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Avatar universal

What is your fatigue like?

I have days I am so tired by about 2pm that I can barely keep my eyes open.  Some days even walking feels like really hard work.  But then I have days like today where I feel pretty good.  I've been pretty productive today.  But unfortunately, I have been having more tired days than good days.

I have some friends who tell me this is normal fatigue and I just need to rest more.  I do run a lot and do other exercise.  But it doesn't seem to matter if I take a break and sleep more or not.  Like the other day, I slept in two days in a row, no exercise, and still woke up tired.  I had to take a good 2 hour nap on those days.  

My husband though thinks it's not normal for me.  I would think that he would know a little better than some friends.  I am used to being a pretty active person.  I honestly hate taking naps almost everyday.  But I feel like I wouldn't make it past 5pm if I didn't.

Does this sounds like normal fatigue?  How would you describe your fatigue?
27 Responses
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14631020 tn?1436545476
I've had Amantadine, it worked as well as a cup of coffee so I prefer drinking coffee, coffee is probably much safer.  Thankfully I don't have addiction issues, I prefer not to take meds at all.  The problem is I have to work.  I have a very physical job and by the afternoon I literally feel like the walking dead and probably look just as bad!  haha  One time last week at work I was so tired I literally ran into the wall and had to stand there to hold myself up.  Thankfully, no one saw.

The cognitive thing bothers me a lot.  Today, I ordered a diet coke and not 5 minutes later I was wondering where my water was :/  It's stuff like that all the time and it's slowly getting worse.  My husband notices it and announced it to my neuro with no hesitation.  It annoys him too.

Thanks :)
Shannon
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Avatar universal
I'm lucky that I really haven't had cognitive problems. I've asked a few people close to me whether they've noticed anything, and they haven't, so so far, so good.

I take Adderall, when I take it, just for a bit more energy, mostly when there are things I absolutely must accomplish. Nevertheless I often crash when it wears off, and sometimes despite it. As Alex says, when energy is gone, it's gone.

Since I'm not ADD, Adderall works differently for me. It's not a drug I like, really, because I don't like the idea of being on speed, but I'm not a drug abuser. This can be a problem for some. Unfortunately for me, Provigil/Nuvigil did not work for me, nor did Amantadine. These drugs are usually tried first. They work for some, but as in everything MS, one size does not fit all.

ess

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14631020 tn?1436545476
Thanks for the light, JJ :)  I will try it.  I have had the dizzy, lightheaded thing for years, it's sort of an old friend..insert sarcasm.  I hate my tremors, though and they have worsened a bit.  I guess I will wait to hear what the doc says.

Thanks again :)
Shannon
Helpful - 0
667078 tn?1316000935
Ess makes a good point. Since every case of MS is different there is not a one size fits all treatment. This is where having a very good doctor comes in. My GP is my go to doc because she is good at diagnosing and treating problems and I can get in usually the day I call. If I need something further I make an appointment with my neurologist's PA.

My fatigue is made worse by my chemotherapy. I get so anemic I have to have two pints of blood once a year. That fatigue gets so bad I get super sick sitting up in a chair even for a minute.

With my MS I did not sleep well at all. I would be awake 48 hours then sleep two. They tried every thing to help me sleep. Then every few years the cocktail no longer works and I have to try something else.

I am raring to go and then all the sudden I can't walk. It confuses people because I do not gradually decline. It is boom I am out of gas. My husband recognizes it before I do. He is very understanding. We will be doing a project and I just have to stop. He used to think I should pace myself. Now he knows.

Exercise does help. After I swim for an hour with no breaks I have lots more energy. The next day I am tired but I still swim. When I first started to exercise it was really hard. I could go 15 minutes walking. I built it up over time. Your kids are your exercise. You probably do more than most of us.

Alex

Helpful - 0
987762 tn?1671273328
COMMUNITY LEADER
'Basically' the way Adderall works when someone has attention deficit hyperactivity disorder - ADHD, is by slowing down their hyper brain functions, so their thoughts, impulsivity, hyperactivity, behaviours etc no longer run so fast that they are not in control....

But when some one who doesn't have hyper brain functions (ADHD) takes Adderall, what they experience is the opposite effect and they speed up, they feel more energetic, their thoughts runs faster, recall more clearly etc etc. Although sometimes the energy benefits, will be negated by the commonly experienced side effects, worsening their other issues eg gastric, dizziness, tremor, insomnia etc It's worth trialling and if it's not the right one, there are alternatives that might suit you better.........there is always light imho!    

Cheers.........JJ

ps thanks Karry :D
Helpful - 0
14631020 tn?1436545476
You pretty much described me to a T.  I am having cognitive issues and I am curious about the Adderall my neuro is talking about putting me on.  I know they use it for people who have ADD.  Did it help improve your focus or memory?  I am desperately seeking my short term memory and learning skills.  I just need to know that every light at the end of a tunnel isn't an oncoming train!

Shannon
Helpful - 0
5887915 tn?1383378780
JJ, the word you are looking for is "lassitude" fatigue.

I agree that all levels of fatigue are different to each individual. I have rheumatoid arthritis, MS and iron deficiency fatigue at the moment which is pretty s_cky. MS fatigue for me can be unrelenting and there's nothing I can do but lay down and rest. I can't get words out, my tremors get worse and my ataxia runs away with me which is draining me even more. It's a constant feeling of spiralling out of control.

My Neuro tells me that some of the fatigue from MS is associated with having to work so much harder to get the messages through. Things like tremors or ataxia ensure I'm going to use more energy to make a cuppa than say average Joe who doesn't have these issues. I find I have fatigue where my body won't move anymore but I can't always sleep to recover well from this so I just rest and other times I could be really sleepy fatigued and could sleep for days.

Take care,

Karry.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Fatigue and lack of good sleep quality are often assumed to be pretty much synonymous, but I think this is a huge oversimpiflication, nor does one necessarily follow the other.

Those of us with MS understand clearly that there's a difference between MS fatigue and the garden variety fatigue everyone gets. If we comment that we're tired, very often others will say. 'Oh I get tired too.' This can be kind of maddening, though there's not much to be done, so I just let it go.

Most days I take adderall to make me a bit more functional. It's the extended release kind, and lasts maybe 8 hours. As it wears off I begin to crash. And soon hopes of accomplishing anything more are gone for that day.

Some days I feel reasonably energetic, and start in on my plans for the day fairly easily. Then boom, within a couple of hours I get wiped out, as if i'd been running a race.

These things happen whether or not I've slept decently, though decent sleep is rare for me. It's incredibly frustrating to be tired to the bone but not to be able to sleep.  Or I do get in 7 or 8 hours, but still wake up exhausted. I literally never wake up, do that wonderful stretch, sigh, jump out of bed all charged to take on the day. I did have a sleep study, years ago, and I don't have sleep apnea, etc., but it showed that my brain does not process the stages of sleep normally, and keeps pushing me back to a lighter sleepy level I have no idea whether MS causes this.

Every month or six weeks my body goes on strike, it seems, and then I'll
sleep 36 hours in 3 days, getting up for the bare necessities only.

I'm writing this endless post to illustrate that every MSer's experience of fatigue is different, everyone's sleep needs and energy is different, and we have to find theeru best level we can.  It's a matter of 'whatever works,' but the one constant is that things won't be the way they were pre-MS. Accepting that we have to reign our lives in is really hard, and we keep knocking heads with this reality, windup paying the price over and over,

At least we can vent here, where people do understand.

ess


Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Thanks for clarifying the difference between symptom and sign.  I guess I should say that I do have signs of something being wrong.  I haven't had a neurological exam yet.  So that may reveal more signs.
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5112396 tn?1378017983
That's just doctor speak that is often used in a different way by layman. "Symptom" is anything that is patient reported. "Sign" is something that is objectively verified by testing. For example: Babinski relex? Sign. Numbness? Symptom, and so on.

Symptoms are taken into account when a doctor is casting a net for possible causes, but collections of symptoms do not typically result in a diagnosis of anything. Evidence is needed in addition to this.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
I can totally understand that the doctor wouldn't take the fatigue as medically significant given that I live a very busy and active life.  But I think my other symptoms will be enough for concern that the fatigue may or may not be consider as a "symptom".
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987762 tn?1671273328
COMMUNITY LEADER
keep in mind, it's not uncommon for young mother's to complain about being fatigued during the terrible 2 stage, with twin 2.5 years olds there would be a lot of people including doctors, who would think it's perfectly normal to be run off your feet whilst their eyes are open, so it might be difficult to get it across that your fatigue is a medical issues and not because you have 2.5yr old twins.....

Not exactly sure how under the circumstances you'll do that but possible if you describe your fatigue "The fatigue I had earlier in the week was kind of like my whole body just felt heavier and harder to move around.  Like lifting my arm took way more effort than normal.  Just getting up from my seat was a major accomplishment." may help somewhat but just don't be surprised if no one gets that your beyond normal tired tired whilst your kids are little.

Cheers........JJ
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
At least my twins still nap.  So I usually take a nap when they do if I feel like I need one which is most days.  Some days the nap doesn't really help and other days I'll wake up and feel like I can make it the rest of the day.

They are 2.5 years old and very active as you can imagine.  But they do play well with each other so that helps me out a lot.  They can entertain each other most of the time.

Thank you all for your input!  About 2.5 weeks till my neurology appointment.  Seems so far away especially since they rescheduled it!
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Avatar universal
I think we all have different levels of fatigue. To me if I have a couple of really active days I will most certainly have a down day to look forward too.
Some days I get up and go a few hours then bam! My body feels like lead and I'm done.
Some days I wake up fatigued. It's different for all of us. For me its kinda a go with the flow type thing which has been a difficult adjustment for me cause I was always the energizer bunny type.
Our friend Alex said it best, energy is like money in the bank. Once it's gone, it's gone.
I never napped, ever, before this disease. Now it's almost daily. I don't beat myself up over it, I just do it.
Cut yourself some slack and give yourself time to figure out what is normal for you. AGAIN,we are all different.  And twins? Bless your heart. Just thinking of chasing twins makes me tired.
Be kind to yourself.
Best regards, barb
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Avatar universal
The fatigue I had earlier in the week was kind of like my whole body just felt heavier and harder to move around.  Like lifting my arm took way more effort than normal.  Just getting up from my seat was a major accomplishment.

I have the other kind of fatigue too.  Like mental fatigue, but I figure that most people have that.  I have other physical fatigue also but I'm not concerned about it when it corresponds to what I have been doing.
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987762 tn?1671273328
COMMUNITY LEADER
Okay sorry I thought i was answering your Q.....to me your recent example wouldn't be totally unexpected, so i didn't think it sounded particularly abnormal for the amount of activity you'd been doing even for someone young and fit.

Personally fatigue changes gravity, i'm way too heavy, it's like trying to move whilst carrying 10 times my body weight.........there is no pushing through it! There's a label ???? starts with 'L' lol for the life of me i can't remember aghhhhhh hmmmm anyhoo lol the level of fatigue associated with MS is itself disabling, the building could be burning and an MSer will not have enough energy to save themselves.....

Keep in mind that you could look for 'fatigue' stories just about anywhere health related and you will definitely find similar fatigue experiences, fatigue is just one of the really vague symptoms that's associated with many different things.....the bottom line though is if you think this is abnormal for you, it's definitely worth seeing your GP if it doesn't improve in the next day or so.

Cheers........JJ

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14631020 tn?1436545476
Nobody knows your body better than you!  Our docs tell our patients that all the time.  Take it to heart.  
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Avatar universal
I understand that fatigue is a very general term and even a healthy person can have fatigue at times.  Keep in mind that fatigue is not my only issue giving me problems.  If it were just the fatigue, I would probably say I just must be over doing it or maybe I have a deficiency.  

Yes, I did do some traveling but that is minor compared to what I am used to doing.  That trip was 3.5 hours.  About 4 times a year we travel back home to visit family which is 11 hours away.  I usually do most of the driving then too.  The last time we took that trip before all these things started coming back, it didn't affect me the way that two day trip did earlier this week.  Sure I was tired after driving all that way and had to take a day when we got back home to rest up.  

But I think that having to take two days to recover from a little two day trip is not normal for someone my age and in my shape.  I'm young and physically fit.

I think it probably is worth mentioning to both my GP and my neurologist.  This tiredness is not what I feel like is normal for me.  

The purpose of this post was to just see if you all thought it sounded abnormal or if anyone has/had similar experiences.
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987762 tn?1671273328
COMMUNITY LEADER
I have to agree with immisceo!

When it comes to 'fatigue' it's an overly used medical term, it has so many different causes which are not necessarily medical issues but behavioural or situational. Fatigue is a truly vague symptom and not always medically meaningful.

You've travelled for hours, not sleeping in your own bed, mixing family members together (yep some family events are exhausting lol oh is that just mine lol), eating a different diet - over eating - under eating for a few days, actively non stop busy whilst away and then you've crashed after travelling hours to get back home again......I personally don't think it is actually abnormal to feel run down and exhausted for a few days after getting back home, isn't there a saying that goes something like, I need a holiday to get over my holiday?

My teenage son sometimes needs a nap for a few days after one of his wednesday 8 hour specialist mathematics mental marathons, sometimes he's just so mentally exhausted he crashes but he's actually always been a very mentally and physically hyperactive kid. If you didn't look at the situational circumstances, you'd think it would an unusual level of fatigue and abnormal for him but under the circumstance the fatigue makes sense.

I don't really know how to work out if what you are experiencing is abnormal under the circumstances or not, what i do know is that 'fatigue' that has no identifiable cause (eg illness, dietary, sleep deprivations etc etc), doesn't improve with sleep, can't push through it etc is usually medically significant though again causation could be anything, so i'd bring it up with your next medical check up or see your GP before then if you are concerned.

CHeers..........JJ              
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Avatar universal
Hmmm. I am tired if i don't sleep till 12 or 1 PM, I go to bed at midnight or 1. I need between 9 and 10 hours of sleep on average. I will hit a tired spell during the day, I push through it, if I sleep I end up not sleeping again till 6 AM.
My sleep naturally wants to fall during the day instead of at night. Always a fight to keep it there.I can't do mornings, if I do I will just fall asleep in a chair at 3 in the afternoon and sleep till midnight.

I have been like this my whole life. Had a sleep study but found nothing other than delayed sleep and natural tendancey to sleep during day hours, aka, a Night owl.



What has been different for me, is physical fatigue that isn't relieved by sleep or stopping activities. Also, I have to sleep with the temp below 65 or I get very crummy sleep and wake up with weakness and nerve pain/numbness, and very tired.

If it is different than normal, go see your GP. Try sleeping with a box fan.
I'm not a fan of sleep meds if you can avoid since they are addicting.
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Avatar universal
I'm not really asking if this sounds like MS fatigue.  Just asking if this sounds abnormal in general.  

I have my yearly physical on August 3rd.  I'm going to ask to have everything checked again: thyroid, iron, hemoglobin, ect.  I'm also going to ask to be tested for Lyme disease again.  I've had all these tests in the past.  But I think it would be good just to have everything double checked.

My neurology appointment is August 5th which was supposed to have been on July 13th but got rescheduled.  
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14631020 tn?1436545476
Fatigue seems to be my constant companion and seems to be getting worse.  Fatigue is what sent me to my primary care doctor in the first place, a few years ago and each year after.  I thought my thyroid was bad or I was anemic or something.  Of course my blood is fine and thyroid has checked out fine for years now. I knew something was wrong I just didn't know what until the ataxia came along and I flunked my MRI.

Today and all this week, by the afternoon, I get this odd feeling of pressure on the top of my head, not a head ache just pressure.  My sinuses are fine, no cold, nothing like that, just a weird pressure right on top of my head.  At the same time I get extremely tired and I mean extremely.  It's hard to work, especially when you are dealing with patients. I have to function and smile but I can barely see because I am soooooo tired.  It will ease off when I get home and get to rest a bit.  But there is never a moment when I am not somewhat tired, it's always there.  I go to bed exhausted and wake up tired, it's never ending.

My neuro is trying sleep meds right now to see if I get better sleep if that will help.  I don't have apnea.  He has mentioned giving me adderall if this doesn't work.  I see him next week.

I don't know if I helped you or not but at least you know you aren't alone!

Shannon
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5112396 tn?1378017983
Have other potential causes been addressed? I know when I was anaemic (a very young, very undereducated vegan at the time), it could have been described just this way too. Fatigue is such a subjective symptom and related to so very, very many things that don't even relate to one another that I'd be hesitant to say it sounds like MS fatigue. I mean, it doesn't sound *unlike* it, but that doesn't narrow the field much necessarily.
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Avatar universal
I wasn't even this tired when they were little babies and still woke up in the middle of the night.  That's partly why I think this fatigue is abnormal for me.
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