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alcohol and liver pain

I HAVE RECNTLY COMPLETED NINE MOS. OF TX. MY VIRALS ARE ALL NEGATIVE BUT I STILL HAVE ABOUT 11 WEEKS LEFT OF SHOTS AND RIBAVARIN. I HAVE BEEN HAVE EXPERIENCING PAIN IN UPPER RIGHT SIDE, GOING TOWARDS MY BACK. COULD THIS BE ATTRIBUTED TO MY HAVING A GLASS OF WINE 3-4 TIMES A WEEK?
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Avatar universal
Do not ignore your doctor's advice. If in doubt about what he/she says, then see another liver specialist (hepatologist) for a consult.

Studies suggest that your chances of being cured if not undectible by week 12 are very low unless you extend to 72 weeks. But if you're still detectible at week 24, then your chances are almost non-existent. To continue on with the drugs with no chance of being cured is a bad choice unless a liver specialist can give you a good reason -- for example, that you have significant liver damage and they want to treat longer to slow or stop the rate of that damage.

That said, if you are highly motivated, ask for a 24 week test. If you're UND at week 24, and want to treat a total of 72 weeks, then that's an option. But frankly, I wouldn't treat for  72 weeks unless I had a lot of liver damage -- stage 3 or 4 -- but that's just my opinion, I'm sure some others would.

As to the couple of drinks you took during treatment, don't kick yourself about it, it's water under the damn. Drinking during treatment is not a good idea but that doesn't mean that the little alcohol you took made a difference. Hopefully, you have learned something from all this and alcohol can be something in your past, not in your future.

All the best,

-- Jim

Helpful - 0
264121 tn?1313029456
This is just my view.  I think EVERYONE should treat.  Here's why.  Every day you're treating is another day that the virus is not replicating and is another day your liver and the rest of your body get a rest from it.

There is a doctor in Denver who says it would be beneficial for NINETY PERCENT of those with end-organ liver damage who are on the transplant list to treat anyway.  This is pretty unprecedented but I agree with him.  

Of course, I have always been this way about my medical issues.  I have two: normocytic anemia of chronic disease and high blood pressure (I don't really count my migraines because they are more of annoyance than something that causes damage to my body).  I take my medication for blood pressure every day and it works great.  I have a million friends who are noncompliant with their medication for high bp.  Every day they do that is another day they weaken their blood vessels.  I don't want to stroke out early, so I have no problem taking a pill, even if it makes me a little tired.

Same thing with the anemia.  My body, for whatever reason, doesn't make erythropoeitin appropriately.  So I'm on procrit (epogen actually).  It used to make me feel like I had the flu but I took it because I needed it.  It doesn't bother me anymore now.  

And now I have hep c.  And I can promise you that I will approach it exactly the same way.  I don't intend to neglect this medical issue any more than I have the other medical issues I've dealt with.  I'm going to treat, and if it doesn't, god forbid, work, then I am going to treat again, harder and longer.
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Avatar universal
Thanks for the pep talk! I have an appointment at Vanderbuilt (TN) to see a hepatoligist there. I live in a small town. My Dr is a gastro/Hepatoligist but I fear he may not be up with the latest research. I am fortunate that I can afford the meds, but don't know if I should ignore Drs advice and continue treatment. I am type 1a, which is the most difficult to eradicate. It makes sense to me that 12 weeks of tx with NO alcohol should yield better results. So far, alcohol has not been a temptation (after I resigned myself to the fact that I can never drink again) . In fact I am quite relieved and proud to have that monkey off my back. Right now I feel like I can stay sober for the rest of my life (however shortlived that may be)
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264121 tn?1313029456
Emily, I'm sorry to hear about about the non-response.  It's what each of us fears going into treatment.  At least, as a type 1b, I know it is my greatest fear as I wait for the doc's office to get my medication set up so I can start.  I agree with Sherri though.  Pursue every avenue and don't give up.  Also, your doctor can always write to your insurance company on your behalf and if that doc won't, switch docs.

It is my feeling that it is important enough to try to clear this disease that all measures must be explored.  That includes moving, writing in to try get into one of the studies, joining AA, whatever it takes.  While you do still carry hep c, it is true that any drinking helps the virus spread and it damages your liver more so when making your decision about whether to continue while not in treatment, you need to have that knowledge.  I don't know where you live or whether you have tried AA or other counseling programs before but in this case, I would consider it more vital than ever for you to attend so that you will stay sober.  Good thoughts for you.
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Avatar universal
Call one of the Pharm companies directly... ask for the PATIENT ASSISTANCE PROGRAM... see if you qualify... they MAY be able to assist you in paying for tx... DO NOT GIVE UP...!
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Avatar universal
After having a small drink or two occasionally durring the first few weeks of treatment trying to gradually give it up, I am now at week 18 and test as a non-responder. (viral load decreased but not near 0) I would give anything to go back and skip those few drinks. I can't help but wonder if that prevented the early response. My ins has refused to cover meds now (due to lack of early resopnse) and I am being told to stop tx and just live with the disease. It's hard to accept that there's nothing to be done. I feel very alone and worry about facing the rest of my life feeling this way. I was a heavy drinker for the last 20 years. Stopping has not been difficult when you put it this way: choose one-- Vodka bottle or life! It is your duty to yourself and your family to do whatever it takes to make the tx a success. I sure hate to saddle my family with a sickly wife/ Mom to deal with. I want to be around and able to see my future grandchildren. I hate that they will never remember me as an active vital person, only as a sickly old lady.
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Avatar universal
The tx is so costly that lots can't even afford it and of course if you have insurance,,,,you are totally amazed at how costly your 6 months to a year or longer will cost you and thankful you aren't writing the check.  I wanted to do it one time only and went so much by the book...it was probably over parenoid but I didn't want to have to repeat due to maybe taking some drinks.  Would a dr recommend this?  Honestly wouldn't surprise me as lots of drs don't feel it would harm but for everyone that says ok to drink during tx,,,,I bet there would be a 100 that would say no.  
Best of Luck to you...
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Avatar universal
well said, alagirl...
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264121 tn?1313029456
WOW.  This has been quite the little string of comments.  Of course lvmysts, you know that when someone says they have 3-4 drinks we're each multiplying it by the factor we'd use if we were telling someone how much we drink.  Just sayin'  I mean, in my mind, you're chuggin it out of a box like I did when I was in college and the cartons are piling up behind the house.  Ok, I'm being a little hyperbolic because the truth is, I hardly ever drink.  I still have bottles of alcohol that I brought to Alabama when I moved here from Texas seven years ago, and they're still full.  Drinking's just not a big deal to me.  It makes me too tired to get everything done that I need to do in the evening.  Zonks me right out.  So not drinking during tx is absolutely no big deal for me.

However, I'm on medication that I am positive is probably not all that great for my liver.  And, some of it I don't have a choice about.  Or I do, but I'm choosing to take it if I need it.

Here's my bit of wisdom on drinking.  Just try to be honest with yourself.  A lot of times, I think that's what gets people into trouble with drinking and various substances in the first place, an unwillingness to face the truth, or at least, a desire to deaden the feelings associated with it a little bit.  How's that for some psycho-babble?  So, if you decide to drink during treatment, your treatment is probably not going to be as effective, particularly the heavier your consumption is.  Hands down, that's a given.  There is contention over whether its ok to drink during the first six months after treatment stops, but one thing about that period is certain.  During that time, your liver is still trying to rid itself from the toxic effects of the treatment itself, so just be honest with yourself that you are piling on if you drink, especially if its frequent and/or to excess.

After those six months have passed, I still say the same thing.  Just be honest with yourself.  If you're drinking what the normal person might consider to be too much and you want to do it anyway, fine.  But announce the fact to yourself and with it, the fact that you're giving your liver a lot of toxins to screen.  Don't try to sugarcoat it or rationalize or whatever. The last person you need to lie to is yourself.  And by the way, I don't think that one drink every once in a while at any point is going to make a clinically significant difference.  The reason I don't recommend it is that I have a feeling that the people who NEED one drink that badly aren't going to stop at one and it isn't going to be every once in a while.  Otherwise, why would you do it at all during this phase in your life when you're working through the hep c virus.

And by the way, just so I can make everyone angry in an equal opportunity sort of way, I don't think drinking is the only area in which hep c'rs are sometimes in denial.  I think they are in denial over treatment at times.  I think people put treatment off and rationalize it with all sorts of excuses when really, they just don't want to deal with the side effects, or maybe they just don't want to admit that they are sick.  They feel like their liver is "ok" because they are at this stage and this grade when a host of new studies show that hep c has an impact on other systems in the body.  If you have hep you are sick.  And there is new research coming out all the time showing just how damaging hep c is.  That old adage that you don't die of hep c, you die with it?  That is becoming increasingly less true as the role of this disease in renal failure and other issues is being shown.

And in parting, I don't think that because someone chooses to drink or not to drink, or hell, if they're shooting up heroin up every day, that they deserve the support of this forum any less.  If there is a perfect person here, then gee, I'd like to meet you.  But to my knowledge, nobody has made me a deity yet.  I've got plenty of opinions, but nobody has given me the authority to judge other people or to say whether or not they deserve to be on treatment or deserve answers to their questions.  This is a medhelp board.  To berate someone for having the honesty to talk about something that perhaps (I don't know, just speculating) others are doing in private instead of educating them and answering their question is not terribly helpful.  In my view.  

.
Helpful - 0
85135 tn?1227289772
One of the first things I noticed in your post was that you had quadrupled you dr’s advice. I did not want to rub your face in it on your first post and I’m thrilled that you saw it yourself.
Please do not be a stranger here. Come back often and ask questions or just let us know how you are doing.
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86075 tn?1238115091
I think I'd rather contract amoebic dysentery at this point...lol...anyway, hope youre well though...miss your music stories on the other side, wherever...
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132578 tn?1189755837
maybe if one of our well informed club members explained WHY its bad to drink while you have Hep C , it would be better understood by all .

Any takers?
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228020 tn?1201650185
welcome!
I'm ever so glad you are not gonna drink and treat at the same time.You have made me really happy.
Maybe you can tell us about ur stats, whenever ur ready....

cheers!
Frank
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Avatar universal
Wow! My doctor made a joke(?) about "not drinking more than a case a week" to me when I first started. On the second weekend I drank quite a bit both days "because I worked hard and deserved it". That Monday was the absolutely most depressed day of my life and I'm not one to have fits of depression. It scared me to no end.

That Monday and just now reading this thread has confirmed to me that drinking while on tx is the stupidest thing I have ever done in my life. 4 weeks later I still have absolutely no desire to pop open a can of beer, bottle of wine or bottle of bourbon. A thing that came ever so easily to me in the past.

All of you have made an impression. From the comfort thy neighbor to the kick his *** so he won't do it again.

You are all right and I thank you all.

From a newcomer with little experience...
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228020 tn?1201650185
Riightttt, like I was talking to you to begin with.....But that's okay, I knew it would come down to this. "I'm over it now."
Do you have hepC?  I'm not asking so i can ridicule u, just curious to know is all. But remember, our biggest glory is not in never failing, but in rising every time we fall.
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248382 tn?1274938634
addendum:  IGNORE THE BULLIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  The good on this forum far outweighs the negative attitudes & judgemental bu** sh**.   Do Not stop writing!  jenn
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248382 tn?1274938634
I am glad you found the forum.  It is a wonderful group.  Good for you admitting to "cheating".  I think the forum is a safe place and is open to letting any one of us  have our say and ask questions we need to ask.
  
A myriad of personalities and attitudes makes it all the more helpful and interesting.  

You have touched my heart with your courage to be honest.  TAke care jenn
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Avatar universal
There is nothing wrong with trying to "fix" people...It's when we give up on humanity, that there's a problem. I had a blood transfusion in 1981 which saved my life...but gave me Hep C. The day I found out.. I was angry... but I immediately channeled that into  positive thoughts. After all...they could have given me blood tainted with Aids...or  I could have been a drinker... (in which case I probably would be dead by now). Which brings me back to the  alcohol issue. I never knew this subject would touch so many nerves... but I totally see it differently now that I've read all these opinions. I have never been a drinker... but was introduced to Pinot about four or five years ago...and until this January, have had a glass at dinner almost every night. If I am at a social event I have two. Believe it or not...I have been drunk once in my life! In 1979 at my sons Baptism, someone gave me vodka with orange juice...Let me rephrase that...A FEW vodkas. I got so drunk, I passed out on bedroom floor. My husband took out the polaroid and proceeded to document this. What I saw the next day sickened me. My dad once told me that there is nothing worse than a woman stumbling around a bar... (I probably just set the womans movement back 40 years!)... well this was my home, which made it worse. I felt I left my dignity on the floor. I am five feet tall and weigh 116 lbs.. If I have more than 2 glasses of wine...I am done. When I wrote to ask about the pain on my side, I guess I needed to admit to someone...that after my doc said one glass would not kill me...I was cheating and having 3 or 4 a week. I have never thought that wine was a problem. I felt it  relaxing after working all day... (like men that have a beer when they get home). So now I know your forum was not trying to beat up on me. Some of you sound like there is so much pain within... while others seem very enlightened. Believe it or not...just reading this for a few days has been very theraputic. Continue to share your stories and your advice... you never know how many hearts you will touch.    
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Avatar universal
I’ll always remember’
the moon in September
and the head at the top of the glass

O’ it looked so good’
a full body as such
and a head at the top’
of the….. glasssss!

O’ yes…, I will remember
the Full Moon in September
that reminds me of the last
full head of my….. glasssss!

as this good fellow waddles down the street twirling his umbrella.

Hot damn getter that was good
Lol!

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Avatar universal
you started it with the first insult.
and you are way off base.
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86075 tn?1238115091
hmmmm, maybe moments like fumigation rites too:)
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Avatar universal
Forsee to Gauf: Is that a punching bag next to your head???
----------------------------------------------
I think MH has given us  private email for moments like this.
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228020 tn?1201650185
I'm confused as to what exactly u mean by "ahole": Is that like something u resemble perhaps? Stop talking sh*t pal!
If you are drinking and you are on treatments then in my books your must be a first class  d*ck head...Thats all there is to it, and if you cant handle it then P*SS OFF!
there now ive gone down to ur level.

DO SOMETHING WITH THIS DRINKING PROBLEM YOU HAVE.
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Avatar universal
I'm not txing...39 must be!!!!  Me-  I get sick and tired of people spouting out whatever the heck  they feel like saying..mean people stink and they don't think b4 they speak......extra opinionated people are a dime a dozen...I see and I ignore them all the time....try putting some heart and love and respect out there..people may actually listen to that.... so for me , no it's not the chemo...it's the unkindness, it pzzes me off bad!...(most of you here are pretty cool tho.) Ya know this is certainly a tough world to live  thru somedays...we all have to keep our own tudes in check....cuz it ain't anybody elses fault if your'e not happy,   And there AIN"T nobody specialer than anyone else around here. so jeez if someone comes here for help, give them the benefit of the doubt...they are most likely sick too. Even if you don't like what they may say...(a fake will soon be seen for wht it is) It's not so much the admonishing, it's the judgemental attitudes.
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