Milk thistle?

[HarlemHon]

Does anyone know if milk thistle is good, bad, or of no effect?  I read somewhere that it is helpful for liver problems so started taking it.  I won't see my dr. for almost three months so can't ask him until then.

[flyinlynn]

Hi

I would suggest you go to the top right of the page and select the green post a question link and start your own thread so more people will notice your question and try to answer. This is an old thread from 2012.

I do know many here are getting treatment on Medicare but I personally know about it as I am covered by my work insurance

Good luck
Lynn

[psu61]

I was diagnosed with Hep C in 1992; was on the transplant list at Duke.  That was 23 years ago. I have cirrhosis and a lesion that they MRI every three months.  I have a low albumin level that regulates the fluid in the blood.  I carry fluid in my abdomen, groin, legs and feet.  Besides fatigue that is the only side effects of the Hep C.  I was thinking of taking 250mg of MT but my doctor says no to herbal supplements.  I'm now 80, off the transplant list and just cooling my heels.  Treatment probably won't help at my age.  My question  concerns insurance for your treatments;  how much does it pay, especially the new one costing $86,000?

[AugustineMama]

Mine says so too. I took milk thistle for 10 years and developed cirrhosis from hepC. The milk thistle did nothing. I got rid of tge HEpC with the new treatment and it cost $100 a month. They do have assistance programs to help you pay if you qualify. I am in the transplant program at Mayo JAX and they say no herbals either.

[psu61]

I was diagnosed with Hep C in 1992; was on the transplant list at Duke.  That was 23 years ago. I have cirrhosis and a lesion that they MRI every three months.  I have a low albumin level that regulates the fluid in the blood.  I carry fluid in my abdomen, groin, legs and feet.  Besides fatigue that is the only side effects of the Hep C.  I was thinking of taking 250mg of MT but my doctor says no to herbal supplements.  I'm now 80, off the transplant list and just cooling my heels.  Treatment probably won't help at my age.  My question  concerns insurance for your treatments;  how much does it pay, especially the new one costing $86,000?

[rambleon40]

The cited milk thistle study focused on only one liver enzyme (why not others?) and gave no numbers, just the conclusion that the difference wasn't "significant."

here's his abstract

What's the definition of "significant?"  

Who paid Dr. Fried?  Who was he speaking to?  Who funds his lab and staff at UNC-Chapel Hill?

Don't know the answers to these questions.  They might be relevant, though.

Also, for some very contra views of milk thistle see, e.g.:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2851903/?tool=pubmed

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17201169

Here's another article authored in part by Fried wherein they acknowledge some hepatoprotective effects (I think):

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18566043?ordinalpos=5&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_DefaultReportPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum


here's one says "good for liver injury, but not viral hepatitis":

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11520257

[rambleon40]

I treated in 1992 and thought I had no sides.  I did not, however, correlate psoriatic arthritis, foot pain, swollen toes and ongoing dry skin that arose shortly following that treatment with the treatment.

I think too that my psyche / personality went a little flat post-1992 (I just lost a bit of my enthusiasm), and I blamed it on other things.  

I only correlated these things after treating again in 2008 and getting pretty much hammered with same symptoms only far worse.

The point is that sometimes when people say "no sides" it might be "no sides that they have connected to treatment"  or "sides that aren't so problematic that they are really noticed."  

Perhaps a repeat treater will think on this subject a bit.  Subtle effects first time around may mean strong effects second time.

[rambleon40]

probably good advice.  

[James10500]

My Doc (Everson) said save your money go out to lunch once a month.

[TexSunflwr]

I treated with interferon/ribavirin in 1999. It didn't work but I had absolutely no lasting side effects. Any sides I did have were gone within a few months of ending treatment.

[uncledudeness]

you hit the nail on the head HPG, the only treatment that cures us is proven. sure there are risks, but there are calculated risks that each of us take daily. i responded to treatment and then relapsed in a few months. i am going to treat again with interferon, ribaviron and incivek. it's been 4 months since i treated and i feel great. sure there are a few sides left e.g. joint pain and a small rash, but they pale in comparison to the alternative. i am probably stage 4 (i still can't get a straight answer to that) so i don't have time to wait for new drugs to be approved.

the point is this; if Interferon was not available to me i might be known as "the former" uncledudeness. i think "almost" everyone would agree that would suk.

i feel for the people that have lingering side effects from treatment, but "the good of many, outweigh the good of a few"....i think i heard that in a star trek episode.

[hrsepwrguy]

"there coming out with non interferon treatment studies right now, so don't tell someone to do treatment"

Hmmm, that is a nice thought, however the projected release for the non interferon tx is 3-5 yrs, interferon has saved many lives and with the  current treatment availible SVR rates are around 75% for all genotypes, for some like me who were diagnosed with borderline cirrhosis, waiting is not a luxury I could afford and treatment looked a whole lot more promising that waiting to advance cirrhosis and possibly on to ESLD, I'm sorry that you are having long term effects but there are many who treat, reach SVR and continue on with there lives without long term problems.

Are you SVR ?

Have a great day

[psmike59]

why the treament ruined my life amost killed me and still having sidez years later, if someone wants to do it another why, good thing. The treatment is poison getting ready to be pulled off too i bet, there coming out with non interferon treatment studies right now, so don't tell someone to do treatment, unless you know for a fact it will work in them and you can't make that promise, i know alot of ppl on disability because of treatment. I collapsed at the 10month mark unalbe to move, walk or talk. This stuff is serious business. I don't blame anyone for finding a better way, im just waiting for the class action lawsuit to come out, cause  ill be on board.

[psmike59]

SAM-e is a much better supplement costs a bit more, but is a strong liver protectant i take it all the time. Also aids in mood.

[ninjamonkey]

I never said MT would heal you but I did say it might make u feel better everyone is different. But if you want to heal your hep c take the treatment for that obviously.

[HarlemHon]

OK, I have read or skimmed over most of these comments.  I never intended milk thistle as a substitute to treatment.  I haven't even had a liver biopsy yet,and I can't make a decision about treatment before that.  So milk thistle is for while I wait.  

[belle19]

maybe my doctor said no because i'm in a clinical trial.  there were 3 groups.    i won't know which group i'm in until the end of the study.  my study nurse is pretty sure i'm in group 1 with the PI.  i have 4 1/2 weeks out of 48 to go.  take care.  belle

[Buffy52]

My Dr.'s said ok to the Milk thistle also Ive been taking it for about three yrs.I read that it was tested in Germany for ten years not to treat hep c   But it did keep the inflammation down

[chainsawmaggie601]

my doctor said ok to milk thistle, but only 175 mg, or 1 pill a day. She ran all my other supplements, and took about half of them away...But, she said the milk thistle is very good. Wish all of them would get on the same page about it. I know we all react differently, and I just can't wait to see my reactions. Starting triple threat, as I call it, on Wednesday. I have been on this site, and you all have such good info, I had many questions when I saw my dr Thursday. Good luck. Maggie

[belle19]

my doctor said NO to milk thistle while on treatment.  good luck to you.  belle

[uncledudeness]

i took MT for 6 months prior to treatment. i think i felt better. but i stopped when i treated. looking back i think i just wanted to do something to help my situation; i felt like i was doing something positive...if it makes you feel better, than do it and forget about all the mumbo jumbo about MT....we all know there is only one way to successfully treat HCV. good luck

[Bali05]

Vit C can maybe indirectly help your immune system but that`s about it.
Silibin by IV has shown such a strong antiviral effect it has been called
a natural PI. Problems is the effects of it are mostly temporary.

I did those VitC IVs when I was still trying to get a handle on my infection
alternatively. The result was enzymes stayed the same but VL went up..lol.
You certainly get a different perspective on things once you reach SVR
and you are on your way there.

Cheers
b

[BoceprevirGal]

I had also read about mega doses of vitamin C, administered by I.V., as having some antiviral promise.
   When-ever I feel like my immune system is low, I usually do take about 1000 mgs of the chewable vitamin C. But this practice could be dangerous for someone who had iron-overload, from the Hep C, because vitamin C helps iron to be absorbed. That kind of freaked me out, but when I had my biopsy, I didn't have that problem, thankfully.
   I think the bottom line is: I wasted alot of years, trying to "cure myself"...my liver enzymes have always been elevated, which shows that my immune system was always trying to fight it, as well. My immune system tends to attack any virus I get, quickly.
   My Doctor said this kind of immune system can cause liver damage quicker then if it didn't attack the virus at all, and just let my body live with the virus. But that my immune system also reacted well to the Interferon/Riba, so I am so glad I decided to get into treatment!

[Bali05]

well , it had that effect on me some time ago but it is also known
to be upsetting to the gastro track in large doses.
This is one reason why in studies they were limited in terms of dosage.
The active compound Silibin in MT if adminstered by IV definately
showed strong antiviral activity. It is actually approved for that use in
Austria .We been posting about this and a lot can be found in the archives.

[BoceprevirGal]

So strange, I was trying to get my ALT/AST down below 400, in order to get into this Research Study, for Hep C.
   So I started taking tons of Milk Thistle, the capsules, and the tincture, all in a weeks time, and it had the exact opposite effect on me: I have never been so sick or constipated, in my entire life, lol
   Maybe it was just the stress of it all, but they never did let me into that study, which I ended up being glad about, I'm doing fine, just doing the triple tx, with my Doctor!