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HELP! Existential/Philosophical/Solipsism OCD
Hello, (Warning if sensitive to Philosophical stuff)
To get straight to the point, I'm 21, I have been diagnosed with Pathological/ Existential/Philosophical/Solipsism OCD. I used to have HOCD, Schizo-OCD, fear of becoming blind, fear of liking my mom (ie sexually) and Pedo-OCD, etc but my current bout is on a whole another level (like 100x more intense, panic attack level). I don't have any physical compulsions, but I do try to fight it through logic in my mind. It's been around a month since I was trying to fall asleep and thought, what if this world was my imagination and everything was a part of my perception. This sent me into anxiety. The next day, while I was taking a shower, I thought of the movie Inception, good movie btw, (Fight Club, Beautiful Mind, Truman Show probably didn't help either) and wondered what if I was in a dream and had a panic attack where I thought my head was going to explode. I wondered if I had to commit suicide to get back to the real world.
These thoughts led to schizo-Ocd or (maybe the Schizo-OCD led to the reality doubts) and doubting my memory (whether certain events actually happened and even though I know I was fine before, my brain finds loopholes to surpass my logic, like you created your memory rather than it is your actual memory even though I know it's my actual memory (ie doubt). There's always loopholes which is OCD I guess.
I had constant anxiety/panic attacks and my memory/concentration is lacking. I question everything (ie Why do I see what I see, why do we stop at a green light?, stupid questions, etc.) My main fear is the false sense of reality (ie Solipsism, living in a dream, and even though I know solipsism is just a thought experiment and people are, in fact, real my mind says you've been teleported into a dream/another reality where everything is the same except it's your perception, ie loopholes). I feel like I opened up a Pandora's Box of thoughts, a 2nd tier of uncontrollable thoughts. I should've just stayed in the 1st tier. My mind is so cluttered with thoughts and hectic. I'm a mess mentally.
My psychiatrist put me on Prozac (fluoxetine) and upgraded my dosage to 40mg and 2x 1mg Clonazapem (klonopin) and I have my ups and downs. However, my downs are really down and low (bad depression where I breakdown and cry, which makes me feel better for some reason) since being upgraded to 40mg on Friday due to school starting soon. I started at 10mg for a week then 20mg for 2 weeks which didn't seem to do much, but you can't tell in that short of a span with these SSRI's and my highs aren't that high. Sometimes I don't have any emotion which also *****. The derealization/depersonalization makes it worse. I have a therapist but she doesn't specialize in OCD but I guess it's better than nothing. I'll be transferred to an OCD specialist mid September.
I care about people and my friends and family so this is why this OCD is latching onto me so hard but I'm in so much pain. My family is in a financial struggle and my mom and dad always fight (hurt me terribly to see my family so disjointed and I'm an only child) which probably added to the stress which led to the attack (maybe subconsciously trying to escape from this reality?). Sometimes I feel if I just black out, the world will end, reality will end.
However, my mom and dad both love me and are doing their best to help me out and not fight and care for me during this time which I appreciate. But I keep doubting whether my parents are real or a part of my imagination (silly but it's painfully annoying). I don't have that "connection" to myself or with people that I used to, especially if I doubt their reality. Also, I'm an introvert, shy, and pessimistic and don't have good stress coping strategies which contribute to my condition.
I'm not interested in anything I was before (ie sports, music, girls, etc.) I just want to reset my brain, like brainwash it to where it was when I was fine. I don't even know what feeling fine is anymore. I'm constantly anxious about something and don't know how to interpret my thoughts (ie whether a feeling is from the family stress or the OCD stress, etc.) I try to match my feelings to before when I was fine but it's so hard. Nothing has really changed in reality except in my mind.
I'm eating healthy and taking in vitamin B, min tran, Protein, along with exercise to help out but sometimes I feel like it'll never end. I ask, "What's the purpose of life, why am I on Earth, why was I born on when I was and not another date, why was I born on Earth, etc. Questioning every single thing imaginable. My psychiatrist says it takes about 3 months for it to go away but it seems like an eternity.
Sometimes I feel like there is hope, hopeless, but then days where my Anxiety/OCD/Depression hits hard, I feel like giving up but suicide is NOT an option, but I just know I can't live like this forever. Sometimes I don't know what I'm thinking, whether I'm believing these thoughts or not, etc. I'm scared if I get better, it'll just come back into another form or this will have a traumatic effect on me.
I'm trying to get back into Christianity to help cope, my family is Christian but my mind says "in your imagination you created Christianity so it tries to negate that belief." My family and friends are the most important thing in the world to me, I just want to be brainwashed back into thinking that the world is real, people are real, life is real. But this past month has been a living hell. I want to believe these thoughts are false but the doubts just bring them back, plus I don't "feel" right. All of you sufferers will know what I'm talking about when feeling "right".
This might sound foolish but I'd rather have cancer than OCD/Depression at this severity. I just want to get back to normal, I'm doing whatever it takes and hope it'll go away with time like the HOCD which was pretty bad but nothing debilitating. It's a month I'd like to forget. I want to chase my dreams and ambition but this stupid illness is preventing me from it and since the mind is more abstract, it's scarier especially when dealing with "false reality" for me. I just wish there was a machine to reset your brain (ie like Reformatting your computer).
Sorry for the long post but need some support and guidance during this time. It just seems like one long nightmare. I'm just assuming that people are real and that there are people who can help me in this world.
In before TL;DR but please read and support
Thanks,
To get straight to the point, I'm 21, I have been diagnosed with Pathological/ Existential/Philosophical/Solipsism OCD. I used to have HOCD, Schizo-OCD, fear of becoming blind, fear of liking my mom (ie sexually) and Pedo-OCD, etc but my current bout is on a whole another level (like 100x more intense, panic attack level). I don't have any physical compulsions, but I do try to fight it through logic in my mind. It's been around a month since I was trying to fall asleep and thought, what if this world was my imagination and everything was a part of my perception. This sent me into anxiety. The next day, while I was taking a shower, I thought of the movie Inception, good movie btw, (Fight Club, Beautiful Mind, Truman Show probably didn't help either) and wondered what if I was in a dream and had a panic attack where I thought my head was going to explode. I wondered if I had to commit suicide to get back to the real world.
These thoughts led to schizo-Ocd or (maybe the Schizo-OCD led to the reality doubts) and doubting my memory (whether certain events actually happened and even though I know I was fine before, my brain finds loopholes to surpass my logic, like you created your memory rather than it is your actual memory even though I know it's my actual memory (ie doubt). There's always loopholes which is OCD I guess.
I had constant anxiety/panic attacks and my memory/concentration is lacking. I question everything (ie Why do I see what I see, why do we stop at a green light?, stupid questions, etc.) My main fear is the false sense of reality (ie Solipsism, living in a dream, and even though I know solipsism is just a thought experiment and people are, in fact, real my mind says you've been teleported into a dream/another reality where everything is the same except it's your perception, ie loopholes). I feel like I opened up a Pandora's Box of thoughts, a 2nd tier of uncontrollable thoughts. I should've just stayed in the 1st tier. My mind is so cluttered with thoughts and hectic. I'm a mess mentally.
My psychiatrist put me on Prozac (fluoxetine) and upgraded my dosage to 40mg and 2x 1mg Clonazapem (klonopin) and I have my ups and downs. However, my downs are really down and low (bad depression where I breakdown and cry, which makes me feel better for some reason) since being upgraded to 40mg on Friday due to school starting soon. I started at 10mg for a week then 20mg for 2 weeks which didn't seem to do much, but you can't tell in that short of a span with these SSRI's and my highs aren't that high. Sometimes I don't have any emotion which also *****. The derealization/depersonalization makes it worse. I have a therapist but she doesn't specialize in OCD but I guess it's better than nothing. I'll be transferred to an OCD specialist mid September.
I care about people and my friends and family so this is why this OCD is latching onto me so hard but I'm in so much pain. My family is in a financial struggle and my mom and dad always fight (hurt me terribly to see my family so disjointed and I'm an only child) which probably added to the stress which led to the attack (maybe subconsciously trying to escape from this reality?). Sometimes I feel if I just black out, the world will end, reality will end.
However, my mom and dad both love me and are doing their best to help me out and not fight and care for me during this time which I appreciate. But I keep doubting whether my parents are real or a part of my imagination (silly but it's painfully annoying). I don't have that "connection" to myself or with people that I used to, especially if I doubt their reality. Also, I'm an introvert, shy, and pessimistic and don't have good stress coping strategies which contribute to my condition.
I'm not interested in anything I was before (ie sports, music, girls, etc.) I just want to reset my brain, like brainwash it to where it was when I was fine. I don't even know what feeling fine is anymore. I'm constantly anxious about something and don't know how to interpret my thoughts (ie whether a feeling is from the family stress or the OCD stress, etc.) I try to match my feelings to before when I was fine but it's so hard. Nothing has really changed in reality except in my mind.
I'm eating healthy and taking in vitamin B, min tran, Protein, along with exercise to help out but sometimes I feel like it'll never end. I ask, "What's the purpose of life, why am I on Earth, why was I born on when I was and not another date, why was I born on Earth, etc. Questioning every single thing imaginable. My psychiatrist says it takes about 3 months for it to go away but it seems like an eternity.
Sometimes I feel like there is hope, hopeless, but then days where my Anxiety/OCD/Depression hits hard, I feel like giving up but suicide is NOT an option, but I just know I can't live like this forever. Sometimes I don't know what I'm thinking, whether I'm believing these thoughts or not, etc. I'm scared if I get better, it'll just come back into another form or this will have a traumatic effect on me.
I'm trying to get back into Christianity to help cope, my family is Christian but my mind says "in your imagination you created Christianity so it tries to negate that belief." My family and friends are the most important thing in the world to me, I just want to be brainwashed back into thinking that the world is real, people are real, life is real. But this past month has been a living hell. I want to believe these thoughts are false but the doubts just bring them back, plus I don't "feel" right. All of you sufferers will know what I'm talking about when feeling "right".
This might sound foolish but I'd rather have cancer than OCD/Depression at this severity. I just want to get back to normal, I'm doing whatever it takes and hope it'll go away with time like the HOCD which was pretty bad but nothing debilitating. It's a month I'd like to forget. I want to chase my dreams and ambition but this stupid illness is preventing me from it and since the mind is more abstract, it's scarier especially when dealing with "false reality" for me. I just wish there was a machine to reset your brain (ie like Reformatting your computer).
Sorry for the long post but need some support and guidance during this time. It just seems like one long nightmare. I'm just assuming that people are real and that there are people who can help me in this world.
In before TL;DR but please read and support
Thanks,
Just wanted to say, well said! I too have had a few bouts with political philosophy myself - I think it was inevitable due to the nature of political science: there are no real defined lines - socialists can be fascists, fasicts can be right and left, and to top it all off, it can pervade all parts of our lives and have direct reflections- the music we listen to, the art we like, etc. Thank you for making me realize that I am not the only one and that indeed we should pursue our passions and be brave enough to keep thinking about complex matters. You touched on this yourself but I wanted to add that I have found it useful to just say to myself, " Well, many people go to school and make a living pondering things that have no real answers. If I really need to go down this rabbit hole, I can always go to school and study philosophy, politics, etc. Until then, I really don't have all the information to make a decision or find an answer". I'm lucky I only get "bouts" that last a few hours or a day. Once I get bored or stop caring, it goes away and comes back 6 months or a year later. Peace :)
Yo
Some people say reality is not real and if you feel that way too, maybe you should consider trying to stop fighting it so much and go with it. It should liberate you to genuinely think reality's not real, like having a lucid dream. You can pursue your dreams with more gusto knowing that if you fail, the failure's not real; if you get rejected, the rejection's not real- anything unpleasant is not really unpleasant because it's not real.
This does not mean you can get away with being mean to people, though- quite the opposite, actually. It can allow you to always be the bigger person because whatever other people do is not really real, even if it hurt, you know it's not real.
You think it's a disease but this is what I imagine all the enlightened people we hear about, like Jesus and Buddha, felt like. They truly believed this world to not be real/ important and were able to be more loving and caring towards those less enlightened, who took everything seriously.
Some people say reality is not real and if you feel that way too, maybe you should consider trying to stop fighting it so much and go with it. It should liberate you to genuinely think reality's not real, like having a lucid dream. You can pursue your dreams with more gusto knowing that if you fail, the failure's not real; if you get rejected, the rejection's not real- anything unpleasant is not really unpleasant because it's not real.
This does not mean you can get away with being mean to people, though- quite the opposite, actually. It can allow you to always be the bigger person because whatever other people do is not really real, even if it hurt, you know it's not real.
You think it's a disease but this is what I imagine all the enlightened people we hear about, like Jesus and Buddha, felt like. They truly believed this world to not be real/ important and were able to be more loving and caring towards those less enlightened, who took everything seriously.
Yo
Some people say reality is not real and if you feel that way too, maybe you should consider trying to stop fighting it so much and go with it. It should liberate you to genuinely think reality's not real, like having a lucid dream. You can pursue your dreams with more gusto knowing that if you fail, the failure's not real; if you get rejected, the rejection's not real- anything unpleasant is not really unpleasant because it's not real.
This does not mean you can get away with being mean to people, though- quite the opposite, actually. It can allow you to always be the bigger person because whatever other people do is not really real, even if it hurt, you know it's not real.
You think it's a disease but this is what I imagine all the enlightened people we hear about, like Jesus and Buddha, felt like. They truly believed this world to not be real/ important and were able to be more loving and caring towards those less enlightened, who took everything seriously.
Some people say reality is not real and if you feel that way too, maybe you should consider trying to stop fighting it so much and go with it. It should liberate you to genuinely think reality's not real, like having a lucid dream. You can pursue your dreams with more gusto knowing that if you fail, the failure's not real; if you get rejected, the rejection's not real- anything unpleasant is not really unpleasant because it's not real.
This does not mean you can get away with being mean to people, though- quite the opposite, actually. It can allow you to always be the bigger person because whatever other people do is not really real, even if it hurt, you know it's not real.
You think it's a disease but this is what I imagine all the enlightened people we hear about, like Jesus and Buddha, felt like. They truly believed this world to not be real/ important and were able to be more loving and caring towards those less enlightened, who took everything seriously.
Hey Sam, my name is Charlie and I'm 18 years old and going through the same thing right now, for a while i've thought I was the only one going through this and have been looking for someone else with the same problem, I really would like to talk to you about it, if you can please shoot me an email at ***@****. Thanks man
No worries at all. Your post actually helped me a lot in getting through it as well.
There's no doubt in my mind that I've got OCD, but there's also no doubt that it's curable. Whether or not it requires medical drugs or psychiatric help I'm not totally sure, but it can definitely be beaten.
I think in your case the fluoxetine definitely helped you and you made the right choice in taking it, as you were obviously suffering quite badly and it seems to have helped you recover. It seems to have helped other people get over OCD and depression as well so it obviously works. The reason I didn't want to take it is mainly because it supposedly makes you 'sexually inactive' (i.e. not interested in sex, or not being able to get aroused). I'm one of the horniest guys around, so that kind of thing doesn't sound too pleasing to me!
There were some other side effects I read up on as well; being anxiety, upset stomach, nervousness (a bit odd being an anti-depressant?) sleeping disorders and some other things. I took another anti-depressant called Sertraline about 4 years ago, and had similar symptoms after taking it that lasted for the first few days or week (i.e. sleeplessness, upset stomach, etc) and my body seemed to adjust to it after that, as my doctor explained to me, and it did seem to help me. Whether or not the side effects you get from fluoxetine are temporary or long term I really don't know, but that's my main concern in taking it.
With regards to Solipsism, it is a flawed subject, it's just very annoying that people like us still seem to entertain the idea that it could be true, which is clearly a result of OCD, but is also common amongst intelligent thinking people like us who like to question everything we live in. I believe we all eventually realize what reality is at some stage, it just takes a while for us to get there.
It's great to hear that you're getting on with your life and socializing with friends, it's definitely the way to go. If you sit in your room alone dwelling over negative thoughts, of course it will make you feel like you're the only person that exists! I'm also guilty of doing that occasionally, so when I'm feeling like that I'll go for a bike ride or something to clear my head a bit which definitely helps.
There's no doubt in my mind that I've got OCD, but there's also no doubt that it's curable. Whether or not it requires medical drugs or psychiatric help I'm not totally sure, but it can definitely be beaten.
I think in your case the fluoxetine definitely helped you and you made the right choice in taking it, as you were obviously suffering quite badly and it seems to have helped you recover. It seems to have helped other people get over OCD and depression as well so it obviously works. The reason I didn't want to take it is mainly because it supposedly makes you 'sexually inactive' (i.e. not interested in sex, or not being able to get aroused). I'm one of the horniest guys around, so that kind of thing doesn't sound too pleasing to me!
There were some other side effects I read up on as well; being anxiety, upset stomach, nervousness (a bit odd being an anti-depressant?) sleeping disorders and some other things. I took another anti-depressant called Sertraline about 4 years ago, and had similar symptoms after taking it that lasted for the first few days or week (i.e. sleeplessness, upset stomach, etc) and my body seemed to adjust to it after that, as my doctor explained to me, and it did seem to help me. Whether or not the side effects you get from fluoxetine are temporary or long term I really don't know, but that's my main concern in taking it.
With regards to Solipsism, it is a flawed subject, it's just very annoying that people like us still seem to entertain the idea that it could be true, which is clearly a result of OCD, but is also common amongst intelligent thinking people like us who like to question everything we live in. I believe we all eventually realize what reality is at some stage, it just takes a while for us to get there.
It's great to hear that you're getting on with your life and socializing with friends, it's definitely the way to go. If you sit in your room alone dwelling over negative thoughts, of course it will make you feel like you're the only person that exists! I'm also guilty of doing that occasionally, so when I'm feeling like that I'll go for a bike ride or something to clear my head a bit which definitely helps.
Thanks for the in-depth reply Truth,
I'm pretty much over the intrusive thoughts (ie living in a dream, solipsism, etc.) I mean it still bothers me from time to time but i can pretty much disregard it now. Now I choose not to believe in solipsism and such because life is much more fun that way, and I feel why do I care so much about whether other people are fake, they must be real if I get so much anxiety because of that and the idea of solipsism seems so illogical to me now even thought its not 100% disprovable.
And I see where your coming from regarding when people say "I'm real as can be" but for some reason it helps me. Or it doesn't hurt me at all. I feel socializing and finding hobbies really does help me with the OCD and having a purpose in life.
BTW, what were the side effects that made you not want to take fluoxetine. I'm on it right now although it's a low dose. I first wanted to beat it on my own, but it got so bad that I was desperate for something and I actually feel it has helped me although it's hard to say since I could have been fine without taking it as well. Thanks in advance!
I'm pretty much over the intrusive thoughts (ie living in a dream, solipsism, etc.) I mean it still bothers me from time to time but i can pretty much disregard it now. Now I choose not to believe in solipsism and such because life is much more fun that way, and I feel why do I care so much about whether other people are fake, they must be real if I get so much anxiety because of that and the idea of solipsism seems so illogical to me now even thought its not 100% disprovable.
And I see where your coming from regarding when people say "I'm real as can be" but for some reason it helps me. Or it doesn't hurt me at all. I feel socializing and finding hobbies really does help me with the OCD and having a purpose in life.
BTW, what were the side effects that made you not want to take fluoxetine. I'm on it right now although it's a low dose. I first wanted to beat it on my own, but it got so bad that I was desperate for something and I actually feel it has helped me although it's hard to say since I could have been fine without taking it as well. Thanks in advance!
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I think the toughest part is that we know these thoughts are irrational, I mean we are smart people, but knowing that isn't always the answer obviously. We constantly test ourselves, and when we finally resolve something it is replaced by yet another test. The key is to not fight it because the more we do the worse it gets.
I also understand your need for this to go away and to be normal again. The bonus is that you know you WILL be normal again, it just is going to take some time. You know this, because you have lived through it before so that in itself should be comforting. Remind yourself of that when you are in that OCD cycle.
You are way ahead of the game here. You may not believe it but you really are. You know the thoughts are irrational, you are seeing a psychiatrist and you are taking medication for it. The increased dosage in Prozac will take some time to take effect as you probably know. You need a really good 4-6 weeks of being at the optimal dose to get the real benefits. Take the klonopin as instructed. It will actually build up to a steady state in your system and be more helpful. I take it myself.
The other thing I would suggest is seeking out a Psychologist to go hand-in-hand with the Psychiatrist. There are psychologists that specialize in cognitive behavioral therapy and I think that goes a long way with the medication. Most Psychiatrists do not teach CBT but you can discuss this with yours and if they don't perhaps they can give you the name of someone that does. Usually at that point the psychiatrist just takes over the medication and the psychologist takes over the actual therapy part.
Here is a book that I also found very helpful during my last major OCD crisis which was in May. It is called Self-Coaching by Joseph Luciani and it has a green cover. I read that thing to death and it really helped me.
Also, I am glad to see that you know that suicide is not the answer. Yes, if we were not here we would not be suffering but compared to having cancer or something like that, we are better off. I know you don't think that now but we truly are. Your derealization/depersonalization will go away, I promise you! And you will be able to do all those things on your to-do list.
If you want to know more about me, then you can read "About me" under my name. It does not list everything I have been through becasue that would take an entire book, but you will get the gist about me and that I understand you and what you are going through.
Feel free to post again here if you need to talk or you can PM me and I will respond. Keep me posted as to how you are doing! You WILL get over this.