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SAW NEUROSURGEON NOT GOOD NEWS
HI, I decided to start a new post as the old one was waiting for the neurosurgeon appt, as bad back pain. I saw the Neurosurgeon on Monday the 20th, after waiting 7 months for an appt. It was not good news, my back is worse than I thouoght and I waited too long for anything to be done.The dr. said Workmans Comp took too long to get me in and the calvacade of events and everything has deteriorated badly where he can't fix anything. He said it all amounts to the fact I need a whole new back and that is not possible. I had one bad disk to start with L4-L5 with a herniation. I now have 5 bad levels . Not only do I have 5 bad levels, ( the disks are all bad and deteriorated, hernaited or and bulging on or near thecal sac) but allso I have eroded cartilage, and bone is rubbing on bone. Also he said he saw signs of Osteoporous and both Facet and SI jOint diseae. If this was not bad enough, the fact I was hit by a truck in 2001, it ot only made my back worse but it broke my foot and after being in a cast and on crutches for 8-9 months, I no longer have the function of an ankle. It is frozen in postion and he also noticed I have severe scar formation on my foot ( after 3 foot operations ) and I am sure he knows that is not good for surgery either. Also my bad feet and gait and pain in the hips has thrown my body out of alignment and made pain worse, particualry on the left. Probably because of the hip pain, somtime in the last year I hurt my left knee and it has been swollen for a long time and the pain has gotten worse and pain beggining in the right as well, with sharp stabbing pains.
After examning my back he looked at my knee and could clearly see the swelling. After poking it and moving and twisting it several ways, he said I need to see an Orthodpeidc dr; And probably get a MRI as it looks like a Menices Tear or Rupture that has gone on for a long time and he is not sure what is going on with the other knee except it also is bad.
He could have done a Lumbar Fusion but he said he could not fuse all five levels and not only do I have five bad levels now but the Degeneration is moving up the spine. He has not where he could put that many levels.I also have poor cirulation ( blue colored fingernails and cold feet) It all amounts to he doesnt have the know how to do any other thing with my back. If the Workmans Comp had done what they should have back in 2001 or by 2003 my back would not be what it is now. He only had two suggestions and more than likely because this is Workmans Comp, I won't get them done either.
He reccomended I go back to see the Spine Specilist that I saw in 2003 that suggested a IDET procedure for my back but noone in the area would do or Workmans Comp would authorize back then .( she is the professor of Spine Unit at a Major Hospital out of the area and is current on new procedures)
The other reccomendation was to go out of the area to a pain management Center Specilaist to see what they could do. Other than that is to get my knee evaluated.
Now I wonder if I made the right decision to try more conservative treatment a try back in 2001 when I first saw the Neurosurgeon after hurting my back. Surgery was offerend then, but I thought I should try other things. NOw I am stuck in a no win situation. I know my back is only going to get worse, and I feel like I am turning into a cripple, I have a bad back that causes pain, my hips are bad and my feet are bad and the pain from all of the other pain has given me a knee injury as well that may need surgery. I also am sure I won't get to see a pain management specilaist and Workmans Comp wont pay for any thing else. I do have my Methadone and I guess I will have to live the rest of my life with that. At least it is working for now, but this knee pain is a new pain that is a pain the Methadone doesnt work well with. What is worse is that the knee pain makes it painful and hard to walk
How do I keep the rest of my spine from deteriorating as the other 5 levels have? Has anyone else had the same problems with just too many levels to fuse? I was afraid of something like this happening. The dr. best explained it just as saying, you can't fix everything, it is like High Blood pressure you just take meds to keep it under control. The difference is, with backs some get cured of their pain, others just deal with it cause they have no alternative. Thanks for letting me rant on my disappointment and frustration. By the way, is there a place to post about knee injuries?
fluffypurrcat
After examning my back he looked at my knee and could clearly see the swelling. After poking it and moving and twisting it several ways, he said I need to see an Orthodpeidc dr; And probably get a MRI as it looks like a Menices Tear or Rupture that has gone on for a long time and he is not sure what is going on with the other knee except it also is bad.
He could have done a Lumbar Fusion but he said he could not fuse all five levels and not only do I have five bad levels now but the Degeneration is moving up the spine. He has not where he could put that many levels.I also have poor cirulation ( blue colored fingernails and cold feet) It all amounts to he doesnt have the know how to do any other thing with my back. If the Workmans Comp had done what they should have back in 2001 or by 2003 my back would not be what it is now. He only had two suggestions and more than likely because this is Workmans Comp, I won't get them done either.
He reccomended I go back to see the Spine Specilist that I saw in 2003 that suggested a IDET procedure for my back but noone in the area would do or Workmans Comp would authorize back then .( she is the professor of Spine Unit at a Major Hospital out of the area and is current on new procedures)
The other reccomendation was to go out of the area to a pain management Center Specilaist to see what they could do. Other than that is to get my knee evaluated.
Now I wonder if I made the right decision to try more conservative treatment a try back in 2001 when I first saw the Neurosurgeon after hurting my back. Surgery was offerend then, but I thought I should try other things. NOw I am stuck in a no win situation. I know my back is only going to get worse, and I feel like I am turning into a cripple, I have a bad back that causes pain, my hips are bad and my feet are bad and the pain from all of the other pain has given me a knee injury as well that may need surgery. I also am sure I won't get to see a pain management specilaist and Workmans Comp wont pay for any thing else. I do have my Methadone and I guess I will have to live the rest of my life with that. At least it is working for now, but this knee pain is a new pain that is a pain the Methadone doesnt work well with. What is worse is that the knee pain makes it painful and hard to walk
How do I keep the rest of my spine from deteriorating as the other 5 levels have? Has anyone else had the same problems with just too many levels to fuse? I was afraid of something like this happening. The dr. best explained it just as saying, you can't fix everything, it is like High Blood pressure you just take meds to keep it under control. The difference is, with backs some get cured of their pain, others just deal with it cause they have no alternative. Thanks for letting me rant on my disappointment and frustration. By the way, is there a place to post about knee injuries?
fluffypurrcat
Dear fluffypurrcat,
I am so sorry you did not get better news. It is very hard to hear your body is deteriating and you knew this because you felt it, felt the pain. I am glad you are getting pain control though that is something to be thankful for. I know this may not mean much now but God does not give us more than we can handle. There is a reason why this is happening though you may not know why now you will one day.
Please do not get discouraged after all it could be much worse, be thankful that you do have the means to see the specialist and have spin control as you know alot of people are not that fortunate.
As advised take one thing at a time and one day at a time, it took a long time to get this way and its going to take awhile to get thins back to somewhat normal. Stay positive because that helps tremendously!
Please know we are all here for you even if you just want to vent. We all know you have had a very tough time and we are here for you. Take solace in that.
I am so sorry you did not get better news. It is very hard to hear your body is deteriating and you knew this because you felt it, felt the pain. I am glad you are getting pain control though that is something to be thankful for. I know this may not mean much now but God does not give us more than we can handle. There is a reason why this is happening though you may not know why now you will one day.
Please do not get discouraged after all it could be much worse, be thankful that you do have the means to see the specialist and have spin control as you know alot of people are not that fortunate.
As advised take one thing at a time and one day at a time, it took a long time to get this way and its going to take awhile to get thins back to somewhat normal. Stay positive because that helps tremendously!
Please know we are all here for you even if you just want to vent. We all know you have had a very tough time and we are here for you. Take solace in that.
I just wanted to ask if you have had any injections for your back like an ESI or facet injections? If you have bad SI joints you can get injections there as well. You have to be careful though, because you can only get so many a year. The steroids can cause avascular necrosis of the hip joint if overused. I never had any success with them for my back, but they did help tremendously with my SI joint and for my neck. When I had the injections done on either side of my neck the effects lasted for three years. The pain was all but gone. No more shooting pains or headaches. It was great until about three months ago, it started coming back. It is worth a try to see if maybe they can help you. I have heard some say they were great and some that did not get any benefits what so ever. My grandfather had it done in his neck as well and could not raise his arms. After the injections he has been pain free in the neck and has no problems raising his arms. It does tend to wear off after some time, each person is different.
Take one thing at a time, as you seem to have several issues going on. It sounds like the knee needs to be fixed as soon as possible. With swelling going on I can't imagine how painful that would be for you. Take care of yourself and be your own advocate. As long as your meds are medically necessary the w/c have to pay for it. I am glad the Methadone helps with your pain. It is likely the dose will have to go up in the future as you build a tolerance. That is not something I would worry about for now. Each person builds their tolerance at different rates. Methadone did not work that great for me. I had to take it because I had to fight to get my meds and it was all I could afford at one time. I know what it's like to fight w/c. I am doing that now with a surgery I have to have. I need a fusion in my back because the other two fusions that were attempted have never fused so they want to go in and take everything out and refuse it, yet w/c is requiring all this documentation of conservative treatment and a presurgical psychological eval first. Sometimes you have to jump through the hoops to get things done.
Just make sure the doctor you pick is willing to fight for you. Most doctors who accept w/c know how it works and how to do all the appeals when they are denied. Just stay on top of it and fight like you have never fought before. You deserve to have your pain treated and treated properly.
I wish you all the best. I am so sorry you are going through all of this. My prayers are with you. Good luck.
Audrea
Take one thing at a time, as you seem to have several issues going on. It sounds like the knee needs to be fixed as soon as possible. With swelling going on I can't imagine how painful that would be for you. Take care of yourself and be your own advocate. As long as your meds are medically necessary the w/c have to pay for it. I am glad the Methadone helps with your pain. It is likely the dose will have to go up in the future as you build a tolerance. That is not something I would worry about for now. Each person builds their tolerance at different rates. Methadone did not work that great for me. I had to take it because I had to fight to get my meds and it was all I could afford at one time. I know what it's like to fight w/c. I am doing that now with a surgery I have to have. I need a fusion in my back because the other two fusions that were attempted have never fused so they want to go in and take everything out and refuse it, yet w/c is requiring all this documentation of conservative treatment and a presurgical psychological eval first. Sometimes you have to jump through the hoops to get things done.
Just make sure the doctor you pick is willing to fight for you. Most doctors who accept w/c know how it works and how to do all the appeals when they are denied. Just stay on top of it and fight like you have never fought before. You deserve to have your pain treated and treated properly.
I wish you all the best. I am so sorry you are going through all of this. My prayers are with you. Good luck.
Audrea
I am so sorry to hear about your pain and everything you have been through. I just wanted to mention one thing to you. I don't know how your state works with it's workman's comp., but here in Texas if you are having any problems or need questions answered you can call the State Board of Workman's Compensation Commission. Hopefully you have something like that their. They assign an Obudsman if someone is needed to help you with anything. If you are having problems getting things approved and it's against what the W/C Ins. carrier is doing the Ombudsman can step in for you and help you through any paperwork that may need to be filed to get what you need. They answer questions that pertain to any rules or regulations, because we all know they will breach them when they can get away with it and deny on a regular basis just so you will give up and go away saving them money. You always have the right to appeal any decision they make.
You may also want to get a second opinion just to make sure you have covered all your options. If you need something done that will help your condition and this is a work related injury, your w/c carrier is required to pay for it wether they want to or not. I would not care what the adjustor wanted you to do. It is not your job to keep them happy. This is your life and you need to be as comfortable as you can be. They don't have to live in your body. When I was 21 I got hurt at work and I was in college at the time. I was hurt so bad I could not keep a steady job. I had already lost my job because of pain but I stayed in college. My adjustor did not like that idea. She told me if I could go to college then I could work. I did not have to stand all day in college so it was bearable. My job required standing so I could no longer do it. I had to have my surgeon send a letter to the adjustor explaining why I could do school and not work. It just baffles why these adjustors can tell you how you are supposed to live your life when they are not the ones living it.
Several years later after all my surgeries I had an adjustor that wanted me to go to a pain management clinic in Houston for 6-8 weeks. I had already been to a pain management clinic twice and was working, but taking pain meds to help with my pain. I was functioning okay at the time, but the meds were very expensive. If I had to pay cash for them they would have been over $3000.00 a month. They did not like paying for the meds so they thought if I went to this PM clinic I would learn to live in pain and not need any more meds. That's what they were hoping for. What they did not understand is that I had a baby girl and a job that I could just not up and leave and what else were they going to teach me that I had not already learned at the other two places? When you are in pain, you are in pain. No amount of meditating or self hypnosis is going to take it away. They even called my PM doctor and wanted him to persuade me to go. He did mention it, but knew they really don't help. They can't make you do something you don't want to do.
I really feel for you and hope you find some better answers. Hopefully there will be something that can be done for you to help you with your pain. Good luck and God bless. Audrea
You may also want to get a second opinion just to make sure you have covered all your options. If you need something done that will help your condition and this is a work related injury, your w/c carrier is required to pay for it wether they want to or not. I would not care what the adjustor wanted you to do. It is not your job to keep them happy. This is your life and you need to be as comfortable as you can be. They don't have to live in your body. When I was 21 I got hurt at work and I was in college at the time. I was hurt so bad I could not keep a steady job. I had already lost my job because of pain but I stayed in college. My adjustor did not like that idea. She told me if I could go to college then I could work. I did not have to stand all day in college so it was bearable. My job required standing so I could no longer do it. I had to have my surgeon send a letter to the adjustor explaining why I could do school and not work. It just baffles why these adjustors can tell you how you are supposed to live your life when they are not the ones living it.
Several years later after all my surgeries I had an adjustor that wanted me to go to a pain management clinic in Houston for 6-8 weeks. I had already been to a pain management clinic twice and was working, but taking pain meds to help with my pain. I was functioning okay at the time, but the meds were very expensive. If I had to pay cash for them they would have been over $3000.00 a month. They did not like paying for the meds so they thought if I went to this PM clinic I would learn to live in pain and not need any more meds. That's what they were hoping for. What they did not understand is that I had a baby girl and a job that I could just not up and leave and what else were they going to teach me that I had not already learned at the other two places? When you are in pain, you are in pain. No amount of meditating or self hypnosis is going to take it away. They even called my PM doctor and wanted him to persuade me to go. He did mention it, but knew they really don't help. They can't make you do something you don't want to do.
I really feel for you and hope you find some better answers. Hopefully there will be something that can be done for you to help you with your pain. Good luck and God bless. Audrea
Hey Again Fluffy,
I haven't a clue why some posts see a lot of activity and others don't. I do know that sometimes the board is just slower than others. It isn't that our members don't care.
Also, as you know, workers comp does complicate the issue. Every state is different. In WI you have 12 years to obtain an attorney and I'm told in N Carolina you only have 4 years.
I assume you are unable to work. I maybe assuming incorrectly. But if you are not able to work have you consider applying for SSDI and/or State Insurance? Once one SSDI you are eligible for Medicare in 24 months. I know that's a long time but usually in the meantime you can obtain State Insurance.
A meniscus tear is repaired without general anesthesia. It is probably the least serious injury/conditions your knee can experience. Recovery is fairly short term, though it is painful for a few days.
Methadone is one of the least expensive long acting medications on the market. I am glad that it is effective for you. Please don't be discouraged. I know that you have a lot of pain and worrisome issues right now. I too have a lot of chronic pain. It has greatly helped me to be active on MedHelp. Feel free to continue to post, respond to threads and you may contact me through a PM.
Hang in there and please let us know how you are doing. I will look forward to your posts. Take Care, Tuck
I haven't a clue why some posts see a lot of activity and others don't. I do know that sometimes the board is just slower than others. It isn't that our members don't care.
Also, as you know, workers comp does complicate the issue. Every state is different. In WI you have 12 years to obtain an attorney and I'm told in N Carolina you only have 4 years.
I assume you are unable to work. I maybe assuming incorrectly. But if you are not able to work have you consider applying for SSDI and/or State Insurance? Once one SSDI you are eligible for Medicare in 24 months. I know that's a long time but usually in the meantime you can obtain State Insurance.
A meniscus tear is repaired without general anesthesia. It is probably the least serious injury/conditions your knee can experience. Recovery is fairly short term, though it is painful for a few days.
Methadone is one of the least expensive long acting medications on the market. I am glad that it is effective for you. Please don't be discouraged. I know that you have a lot of pain and worrisome issues right now. I too have a lot of chronic pain. It has greatly helped me to be active on MedHelp. Feel free to continue to post, respond to threads and you may contact me through a PM.
Hang in there and please let us know how you are doing. I will look forward to your posts. Take Care, Tuck
Hi, thanks for replying. NOw that I have posted this I guess noone has any encouragement and knows what else to say. I just feel helpless with Workmans Comp. It is no win situation and you have to fight for everything you get and everything you want. NOw that my case is so old, 10 years this Sept., no lawyer can help me get anything in the way of medical care, as they only handle the case up to the first 5 years. After that, you are on your own.
My fear now, is that my knee may need surgery or in my case, it may be the knee has been injured too long, ( several months, mayby close to a year) and the fact my other knee is now hurting, I can only see things getting progressively worse. I have an appt on this comming Monday, The 27th, and that is too see my regular health care provider so he can order an MRI, Without a MRI, and a referral from my regular DR. I can not get in to see the Orthpedic Dr.s .
I am sure there are other people out here on this forum who because of their back or neck, have had other parts of their bodies compensate from the pain and then injure that body part. I wish I could go back in time, but like you said, who knows, It may be the same outcome with my genetics or just plain fate. You can't controll what isn't yours to controll. I am grateful for Methadone, but sometimes you have to fight to get it too. I have already cut my dose down by 30% in order to get a more accuarte diagnosis from the Neurosurgeon and to please the Workmans Comp group who don't want to even pay for the meds. I dont know how long I can stay on Methadone, but unless I get the chance to see the Pain Managemnet Specialsit, I just think this is the med I will be on for a very long time, but have to deal with higher doses as time goes by.
I appreciate the time and effort you gave me by answering this post, and I just think everyone else has no response to offer any support or ideas , thinking I would perhaps get a better plan. It is like telling the man going blind,I can't help you get your eyesight back, you are just going to go blind and deal with it.
Thanks for caring. fluffypurrcat
My fear now, is that my knee may need surgery or in my case, it may be the knee has been injured too long, ( several months, mayby close to a year) and the fact my other knee is now hurting, I can only see things getting progressively worse. I have an appt on this comming Monday, The 27th, and that is too see my regular health care provider so he can order an MRI, Without a MRI, and a referral from my regular DR. I can not get in to see the Orthpedic Dr.s .
I am sure there are other people out here on this forum who because of their back or neck, have had other parts of their bodies compensate from the pain and then injure that body part. I wish I could go back in time, but like you said, who knows, It may be the same outcome with my genetics or just plain fate. You can't controll what isn't yours to controll. I am grateful for Methadone, but sometimes you have to fight to get it too. I have already cut my dose down by 30% in order to get a more accuarte diagnosis from the Neurosurgeon and to please the Workmans Comp group who don't want to even pay for the meds. I dont know how long I can stay on Methadone, but unless I get the chance to see the Pain Managemnet Specialsit, I just think this is the med I will be on for a very long time, but have to deal with higher doses as time goes by.
I appreciate the time and effort you gave me by answering this post, and I just think everyone else has no response to offer any support or ideas , thinking I would perhaps get a better plan. It is like telling the man going blind,I can't help you get your eyesight back, you are just going to go blind and deal with it.
Thanks for caring. fluffypurrcat
Hi Fluffypurrcat,
I am so sorry that you did not have better news. None of us guessed that it would be that severe. It proves it take the specialists to give you the right answers.
Don't beat yourself up for not having surgery when offered sooner. Not only did you think you made the best decision you could at the time you must remember that hindsight is 20/20. And who's to say that even had you had surgery that you wouldn't have ended up in the same or similar situation today? So please don't feel guilty.
I am thankful that you obtain pain releif from the methadone and that you have a physician that will prescribe it for you.
I wish you the very best. Others will post with their suggestions. I do not have your condition but you have my emphathy. We are here for you. Hang in there. Tuck
I am so sorry that you did not have better news. None of us guessed that it would be that severe. It proves it take the specialists to give you the right answers.
Don't beat yourself up for not having surgery when offered sooner. Not only did you think you made the best decision you could at the time you must remember that hindsight is 20/20. And who's to say that even had you had surgery that you wouldn't have ended up in the same or similar situation today? So please don't feel guilty.
I am thankful that you obtain pain releif from the methadone and that you have a physician that will prescribe it for you.
I wish you the very best. Others will post with their suggestions. I do not have your condition but you have my emphathy. We are here for you. Hang in there. Tuck
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