Aa
Taking Armour while pregnant
Is taking Armour while pregnant and trying to get pregnant safe? My endo told me if I want to get pregnant, I need to go off the Armour beforehand.
Just wanted to try and add a few worthwhile thoughts. First, patients on thyroid meds frequently have their TSH suppressed to the low end of the range and below, without actually being hyper, even though many doctors will pronounce you as hyper just based on the TSH test, regardless of symptoms. To me, you are hyper only if you have hyper symptoms. You only become hyper through having too much thyroid hormone in the blood. I don't get the doctor's logic that having too little of a pituitary hormone (TSH) makes you hyper.
My own TSH level has been less than .05 for over 20 years, yet I continued to suffer with lingering hypo symptoms, until learning about the importance of getting FT3 into the upper part of its range. Now my FT3 is 3.5 and FT4 is 1.05 and although I am still making slight adjustments, I already feel the best ever.
If you have the time and are interested in why I think the ranges for FT3 and FT4 are too broad and need to be adjusted as was done for TSH 6 years ago, you might have some use for this email I sent to the ATA twice, without any response of course. It also probably explains the years that you continued to have hypo symptoms even when your lab results were "normal".
After having gone through years of not being treated for hypothyroidism, because my TSH was 4.97 and thus "normal", I was very pleased to note that the AACE had finally recognized that the range was incorrectly determined. After removing some suspect hypo patients' data, and recalculating the range, they recommended it be lowered and narrowed to .3-3.0. Six years after this recommendation, why is it that most labs and doctors still do not recognize the change and still use the old range? Since doctors also over-rely on TSH as the gold standard for thyroid testing, multitudes of hypo patients are still being told they are "normal" and do not get treated. Is the ATA doing anything to encourage the medical community to change this practice? If so, why is it taking so long?
My second concern is that doctors predominantly rely on TSH in determining a patient's thyroid status. Why is this, since TSH is a pituitary hormone that is affected by so many variables, including even the time of day when tested? Why not promote more widespread use of the actual thyroid hormones that are biologically active (FT3 and FT4) and that largely regulate metabolism and many other body functions? From studies I have seen and much personal experience, TSH does not even correlate very well at all with hypo symptoms. The test that has been shown to correlate best with hypo symptoms is free T3. Yet there are very few doctors that order a FT3 test as a matter of course, and some that refuse to order one at all.
When FT3 and FT4 are tested, the ranges are so broad that patients with overt hypo symptoms will usually still fall in the lower end of the current range. As a result they are also told they are "normal" and receive no treatment. Why haven"t the reference ranges for FT3 and FT4 been corrected like TSH, to exclude suspect hypo patients? If this were done, these ranges would likewise be raised and narrowed, comparable to the new range for TSH. I'm sure that some would say that the range is just a reference range, that as you approach the lower end of the range, that the probability of being hypo goes up and that in those cases, doctors look further to determine if medication is advisable. I agree that this should be the case but I assure you it isn't. Labs and doctors interpret results within the reference range as "normal" and don't want to go any further. As a result of all this the above misunderstanding and misapplication, millions of patients go untreated and remain miserable with their hypo symptoms.
Is the ATA doing anything to raise the awareness of these problems among the medical community so that we hypo patients can look forward to some positive changes? If you are not, then I cannot imagine any other organization that could do the work necessary to coordinate changing the awful mess that exists in the area of diagnosis and treatment of thyroid patients. Your response will be greatly appreciated.
My own TSH level has been less than .05 for over 20 years, yet I continued to suffer with lingering hypo symptoms, until learning about the importance of getting FT3 into the upper part of its range. Now my FT3 is 3.5 and FT4 is 1.05 and although I am still making slight adjustments, I already feel the best ever.
If you have the time and are interested in why I think the ranges for FT3 and FT4 are too broad and need to be adjusted as was done for TSH 6 years ago, you might have some use for this email I sent to the ATA twice, without any response of course. It also probably explains the years that you continued to have hypo symptoms even when your lab results were "normal".
After having gone through years of not being treated for hypothyroidism, because my TSH was 4.97 and thus "normal", I was very pleased to note that the AACE had finally recognized that the range was incorrectly determined. After removing some suspect hypo patients' data, and recalculating the range, they recommended it be lowered and narrowed to .3-3.0. Six years after this recommendation, why is it that most labs and doctors still do not recognize the change and still use the old range? Since doctors also over-rely on TSH as the gold standard for thyroid testing, multitudes of hypo patients are still being told they are "normal" and do not get treated. Is the ATA doing anything to encourage the medical community to change this practice? If so, why is it taking so long?
My second concern is that doctors predominantly rely on TSH in determining a patient's thyroid status. Why is this, since TSH is a pituitary hormone that is affected by so many variables, including even the time of day when tested? Why not promote more widespread use of the actual thyroid hormones that are biologically active (FT3 and FT4) and that largely regulate metabolism and many other body functions? From studies I have seen and much personal experience, TSH does not even correlate very well at all with hypo symptoms. The test that has been shown to correlate best with hypo symptoms is free T3. Yet there are very few doctors that order a FT3 test as a matter of course, and some that refuse to order one at all.
When FT3 and FT4 are tested, the ranges are so broad that patients with overt hypo symptoms will usually still fall in the lower end of the current range. As a result they are also told they are "normal" and receive no treatment. Why haven"t the reference ranges for FT3 and FT4 been corrected like TSH, to exclude suspect hypo patients? If this were done, these ranges would likewise be raised and narrowed, comparable to the new range for TSH. I'm sure that some would say that the range is just a reference range, that as you approach the lower end of the range, that the probability of being hypo goes up and that in those cases, doctors look further to determine if medication is advisable. I agree that this should be the case but I assure you it isn't. Labs and doctors interpret results within the reference range as "normal" and don't want to go any further. As a result of all this the above misunderstanding and misapplication, millions of patients go untreated and remain miserable with their hypo symptoms.
Is the ATA doing anything to raise the awareness of these problems among the medical community so that we hypo patients can look forward to some positive changes? If you are not, then I cannot imagine any other organization that could do the work necessary to coordinate changing the awful mess that exists in the area of diagnosis and treatment of thyroid patients. Your response will be greatly appreciated.
sorry, this is really long!
i had RAI 9 years ago @ age 25 and it's been a battle ever since with energy, fogginess, mild depression here and there- not constantly and of course, trouble losing weight. i had a miscarriage and some trouble getting pregnant after that, but i did finally have a healthy baby girl after 2 years of trying.
the "something" that comes up - i have been arguing with my endo (his nurse most of the time) on my synthroid doses for about 3 months now. a little history: i stopped seeing my endo throughout my pregnancy. my baby's now 9 mo's. i got my labs done with my OB throughout the pregnancy and things worked out fine that way. after my baby was born, i was feeling so awful that i went back to my endo to check- in and see if there was anything they could do or suggest to help me. i was on 150 mcg synthroid at the time. i got them to let me stay on the 150 for a couple months even though they wanted me on 137 mcg. the 150 mcg puts me at a TSH of 0.16 ( my T3 and T4 are still "normal" - i don't have those #'s). they are insistent on this # and that going hyper "opens up a whole new bag of symptoms" than what's going on now. well, i know better after all these years!! i have been back on the 137 mcg for less than a week (no choice since i ran out of the other dose and they won't write me a prescription for anything but the 137) and i am feeling even worse- tired, irritable, headaches, no energy, cold ect. pretty typical hypo symptoms. i didn't feel good before on the 150 mcg, just not terrible. i have been researching and i really want to try the dessicated to see if that can help me out.
i had looked into armour or desiccated hormone a few times in the past. the first time i asked my old endo about it, he told me the potency is unreliable on armour and he wasn't really into it. i didn't persue it after that, that was back when i took the dr's word as good. he also told me that i should be taking the name brand synthroid and not generic for that same reason - potency and reliability. looking back, i see he was doing what lots of endos are doing - backing the synthroid brand name! so lame! at my current endo, they are more willing to write me a prescription for armour or dessicated even though they say when i want to try and get p.g. next time i need to go off a few months before trying as the T3 cannot be converted accross the placenta....or something like that, don't quote me on that, i can't totally remember how he put it. anyhow, my immediate concern is that there is this supply shortage of the dessicated.... i have spent weeks looking for a pharmacy that carries armour, west-throid or nature-throid in my area. im thinking i am just going to order the canada "thyroid" from canadameds.com and go back to trying to manage this myself for the most part and check labs through the mail.
it really stinks having to get into arguments with the endo nurse almost weekly over this. but, i will at least let them know my plan b.c they seemed pissed off over me trying to take matters into my own hands last time.
i had RAI 9 years ago @ age 25 and it's been a battle ever since with energy, fogginess, mild depression here and there- not constantly and of course, trouble losing weight. i had a miscarriage and some trouble getting pregnant after that, but i did finally have a healthy baby girl after 2 years of trying.
the "something" that comes up - i have been arguing with my endo (his nurse most of the time) on my synthroid doses for about 3 months now. a little history: i stopped seeing my endo throughout my pregnancy. my baby's now 9 mo's. i got my labs done with my OB throughout the pregnancy and things worked out fine that way. after my baby was born, i was feeling so awful that i went back to my endo to check- in and see if there was anything they could do or suggest to help me. i was on 150 mcg synthroid at the time. i got them to let me stay on the 150 for a couple months even though they wanted me on 137 mcg. the 150 mcg puts me at a TSH of 0.16 ( my T3 and T4 are still "normal" - i don't have those #'s). they are insistent on this # and that going hyper "opens up a whole new bag of symptoms" than what's going on now. well, i know better after all these years!! i have been back on the 137 mcg for less than a week (no choice since i ran out of the other dose and they won't write me a prescription for anything but the 137) and i am feeling even worse- tired, irritable, headaches, no energy, cold ect. pretty typical hypo symptoms. i didn't feel good before on the 150 mcg, just not terrible. i have been researching and i really want to try the dessicated to see if that can help me out.
i had looked into armour or desiccated hormone a few times in the past. the first time i asked my old endo about it, he told me the potency is unreliable on armour and he wasn't really into it. i didn't persue it after that, that was back when i took the dr's word as good. he also told me that i should be taking the name brand synthroid and not generic for that same reason - potency and reliability. looking back, i see he was doing what lots of endos are doing - backing the synthroid brand name! so lame! at my current endo, they are more willing to write me a prescription for armour or dessicated even though they say when i want to try and get p.g. next time i need to go off a few months before trying as the T3 cannot be converted accross the placenta....or something like that, don't quote me on that, i can't totally remember how he put it. anyhow, my immediate concern is that there is this supply shortage of the dessicated.... i have spent weeks looking for a pharmacy that carries armour, west-throid or nature-throid in my area. im thinking i am just going to order the canada "thyroid" from canadameds.com and go back to trying to manage this myself for the most part and check labs through the mail.
it really stinks having to get into arguments with the endo nurse almost weekly over this. but, i will at least let them know my plan b.c they seemed pissed off over me trying to take matters into my own hands last time.
Well blunty - that is false. There is no medical reason for you to be forced into one treatment or the other. Its all about what works for you.
I have the same medical background persay - as you . Graves/RAI. 4 years I struggled on Synthroid and I was miserable. I can not and WILL not say - Synthroid does not work. It does.. for some.. not for me. I however, was not looking to have a baby after my RAI - I already had my children I was ever going to have.
After being here for almost 3 years on this board and the research and interviews I have done with many local doctors there is no evidence being on a decissated thyroid med or T4 Synthetic effects a pregnancy. Its the condition of the patient- with the disease- that effects the birth not the choice of the meds being used.
Do you have a logical explaination from this doctor on why this med is the best? You mention "something" comes up? - What is that?
What is your complaints being on Synthroid right now? What are you experiencing that you want to consider a change? How long has it been since your RAI?
I have the same medical background persay - as you . Graves/RAI. 4 years I struggled on Synthroid and I was miserable. I can not and WILL not say - Synthroid does not work. It does.. for some.. not for me. I however, was not looking to have a baby after my RAI - I already had my children I was ever going to have.
After being here for almost 3 years on this board and the research and interviews I have done with many local doctors there is no evidence being on a decissated thyroid med or T4 Synthetic effects a pregnancy. Its the condition of the patient- with the disease- that effects the birth not the choice of the meds being used.
Do you have a logical explaination from this doctor on why this med is the best? You mention "something" comes up? - What is that?
What is your complaints being on Synthroid right now? What are you experiencing that you want to consider a change? How long has it been since your RAI?
Sorry, I should have specified - i am hypo (forever) due to RAI and Graves.
My endo wants me to remain on synthroid instead of switching to armour.i have been trying to switch to armour for a few weeks now and each time i attempt, something comes up on why i can't/shouldn't.one issue is that no pharmacies seem to carry it right now, but also i want to try and get pregnant with my second baby in about a year and he's saying when i start trying i should be on synthroid and NOT armour. it just doesn't make sense to me...i was wondering if anyone else has ever heard anything like that?
My endo wants me to remain on synthroid instead of switching to armour.i have been trying to switch to armour for a few weeks now and each time i attempt, something comes up on why i can't/shouldn't.one issue is that no pharmacies seem to carry it right now, but also i want to try and get pregnant with my second baby in about a year and he's saying when i start trying i should be on synthroid and NOT armour. it just doesn't make sense to me...i was wondering if anyone else has ever heard anything like that?
Your doctor should be vocusing on the thyroid lab sheets more than determining what medication is needed.
Synthetic T4 - synthetic T3 in combination - or using a desiccated thyroid medication is not the issue. The issue lies with the lab sheets.
Synthetic T4 - synthetic T3 in combination - or using a desiccated thyroid medication is not the issue. The issue lies with the lab sheets.
What????????? If you are hypo, and not on Armour, then your rising TSH and low frees could cause miscarriage, infertility, etc.
I don't know your current lab levels. I don't know if you are a hypo or a Hashi, so I can't say if the doctor is right or wrong on this. Please post your current TSH, FT4/3 levels along with your Armour dosage.
:) Tamra
I don't know your current lab levels. I don't know if you are a hypo or a Hashi, so I can't say if the doctor is right or wrong on this. Please post your current TSH, FT4/3 levels along with your Armour dosage.
:) Tamra
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