Do you think it's an accident that he reached the age of 45 without ever having a girlfriend?
What do you see in him? He sounds incapable of a relationship and he also sounds like a jerk.
I know. It's no accident he reached 45 and never had a girlfriend. But he DOES show a side of himself to me that he doesn't show anyone else. He will pick me up from work even if he is in a place that is an hour away. he has been there for me 100% thru the death of my step mother whom i was very close with. he is very aware of certain things but other things just escape him. i honestly believe its because he doesnt know how to be a boyfriend. he is very introverted. he has been a nerd his whole life. wallflower. i adore him. he does care for me a great deal. i know he does. he has said he does. im just in need of a little more than he can give i guess. i dont know. im so confused.
You can't change him or fix him. If you are frustrated now, think about if you get in more seriously with this guy.
I've only dated one virgin - I was 40 at the time and the guy was 38. He was one of the most socially inept people I'd ever met. I invited him over for dinner and said, "why don't you bring something to drink?" Instead of bringing wine or something else enjoyable, which sort of goes without saying that's what you do, he brought water in his bicycle water bottle and drank it during dinner. I kid you not.
I don't think this guy is an emotional match for you maturity wise. All of his "great" qualities are sort of clouding up your view of the negative sh*t, and I think the negatives here are pretty big.
I hope this guy isn't proud of his virginal status. Being a virgin is a liability, whether you are a woman or a man. It's not something to be proud of, IMO. It's just a state indicating you haven't had sex, but we don't live in the 18th century anymore (although some around here would like us to be, though). If he got to be this age without a natural curiosity for sex and what it means in the context of his relationships with women, I think he is someone I want to steer clear of.
Have you considered couple's counseling? Maybe that would help, because I'll bet most of his problem is just what you said--he doesn't know how to be a boyfriend.
As a side note, have you ever seen the movie "40 Year Old Virgin?" This movie is pretty darn funny (although raunchy and vulgar; definitely an adult movie), and the main character just has no clue how to relate to women that he feels attracted to. Then he gets a girlfriend, and he really cares deeply about her, but she begins to think he's insensitive and careless when she wants the relationship to progress and he just "doesn't get it."
This guy doesn't sound right to me. He will never change...
id move on. whats he saving it for? besides, virgin or not a selfish man at 45 will not change. i find that characteristic to be a hard one to live with.
Move on... He still doesn't sound right to me I think he will never change. Believe me...
i dated a man that age, very selfish. didnt compliment, didnt put me first ever. he would actually get out of the car and go into the restaurant before i could get to the door (my opinion not nice lol). anyway he never changed, after 3 years. the only thing that kept me around for that long was the most fantastic sex ever!!!! but even still not worth it looking back. i feel if you have to come on a message board and complain like this, maybe he isnt the one for you. do what makes you happy.
Well, he sure knows how to stereotype. Just because somebody is a "busty blonde" doesn't mean they don't have any brain cells or you "can't talk to them."
But he's not necessarily doing great in the "easy to talk to" department, either. People in glass houses and all.
He's clueless. Move on.
Come on, ACHE, you gotta be kidding us. You think it's appropriate that this guy throws around backhanded digs and insults and he thinks it's fine? You think it's okay that he doesn't treat her with some semblance of dignity and respect? I don't care what "size" she is or that she doesn't look like a supermodel. How many of us do, for chrissakes? Hurling insults, especially in the form of humor, is immature and thoughtless.
But this is pretty telling, from the OP:
"But he DOES show a side of himself to me that he doesn't show anyone else. He will pick me up from work even if he is in a place that is an hour away. he has been there for me 100% thru the death of my step mother whom i was very close with. he is very aware of certain things but other things just escape him."
He's never shown anybody else these "sides" because he's never had a girlfriend! Listen to yourself, please. Any man who doesn't make you feel good with his words AND his actions isn't going to be an appropriate partner for you.
I hate to bring this up again, because I've mentioned it more than once around this place, but the bottom line is that you should go into a dating situation, a relationship, a partnership, a marriage - any of them, at any level - you should go in assuming that THINGS WON'T CHANGE. Because 9 times out of 10, they won't. Then where will you be?
I sort of glossed over that he was your first kiss. I guess I assumed he's never had intercourse or BJs. This guy has never kissed a woman and he's 45 years old.
Couple's counceling was only my suggestion because she said she "loves him dearly but is fed up with his lack of concern for her feelings."
She also said that she's convinced he loves/cares about her.
The guy is a 45 year old virgin who's never had a relationship before. Sounds to me that he just needs a wake-up call on how to be in one with some good counceling. How else is he going to mature in this area of his life?
It's just up to the original poster whether or not she wants to be the one willing to help him mature and remain in the relationship with him.
Why is my advice not acceptable to you when you're not even the one asking for it?
omg, i never meant to cause an argument between people on this forum! lemme try to clear some things up just a little. i mean i made the poor guy seem like a mean evil rotten cant care for anyone arse!
the "digs" he gets in arent so much digs as this: went to a concert, of course always half nekked women there, so jokingly i pointed out a particularly busty bleach-blonde for him and he says he isnt interested in someone that looks like her, he would rather have someone with brains that he could talk to. my problem? he hasnt ever really said im pretty. ugly either. just tells me when i dog on myself that im not ugly, im not fat, etc. doesnt give a compliment. although he has said he likes my hair. oooookkkkkkk
last night i told him that he felt really nice to hold on to during a really nice hug, his reply? thanks. i got butthurt and came unglued and told him that it would be nice if he could just once say something nice about/to me. he looked confused and said he didnt know how to feel about me saying that since he thought he has said nice things to me along those lines. i said think again buddy. he is still thinking.
he knows i have to get out of my apt cuz of the changes being made around there regarding seniors and not seniors (im not a senior therefore whereby i have to vacate) and he also knows mom cant really help me much cuz of her health. his reply? you know ive been planning this tourney for awhile. i cant back out. my feelings? get the hell over it. i need your help. so what did i do? kept quiet, wrenched my back and can hardly use my right wrist for the carpal tunnel, arthritis, tendinitis and bursitis aching so bad from me moving so much last weekend on my own. that one, he deserves everyones anger for.
but mostly he is sweet, caring, would do anything for me any time i ask him to. its just when it comes to being unselfish, he has no clue how to do this. he has been alone so long and without love from his family and has never had a friend he could truly call a friend that he has no clue how to act in the real world with real people. he let me in. i see the real HIM. what he is capable of and how deep the hurt goes from lack of love from everyone. im getting thru to him, but its taking too long i think. maybe couseling would be a good idea? i dunno. i appreciate all of you responding as you did. im just sorry i caused an argument!
Nothing is wrong being a virgin at 45 yrs old and it sound like to me no one wants sex with this guy cause he sounds like a Loser!!!!! Your very smart not staying with a guy doesn't treat you well....
How long have you been dating this guy? I mean, have you had this relationship long enough that you would have expected to be having sex by now?
Satan on a cross, he might also have some sexual hang-ups that he's ashamed of or uptight about as well. He doesn't sound like he's in a hurry to have sex with you. That's not about you - it's his deal.
does he live at home with his mom still? i dont want to knock people who use myspace, but really at 45? what is his purpose for that? if a guy tells you he wont be hurt by you leaving, that means he doesnt care. my ex said that to me too. he said he didnt need me in his life and he would be fine if he died alone. he got his wish.
oh my queensryche lol .my dh loves 80's long hair bands. its been nice not having to listen to the boneyard on xm radio lol. anyway, myself, sex is pretty darn important!! my dh has been gone for only a few months and im dying here! lol. people dont always represent themselves honestly online anything. i have had some interesting stories regarding that. lol. i still say get out. i dont know your age, but i think you might be a bit younger than him? i dont feel its worth wasting time in a so so relationship
i know. im probably one of the most unselfish people i know and i know that sounds so awful to say,tooting my own horn and all, but i can see it now. that im always the one to give in every single solitary relationship i have ever been in and then they take take take and when im either tapped out or done giving I GET THE BOOT. he is sweet and has a lot of good qualities, but i think maybe you guys are right. the bad well outweigh the good in this one. if he has to think about whether or not he has given me any sort of compliment then he probably hasnt. and if he hasnt given "IT" up to me yet, then im not the one for him. sex is a special thing, but not that damned special. (oh and just for the record, he would bring wine or beer instead of a water bottle for himself to dinner. he is inept, but not quite that bad, lmfao)
thanks for the insight guys! i appreciate your input. talking to you and another friend of mine has opened my eyes to the fact that this probably wont work and will only get worse. especially since im moving pretty far away from him and we wont be able to see each other but maybe on weekends. oh well. i do care for him and i think i do love him just a little but the hurt i feel daily isnt worth it to me any more.
yes, stereotypical. his myspace page says it all. yes ive been in this relationship long enuf that we should being doing more than playing touchy feely. ive tried oral sex and he almost gave me whiplash to get me off him telling me he isnt ready. that was only 2 months ago. told me he wanted to have sex with some ho he knew a coupla years ago, willing to give it up to a skank but not someone that has true honest feelings for you? niiiiiiiiice. and to tell me he wanted to do her, that really falls into the "are you stupid or what?" category, for us both! im thinking the answer is "or what" for me. him? cant know, not sure if i care at this point. and you guys arent swaying my decision, just opening my eyes to what i already knew but was unwilling to admit to myself. baseball, ebay and HIMSELF are the only concerns in his life. at the beginning of the relationship he told me that if i wanted to end it, fine. he wouldnt be hurt, just tell him before i cheat. nice eh? shoulda ran right then and there. moron that i am, i believe in giving people a chance. duh!
no he doesnt live at home. he wouldnt. couldnt. he and his mom cant stand each other. i think truly thats part of the problem. he views women differently because of the way his mother has treated him for 45 years. it started at birth and got increasingly more awful as time went on. for some reason he is the hated child. (second of 4) i dont know why she hates him, and i dont know that i will ever find out or care to find out. he wasnt so mean as to say he didnt care if i was in his life, just that if i found someone else that i wanted to be with more, fine, tell him and hes gone. he hugs me a lot, back rubs, we are in each others heads alot, think the same things and say them at the same time, weird **** too. but i guess that isnt enuf to continue with this relationship. he makes me smile all the time tho. im so tired of not being able to hold on to a relationship. good thing i like being alone.
"i dont want to knock people who use myspace, but really at 45?"
LOL. Pertykitty, one of my women friends was telling me about how her recently divorced neighbor went on myspace - he's 51. I don't know enough about myspace, but it does seem like something the younger folks do. For the older guys, there's something a little off-putting about it. Don't know. Maybe it's like craigslist or something, has a built-in cruise factor? Yikes.
OP, every time you come on here and give us more information, it sounds worse and worse.
If you're having trouble with relationships lasting, maybe you can take some time and think about the kinds of guys you're picking out. Usually we all have patterns for what we are attracted to, and often what we're attracted to isn't emotionally healthy for us. Good luck to you.
Move on... He doesn't sound to bright trying not to be mean us women deserve alot better than that......
i know i do, but i also think mebbe just mebbe if i gave him a chance he would step up to the plate and be what i need. but i know that isnt going to happen. im just a sucker for a weeny! (dogs that is! doxies. has 2. cutest little miniweenies EVAH!! ) lmfao
Ya you can give him a chance but I don't think he's going to change....
Wish you the best please don't let a guy rule you....
oh hun i would never let a man rule me! i have in the past and i have learned that lesson a long time ago. see, the thing of it is, i KNOW he can be a good guy. step up and do what needs to be done. but he wont. and honestly any more i dont care what the reason for it is. if you cant let yourself go to be with me on a personal level and a sexual level then we shouldnt be together. period. poor guy. he aint gonna know what hit him. oh well, not my problem any more.
medgal, this guy has no friends, no family, no girlfriends, no nothing except some weird myspace page.
And he about knocks you down when you approach his crotch.
Is there any possibility this is a woman you're dating? Do you have any real idea of his history - any friends, or baby pictures, or have you felt his penis when you hug? (Sorry, TMI, but really, this is very weird).
yeah im thinkin mebbe its time for me to be sans man and just find me. i was alone for almost 6 months after my last ex dumped me for my best friend. i liked being alone. . then my girls wanted me to post a myspace so we could chat during the day with them home and me at work. yeah yeah yeah, i should know better. meeting someone online especially at myspace. a little detail i neglected to tell ya'll. im a myspace *****, yes. lmfao i have learned my lesson lemme just tell you! kinda like the idear of bein alone agin! do what i want when i want. and dont have to worry if someone is gonna get butthurt or if im gonna be the one getting hurt! that sounds kinda nice to me! thanks guys.
hey i met my husband doing online dating, weird i know but when you dont go to bars or such it can be hard to meet people as a single mom, but myspace i take as a teen site lol i could be wrong!
op i think he is my ex lol. he was the first of 4 adopted kids. his mom was not quite right, had depression and treated the kids oddly. he resents her and i believe that to be why he never had a relationhship last or will ever. he wont let go of himself to risk hurt no matter how great it is. if only there was a gadget that you could point at a man and it tell you if he is an abuser, idiot, or has a teeny weeny lol.
lmfao im not against online dating, i just should have known better for a 45 year old man to be on myspace (yeah, i have met some wonderful people on myspace for the band i like, queensryche, but thats all we talk about. ) i did it for my kids to be able beg and plead to do things that they know good an well im going to say no to anyways! lol yes, i wish i had either a gadget or the foresight to know if someone is a dork, clod, moron, idiot, abuser, alcoholic, teeny weeny, thats funny! lol i almost ran for the hills when he first told me he was a virgin, im kinda wishin i had now. save us both the headache and me the heartache. ***sigh*** hindsight is always 20/20 no? lol
yes yes i love the hair bands of the 80's! only thing is, i feel awful at the concerts cuz everyone has gotten so darned old. lmfao
yes im quite a bit older than him. 10 years younger to be exact. i matured earlier than i should have as i was married and had chidren at 18. in fact, i had both girls before i was 20 years old. i thought i was doing well in waiting till i was 17 to have sex! i guess 45 shoulda been my goal ! lmfao all kidding aside, i would love nothing more than to try to make this work with us. we have so much in common. we get along great for the most part, but the inconsideration and the lack of common sense has me in a twist almost every day. and i shouldnt have to live like that. and im sad about that cuz i really care for him and in his own f&*^ed up way i know he cares for me a great deal, but he wont change and i cant stay in a relationship like this. not fair for me.
Rock Rose we are close in our thinking - I was wondering if the man is gay and maybe he just cannot accept it. He is complete denial or something. Regardless, he isn't someone I would trust with my heart or feelings.
My opinion the guy don't sound right and I think when you wake up you will relize he's no good.....
YES he is a man, i have seen it and i have touched it and played with it. we just haven't done oral sex or intercourse. and yes, its real and it ejaculates as well. (not trying to be a smart arse, just covering all the bases and questions you might ask later! lmao)
im not sure still if im going to continue this relationship or not, but i will say something here:
he is a good guy. he has a heart of gold. he would do anything for me. i dont honestly know if he is capable of ever having sex with anyone, including me or even the ho he told me about. he has a tough, often times weird exterior that is kind of hard to get thru but once i did get thru it, i found a diamond in the rough. the only problem is making him see beyond himself. i dont know if i can wait long enough to find out if he can see beyond himself. i didnt see him last night as he had a game and i had to work late, but i stayed up most of the night analyzing everything, everything i told all of you and what you offered to me (which i appreciate immensely! thank you SO MUCH for all your input!) and im leaning towards ending it more than not. he is good to me but i deserve someone that can see me and him not just himself.
I still say the guy isn't worth it and to move on you will wake up one day knowing he's not worth it... Good luck in the future..
I read your post very good attitude right on the button. very smart too.
"he is a good guy. he has a heart of gold. he would do anything for me."
Well, apparently he won't do anything for you. You are not getting the emotional support you need from him, and you are apparently not getting a healthy sexual relationship out of him. Those are two HUGE things, in my book.
The "heart of gold" sh*t that you are describing are qualities that many people have for a variety of reasons. They don't have much to do with him loving you. Many people simply have a background moral code they grew up with, so they know enough to "be nice" to people. Wanting to please people is common. You should not hold this guy up on a pedestal because he is willing to drive over an hour to see you and take you somewhere. My women friends also do stuff like that for me. So did my former boss. All platonic relationships. And I did stuff like that for them. (Well, not the driving part, since I don't drive, but other favors.) You are letting stuff like this get in the way of your seeing the bigger picture here, which is that he doesn't seem capable of a deep emotional or sexual relationship you.
At this point, whether he's gay, tranny, a mama's boy, emotionally stunted, or is walking around with a serious psychosis with pathological traits doesn't really matter. What matters is that this thing isn't happening FOR YOU.
"i dont honestly know if he is capable of ever having sex with anyone, including me or even the ho he told me about"
Doesn't matter at this point. You are not getting what you want, and in fact you've been rebuffed in trying to get what you want, both sexually and in discovering that he is clueless about his remarks and behavior towards you, so attempting to figure out why isn't productive.
I'm always surprised to see how folks use stereotypical language to describe sex workers. You sound like an intelligent woman - did you really mean to say "ho?"
Look, you are obviously a very nice person, why would you 'settle" for this guy if you know he is not who you want emotionally. People get involved with people all the time thinking that they can change them. YOU CANNOT CHANGE PEOPLE!!!! They are who they are. You either accept them for who and what they are or you don't, it's that simple. I think you are underestimating your ability to find someone that suits you, and I am not sure why. Maybe you have a little insecurity about not being a "supermodel". I am by no means a supermodel (most women aren't). But, I certainly value all of the good qualities I posess and can give to someone, and I am very comfortable in my skin (although a little overwieght) but, I work on that daily. So, what I am saying is don't sell yourself short over this guy (who sounds like a loser to me) just because he will drive for an hour to pick you up. As for being a virgin, so what? Why would you want your first time to be with this guy who is not even emotionally attatched, might as well do it with a dildo. Probably would be more satisfying for you anyways than with someone who is not interested in you or your needs. Best of luck, I wish you well.
Just trying to help the poor girl. I hope she uses some of our advice.
You can try so much to help people and give them advise they might listen to what we say but they will not do anything until they get hurt... To me this guy isn't all there but in her eyes she thinks he's great.. Hopefully she will wake up and smell the coffee...(LOL)
In case you are still reading replies, just know I have known my boyfriend for a very looong time (over 10 years) and we were friends. He geeked out a lot and just didn't have time for women; he had cerebral pursuits ("brainaic") and is often described as 'eccentric.' But a heart of gold, it seemed - always helping others with difficult tasks (easy for him) and finally when we were both single, I asked him out. Took 9 months approx. just to get a kiss. I had to do the kissing. He was "too shy" he said later. Then I was also reading up on Asperger's Syndrome and you should MAYBE look into that. Aspies have a tendency to be single-focused on things. AS is a spectrum, so he may exhibit some or all traits. I don't care what anyone else's opinion is of my post but am just telling you this because IT HELPED ME understand him, and in turn, I didn't take things so personally anymore. When I saw how he viewed the world, it wasn't a personal affront. So, rather than rage on him, I was reeeeally suuuuper patient and when I saw my opp'y, I made my move! I planted one right on him! He'd never had a girlfriend, at least not for 20 years, and he's older than your boyfriend. I love him so much and he doesn't compliment me a LOT but *I* know from having known him before that he makes the effort. He just 'doesn't know how.' His other family members seem to be the same way, at least some of them. Eccentric. Sometimes really smart people aren't social, and we take it personally, because we are indeed social (we women, anyway).
So, I suggest looking into that. It could also be that he's pathological or has some degree of mental illness - perhaps depression or schizoid personality. I don't know. Armchair psychology isn't really my bag. But, I am telling you, when I give the benefit of the doubt regarding the Asperger's, I can relate much better to him, and not expect too much. Of course, it would be great if he had an *official* diagnosis. But, there are some who say AS doesn't really exist. It could be a slim chance; I'm not sure what percentage of the population has it. But, trust me, I love my boyfriend and I'm selfish; I want a future with him. I don't know if we have one or not. All I know is that *I'm* the only one who seemingly *understands* him, regardless of what he has.
As for the loner personalities, I am finding that I require some degree of social interaction. It can't be all from him. And I can't have outside interests when I'm worrying about "us." Therefore, I have other close friends who fill the gap, so I don't overwhelm my boyfriend, and have my own life outside of our relationship.
I love my boyfriend dearly and am too clingy right now to see the forest for the trees. My boyfriend is pedantic, bookish, and looks like a grown-up version of Harry Potter. He looks at least 10 years younger than he is. There are so many things I love about him, and yes, sometimes I wish he were more vocal. But, it ain't gonna happen. I'm not saying to put up with an abusive relationship that's one-sided, where he doesn't interact with you and ignores you. That could spell disaster.
I'm just saying to give the benefit of the doubt and also, trust your gut. If you feel he's not trustworthy, that's one thing. Also, I don't know your age, but just know that as a woman gets into her 40s, well, watch out! It's so easy to fall for someone, and to be attracted, and the whole nine yards. They say (and hopefully this isn't all preachy) to be careful for what you wish for, and not only that, but be choosy about whom you sleep with. It's just too *easy* to get attached to someone whom you think is "The One." That's because biologically, we are wired to exchange DNA :)
So, he may or may not be the greatest to you, but perhaps write down the pros and cons of the relationship, and what you hope to get out of it, and what can change, and what won't. See if you have similar goals, and if he talks about a future together. If you think it's worth sticking it out, make that decision. If not, put some distance between the two of you, and seek out other relationships, but be picky. You'll have a list, as stupid as that sounds, of what you want.
If you decide you can't live without him, then don't go back if it's an abusive relationship where you do all the work, and he takes you for granted. My advice: Be VERY DIRECT with him. Utter consequences, not necessarily ultimatums, but TELL him what YOU want. If he doesn't come through, there's your answer. Make sure he understands. Sometimes we women talk ABOUT the situation or complain, never just coming out with what's needed or expected.
Hope this helps and good luck!
I concur wholeheartedly, 100% with you, Barn Babe. I believe it applies to my situation as well. Thank you for your post, if you are still reading this.
Also if you do decide to have intercourse, use a condom. It doesn't matter if you 'think' he hasn't had contact with anyone. Prostitutes typically *don't* kiss, either. I found out my boyfriend had frequented strip clubs, oddly enough (I told you he was eccentric!) with his friends from work, who had taken him there. Otherwise he wouldn't have thought to go there. He started going on his own. Who knows if he had a BJ or something else before? Use a condom; it's always wise.
When you DO decide to have sex, you may have to do all the work at first. He may be overwhelmed, or seem to be. Or he may act like he sort of knows what to do, but I believe I could see through my boyfriend's soul, as though he had died, the first time we did 'the deed.' TMI yeah, well, I believe in my heart he *was* a virgin, but too ashamed to tell.
Also, my boyfriend said his last girlfriend could climax easily; yet, I've no idea how, when it seems he was so inexperienced. And now he says all the time how much 'experience' he has gained! I had always thought he was handsome and never pictured him as gay (I have a certain stereotype in my head; bad, I know!). I had thought he was on the effeminate side in some respects, but masculine in others. I was so intrigued with him and am still so fascinated with even his mannerisms and ways that he talks.
So, follow Barn Babe's advice and she's right; if you're ready to deal with helping him mature, go for it! What bothers me about MY situation is that my boyfriend talked about his ex-girlfriend (albeit from many years ago!) as though they had gone beyond the 'deed' and he and I have yet to do what he described!
I think some people are absent-minded and you have to tell them what you want out of the relationship; if you put them on a pedestal, they use you or take you for granted. Right now I'm looking into social events and in case my relationship falls through (I don't have enough love to keep us both together by myself, nor the power to do so), as my boyfriend has broken up with me before, due to minor reasons.
Well, yeah, good luck with that, and let us know how it turns/turned out!
I'm wondering if he has some other rooted problems. You said it yourself, his relationship with his mom is not good nor has it ever been.
I'm not saying that makes it ok for him to act the way he does at 45, but maybe there really is an issue there that is not being dealt with.
I would suggest before you dump him cold to fully be honest with him. Tell him everything you've told us, if you haven't already, and suggest counselling. That can help aid the communication along. You're probably right in the sense he doesn't know how to be a boyfriend. Having said that, if you do all this and he shrugs it off - he clearly has other issues besides you and the relationship that may just be too large for you to tackle or want to tackle.
He probably won't change, but counselling can give couples tools on how to better handle situations and communication if you do want to give it a shot. Hey, being a virgin at 45 I bet he is totally freaked out by sex. If it were me I would be. He doesn't know how to "do" anything - he's supposed to know everything by his age in the realm of sex - he's probably terrified, along with whatever other issues there are.
If you decide the issues to are too big then yes move on. But I would hate to judge and just say "loser" when he could in fact have some real issues that could be helped with some counselling if he's willing. If he's not, then move on.