Premature beats and palpitations

[lisapep]

Thank you so much for taking time to answer my quesitons.I am a female 31 years old no family history of heart disease non smoker 5'2" and now am 148 pounds (after losing 50 pounds.. I have  been on WW).  Well I have gone in SEVERAL times within the last year  for heart palpitations and each time the Dr. says I am fine it is normal dont worry about it. But no ekg or anything they suggested see a mental health person to discuss stress.  they did do a blood test and all is fine.  they also took BP and it is 118/68.  My pulse although elevated shortly after the episodes will drop right back down to my normal range 70-80 BPM.  Well here is my dillemma.  I went to a DR. outside of the Kaiser organization and he did an ekg that was normal and put me on a 24 hour monitor.
Durning the 24 hour monitor I had a couple of episodes.   during one episode the paramedics were called.  Well the paramedics did an ekg and said they saw some premature beats. (the episode was over by then and i was in my "recovery" mode) This was something that the dr. did not see the day before when they did the ekg in the office.

my ?? are as follows:  can the 24 hr. holter indicate wether the "palpitations" are life threatening

what is a premature beat and is this a point of major concen?

One paramedic said that as i took slow deep breaths in my heart rate would go up then as i slowly exhaled it would go down. is this normal?

Are there any other test that I should request to insure all bases are covered?

Thank you again for all of your help. God Bless You
Lisa

[madgeOwens]

I have had heart palpitations all of my adult life. I am now 54.
Caffeine and chocolate would always bring them on.  If they were bad ebough to cause light head I would lie down until they subsided. Avoid caffeine and chocolate and maybe you will stop having palps.  
Now though I am getting pvc's and I can't believe how everyone in here is saying ignore it and get use to it.  To me it is not that I worry about the flipping in my chest (I am use to that) no biggy. To me it is the symptoms. I get short of breath, chest pain and feeling like I am about to pass out.  I do not see how I can ignore that! So hopefully when I see cardiologist on Monday they can help me...........but what I am reading in here is making me feel I have no hope at all. I enjoy all of the posts though. I am a retired nurse so I do know a wee bit about this. And I do mean a wee bit.

[zooee]

Hi Ozjyo

Other people don't feel it because it does not scare them, they ignore it and I can tell you that when they don't scare you they stop coming and you can hardly feel them.  I have lived that and i barely felt a flutter.  Then I got scared as always and they slowly became thumps and coughs and so on.  You really have to accept them TRULY as nothing and that makes them go away.  Also exercise is great for this.  If all your tests are normal, then do you know how strong your heart is!  WOW it is amazing and loves to run and play fast.  You can't hurt your heart. Accept, accept and do not be afraid everyone.

Best wishes to all and know you are not alone.

[454]

Thanks a lot for your comments.  It is very hard some days, but you're right.  Its like you feel good and then start looking for something else.  The human mind is a very difficult thing to convince.

[zooee]

I think you are just feeling your alive!.  You had all those tests and all were normal, yet you still doubt.  When you listen carefully to every thing your body does, you will undoubtly feel EVERYTHING.  The fact that you check your pulse tells me you still think something is wrong!  Why if your pulse is normal, you exercise great and the tests are normal are you still looking for something.  Ignore it and just tell yourself it is nothing, cause it is 454.  I do this too and way easier said then done, but we have to get this one day, we have got to believe after all is normal and stop feeling and looking for every little quirk and jitter.

Do we think we can live in our body's with no feelings at all?  Surely we can't go thru life feeling nothing.  I bet even Dr's feel this.  They don't panic like we do and fret and worry.  I bet if they did a study on people with PVC/PAC's, it would show we are all over anxious people prone to worry and anxiety.

Food for thought guy's

P.S.  I am not perfect and I hope I can practise my own advise :)

[454]

I've posted before and have been diagnosed with benign PVC's as shown by normal echo(June 2005), ekg(January 2005) and 3 week cardionet monitor(Jan-Feb2005)All normal bloodwork with the exception of slightly low hdl(38) Total cholesterol 183.  For the past two days, I have a fluttering below the nipple line on the left side of my uppper abdomen(Seems to be right behind my first rib at the bottom).  When I take my pulse, it doesn't seem to be skipping a beat as when I have a PVC.  Could this be a muscle spasm or is it another run of PVC's?  I am on 50mg Toprol XL for Mild hypertension(usually runs 120's to 130 over 70-80.  Also, I take 20mg of aciphex for reflux and take a multivitamin.  Exercise 3 times a week with a two mile brisk walk. 6' 170lbs.  Lost 25 lbs from jan-June with exercise and diet. Thank you for your help.

[Ozyjo]

Hello again,

I just find it hard to understand if a lot of people get them but just dont feel it.  Why do some feel it?  I actually thought that my heart must have moved position and is sitting closer to my chest wall, silly as it seems.  But my doctor said that its not that.  I dont know, as someone previously said, you just wont accept that it is nothing and want a doctor to prescribe some miracle drug and it will all go away.  Maybe someday, it will happen.  Has anyone lost weight and found it to reduce them.  I was wondering if maybe carrying too much weight makes it worse as your heart is obviously doing more work.  I would not consider myself to be to big (74kg), although I could do with a little off!  Has anyone tried any natural remedies from the health food store, such as "SEDI-CALM" or similiar, these are suppose to help calm you down if you are stressed out?  If anyone has any thoughts on this, please let me know?

[zooee]

Evening everyone,

I have been checking this out for years now and I just love coming and reading all our misery!
I have had PVC/PAC's for going on 20 years and I am 40 now.  I can tell you that after you have been checked out and told it is normal, then it comes down to anxiety.  
What happens is you feel that awful thump, pause, cough and then you become scared and pump the adrenaline and all goes down hill.
We are choosing not to believe that something is NOT wrong.  We think we know more than the dr/s and in fact we don't.  I know this is harsh but I have lived this day in and day out.  If he could only feel this, i'd say to myself, something has to be wrong.  Then you get the test and NOTHING is wrong, it is your heart having skips and jumps just like the the rest of the world, they just DONT focus on it like we do.  I layed on the table doing the echocardiogram and had 10+ PVC's and she said SO, we all get em honey.  Test of course came back normal.
We listen, we count, we become afraid and then we doubt.  Just for today I must have checked my heart rate over 30 times and it was 72-80 JEEZ! but it has skipped as least 75 times and boy I felt eveyone.  We really must accept them, let our heart do it's thing and when it want's to stop it will, you can't control them! I know easier said then done, but it is the way out of this circle of fear adrenaline fear. I have not found total peace but i do know that it is time to stop being afraid of something that is normal. They go away when they mean less and when you give them such importance they love to come, visit and stay.

I wish all you wonderful people well and I will continue to check this out weekly.  GOOD LUCK and God Bless us ALL!!!!

[lisapep]

wow everyone boy do i feel much better.  I still get very scared when they happen but talk my way through.. does anyone have any "tips" on how to deal with these palpitations? any help would be wonderful

God bless you all

Lisa

[tickertock]

With a fast heartrate and even PVCs ,  I have found the beta blocker atenolol to be very helpful, of course not everyone responds the same and some just can't tolearte them even though they are safe drugs.

Try and avoid hyperventilating, sometimes you don't realise you are doing it when anxious. Try to identify triggers and avoid them no matter how farfetched the triggers might appear.

Keep tellin yourself you have lived through this before without incident, read the the stories of those who coped and lived with this most of their lives and nothing bad has happened to them. Talk to yourself and try and convince yourself you'll be fine, these are the things that have helped me most.Good luck.

[TerBear5]

I feel as though my life has just been saved, and I'm not alone after all.

Just discovered these threads. I feel so relieved I could cry. I am not alone! I'm a 56-year old female. Always athletic and in good shape, but at age 8 I had my first "episode" of a speeding fluttery thumping heartbeat. It scared the bejesus out of me, but before I could get to Mom and Dad, it had returned to normal.

Through my WHOLE life these episodes would come over me. No real regularity or rhyme or reason. And it was always unexpected and weird and scary as all get out. Sometimes they would last for a few minutes, sometimes much longer. They "seemed" related to me breathing or moving funny...once when I'd just cross-country skiied to the top of a mountain, I stopped, took a huge breath and the heart-thing started. I slowly skied down to find help, but the episode passed. Once I just bent over and reached for a glass and it started. Once I just yelled "AHA!!" and it started. The list goes on. It seems related to breathing to me...not stomach issues...but I do have reflux no and again.

It shakes my whole body. twitter/flutter THUMP, twiiter/flutter-THUMP...it's awful. When they stop I kind of feel a little choke in my throat and voila, my heartbeat is totally normal again. There is never any pain, but sometimes right at first I get a little tingly and short of breath because it scares me so badly. Once I calm myself and resign myself to the fact it's happening it seems to help them pass more quickly.

Yes, I have been to several doctors describing it. I've had EKGs (normal, no enlargement etc) and worn a monitor for 48 hours. Ultrasound--everything normal. They told me to purposly gag myself or cough to stop them. Or gently massage my neck. They said this is commom and occurs in healthy young women and that I'd grow out of it.

But I'm 56 now, have been terrified my whole life, and have grown more stressed and anxious every time my heart 'skips" thinking here comes an episode and this is the one that will kill me--they cripple me with fear. I, like others have mentioned here, have lived in terror and fear, missing out on so much, because I was too scared to go, or participate in fear I'd have an attack and keel over dead.

Man, this is NO way to live. I thought I was alone. No medical person has ever observed me while having one...my husband was driving me to the emergency room with one but before I could get out of the car, it stopped. Little chokey feeling and perfectly back to normal.

When I feel myself getting worked up and scared and my heart starts skipping, I get up and keep moving; trying to distract myself from the thought of it. It always helps. It's a lot of head stuff too.

My condition is still unnamed/unknown to me.

[bigmick]

LAF is Lone (as in the absence of any underlying pathology/heart disease/cardiac strucutral abnormality etc.) Atrial Fibrillation - not fun!

And yes, I too know how painful esophageal spasms are! I've had them on several occasions over recent years - like intense pain for about 30 seconds, then a minute of relief, with the sequence repeating for an hour or two. Really does feel like severe on and off cramping - most unpleasant.

Interesting to note that you are also an anxious person. As ever, its a bit of a chicken and egg thing is it not? Do the symptoms make one anxious or vice versa? Likely both, and the two do, for sure, compound and exacerbate each other.....

FWIW, I am educated to PhD level and am an avid researcher. I sometimes wish I was rather more ignorant than I am! I firmly believe that a) brilliance (and I'm NOT saying I am (-: ) and insanity are close cousins, b) anxiety underlies most if not all disease, and c) that anxiety, GERD, and heart arrythymias are all VERY closely associated with each other.

BM

[tickertock]

There is a thin line between sanity and insanity, just like love and hate sometimes.

Most persons above the average intelligence are found to have some form neurosis. Like bigmick said ignorance can be a bliss, on other occasions it can cost you dearly.Good health and anxiety free days to all.

[Ozyjo]

Hi,  I am 38 yr female.  I was diagnosed with Ectopic Heartbeats.  I first noticed them soon after having my second child (C-Section)  I dont know if this brought it on, but I was fine before this.  I too had to wear holter monitor for 24hours.  Results came back showing the Ectopic Beats and doctor said not to worry about it.  Easy for them to say when all you can feel is your heart trying to jump out of your chest.  I notice it more at night as soon as I get in bed and put my head on pillow, I can hear every heart beat and EXTRA BEATS.  Im so scared my heart is going to stop beating.  It actually ends up bringing on a panic attack which obviously hightens the symptoms.  I end up getting up and sitting in front of TV until I get the courage to try to go to sleep again.  I do find that coffee, chocolate, alcohol (even in small amounts), ice cream or soft drink does make it worse, so I am trying to avoid these things at night. I am hoping this will stop one day, but my doctor said it is something I will need to get use to as it is here to stay.  She did suggest if it is really worrying me, she can prescribe something to slow my heart rate down a little.  I dont want to do this though.  It is comforting to know others have the same problem (although I would not wish this on anyone).

I have a question.  Is it likely to cause further problems if I keep eating the foods that make it worse, or should I cut these foods out completely. I am drinking decaf coffee which seems to be better.

Ps.  Great website!!! very informative and comforting.

[upbeat63]

I agree, knowledge is power, but it comes with great responsibility to use it right, and it may be harder to apply to oneself objectively. That's the key. Especially when the anxiety overrides all logic.

The great news is, there are many brilliant people on this forum who can assist in their own ways. I've been helped tremendously, as someone who has had both extreme anxiety and high frequency PVCs (I can't remember which came first, or if together, it's been so long).

And I second Tickertok in wishing all many anxiety AND PVC free days.

[bigmick]

Thanks for the response - its much appreciated. I guess you are essentially saying that your own runs of ectopy are kinda like a repeating sequence of the same thing - sometimes up to 8 repetitions. I couldn't pin my own down with such a description: my seem far more random and irregular - tough to find any theme/combination/salvo being repeated 2-10 times or such. Mine vary greatly - sometimes I get a real steady fast beat - not really uncomfortable at all - lasting 3 to 30 beats and then sometimes a pause before NSR is resumed and sometimes not! Other times a run feels like an utter jumble with no discernable pattern at all. Just a chaotic jumble - and sometimes quick enough to really freak me out and leave me a little anxious and even a touch light-headed (assuming it lasts more than a few seconds). Hey, I also get the occasional single ectopic (barely discenrnable in itself) which has a real looong c a v e r n o u s pause after it... like for 2-3 seconds.

My own view is that virtually everyone out there gets ectopic activity - its just that they are not aware of it. For example (and reassurance for other readers here no doubt!) check this out:
TI - The rhythm of the normal human heart.
AU - Clarke JM; Hamer J; Shelton JR; Taylor S; Venning GR
SO - Lancet 1976 Sep 4;1(7984):508-12.

The 24-hour cardiac rhythm was studied in 86 subjects (41 male, 45 female) aged 16-65 years, after exclusion of 15 additional volunteers with suspected abnormalities. The electrocardiogram was recorded continuously for two 24-hour periods. In this apparently normal population, 10 subjects (12%) had disturbances of rhythm which are widely believed to be of serious prognostic significance; they included frequent ventricular ectopic beats, R-on-T and multifocal ventricular ectopic beats, bigeminy, and ventricular tachycardia. Supraventricular tachycardia, infrequent ventricular ectopic beats, junctional rhythm, and second-degree heart block were also observed, and if these are included most of the subjects showed some disturbance of rhythm. Bradyarrhythmias and tachyarrhythmias were equally common in waking hours and during sleep. These disturbances were not confined to the older age-groups. Heart-rate but not the number of arrhythmias was significantly higher in smokers.

PMID- 74472

I myself have always been an extremely anxious and hypochondriacal/cardio-aware person, and boy, do I notice EVERY single ectopic and run of the same.

I should also here add for completeness (indeed, I should have mentioned it in my original post to you - but I wanted to hear your views independant of this info!) that I have had 5 episodes of LAF over the last 6 years (the last being almost 2 yrs ago)- all a few hrs long, all self-converting, all starting in the early am. Heart checks out A1 with 70% EF and no atrial enlargement. I've never aken any meds and nor do I intend to. I guess an ablation or a mini-maze may well await me at some time in the future. Like Many LAFrs, I have also for many yrs (like almost 20 yrs) suffered with bad GERD (including with erosions upon endoscopy as discovered about a year ago) and have found that omeprazole (20mg per day) has helped greatly whilst I've been on it this last year or so. Returning to our original thread of discussion, and before you ask..., no, my runs of ectopy do not feel like AF!

Best wishes,

BM

[bigmick]

Hi there,

I too get those runs of PACs.... I think - never had 'em caught on a Holter tho, so not completely sure that that's what 'they' are. Given that you yourself have had runs of PACs confirmed on a Holter, can you tell me how they 'feel' when you're having them? Does your heart beat regularly or irregularly or can such runs happen either way? Does your heart feel kinda like its trying to beat while its empty, thus giving a kinda freaky hollow/winded/queezy feeling to the run of ectopics? Can such runs of ectopy vary in speed (altho almost always quicker than NSR)?? If so, then you and I are doubtless experiencing much the same thing!

BM

[tickertock]

Sinus arrhythmia is also known as a breathing arrhythmia from my understanding, usually the heartrate increases while inhaling and decreases while exhaling, it is usually a sign of healthy heart function and is assocaited with longevity from what I've read in some medical literature.

[ValerieSN]

Lisa,

I didn't realize the doctor responded.  I guess I should have looked down in the messages more.  I think he mentioned Sinus Arrythmia.  That is different than a PVC I believe.

I don't know much about Sinus Arrythmia so I cannot offer advice there.  But, if the doctors say there is nothing to worry about, I wouldn't.  Have you done research online about it and has it eased any of your mind??

ValerieSN

[lisapep]

Thank you so very much.  You have helped put my mind at ease as well.  We just dropped off the monitor so I should be hearing something soon.  I pray all is well (I am sure the Good Lord will see me through) thank you again for your re-assurance.

May I ask.. when they happen how do you handle them.  IS there a breathing technique? I know I make them worse by freaking out.  Please let me know your thoughts

thanks

lisa

[ValerieSN]

I just wanted to mentioned that a little over a year ago, I was starting to have heart palpitations, where I would feel my heart pounding in my chest and I got periods of a little shortness of breath during that time I would feel my heart beats.  I had an EKG and it was normal as well.  I then went to wear a 24-48 hour holter monitor to record my heart rate and rhythm.  It did show something.  I have what is called Premature Ventricular Contractions (PVC) or also called Premature Ventricular Complex.  It is a common heart arrythmia.  

If you know anything about the heart, there is a right atrium, left ventricle, left atrium and left ventricle.  In the right atrium, there is our natural pacemaker of the heart (or sinoatrial node).  It sends signals down nerve fibers called "The Bundles of His" to the ventricles and the heart beats.  Now, with PVC's, something from the outside of the heart (meaning caffeine, stress, and other factors) act as the electrical trigger that makes the ventricles contract early before it should.  These outside stressors or factors cause the heart to beat.  There isn't anything wrong with the sinoatrial node itself.

Again, this is common.  Too many palpitaions in an hour is not good, though.  Meaning, if you are getting them very frequently every minute, then I would concur with your doctor again.  other than that, I would figure out what may be causing the premature contractions (what triggers) and how to decrease them.  I have been limiting caffeine myself.  I quit smoking because of this too (smoked for 10 yrs).  I still have stress in my life, that I cannot control now, as I am going to college to be a nurse.  Yet, my PVC's are not as frequent as they use to be.

Now, I am not saying you have this, but you very well might have it though.  If the doctor is not worried, it may be this.

Good luck to you.

[lisapep]

THANK YOU VERY VERY MUCH!! You have defiantely put my mind at ease.  
I have always thought Doctors are angels sent down from God. to help us here on earth.  I am sure that your job can at time be taxing and thankless.. but just know that every day you change someones life in a a positive manner.  God Bless You!

Lisa

[lisapep]

OOps I almost forgot:  SOmetimes there is some pain with the episode but it will subside as well.  teh pain is more of a stabbing rather then pressure.  Thanks again.. and you will be blessed 10 fold for helping so many people.

Lisa

[Cleveland Clinic]

Lisapep,

thanks for the post.

my ?? are as follows: can the 24 hr. holter indicate wether the "palpitations" are life threatening.

There are some things that cause palpitations that can be seen on a holter that are entirely benign. It just depends on what they saw.

what is a premature beat and is this a point of major concen?

Generally not. Most everyone has them some more than others. As long as there is no other cardiac problem causing them they are entirely benign. They can be quite bothersome though.

One paramedic said that as i took slow deep breaths in my heart rate would go up then as i slowly exhaled it would go down. is this normal?

Yes. Its called sinus arrythmia. And isa finding in normal healthy hearts.

Are there any other test that I should request to insure all bases are covered?

I would discuss your concerns with your physician. A good history and physical should help tease out any other problems.

good luck