Aa
This happen to anybody?
When I am tired, my foot will slowly slip of fthe gas pedal when I'm driving. I don't even notice till the car abruptly slows down. I mentioned this to my sister last night, and she laughed because she does the same thing. Anybody else??????
Penn
Penn
Oh no...I'll have to get the book!!!! I need to keep up with this group! Seriously though Penn, I wish you the best at CC.....Craig
I forgot to mention that "Man of LaMancha" is going to be required reading for the Gamma Hypo Chondria members (did i reverse the order again???)! We're all out there fighting our windmills and need all the tips we can get!
Penn
Penn
Zilla - hopefully DH means dear hubby in my case. Although I'll be checking the closet for that orange jumpsuit...lol.Very impresed with your Spanish, by the way=)
Craig- I missed that you had asked about my EMG. Yes, it was negative. This really surprised me, since excruciating spasms are my most bothersome symptom. Woke up @ 3am today to find my thumb literally jumping up and down at a speed I could not reach trying to replicate it. I could feel like a "bolt" from my elbow to the thumb. It continued for at least a minute or 2 after it woke me up. Really weird - story of my life right now:)
Penn
Craig- I missed that you had asked about my EMG. Yes, it was negative. This really surprised me, since excruciating spasms are my most bothersome symptom. Woke up @ 3am today to find my thumb literally jumping up and down at a speed I could not reach trying to replicate it. I could feel like a "bolt" from my elbow to the thumb. It continued for at least a minute or 2 after it woke me up. Really weird - story of my life right now:)
Penn
Penn-in case you don't see my CCF post, the neuro I saw has initials L.S. She is a real candidate for the weinie roast. One of her comments was "I'm just a little old MS neurologist, I don't know much else". Wow, all the way to Cleveland for that!!
I am working on that complaint letter to Cleveland. And being the dull boring engineer that I am, I have never seen Man of La Moncha or read the book. In the meantime, I am really nervous waiting for the LP results at my appt on Thursday. I always worry that the docs will just send me home and act like I am a psych case. We'll see....Craig
I am working on that complaint letter to Cleveland. And being the dull boring engineer that I am, I have never seen Man of La Moncha or read the book. In the meantime, I am really nervous waiting for the LP results at my appt on Thursday. I always worry that the docs will just send me home and act like I am a psych case. We'll see....Craig
Hi!
Don't be so impressed~
The Man of La Mancha was the first musical or live stage play I EVER saw! I was 14, and an usher at the Fisher Theatre in Detroit. It left quite an impression on me. I knew right then that I wanted to be on stage. As an usher, I "had" to see the play a few times. I took up acting in college and acted professionally in regional theatre before I got married.
I did read 'Don,' at some point along the way, but I only took high school Latin. How I'd love to be able to read something in "the original Renaissance Spanish!" WOW! Or, as we Latin speaking people say in Spanish--"WOW-O"
Also~~What does DH stand for? Dear Hubby? D*** Husband? I've always wondered? I'm never hip to the lingo...
Also, also~~I watch all those Forensic File shows, Penn. Be careful. Your hubby could be poisoning you. The clue would be if they interview him for the show in an orange jumpsuit, he's poisoning you. Orange jumpsuit -- guilty. Very big clue. Be careful. But if they interview you two together, rest assured that he still loves you and the two of you are still very happily married, and the whole incident has only strengthened your marriage. It's these little things I pick up on that would make being a forensic detective a great second career for me.
Craig ~~ Write the letter! You owe it to yourself!
Have a great day, everyone!
Zilla*
Don't be so impressed~
The Man of La Mancha was the first musical or live stage play I EVER saw! I was 14, and an usher at the Fisher Theatre in Detroit. It left quite an impression on me. I knew right then that I wanted to be on stage. As an usher, I "had" to see the play a few times. I took up acting in college and acted professionally in regional theatre before I got married.
I did read 'Don,' at some point along the way, but I only took high school Latin. How I'd love to be able to read something in "the original Renaissance Spanish!" WOW! Or, as we Latin speaking people say in Spanish--"WOW-O"
Also~~What does DH stand for? Dear Hubby? D*** Husband? I've always wondered? I'm never hip to the lingo...
Also, also~~I watch all those Forensic File shows, Penn. Be careful. Your hubby could be poisoning you. The clue would be if they interview him for the show in an orange jumpsuit, he's poisoning you. Orange jumpsuit -- guilty. Very big clue. Be careful. But if they interview you two together, rest assured that he still loves you and the two of you are still very happily married, and the whole incident has only strengthened your marriage. It's these little things I pick up on that would make being a forensic detective a great second career for me.
Craig ~~ Write the letter! You owe it to yourself!
Have a great day, everyone!
Zilla*
'Zilla gets the trivia award of the day - that WAS Don Quixote's horse's name! I am so impressed.
Craig, your doc @ CCF was not Dr. Ku****er, was it? I don't want to put her name, although I tihnk I already did on another thread, not thinking.
I don't THINK my hubby would try to poison me, but I have been a little cranky the past several months. Hmmmmmm..........
Penn
Craig, your doc @ CCF was not Dr. Ku****er, was it? I don't want to put her name, although I tihnk I already did on another thread, not thinking.
I don't THINK my hubby would try to poison me, but I have been a little cranky the past several months. Hmmmmmm..........
Penn
Penn - looks like the mimics are being well ruled out. Remember that Lyme really does take a Western Blot, which you may have to ask for. IS you DH trying to poison you? We had a sweet old couple when I trained at LA County General. She was in for some mysterious neuro disease and her husband visited her daily - and brought her chocolate covered cherries. One day the resident asked for one (and was reamed out for being inappropriate!) He sent the cherry to the lab and they found it laced with something, I think it was strychnine. This was eons ago - you all remember dynosaursm giant ferns, volcanic activity...
Your cramps sound awful and I do hope you have a better experience than Craig. Yes, we get to roast your neuro, too.
Craig - Where are you now that CCF failed you? Have you written the director of the CCF and told then that after all the wait, anticipation, work of getting accomodations for you and your kids AND the huge expense that she not only rather dismissed you outright, but failed to help further the workup? Places like that have to be the thorough ones, the ones who think of the weird stuff. And They are paid BIG BUCKS - that's for their time and their supposedly vaster knowledge. People should not have to find out their info online from a pediatrician who isn't really up in the field. You sound very dejected and discouraged. And I agree, you don't have a peripheral neuropathy (if I remember your history correctly).
Moeck - Do you have problems knowing if you really have a firm grip on things? (I mean, other than reality,lol?)
'Zilla - Even though I read the entirety of "Don Quixote" in the original Renasissance Spanish!! I don't remember his horses name, but the muscial Man of La Mancha is one of my favorite EVER!
Quix
Your cramps sound awful and I do hope you have a better experience than Craig. Yes, we get to roast your neuro, too.
Craig - Where are you now that CCF failed you? Have you written the director of the CCF and told then that after all the wait, anticipation, work of getting accomodations for you and your kids AND the huge expense that she not only rather dismissed you outright, but failed to help further the workup? Places like that have to be the thorough ones, the ones who think of the weird stuff. And They are paid BIG BUCKS - that's for their time and their supposedly vaster knowledge. People should not have to find out their info online from a pediatrician who isn't really up in the field. You sound very dejected and discouraged. And I agree, you don't have a peripheral neuropathy (if I remember your history correctly).
Moeck - Do you have problems knowing if you really have a firm grip on things? (I mean, other than reality,lol?)
'Zilla - Even though I read the entirety of "Don Quixote" in the original Renasissance Spanish!! I don't remember his horses name, but the muscial Man of La Mancha is one of my favorite EVER!
Quix
I picked up my latest results this morning. Spent quite a bit of time looking up what the heck they were testing for. Lots of amino acid disorders (didn't know there was such a thing), myasthenia gravis, anemias, celiac, metals, etc - a lot of these had already been ruled out. Acouple of them seemed to be making sure my hubby wasn't trying to poison me=)
Saw my PCP too. He suggested I leave for CCF @ 3am, so that I am at least somewhat fatigued by my appt at 9am. Otherwise I will present as perfectly normal. Why are doctor appts ALWAYS in the morning???????
BTW did I mention that this weekend I had some of what my soon-to-be former neuro called "transient cramps" - actually spasms bad enough that all my toes on left foot going different directions, foot being pulled up toward my knee and entire leg in spasm, which we clocked at 25 minutes long? How's that for a transient cramp - add her to the weenie roast??? Hope Dr K @ CCF is the keeper in this mess of "specialists". I've only had 2 neuro's. I've read of some having 6 or so - how did you not lose your mind?
Anyway, it's definitely NOT morning now - I've had to retype every @#%$# word I've typed. Need to go chill out. Take care.
Penn
Saw my PCP too. He suggested I leave for CCF @ 3am, so that I am at least somewhat fatigued by my appt at 9am. Otherwise I will present as perfectly normal. Why are doctor appts ALWAYS in the morning???????
BTW did I mention that this weekend I had some of what my soon-to-be former neuro called "transient cramps" - actually spasms bad enough that all my toes on left foot going different directions, foot being pulled up toward my knee and entire leg in spasm, which we clocked at 25 minutes long? How's that for a transient cramp - add her to the weenie roast??? Hope Dr K @ CCF is the keeper in this mess of "specialists". I've only had 2 neuro's. I've read of some having 6 or so - how did you not lose your mind?
Anyway, it's definitely NOT morning now - I've had to retype every @#%$# word I've typed. Need to go chill out. Take care.
Penn
"It also implies that you may feel an altered sense of pressure under that foot."
Thank you, now I have the right words to describe how my right hand is.
moeck
Thank you, now I have the right words to describe how my right hand is.
moeck
Hi ..was your EMG normal? The neuro at CCF told me that CCF usually doesn't accept other EMG tests except those done at Mayo Clinic. So you might need that again. I have had three normal EMGs and will not agree to a fourth. CCF wants me to come back and have an EMG and see a peripheral neuro but the neuro in NJ said that is a joke because I obviously don't have a peripheral neuropathy. I am sure they will be more empathetic to you, having two sisters with MS. Good luck...Craig
Hi, Penn!
Yeah, I have problems with my right leg/foot while driving, too. I have weakness, sometimes I have that weird perception problem that maybe you're describing, but I don't think so. Sometimes I don't feel my legs. Guess it's not the same. But When I go to step on the brake pedal, sometimes I tremor something fierce. Not lately, but when I was having severe weakness I did. It made me stop driving for a while. My oldest son was "Driving Miss Daisy."
I, too, am jealous of Quix's forum 'handle.' I feel more like Rocicante's behind (wasn't that his horse's name? It's been so long since I've seen that play -- I'm and old theatre buff, and I DO mean old!) in my quest for the impossible dream.....
Take care and keep us posted! (Deep Purple? Rock on!)
Zilla*
Yeah, I have problems with my right leg/foot while driving, too. I have weakness, sometimes I have that weird perception problem that maybe you're describing, but I don't think so. Sometimes I don't feel my legs. Guess it's not the same. But When I go to step on the brake pedal, sometimes I tremor something fierce. Not lately, but when I was having severe weakness I did. It made me stop driving for a while. My oldest son was "Driving Miss Daisy."
I, too, am jealous of Quix's forum 'handle.' I feel more like Rocicante's behind (wasn't that his horse's name? It's been so long since I've seen that play -- I'm and old theatre buff, and I DO mean old!) in my quest for the impossible dream.....
Take care and keep us posted! (Deep Purple? Rock on!)
Zilla*
I should have aded to my "Limboland" update the things that have been ruled out (those I can remember and pronounce, that is): lupus, lymes, RA, menieres, FM, vasculitis, heavy metal poisoning (except for that Deep Purple concert in the 80's...lol), spinal cord injury, vitamin/ mineral deficiencies. That's all I can remember, but there are some others.
Waiting for copies of a whole slew (spelling???) of blood work and reptitive nerve stim tests from neuro (had to cancel follow up appt. due to work, but am to pick up test results tomorrow to take to CCF with me). Both neruos declined to do muscle biopsy requested by my PCP. The doc who did my repeat EMG and RNS was openly bewildered by this.
Thanks
Penn
Waiting for copies of a whole slew (spelling???) of blood work and reptitive nerve stim tests from neuro (had to cancel follow up appt. due to work, but am to pick up test results tomorrow to take to CCF with me). Both neruos declined to do muscle biopsy requested by my PCP. The doc who did my repeat EMG and RNS was openly bewildered by this.
Thanks
Penn
You are too funny!!
I was hoping for a different response the foot slippage. I had mentioned it to one of my sisters, who laughed - hers does the same. She has MS (both sisters do), but I was hoping it was just another of our wierd family thing (one of many, I'm afraid to admit:) Needless to say, I try not to ride in the car with her.
As for Limboland - I go to CCF on 9/26, so I hope not to be a resident of Limboland for too much longer. I sure hope to find out something. I'm told to expect to go up a few times before I get anything definitive. I'm hoping for neon letters to show up on the MRI:)
Penn
I was hoping for a different response the foot slippage. I had mentioned it to one of my sisters, who laughed - hers does the same. She has MS (both sisters do), but I was hoping it was just another of our wierd family thing (one of many, I'm afraid to admit:) Needless to say, I try not to ride in the car with her.
As for Limboland - I go to CCF on 9/26, so I hope not to be a resident of Limboland for too much longer. I sure hope to find out something. I'm told to expect to go up a few times before I get anything definitive. I'm hoping for neon letters to show up on the MRI:)
Penn
Yeah, I love the name...it's MINE. You can't have it! We could call you La Mancha or Sancho....or Dulcinea.
I missed your original question and it is actually one I have an answer. Have I ever been at loss for one? BTW, Penn, you have always been a regular here in my mind. I guess once I bond with you I expect you'll be with us forever.
Your foot slips down on the pedal without you noticing. This is a defect in joint position sense. The person with a perfectly functioning neurologic system (does anyone know someone like that????) will always just "know" where their feet and hands are. One of the commonest defects in MS is loss of vibratory sense which is the finest part of position sense. As that nerve pathway is injured the person loses track of the position of the limb(s) in space. So having your foot drift down on the pedal causing you to slow down indicates that you are unaware of the subtle movement and relocation of the foot. It also implies that you may feel an altered sense of pressure under that foot. I'm afraid this points more toward MS than away from it.
My sis drives me and does our errands. I limit myself to the back road route to the grocery store....probably shouldn't do that. When I'm tired I have to use my hand to help lift my leg onto the brake. :( Maybe I should look into hand brakes.
It really would be nice to get a diagnosis here. What do you say? BTW - where are you again in the whole Limboland work up?
As far as not really realizing that you're not going to be as peppy at 5pm, Hope Springs Eternal. I know that on the rare day where I actually have energy, or when my Provigil is doing a really good job, I go at the windmills (they move, you know) with all I have. I should know that I am going to overdo it and be wiped out for days, but Nooooooooo! I have to do everything I want to. Maybe the failure to learn is part of the MS brain. We'd make lousy subjects for Pavlov.
Hmmmm.....Pavlov....Does that ring a bell?
Quix
I missed your original question and it is actually one I have an answer. Have I ever been at loss for one? BTW, Penn, you have always been a regular here in my mind. I guess once I bond with you I expect you'll be with us forever.
Your foot slips down on the pedal without you noticing. This is a defect in joint position sense. The person with a perfectly functioning neurologic system (does anyone know someone like that????) will always just "know" where their feet and hands are. One of the commonest defects in MS is loss of vibratory sense which is the finest part of position sense. As that nerve pathway is injured the person loses track of the position of the limb(s) in space. So having your foot drift down on the pedal causing you to slow down indicates that you are unaware of the subtle movement and relocation of the foot. It also implies that you may feel an altered sense of pressure under that foot. I'm afraid this points more toward MS than away from it.
My sis drives me and does our errands. I limit myself to the back road route to the grocery store....probably shouldn't do that. When I'm tired I have to use my hand to help lift my leg onto the brake. :( Maybe I should look into hand brakes.
It really would be nice to get a diagnosis here. What do you say? BTW - where are you again in the whole Limboland work up?
As far as not really realizing that you're not going to be as peppy at 5pm, Hope Springs Eternal. I know that on the rare day where I actually have energy, or when my Provigil is doing a really good job, I go at the windmills (they move, you know) with all I have. I should know that I am going to overdo it and be wiped out for days, but Nooooooooo! I have to do everything I want to. Maybe the failure to learn is part of the MS brain. We'd make lousy subjects for Pavlov.
Hmmmm.....Pavlov....Does that ring a bell?
Quix
Good advice. I had to be "Miss Daisy" for quite a while, with my father who's 76 the only one available to dirve me. I HATE bothering him (I know he doesn't mind, but I'm a very independent person, so I mind). I have been so happy to be able to drive at all lately, it never crossed my mind that I am risking an accident. I guess my biggest downfall is that in the morning when I go to work, I am at my best point of the day and I feel like I'm my previous self - you'd think I'd learn after all this time that I'm not going to be so peppy @ 5pm. I also tend to drive as long as my spasms are staying on the left (non-driving foot) - in retrospect a stupid assumption on my part. I guess I'll be back to Miss Daisy=(
As to my question original though, it seems there's not a lot of folks who don't realize that their foot moves somewhere (off gas pedal or elsewhere, not necesarily just in the car)??? Am looking for something that differentiates my issues from MS or some of the mimickers (the ones I'm aware of have been ruled out at this point, but there are no doubt lots more), so that'd be great. I wish i knew where I fit. Don't care what condition, if any, I have. But if I do, it would be REALLY nice to identify it so I can deal with it. I fancy myself a strong person - definitely a stubborn one - whatever it is, I'm up for the fight. But what am I fighting????? (Quix - I'm officially jealous of your screen name. It's so perfect for this whole diagnosis ordeal)
Done whining now. Thanks for listening
Penn
As to my question original though, it seems there's not a lot of folks who don't realize that their foot moves somewhere (off gas pedal or elsewhere, not necesarily just in the car)??? Am looking for something that differentiates my issues from MS or some of the mimickers (the ones I'm aware of have been ruled out at this point, but there are no doubt lots more), so that'd be great. I wish i knew where I fit. Don't care what condition, if any, I have. But if I do, it would be REALLY nice to identify it so I can deal with it. I fancy myself a strong person - definitely a stubborn one - whatever it is, I'm up for the fight. But what am I fighting????? (Quix - I'm officially jealous of your screen name. It's so perfect for this whole diagnosis ordeal)
Done whining now. Thanks for listening
Penn
I agree...
When my symptoms became serious last october, i was unable to drive... i was having a great deal of difficulty with dizziness, reaction time and unsteadiness. I was so disappointed since i just leased a new car... tried a few times and realized it was not a good situation for which everyone just stated... i would not want to cause an accident. When i was tested by a neruopsychologist for congitve issues, word recall, etc. , he asked about driving & i told him i wasn't...he tested me with a AAA driving risk assestment test... did poorly in reaction time & leg strength/general mobility/ head & neck flexibility & visual information & processing... so he strongly suggested i not drive until i am re-tested in may. Recently was diagnosed with foot drop and although it is my left foot, i am very unsteady on my feet... so, for now, my hunny is "driving miss daisy"... can be frustrating but when i think about what the consequences could be... it is not worth the risk...
So, if i am reaching anyone who is driving when they are having these type of issues... i understand, but a word to the wise...
GOD bless,
Frann
When my symptoms became serious last october, i was unable to drive... i was having a great deal of difficulty with dizziness, reaction time and unsteadiness. I was so disappointed since i just leased a new car... tried a few times and realized it was not a good situation for which everyone just stated... i would not want to cause an accident. When i was tested by a neruopsychologist for congitve issues, word recall, etc. , he asked about driving & i told him i wasn't...he tested me with a AAA driving risk assestment test... did poorly in reaction time & leg strength/general mobility/ head & neck flexibility & visual information & processing... so he strongly suggested i not drive until i am re-tested in may. Recently was diagnosed with foot drop and although it is my left foot, i am very unsteady on my feet... so, for now, my hunny is "driving miss daisy"... can be frustrating but when i think about what the consequences could be... it is not worth the risk...
So, if i am reaching anyone who is driving when they are having these type of issues... i understand, but a word to the wise...
GOD bless,
Frann
Hi, All, I have to reinforce Fishie's Word of Caution. Reaction times and driving skill have been shown to be reduced in MSers with lower extremity muscle involvement, and in others with global fatigue. We can be less safe drivers and need to be extremely aware of how we're feeling. Those with a history of OP may have poorer night vision and many of us are wiped out early in the day. We certainly can be a risk to ourselves our passengers and those around us!
Good heads up! Q
Good heads up! Q
Thanks FF - That story is really a reality check. I have driven when I shouldn't have, and looking back, I knew it was difficult, but was trying my hardest to work through it. Now, I just don't do it when I know I'm slow. . . .
I'm glad you shared the story, we all need to heed this warning, especially when others lives are at stake. . .
have a good one!
SL
I'm glad you shared the story, we all need to heed this warning, especially when others lives are at stake. . .
have a good one!
SL
Can't say that I've had that occur very regularly, maybe just on occasion accidentally. But, for all of you, a word of caution if your MS symptoms are affecting your feet or reaction time: When I was in middle school, a girl in my class and her mother were killed in an auto accident. The mom had MS and it was suspected something went wrong while she was driving and she couldn't stop in time. Be aware of any limitations you have and be on the safe side!
I don't feel it slip off at all. I only feel the care suddenly slow way down. I try not to drive at night too. Worse then. Had to take my hubby to the ER last week (he lost a fight with a chef's knife cutting onions), and the foot slip happened on way home late - only a 10 minute drive. It's happened a few other times - always when I'm tired. Of course I am tired ALOT these days=)
I too am usually good in the am (a little goofy when first get up though- walked striaght into the wall this am). As the day goes on, I get more and more tired and have more "issues" (I hate to call them symptoms, but you get the point). Start tripping over my own feet, spasms, twitches, rigidity, buzzing... all that fun stuff usually gets interesting after 3 or 3:30 in the afternoon. I'm a real hoot the last few hours of work!!!
Take care,
Penn
I too am usually good in the am (a little goofy when first get up though- walked striaght into the wall this am). As the day goes on, I get more and more tired and have more "issues" (I hate to call them symptoms, but you get the point). Start tripping over my own feet, spasms, twitches, rigidity, buzzing... all that fun stuff usually gets interesting after 3 or 3:30 in the afternoon. I'm a real hoot the last few hours of work!!!
Take care,
Penn
Hi Penns,
Well, I haven't had the slip, but have had the feeling that I had to keep double checking that I could in-fact push the brake, and gas when needed. Reaction time was really a big concern.
What I've noticed now is that I'm good early in the am and day, so I avoid driving at night when I can. Seems to be worse then.
When it feels like it slips - does it feel like you have to think about getting it back on to the pedal, or can you quickly, feel the slip, then slide it back on?
I'm curious because if you can quickly recover (via a good reaction that works), I'm thinking it's just a a relaxed position thing but the other is the slow reaction based and signals not getting through smoothly (that's how it feels to me anyway).
talk soon,
SL
Well, I haven't had the slip, but have had the feeling that I had to keep double checking that I could in-fact push the brake, and gas when needed. Reaction time was really a big concern.
What I've noticed now is that I'm good early in the am and day, so I avoid driving at night when I can. Seems to be worse then.
When it feels like it slips - does it feel like you have to think about getting it back on to the pedal, or can you quickly, feel the slip, then slide it back on?
I'm curious because if you can quickly recover (via a good reaction that works), I'm thinking it's just a a relaxed position thing but the other is the slow reaction based and signals not getting through smoothly (that's how it feels to me anyway).
talk soon,
SL
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