I was negative and gone right on with my life. Instead I had an indeterminate test which made me retest alot sooner.
I appreciate all the words of support and encouragement. No matter where you are or who you are you absolutely have to look for the best in your situation. Anger, Bitterness, and Depression are all natural reactions, but I don't see where they improve my status, so I've decided to skip that. I never liked being angry at myself anyhow. At the end of the day the only person you can be angry at for engaging in risky behavior is yourself.
I would encourage anyone who has recently converted to find some heroes. My heroes are my friends who have lived so long with the disease. I know more people than I can count who have lived 10 years with HIV. I know quite a few people who have had it 20 years. They are my heroes because they are proof that if you get adequate healthcare, take care of yourself, and live with a positive attitude and outlook that you can have a fullfilling and enjoyable life.
Our local HIV clinic, Legacy (formerly Montrose Clinic) has a class called NextStep that helps people adjust to life with HIV. That's my next step and tomorrow I'll be arranging to be in that class. My other next step is to figure out what to do about healthcare. I'm unlucky enough to be uninsured. No matter, any insurance company would drop kick you once they find out you have HIV anyway. I had always thought insurance was expensive, it's not. Policies abound at $150/mo for the healthy. The good news in my situation is Texas has a High Risk Insurance pool that guarantees insurance to anyone who pays the premium and is uninsurable elsewhere. I'm lucky enough to be able to afford that option, so I have to check and see if that is a route that is worth pursuing for me. Mind you it's not easily affordable, but I can pay for it.
All any of us can really do is strive to live our lives in the best possible way, being honest with ourselves and others.
As for the Holidays, I'm enjoying them just like I otherwise would have. With one exception. I'm very acutely aware of how wonderful and supportive my friends are. I can't ask for anything more than supportive and caring friends.
he tested pos less than 8 weeks after his exposure. He probably wouldve tested positive at 6 weeks had he taken a test then.
But…I do not understand, man…. People talking yesterday about you were so sad..but I do not understand one thing. So your symptoms were at the end of nov. but when was it your exposure , because you’ve had so many negative tests till now….i do not undersand at all…..were you in the 3 months window? I am very sorry and hope you can enjoy your holidays….
Your are impressing me deeply NTJOCK, with your take on the outcome of your status everything you said is very true and i wish only the best to you. Excercise, eat healthy and find yourself a good specialist. Thank you for sharing this with us as well, enjoy your holidays NTJOCK.
C H A P E A U
C H A P E A U
Hi, I've been reading this thread and I was really hoping that you would end up negative. I'm really sorry to hear that that was not the case, however, I'm glad of the outlook that you decided to take on your results. Having a positive outlook is always the best way to handle any situation in my opinion. Like you said, there are much worse diseases out there that could kill you much faster than HIV and much more diminish your quality of life in the process. Stay strong and the best of luck to you.
I'm truly sorry to hear about your results, however I'm very happy you're taking it as well as you are. You are truly strong willed and I believe you'll be just fine :)
Best of luck to you in the future and stay healthy
Best of luck to you in the future and stay healthy
I'm truly sorry to hear that, man. But it's good that you are handling the news well.
The thing to do now is to find a good HIV specialist and keep track of your CD4 and VL numbers. You don't need to start any meds until your CD4 numbers drop to below 350 - but that choice is up to you and your doctor.
I wish you all the best
The thing to do now is to find a good HIV specialist and keep track of your CD4 and VL numbers. You don't need to start any meds until your CD4 numbers drop to below 350 - but that choice is up to you and your doctor.
I wish you all the best
Well the results came back yesterday. The PCR was the slowdown, but I still think it was worth it. All three tests (elisa, WB, PCR) wound up being run. All three came back positive. :(
I'm still glad I did the earlier retesting, and I'd recommend it to anyone in my situation. If I'd waited and done what the clinic suggested it would have been 25 Jan before I found out.
My friends have been very supportive and good to talk to about this. Now my focus shifts to making the best of the situation. While it's tempting to be down, depressed, or even angry, I don't think that's productive. In fact I don't think any good comes out of it. I prefer to see the glass as half-full, and I think it could be alot worse. For one, there are worse diseases to have. For another, we have it really lucky in the US. In some countries there is no access to medicine or healthcare (think Africa).
I cannot change the past, I can only infuence today, and the future.... meaning that we can learn from the past, but we shouldn't obsess about it. Obsess about the future and making it better for yourself and others.
I'm still glad I did the earlier retesting, and I'd recommend it to anyone in my situation. If I'd waited and done what the clinic suggested it would have been 25 Jan before I found out.
My friends have been very supportive and good to talk to about this. Now my focus shifts to making the best of the situation. While it's tempting to be down, depressed, or even angry, I don't think that's productive. In fact I don't think any good comes out of it. I prefer to see the glass as half-full, and I think it could be alot worse. For one, there are worse diseases to have. For another, we have it really lucky in the US. In some countries there is no access to medicine or healthcare (think Africa).
I cannot change the past, I can only infuence today, and the future.... meaning that we can learn from the past, but we shouldn't obsess about it. Obsess about the future and making it better for yourself and others.
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