Aa
Aa
A
A
A
Close
Avatar universal

Lost and confused...

I have EVERY symptom of having a thyroid disorder plus I have off lab results...

Thyroid Anti-body 1.0 IU/ml
Thyroid Peroxidase AB 18 IU/ml
TSH          0.570 ulu/ML (almost at the bottom of the line)
Total T3    1.5 ng/ml (almost over the top)
Total T4    11.0 ug/dl (almost over the top)
T4 Free     1.15 ng/dl (only normal result)
Thyroid uptake at 24 hours was 26% (over the line by 1%) and 10% at 4 hours
and a positive Speckled ANA

Waiting FINALLY for my labs for T3 Free.

I also had a strange reaction to the iodine for the uptake test - by the 4th hour after taking it I felt absolutely great!!! HOW WEIRD!!!! Then the following 2 days I felt like I was in a big dark pit.

From what I've read this could all be from Hashimoto's with the antibodies make a "false high" result with the T's. Could also be Grave's as something autoimmune is going on. My "new" doc said my thyroid is classified as normal and why she tried to refer me to a endo doc he said there was no need to see me.

Anyone here have any ideas on any of this?
20 Responses
Sort by: Helpful Oldest Newest
1756321 tn?1547095325
I'm one of those people lol. I don't touch any seafood actually. Ugh~!
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Was thinking about your comments on Brazil nuts while doing some reading and trying to find and consume "super foods". Here's a link to sardines - many people wouldn't touch them, I happen to love them.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=nutrientprofile&dbid=174

No new news other than that.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Wow! More great info. I've had alot of tests done...
No H, Pyloria
No STDs
Had a cat scan with contrast and that live X-ray with the lovely barium swallow - all normal except "foci" in my kidneys and liver which they said were nothing???? Even GI specialist said no biggie.
I do have keratisis pilaris (a keratin disorder with my pores.
Everyone in my family has that.
Did a 60 (yup 60) day stint on Doxycycline just to be sure its not a tic borne problem.
I have had severe body pain for many years now as well. And my skin is always bloated up. Is awful when its hot.
Only eat whole foods now and use very little sugar.
I'm thinking if the Holistic Doc will run a few more thyroid tests that something will show up. Graves is a real possibility. After how that iodine made me feel I don't see how it could be something beside my thyroid. Literally taking that pill for the test made all of the yucky funk that I feel completely go away. Its killing me that I had to go back to feeling like tis again!!!! Ill post more info as it comes in.
Helpful - 0
1756321 tn?1547095325
I've read feeling sick from supplements is one of the possible symptoms of low stomach acid. Vitamin C is highly alkaline forming too so not surprising about the heartburn. Vitamin B12, folate and vitamin B6 are needed to keep homocysteine levels in healthy range. I personally had elevated liver enzymes for years from undiagnosis Hashimoto's thyroiditis.

Gallbladder Attack's article is really informative about stomach acid. Here are some excerpts...

"Signs of Deficient Stomach Acid

Gas, bloating and burping shortly after a meal could be lack of HCl
Constipation
Diarrhea
Feeling of fullness or food not digesting
Heartburn and/or gastric relux (sometimes too much HCl but most often not enough)
Bad breath
Foul smelling stools
Loose stools in the early morning
Food allergies
Dialated blood vessles on the cheeks and nose - Rosacea
Pernicious anemia or iron deficiency
Anal Itching
Nausea especially after taking vitamins and minerals
Weak or cracked nails
Parasites - or at least increased susceptibility to parasitic infections
Chronic yeast infections
Acne in adults - especially if you have other symptoms from the list
Asthma
Since low levels of stomach acid results in poor absorption of nutrients, many symptoms that accompany a deficiency of that vitamin or mineral makes this list much longer. The nutrients most affected are calcium, iron, folic acid, vitamin K and many B vitamins. See pernicious anemia.

Risk Factors and Causes of Low Stomach Acid

Allergies
Anemia
Adrenal fatigue
Alcohol
Atrophic gastritis
Heartburn
Gerd
IBS
Rheumatoid Arthritis
Hives
Candida and other Yeast
Bacterial Dysbiosis or infections in the Gut
Adult acne
Eczema
Alcohol consumption
H. pylori infection
Stress even in children
Age. HCl production decreases with age

Diseases Associated with Low HCl

Asthma
Diabetes
Osteoporosis
Arthritis
Hepatitis
Eczema
Acne rosacea
Dry Skin
Psoriasis
Parasites
Gallbladder disease
Herpes
Hives
Hypothyroid
Hyperthyroid
Thyrotoxicosis
Autoimmune disorders
Lupus erythematosus
Myasthenia gravis
Pernicious anemia
Celiac disease
Sjogren 's Syndrome"
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Well I love Brazil nuts and will certainly try them. It is funny how when I take supplements, they often make me feel ill, but when I eat the food containing the vitamin, it is fine. I can't take any vitamin C supps, make me terribly naucious and give me wicked heart burn, but I can eat things like mangos and they are fine. (And quite yummy!)
I am hoping the Rhumatologist can put better sight on this whole mess, BUT I dont see him until August. He is supposed to be top of the line. We'll see. There are enough "crumbs" lying around in my blood tests, so hopefully he has an incredible ah ha moment!  LOL
So far Lupus looks like a possibility, but that is unlikely to give me that constant revved up feeling... Buy it has just been soooooooo long since I've even felt like a human being. Thanks for walking part of this desolate road with me.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Specifically my lab for the ANA was:
1:160 Speckled Pattern IFA - ANA

I also have a high range Alkaline Phosphatase *92ul but no range listed.
And my homocysteine is *15.3umol/l (again no range listed, but both have the asterik.)And my HCT count is in the highest normal range.

The lab put an asterik by my eGFR level but that is greater than 60 and that is normal.

I think something autoimmune is going on also, BUT I don't think they've hit the nail on the head yet. I'm thinking that eventually they"ll do a test and the level will scream "HERE I AM!" The titer for the ANA is still mid-level for Lupus but is also found in, as you said, many other auto disorders.  I'm going to look up the things you mentioned. Thanks again for you valued input!
Helpful - 0
1756321 tn?1547095325
I've read a speckled ANA pattern is suggestive of antibodies to RNP, SS-A, SS-B, Sm, centromere, p95 or p80 coilin.
Helpful - 0
1756321 tn?1547095325
My thyroglobulin antibodies were elevated too just to add.  I had hashitoxicosis (I've had both types types).  I eat brazil nuts (50 - 90 mcg of selenium per nut depending on the soil). I noted a difference eating brazil nuts but no difference taking selenium supplements.


Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
I had a thought that antibodies could alter my results and make false high or low readings. Am going to pursue getting my graves anti-bodies looked at and there are other test that can look further into the conversion process.
I thought too that the speckled ANA could point to something affecting my thyroid but after the reaction to the iodine I think it is def a thyroid imbalance. Ill put up more info as I get it. Thanks so much for your post!
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
I did do some reading on selenium just today.

http://www.*************************/selenium/

They said selenium can be quite substantial. I seem to be VERY sensitive to putting anything in my body so if I were going to try it I'd have to find a low does of it. Most are 200mcg and that is double the USRDA.
I did end up getting some Lugol's but am faced with the same delima - that is extremely strong, so I diluted it (its a liquid) in water to see how it goes. Started really small - about 1/3 of the USRDA.
When things don't agree with me I become very ill so better to err on the small side.
Am going to make an appointment with the holistic Doc again - either this week or early next week. She'd probably have no problem testing for the Graves anti-bodies. I'd like to have a nutrition panel done as well. As I stated, my digestion has gone on the fritz the past couple of years, so who knows what else is wrong. Maybe she'd agree to let me try T3 also to see if I feel any better.
My big thing with the iodine is that someone with a normal thyroid couldn't have the reaction that I had to the iodine. And very honestly, whatever the reason, I felt so completely normal after taking that, that I can't help but want to feel like that again.
I'll post more after I go see that holistic doc gain. The regular doc was hostile at my insistence that she check my Free T3 so I won't bother her anymore.
Thank you and all the others for all the replies!!!!!
Helpful - 0
1756321 tn?1547095325
My labs showed subclinical hypo when I had major hyperthyroid symptoms due to Graves antibodies. My thyroglobulin serum (not antibodies but serum) was high due to being hyperthyroid.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Your Free T4 is at 56% of the range which is just about perfect for the rule of thumb being 50% or slightly more.

Your Ft3 is low in the range at only 31% of the range.  Typically people who are medicated for thyroid want this to be certainly above 50% and the rule of thumb is the upper 1/3 of the range = 67.7%.  

So it does appear that your not converting the T4 into T3 well.  If you can convince your Dr to prescribe some T3 that would probably make sense.  T3 has a short half life and that it peaks in about 4 hours and tapers off and is almost completely gone within 12 to 24 hours.  typical starting doses we see are 5 mcg or even 2.5.  Anything more than 10 mcg is not tolerated by a lot of people.  Because it is short lived and used in the body so fast.  Many people take T3 in two doses during the day to help keep the blood levels averaged a little bit. But if starting out at 5 or less mcg then splitting the dose may not do much at such a low level.

T4 has Four iodine molecules, T3 has three iodine molecules.  So iodine is necessary for thyroid production.  But interestingly to convert to the active form, an iodine molecule has to be stripped away from the T4 molecule to result in the T3 molecule.  So conversion actually "produces" iodine.

Since you seem to have ample supply of T4, it would seem unlikely that you are deficient in iodine from this perspective.

Other fatigue causing things are deficiencies in:

Iron
Ferritin
Vitamin D3
Vitamin B-12

Conversion from T4 to T3 is helped by and needs the element Selenium.

So you may want to get those all checked as well.  Possibly supplment with Selenium may help with conversion and help bump up your FT3 level. But don't expect a miracle with Selenium.  It is just a possible help to the whole picture.

Just my thought and others may have different opinions.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
The new results are in and have kinda weird results...

TSH - 0.731 uIU/ml          (Range .558 - 3.740)
Free T3 - 2.89 pg/mL      (Range 2.30 - 4.20)
Free T4 - 1.15 ng/dl         (Range 0.76 - 1.46)

Thyroid Peroxidase AB  16     (Range 0-34)

I had expected due to how revved up I feel all the time that the T3 would be high - but in fact it is on the low end. Again the endo doc said they looked fine and no need to see me. I am still blown away by how awesome I felt that day I took the iodine pill and am trying still to apply that to the results of my test. If iodine inhibits thyroid function my levels would have been even lower, and it doesn't explain why I would feel so good. I could feel the pulsation in my neck kinda like something was going on. And then the 2 days after I felt like I got shoved into a dark pit. Both Wolff-Chikoff  nad Jod Basedow effects say they take weeks for their effects to wear off. Wish that lovely man felt as awful as I do!

So I dont now know what to do. Is there a T3 only med that could help but upping that a little bit. Should I just say the heck with it and consume a little extra iodine each day and see what happens. Maybe it is solely an iodine deficiency???

Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Yes, waiting for T3 results. Should be available early this coming week. I was doing more reading on T3 and it was explained in one page as being kinda like the accelerator in a car.
These docs drive me bonkers. The one I have now is a new one and it actually made her angry that I insisted that the free T3 be tested as no one ever has.

On the iodine - Thanks so much for posting that about the wolff-chaikoff effect. While reading up on that I found another like to another iodine related phenomenon called the Jod-Basedow phenomenon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jod-Basedow_phenomenon

There's a really interesting page here about Wolff-Chaikoff effect.

http://www.optimox.com/pics/Iodine/IOD-04/IOD_04.html

My thoughts on the iodine are how in God's name could I feel so so so awesome that day and then I'm back to feeling so very badly again. In that long page on the Wolff-Chaikoff effect it went into a description of how when the labs rats they used were starved of iodine but continued to have thyroid hormones that the effect was they acted like zombies. That is exactly what I feel like. The living dead. No pun intended!!!

I was told by the naturopathic doc that I can occasionally afford to see that the immune levels cropping up here and there may be Lupus. I have an appointment to see a rhumatologist but that's not until the beginning of August.I am considering paying again to see her (she doesn't accept my insurance) and asking her to run the rest of the thyroid panel for me.

I don't know what else this could be. I really do have all the symptoms of a thyroid disorder and its been going on for so long now that I think I am also experiencing some adrenal fatigue. BUT noone thinks they need to look into that either. Sigh... Sorry, but its been such a long horrible road and I am feeling pretty well defeaated.




Helpful - 0
1756321 tn?1547095325
I did read an article from UpToDate on Iodine in the treatment of hyperthyroidism and it does mention iodine is used as a minor treatment in the treatment of hyperthyroidism. This sentence is interesting...

"Graves are more sensitive to the inhibitory effect of pharmacologic doses of iodine than normal subjects, making iodine treatment effective in some patients. In addition, pharmacologic amounts of iodine may acutely ameliorate hyperthyroidism by blocking thyroid hormone release."
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Your TPOab is slightly elevated.  Elevated TPOab can indicate autoimmune thyroid disease, but it can also be somewhat elevated with other autoimmune conditions.  It's not unusual for us to see people diagnosed with Hashi's with antibody counts in the hundreds or even thousands.  So, I would consider your result "borderline".  With your family history of Graves', they didn't test TSI (Graves' antibody)?  ANA indicates some autoimmune disease.

Your total T3 and total T4 are both very close to the tops of their ranges.  However, your FREE T4 is right smack dab in the middle of the range...right where it should be.  Frees are much more important than totals.  You said you're waiting for the results of FT3, correct?

Iodine is not used to treat Graves'.  You're probably thinking of RAI (radioactive iodine), but it's the radiation that is treating the Graves' disease.  The radiation is attached to iodine only so the thyroid can be "targeted" and will take up the radiation.  Radiation will kill off the thyroid.

Thyroid hormones cannot be made without iodine, so people with Graves' are told to avoid it.  Typically, an iodine deficiency causes a goiter (enlarged thyroid), so since yours is normal size, it's unlikely.

Has anyone explained your positive ANA results?



Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
My mom had full blown Graves disease. Her thyroid had grown throughout her neck and into her chest. But my thyroid scan came up as normal size and no nodules. I read about the Wolff-Chaikoff effect after reading what you wrote - so trying to piece it together make me think that iodine pill they gave me made me feel awesome by about 4 hours after ingestion. that is when I felt the best. By the next day when they did the 24 hour uptake scan I was feeling lousy again. So what I'm thinking is if I continued to take iodine I would continue to feel better. I also read iodine is used at times to treat graves.
BOY I would like my well paid doc to figure this out, but even though she tried to refer me to an endocrinologist, he said theres no need to see me just by looking at my labs.
I have been to so many Dr.s thrying to figure this out, but they just had me antidepressants and send me on my way. Am in tears now just thinking about how horrible tis has all been!
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Thyroid Anti-body 1.0 IU/ml (Range 0-5)
Thyroid Peroxidase AB 18 IU/ml (Range <9)
TSH          0.570 ulu/ML (almost at the bottom) (Range 0.5 - 4.70 µIU/mL)
Total T3    1.5 ng/ml (almost over the top) (Range 0.6-1.6 ng/m)
Total T4    11.0 ug/dl (almost over the top) (Range 4.5 -11.5 ug/dL)
T4 Free     1.15 ng/dl (only normal result) (Range 0.7-1.5 ng/dL)
Thyroid uptake at 24 hours was 26% (over the line by 1%) and 10% at 4 hours
(Range <25% at 24 hours)
and a positive Speckled ANA

Waiting FINALLY for my labs for T3 Free.

I've felt terrible for 27+ years now. Got "sick" within weeks of becoming pregnant for my first child at 20.Last 2 years my digestion went to the pits and hardly works at all now. When I had the iodine for the uptake scan I felt like a million dollars - made me feel awesome. First day in 27 yeaars that I actually felt normal. But the Dr. blew it off as if I was lying about what the iodine did to me.But the day after I crashed hard. I have never been a salt person and am allergic to shell fish so I hardly ever consume much iodine. I've been on a whole food diet for months now and I do not have the gluten genes. They checked for that.
I go back and forth between feeling like someones got their foot constantly on my gas peddle and then feeling like I can hardly even function at all. My hair is so fine - kinda like a spider web and falling out to where I can see my scalp now. But even on days when I feel like I am going jump out of my skin I am at the same time so so so tired!!!! This makes me mental. I either sweat ever so embarrassingly or find it hard to sweat at all. I am TOTALLY unable to stand temp changes. Hot makes me boil and cold make me feel hypothermic. I haven't slept in 27 years. 2-3 hours a night and that's it. If I try to nap, just as I fall off to sleep I startle out of sleep, feeling like I was falling. My body tissues are always bloated up. My mouth is always dry. My eyes burn and itch. My balance is so off. Hope these are better clues.
Helpful - 0
1756321 tn?1547095325
Wolff-Chaikoff effect: the decreased formation and release of thyroid hormone in the presence of an excess of iodine.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Please post the reference ranges on all your thyroid tests.  Ranges vary lab to lab, so you have to post both together.

Please list your symptoms.

Are you on any other meds or supplements?
Helpful - 0
Have an Answer?

You are reading content posted in the Thyroid Disorders Community

Top Thyroid Answerers
649848 tn?1534633700
FL
Avatar universal
MI
1756321 tn?1547095325
Queensland, Australia
Learn About Top Answerers
Didn't find the answer you were looking for?
Ask a question
Popular Resources
We tapped the CDC for information on what you need to know about radiation exposure
Endocrinologist Mark Lupo, MD, answers 10 questions about thyroid disorders and how to treat them
A list of national and international resources and hotlines to help connect you to needed health and medical services.
Herpes sores blister, then burst, scab and heal.
Herpes spreads by oral, vaginal and anal sex.
STIs are the most common cause of genital sores.