Homocysteine - My homocysteine is 12.36 > 7

[Antonych]

I received my last exams Friday in my mailbox and an email from my doctor (She is very competent), she informed me that I have homocysteineemia.
In fact my homocysteine is 12.36> 7 (it is a rare disease its frequency in the population is between 1 / 60,000 and 1 / 300,000 people), these are toxic amino acids that accumulate in the blood ... In short I let you go google.
The treatment is vitamins, she recommended me a specific brand that I ordered and it will last about 3 months.

I did 32 final exams in total (in a week), I could scan the results and put on the drive and send you the link the week before.
I'm really happy.

I had other health problems that certainly have nothing to do with PATM, but Homocysteinemia is the most suspect for PATM, followed by vitamin D.

[TAPAKAH]

Google "masturbation vitamin B" and you'll see a lot about how excessive masturbation could lead to vitamin B depletion among other things. This ties in with what a Chinese poster wrote a few months ago. He said there's a sort of consensus in his Chinese PATM community that symptoms reduce greatly if you abstain from sexual activity.

[ocvq]

Info URL HTTP, link for more info.

[ocvq]

Parece que la masturbación no tiene nada que ver con la perdida de vitamina B, mas bien ayuda a disminuir el estrés, a menos que exageres como 10 veces al dia. Cita la pagina o articulo donde dice el informe para leer mas sobre eso.

[ocvq]

It seems that masturbation has nothing to do with losing vitamin B, but rather helps to reduce stress, unless you exaggerate like 10 times a day. Quote the page or article where the report says to read more about it.

[ray2502]

Hello Antonych

What brand of vitamins did she recommend? And could you follow up on your results by providing us with a link.
Thanks in advance.

[Antonych]

Hello ray2502

I made screenshots that I put on Word and transformed into pdf, download here: ( https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B4G5e5vmlbBKZkpHcVBrb1I3Z2c?usp=sharing   )


Sorry the results are in French.

For the vitamin, she prescribed a vitamin complex B. Knowing that she had already prescribed iron with folic acid and 4 vitamin D capsules.

( https://www.bionutrics.fr/produits/vitamines-et-mineraux/b-nutrics-detail )


I can confirm that I had a very good week. My PATM has decreased by at least 85% already, knowing that I have to take the vitamins over 3 months and the vitamin D gellules in 2 months.

[ocvq]

HI,
Hematocrit 36 (normal 40-50)
Hemoglobin 11.70 (normal 13.00-17.00)
M.G. 82.57
T.G.M 26.84
C.c. M 32.50


Segmented Neofilophiles 52 (normal 50-70)
Eosinophils 3 (1-4)
Lymphocytes 44 (normal 25-40

[PATMsufferer]

Thanks for the information. I googled what some of the comparable English terms are:

Globules rouge = Erythrocytes
V.G.M. = MCV (mean corpuscular volume)
T.G.M. = MCH (mean corpuscular hemoglobin)
C.C.M. = MCHC (mean corpuscular hemoglobin concentration)
Globules blancs = Leukocytes
Plaquette = Thrombocytes (Platelets)

Very interesting. It looks like the homocysteine levels are only slightly elevated, though. >30 is a serious elevation, so 12 isn't too serious - although it's still a good idea to take vitamins to lower homocysteine since it can be a risk for heart attack.  

It's also interesting that the candida test came back negative. It looks like candida might not be a critical part of PATM.

The B-Nutrics vitamins look very good - all of the B-vitamins in active forms along with choline, PABA, and inositol. They're made by the same company that makes Candibactin, so they should be good quality.

[ocvq]

How much of each vitamin should be ingested? B2 mg, B6, B12 mg, Folic Acid mg. Anyone know or have data? Why Wiquipedia is half bad, is not so believable or is it? For any exaggeration of the consumption of vitamins could alter the genetics or bring "fatal" consequences to our body.


http://www.foodforthebrain.org/alzheimers-prevention/methylation-and-homocysteine.aspx

[Jon3456]

Thanks Patmsufferer. The powdered form of certain supplements are well absorbed than capsules. Could you share with me the powdered form which you take? And also the b complex supplement. Do you overdose on the b's? Or stick the dosage?

Sticking to a less choline diet is essential for us. It's good that you've built up your system in this manner so you can further tackle the bacterial problem. This whole patm thing would never be understood since there are so many causes. How's your gut flora?

[PATMsufferer]

For TMG, I use Jarrow's TMG crystals. For the B-vitamins, I take a combination of Seeking Health B-minus, Maxx Labs Liquid B12, and Pure Science Methylfolate.

I take the B-minus because I don't like how most complexes contain excessive B12, and I like taking B12 as sublingual drops since B12 isn't always well-absorbed in some people's stomachs.

I take methylfolate separately so I can take higher doses of it (1-5 mg/day), which most complexes don't provide. The methylfolate isn't for PATM; it's for other health concerns (e.g., optimizing nerve function).

I also keep a bottle of 100mg B2, and I take a tablet at lunch and dinner (I take B-minus at breakfast). In other words, yes, I definitely overdose on B2 (and on methylfolate), since it's supposed to help activate any residual FMO3 enzyme activity in the liver (important for TMAU).

Grateful2011's Methyl-Guard Plus looks like an exceptional product, and it has the most important B-vitamins in their activated forms, i.e., forms that the liver doesn't have to provide "additional processing" for the body to make use of (methylation is one example of such "additional processing").

I've read that it's wise to supplement all of the B-vitamins together since they can get out of balance if you don't. Methyl-Guard Plus doesn't have B1 (thiamine), B3 (niacin), B5 (pantothenic acid), or B7 (biotin), so you might want to make sure you're getting these other B-vitamins somehow while taking Methyl-Guard Plus (e.g., by eating Vegemite, nutritional yeast, brewer's yeast, etc.)

I haven't re-checked my gut flora recently. On the last two tests (8 months ago), lactobacillus spp. were still strongly reduced. I'm currently doing a course of Candibactin-BR and Candibactin-AR while also taking Resveratrol (which supposedly increases lactobacillus spp.) and Vivomixx probiotics (a cheaper version of VSL#3). I also use Klaire Labs Interfase Plus digestive enzymes, which supposedly breaks down the biofilms around bacteria.

My gut feels better (i.e., less irritable), but PATM is still there. The bottom line is that all of the supplements I'm taking are definitely making me feel better, but they have yet to cure my PATM. Hopefully they'll help me pinpoint what is and isn't causing PATM.

[PATMsufferer]

According to examine . com, creatine might be an effective way to get the methylation cycle in balance. Google "creatine-and-same" along with "examine".

Basically, our bodies deplete SAM-e to produce creatine, so if we supplement creatine, then our bodies don't have to burn through SAM-e to make it. And since SAM-e is produced from TMG, we can preserve more of our TMG since it won't be used up to replenish SAM-e. This process should allow more TMG to be devoted to lowering homocysteine levels.

[Jon3456]

Thanks PATMsufferer. I ordered the TMG crystals and Homocysteine defense(B vitamins). Dont know if these would help the odor in any manner but from what ive read is that it would methylation.

BUT, im a little confused about the TMG dosage. I dont know if ive TMAU but my symptoms side with it. Having said that, arent we supposed to avoid TMA or anything that produces TMA In the gut since it cant get metabolized?  

[PATMsufferer]

I've read that 3g or more of TMG per day has been used to lower homocysteine (examine . com/supplements/trimethylglycine/ ).

It is true that TMG could increase TMA in the body, and hence it could increase TMAU symptoms. We shouldn't completely avoid choline or other TMA-producing substances, however, because they are important for our health. Unfortunately, they probably will increase TMAU symptoms at least a little. It's a cost/benefit question.

I have found that I tolerate powdered TMG better than capsule TMG, but even with powdered TMG, I notice a slight increase in my odor, but it's not as significant as if I eat broccoli or take a carnitine pill.

[PATMsufferer]

Interesting. I began taking TMG (trimethylglycine) a month ago to test whether it would increase my PATM reactions (I thought it should if my PATM were related to TMAU, since TMG would be readily reduced to trimethylamine). Surprisingly, my PATM reactions did not get terribly worse, and I actually felt a lot better after taking it. I've been taking it ever since, hoping that reactions might decrease over time (they're definitely still there).

Since TMG reduces homocysteine levels, I wondered if I felt better because the TMG reduced elevated homocysteine levels in my blood. I once tried to get tested for hyperhomocysteinemia, but my doctor considered it frivolous, so I can't be sure that elevated homocysteine levels in my blood were truly a problem for me, but TMG has nevertheless become one of my preferred supplements.

So yeah, let us know how the vitamins work for you.

[Jon3456]

Hi Patmsufferer, i was considering on taking the TMG as well for reducing the homocysteine levels. Just wanted to know if you're taking it with vitamin B's, folic acid? Also, how its working for you lately?

Secondly, are you just giving off any particular odor or just reactions?

[PATMsufferer]

Hi Jon3456, I do supplement the B-vitamins. I make sure to take the activated forms of B2, B6, B9, and B12 (i.e., riboflavin 5'-phosphate sodium, pyridoxal 5'-phosphate, methylfolate, methylcobalamin).

I take TMG in powder form so it's more likely to be absorbed in the small intestine rather than the bacteria-heavy large intestine.

I definitely have odors associated with my PATM, and I bet if I took TMG in capsule form, my smells would be much more intense since a lot more TMG would be available for the colonic bacteria to break down into trimethylamine.

With my powder TMG, my reactions and smells have not gone away. But I do feel better taking it.

I was on a TMAU diet for a long time, so I wonder if I became deficient in choline. Since TMG is made from choline, perhaps the supplemental TMG makes me feel better because it's restoring a vital nutrient that I foolishly selected out of my diet. Just goes to show that people should always be cautious when experimenting with diets.

[grateful2011]

hey PATMsufferer

Glad you are having success with TMG, it looks like that supplement addresses the homocysteine levels in our body

Thank you for teaching us about this, I had never heard of this TMG and just recently learned about homocysteine and how it relates to inflammation in our bodies


Also glad, you are taking "active" B vitamins , I don't know what that means - however I would suggest you to check out if your particular "active" B's supplement, also help your body to methylate properly ?????

God Bless always !

[grateful2011]

Your thorough and great research is helping this forum  PATMsufferer!

Thank you also for your knowledgeable opinion of my new supplement Methyl Guard Plus.

Since you stated I'm not getting the full B complex - what do you think about adding this supplement called - Bplex-pro ???

I know you will become patm free soon, because of your healthy choices - God Bless you

Are you monitoring your food choices as well ?

[PATMsufferer]

Hi Grateful2011. Thanks for your encouragement. Methyl Guard Plus has amazing doses of B2 (90mg), B9 (3mg), and TMG (1.8mg). It's hard to find a B-vitamin supplement with more than 20 mg of activated B2, so if I didn't already have my B-vitamins sorted out, I would consider getting Methyl Guard Pro for myself.

BPlex-PRO also looks really good, and has all of the B-vitamins except B3 (B3 as niacin is worth supplementing by itself - the flushing sensation can be invigorating). Most surprisingly, BPlex-PRO has B1 as benfotiamine instead of thiamine hydrochloride! (Benfotiamine is better at crossing the blood-brain barrier.)

Citicoline is also a surprising addition. Like benfotiamine, citicoline is good at crossing the blood-brain barrier, and it's a more absorbable form of choline than the more commonly found choline bitartrate (Alpha-GPC is also a good form of choline if you can get it).

Chelated zinc and betaine anhydrous (aka TMG) definitely make this a very good supplement. The dose of TMG is a little on the low side (1-3g is good for lowering homocysteine, so an additional TMG source might be needed); zinc, however, is at a good dose.  

The other ingredients are in pretty low doses as well, but I think they're in there to help absorption of the B-vitamins (i.e., effective doses of L-glutamine, L-arginine, etc. would be in the range of, say, 5g instead of 10mg, so this pill wouldn't be a primary source of amino acids.) The NAC is also good, but again at a low dose (600mg is a more common dose). But you can only fit so much into one capsule. For the B-vitamins, this supplement seems awesome.

Just a note about supplementing zinc: Zinc is extremely important, and unless you consume lots of beef, oysters, and/or pumpkin seeds, you might have difficulty getting it from food alone, so it's worth supplementing. However, it can cause a copper deficiency if it's supplemented for too long. Copper chlorophyllin is good to take while supplementing zinc, or you can get a zinc-copper complex like Jarrow's Zinc Balance to make sure you don't get a copper deficiency if you're supplementing zinc for months on end.

Diet is also very important, and I've been following a very healthy diet for the last 3 years. I haven't touched alcohol or even so much as a potato chip. I bought a slow-cooker and I try to consume broth as much as possible (just toss in some carrots, potatoes, bones, chicken/beef, and apple cider vinegar, and in 8 hours you have a stew that lasts for 3-4 days, very convenient).

I avoid processed foods, sugar, and excess salt, so unless I have a food allergy that I'm not aware of, my food choices shouldn't be contributing to PATM (but it's still possible that some food allergen I'm inadvertently consuming could irritate my gut). I also don't strictly follow a TMAU diet anymore, because I'm afraid of missing out on vital nutrients, but I still generally avoid some problematic foods like broccoli.