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A question for Grace
Hi Grace,
You mentioned that it is important to put on a condom before penetration to help prevent HSV. What about two people (one is positive, the other negative) sleeping together naked in the same bed? Should one be wearing a underwear to prevent accidentally exposure, such as rolling over each other, etc? Thanks.
You mentioned that it is important to put on a condom before penetration to help prevent HSV. What about two people (one is positive, the other negative) sleeping together naked in the same bed? Should one be wearing a underwear to prevent accidentally exposure, such as rolling over each other, etc? Thanks.
Hi Grace,
Good response. Thanks. I had a chat with the sex educator. Suffice it to say: she didn't see my side of things. I did, however, ask her if she's ever had an oral cold sore--to which she responded, "yes, of course." I then said: "Do you then consider yourself orally unhealthy." Not to be trumped she left the discussion with, "Absolutely not, the genitalia is just different."
I think she's on to something with that comment. Why is it that when the genitalia is affected by a relatively minor skin condition that the national health guard is called in to protect unaffected vaginas and penises across the country? Yet, when it's the lips/mouth affected by a very similar virus, it simply doesn't matter, passed off as a rite of passage into adulthood.
It seems, to me anyway, that many sexual educators are complicit in this mythology surrounding the genitalia. In fact, I understand that in the US there have even been laws enacted to protect those who are infected with HSV2 by a willful partner. I wonder if it was another part of the body affected by HSV2 if we'd have the same societal reactions (legal, medical, social, etc.,) I think the example of HSV 1 provides a particularly telling example of the different reactions. Ironically, 60% of neonatal herpes in Canada is a direct result of HSV 1. Yet there are no laws about this....
Anyway, thanks for your help. Enough on the soapbox.
An additional question:
What percentage of whitlows are type 1 vs type 2.
Good response. Thanks. I had a chat with the sex educator. Suffice it to say: she didn't see my side of things. I did, however, ask her if she's ever had an oral cold sore--to which she responded, "yes, of course." I then said: "Do you then consider yourself orally unhealthy." Not to be trumped she left the discussion with, "Absolutely not, the genitalia is just different."
I think she's on to something with that comment. Why is it that when the genitalia is affected by a relatively minor skin condition that the national health guard is called in to protect unaffected vaginas and penises across the country? Yet, when it's the lips/mouth affected by a very similar virus, it simply doesn't matter, passed off as a rite of passage into adulthood.
It seems, to me anyway, that many sexual educators are complicit in this mythology surrounding the genitalia. In fact, I understand that in the US there have even been laws enacted to protect those who are infected with HSV2 by a willful partner. I wonder if it was another part of the body affected by HSV2 if we'd have the same societal reactions (legal, medical, social, etc.,) I think the example of HSV 1 provides a particularly telling example of the different reactions. Ironically, 60% of neonatal herpes in Canada is a direct result of HSV 1. Yet there are no laws about this....
Anyway, thanks for your help. Enough on the soapbox.
An additional question:
What percentage of whitlows are type 1 vs type 2.
Can you email her or call her to talk to her about this? Ask her why she said that. If the reason isn't valid, let her know how it's probably a good idea for her to find a better way to say what she wants to say. Telling someone that they are genitally unhealthy because of herpes, is just one more negative message being sent needlessly which makes it harder for folks to adjust to the idea of herpes when they contract it. considering how many of those 10th graders will have hsv1 or hsv2 genitally within the next 5 years of their lives, teaching them in a down to earth way that approaches it from the idea that std's are just germs that are typically transmitted through being hot and sweaty and having direct skin on skin contact with a partner is a much better way to handle it. Sex educators should be battling the stigma of std's, not promoting it. if she meant it from the standpoint that having hsv2 genitally makes you more likely to contract a 2nd std and/or hiv, she should say that ,not use the phrase genitally unhealthy.
You could also say "excuse me but I have genital herpes and my doctor has never ever mentioned that my vagina is unhealthy"....he he he
You could also say "excuse me but I have genital herpes and my doctor has never ever mentioned that my vagina is unhealthy"....he he he
Thanks Grace :)
If I were to speak up to that sex educator, what could I possibly say in response to her comment that someone with GH not being in good genital health? I would love to have a ready-made response for the future....
If I were to speak up to that sex educator, what could I possibly say in response to her comment that someone with GH not being in good genital health? I would love to have a ready-made response for the future....
sounds like that person is either clueless or trying to scare the kids.
typically recurrences are limited to just 1 side in most cases.
grace
typically recurrences are limited to just 1 side in most cases.
grace
Hi Grace.
I'm back with a couple more questions:
Today, someone (a sexual education counsellor, doing a talk to a grade 10 class) mentioned that a person with genital herpes is "genitally unhealthy" in terms of sexual health. What is your make of this? I mean, it is an transmittable infection, but....this sounds so terrible.
2) Can a recurring infection take place on both sides of the body (during the same outbreak)?
I'm back with a couple more questions:
Today, someone (a sexual education counsellor, doing a talk to a grade 10 class) mentioned that a person with genital herpes is "genitally unhealthy" in terms of sexual health. What is your make of this? I mean, it is an transmittable infection, but....this sounds so terrible.
2) Can a recurring infection take place on both sides of the body (during the same outbreak)?
1 - I think covering the bases with accurate info is a good idea. I typically email links to asha's herpes info and also the herpes handbook to potential partners after our initial "talk"
2- as far as I'm concerned yes they do. One can argue they should also discuss their hsv1 status prior to kissing but even I don't do that myself.
grace
2- as far as I'm concerned yes they do. One can argue they should also discuss their hsv1 status prior to kissing but even I don't do that myself.
grace
Amazing. THANKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
1) Do you think that a HSV2 positive person has the responsibility to not only tell the uninfected potential sex partner about their status, but also about all the methods of transmission, shedding, etc. Or it that something the other person needs to do? How much disclosure/education is on the shoulders of the person with the infection?
2) Does a HSV 1 positive person have a responsibility to tell a partner oral sex partner about their infection?
1) Do you think that a HSV2 positive person has the responsibility to not only tell the uninfected potential sex partner about their status, but also about all the methods of transmission, shedding, etc. Or it that something the other person needs to do? How much disclosure/education is on the shoulders of the person with the infection?
2) Does a HSV 1 positive person have a responsibility to tell a partner oral sex partner about their infection?
1- you should be donating blood when you feel your best and are not run down so that your body recovers quickly. if your body is busy fighting off a herpes recurrence, it's best to wait a week and donate then when you are feeling top notch again.
2 - as much as for during pregnancy as anything. if you can keep a women hsv2 negative during her child birthing years, all the better. also since it increases your risk of hiv, always helpful to reduce the risk of infection. most relationships don't last so even though you and your partner might be all googlely eyes and oh baby I'll love you forevers now, next week may be different....he he he
3 - never saw that stat before. good study showed that in 6 months after diagnosis, most folks are back to their baseline. now if that baseline is depression and suicidal ideation, no reason to think that having a herpes diagnosis is going to make all that go away.
2 - as much as for during pregnancy as anything. if you can keep a women hsv2 negative during her child birthing years, all the better. also since it increases your risk of hiv, always helpful to reduce the risk of infection. most relationships don't last so even though you and your partner might be all googlely eyes and oh baby I'll love you forevers now, next week may be different....he he he
3 - never saw that stat before. good study showed that in 6 months after diagnosis, most folks are back to their baseline. now if that baseline is depression and suicidal ideation, no reason to think that having a herpes diagnosis is going to make all that go away.
So amazing, thanks.
Yes, Dr Warren's book looks good. I read the free chapters available on amazon. I'm not sure if she's HSV 2 positive or not....but, you clearly are, and are really open about having it, dealing with it honestly, without much fanfare. That would make for an excellent book. Someone who's actually be there and gone through it all---as opposed to the standpoint of a nurse/doctor who's only read about it in textbooks/or witnessed it in patients. Consider writing it!
A couple more questions:
1) Blood donations clinics often advice HSV2 patients not to donate during an outbreak. What's the reason? Are the antibodies in the blood higher at this time and more dangerous?
2) Out of curiosity: why is there such a huge push towards HSV2 prevention between couples with different HSV statuses. Why is preventing is it so deeply encouraged (almost as if it were HIV) in the context of monogamy?
3) I read that 29% (on a herpes website) of people newly diagnosed with HSV2 consider suicide. Is this accurate? Based on your experience, do most people get over the diagnosis and not think of it much or does it always haunt them in their everyday lives?
Yes, Dr Warren's book looks good. I read the free chapters available on amazon. I'm not sure if she's HSV 2 positive or not....but, you clearly are, and are really open about having it, dealing with it honestly, without much fanfare. That would make for an excellent book. Someone who's actually be there and gone through it all---as opposed to the standpoint of a nurse/doctor who's only read about it in textbooks/or witnessed it in patients. Consider writing it!
A couple more questions:
1) Blood donations clinics often advice HSV2 patients not to donate during an outbreak. What's the reason? Are the antibodies in the blood higher at this time and more dangerous?
2) Out of curiosity: why is there such a huge push towards HSV2 prevention between couples with different HSV statuses. Why is preventing is it so deeply encouraged (almost as if it were HIV) in the context of monogamy?
3) I read that 29% (on a herpes website) of people newly diagnosed with HSV2 consider suicide. Is this accurate? Based on your experience, do most people get over the diagnosis and not think of it much or does it always haunt them in their everyday lives?
Terri already wrote a much better book than I ever could :)
1 - first off the obvious reason - active lesion means open portal into the body. then there are also changes in the skin that occur when hsv2 infects the genital area that make it much easier for hsv2 to infect you.
2 - I'm a fan of femdophilus my jarrow myself but I only take it because I have had bv issues for the last 5 or 6 years. No research showing that hsv2 causes an increase in vaginitis. sometimes it a chicken and egg thing - you have bv especially which increases your risk of std's in general. also sometimes once you get yeast, getting rid of it is easier said than done.
3 - some of it's the material the sex toys are made out of and also it's partly the way you use them. your bf using a dildo on you and then you using it anally on him is a bit different than your bf manually stimulating you.
grace
1 - first off the obvious reason - active lesion means open portal into the body. then there are also changes in the skin that occur when hsv2 infects the genital area that make it much easier for hsv2 to infect you.
2 - I'm a fan of femdophilus my jarrow myself but I only take it because I have had bv issues for the last 5 or 6 years. No research showing that hsv2 causes an increase in vaginitis. sometimes it a chicken and egg thing - you have bv especially which increases your risk of std's in general. also sometimes once you get yeast, getting rid of it is easier said than done.
3 - some of it's the material the sex toys are made out of and also it's partly the way you use them. your bf using a dildo on you and then you using it anally on him is a bit different than your bf manually stimulating you.
grace
Oh wow, such great answers.
Grace, you should really write a book. Make it in question and answer format: it would be bestseller, for sure!!!!
A couple more questions. I'll stop soon. I promise :)
1) I understand that HIV is easier to contract in people with HSV2 (if they have unprotected sex with someone with HIV, of course). Why is this? Is this because of lesions or because of a general cell change in the genitals. Is this only during an outbreak or always?
2) It sounds to me that HSV2 alters the environment of the vagina and as such women are more susceptible to yeast, etc. Do you think probiotics are a good idea for women to take as a treatment, preventative of this? (My experience is they are good for yeast, etc?
3) Not to beat a dead horse but: What is the difference between a sex toy (used by a person with HSV) and a hand (touched to the genitals of someone with HSV) in terms of passing on the infection to a HSV negative person? Why are sex toys more of a risk?
Grace, you should really write a book. Make it in question and answer format: it would be bestseller, for sure!!!!
A couple more questions. I'll stop soon. I promise :)
1) I understand that HIV is easier to contract in people with HSV2 (if they have unprotected sex with someone with HIV, of course). Why is this? Is this because of lesions or because of a general cell change in the genitals. Is this only during an outbreak or always?
2) It sounds to me that HSV2 alters the environment of the vagina and as such women are more susceptible to yeast, etc. Do you think probiotics are a good idea for women to take as a treatment, preventative of this? (My experience is they are good for yeast, etc?
3) Not to beat a dead horse but: What is the difference between a sex toy (used by a person with HSV) and a hand (touched to the genitals of someone with HSV) in terms of passing on the infection to a HSV negative person? Why are sex toys more of a risk?
1- perhaps....he he he
2 - a sex toy is different from another surface. If you have herpes and your partner uses a sex toy on you and then you use it on them, that is a way to transmit herpes. If you clean the sex toy off with soap and water though before using it on your partner, not a risk.
3 - most folks just avoid sex during obvious symptoms genitally to be honest. Other's use condoms. some do do the whole shebang.
4- I'm always on suppressive therapy so I have very few recurrences. when I do they start out with a particular itch that I recognize and then gets painful and a small ulceration in the skin is present.
grace
2 - a sex toy is different from another surface. If you have herpes and your partner uses a sex toy on you and then you use it on them, that is a way to transmit herpes. If you clean the sex toy off with soap and water though before using it on your partner, not a risk.
3 - most folks just avoid sex during obvious symptoms genitally to be honest. Other's use condoms. some do do the whole shebang.
4- I'm always on suppressive therapy so I have very few recurrences. when I do they start out with a particular itch that I recognize and then gets painful and a small ulceration in the skin is present.
grace
Thanks for the reassurance: I just want to learn as much about the infection. I'm a teacher and really think this is fantastic educational stuff, in addition to my own person interest in it:
1) Why does the UK and Europe have such dramatically lower rates of HSV 2 compared to North America? Are they having less sex? hahahah.
2) If HSV2 cannot be transmitted by indirect hand contact, why are sex toys not recommended to be shared in discordant couples and as such carry a low risk (not no risk) for transmission? What is the difference between shared sex toys and hand genital contact (if someone touches themselves first) in terms of risk?
3) When a negative man (for example) becomes sexually involved with a HSV 2 positive woman, do you find (based on the wide experiences you witnessed) that most insist on strict condom use, coupled with suppressive therapy and excessive hand washing? Or do people relax after some time in being in the relationship?
4) After 20 years plus with this infection, what do your outbreaks typically look like? Personal question, I know. Feel free to ignore.
1) Why does the UK and Europe have such dramatically lower rates of HSV 2 compared to North America? Are they having less sex? hahahah.
2) If HSV2 cannot be transmitted by indirect hand contact, why are sex toys not recommended to be shared in discordant couples and as such carry a low risk (not no risk) for transmission? What is the difference between shared sex toys and hand genital contact (if someone touches themselves first) in terms of risk?
3) When a negative man (for example) becomes sexually involved with a HSV 2 positive woman, do you find (based on the wide experiences you witnessed) that most insist on strict condom use, coupled with suppressive therapy and excessive hand washing? Or do people relax after some time in being in the relationship?
4) After 20 years plus with this infection, what do your outbreaks typically look like? Personal question, I know. Feel free to ignore.
you didn't get hsv2 from a hand job that I can assure you. I just read through your whole post with HHH and totally 2nd his responses to you - whatever is going on, it's not hsv2 from your most recent partner.
grace
grace
LOL!!!!! You're right: it is like a test. But don't worry: you easily earned an A with all your great answers:
As to why? Well, I'm naturally inquisitive and inadvertently started dating someone with HSV 2 (genital). I found out after our first and only sexual encounter. It only consisted of a vaginal massage (I guess, most people here are calling it a hand job---an expression I just love!!!). Our genitals were fully covered by clothing. I didn't even see his penis :) And I wouldn't have thought even twice after until symptoms developed five days after the encounter, strongly suggestive of HSV. I wrote to HHH about it. And, now, after reading your answers, it does indeed look like an initial outbreak can include lesions on non-genital areas, which also makes me wonder about "hand jobs" (considering the virus can live on sex toys and be passed on to an uninfected partner that way---what's the difference?)
I am now super interested in this topic and one question seems to be leading to another. I hope you don't mind.
As to why? Well, I'm naturally inquisitive and inadvertently started dating someone with HSV 2 (genital). I found out after our first and only sexual encounter. It only consisted of a vaginal massage (I guess, most people here are calling it a hand job---an expression I just love!!!). Our genitals were fully covered by clothing. I didn't even see his penis :) And I wouldn't have thought even twice after until symptoms developed five days after the encounter, strongly suggestive of HSV. I wrote to HHH about it. And, now, after reading your answers, it does indeed look like an initial outbreak can include lesions on non-genital areas, which also makes me wonder about "hand jobs" (considering the virus can live on sex toys and be passed on to an uninfected partner that way---what's the difference?)
I am now super interested in this topic and one question seems to be leading to another. I hope you don't mind.
ok i gotta ask - why the zillion questions? I feel like I"m taking a test here....lol
grace
grace
Very interesting, thanks. WOW!
-How common is this among initial infections? Rare or fairly common? Do you have the names of any of this research. Would love to look it up..
-Is HSV1 easier to contract than 2? What I mean, is given the fact that many children get type 1 as a child and likely haven't engaged in much kissing (apart from a quick peck on the cheek, lips from mom, dad, etc), it stands to reason that type 1 can be passed on through indirect contact such as hands, surfaces. etc? Whereas based on what I read about type 2, indirect contact cannot pass it on (at least not in any measurable numbers). It takes a lot of heat, fiction and sustained contact with a mucous membrane.
So, does type 1 live longer on hands and surfaces than type 2, accounting for the fact that many children contract it without having passionate, sustained kissing from an infected partner?
-How common is this among initial infections? Rare or fairly common? Do you have the names of any of this research. Would love to look it up..
-Is HSV1 easier to contract than 2? What I mean, is given the fact that many children get type 1 as a child and likely haven't engaged in much kissing (apart from a quick peck on the cheek, lips from mom, dad, etc), it stands to reason that type 1 can be passed on through indirect contact such as hands, surfaces. etc? Whereas based on what I read about type 2, indirect contact cannot pass it on (at least not in any measurable numbers). It takes a lot of heat, fiction and sustained contact with a mucous membrane.
So, does type 1 live longer on hands and surfaces than type 2, accounting for the fact that many children contract it without having passionate, sustained kissing from an infected partner?
sometimes it's on the buttocks from contact with the virus there but most times it's from the virus infecting the nerves and showing a lesion there. Several research studies out there showing that folks initially infected can have non-genital lesions as well as lesions in multiple locations initially.
grace
grace
You are asking great questions. I hope others will read your post and benefit from it.
Oh my...you are so right: clear as mud LOL!!!!!!
How would a newly acquired infection, initial outbreak occur on the buttock for example? Would it have had to have been inoculated into the skin, through dry humping, for example? I understand the nerves are connected but I thought that the blisters only occur in other areas (such as legs, buttock) in later outbreaks because it takes that time to settle into their new environment and that the initial, newly acquired outbreak takes places in the area of the most friction. AAAHHHHHH :)
How would a newly acquired infection, initial outbreak occur on the buttock for example? Would it have had to have been inoculated into the skin, through dry humping, for example? I understand the nerves are connected but I thought that the blisters only occur in other areas (such as legs, buttock) in later outbreaks because it takes that time to settle into their new environment and that the initial, newly acquired outbreak takes places in the area of the most friction. AAAHHHHHH :)
Thanks again for the great information. To get this straight: you are saying that an initial outbreak on the buttock or thigh, for example, is possible; however, if it happens, that means it's just not a recently acquired infection but rather the first noticeable recurrence? I this correct?
- it's like 4-5% risk each year for the woman
- you can have the initial ob anywhere. most folks who think that it's a newly acquired infection, are actually just having their first obvious recurrence
-hsv2 increases your risk for hiv so it is a big deal in that aspect. also babies who contract hsv2 during birth can have devastating outcomes.
grace
- you can have the initial ob anywhere. most folks who think that it's a newly acquired infection, are actually just having their first obvious recurrence
-hsv2 increases your risk for hiv so it is a big deal in that aspect. also babies who contract hsv2 during birth can have devastating outcomes.
grace
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You are reading content posted in the Herpes Community
Herpes spreads by oral, vaginal and anal sex.
Herpes sores blister, then burst, scab and heal.
STIs are the most common cause of genital sores.
Millions of people are diagnosed with STDs in the U.S. each year.
STDs can't be transmitted by casual contact, like hugging or touching.
Syphilis is an STD that is transmitted by oral, genital and anal sex.
