Supplements

[Lilla]

This forum is a wealth of information -- I just wanted everyone to know that, and I'm sure  everyone agrees.   I have read about all different kinds of supplements and get confused.  I take a multi vit., extra calcium (1200 mg total--I'm female/55), Omega-3, CoQ10 and a probiotic....I stopped Milk Thistle as I "think" I read somewhere not to take this, but now I'm not sure.  Can someone post what they may know on Milk Thistle.  Thank You, thank you!!

[Eisbein]

I wrote to you on the other side under Forseegood's post to you. See you there.

Ina

[tallblonde1]

I responded to your above message, but they zapped it because it too personal, I guess.  Did you see it, or should I repost on the other forum?

Susan

[jmjm530]

Goof: Goof: That's why I was uncharacteristically quiet. If the folks wanted it attibuted, I figured they could handle it.
-----------------------------------------
Good point and partly what I was trying to say. The way the internet is, after a few rounds this list will have either Cortisol (or maybe Courtesan :)) on it for relaxation. LOL. BTW, from the other thread, we no longer use "radio" tires, the newer cars use "tv" tires. Thought you'd want to know.

-- J

[tallblonde1]

You're welcome.  I hope your watchful wait is as successful as mine has been so far (knock on wood).

Take care,
Susan

[GoofyDad]

Kalio: Yes it is Califia's list, and when posting it it should be attribured to her and also to HR as his input on the items on the list and the dosages are also very valuable.

Jim: Good point. I asked that question in the following thread when Goofy posted the list but no one, including you, gave me a definitive answer.

Jim: .....hopefully people will not simply copy down the list and start taking what's listed without getting clarification on who exactly the list is intended for.

Goof: That's why I was uncharacteristically quiet. If the folks wanted it attibuted, I figured they could handle it.

  

[swahnzong]

Susan--

Thank you for your time and effort in posting your protocol. I truly appreciate it. Best wishes to you!

[tallblonde1]

Jim,

My probiotic and digestive enzymes are both from Brenda Watson's company...Renew Life.  I purchase them from Vitacost (much, much cheaper), rather than through her website.

Here's the important thing about probiotics...

If you're looking to enhance your immune system, you need a probiotic that is high in bifidobacterium.  Her product is ("Ultimate Flora Adult Formula").

Also, you need an enteric coated capsule.

I take one probiotic capsule in the morning and one digestive enzyme capsule ("Digest More" by Renew Life) at night.  I don't take any supplemental fiber because I get plenty from my diet.

Susan

[Forseegood]

saw you on here and I thought about you...have you ever tried Good Karma Organic Rice Cream? (faux Ice Cream) Very, Very Vanilla? It's really good, I'm hooked (for dessert) no gluten, no dairy...at Trader Joe's for cheap, try it!

[jmjm530]

Thanks again. I'm printing this thread out.

-- Jim

[jmjm530]

Eisbein: think one can improve mightily with diet alone...that leaves lots of improvement on your part:)
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HUH:) Just for the record, those cheese omelet/bacon/home fries bkfasts were only when I was on treatment. I've cut down significantly on fats and carbs recently but have noticed my metabolism is not working as well as it did pre-treatment. Hopefully, I can get things more in gear by a combo of better diet, more exercise, and probably a gradual introduction of some of the supplements listed. BTW what makes you think the interferon didn't accelerate the oteo with your spine? It seem to accelerate anything lurking just under the surface.

Be well and don't forget to report back on any laser research you're doing per my last thread. No rush on this since I'll probably wait until Fall.

-- Jim

[najeen]

This has been a really good thread on the use of supplements and thanks to all who have contributed.

[Eisbein]

Susan, I didn't see your post, and I was not sure if you saw mine, because the thread was removed.
I miss talking to you. I hope you understood what I meant by "brige over troubled water".
Give me a dinge ling if you are up to it.
2006 was a hell of a year.
Now I have been dx with osteoarthritis of the lumbar spine...finally something not Interferon related.
Ain't that a blessing, even though my back is killing me.

____________________________

Jim, the list is also for post treaters who want to help their livers reverse some stages.
Califia unfortunately has still many areas of stage 3 fibrosis, right next to areas of healthy liver tissue.
In conjunction with numerous post tx issues she felt an aggressive supplement regimen could be beneficial.

I think you are correct, everything depends on our individual cicumstances as to how much supplementation we need.
I swallow about 30 vitamins and supplements a day, but only a couple are specifically for the liver.
I target specific organs with my slew of pills, but my diet, out of necessety is so damn good, I feel I don't need to help my liver...I need to help my brain and get out of the funk, as well as my joints, eyes etc.

I think one can improve mightily with diet alone...that leaves lots of improvement on your part:)

Ina

[tallblonde1]

Jim,

Another important thing about probiotics...

Look for brands (like the one I'm using) that contain FOS (fructooligosaccharides).  These organisms are called "prebiotics" and they're basically "food" for the probiotics.  Live organisms, like probiotics have to stay healthy, so they require their own food source.  FOS is the food source.

[jmjm530]

Forsee: have you ever tried Good Karma Organic Rice Cream?
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Sounds very California to me :) Whatever happened to the Sushi? Also gluten and dairy free.

-- J

[jmjm530]

I started the Probiotics a couple of months ago. Which ones do you take and what doses? Same with the digestive enzymes. Do you take fiber supplements like psyillium and/or Flax? Forseegood recommended something called "Ultimate Fiber" which is bascially Psyllium. I will look into the Brenda Watson's formula. Part of me wants to agressively treat the IBS but the other part thinks a lot has to do with stress although I've been stressed before and never had it. Right now I'm upping my aerobic exercise which might help the stress part so between that and the supplements discussed maybe I'll see some progress. Thanks again.

-- Jim

[tallblonde1]

Califia used herbs and supplements during the 10-plus years between treatments and her Stage 2-3 remained the same throughout that period.  No progression.

[tallblonde1]

Califia completed her second tx more than a year ago.  She failed monotherapy back in the early 90's and then did an extended round of combo treatment, which led to SVR.

[jmjm530]

Thanks for further clarification. But Susan does bring to light an important issue when she asked if it was necessary to take these things AFTER treatment. My understanding is that Califia, like Susan, hasn't treated yet? In any event, I would imagine that a list like this is not necessarily one list fits all people and that it would be modified depending on whether one has treated, how much liver damage, as well as I assume other health issues. Too bad Califia and HR aren't around to help clarify and hopefully people will not simply copy down the list and start taking what's listed without getting clarification on who exactly the list is intended for. I'll try and present this question to HR when he returns but I have a feeling his answer will be that it depends on the persons individual profile -- although he will no doubt say it more impressively :)

-- Jim

[tallblonde1]

Not sure if you saw the message I posted to you last week (the thread was removed).  I said I was happy to read about your SVR and wished you continued healing of your post-tx sides.

I also said God bless you...

Susan

[tallblonde1]

These must be HR's recommendations, because I don't recall Califia commenting on them:

Ursadiol
Lactulose
TMG
Taurine
Resveratol
Curcumin (or Turmeric)

I do know that taurine is recommended for epilepsy.  I give it to my epileptic dog (along with phenobarbitol, posstassium bromide, and Keppra) and it's definitely lessened the severity of his weekly seizures.  Not sure why taurine is recommended for folks with HCV.

I'm sorry to hear that you continue to have post-tx problems.  How long have you been taking the probiotics?  I've noticed considerable improvement in my IBS since taking the probiotics AND digestive enzymes and consuming high-fiber foods.  Have you heard about Brenda Watson's H.O.P.E. formula?  Google it.

The other thing that I strongly believe has made a big difference for me is SLEEP.  I make sure that I get a full 8 hours of sleep every night.  A lot of healing takes place during sleep and I don't want to short-change myself of any healing.

Susan

[Eisbein]

The list came from HR. Califia was good enough to put it together for us.
She took many of the supplements prior to talking with him, but he felt some of her dosages needed to be increased to yield better results.

Ina

[jmjm530]

To clarify on what HR added to Califia's list --  would that be anything not listed in your protocol list (C26) but listed in what I posted in "C14".

Thanks.

[jmjm530]

TB: In reviewing the list you provided, I can pretty much tell which items were recommended by Califia and which ones came from HR.
----------------------------
Since Califia and HR haven't been posting recently, would you mind breaking them down or do I just subtract from what I posted in "C14" your list and then come up with what HR added?

TB:

Are you taking some/all of these things? After achieving SVR, is it necessary to take anything? Just curious.
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Currently I'm not taking anything but a multi w/o iron, Omega 3's, Probiotics and sometimes a baby aspirin. That said, I am starting to do some research in terms of getting my immune system/metabolism better balanced. Be it with Chinese herbs (from reputable sources this time); supplements as listed; whatever.

Like many who have treated, the only improvement I've noticed from treatment is when I look at my blood labs and see normal enzymes and no detectible virus.

Physically and mentally, the treatment drugs not left me any better, to the contrary. Persistent skin and digestive problems and more problamatic, a deteriorating lipid profile, especially troublesome to someone like myself with a family history of cardiac problems. My treating doctor finally admitted that the interferon is known to worsen the metabolic syndrome.

No regrets on treating -- didn't have much of a choice as I was told between stage 3 and 4 -- but these drugs really can do a number on your immune and metabolic systems. Therefore the post treatment research to try and get back to where I was physically and mentally BEFORE I treated. So in a more direct answer to your question "is it necessary to take anything?" -- the answer is probably yes, but what to take post treatment may be different than what to take pre-treatment like in your case. And then there are our own individual medical histories to take into consideration.

You are one wise lady with your watch n' wait approach, including the supplements whose role I didn't understand very well way back then.

In case you wake up one night with the irresistible urge to treat, below is some bedside reading in case you missed these threads on some of the post treatment side effects being reported here.

That said, what Dr. A and I mentioned -- one or two shots -- is a different story, so do let us know if you end up pursuing that.

Thanks again for the supplement info and hopefully you'll be around from time to time.

All the best,

-- Jim

Links on post treatment side effects:

http://www.medhelp.org/forums/Hepatitis/messages/41434.html
http://www.medhelp.org/forums/Hepatitis/messages/41439.html
http://www.medhelp.org/forums/Hepatitis/messages/41446.html
http://www.medhelp.org/forums/Hepatitis/messages/41492.html
http://www.medhelp.org/forums/Hepatitis/messages/41498.html
http://www.medhelp.org/forums/Hepatitis/messages/41506.html
http://www.medhelp.org/forums/Hepatitis/messages/41513.html
http://www.medhelp.org/forums/Hepatitis/messages/41515.html

[Kalio1]

Yhe entire list was worked out or approved with HR.

The dose he recommends of laculose is one sip a day.