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Tramadol & Ultram Recovery Room Part 18

Oct 26, 2009 - 216 comments
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tramadol

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ultram

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Healing

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withdrawal

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Withdrawls

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Recovery



Hi Friends,

Welcome!

Please make yourself at home ... snuggle down by the fire and hang on. It's a bumpy ride.

Love and Healing,
Emily

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Avatar universal
by TRAMMAN999, Oct 26, 2009
Yeahhhhh    1st on this page to tell the world.
This is the end of Day 5 of Tram c/t. What a ride it's been!!! Who has to pay money for roller coaster rides when it's FREE!!??
If I can do it, anyone can do it. I was an extremely heavy user for 3 whole years. (and extremely frightened, because I couldn't taper!)
This bit of typing has exhausted me. But, when I'm up to it, I promise to give you a blow by blow account of that roller coast ride.
I must say before I collapse, that without this site and certain people fighting for me and with me, I probably could not have done it. Thank you all. And thank all my special people (you know who you are).     Yours   Tram

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by madtram, Oct 26, 2009
Hi TMan, you sound alive and punching, a serious contender to win this match.

Jenny, the tramadol ER might be useful if you have been habitually taking multiple doses during the day as the ER will stretch out one dose through the day.  When you are less uncomfortable you could drop to half an ER, then quarter.  Others have reported that this works.

Klonopin is a complication because tramadol and benzos are additive which means that dropping tramadol may throw you into benzo withdrawal even though you haven't increased your benzo dose.  I would try using the ER in preference to upping the klonopin dose but as the objective is to first get off the tramadol, don't put undue pressure on yourself if you do need to take a few more klonopin.

Our dear Emily has done just what you are undertaking with tramadol then klonopin, so it would be very worthwhile for you to read back through her journals.  KC, Chrissie & I , (& others I'm sure), have also come off benzos after tramadol & will be happy to support you through the process.

Any additional resources, such as addiction experts would be a great idea, they may have some tips we haven't discovered yet.

A round of cheering for all.

M

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 26, 2009
Thanks Tram Man.  

Thanks M- Can you split an ER dose?   I thought it was dangerous to split time release stuff.  Is that what you meant?  Taking the ER could be better for me because it would stop the psychological action of taking it throughout the day.

I'll try not to mess with my klonopin unless my sleep is awful.  Hopefully, it will help me sleep at night as is.

Thanks for all of the support.

I put a call into my family member and he got me an appointment with an addiction psychiatrist he knows and really likes...he doesn't like many shrinks, so he must be good! It's not until next Thursday unfortunately, but that's pretty fast compared to most.

Jenny  

Avatar universal
by hanginin, Oct 26, 2009
Hey Guys. Day 4 for me and it was tough being at work but I made it and even though I'm having some emotional issues the tram effects seem to be getting better. I'm having a real hard time at work and that makes is worse. I thank everyone here so much because it seems like we are all in this together and I have been to this site several times today when I got real stressed and everyone keeps me in the moment. Day 5 tomorrow and then I will be away from work for 2 day where I have no access so day 7 is looking very close. Thanks again and everyone keep fighting the good fight.
Hanginin

Avatar universal
by TRAMMAN999, Oct 26, 2009
madram & JG525
Just a comment    -  As well as being a heavy user of Tramadol for initial neck pain for 3 years, I was also put on 2mg Clonazepam (Klonopin ) That was some 14 years ago. You know I have no psychological problems with taking 2mg. I have never had any effects. I was concerned about going c/t with the Clonazepam - I just took them as usual - and I did use a couple to calm me down about the second day. Clonazepam (as the Dr puts it & I agree) it is just a part of me now. Tramadol is the issue of the year.     .....   Maybe Clonazepam later.     2mg/day minimal dose.     Aye Tram

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 26, 2009
Yeah, everyone talks about benzos being hard and it's not easy to stop, but I've gone from 2mg to 1 mg by .25 per month or so fairly easily.  Whereas the tramadol hits me a lot harder if I try to stop.  I'd like to get pregnant next year, so eventually I want to be off all of them.

I don't crave klonopin...it makes me tired.  The SSRI quality of tramadol makes me more energetic.  I had been struggling with thyroid issues, so that energy was irresistible to me.

Jenny

Avatar universal
by TRAMMAN999, Oct 26, 2009
JG525
I agree entirely. I never feared Clonazepam. I don't think it has "any" effect on me now.
I reckon (famous last words) I can come of Clon without the terror of Tramadol. In other words like you imply Tramadol is a far more serious issue. Having said that there is a certain someone on this site that I know that would have strong views on this.

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 26, 2009
Wow, Guys..I am having one more messed up night. This is by far the worst so far and I know it is all psychological. I am feeling like a raging b*tch! LOL..I am so short tempered and easily irritated not to mention anxious and depressed. Everyone is avoiding me like the plague and I am actually appreciating that. I made it through homework, shopping for last minute Halloween things, walking around my neighborhood and cooking dinner. I am shocked I accomplished that much. I found myself thinking the worst possible thoughts, such as: "Maybe I should do this  getting off meds after the holidays" blah, blah, blah...So I jumped on here instead of making a bad choice. It seems like day 4 is always the worst for me when withdrawing. I have no clue why, but day 4 is always hardest for me. Also, has anyone else had awful breakouts when coming off trams, or any other med? I am in my mid 30's and I have never had any pimples until I am coming off medication. Maybe it is not related at all and just something else being thrown at me to get me down. UGH!!! I have a HUGE costume party this weekend and instead of looking forward to it I am dreading it like you wouldn't believe. Well, there is my moaning and groaning session for the night. Time for my vitamins, valerian root, valerian root tea, Aleve and hopefully a little bit of sleep. I wish everyone the best of luck for another prosperous day tomorrow. I am going to try my best to wake up and MAKE myself feel more optimistic. Night All!

Avatar universal
by hanginin, Oct 26, 2009
notsosunny. I know what you are feeling like. Today is day 4 for me also and its been rough. Lets both tough it out and
maybe we will all feel a little better tomorrow. Good luck


Avatar universal
by newway, Oct 26, 2009
Busy here tonight - thank god we have a place to go.

I am tapering tram and was trying to control the clonazepam - but after reading some of the above posts - I am going to focus on the tram - and deal with the benzo later.

I have been prescribed the ER tramadol - but have always chewed them - which basically eliminates the extended release.  Now I am trying to just take the ER as I taper - but I am exhausted all the time - when it hits me I can barley manage to speak.
However, after going from about 1000mg to 400mg over the past few months - except for the odd RLS and constant low level anxiety - the exhaustion is the only really tough thing - so maybe ER is the way to go.

It's great to be able to log on her and read everyone's posts.
Keep on fighting

Avatar universal
by lisajomama, Oct 26, 2009
Hi all.  I haven't been on here for two weeks, and I am happy to see so much activity.  I couldn't even begin to read everything since my last post, but I've read through the most recent post.  
It has been five weeks since my last tramadol (i was a heavy user for two years), and I feel pretty good most of the time.  My sleep is still slightly interrupted in that I wake up throughout the night to look at the clock.  If it is still dark, I go right back to sleep which is good.  I don't take anything for sleep anymore.

Hang in there, day 4-ers!!!  The first week is tough, but it gets way better.  I still go through spells where I find that something is missing and I am feeling a little tired, but keeping busy is the best medicine for that.
One thing that is buggin' me right now though:  I cannot stop my armpits from sweating.  It is so annoying.  I have never sweat in the pits like this before.  I don't get the sweats anywhere else anymore...just the pits.  I pack on the deodorant and change shirts constantly on the weekends. At work I double layer my shirts try to remember not to raise my arms in the air to stretch.  I hope this will pass.

Good luck to everyone in their battle.  I will try not to be absent for so long again as it is so good for me to read your posts.

599071 tn?1300072302
by madtram, Oct 27, 2009
Splitting an ER dose is definitely not precise but pills from established manufacturers, (although perhaps not all internet generics), should provide enough of an even dose for your body not to know the difference between a mg here or there.

I'm sure not everyone with concomitant tram & benzo use will have problems.  I thought I was only on a sleep med & didn't appreciate that it was a benzo until I started having big problems long after stopping tramadol.  In my ignorance I had also stopped the zopiclone cold turkey, (about 2 months after quitting tram), so it's impossible to determine what caused what.

Jenny, given that you have tapered down the klonopin with no major problems to date, you will probably be fine.  Slow tapers are definitely the go with benzos.

It is known that tramadol & benzos have additive effects & boost up the strength of one another so just keep this in mind for anyone who feels that their tramadol withdrawal symptoms are more extreme, you may benefit from adjusting your benzo dose.

Sunny, opiates, (natural & synthetic), will suppress your hormonal output.  As the drug leaves your system, your hormones start to kick back in & may take some time to stabilise in the same way that your neurotransmitters do.

Great to hear from you Lisa, it's so important for those in the dog days of withdrawal to hear from people who have bounced back to something approaching a satisfying life.

Avatar universal
by chrissie145, Oct 27, 2009
Yeah...that'd be me then Tramman would it?!! (Strong views on benzo's)!!!!   Like Madtram I do appreciate that everyone is different. But I also believe the benzo's are evil littlle pills - and have read that they are more difficult to come off than heroin.
(So good to have you back posting Tramman - such a huge victory you have won!)

I too stopped my sleeper (zolpidem) cold turkey - and did a rapid taper off 45mg mirtazapine. All this just 40 days after cold turkey off tramadol and a rapid taper off diazapam. So there is bound to be confusion as to what is causing what. But....from my time on this forum, I can see that I would be out of the woods now if I'd had only had tramadol to contend with (94 days clean). Yes the w/d were vicous - and I wouldnt wish them on my worst enemy. (Well maybe just my doctor!) But I feel more in danger more from the benzo w/d. I struggle daily with suicidal thoughts and if you knew how much I loved life you would know this is from the drugs and not me!

The thing about benzo w/d is that it takes soooo long - and this really wears you down. And its totally random. I had a few better days and then a massive kick in the teeth again that has so far lasted for 11 days with no let up. I am having depression, brain fog, fatigue, irritation, horrible horrible panic attacks that make me scream, waking dreams that scare me sick. I am hardly human and find it so hard to engage with life and other people. And thats just the pyschological. The physical wasnt good either but has mostly passed now. And then of course all the literature says that this could go on for a year - or even two. I would go crazy if I focused on that so I am believing for improvement at  3 - 6 months. And KC and  Linn tell me this was so with them. (And for our lovely Emily too I believe)  (What did you find Madtram?)  I havent written this to frighten anyone and certainly not to discourage you. But I want the best for all the warriors on here - and I want that you are better when the tramadol w/d has gone, I dont want you to have to go through all this too!  I am finding it soul destroying. So if you havent started on the benzo's then avoid it if possible - and if you have - be careful!

You see, I didnt get anything 'extra' from benzo's. I was given them because the doctors didnt know that the panic attack I had in February was because I had reduced tramadol  - and not because I was suddenly going into an anxiety state. The pills made me feel calmer, but they also made my limbs heavy and I was very tired. I didnt even like them - but thought I needed them.

But....having said all that, it is one step at a time. One drug at a time. Your fight is with tramadol now - and you have to do what you have to do to get off that. When you do tackle the benzo, it may not be as bad for you. And it wont be as bad I am told if you do it slowly, slowly slowly. (Not like Chrissie!!!!)

My heart goes out to all on here. I am coming from a place of intense pain at the moment. Pain I want to help spare you from.I guess we earn the right to speak out when we ourselves are wounded warriors.

Love to all.
Chrissie



Avatar universal
by chrissie145, Oct 27, 2009
Sunny, I would see the pimples as a good sign. Could it be the poisonous tramadol is coming out in this way? And Lisa - the sweating too? I know methadone leaves the body this way big time!

You are getting it outside of yourselves folks!!!  Good news I reckon!

Chrissie



Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 27, 2009
Thanks EVERYONE!!! I woke up with a different perspective this morning. I am looking at my breakout as a good thing. My body trying to rid this nasty evil med from my body. Besides, it is just pimples. It could be something worse.

So far I have been up since 6AM (EST) and I am feeling decent, although I stared at the ceiling until 3AM. I am going to take my vitamins and drink some gator-aid, which I am so sick of, but it may be helping me feel better so I am not going to stop drinking it. I am going to go ahead while I still feel decent and have my mind set on continuing to feel that way and take a walk and exercise. Release those endorphins! :) I have still had zero RLS. That I do not understand. I normally suffer with that severely. Maybe the vitamins and herbal supplements are helping with that. Whatever is helping I just know I am thankful for it. I have also not had one single bit of "the runs", which I also find very bizarre. Thinking about all this stuff does tend to make me a little anxious because it is like I am still anticipating the worst is still yet to come. This bout with W/D's has definitely been more phsychological torture than physical, although I am in alot of physical pain due to all my ailments. Nothing I can't cope with, though.

I also just wanted  to tell everyone going through this that it is indeed possible to get off these things. That may be a little premature for me to say considering I am only on day 5 of no trams, but if I can go 5 days then there is certainly hope for anyone. In the past I have gotten off of hydrocodone, methadone and demerol and these stupid trams are so much worse than any of those. GO FIGURE, the "wonderful non narcotic pill"!!! Plus, I always replaced one pill with another in the past and I just refuse to continue repeating this cycle. I was exhausted with worrying about counting pills and planning my entire life around this medication. JUST FED UP WITH IT!

Oh, I just wanted to tell everyone going through this or planning to taper or go CT that I truly think that in the evenings the valerian root and valerian root tea is helping me alot. It is worth a shot to try guys! Last night after I logged off I drank some tea, which isn't that bad if you like herbal teas, and took only one valerian root capsule. I actually felt myself calming down and chilling out within 30-45 minutes or so. I may not be sleeping well but at least I am not pacing and pulling my hair out. I am also taking my vitamin supplements religiously. Unlike past attempts I have not taken any cold/flu medication. I really think now that in the past those meds made things worse for me. I thought the dextromethorphan in the pills or elixir would help me and I just think it made it so much worse so I am staying away from that!

*Lisa, I am sweating really bad, too. It must be the trams leaving us because I have never been one to sweat like this. I had to stop at a convenient store the other day and pay a million dollars for some deodarant, but I had no choice. LOL..It is not just my pits, though. I am having a hard time even applying makeup because I am sweating it off before I can even finish applying it. I hope this subsides soon.*

I just pray that there comes a day when my eyes open in the morning and my first thought isn't pills.

Everyone have a great day. Hang in there and be strong! We can all get through this together! :)

910168 tn?1262466069
by Lillyval, Oct 27, 2009
Wow, what a lot of activity on this forum, and what great support.

Jenny, I was the one who used ER tablets for my taper.  I did the 200mg ER's for a couple days then the 100mg ER's for 10 days.  Then I went to 50mg (which isn't even worth continuing - at this point it's easier to just stop).  The ER's keep a low level of tram in your system so the withdrawals are at bay, while at the same time break the habit of popping pills because you only take one in 24 hours.  The minute you cut one, though, they are no longer ER.  You get the whole dose at once.  Good luck to you.

For those of you going through such a hard time I just want to say that life after tram is a reward worth fighting for.  I didn't even realize how low functioning I was on tram until I started functioning normally again.  I'm not only better to my kids, but I even give my pets more attention.  I care more about the house and I'm more on top of the bills and returning calls and all the other little details of life.  It is SO MUCH BETTER.  I never want to go back.  I feel like I have a real life now.  I am so grateful.  
Bless you all,
Lilly

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 27, 2009
Wow- So great to read everyone's posts! I've read some pretty scary things, so I didn't mean to make klonopin sound like no big deal.  As Chrissie, I think said, the after effects seem to linger on.  A taper makes a huge difference with it though.  When I first started going from 2mg to 1mg, my doctor said .5 mg every few weeks shouldn't be a problem.  Well, clearly he's never personally done it! When I went from 2 to 1.5, it was okay, but when I went from 1.5 to 1, ouch! So, I went back up to 1.25 then to 1mg and I've been holding steady there.  I think I need to hold off on going lower until I kick this tramadol thing- particularly since I don't abuse klonopin.  I hate to think what my sleep will be like though after I quit.  Has anyone seen "Paranomal Activity?" I'm like that girl minus the demon LOL.  Freaky stuff.

Maybe because I take it properly as a med and not too much like tram, I don't feel like abusing it.  M- Did you mean that the klonopin might need to be raised or lowered after going off tramadol?  Just wanted to make sure I was clear.  It makes me angry how easily they prescribe benzos and even ambian.  These things aren't easy to get off of at all...addict or not.  There is a definite physical dependency.

I'm going to try one at a time.  First, the tramadol, then either the pristiq or klonopin.  I'm afraid the pristiq could be the worst! I'll see if the addictions guy can help.

I read that some people used suboxone to get off tramadol, but is it worth it?

Thanks for all of the support.  It's great to hear others stories!

Jenny

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 27, 2009
Lily- Thanks! Your story is inspiring.  Thanks for the info on ER.  Maybe I will just use the 100s and not cut them.  You're right, it doesn't seem worth it with this drug.

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 27, 2009
To Hanginin and Notsosunny - Keep up the good work!  You are both now at the point where you will really start to feel better.  Keep posting too - when I was quitting and lurking on this site, stories like yours are what inspired me to jump.  Lilly is exactly right - after getting this stuff out of your system, life gets much much better!

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 27, 2009
JG - just found your question from part 17 - to answer:  I don't think ERs work well for taper because you cannot cut them without destroying the extended release function.  That said, to use ERs as part of the overall mg's of your taper regime may work well (as others pointed out above) because of the "low level" maintenance.  I haven't taken them, though, so have no personal experience.  It is good you've found an addiction specialist, because that person is much more likely to actually know (as opposed to my guessing) the answers you seek.  

However you approach it, be sure to approach it as the fight of your life, because it is!

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 27, 2009
Thanks Hillbilly.  Your story is also inspirational (that sounds cheesy, but I mean it!).  I don't go around using the word inspirational very often.  Do any of you use a recovery program outside of this?  I'm sure the specialist will encourage me to go to AA or NA, as he's a member.  I am a total addict, but I never feel like I fit in with people that have used more hardcore drugs...well, I've used more hardcore stuff years ago, but didn't continue down that road.  I've been to AA meetings because I quit drinking, but I never felt AA sober because I'm still on this drug.  It just feels like I don't fit anywhere you know?  But, from what I know about addicts in general, this is the problem to start with- not feeling a part of things.  Sorry for rambling.  Maybe once I kick this or start getting rid of it, I will feel like I belong at a recovery meeting.

334144 tn?1423248271
by booba77, Oct 27, 2009
Lilly~It is uplifting to hear you say you are better with the kids, house, pets, etc.  It seems that this tramafog has totally affected my ability ti buckle down and clean, so my house is a wreck, but you have inspired me.  I probably have 2 more days of pills left and then it may be CT for me, as I cannot stop borrowing tommorrow's pills today.  A lot of you guys are thru thru the worst of the physical stuff~congrats.  And to not have RLS is awesome.  That is the WD symptom that I fear the most.  Speaking of, where do you get the tonic water with quinine?  I will need it in a couple days and I want to be prepared.  Keep fighting fellow warriors.  You are all doing great!!!

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 27, 2009
Why thanks JG.  Speaking for myself, I'm a total closet addict.  This site is the only place I've openly admitted it, which is why this site has meant so much to my recovery.  What this place does for me is the same thing that many of the programs do for others - provide accountability.  Every day, I look at that tracker and know it goes to zero if I don't avoid substances today.  For some, though, a more immediate accountability is needed and that is where meetings come in.  Personally, I don't think there is any right or wrong way to break the evil spell of drugs - just so long as you find a way.  

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 27, 2009
Thanks...I'll have to see how it plays out I guess! Accountability is a big thing for me too.

For those dealing with RLS or leg cramps at night, this is an old wives tale totally, but I had leg cramps and weird feelings from my thyroid thing (I think) and for awhile I slept with a bar of ivory soap between my feet.  It worked a little.  Maybe it's placebo, but it's just a bar of soap, so I thought I'd mention it!  It wasn't quite like RLS, but I think I've read that before too.

I hope I feel like cleaning when this is over.  Tramadol used to help me clean, but not so much anymore.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 27, 2009
Hey JG just do the basics in cleaning your house.Quick vacuum,tidy up,beds made and dishes done or in dishwasher.Just so its presentable to yourself and family and you will feel more able to tackle the task that is most important and that is the withdrawal.Best of luck to all and I'm off to work.

Avatar universal
by newway, Oct 27, 2009
Jg - I have returned to AA meetings.  I stopped going for the exact same reason as you mentioned - I don't feel clean and sober.
But a wise man here (yep that's you Fred) helped make me feel a little less embarassed or ashamed to go.  I need AA to help me now and when I am off tram.  I am one of those who was given tram for pain - but already struggled with alcohol and drugs - hence my Dr prescribing the "non narcotic" tramadol. lol

I don't mention the tram use in AA - but have talked about it with a few members I am comfortable with.  This ****ing drug has taken so much from me - I am not going to let it take away my support and make me feel ashamed.  I would never have taken this drug if I had known it was a narcotic - yes I continued to use it, yes I liked the way it made me feel - even the more reason to continue with AA and the support there - all you need is a desire to do something about your drinking (addictions) when you walk through those doors.
Keep reading and keep posting - you will see we all have the same battle - but different ways of fighting it - as long as we get the same outcome - we all win!

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 27, 2009
Thanks Pharma and Newway-

I will probably return to AA at some point.  I haven't had a drink in over 3 years.  I also thought this was a non-narcotic when I started for my herniated disc.  

I'm happy I have my family involved now.  It takes some of the shame away.  It's nice not to have to hide it.  I'll probably be hating it when I'm done tapering and can't do more, but one day at a time :).

Thanks!
J

334144 tn?1423248271
by booba77, Oct 27, 2009
Okay guys I have a question mainly for those who have gone cold turkey or people knowledgeable about trams and risk of seizure.  If I go CT, how large is the risk of having a seizure? Hillbilly~how many were you up yo when you went CT?  Please those of you who have gone CT please post how many you went CT from and whether you had any seizures from withdrawal.  Thanks guys.

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 27, 2009
I did not have any seizures.  I've heard of seizures with high consumption levels but not with cold turkey withdrawal.

At the height of consumption, I was taking around 20 per day (along with 5 Norco 10s per day).  I quit the Norco first and then started a taper on the Tramadol.  Over the course of 4 weeks, I tapered to around 10 per day (some days more, but I knew no one was counting), then went cold turkey.  Withdrawal was rough for a few days, but no seizures.

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 27, 2009
Booba, you will do fine because you want to get off these evil things, but I sure know what you mean about borrowing tomorrow's pills for today. I have done that more times than I can count. I used to call lorcet the devil's pill, but I swear these trams are the absolute worst. I, too, am finding it impossible to clean my house. I have family coming this weekend to babysit my kids and my kids have company coming to spend the night and I just can't force myself to get up and clean. I am going to have to, though. I just need to do it when I do get the sporatic energy bursts that I am getting. This morning I felt pretty good. Went for a walk, came home did some light weight training then BOOM, I decided to lay down just for a little while and I got up feeling like crud. I never slept, though. Anyway...Trams did help me clean and gave me energy and that I miss. The thing that I keep thinking about though is that I literally can't remember the last time I felt a buzz from the trams. I took them to feel normal and function. So, I keep asking myself why I feel like I am sitting on the fence with this when I obviously just want to feel normal and I can do that when the trams are history for good...RIGHT? I am trying not to live in the moment but keep looking towards the future optimistically. I am on day 5 now and for that I am proud of myself.

I do have a legitimate question..that is actually why I logged back on. Does anyone have any clue as to why I haven't had "the withdrawal runs"??? I am on day 5 and I haven't even used "#2" yet at all. That worries me. My tummy is very bloated and painful, yet still nothing. I hope I haven't totally messed myself up after all these years of pill usage and living on stool softeners to use the bathroom. I am not trying to be too open about my personal issues, but normally when I used to run out of meds by day two I was constantly running to the bathroom with an upset tummy & living on Immodium. I am really beginning to worry about this. Should I allow nature to take it's course or should I try to go ahead and take something to cleanse me out? Guys, I swear if I make it through this I am so done with any kind of medication whatsoever!

I am off to soak in a hot bath! EVERYONE TRY YOUR BEST TO HAVE A HEALTHY AND POSITIVE DAY! Once again, thanks to EVERYONE for the advice and words of encouragement.

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 27, 2009
Notsosunny- Hang in there! That is odd about having the opposite tummy problem.  Have you tried eating high fiber foods like veggies?  You haven't taken Immodium or anything?  That's disconcerting that you are having pain.  I hope someone can help!  You haven't gone in 5 days?  I'm sorry, I can't remember if you are working with a doctor at all...if so, I'd go see them.  If not, maybe someone here can help!  

Jenny

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 27, 2009
Jenny...I have never had this issue when I have stopped taking meds. I am having the opposite issue from the "norm"..you are exactly right. I have had issues with going to the bathroom for years because of the constipation brought on by my pill usage. I have lived on stool softeners and laxatives for about 9 years. I actually had rectal surgery in 2003 due to a huge and painful thrombosed hemorrhoid. I was told at that time I needed further surgery to correct interal ones that I didn't even know I had,which I never followed up on. In 2005 I had out patient surgery to repair an anal fissure. So, as you can see I have done alot of damage to myself. I am just getting more and more terrified that I have caused damage to such a degree that I am going to HAVE to go the doctor. Usually by this point in the withdrawal stage I am almost done with "the runs" but this time they haven't even started. It is becoming more and more painful by the hour. I am going to resort to my prescription stool softeners. I am getting desperate. I assumed I wouldn't need them so I stopped taking them when my trams ran out and got the Immodium handy, but nothing has happened. By the way, I am not under a doctor's care for getting off the trams. My doctor didn't even know I was on them. I see him only when needed as he is about an hour away and HE DOES NOT WRITE PAIN MEDS. Thank God. I have to go get my kids but I am going to call his office when I return home. Thanks so much to everyone! :)

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by 12Stepper, Oct 27, 2009
Wow, I'm amazed at how many of us there are. With the benzos mixed up in it all, it really does become an unpredictable mental state. Like Madtram, I was prescribed a benzo for sleeping during the time I was using tramadol. I was not warned in any way about the possibility of dependence and withdrawal.

I slow tapered off Ativan last March but didn't get really bad mental symptoms til I quit tram in June. It seems like the combination does lead to a longer recovery period. My main problem was depression. Some days would be great and then those horrible negative feelings would return out of nowhere.

Chrissie, a number of bad days in a row is really hard to take (11, wow, my heart does out to you!), and during those times, I'd search this site for others who experienced something similar and no matter how many times I'd find people experiencing the same thing, I'd always take comfort in knowing that it IS the tram (or benzo, in some cases, it's hard to know) withdrawal, and not a real vision of the world.

It seems like not everyone experiences mental symptoms, but It's good to be prepared so that one knows right off the bat that depression is a w/d symptom. I remember Madtram quoting Emily's helpful phrase: "It's the tram talking." Our job is to do whatever it takes NOT to listen.

I've made myself (not having any natural motivation available to me) do a few things to help--like the walking, the reading of a good novel (even enjoyed the Twilight books), the calling friends, the adult school classes, going on little outings, cooking new dishes, volunteer work, getting my teeth fixed, all the while reading and posting here. All these are just insignificant little details, but by putting enough together, they've helped me to get my life back.

It does go on for some time and that is the hardest part. But that is the way it works and there's just no getting around it.
6 months (the minimum amount of time they say it takes to get over the longer lasting symptoms) does seem like a really long time (some days seem like an eternity), but it does pass if we just make it through another day.

Have another good day of battle, fellow warriors, Love and courage, Linn

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 27, 2009
Notsosunny- Definitely sounds like you should see your doctor.  Who knows? It could be coincidence.  You could always tell him that you were on some pain medicine and decided you needed to get off it.  He doesn't have to know how much...unless you need to tell him for your stomach's sake.  Guess it depends on what's wrong.  I'm usually pretty honest with doctors, as long as it's confidential.

12 Stepper- It is interesting.  I also wasn't warned at all about benzo dependence by my sleep doctor.  I wonder why they give it out so easily?  He doesn't seem to think it's a big deal.  At least ativan and klonopin are controlled! That might be why I never abused it...I couldn't.  Not easily anyway.

I have had very little energy anyway.  I have hypothyroid and adrenal fatigue, but those are getting treated and I'm feeling better in general.  Maybe the tramadol triggered all of that anyway.  Today, I've only had two of them and I feel okay, which makes me feel a bit silly.  If I've only had two, why can't I stop?  

I enjoyed Twilight too! I've been thinking about getting the Sookie Stackhouse series.

Jenny

Avatar universal
by Revcharberry, Oct 27, 2009
I had no idea that tramadol, ativan and ambien caused so many problems.  I  am taking those and like two or three of you cannot clean my apartment.  I am thankful for this site.  Prayerfully soon I will be on the road that Emily and some of you are on and not listening to the tram talking.  The guilt, shame and depression is horrible. Rev.

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by booba77, Oct 27, 2009
Thanks for the info about having a seizure coming off cold turkey.  Looks like I should be good to go-"GULP".  Notsosunny-That is great that you don't have the runs, but I am worried about the constipation and pain.  I would try a stool softener, and if you really do not want to go to the doc, try glycerin suppositories or miralax (you mix the powder in juice or water and it is tasteless).  I give my daughter miralax sometimes if she is stopped up.  I think after the seizure years ago, the runs were the worst symptom for me besides maybe the sweats.  I couldn't do anything for going all the time.  When I ran low not too long ago, the RLS was horrible for me, so that is what I am petrified of now.  I saw the first twilight movie, although I haven't read the books.  My hubby could not believe that I thought Edward was sexy.  I can't wait until the next movie comes out.  I love that guy.  

Also, I have some klonopin (clonazepam) that my mom gave me for when I have anxiety, but I never take them because they make me tired and crabby, but I thought maybe I could use them if I couldn't sleep or to sleep through the worst of the WD's, or is that not the case with benzos?  I know the Thomas Recipe suggests valium, and I thought clonazepam was valium, but maybe it is not.  What do you think?  Has anyone used klonopin just to go through the tram WD's or is that just a horrible idea, as I will get addicted to the benzos as well?

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 27, 2009
Welcome Rev.  You have found a shame-free place, so settle in and stay a while.  I too suffered with guilt and shame.  These problems have been largely cured by getting clean.  I had to make peace with the fact that I can't change yesterday, but can become the master of tomorrow.  

Booba, you are indeed "good to go."  I'll keep you in prayers as you jump.

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 27, 2009
Rev..You are so right. The depression & anxiety is kicking my butt more than anything. I have recently been honest with friends and family regarding my pill usage. That has helped me SO MUCH! My husband is so understanding because he has been with me every step of the way. He knows I didn't go out and seek to become an addict and he has witnessed my struggle with this demon. My parents are there for me 100% and I have even spoken with my teens regarding this issue because I never want to see them travel down this same path. Maybe if they know what I am going through it will help them to decide to never take that first pill/drug. When it was all out in the open I felt empowered and I felt like I had a support system. However, the past 5 days have been difficult and I wouldn't be where I am today (5 days tram free) without coming to this site. Although my family is there for me they do not actually know first hand what I am going through and how I am feeling. The Warriors here do and have been encouraging and inspiring!!!!!! The tram is still trying to talk to me but I am trying with all my might not to listen. It would be so easy to pick up that phone and place my order, but if I do I am only delaying this process. I can't go on like this anymore. I am passed the shame and guilt (for today anyway) and now just dealing with depression and anxiety. I have always asked my doctors in the past to prescribe me something for anxiety and now I am truly so thankful they never did. I was on Lexapro for depression from 2002-2007. I was diagnosed with post-partum depression and was only supposed to be on it temporarily and it turned into 5 years. I went off the Lexapro CT but I never had any problems because I had other pills to disguise whatever it was I was supposed to be feeling. I guess I have been numb for a 1/3 of my life due to pain pills. It is just a sad tale. UGH! At this exact moment I am feeling hopeless, but my common sense tells me that it isn't hopeless. I am anxious, worried, nauseous, in pain, lethargic, restless, angry, sad....You name it, I am feeling it. Somehow though I am still remaining optimistic through all of this eventhough I feel like I am fighting a losing battle with every turn..Example: As we have discussed about not being able to pull it together to clean our houses..well, I forced myself to pull my vacuum out to at least get my floors done only to find that it is blowing air instead of sucking debris. I just had to laugh. Then I decided to try to eat some chicken noodle soup and went to microwave it and my microwave is making a roaring noise and not heating. All this happened in the course of 10-15 minutes. When it rains it pours I suppose. We will all make it, though. I just keep in mind that things could be so much worse. God Bless to all and everyone hang in there. :)

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 27, 2009
You're doing great Notsosunny! You have 5 days and that's awesome :).  Sometimes it can get hard to remember the stuff to be grateful for when we're in a fog.  Hang in there!

Avatar universal
by grandmagirl, Oct 27, 2009
grandmagirl update......

Welcome all newcomers....

I am so happy to report that after stopping Tram On March 17th 2009  I am alive and doing pretty well.  

I have finished my taper with benzo's...Coming off the Tram was far worse than the benzo taper...

Coming off Tram in retrospect was pure Hell. I don't know how I was able to work everyday and not lose my mind. The last taper has been so much easier. I was surprised that I didn't feel worse. I was expecting  to feel awful and that just did not happen to me...I have had some really ****** days..but all in all it's not that bad.

Bottom line I'm DONE.. I realize that I may have some bad days a head ...but I feel so much BETTER than I did in March ..I will take the bad days as they come and know that they will go away with TIME...

It's been "Mr.Toads Wild Ride"  

By the way Emily...I now wear shoes that match and I wear a DIFFERENT outfit everyday...NO more as you said it "Parka wearing days" for me...  Love and hugs to all      {still can't spell}

Peaceful wishes from California

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by booba77, Oct 27, 2009
Congrats Grandmagirl.  I cannot wait to be able to say I am 6 months free!!!!  You make us warriors proud.

Notsosunny-I know how you feel about the vaccuum and microwave-when it rains, it does poor.  You have been through the worst of it, although the emotional will not be easy either.  I am gearing up for my jump in a couple of days.  I am so proud of you for staying optimistic, and I know it is so hard to when everything seems to be going wrong.  5 days tram. free is something to be proud of.  Keep your chin up, you are doing great!!!

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by Dev0n, Oct 27, 2009
Hi everyone Day 17.
This place is really busy so many people so many posts..so much pain and suffering because of medical incompetence.
Well still tram free and feeling stronger every day.Thank you to everyone who posts as it helps me to understand what is going on in my body and mind especially when things get tough.
On a lighter note. This weekend my daughter came home for a few days from London and bought me this electric massage chair! After an hour of putting it together i asked her "are you sure its safe?".she turned to me with her crooked smile and replied "well if it isnt you wont have to worry about the electric bill". I just burst out laughing and it felt good.The first time i have laughed like that for a long long time.

Hillbilly and madtram thanks for your support you guys are proof that this thing can be beaten

Chrissie my neighbour. you are doing so well and my heart goes out to you,i have no more advice to give than what has already been said.I know we live very close to each other so i will send some positive energy your way.

Fred your posts are incredible thank you

everyone else who is starting the journey good luck.The first 10 days were the worst for me so keep going.

Healing thoughts to you all keep fighting never look back

Dave from nightime Devon











Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 27, 2009
Dave I am so proud of you because like many others you have come a long way.You were so down and desperate when you first posted and now look at you...you are on day 17.I am thoroughly impressed.Pat yourself on the back because you deserve it.You are through the absolute worst and are living proof that we can conquer this beast together.

Avatar universal
by hanginin, Oct 27, 2009
Hello everyone. I just finished my day 5 ct and I feel great today. I know I am not out of the woods yet but It's funny that everytime I even get a little weak I come to this site and I feel such a sense of peace and hope. I have so much respect for the people posting and having the guts to not only admit they have a problem but face it head on knowing how bad the first few days are going to be. I guess its time for me to admit something else. I am a medical professional and I might be able to help with any of the drug related questions. I know all about them just couldn't follow my own directions after having 3 major surgeries in 2 years from playing sports.  Notsosunny you might want to try a dulcolax suppository for your little problem. The tram decreases the smooth muscle tone in you gi tract and you might be impacted. The dulcolax will help. Booba77. The klonopin ( clonazepam) is very similar to the Valium ( diazepam). It is addictive but it should be fine for just a few days
to get over the worst of the tram wd.
Thanks to everyone on this blessed site. Tomorrow is day 6. Wow
Hanginin

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 27, 2009
Hi hanginin.I am also a medical professional.I am a pharmacist who had a codeine problem.I took T3 for RA pain and did not want to take it anymore because I realized I was looking forward to the high rather than the pain relief.I wanted a safe alternative and came to this site to read about tramacet.Boy was I shocked because the doctors believe the drug reps as I also did that tramadol  is not addicting.My eyes were opened and i did not start taking tramadol except for a couple of tabs that did take away my pain and did not feel any different than T3.I did not get addicted to tramadol but was almost abusing T3.I only took 8 a day at the most and had tapered to 2 or 3 a day.When I stopped the 2 or 3,I had withdrawal for about 4 to 7 days.Not as bad as tramadol but it was still withdrawal.I learned that the rebound pain that I got from taking codeine was worse than the original pain.Once the rebound pain subsided with the help of extrastrength tylenol and aleve,I have discovered to my surprise that my RA pain is controlled with non Rx meds quite well.I have been clean for about 7 weeks and feel great.I am now helping other patients withdraw from tramadol and warning everyone about its subtle effects.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 27, 2009
I must add that when I went thru the withdrawal,I was working 60 hr weeks and on my feet all day and still made it thru.My feet are all deformed because of the RA and used to hurt the most in my body.I got new orthotics made and now have much less pain.Again I have no rebound pain and do not get up in the morning hurting like I used to.I feel so good.

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by booba77, Oct 27, 2009
Thanks for the post Hanginin and congrats.  You are thru the worst of it. Good to know we can come to you medical questions.  Thanks for offering the help.  Lord knows we need it. Goodnight all.  Peace.  

Avatar universal
by newway, Oct 27, 2009
I love seeing the days add up for some of you, and it is amazing how many new people have found this site.

I have a problem I need some help with - my partner, with the best of intentions - talked to our Dr.  - told her that I was addicted to tram.
I was furious - the fear of my Dr. cutting me off before I can finish my taper terrifies me.  I had asked my partner not to say anything - I have been open about my addictions these last few months as I am trying to get my life back and now I feel like my feet have been pulled out from under me.  
I can't believe that my partner went behind my back and did this - I have an appointment next week - and I know what's going to happen - she knows I am addicted - all her *****ing medical journals will tell her that there is no withdrawal effects - so she is just going to cut me off and I am screwed.  
I haven't ordered anything on line for a few months - I am at a dose that what the Dr. prescirbes will be okay with what I have left to taper - now I am screwed, and feel like an idiot having to face her.
I am terrified, angry and a bit overwhelmed right now.  I have a plan worked out - and it revolves around my getting my work organized before I can give up a month to either c/t or medical detox.  Now this all may be messed up.
It is so frustrating - I was depending on my partner for support and it was like their was no understanding at all - I explained my fear of the Dr. - their lack of knowledge etc.
What a mess.

Avatar universal
by nancy652, Oct 28, 2009
I have read everyone's posts and am amazed what you are all accomplishing. I stopped the T madness back in August. I am now trying to start a forum for us to study the research behind Tramadol, and promote some consumer awareness. Madtram sent me tons of medical studies that I am wading through and I have done this week some in-depth research into the FDA approval process for new drugs. I am backtracking to see how the drug was approved to distributed on an unscheduled basis when I believe it is more harmful than a normal opiate. I am writing a Freedom of Information request to the FDA regarding tramadol's 1995 marketing approval.

I am not a antidrug crusader. I am antihypocrisy. Many doctors won't prescribe adequate opiate treatment to those who need it as they are in fear of losing their licenses. Our drug laws are a mess. The DEA scheduling system is a mess. The FDA dropped the ball on tramadol. I am not currently feeling like more regulation will fix our drug laws. However, I'm not proposing any answers. This is what I can do:

Find a way to make the material available to you. Madtram has done alot of work collecting med studies. Anyone who wants should read them. I'd like to create a library for us. Fred kindly guided me to create a forum, which exists and we can use, but it is hard to post my material, like the FOI request.  Please pm me if you want any of my other research, such as the research into Chemie Grunenthal, the developer of T, and the FDA appoval process and how that works. If you have any interest in helping with anything, let me know and I can guide you in the areas that I now think are useful. We can research together and at least find out what happened here. This is not a lawsuit; it is an information campaign and an investigation. That is enough right now.

Good luck to all of you and much love. Thanks again to Emily for giving us a spot to save ourselves.

Best,
Nancy

Avatar universal
by chrissie145, Oct 28, 2009
Good news that the benzo taper worked so well Grandmagirl. As I said earlier - it is the best way to go. I saw a drugs doctor for the first time last night. (Couldnt get appointment before because I was on prescription drugs and not illegal stuff!) He wonders if i am suffering because I came off too fast. He offered me the chance to go back on a low dose and taper off over a long period. I feel it would break my spirit and he understood. He reckons this will go on for at least 6 months - but possibly 18 months if i am in the minority group that is super sensitive. I am not sure that I can bear this torment for much longer. The only hope I have is that my faithful KC has been through this and tells me that it DOES end.  I dont want ot put those evil things in my body again but am I being stubborn?! Be careful warriors - dont fall intom this trap too.

(I cant remember who asked but valium is diazepam.)

Thanks for good wishes Dave and well done on Day 17.

Good luck everyone.
Chrissie


Avatar universal
by hanginin, Oct 28, 2009
Pharma9. I am also a Pharmacist and I truly admire you for getting thru we while working those hours. I am on day 6 today and I feel great today. I know that there are still going to be some issues but this board is my new best friend. I know we are going to succeed and if someone stumbles then we can pick them up. This battle can be won.

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 28, 2009
Hanginin..Here we are on day 6!!! I can't believe it. Yay for us! And Yay to everyone else taking this journey! I am "OK" this morning. Not feeling great, but not feeling too bad. I seriously admire you guys that actually work around medication and are still conquering this demon!! That is awesome and it is AMAZING!!!! Congrats to you guys for that strength! I know at this point in the game I wouldn't be so strong so applause to you guys!!!!
I am just in so much pain today. My back, my hips, my neck, my tummy! I am just curious if this is the kind of pain I would have been living with had I not kept myself numb or if this is still rebound pain? Either way, it is miserable. My pain level just suddenly went off the charts around 2AM....WHEN I WAS FINALLY ACTUALLY SLEEPING! UGH and LOL! Anyway, I managed to get it together and crawl to the kitchen for some Aleve and a huge glass of water. I actually went right back to sleep. I can't believe I actually slept last night. I am so excited...baby steps in this process in so true. One thing I remember a fellow addict telling me once is that once a person is addicted to pain pills they feel as though they can't handle any kind of pain at all. That may be what I am experiencing. I am just not used to feeling ANYTHING anymore. My mother-in-law is a HUGE pill addict and has been for almost 40 years. She once told me that she thought her life had ended when they took Quaaludes off the market. Anyway, she called me up once crying hysterically and wanting money for pills (she blew her money on Clinique & Estee Lauder make-up instead of her pills was her excuse for needing money from us) because her lips were chapped. I mean, come on...chapped lips!?!?! LOL, it is actually not a laughing matter, but that just shows that she can't handle any pain of any kind whatsoever.Thank Goodness we no longer live in the same city or else she "wouldn't stand for seeing me go through this" and would surely bring me something to "HELP"!!! Her intentions are good but she is just numb, too! Ya know? Ok, I have babbled enough...........
Well, I am about to meet day 6 head on! Wish me luck and I wish everyone here luck as well. :)

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 28, 2009
Nancy- I would be interested in that information.  I'll see if I can figure out how to PM you.  I'm new to this site.

Chrissie, you're doing great. :(  Everything I've heard about benzos suggests that a slow taper is the way to go, but I don't know how I'd feel if I had already quit.  Have you checked some of the benzo sites?  I know they talk about this a lot.  I do not look forward to finishing my klonopin after all these years.

Newway- I'm sorry your trust was betrayed.  That must be super hurtful.  Don't be ashamed though.  I think doctors see this all of the time.  Also, maybe they will start reporting how addictive it is.  He might be willing to work with a taper.  I know that's not the point.  I'm sure your partner did it out of love, but it's still hard.  

I'm am still doing my rapid taper, which consists of running out, fessing up to my family and they've given me two a day, plus some 100s (about 2-3) until I see the addictions guy.  I know taking 2-3 a day sounds really dumb and it feels kind of dumb LOL.  It's just enough to stave off that final taper where I start with the flu like symptoms.  I just can't do that.  The one in the morning is just enough to clear my head.  It feels so pathetic.  The psychological pattern is the way I felt when I quit smoking, although that may have been worse.

I figure the addictions guy can help me with this, my klonopin and then hopefully my AD.  I'm so overmedicated for how "normal" I am.  Also, hopefully he can help me with the tools not to find some other drug or whatever (food?) to fill that emptiness.

For those of you who have stopped, you aren't missing anything...stick with it! Addictions lie to us.

Jenny

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 28, 2009
Notsosunny- I have a very low pain threshold now.  How's your stomach?

Is it the tramadol w/d that causes there to sound like there is a little bell ringing in your ear?  That's always my first morning withdrawal symptom.

Jenny

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 28, 2009
Morning Jenny! I did got to the bathroom this morning. I think my tummy will be OK..I am going to give it through the weekend. If it is not feeling somewhat normal then I will call the doctor Monday. I didn't call yesterday like I had planned to. You know, this is a situation more comfortably dealt with at home but if I need to see him I won't hesitate to go. Thanks so much for asking. :)

I have heard the ringing in my ears before. It is even like a buzzing sound at times. I haven't had it consistantly but I have experienced it before. I never really associated it with withdrawals but now that I am thinking about it and know it has happened to someone else I think it may be a possibility. When I am going through withdrawals I am just overloaded with all kinds of crazy bodily and mental issues. IT *****!

Also, has anyone noticed themselves urinating every few minutes when coming off the trams? I know pain meds can suppress the need to urinate and I also know that I am drinking ALOT of fluids to stay hydrated, but it seems as though I am running to the restroom every few minutes. Maybe this is just par for the course when withdrawing. Hmm? I have never made it to day 6 so I don't really know at this point what I should or shouldn't be feeling. I guess I should be thankful...maybe I am flushing all this **** out of me.

:)

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 28, 2009
LOL- I always pee a lot.  Yes, I think that is what the ringing is from.  It's like a brain fog with ringing for me when I don't have it.  I thought that was thyroid related because brain fog can be, but it's probably this.

Hope your tummy feels better! I agree better to deal with at home if you can.  My only concern was that you had previous surgery, but you know your body :).

Jenny

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 28, 2009
Newway, I am so sorry to hear that your partner betrayed your trust like that. I am sure the intentions behind it were good but it should have been your choice if and when you spoke with your doctor!!!! Although my husband has been supportive there have been times over the past decade when we were arguing that he has threatened to call my ex-doctors. He never did, though. Thank God. The only advice I can give you in regarding how to handle this situation is just to talk to your doctor about YOUR taper plan and explain to him/her what your plan of action is. If he/she is understanding they will either stand by your choices and guide you through it, suggest a different plan of action and/or maybe even prescribe you something that may help with withdrawals while coming off. I know it seems devastating right now, but it may turn out to be a blessing in disguise that your doctor knows about this. The one thing I realize is what you are going through right now. I think the anticipation of getting off these meds can be just as difficult as actually doing it. That fear and anxiety can be overwhelming. Try not to dwell on it and get yourself anxious before your appointment. Just hope for the best but prepare yourself for the worst. I seems like I live by that philosophy these days!!! Please don't feel like an idiot having to face your doctor. Trust me, they have seen and heard it all. It is just that so many of them are so very NOT understanding regarding the issue of pain management and pain medication. I really wish that right now I was under a doctor's care for what I am dealing with, but then again, I would want to be the one seeking it. I wouldn't want anyone else doing it for me. This is a delicate issue for sure. Just know that whatever comes of this situation WE are all here for you. You can and will make it through this one way or another. I am all over the board emotionally and physically right now myself. Still sitting on the fence, I suppose. Best of luck to you for sure! :)

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 28, 2009
Notsosunny.I really believe that your extra pain is rebound pain of withdrawal,because it happened to me.I persisted as you did and only took aleve and extra strength tylenols and the pain became less each day.I now have very little pain and when I do the extra strength tylenols help.I also soaked in epsom salt bathsI don't awake with a headache anymore and feel good.You have to watch the number of tylenols you take because of the liver.My dose was 2 extra strength tylenols every 4 hrs ie 8am,12noon,4pm and around 8 or 9 I took 2 extrastrength robaxacet for the night.The muscle relaxant in the robaxacet helped as well.In between the tylenols I took 2 aleves every 6 hours.I now can get away with about 6 extrastrength tylenols a day.Also too much aleve can wreck the stomach and kidneys.My doses are within safe limits and none of my pain pills are rx meds.One day my back and shoulders hurt so much I felt sick to my stomach but I hung in and the pain subsided.I realized that I was looking forward to the slight high that the codeine gave me rather than the pain relief.Once I made up my mind that the high was not worth it,I was willing to accept the quite adequate pain relief that non rx meds gave me.I do remember being alittle disappointed in the beginning that I would not have that high to look forward to and how would I be able to cope with pain and work.I put this thought out of my mind and kept plugging on and guess what....I really do not need any of those narcotics in my life and I coped better than I ever thought I would.I am also taking b12 and omegas and antioxidant vitamins.This experience has made me more in touch with my customers and I have been extra diligent in helping people with addiction problems.I always justified my codeine intake on the fact that I have a real disease with real pain that needed a heavy duty pain reliever because I have to work long hours on my feet.You know...the old woe is me story.Actually I realized that I am lucky to have a recession proof profession and not ever worry about jobs even if I have to stand on my feet.I am better off than most people and do not need the help of narcotics to get along.I have to stress that it was easier for me because I was not addicted to tramadol,just codeine.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 28, 2009
I think one of the reasons doctors are so upset and unbelieving that tramadol is addicting is that tramadol was to them a safe option over narcotics and without that they really have very little to treat chronic pain with.Because it was introduced as a non narcotic,non addicting pain reliever with antidepressant properties,they thought they had the ideal drug to give to give without possibilities of addiction.It sounds ideal,but unfortunately has not proven to be so for chronic pain.I was on a site recently that still recommended the use of tramadol because it is non addicting.Dealing with chronic pain is different for each person and has to become a way of life.All pain relievers can cause rebound pain,but narcotics are the worst.

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by booba77, Oct 28, 2009
Newway~I am sorry to hear about your partners betrayal, but Im sure they were trying to help.  Please do not feel ashamed at all.  Go in there with your head held high and explain what happened.  I think it is also important to stress the existence of this website.  Maybe if docs saw it and read the posts, they would be more understanding and helpful. Hangin and notsosunny congrats on day 6.  Be proud.  Sounds like youare both faring well for the most part.  Tomorrow is my last day of trams, then I will be "jumping overboard. so to speak.  My hubby is working Saturday now so I guess my 4 year old can help take care of me.  Hat should be interesting.  If I take my last one thurs evening, do you think I can work on friday, or should I not even try?

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 28, 2009
Hi Booba...So, you are about to jump overboard, huh? I will totally keep you in my thoughts and prayers. It is hard...TRUST ME, but I know in the long run it is so worth it. As far as working Friday...You will probably be able to make it through it considering it is your 1st day tram free. You need to do whatever you can to stay occupied. Idle hands are indeed the devil's playground. If you are at work it may be easier for you to make it through the day instead of sitting home and thinking about the demon pill! Of course, you know yourself best, so if you think it may be too much for you to take in on your first day then it may be a good idea for you to call in. From my experience (and if you go back and read my first couple posts here) it is easiest for me the first day or 2 because I feel empowered and so ready to conquer this. Usually my first day tram free is fairly easy just because of that empowering feeling. It is not until day 2-3 that the REAL feelings take over. Just keep that in mind. I still try to tell myself it is mind over matter.  What I have had to do in the past when going through this is get things ready for my kids, hubby and myself ahead of time. Before I would run out of meds I would cook several nights worth of meals in advance so it would be easy to open the freezer and thaw something out without struggling to cook and withdraw at the same time. I would go ahead and cut any veggies I would need and ziplock them. Buy cereal and easy to fix items. I stock up on canned and cup soups. I get boxed/canned juices and drinks so I wouln't have to make tea and such. I learned the hard way several times that without proper preperation it just made life h*ll! I would make sure clothes were ironed and bed linens were changed...yada yada yada..you get the picture. PREPARE AHEAD OF TIME! It has been vitally important to my progress that I did this. (Although I could have done a better job preparing...I forgot to do alot of important things ahead of time, but oh well, I really didn't give myself much time to prepare considering I didn't plan on taking this step until the last minute!!!) I have 2 nights worth of meals left and then I have to go back to full fledge cooking. Since I ran out of meds I have only had to cook side dishes and a few other little things. I left nothing major for myself. My husband brought me home a new microwave yesterday! God Bless him. Now I am just sitting staring at the little pieces of debris on my floor and no way to vacuum. LOL..I am about to take yet another hot bath. I am probably the cleanest human on earth right now. LOL...As always, Warriors...fight a good fight and best wishes to you all! :)

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 28, 2009
Good luck booba..I tend to agree with notsosunny that I would go to work.The first day one is has more strength and energy and it is better to stay busy.When you are at work you have to grit your teeth and concentrate as best you can.Take some aleve and extrastrength tylenols with you in case you need something for pain.Take b12 and omegas and vitamins and you will get thru the day.You will feel proud of yourself that you could still work and it will empower you to continue.Just take one day at a time and if you feel capable go to work because it is a distraction and lets face it we have to earn money to pay the bills.I sneezed like crazy at work but blamed it on a cold.The weekend is coming up soon and you can hang in till then.As each day passes you will get one day closer to your goal.I am at day 42 or thereabouts and not missing codeine one bit or feeling any worse,in fact better.Good luck in your healing and we will all be here to help you along

Avatar universal
by TRAMMAN999, Oct 28, 2009
booba77,   ............       You are good to go. I am on Day 8 as I mentioned in my note. I mentioned the fact that I was on a high dosage and then just quit. But, I had all the ammunition ready and the time and space with nobody to worry about and nobody to bother me. For me perfect conditions which I had engineered.
Sorry, I want to encourage & support but the truth is, it was tough - maybe because I was coming from a high dose. No way could I have operated after just a weekend. I certainly could not have looked after a toddler. Apart from all the things mentioned by 'colleagues' on this site one of my biggest problems was sleep - restless legs, body & mind - then the next day difficult to cope with whatever is thrown at you. However, I don't know how long you have been on Tram and what dosage you are dropping from. I guess my 3 years on a high dose and dropping from a currrent 500mg/day was fairly extreme. And, as we always say on this site -   "everyone is different!!"    - - - maybe I am just a 'big softy'.
To answer your other question, I used Clonazepam - Benzoes (to the unlearned) are all much of a muchness - they calm the mind & muscles and aid more comfortable sleep. You won't get hooked after only a few days!!! Just make sure you don't make a habit of it !!!*** or you will have more tapering in the future.
Please post when you finally go for it and "I know" through experience that you will have many, many people helping you along the way. May you have a relatively peaceful return to 'normality'.   Tram

Avatar universal
by hanginin, Oct 28, 2009
Hey everyone. I just got through swimming about a mile this morning. Last week I wouldn't have been able to even get to the gym. Notsosunny.  The pain you've been having is rebound pain. The tram numbs even minor aches and pains and when its gone you feel them again. Pharma9 gave great advice on the otc pain killers.  This will get better in a few days as well. I have found that the B12 dots that are used under the tongue give me more energy and make me feel better.  Everyone keep strong and anyone that has just stopped today just remember it can be done.

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 28, 2009
Booba- I agree with everyone else.  I remember when I quit drinking and smoking cigarettes, I was a little useless for awhile.  Now, that's totally different.  I didn't have DTs or anything, but quitting smoking was miserable.  It's not the same feeling, although you're tired all the time and draggy with that.  I don't remember having the zapping and brain fog like I have without tramadol...it really reminds me of coming off of Celexa (for me) except it sounds like it may last longer.  Yay for us! LOL

In the end, all addictions are healed by reaching out for help and by NOT giving in to cravings.  I am not a religious person, in fact I'm not a believer at all, but I learned through other addictions, when you get a craving, just pray to whatever.  Basically, we're addicts and we can't control this...that's why most of us can't do a taper...we have no control.  So, if you turn your control over to a "higher power" and ask for help, it can ease the suffering.  For me, that is sometimes a group like this, not so much "God."  If you do have a strong belief in something, then use that.

One things they use in a program I did is the 5 Ds.  Delay, Distract, Deep Breathe, Drink Water and Discuss.  That's a way to get through cravings.  Delay, Distract and Discuss can be done by typing on this board.

None of this will help with the physical withdrawal, but if you don't push through the cravings then you have to go through physical withdrawal over and over.  

You have my info if you need to reach out! And I'm sure everyone else will be here.  They can help more with specific tramadol stuff then I can.  

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 28, 2009
Hey..nice to hear from you hanginin.Good to hear you feel better and keep up the good work.Just of to work now and will check in when I get home.Hope everyone has a good healing day.

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by booba77, Oct 28, 2009
I just want to say that I love this place.  I really do feel empowered after reading your posts.  Tramman~coming off about 1250 mg a day since july 2007.  I feel that so much is built up in my body I will be okay for work Friday.  I have a feeling the next monday and tues will be sick days tho. noysosunny~thanks for the preparation advice.  i had not thought of any of that.  I will be stocking up. Pharm9~I usually prefer advil to tylenol, and i will be sure to stock up. Also, i have the liquid B12.  is that good to use? it was expensive as hell.  JG~I love the 5 Ds.  ~ will be using them.  by the way, i am a cigarette smoker.  i quit about g months before i got pregnant and started back when she turned 2 years. i never smoke in my house or around my daughter.  Quiting smoking is the worst.  Thanks for all the great advice.  

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 28, 2009
Jenny, Wow..I admire you for quitting smoking and drinking. I applaud you for that!!! I simply can't imagine giving up my cigarrettes and I absolutely hate them but I love them, too. I know one day I am going to have to conquer that beast and quit. It is so unhealthy and disgusting. I have no desire for alcohol whatsoever, thank God. I suffer from hangovers so severely that is makes me not even want to drink. Even now, in my time of desperation I have no desire for alcohol. I go out occasionally (about once every 3 or 4 months) but then I suffer so bad that I don't want to go out for several months or even look at alcohol for that matter. I have always known to be weary of alcohol because alcoholism runs on both sides of my family really bad. My Daddy was a severe alcoholic all of his adult life and literally died with an open bottle of Canadian Lord Calvert sitting beside his office desk. My Mom has never smoked a cigarrette or drank a sip of alcohol but there are family members on her side that were severe alcoholics. I always preferred the pills over all else. Of course...that is why I am here!

Today is getting harder for me and it is only because my mind is going a million miles a minute. I am thinking about this weekend, the company coming to visit, the cleaning that I have yet to do, the costume party...and the lack of energy and desire to do anything is very aggravating. I am in pain and my heart is beating fast, which is driving me nuts. I could be feeling better by today but I am allowing the anxiety to get the best of me. Mind over matter my @ss! LOL! As we all know, I may be back in a couple hours saying that I am feeling so much better. I swear I am from one extreme to the other at the drop of a hat. Time to get the kids and make myself truly function.

Peace & healing to ALL!!!!

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 28, 2009
Smoking is terrible to quit, but I'll tell you, it's probably the best thing I ever did.  It really took awhile to get used to and I thought I would never be free of the cravings, but now, it's just not an option.  I'm only 29 and I smoked 2-3 packs a day for 11 years.  My body isn't happy about it either, but at least I don't have asthma and bronchitis anymore.  I hope I never touch another one because I don't know if I have that quit in me again.

Alcohol was easier to stop for me.  I was really getting out of control with it and I also have alcoholism in my family, so I used my support for quitting smoking for that too.  I used to get sick and just keep drinking, but it was more social for me, so I think I stopped early enough to be okay as long as I don't go back out.

All of these prescibed drugs are a different ball game for me.  It's easier to hide the tramadol problem than it would have been a coke addiction or anything like that.  Plus, it's easy to rationalize because I do have pain.  But I can see it's not healthy anymore, not that it ever was.  That's why I told my family.  I don't know if I could quit on my own.  Actually, I couldn't, because I tried.  But some people can!

It's great to see everyone getting days in a row! You have to celebrate each day :).  I'm ready to join too!

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 28, 2009
Jenny, I too admire you for quitting smoking.  That said, booba you may find, like me, that smoking is what keeps you from going totally crazy during the next few days.  I will also say, however, that just this morning I was thinking now that I've gone 43 days without tram, I can quit anything - including smoking.  My deal with myself was to start my tobacco taper today.  I've had 5 less than usual so far. . .

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 28, 2009
Hillybilly- You're probably right about it helping...just like Klonopin might help some of us.  You definitely can quit smoking! That said, don't rush.  It's a long process and will most likely trigger cravings for any other substance you can put in your body.  Just make sure that going back to tramadol would never be an option, no matter how bad you feel.

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by booba77, Oct 28, 2009
That is awesome Hillbilly!!!  I smoke about 6 a day during the week, more on the weekends and the most on Saturdays which is foosball night.  I love my smokes.  My mom smoked for 30 years and has horrible COPD.  I initially quit becaause I promised her if she did I would too, but i am back at it.  I guess the terrible 2s did me in.  This will sound weird, but I wish I could drink. I cannot do it.  the hangover and headache killsme.  but i love a margarita.  My hubbys mom is a closet alcoholic, though we all know of course.  he drinks once a week, which isnt too bad.  I feel like I am about ready to jump guys, but I will be in severe WDs during trick or treating and i hate to miss that.  i guess in the long run it is better for all tho.  Daddy will do fine with her.  Maybe they can score me some milk duds.  Better get to work. Keep the faith guys.  

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 28, 2009
Hillbilly, I certainly wish you luck with the tapering from nicotine. That is definitely not something I think I am anywhere near close to starting. I am usually a 1/2 pack a day smoker but I have broken into my 2nd pack every evening this week. I think it has kept me from going totally insane. I know I am extremely very much so addicted to nicotine and I don't think I will be able to quit that without some medical help. It isn't that I smoke a large quantity normally but I am 35 and I have smoked since I was 15. That is a long time!!! I will do it one day, though. My husband was told 1.5 months ago that his lungs sounded awful so he has cut back smoking tremendously. If he is tapering to quit totally he hasn't shared that with me. Anyway, I say congrats on taking the step to quit, Hillbilly! That is awesome!

Booba, I was in fullblown withdrawals 2 Halloweens ago because I ran out of trams and couldn't get anything else. Going out and trick or treating with the kids actually helped me. I was PMS'ing on top of it, too. (Sorry Guys, but it is the truth :)) I thought it was going to be a horrible night but getting out and walking did me so much good. Not to mention seeing the kids have such fun. The way I was feeling was never far from my mind, but I handled and made it through and ended up having a great time. So don't fret over it Booba..You will do fine. We somehow find strength when it comes to our kids. Plus, if you can score some milk duds out the deal that is something to look forward to. :)



Avatar universal
by gubatzzz, Oct 28, 2009
Hi All,
I am realy glad to have a place like this to go to, It has been a major part in helping me get thorough this ordeal.

Today is 2 weeks off the Tram and my energy is starting to go through the roof. The residual fibromyalga like pain is starting to go away and stomach and Intestinal problems are settling down. My big problem now is the insomnia and RLS,But  I can actually feel the old me starting to come back. (GREAT)

Interesting enough I had bloodwork done at 3 days off the Tram, While withdrawing and suffering and all the results came back normal. (WHAT A RELIEF).
After a long visit with my new MD today he has decided to up my Ambien to 10 mg to help with the sleep, he has taken me off the Mirapex (Parkinson type drug) for restless leg as he believes the RLS at this stage is more from coming off the Tram and the Anxiety. So he has put me on a very low dose of Paxil to help quiet my brain and see if it will help quiet the RLS. My wife is a nurse at a local Hospital rehab center and she asked the main shrink who said that it was a very good thing to try as Paxil will help with the serontonin and attempt to quiet my Brain.  
I am still having very small Brain zaps (like an electrical short circuit 1 sec or less) that I can only feel now when I lie down and try to go to sleep, but the RLS soon takes over and then thats all you feel. I have found that trying to fight it, and getting in and out of bed makes it worse. If you can distract yourself or find a positive way to channel the anxiety it will help. I walk a mile on the treadmill at 3am and do some streching, but still I find myself not getting to sleep until 5am, and then its only for a few hours. Sorry for rambling on but the message id the same,

         ANY DAY OFF OF TRAM IS A BETTER DAY!!! Even without much sleep I feel like a new person.
DON'T GIVE UP.. it is worth the battle.

Best Regards
Gubatzzz

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by booba77, Oct 28, 2009
Notsosunny~thanks for the words of encouragement.  ~ will def. join in the festivities now, regardless of the WDs.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 28, 2009
I take the b12 that goes under the tongue.I.m sure liquid is just as good.Take 1000mcg per day along with antioxidant vitamins and omegas.I also take 2 halibut oil caps daily to help the immune system.Today was crazy at work,everyone is worried about H1N1 and thinks they have it.Our supply of Tamuflu is almost gone and the company cannot supply the liquid for children.I had to make up my own mixture of tamuflu liquid using the capsules and a suspending agent for a child.I used to work at Sick Childrens Hospital in Toronto and have made many liquid mixtures in my day.I am glad I am at the stage where I am in my healing because I have to do many calculations quickly and can't be wrong.My head is nice and clear  and I was so busy I did not have time to feel any pain.Did not need my tylenols till now just before bed.It is so good to see all the people on this site trying so hard to succeed.I also quit smoking 25 years ago and tackled the nicotine withdrawal much the same way as this.I really really wanted to be a non smoker much more than I wanted that stupid cigarette and conquered that evil.I must say I felt good driving to work today and realized that my shoulders felt like a weight had been lifted off them.That weight was the constant rebound pain I was trying to abate with codeine.I guess I feel like I really got the monkey off my back and it feels lighter.

Avatar universal
by hanginin, Oct 28, 2009
Pharma9. This H1N1 is crazy. I don't think anyone has any of the suspension and everyone is compounding it. I'm glad you had a good day though and didn't have much pain. Our job can drive you crazy and what do we work with all day but drugs. I am so glad for this site because I honestly thought it was just me with the tramadol. Nossosunny, I think tomorrow is 7 for us and we are still going strong. Lets do good tomorrow and then start our second week.  Gubatzzz. I loved you quote and its for sure true. Nothing is as bad as tramadols, nothing. I hope we get some new people off the trams in the next few days and I look forward to talking to my new most trusted friends tomorrow.
Hanginin

Avatar universal
by nancy652, Oct 29, 2009
Morning fine people.
People have started emailing me about the studies that madtram has so kindly provided me. Thank you! So I'm busy trying to find the most efficient way to do this. I've sent some off, but I have yet to figure out how to organize the consumer stuff. This is going to take an online library.
In the meantime, feel free to pm me and I will work with you so I can direct you to the medical studies and the FDA info, or give you the search terms. Anyone who is up to it (these activities have contributed to my detox) may join us. This is going to require the talents of may different people.
Have a wonderful day. Like madtram said....this could be fun, you know, to fight this fight when you feel up to it.

Love,
N

Avatar universal
by hanginin, Oct 29, 2009
Good morning everyone. Day 7 today and I am looking forward to the day. With the tram every day was just a struggle.
We all need to be strong today and remember how far we've come. If today is you ct day just dig in and realize its not forever. Have a great day.
Hanginin

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 29, 2009
Good Morning to everyone!

Hangin, we have made it to day 7. I am, too, looking forward to the day. I walked my daughter to school this morning instead of taking the short 1 minute dirve. Her school is literally in our neighborhood yet I drove her every morning. Not this morning...It is awesome weather so we walked. I feel pretty darn good so far today so there is hope for all of us!

Booba, take it easy today and don't get anxious. Look forward to this step in your life. You are going to do great. You have a positive outlook but a realistic one as well so you will be just fine. I will be thinking of you and everyone else fighting this war.

Everyone have a great day and stay strong. This is not easy but it is worth it...

Peace and healing to ALL!

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 29, 2009
I almost forgot...I do have a question.

Last night, although I SLEPT, I had some strange sensations with my arms. As I was trying to fall asleep my arms would all of a sudden flail or jump and it only lasted a second but it was so weird. I have never had any issues with my arms uncontrollably flailing with no warning. I am hoping it is something that occurs only when trying to sleep..Kinda like RLS. It would be quite embarrassing to have this happen during the day in public. It was kinda like tourettes of the arms if that makes any sense. A couple times it happened as I was actually falling asleep and it startled me to the point that I was a little scared. Kinda like that waking up from having a nightmare feeling. Anyway, I was just curious if anyone else had experienced this.

:)

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 29, 2009
Congrats to hanginin and notsosunny for day7.Just think the time will pass easier each day and soon you will stop counting the days.I am at day 43 or thereabouts because I have now stopped counting.Just keep plugging everyone and you will have wonderful success.I got up this morning with no shoulder pain or any pain.I feel good.I cant remember the name of the writer who described his battle with tramadol as if he was the warrior and T was the enemy and he vanquished his enemy as it slunk wounded down the hill .Something like that ...he was descriptive.Onwards soldiers.

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by booba77, Oct 29, 2009
Happy Day 7 to notsosunny and hanginin.  Congrats.  Notsosunny~funny because I was feeling super anxious before reading your post.  I have 6 trams left and that is it.  Tonight I jump on the cold turkey bandwagon.   I have tapered a little over the past 2 days, so ~ am dragging a bit.  I have a huge box of aminos vitamins, etc. to go thru and get ready to take.  gotta get some epsom salts too.  No one ever answered my post about where to get the quinine for RLS? I fear the RLS.  Also, should I try to get the H1N1 vacc for my daughter if i can, or are there bad effects from it?  from what i have heard, it is hard to get.

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 29, 2009
Hi everyone! I'm out of town, so can't reply as much as I'd like.  My sleep has been a been harder to get into since I've tapered down.  More restless too.  I always thought my klonopin knocked me out, but I guess it was the combo...I think some of you said this.

As to those who think they want to quit smoking, I used an online meeting support group- like AA.  It really helped and I'm happy to tell anyone if they want it.  My parents had a lot of success with Chantix, but not everyone does.  I really didn't want to quit, but I knew my then boyfriend didn't like it and even though I never would have let him tell me to quit, I did it.  Thank goodness.  My step-dad has very advanced COPD and it really *****.  That would never have motivated me though.  Anyway, I would wait until each "quit" has settled in before trying that one. It makes you crave a lot.

Just wanted to throw that out there.  Certainly not here to try and get anyone to quit smoking.  Just to get myself clean :)

Jenny

Avatar universal
by newway, Oct 29, 2009
Good Morning all,

I have tapered down to less than half of what I was taking,  I am doing it slowly - trying to stay functional day to day.  So far it has not been terrible - low grade headache, sweating, fatigue (extreme) - minor aches and pains.  
On Monday I dropped another 50 mg - and I think I am going to have to start droping by 25mg from this point on if I want to continue to feel okay.  The drop on Monday threw me into mini withdrawal - stomach issues, headache, twitching during the day, RLS at night.  Minor compared to what those of you going CT are going through - but bad enough it makes it difficult to deal with staff and clients.  
I am not going to go back up 25mg to ease it off - no way - I am not ever increasing what I am taking - just a steady decrease until the withdrawal symptoms are bad enough that I just jump off.  
I am going to stay where I am until the symptoms ease up and then I will go down another 25mg.  I am down to 375mg - so maybe this is as low as I can go without feeling sick - I may be jumping off sooner than I thought.

Thanks to all who offerd support to deal with my Dr situation.  I will print off some of the information from Nancy's forum and some posts from here  - incase my Dr decides to cut me off.  Now that my Partner has told her about my addiction - as I said before - I am terrified that she will go with the same information that told her that it was non addictive - I'm pretty sure the next line is - no withdrawal symptoms.
I will go in prepared and hope for the best - i've tapered down to the point where I need the prescription - it is just enough to keep my taper - if I don't get it I will be out within a day or two.  I am tempted to order more online to make sure I will be okay.

My home is not a pleasant place to be right now - I am still fairly angry that I have been put in this position. I had explained to my partner the Dr's ignorance on the drug - how I wanted to deal with it.  Very frustrating.

I go to the Dr's mid next week - keep your fingers crossed for me!

Notsosunny - I get RLS all over my body.  The last time I went CT I was jumping around the house like I was on fire - I couldn't stay still - nerves were shooting everywhere.
I forget who mentioned the rining in the ears - but I have had it from about the first week I started T - I hope it goes away after I am T free.

Take care all

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 29, 2009
Newway..you have come along way from your first post and a slow taper is just as good as anything.The main thing is that you are not increasing or even maintaining a high dose.Please don't order any on line for I am sure your doctor will understand and prescribe you enough to taper as needed.You have shown determination and strength of character by tapering and sometimes that is harder than going ct.Less withdrawal,but harder to do.Forgive your partner for trying to be helpful and try to make your home as pleasant as possible.Everything will work out because they will see that you are sincere in your efforts and are trying as best you can.Everyone has a different approach,but the end result will be good for all involved.We all care for you here and want everything to work out well.A slow taper is like dieting...slow and steady has best success.You still have to work and deal with clients and you know the best way to handle your situation.Keep up the efforts and our thoughts and prayers are with you.Remember it is not your fault that you got addicted to this devil drug.Who would suspect that a non controlled drug is as addicting as this one is.

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by booba77, Oct 29, 2009
is there anything out there all natural that can help with the twitching and RLS? Does anyone have any suggestions?  newway~good for you for tapering.  I wish I could have had the resolve to do it.  6 more trams left and I am free!!!!  Onward warriors......

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by madtram, Oct 29, 2009
Booba, you can get the quinine in tonic water which you should be able to get at your local food market.  You can also try Hylands restful legs but you need to take a lot of pills to get the equivalent dose.

Very late here, so wishing you all the strength you need for today's battles.

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 29, 2009
Newway- I would emphasize the SSRI component to your doctor.  They wouldn't tell you to come off an anti-depressant suddenly and it (for me) has a lot of similarities.  If you keep tapering then they'll believe you I think.  If you go online and order than you're opening your mind to a lot of other possibilities that will just make it harder.  Hang in there!

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by GreatWhite, Oct 29, 2009
Hey guys, I am new to this forum and my story is quite similar to everyone's i guess. So I will just lay it all out there as I have finally decided to beat this thing once and for all:

Came to NY from CA drug free in about 2001. Got a job as a bartender at a restaurant and was introduced to all kinds of drugs from the staff there. (Waiters and Waitresses do a lot of drugs, guess you have to do deal with hungry people all day). Started out just smoking pot recreationally until I started buying pills from somone else. vicodin and percocet and any pain pill i could take, as i loved the high. But i never really took that much. 20 pills would last me a week or more. As I was very economical with my drug use. Coming off vicodin and percs after that week was basically just like a stomach bug, nothing more that would last a day. After I quit that job, I wasnt taking anything until I felt the urge to take pills again and started ordering Trams online. Now I get them delivered to my door every month or so. Like I said i never really take more than 2 at a time like 2 or 3x a day so 90 pills would last me 3 or 4 weeks.
  Right now i am down to 3 a day, but havent really had the encouragement or inspiration to kick the habit until my girlfriend found out about it and confonted me. Nobody knew or at least so i thought, until she confronted me. Turns out she had suspicions that I was taking something, and asked me and i just told her the truth. That it wasnt serious, that i wasnt a drug addict, i didnt do it for the high, i just did it so my body wouldnt get sick anymore. I cant afford to get sick because I do have a day job, and go to grad school, so i consider myself a functioning adult on these Trams. If i were to quit cold turkey i would need a lot of excuses as to why i wasnt at work and definitely would probably either be fired or close to it. So my gf did a bunch of research as have I the last couple days, and i have decided to tell my aunt and uncle, who i live with, and try to figure out a plan. I am definitely embarrassed by my drug use, afraid of what people might think, and afraid to tell anybody anything about it. It took a lot of me telling my gf and the last few days have been filled with tears and emotions that i never knew i had inside of me.
  Today i am so motivated to quit! My gf wants me to get professional help and take a leave of absence medically from work and go to a treatment center. Apparently only 2% of people who try to do it themselves actually quit for good. Its been about 2 years since I been on them, and the withdrawal symptoms scare the sh*t outta me but like i said, now that I have found this forum and hopefully will have the support of my family I know i can do it by myself. I want to start seeing a good psychiatrist to talk to them and hopefully that will help me get that part of my life in order of keeping things inside and hiding emotions. What my plan is to get it down to 2/day, which i have before, and then 1/day and then 1/2/day. and then just stop. I know this is going to take a lot of resilience and a lot of mental control but I know I can do this. I am sure there will be days where it is unbearable, but hopefully with the support of people I can get through it. I cannot imagine doing this alone, Iam lucky to have a great gf who truly loves me and wants to help me. I was so afraid that if i told her she would leave me but its quite teh opposite., She keeps telling me its not my fault.. and i want to believe that so bad, but i am still embarrassed at this point. Going to the gym is defintely going to help with everything as i love working out, but I also want to try some fish oil, and ambien probably to help sleep.
  Let me know what you guys think, i would love to hear your opinions and welcome any criticisms or comments. Thanks,
Chris


Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 29, 2009
Booba..I have been faithfully taking valerian root and drinking valerian root tea nightly. I got it at GNC and it is not expensive at all. I am having some anxiety, insomnia, jerking and flailing trying to fall asleep, but all in all I have had less nightly struggles than usual. It is definitely worth a try. PM's don't work for me. If I take a tylenol PM for some reason I always have a rough night so I decided to just stop even taking them at night. However, whatever works for you to get some sleep DO IT!

Newway..You are doing great on your taper and everyone else with the willpower to taper. I know it stinks to be facing this battle and having relationship issues. Double Whammy! You will be fine though....Hang in there and remember THIS TOO SHALL PASS! I also agree with pharma...Please don't order any online. That was/is/was/is what I have been struggling with because they just make it too d@mn easy to get them. I know if I have refrained from ordering them anyone can. I literally spent my "pill money" just so I wouldn't be tempted. I always stashed back here and there for my online orders so it wouldn't seem like I was spending so much money on the stupid trams (or taking away from my kids...funny how we rationalize things when we need our meds!!!) so I spent it so I couldn't order them! I have always refused to take money from the bank account to order them so that is not an option for me now either! I am on day 7 (YAY!!!!!!) and things are looking up. It is a day by day struggle. There are good days, decent days and horrible days, but every single day tram free is worth it in the big scheme of things!

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 29, 2009
Chris..WELCOME!!! First of all...try your best to throw the guilt and shame out the window. You have taken the first step and that is the hardest. Post here when you are feeling weak. I, too, opened up to my family about my issues and they have been great. However, none of them really know what I am going though or what I am actually feeling because they haven't experienced this. The posters here have and are great at encouraging and giving friendly advice on how to cope. I really, and I do mean this, believe I wouldn't have made it this past 7 days had I not found this site. There were times when I was so weak that I would just about make my online order but I would come here instead. It has been a GREAT support for me and I know it has for others, too. Hang in there. It is a bumpy and scary ride but worth it.

Gotta run some errands. Everyone keep fighting.
:)

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 29, 2009
Wow greatwhite..you have everything in place to start on a new clean life..a good support system and a desire to do so.You also seem to realize why you take these pills..other than the fact you are addicted,you feel you need them to cope with things.You have probably learned that even if they help you cope for a while the effect is not lasting and the letdown is worse than if you did not have the drug.You are going to grad school and have a good future ahead of you.Just remember that you will have a good life now and in the future free from drugs and full of promise.You should be proud of what you have accomplished already and with your new determination and our help and your loved ones help you will conquer this nasty habit.Whichever method you choose,ct or slow taper,you can and will do it because if you want it badly enough it will happen.If you need the antidepressant effect of the drug perhaps the doctor can prescribe an antidepressant in a low dose if it is ok with you.Good luck and keep us posted.

Avatar universal
by brighterdayahead, Oct 29, 2009
Hey guys.  I don't really know how I stumbled on this site this morning but I have really been moved by it.  I have abused prescription drugs for years after I got my leg mangled in a car accident and am really sick and tired of it.  I currently take Percocet 10 and Ultram and whatever else I can get my hands on when I run out.  When I'm out of all my pills, my ole faithful marijuana seems to get me through.  My doctor also started me on Lyrica this week though I haven't taken very much of it.  I sympathize with everyone on here.  I am a healthcare professional and therefore hide my drug use from EVERYBODY!!!  I have been to treatment about 6 times now and am convinced that I will not go back.  I want to live a better life and am really getting ready to take the plunge! I know what I have to do but it is so hard!!! I see that you guys are battling too and it is comforting to know that I am not alone.  I don't know any of you but all of a sudden, I feel like there is hope for me too.  Also, like everyone else, I routinely suffer with WD symptoms.  I have never heard of tonic water with quinine or valerian root tea but am going to check these out.  If anyone has any suggestions for me, please let me know.  I will be coming back here.  Good luck everybody, we can do this!!! There has to be a better way to live life!!!

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by GreatWhite, Oct 29, 2009
Thank you for the kind words pharma and notsosunny. So glad i found this site! I took two trams this morning and have yet to take anymore for today. I am definitely experiencing some irritable bowels right now and some pain in my back. I am going to try and only take one more for today and take some valerian root for tonight. I want to get my dose down to 3 a day. And then get it down to 2 a day in the next couple of days. These withdrawal symptoms arent as severe yet but i know the worse is yet to come. I think after my class on tuesday night, iam going to take the rest of the week off and try to do it cold turkey. That way I will have 5 days to get through the worst of it without having to worry about work. I think that will definitely help get me in the right direction. I looked up info on the Thomas Recipe and definitely going to get everything ready to beat this thing. If i cannot do this alone, i think a treatment center is in my future because I no longer want to be controlled by these things. My girlfriend has introduced to me a new found faith in God, and that is helping with everything because I know these pills are the devil's way of controlling me! I want to be free and I want to live. But most of all I want to feel. I want to feel sadness, and depression, and hurt, and loss..things that i suppressed with these STUPID PILLS! I want those feelings because those feelings used to teach me lessons. now they are covered up by the devil and his stash of trams! Tonight i am going to try and tell my family about my usage so wish me luck with that, i will post an update hopefully tonight! god bless and keep up the good fight everyone!

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 29, 2009
Great..I think it is wonderful that you have found faith and it will help you along.One of our posters keb77 is a person of faith and always has a thoughtful line of scripture with her posts.She has not posted recently but if you go to previous at the top of the page you can read the posts from thread 17 and she was inspiring with her bible scriptures.You now have accepted a higher power in your healing and I have confidence that everything will work out for you after you get over the bumpy bits.Everyone is on your side and together we will do it.I feel like I keep repeating myself about the rebound pain because it is so true.To ward off the rebound pain take2 extra strength tylenols every 4 hours(max 8/day) and aleve or ibuprofen as directed on package till this pain subsides.My rebound pain was relieved in about a week or 2 and now I hardly have any pain.Certainly nothing that non RX drugs will not take away.Love and healing to all.

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by booba77, Oct 29, 2009
Welcome greatwhite and brighter day.  We are all in this together so anything you need, please ask.  Notsosunny, i have some valerian and will start on it when I get home.  3 trams left and Im free.  

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 29, 2009
Welcome brighterday I am a pharmacist and have been clean from a codeine addiction for approx 6 weeks.I am living proof that one can conquer addictions.I have never been addicted  to tramadol or benzos and feel that maybe my cross was easier to bear than others here.I took T3 for RA  pain and realized that I was looking forward to the high more than the pain relief.Made up my mind that it would stop and tapered from 8 T3/DAY to 2/day then stopped entirely.Did get withdrawal for about 5 to 7 days and rebound pain .I realized that the codeine caused more pain than what it relieved.Got thru rebound with extrastrength tylenols and aleve and now have no rebound at all.I do know that all pain meds can cause some rebound,but narcotics are the worst.I do not get up with a headache or pain any longer and my feet do not throb at the end of a long day on them at work.I still take methotrexate for the RA.but non rx pain meds keep me under control.Narcotics cause more pain than theoriginal pain you take them for if used chronically.I wish you the best and hope you can heallike I did

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 29, 2009
We all stumbled upon this site for a reason Brighterday!!! It had to be meant for us all to find it and each other. This battle is not something that can be won without support and that is for sure. Everyone has really good advice on what has and is working for them. I didn't go the Thomas recipe route but only because I do not have access to Valium..Thank God. I am too easily addicted to things to ever even try to use Benzos. I am struggling with this daily, but it is getting better. Today is better than yesterday..so there is hope!!!!!!! There are some people on here with AWESOME medical experience than can help you more since you are taking Percs and trams. (Man, I used to LOVE Percocet, but never had a problem with them..just LOVED them when I had them kinda thing...) I really don't know what I would do if I had to come off of 2 things at once. I could do it...but right now being in the midst of this tram battle I can't imagine it. BUT YOU CAN DO IT!!!!!!!!!!!! I would suggest stocking up on vitamin/herbal supplements, gator-aid, soup, valerian root (works great for me) or the quinine (which I haven't tried but am thinking about it because of the positive things I have read about it), B-12(or B complex), omegas, St. John's wort, Immodium for the bowel issues, Epsom Salt for hot baths (which I haven't done yet, but am going to get some in a little while), Aleve, Advil, Tylenol...Just be ready and prepare. For some reason today I am also CRAVING vegetables like crazy. It is baffling me. I want to just eat them nonstop. I guess my body needs them. I stocked up on frozen veggies a little while ago so I am going to give in to that craving. LOL...At this point, Day 7 for me, I feel like I am going to throw up when I look at Gator-aid so I stocked up on flavored bottled water to stay hydrated. That is very important. I have been having bad bouts of nausea so I got a couple bags of hard candy to see if that helps. (Sorry, if it seems as though I am babbling, I am just trying to remember as much as I can that has gotten me through this!!!) I have also FORCED myself to maintain a routine of working out. Sometimes it has been a battle to motivate myself but I always have felt better afterwards...even if it was short-lived I was glad to feel better even for a moment!!!! I know there are some things I haven't done that others have and things others haven't done that I have, but I guess it is just finding what works for you to make you feel better through this fight. Others will give input I am sure. This is an amazing place to come to and has helped me so much!!!!

Everyone hang in there and have a great day!!!!  



Avatar universal
by hanginin, Oct 29, 2009
Hello everyone. Notsosunny and I are on our 7th day and I feel so much better. The first few days are awful but this forum and these wonderful people will keep you going. I am also a Pharmacist and I know this is going to be a constant problem but I am not going to let it control me any longer. The quinine everyone is looking for is not available anymore as a rx drug. It was taken off the market. There is a homeopathic medicine that has quinine in it and you can also take calcium and magnesium for the cramps.  Everyone stay strong and have a wonderful day

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 29, 2009
One last comment and I have to go to make my costume for halloween.Back to the pain issue..which is why most of us got started on these narcotics and I include tramadol in this category..I have noticed that after the initial rebound pain has subsided not one poster has complained about or commented on ongoing pain that can not be relieved.I have not read a single post where someone says..gee the pain is so bad that I am tempted to go back to the narcs.Maybe we have learned to bear a little more or we exaggerated our pain to justify our use of narcs.I think it is a little of everything,rebound is now minimal and we are able to relieve pain with non rx meds or other means.We are learning to structure our live around the pain,minimalize it as much as possible and get on with it without a dull fog in our brains.I see customers every day who are allergic to codeine and handling chronic pain with non narcotics.These people do not increase their pain meds like we did with narcs.Goes to show you that chronic narc use CAUSES pain,not relief.

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by Lillyval, Oct 29, 2009
notsosunny - It sounds like you've had a tough couple of days.  Good for you for being able to rise above it and still be here helping others.

Newway - I identify with you anxiety about your doctor.  Even though my doctor STILL doesn't get it that tram. is addictive, his assistant gave me a script for a tapering schedule.  So don't feel that all hope is lost.  Tell them what you need.  We have to FIGHT to get ourselves sane and healthy again.

A couple of days ago someone asked if it's worth it to go on Suboxone.   (There's been so many posts I don't remember who it was).  I believe this is a forum of people who want to get off all drugs, not just tramadol.  That being said, my answer is that it has been TOTALLY worth it for me. I've only been on it for 2 weeks and I have suffered no withdrawals, no brain fog, and no drug cravings.  Tram is the farthest thing from my mind.  I'm already below the lowest "maintenance" dose and am ready to drop lower.  I'm not high or impaired in any way.  I just feel NORMAL for the first time in years.  I have no plan to stay on it.  I plan to reduce my dose with each doctor visit (every 3 weeks).  After having gone through the hell of withdrawal myself - I cringe seeing some of you going through it.  For those of you who are good candidates (drug history, long time use, high doses or previous attempts to quit) I would absolutely consider the medical option.

Chrissie - last but not least my heart is with you.  You have suffered long and hard.  But you have such fight in you.  I hope you feel better each coming day.
God bless,
Lilly

Avatar universal
by brighterdayahead, Oct 29, 2009
Thanks booba, pharma, and notsosunny!!!  I really appreciate the support and information.  I know I can do this, I just wish I could get over the feeling of impending doom regarding withdrawal.  I have felt so isolated for so long it feels so good just to have some folks that understand where I am coming from. I know I can do this, I thank GOD for stumbling upon this sight, maybe I'm just losing it but I think it was a God send. I lost my mother to a drug OD when she was 45 and am so afraid that the same may happen to me if I don't get off this stuff!! Talk to you guys soon, ya'll stay strong and have a great day!!! I can't wait until I can be free!!!

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by forget_me_not, Oct 29, 2009
Brighterday, the support and information you will find here are sooo incredibly helpful.  I did this without any support -- told my family that I was sick when they asked what was wrong.  I am now 54 days out cold turkey and can promise you it gets SO much better.  I actually feel pretty "normal" now most of the time - and that's something I never thought I would be able to say about myself after three years of tramadol and klonopin.  Quit both cold turkey on the same day, and it's been an experience through which I've am forever changed.

Blessings to you.  Stay strong and let the wonderful people here help you when you need it.

~fmn

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by GreatWhite, Oct 29, 2009
I got through the entire mid-morning and mid-afternoon without taking a single pill. first time in a while. I definitely need to take one more before I sleep but im so happy I could do it. The pain is here but not as bad as I thought it would be. I definitely know I can DO this. I want to just zip through to week 3 already and be over it but tonight iam going to flush all the ones down the drain I dont need anymore so I have no other options. I am going away this weekend so its impossible for me to go cold turkey this weekend, but when I get back, it is ON!!!! I am going to keep reducing my intake every single day until i get to 1.5 or 1 and then iam done for good! everyone in here is awesome and so glad i found you guys. Keep up the support and loving words because they truly are an encouragement to me knowing other people are going through the same things and have made it out on the other side even better!

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 29, 2009
Finished my costume...just a quick sew job and want to say a word of encouragement to greatwhite.Today is the beginning of your new clean life and future going forward.You have taken an improtant step and keep up the good work with faith and hope.

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 29, 2009
Way to go Warriors.  For you who are new here, you've found the right place.  I continue to receive great inspiration from the folks here and I hope all of you will too.

Greatwhite:  when I jumped, I did so by flushing my supply.  I called it the Flush of Freedom.  It certainly isn't the best method for everyone, but it worked for me.  I suppose it provided a kind of symbolic closure.  

Power and Prayers to all of you.

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 29, 2009
I just wanted to take the time to say one HUGE collective THANK YOU to everyone for all the kind words and encouragement. It is great having somewhere to come to and everyone understands and supports you!!! It means the world!!!



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by booba77, Oct 29, 2009
I agree notsosunny.  This place is wonderful.  If I had not come back and read all of the posts, I would have placed another order, spiralling myself into deeper debt and depression because of these terrible pills.  I have taken my last 3 trams, and am totally out.  I have no brain fog, but am irritable as hell, but I am finally free.  In an hour i will be going to my little girl's daycare Halloween Bash-candy and cake walk, here we come.  If I feel too bad to work tomorrow, I will call in, but i am going to try to go in.  It has been hard to jump with my parents across the country, because even though they don't know about my addiction, they are a huge part of my life.  I am lucky to have supportive, loving people around me, but because of the debt I have dug myself in ordering these trams online, I cannot bring myself to tell my spouse or my parents.  I guess I hate myself in a way, and hate what I have done to us financially.  My husband has $16,000 worth of medical debt, but he could not help that as he has to closely be watched when he gets sick because of the tetralogy of fallot he had on his heart when he was a baby., andhere  I have dug us in debt because of a stupid addiction.  Telling him about my addiction would mean also telling him that I have financially crippled us, and I don't have the balls to do that right now.  Wow-that was hard to get out but I feel like telling you at least makes me aknowledge it.  I deserve however horrible withdrawal is going to be.  I honestly feel like my life has fallen apart.  If you could see my house, you would understand.  I used to be such a clean freak.  I want to pull myself together.  I want my daughter to see me as a strong person, the person I used to be, I guess, before these drugs turned me into a zombie with no motivation.  I better get off of here.  Work is overwhelming, but that is good for me.  i tend to feed off of the stress here at work.  I am lucky to have a great job.  I work at a construction company-mostly filling out bids for jobs and billing, reviewing timesheets, cleaning the attic, etc.  My office is the landfill of work.  If no one wants to do it-give it to me.  But it is my second home, well, maybe third now that I have found you guys.......I better jump.  I may be able to get one more DBE letter finished before the party.  Thank you guys, for listening to me.  I'm sure I will be filling up the boards tomorrow, as the first of the WD's start to get more intense.  Thanks for all the well-wishing.

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 29, 2009
Congrats Booba! You took the leap and we are all here to be your life preserver.... Eventhough I "stashed" money aside here and there for my pills I KNOW that with the money I have spent on this addiction over the years we could have so much more! I justified ordering trams online because before I was doing that I was doctor shopping, paying the office vists so I wouldn't turn it in on our insurance, paying out of pocket for the prescriptions and then buying them from people when I ran out. So in my mind I was saving us money with the trams. I have made every excuse in the book to continue using and justifying it.
It is just sickening to think of all the money gone! I am a stay home mommy so my husband is the sole bread winner and it hasn't been fair to him. It isn't fair to my kids and really I haven't been fair to myself! I have robbed myself of many good years because of pill addiction. I was thinking earlier that my youngest child has never seen me "clean & sober"!!! Of course she has no clue because pills can be easily hidden and kids don't understand about the addictive aspect. I know, though, it makes me very sad NOW that when I moan or groan about hurting she will tell me to go take my medicine. I do feel ashamed, but I have stopped the tram train and she has no clue what I am going through at all. I am hiding it fairly well or either I am indeed feeling better! Not sure yet! :) My teens do know and I have been honest with them for their benefit and also so they would understand that if I became a raging lunatic and went off the chain that it wasn't something they did and for them to just bear with me through this. They've been great!!! Booba, cut yourself some slack..In fact, cut yourself ALOT of slack!!! What you're feeling right now is just the feeling of dread an anxiety. It will pass. It will!!!! Telling your husband is something you may want to do or may never want to do. That is your choice. Don't do it any time soon if it is going to bring undue stress and turmoil into the tram battle. Baby steps and one step at a time!!!!!!!!!!! My house is still a mess and I will clean it when I clean it. If my company doesn't like it then they are welcome to clean it for me..LOL..J/K..Seriously though, I will tidy up before their arrival but I refuse to obsess and worry about right this moment. Right this second my back hurts and I feel like I have a krink in my neck so housework can wait for now. Just literally take it one day at a time and don't bombard yourself with more than you can physically or emotionally handle. If you have to call in to work then call in..Sunday would be a good day for you to try to get some good therapeutic sleep if your husband is off work. Funny thing for me is that I can sleep during the day when I am in withdraws, just not at night. Weird, huh? I can't sleep for long, but I can lay down and take little cat naps. Anyway, I know I am here and everyone else is too for support! It is helping me more than I ever imagined possible coming here. I am still very much so struggling, but I promise you it IS getting better. I, too, have a Halloween function tomorrow with the kids from 3pm-6pm and I was telling them earlier in the week not to count on going & NOT TO TELL THEIR LITTLE SISTER ABOUT IT!!! I didn't want her to know about it and then disappoint her by not going because of my situation. Now, I am looking forward to going and having a good time and so are the kids. I am looking forward to alot now. I am going to take the money that I would have spent on trams every month and make it a point to pay extra on a bill and do something nice for the family and myself. I have BIG plans for the future and I am feeling more optimistic NOW that I will be able to achieve them! No more of my rambling! Thanks for listening everyone! To everyone jumping today...CONGRATS! To everyone who has already taken the leap...CONGRATS!

Hangin....Day 8 for us tomorrow! YAY us! Hang in there!

Avatar universal
by chrissie145, Oct 29, 2009
I have just caught up with the posts - quite a marathon.(Talking of marathons -  where are you Polly?)
Blessings to all you brave people! (And especially Newway - great progress!)

I am 96 days clean of tramadol (C/T) and 58 days clean of diazepam (rapid 10 day taper) And as my special people know I am not having a good time! Its not just that I am very uncomfortable due to the usual stuff - but now I am TERRIFIED too! I saw a drugs doctor on Tuesday and he told me that as I had done such a fast taper I could be looking at 18 months w/d. And then today I tried to find a benzo support group through a helpline (no luck) and the 'expert' on there told me that even if i had tapered I would be 2 years before I was better - and now I could expect even longer. I am trying to believe she is an idiot - but in truth she heads up a well respected organisation in the UK and is often speaking on radio and in newspapers. On the other hand folk on here have been much better after 6 months -so maybe she is an idiot (Any ideas?) I had prepared myself for 6 months - but 2 years feels impossible.

But....back to tramadol and I want to tell you about a recent development that confirms all we already know about the evil drug. A year ago, whilst colleagues lowered a huge industrial freezer down a stair well, my son guided it. The rope broke and the thing fell on top of him.  Since then he has been unable to work, in  a great deal of pain - and needs a stick to walk. In spite of seeing numerous specialists in the UK he has not recovered and has in fact got worse. This week he went with his wife to her home country of Poland. A doctor with an excellent reputation had agreed to see him. (It will be no surprise to you to learn that the drug they put him on here was the evil tramadol) . He has taken between 400 and 800mg for over a year. During this time he has got worse physically, become very depressed and lost 50% of his eyesight.

The Polish doctor took one look at him and asked his wife (in Polish) if my son always looked that way. He said that it was like he had a dead man sitting in his office!!!  His examination revealed multiple problems, but his final words were "you are dying from the drugs you are on - they are killing you". My son has become like a zombie with no emotion or expression. The doctor thinks he can help - but only if the drugs go. So last night my boy went cold turkey off tramadol. I had been talking to him abot this since my C/T in July. But he was in so much pain he couldnt comprehend coming off. Now he has jumped. I so respect his courage - but I am very concerned. He has multiple injuries and now no pain relief. He will fly back to England on Saturday and go back to Poland at Chroistmas for the rest of his treatment. I am convinced that he would have recovered by now if it had not been for the tramadol. It has caused far more problems than it has relieved.

So, if you needed any confirmation that we are all doing the VERY BEST thing by getting off these wretched pills - you now have it!  

Keep fighting on - its better than being dead - whilst still breathing!

Thank you Lilly. You never forget me and I am grateful!
Chrissie




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by GreatWhite, Oct 29, 2009
So got done with work today, which i was really agitated with because today was the first day in a long time that I didnt take one pill during the day. I took a half at 3pm, so 25mg, and went to the gym to workout. Had a great workout, took a hot shower and loved every second of it. My back is hurting a lot, and so are my legs and i am definitely having trouble sitting still but all in all in good spirits at the moment. I went to GNC after the gym and got Valerian tea (stuff is stinking up my room right now), Calcium with Magnesium and Vitamin B, tylenol extra stregth, Fish Oil, and acidophilopous for pooping silly. So thats my Power Pack for now during the time i wean my dosage down and eventually quit altogether. I am hoping to get down to 1 a day by Monday so wish me luck in that. After I get down to one, Iam only taking one until Tuesday then taking the rest of the week off, just going to make up a story to my job, and jump completely off of them. So for now, it is minor withdrawal symptoms. If anyone knows any uplifting music that helped them get through this, please recommend, i want to download some tunes to help me through this...love to all and luck to all. God Bless. Remember, You can Do all Things through Christ Who Strengthens you!!!
-Chris

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 29, 2009
GreatWhite....Rise Above This by Seether is my theme song right now. You will love that one...You guys should all listen to it I just listened to it and it just fits so appropriately. .

I just bought the new Pearl Jam song called Fixer! I love it!

I like to listen to older Creed stuff when I am feeling down for some reason..I like My Own Prison by them....

I just put all the Kings of Leon songs I could find on my ipod. Love them!!!!

~The past week I have listened to alot of my daughters' mix CD's just to make myself feel a little more lively..But Pink,  Beyonce and Miley Cyrus might not be your thing. LOL...~

Music is an amazing escape for sure!!!!




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by JG525, Oct 29, 2009
Hi everyone! I've enjoyed reading everyone's posts.  Chris- Not sure how you're tapering so much...good for you! I'm supposed to be on two pills now, but today I took 4, yesterday day 3 (50mg).  It's so silly really, but it's just a compulsion.  Tonight I had to drive over a bridge and they freak me out a bit because I'm not used to them.  I've noticed since I've been tapering, my anxiety is worse.  I know once I stop and give it some time, the anxiety will be better.

I had enough pills to take two a day until Thursday, actually a little more.  I might still including the ER, but not if I can't stop responding to the cravings.  I just keep thinking, who cares if I run out, I might as well take them if I can.  But they don't do anything to me!

Ugh...I just wish we could all hole up in a luxury mountain retreat where they give massages LOL...I guess that's probably what some detoxes are like, but I just want a spa where I can avoid life for 3-7 days :).

J

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by hanginin, Oct 29, 2009
Hello everyone. Another day in the books. I am looking forward to day 8 tomorrow. Today has been rough. My Grandmother is sick and we had to take her to the hospital and it seems any time I have any stress I look at things in the worst possible way. Without this group I would have been back on the trams but I knew I could get home and see what gigantic hurdles everyone is making and I simply will not weaken. Thanks so much for the words of hope, love and faith that this site gives every day. Notsosunny. We start our week 2 tomorrow.
Hanginin

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by janesweet, Oct 29, 2009
I am new to this site.  I was on Suboxone and found it much harder to get off than tramadol.  I can tell my disease has progressed as it was much easier to withdawl from this a year ago!  I s down to 5 a day (50 mg) and my husband hud the pills and like a good addict I found them and have taken a lot teh past two days.  i am emted to just stop cold turkey as I want my life back so much.  I clearly have no control over this addiction.
My other concern is that the folks where I order this stff from continuall contact me.  i wish this was a controlled drug as it is so addictive and dangerous.  
I read Emily's post about going cold tukey and I wonder how much she was taking before she just stopped.

I go to AA meetings and have since I was 20.  I was a heroin addict until I was 25 and thankfully never retrned to that drug!
I was so motivated, I went back to college and grad school and did exceptionally well.

I am marrried with two children and have a blessed life except for tis huge monkey on my back.  Anyone have any suggestions about detoxing and/or just doing a "cold turkey:?

My doctor tried to convince me to stay on sub and even on 4mgs. I was constipatd everyday and trying to come off of that was like methadone.

Thank you all for your posts!  it's great not being so alone in this.

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by madtram, Oct 30, 2009
Welcome Jane, ("Sweet Jane" is one of my fav. songs, esp. the Cowboy Junkies version.)

You are already ahead of some of us naifs who had never withdrawn from anything, in that you know that no matter how hellish the process, all these "sleeping with camels & hanging out at 24 hour Mai Tai bars", (credit Emily Post), withdrawals do come to an end.

The cold turkey or taper decision is an individual mix of personality type; physiology; being open to experiencing bad flu-like symptoms for a few days; & level of addiction, (many who are addicted find it impossible to taper).  Length of time on tramadol & average dose level can also contribute to the severity of withdrawals.

Emily was on 6-10ish 50 mgs when she quit cold turkey, I was on 6ish.  We both had relatively long withdrawals but we had also been on them for at least 5 years & had been prescribed benzos for the tramadol side effects which complicates withdrawal for sure.  Fred came off a similar dose & had a shorter period of intense withdrawal, (Fred's journals are also an excellent guide book for the realities of cold turkey).

Plenty of people have gone cold turkey off much higher doses, (most recently Hillbilly & Tramman).  People have also used very slow gradual tapers & got to the end with virtually no side effects at all but you must be 100% committed all the time to go this way.  If you find yourself "borrowing pills" from future days allocation, tapering is probably not for you.

If you decide on cold turkey, get stocked up with the Thomas recipe & odds are reasonable that in just one week, you will be tramadol free & feeling the worst is behind you.  From that point, there is so much to look forward to.

Chrissie, so sorry to hear about your son but hopefully you will start to see some improvement now that he is off the tramadol.  As for the benzo websites, I agree with Emily that they are very scary which can have its disadvantages.   The tapering manuals & advice about supplements are definitely worth taking on board, however, suggesting to someone not to expect recovery for 2 years, (no use at all IMO). The mind-body connection is much more powerful than that & there are many things we can do to support our neurochemical recovery.

I recommend Norman Doidge's "The brain that changes itself", to anyone who is interested in how to improve the health of your brain.  For inspiration & appreciating how much recovery is possible from the most severe levels of brain damage, read Jill Taylor-Bolte's "My stroke of Insight".  This knowledge that our brain's are much more adaptive that was thought is still very new but just as real as the discovery that the earth was round.  Provide your brain with the best environment for recovery & you will do so much better than 2 years.  Benzo experts are well meaning & useful but they too have their agendas.  They want it to be understood how much damage the drugs can do but if an expert tells people to expect that it will take 2 years to recover, this will have a lot of influence at the sub-conscious level.

This is going to sound very bossy & is not directed at you Chrissie but is what I believe & try to do myself & perhaps someone will find it useful.  Changing your brain is like physical exercise, sometimes it will hurt.  You need to push yourself by learning a new language or skill, do the hardest Suduko or cryptic crosswords, use CBT techniques to improve your way of thinking.

Lastly, it's never too late to improve your health with vigorous exercise.  The September, 2009, issue of Metabolism reports a study of older women where all participants achieved the cardiovascular and metabolic capabilities of women 16 years younger, after a 12 week program of exer-cycling for 1 hour, 5 days a week.

Sunny & Hangin, day 8, way to go.

Avatar universal
by FinallyFred, Oct 30, 2009
Hello Tramadol Warriors!

Since there are so many new people here, I thought it might  be informative to drop in a couple of definitions that may be of interest:

Addiction is a neurobiological disease that has genetic, psychosocial, and environmental factors. It is characterized by one or more of the following behaviors:

Poor control over drug use
Compulsive drug use
Continued use of a drug despite physical, mental and/or social harm
A craving for the drug

Physical dependence is the body's adaptation to a particular drug. In other words, the individual's body gets used to receiving regular doses of a certain medication. When the medication is abruptly stopped or the dosage is reduced too quickly, the person will experience withdrawal symptoms. Although we tend to think of opioids when we talk about physical dependence and withdrawal, a number of other drugs not associated with addiction can also result in physical dependence (i.e., antidepressants, beta blockers, corticosteroids, etc.) and can trigger unpleasant withdrawal symptoms if stopped abruptly.

Tolerance is a condition that occurs when the body adapts or gets used to a particular medication, lessening its effectiveness. When that happens, it is necessary to either increase the dosage or switch to another type of medication in order to maintain pain relief."

***

Jane,   Welcome to our sometimes happy but always real home.  It's interesting (though not surprising) that you said that suboxone was harder to get off than tramadol.  I would say more, but I am bitting my tongue at the moment.  

I too am a recovering alcoholic and a grateful member of AA.  The same doctor who told me once that "if you don't stop drinking, it's gonna kill you" prescribed this "safe" tramadol to me a few years after I got sober.   I took 400 mg./day for six years, never ordered online, built up a powerful tolerance, was definately "dependant" and probably "addicted".  I fear it is...um...in my nature.   During the last several years I was in nearly constant PAIN due to the tolerance I had built up to the drug.   AT the beginning of every 21 day rx cycle in later years, I was always desperate to feel less UNWELL, so I would take 10-12 pills/day.   I knew I was borrowing tomorrow's pills on those days, but I didn't care.   I had poor control over my use of tramadol.  Thinking back, it's hard to say whether I "craved the drug" or simply wanted to feel less unwell.  But my reality was that the last 4-5 days of EVERY rx cycle, I was on a forced taper to like 4 pills/day.  

Those days were never happy times.  At the time, I didn't recognize that  I was partially withdrawing. I just knew I felt like I had the flu, I couldn't sleep, I had RLS, indegestion, etc. etc.  I can't tell you how many times a day I counted my precious few pills left.  Always hoping beyond hope that I might find the "one that got away", at the bottom of the drawer, under car seats, etc.  Rarely did I strike gold however.  

EVERY person now on trams really has one of three choices:  (1) continue at your same dose and continue to experience regular withdrawal symptoms.  (2) Order and take large quanties of this drug to cover your increasing tolerance to the drug (you WILL be back later however), or (3) figure out a way to get free of this drug.

My personal belief is that people like me are incapable of managing a successful taper.   I SO welcome EVERONE to try to taper and I am a little jealous of those who have successfully pulled it off.  

When I got here last November, I discovered that I was not unique.   I read stories just like mine and felt part of the community here.   I wondered at first if I ws "permitted" to shae something. Because in those first days, I didn't have a great deal to offer.  But one day, I cased to be a "lurker" and began posting here.  

I realized that those symptoms I had felt for so many months/years were withdrawal symptoms.  Go figure!   That was thousands of posts ago and there were one of two people tapering at the time, but I gravitated to the stories of people like me, who had been unsuccessful in even staying at their prescribed dose, let alone managing a gradual taper.

Everyone has their own reasons for quitting this drug.  Some stop for financial reasons.  Others have had seizures and nearly killed people while driving.   I had a near miss while on my motorcycle and as horns honked at me, I discovered that I had made a left turn in front of an oncoming vehicle.  I recall one woman who had an accident due to a seizure while on this drug.   Others try to stop for their spouse, friend, or partner.  Some are simply tired of living in the zombie zone.

My reason for stopping was that I SIMPLY could no longer go through those hellish last several days of every rx cycle.   I am a real workoholic but I found myself struggling to push through work those last days of every rx cycle in the end.  Insomnia was horrible the last days of every rx cycle.   I WANTED to curl up in a ball and call in sick every day those last days of every rx cycle and I was finding that I actually had to take a sick day every few months when my insomnia left me to tired and achy to work.   I had had my experience with forced tapers and it wasn't pretty.

I read stories in Emily's early journal entries by people like Cadillac Jack, who said that the only way to be successful in defeating this drug was to declare a personal all out WAR on the drug.   And what gave me HOPE, was that I learned that if somehow I could just string 5-6 days together without taking the lovely little white pill, I would no longer have to face those reoccurring withdrawal symptoms ever again.

To find Emily's early journal entries, go to the top of the thread and click on "journals", then "see all".  Keep clicking "next" atthe top right of these pages and you will keep going back to her earliest entires (June 2008?).  Read those if you haven't already done so.  

I posted like a mad man that first week.    I recently captured many of my early journal entries on my profile page if anyone is interested in reading about my journey.   What I recall is that I immediately began reaching out to the others here.  I discovered that when I remained focused on "service" and community, I was less focused on my own withdrawal.

And just as others promised, withdrawal WAS hard, but it didn't last forever.   By the 5th or 6th day, I was feeling so much better than I EVER felt during EACH of my rx cycle withdrawal periods.   Today I get to plan vacations out of town without regard to my supply of pills.   I no longer need to go hat in hand to my doctors' to have prescriptions renewed.   And as hard is that first 5-6 days was, I have avoided all of that pain and suffering every day over the past eleven months.  If I had known of the solution sooner, I would have quit years before.

The first 24 hours of cold turkey isn't actually too bad since one is well rested and we still have the drug in our system.   By the second day, it get's ugly.  By day three you are suffering from the cumullative afects of not sleeping.  "Kicking at the sheets" as someone said.  If one manages to string 3-4 days together, one begins to ask, "how much longer will this last?"  And the answer at that point, is "not much longer".  At that point, one is frighteningly close to the end, so if that's you, push on and you will be free of the affects of this drug if you can endure yet another day or two.  

My philosophy was and is that  unless we gear up for a terribly difficult fight, we are doomed from the start.  No amount of effort short of an all out war will succeed.   I surely experimented with my share of items of the "Thomas Recipe".  But I didn't expect that the way out would be easy, soft or kind.   Speaking only for myself, I know that I would NEVER have made it through without making this BATTLE the most important thing in my life for a week.  Eyes that seek an easy way out will probably nver make it to the other side called FREEDOM.

Personally, I can't imagine working that first week.  Kudos to those who do work while they are withdrawing, but I could not have done so.   I also cannot imagine trying to do this sort of WAR on trams without the knoweldge and support of a spouse or loved one.  Not that such people often truly understand what it's really like, but it does help some.   Try not to fast forward, but remain in the moment.  Sometimes all I could do was to NOT use tramadol in that one tiny moment.  But moments turn into hours, which turn into days.  And one day soon, you too can look back on this as something in the past.

Good luck to you all, whereever you are at in this battle.  red




Avatar universal
by FinallyFred, Oct 30, 2009
That's fred, not red!  LOL
Good Night to all...

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Aw Fred...we love you

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by hanginin, Oct 30, 2009
Good Words Fred. I start day 8 today and I feel much better this morning. I know if I get weak or have any problems I can come to this site and it will give me the encouragement I need to keep going. Good luck to everyone today and lets
all stay strong together.
Hanginin

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
I got up bright and early and read all the new posts.Just love to hear from everyone esp Fred,cause he is so full of wisdom and understanding.You are so right Fred,those good moments turn into hours,then to days and soon you will even stop counting each day.I have lost all interest in the fleeting high that narcotics give.Been there,done that..I wake up every morning with a high of living and a lightness in my body.The tenseness in my shoulders is gone and I feel good.Now that I have experienced the lack of rebound pain,I no longer need anything stronger than non rx stuff.I can't guarantee that I will never feel pain,but have been able to cope without the narcs.I have never taken antidepressants or benzos and only a couple tramadols and probably have not experienced as intense withdrawal as others here altho it did last 5-7 days with sweats,RLS,rebound pain,lack of sleep,no depression though.I was not tempted once to go back to the pills because I had flushed them all.We only get one life to live and I want to make it as good as possible.This is Friday another day closer to the weekend ,but I have to work all weekend...and another day past us.Happy healing to every single one of us and keep fighting everyone.

1090333 tn?1264512093
by GreatWhite, Oct 30, 2009
Last night was difficult. My gf came over to give me comfort, but touching someone when they are craving that drug so bad, just sent pins and needles down my body. I ended up taking only 2.5 yesterday until last night when the cravings and RLS got so bad that I had to take another half to actually sit still long enough to fall asleep. If i didnt have work today i definitely wouldve fought that urge. I am interested to know what some of you who quit did at night when you could not sleep or sit still. Almost impossible to sit still and watch movies, I constantly was standing up and walking around in circles. so if anyone has any suggestions i would love to hear them. I even took valerian and drank a valerian tea, made me drowsy and when I finally did fall asleep I did sleep through the night. My goal for today is only to take 2. One in morning and one at night. In between I am taking tylenol extra strength. I used to only take 2 a day. I am definitely positive I can do it because I did it yesterday. The only problem is I have to go away this weekend to a wedding that I already committed to. So I cannot go CT this weekend but Tuesday iam taking the rest of the week off to give myself at least 5 days of being sick. Tuesday is my CT day! Let the BATTLE BEGIN!!!I cannot wait to get this devil drug out of my system for good. the only thing that really scares me is the nights because you are all alone and cannot sit still or sleep and nights are lonnnnngggg when you cannot do either of those things. You guys are a all a real inspiration and I hope to get my tapering down to 1.5 or 1 by Tuesday. Keep fighting all of you, here is a good statistic for you: 45-50 million people have abused prescription drugs at one point or another. So you are definitely not alone! God Bless and remember "You can do all things through Christ who strengthens you!"
-chris

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 30, 2009
Good Morning All! Hangin...we made it to Day EIGHT!!!

I hope everyone has a great Friday and another wonderful day of healing.

I am having a BAD morning. It would be bad with or without trams so that has nothing to do with it. Just NOTHING has gone right and EVERYTHING has gone wrong...Down to not finding my car keys and looking everywhere except my purse, which is where they were. Just one of those mornings. But it is early and it will get better!!!! I have certainly proven to myself that I can indeed handle the little stresses of life that the trams used to just numb for me.

Well, I am off to the store to get some coffee. I haven't had any yet...May be one reason I am so ill and irritated. LOL..

Peace and healing to EVERYONE!!!!!

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 30, 2009
Sweet Jane (love that song too) - the taper vs cold turkey decision is indeed a personal one.  I was on a taper program but quickly noticed I was already withdrawing, so I flushed my supply and jumped.  I figured if I was going to go through that, then I'd just as soon go through it clean.  I'm now 45 days out and, even though some days are better than others, each day is a little better.

Great White - you might want to also get lopamiradine (Imodium) for the trots.  I haven't heard of the stuff you did get, but I know lopamiradine is very close to opiates in its effect on small and large intestines.

Notsosunny & Hanginin - 8 days!!!!  Fantastic!  



Avatar universal
by newway, Oct 30, 2009
So much suffering and wisdom in the same place.  I am also a member of AA, and know the power of the group - the support, the feeling of belonging.
I do find that on-line - at least for me, I am a bit less inhibited, more honest with my thoughts and emotions.  I love when I have the time to go over the posts, read them and see where people truely are.  In Face to face meetings I am a bit more reserved, a little shy.

I am one of those few trying to taper - I have done the CT thing of opiates a few times and T once.  I have no idea how you all manage the Tram CT.  I could not handle the darkness, the depression that came with it.  I am an addict - so if left to my own devices I would borrow from tomorrow.  I just got to the point where getting off this **** was the most important thing in my life - so I have someone holding the pills.  I was able to do the first bit of the taper myself - the drop from about 20 pills to about 12 - I was very determined and it was very gradual - I didn't notice many withdrawal effects - but now that I am down to 10 per day (I know it sounds horrible - but that is half of what I was taking) I am starting to feel more of the withdrawal - still pretty manageable - but enough that I would be tempted to take "just one more" - so someone else is in charge.  I am not sure which will be harder for me - the withdrawal, or letting someone else have control. lol
I often tell my parnter I have finely tuned leadership skillls that don't like to be questioned!  Being a control freak - um I mean, having finely tuned leadership skills and an addiction is a battle in itself.  To actually admit I couldn't take care of this on my own - wake up in the morning - make a deal with myself that I will only take so many pills, or only take them when my back hurts.  If I wasn't so stuborn I would have reached out long ago for support.  I think the first time I found this web site was over a year ago - I read a few posts - thought - nope I am better than that, I can do this on my own - and put in another year of tram h*ll.

Keep fighting all!

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 30, 2009
Coffee is now brewing and I think I hear angels singing...LOL..Caffeine and nicotine have been what has kept me from going nuts as nasty as a habit as they are they have been my sanity...Anyway..I am already feeling a little sigh of relief from my H*LL morning. I think I am even going to surprise my daughter at school and go have lunch with her. I was kinda nasty to everyone this morning so I want to do something to make it up to her..and probably ease my conscience as well. Well, whatever reason it would just be nice to surprise her for lunch.

Stay Strong Everyone!!!!! :)



Avatar universal
by TRAMMAN999, Oct 30, 2009
I am back posting after going through the 5 Day War. In fact, I'm on day 9 now. What I have read of others, Yes, they are pleased the tough withdrawal symptoms have passed and say they feel a little better each day. Well, I'm on Day 9 as I mentioned, and I feel whacked out, don't have any drive, and quite miserable! I still have that feeling that if I just took 100mg Tram I would be up and running; aghhhh!!!    To me this is a bad sign. Means I am not getting on with life without the Tram. (still addicted, though clean, so to speak). God forbid I do not want to go through all that again - so what's going on - what can I do? I know I should be trying hard to be busy and to exercise, but I just aint got it.
Is it the fact that I was on a high dose for so long that my body & mind have just shut down? Were my expectations too much? I got these expectations from c/t people's comments on this site!?
I've got to improve if only for one thing - my psychiatrist insisted that I should NOT go c/t. He will have great pleasure in saying ' I told you so'. However, that's beside the point because I 'could not' do his taper.
I'm taking vitamins, but my sleep is horrendous. I'm on Mirtazapine 45mg (the doc says that should see me through the night). I can't even get to sleep. Last night took ambien, Clonazepam & the Mirtazepam & couldn't fall asleep).
Any suggestions, comments etc  - or just to tell me this is the way it is (for a while!!).

I am thinking about booba today she's working on first day of c/t - get thru  this day and collapse for the weekend booba.

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 30, 2009
Indeed, Tram, I too am praying for booba today as she jumps.

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by GreatWhite, Oct 30, 2009
Tramman thats awesome man..9 days mustve been rough. But hang in there. From what ive read of other people's posts there are lingering effects after a few weeks still. It most likely is, if not definitely is, from the amount you were taking for so long. Think about it, only 9 days clean after all those years and all those pills>? of course your body is going to need more than 9 days to adjust. I had a horrible night's sleep last night, and i am constantly checking this website today for encouragement and inspiration. 9 days!! man just say that in your head! I wish i was at 9 days right now! I am only tapering off, taking only 2 pills today once in morn and once at night, and it *****! So when i finally jump on Tuesday, the only thing that really is going to be tough for me is the sleepless nights! But you know what, you have come so far, dont look back, only look forward. The hardest part is over. From other people's post they say they have good days, bad days, and some in between, so i will pray for those good days to come sooner than later! Hang in there man, your doing way better than a lot of people. Keep up the war and i look forward to joining you on the other side of the Battlefield! Just wondering but how much sleep would you say you have gotten in the past 9 days?
-Chris

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 30, 2009
Guys, I was just reading up on Tramadol and how dangerous it is. This article I am reading suggested that Tramadol addicts, in particuliar, go the Waismann Method (being put to sleep and having withdrawals triggered while asleep/sedated), if possible, to detox because of the dangers. It also said that no matter what the dangers of detoxing are it is still far less dangerous than continuing to take the tramadol. I am still reading, but I just wanted to say that I truly had no clue that this pill was so dangerous. I am quickly finding out, though. I wish it were that easy that we could all just go and be put to sleep and wake up healed..Wouldn't that just be grand?!?! Ok, I am going back to reading. Keep in mind everyone that we are doing something that so many people simply can't do and most of us are going it alone except for the support here. We must really be some pretty strong people to do this..Stronger than we thought!!!!

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Tram..It is quite normal to constantly think about the tramadol,but you have been clean for 9 days...Just think how much you have accomplished and how it will soon be over.Do not be discouraged because you still think about the pill because this is normal.You will think about it less and less as time goes on.You are getting on in life without the tramadol and will continue to do so.You just hit a bumpy part in the road.Great...If the sleepless nights alone bother you...you can console yourself in knowing that you are at least not disturbing anyone else's sleep by being so restless.Any tiny or big step that each one of us takes in the right direction is a huge step in our eventual healing.

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 30, 2009
GreatWhite..I just saw your post where you asked for some suggestions as to what to do in the eveings when you are restless..I have struggled with this. My mind races in the evening and that is when my cravings and anxiety are the worst. I have a husband and kids that I have to focus on so that takes up alot of my time..Until they go to bed and then I am on my own. I have utilized my DVD collection ALOT. We also have Comcast cable which offers a service called ONDEMAND which has hundreds of free movies every month and I have used that alot. ONDEMAND also has TV shows on there so I have gone back and watched TV shows that I have missed seeing when they were on. This has helped me kinda escape reality and take my mind off things at least for a little while anyway. I have also had the book Cure For the Common Life for about 3 years now and I just started reading it last night. Before I realized it 2 hours had gone by. I had forgotten how wonderful and relaxing reading could be. I also work out early evening and do as much cardio as I can. Hot baths have helped momentarily with the muscle and joint aches so I always take a very hot bath around 9pm-11pm. Depending on when things slow down with the family and I can fit it in. Being a chic I can also pass time doing the whole beauty regimin thing. You know..pluck my eyebrows, paint my nails and toes, pamper my skin, touch up my roots.....Those are just a few things that have helped me cope. I had a horrible time falling asleep last night but once I fell asleep I did sleep through the night..well, by that time it was morning. Any sleep is better than no sleep!!! By the way, I am sorry I didn't warn you about the smell of the valerian root. It is quite putrid. It also works like catnip on cats. I found that out when I dropped my bottle and my cat went haywire when she started sniffing them. I got a laugh out of that. She went nuts. I read up on it and found out that is wasn't harmful to cats and some people actually used it instead of catnip for their felines. Just a little valerian root trivia there.

I try to be as positive as possible, but we all know it is a struggle. I admire anyone who can taper. I lack the willpower. If it is available I would abuse it. Justify it by telling myself that I am gonna withdraw anyway so I may as well TRY to get a buzz before they were gone. Just crazy thinking! I would sometimes take more right before my supply ran out. I think just out of frustration and desperation I would take more of them just to see if I could feel something from them. I didn't feel anything except more frustration and worry. I feel decent today but I still wonder if there will ever come a day that I don't think about pills. Then I start to worry that if something happened to me...say I got injured and NEEDED something for pain would I get started all over again on something else. Just mind racing thoughts and anxiety over this and the future. It is going to be an ongoing battle and I just have to get that in my mind.

I, too, hope Booba is okay. She took her last 3 trams yesterday afternoon.. I hope she checks in and lets us know!

I am off to get ready to go have lunch. I wish everyone luck today...Stay strong!

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 30, 2009
Tram..I just wanted to comment really quick that I am right there with ya on how you are feeling. Although the days have gone by and I am so proud of that,  I honestly can't tell how I feel from one moment to the next. I am all over the board with my emotions. I could very easily see myself relapsing, but I swear I refuse to! I am not going to ever, I mean EVER, go through this again! Just stay strong, I know it is easier said than done, but we all just have to stay strong...PERIOD!!! Please hang in there Tram! It will eventually get better for all of us!



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by GreatWhite, Oct 30, 2009
Thanks notsosunny your ideas really help, of course i wont be painting my nails however. haha. But today getting down to just two pills has been so far soo good. Not withdrawal symptoms yet except pooping whenever I eat. What happens to me at night is I just cant sit still. So even when I am watching tv or watching I movie I am constantly moving or walking around and pacing. i definitely feel tingly in my arms and legs and just want to walk around even though i dont. Does this make sense to anyone? Its like i am a lost child. But after this weekend I am going to to try my hardest to just take one pill on Monday and half at night, and then same for Tuesday since I have class that night and i dont want to be shaking and pacing during my grad class. So hopefully by this time next week I will be Tram free and free from the cold grip that this ******* pills have taken on me. I also put my pill bottle behind a picture of my two nieces who i love with my whole heart so everytime I have to take one I look at their pic and it gives me so much strength and inspiration to just stop so i can be there to watch them grow up. Hope all is welll and reallly hope Booba is keeping up the good fight!!

Avatar universal
by janesweet, Oct 30, 2009
Congrats on 9 days!  That is awesome!  The last time I went off of tram I was so depressed!  I was supposed to go on vacation and had to cancel because I was afraid to drive (hig anxiety) and I was afraid for my safety.
I made my husband take the bottle of (hidden) tramadol out of the house this morning.  he doesn't get the fact that i can find the stuff in minutes and would tear through the house!
I am tapering with his help.  I find that having "commitments" and "work" give me an excuse to not stop.  I am now at the point where I am canceling all that is on my plate and am just going to take care of myself and not feel guilty because i am canceling plans.
I have been clean and sober most of my life and I too was introduced to this drug by a dentist who said it was good for "addicts".  This is the worst stuff imaginable!  
I appreciate people sharing about not being able to taper and doing it c/t.  I am going to try to taper but again, my husband does not do a good job at hiding this white pills and I find them easily.  Due to this website I told him he could not leave me in the house with them and please take them to work.  I ave 5 for the day and will right out a detox plan.  
I feel like such an *** because (most of us are probably smarter than the average Joe) I know better than to start this cycle over and over.  i think I am at my bottom which came when I was taking sub for 9 months and felt like ****.
I am a runner and have not been running in days due to this narcotic ****.  So glad to read everyone's posts!  Keep up the good work.
And to newway, I do not talk about this drug in AA meetings and have not admitted to relapsing.  My drug of choice was never alcohol but I find AA to be a much healthier group of people.  I did start in NA 20 years ago.  Support is key i this and for me admitting that I have relapsed once again, will be helpful and at least honest.  
My goal is to be well enough to go on a ski vacation December 18th with my husband and kids and see a lot of my friends.  
This is such an isolating illness!!!
Have a great day everyone!

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Greatwhite,Perhaps you could take a soak in epsom salt bath at night to help relax.I know guys are not so big on tub soaks,but it really helps both pain and relaxation.I never filled the tub completely,just enough to soak my back and feet and it was very soothing.That jumpiness is the nerves and muscles going back to normal after being constantly stimulated by the tramadol.I also took extrastrength robaxacet at night because the muscle relaxant in it helps.Good luck in your jump off .This may sound trivial,but I am having a harder time fighting off the urge to eat the Kitkat chocolates I got for halloween...that's all I can think about.What do you think..maybe just a couple..they are small(she says as she grits her teeth)

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by GreatWhite, Oct 30, 2009
where can i get robaxacet? over the counter? i will def try the epsom salt bath along with the valerian.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
I am in Canada and you can but it over the counter here.I think you can in USA as well

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Just had lunch and guess what I had for dessert?3 little kitkats....Yummmy...

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 30, 2009
Just got back from lunch at the school with my daughters. My 15 year old wanted to go with me so I picked her up and we went. My little one was so pleasantly surprised. It really helped my mood being around all the smiling little faces of her and her schoolmates. I actually went the full hour that I never even thought about the stupid pills. That is a huge deal to me because usually I am constantly thinking about it. I did eat way too much..school lunches are so much better than they were when I was in school. LOL...

Well, now I am home and my battle begins again. I still have to clean my house for my company this weekend. I sure hope I can work well under pressure. I have known for 2 months they were coming and now here I am with just hours until they arrive and a messy house to tackle. UGH!! Calgon take me away. LOL...

Keep fighting guys! :)


Avatar universal
by TRAMMAN999, Oct 30, 2009
I'm back on after only a few hours. The hours have passed today, but that is all. As I said I feel C***. I thought I would think like 'janesweet' & 'GreatWhite' 'that's awesome'. (thank you janesweet) 9 days clean! But I just can't get that feeling (and I should do, cause I reckon I deserve it) -      I feel so rotten.
             'GreatWhite'  &  'pharma9' you are so encouraging - thank you   -   of course what you both say are corrrect (& I know it) - I will take your comments on board. I think it is an expectation thing - you've given all you've got to get through the war and then Zonk!!   =   anticlimax. I know in whatever part of my brain I should be full of glee and proud, but the brain forefront is saying 'look pal, you feel rotten'. IT IS all the symptoms of depression!?  No umph to get out of the chair and go out the door - just to sit in a chair and feel 'rotten'. No doubt the poor sleep (& filling myself with a sleeping pill, a calmer down, Clonazepam & 45mg Mirtazepine) does not help one's get up & go!? I have only recently started taking Mirtazapine and it did help me sleep (when I was taking the Tram).
I have had very little, poor quality sleep over this period - if I can just get a good night, then maybe I can get out of the chair.

Yes.   please do!!!   Sock it to me - tell me (in no uncertain terms) I'm along the right road and to ride out the storm until calm falls.
Thank you guys for lifting me after only a few hours of posting. The very best to you GreatWhite - I shall follow with interest (and maybe offering you support when the time comes!!??


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by booba77, Oct 30, 2009
Hey Warriors.  I am still alive, though  barely LOL.  I haven't even read all of the posts for today, but once I saw people thinking of me, I wanted to write and let you know that I'm still alive.  Didn't go to work today.  I know I know.  Dammit I have been there 8 years,  and they won't fall apart without me.  I took my girl to daycare for her party, and am at home looking gross and exhausted.  I have some back pain, but unsure why.  Is this rebound pain pain that you would have felt had you not been on tramadol, or caused by the trams?  I am typing at a computer, oddly.  I usually text on the site from my phone, so hopefully my grammar and punctuation are better (my major was in English).  I'm going to read more of the posts and write more shortly.

Avatar universal
by TJAR, Oct 30, 2009
I am new to this site.  I want to taper off my tramadol  use but have had trouble sticking to it.  Any advice?  Also, can you avoid the terrible feelings if you do it slow enough?  From what I have read it sounds like most go cold turkey, but I am wondering if it is possible to do it more slowly to avoid W/D.  Also, I have read that if you have problems with addiction that you should see your doctor because they can somtimes prescribe things to lessen the cravings.  I have not talked to them yet, as I am afraid it will get out in the community some way or even give me some kind of label with the clinic.  Any thoughts on that?

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Are you taking b12 tramman?I really think it helps.I feel almost a high when I take it.Kind of a good to be alive feeling.I also take antioxidants and omegas and vitd.Perhaps a cup of warm chammomile tea will soothe you or even a hot epsom salts bath in the middle of the day.I love those epsom salts because they provide the body with magnesium and soften the water to make cleaning the tub easier.I take 1000mcg b12 under the tongue every morning.The day is half over and you are still holding off.Consider your alternative..what is it really?You stay the course or you drop out...You have come too far to turn back and there is a light at the end of the tunnel.....Look..see it?

Avatar universal
by newway, Oct 30, 2009
Tramman - the first time I went of T, I did it CT - it was a horrendous experience - no one knew - so I had no support, and I did not expect the depression and lack of energy.  I expected what I had experienced from opiate withdrawal - horrible flu, sick as a dog, not sleeping - but then slowly feeling better.  The depression is what sent me back to using - seriously - I couldn't make myself shower!  
If however, I had stuck it out - I would be a year tram free right now - instead of starting over.  That is what you have to hold on to - one pill will make this whole thing start over.
This time I am prepared for the depression - as much as one can!  I have the 5htp, B12 and am trying to eat well as I taper down.  
I know this is going to sound like the hardest thing in the world - and god knows I wasn't able to do it (but I relapsed) get some fresh air - try and drag your low energy self out for 5 min of fresh air.  The one thing I have noticed in these posts is that fresh air and exercise seem to be common among many who have been sucessful.
I do think the longer you are on t, and the higher dose will make it more difficult - and take longer to clear your system.  The evil pill is now fighting for survival - it wants you to give in - to take more.
Try and focus on self care - getting up and showering at a regular time - even if you haven't slept, and put on real cloths - not pj's.  Try small tasks - like dusting - or washing a few dishes.  Make yourself get up and change positions - get the blood flowing.  
Now you are fighting withdrawal and a very real sense of depression - so any activity will feel impossible - but you have to force yourself - even just a walk around your home.  I am not sure what interests you - but crosswords, puzzles anything that distracts you - all I know is that staying in bed, in my pj's doing nothing - giving in to the depression - brought me here a year later - you have 9 days - you have survived the first 9 days - you can do this - keep asking for support - I am sure others will have ideas to help - but you are going to have to dig down deep and make yourself move forward - and even if it is just taking a shower today - that's one tram free shower.  Focus on the positive and realize the pull and the strength those evil little pills have.
Sorry if I am sounding over zealous - but this is where I gave in - and if there is anything I can possibly say or do to help you get past this point - to realize that this too shall pass I will do it.
I will be thinking of you!

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by booba77, Oct 30, 2009
I have got to take a shower people.  I tried to take a bath this morning and fell asleep, but after I got in the bed to try to sleep?  Forget about it.  Can you have RLS during the day, if so, I have it.  I will post more after I feed those blasted chickens.  

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 30, 2009
Booba:  what you're probably feeling is more related to the tram trying to get you to dose.  I had that too for a few days.  Now, my pain level is even lower than it was back when I started this evil drug.  Hang in there, it may not seem so, but it WILL get better.  Every minute you survive is another minute you won't have to do this again.

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 30, 2009
Oh, and yes, you can have RLS during the day.  I had several days of that and it still comes back from time to time (but usually only for a few minutes).  Still prayin' for your success, buddy.  I'm anxious for the day you'll be on here talking about how different life is. . . .

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 30, 2009
Booba..I have experienced what I THINK it may have been RLS a few times during the day. Kinda like a momentary feeling of wanting to crawl out of my own skin. I don't think RLS just happens at night for everyone. I would hate to have it day and night but I think if I had to choose I would choose not to have it at night. THAT IS THE WORST! I haven't had a hard time with RLS so much so far and I am on day 8. I think I have felt little twinges here and there but nothing that lasted the entire night. Hillbilly is probably right, though..it is probably just your body and the tram trying to get you to dose up. Don't fret too much about not going to work. It is important for us all to be kinda easy on ourselves and not beat ourselves up about things right now. Easier said than done, I know..and I need to practice what I preach. LOL..

Well, I think I feel the beginnings of a UTI coming on. I think that is partly why I am in such SEVERE pain. I know I posted a couple days or so ago and asked if anyone else was urinating alot coming off the trams because I felt like I had to go pee every 5 minutes. Literally. Last night I noticed that only a little bit was trickling out and today the pain is much worse. I was hospitalized for a day and a half a few years ago because my white cell count was 30,000. Normal is 5,000-10,000 so I had a very significant infection. I was supposed to follow up with a urologist but never did because I never had anymore issues with it until now. The pain is from my rib cage down to my hips and it is just horrible. In fact, I keep typing a little, getting up and walking around and then coming back to type. I am getting more miserable by the minute. I am going to stock up on cranberry juice, lemon juice and Azo pills. I hope it doesn't get worse and I hope I can treat it at home. Last time I had one I was sent home with Dilaudid and 2 refills. Don't you guys know I was happy for a FEW DAYS. I surely don't want that again. I really don't. It would just send me into using again and undo everything I have fought for to get 8 days clean.

Hang in there everyone.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Notsosunny.You probably do have a urinary infection and need an antibiotic like cipro or sulpha.Maybe you can go to the clinic and get it.You don't need the narcotic but I certainly recommend an antibiotic started as soon as possible.Some people esp seniors have gotten hallucinations and psychiatric symptoms from UTI infectionsIt happened to my mother and she was talking to dead people and had severe back ache.She was a lot better after only 1 day of antibiotic called macrobid.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
You can always tell the visitors that you have  a uti infection and blame all the withdrawal symptoms on that.I would not be surprised if a lot of your crummy feelings are from the uti infection and you will feel much more sunny when it is cured.

Avatar universal
by chrissie145, Oct 30, 2009
Great Post Newway. Absolutely spot on. I am sure it will encourage not only Tramman but everyone else. You have given so much to this site. And you will be tramadol FREE very soon I know!
Chrissie

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
TJAR..Everyone has a different opinion about going ct or tapering.Much depends on your personality and support system and determination.A few have been able to do a super slow taper and feel very little withdrawal,but most seem to want to do it quickly and get it over and done with because regardless of what you do it seems you get withdrawal symptoms from reducing the dose.In my opinion if you have the strength to maintain a slow taper and do not borrow tomorrows pills that is a good way to go.Even cutting by 1 or 2 tabs weekly is still progress.Fred has good opinions about which way to go.Welcome to the family and let us know how you are coming along.

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 30, 2009
TJAR- I am tapering, although I've had a hard time 3, then 4 next day and so far two pills today- 50mg.  I talked to my husband and mom about it.  Otherwise I'd never do it.  I'm still having trouble not taking an extra one here and there as someone mentioned above.  Part of me wants to take 5 and say screw it, but I'm going to see a shrink next week and I want to last until that Thursday and hopefully start withdrawing then, so I can have all of Friday, Sat and Sun.

If I get RLS, will a muscle relaxer help? I have some skelaxin at home.  It usually makes me feel irritable, so that's why I never finished them, but if it would help with that, then I'd take it.

Notsosunny- I hope you get some antibiotics for the UTI.  I'm not sure if serious ones can be fully treated at home and they can really be bad.  Hang in there.  Pharma might be right about that causing your symptoms.

Booba- you're doing great!

Jenny

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by forget_me_not, Oct 30, 2009
Regarding the RLS -- it's pretty much a round-the-clock thing during the first days, and not confined to the legs for many of us.  It might better be called Restless Body Syndrome since it affects many people's arms as well.  Just a miserable thing to go through.  It does get better, though.  Stay strong!

Potassium helped me some, and hot showers helped quite a bit.  I took four or five showers a day during my first week off tramadol CT.

For me, just as Fred has put it so well, it took an all-out declaration of WAR to beat the withdrawal during the first couple of weeks.  I was so, so, so angry at the drug and at myself for being addicted to it.  The anger got me through the first two weeks.  After that it was sheer determination to NEVER experience that particular he)) again.

Be strong.  At 55 days out I can promise you it gets SO much better.  I feel blessed to be part of this community of warriors...

blessings,
~fmn

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by forget_me_not, Oct 30, 2009
Chrissie, look for a PM soon!  I am writing to you now.

~fmn

Avatar universal
by zealious, Oct 30, 2009
Its such a relief to know that you are not the only one. As most of you hear I got started on the devils tram when I started suffering severe carpal tunnel and a visit to the doctor had me set up with the "non addictive" ultram and motrin. Well I have never had any addiction before.. but I have tried pain pill recreational before and found them nice. but never had a problem..
With the tram It was very shocking how strong they were. I thought it was going to be like asprin or something the way my doctor acted.. but I have to say .. ive tried codine hydrocodone, darvocet, oxycodone and morphine in the past. and the tram blew them all away. I thought maybe it was just my chemistry or something. but I would get this huge surge of energy and at the same time get the euphoric opiate feeling.
So now its been a year. exactly. of about 600-800mg tram a day. I never took over the doctors recomendation... but then again who am I fooling when I skip a couple doses. because I know if I take a double dose I will get high..
Well im on day 4 right now. and i have done a rapid tapper.  I went from 800mg one day to 200mg and was already startng to wd. day 2 i took 50mg in the morning and 50mg at night. I was able to find a few darvocett and I have taken about 1 a day. and now I have 4 darvocett and 100mg ultram left. I am on day 4.. I def have been going through bad wd esp at night when I am trying to sleep. I have no energy. and last night I found my self crying. for no reason at all. I couldnt control my emotions I simply was crying all night long.

I feel a lot better knowing im almost through the worst. I have a feeling last night was the worst..  however i do fear a second withdrawl from the tappering... Is this possible?

Avatar universal
by zealious, Oct 30, 2009
Oh and to top off the wd I also lost my job. so I think the depression thing is going to be tough for me. One minute I think its a blessing I dont have to be at work the way I am.. and that i will probly find a better job.. then the next minute im thinking jeez I did not get a lot of applications in today... what if I dont find a job.. and omg I feel so sick right now.. and My fiancee just left town wont be back for 3 days. Im all alone right now.. its tough. I might go pay my mom a visit or something.

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by GreatWhite, Oct 30, 2009
Yes zealious you should be around your family right now. At least be around someone who can take your mind off the evil drug. I am doing a rapid taper as well. Well not so rapid because I never really took more than 4 pills a day. Today I have only taken 1!!! and that was at 630am  and now it is 630pm... cant believe i made it through the day without taking more. Definitely wanted to as i have a whole bottle right now but iam not going to. I will have to take one more before i go to bed or else the shakes will keep me up all night and i have to go to a wedding tomorrow. But the key is to get in the frame of mind. You can beat the RLS and the restless nights. Like everyone said, the worst is only a few days then its all a mind game and not picking up that bottle. Like i wrote before, i put my bottle of pills behind a picture of my nieces and that gives me inspiration not to pick it up. Also if you dont want to take any that day, dont carry them with you, then you cant. I definitely have thought about taking more but you have to get your mind ready for an all out WAR! Get angry at the little PILL! Curse at it and yell at it. thats the only way your mind will make it through. After this weekend, it is all over and i am getting off completely. You will find a job, and you will start feeling better. DO NOT GIVE IN! no matter how *****y you feel. DONT GIVE IN. you know its not worth it, and so do i! I am a guy and i am finding myself wayyyy more emotional than when the drug suppressed all those emotionss. Your body hasnt released those emotions in a while because of the trams. So let it all out. I just found myself crying driving down the Hudson River in NY because it looked so beautiful..hahah. and i have never done that in my life. But i have held out 12 hours, now its just another few more hours. I def am starting to experience a little tiny bit of RLS, or RBS which it def should be called because i get it in my arms too. but hang in there, and say a prayer and know that God is with you and so are all of us. If i hadnt found this support sytem, i would definitely have taken some of those Devil Pills by now...
-chris

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
WowwwGreatwhite...I am so happy to read your last post...It is so much more positive than the first one that was so full of desperation.You are ready to fight the good fight and boy do you sound good.I love it..love it.You will do yourself and all your loved ones proud.I feel like cheering here because I am so happy that you have realized the path you will take and are ready to take it all.Bring it on..You are ready to fight.You did not get to grad school by being a wus and I will call you Rocky...I did the same thing when I finally made up my mind that I wanted to be clean way more than I wanted to be high and fought the battle fiercely.I am at at least 6 weeks ,maybe more ,because I have stopped counting the days.Lots of love and luck to you for the weekend.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Chris..I feel that this experience will make you a better person and a wonderful husband and father because you will have empathy with people.Maybe God gave you this experience to teach you about determination and empathy and you will learn from it like I did from mine.With God's help and the help of the people around and mostly yourself,you will conquer.

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by Dev0n, Oct 30, 2009
Hi everybody... Day 20
Still going strong and actually sleeping which helps.I just wish my mood would improve.The problem is every now and again the w/d sysmptoms kick in, sometimes for just a few hours but sometimes for days.Nothing is constant and when your starting to feel better it really does knock you back.

Although i have been free for 20 days i have been fighting this since July.Two attempts at c/t both failed because i was not prepared for the w/d.I actually thought i had a stroke because my arms went numb and i couldnt control my legs at all.My anxiety attacks were crazy.This was before i found this site and read your stories and symptoms.So i changed my GP and actually found a Dr who listened and came up with the taper plan.
I did 6 weeks starting at 600 a day and coming down 100 each week until zero day.Now the first 2 weeks were not so bad but once i got under 400 a day things got harder but nowhere near the levels of going c/t.It does take some self discipline but having done the c/t i found this easier as i knew what to expect.However when i finally jumped off it was still hard and still is.
Though as each day goes by i am finding it easier to cope and once i started sleeping it made a huge difference.

To all those people going through the first week i feel your pain and wish you all the best,keep going as it does get easier and there really is no other option.

keep fighting never look back

Dave from Devon


Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Hey Devon..So good to hear from you and all your positive news.I am happy for you and what you have accomplished.Of course we know now that the road is not smooth and there will be bumpy bits along the way,but we can handle that,We got this far after all..and I must say you have done extremely well.I am here all day because I have an unexpected day off work and have spent the whole day here reading both inspiring stories and others that break my heart.But I know that most of the people here will make it because we will all pull together and get thru this.I am also drinking as little wine(it is my day off)and cheering everyone on and hopefully encouraging others to just do it.

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by booba77, Oct 30, 2009
notsosunny~girl u better go get an antibiotic asap.  in the meantime get some azo and juice.  im ok.  taken 3 baths and got horrid runs (sry if TMI) but Im ok.  taken 3 advil for back pain and it worked.  gotta go.  New degrassi is on.  am i tje only one that loves this show?

Avatar universal
by zealious, Oct 30, 2009
Thanks so much chris. It makes me very optimistic to hear from you. I like how you put it as a war. Thats def a good way to look at it. What doesnt kill you makes you stronger right.? Glad to know the emotion thing is normal.. I felt a little shame for crying and I didnt want people to see me. But now im around my family and I can see the light. Everything is going to be ok..

We are all going to be ok.

Keep up the good fight.

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by forget_me_not, Oct 30, 2009
yes, Zealious, we ARE all going to be ok!  amazing how an affirmation like that can be so incredibly powerful.  Just reading it in your post brought tears to my 55-day-clean eyes.  :)

It is WAR, indeed.  Never say die.  Things get so much better, and when they do, you'll have a powerful witness for others who find themselves a few days behind you on the trail...

blessings,
~fmn

1059641 tn?1277525976
by forget_me_not, Oct 30, 2009
A post from my journal that I hope may be helpful for those just making the jump off of tramadol, written at 27 days out (I am now 55 days out and life has improved by leaps and bounds)...  still learning how the forum works but I do hope this can help where it needs to.

peace,
~fmn

--------------------------

I am writing this at 29 days out with a determination that I am amazed by.  Just typing “29 days out” brings tears to my eyes.  I was at a point not long ago when I thought I would never be free of tramadol.  I thought I would die before I ever saw this day.

The determination I feel about sharing my story is very powerful.  Like so many people reading this, not long ago I was here, reading Emilypost’s journal, searching for glimmers of hope, words of help and a reason to think I could beat this demonic drug, amazed at the havoc it had wreaked my life and others’ lives.  I had exhausted myself trying to live with it, and I knew that my only hope was to get away from it.  I traveled the road from believing this medicine was my lifeline to knowing that it was, quite literally, killing me.

This is where I found my courage.

My story is long and convoluted.  The short version is this: I began taking the poison three years ago for a sprained wrist.  I found out quickly that tramadol “fixed” the depression I had been struggling with since I was a teenager, maybe even before that.  I will preface all of this by saying that I am not a typical addict, just like you are not a typical addict.  That’s because there is no such thing as a typical addict.  If you swallow this pill, you are fair game.  

The antidepressant qualities of tramadol were too much for me.  The first lie: the drug restored me to normal, or made me normal for the first time in my life.  There are a million ways to rationalize dependence.  And so the destruction began.  Before I could turn around, I was dependent on the medication and its deception, unable to get through a day without it.  

I started out at 300mg per day (prescribed dose), an increased my dose to 600mg per day pretty quickly.  I took 50-mg tablets.

This poisonous drug is an insidious captor.  It took me over quickly and easily.  I became, over the course of two years, a person I hardly recognized.  The shiny, beautiful beginning quickly turned into a nightmare of physical and emotional pain and fear.  I now understand that I was in a state of constant withdrawal as my body needed more of the poison than I could supply.  Running out of tramadol was more frightening to me than dying.  In the recesses of my mind I feared life without this drug, but not nearly as badly as I feared life WITH it.

After running out a couple of times, I knew that I couldn’t – COULDN’T – live through that again.  And that was a huge part of what made me so angry.  Nothing is worth that kind of suffering and anguish.  So, 29 days ago, I decided.  No more.

It was my decision to go off the poison cold turkey.  To me, that is a judgment call we all have to make.  I couldn’t taper and didn’t want to.  I was done with the perpetual withdrawal and the fear.  I was angry and scared, but most of all, I was done.

And here I am.  Sharing my experience may be the most important thing I ever do.

You are probably here because you want to be free; if you’re like I was, you are scared to death of what you know is coming after you make the break.  I have experienced withdrawal from hydrocodone and it was, for me, a walk in the park compared to tramadol WD.  Sure, it is going to be difficult, but you CAN make it through it.

If there is something in my experience that can help you, I hope it will.

You are going to need to give yourself extraordinary latitude in coming days and weeks.  Your body and your brain are going to revolt against the drug.  It is poison, and you are going to feel it.  Understand that you are healing.  Also understand that there is no single way to get through it.  It’s all so random.  You may not have the WD symptoms I had, but you may have some I didn’t have.  You will find on this journal many people whose experiences, while different, contain some truths that are uniquely yours.  Take comfort in this.  You are NOT alone no matter how bad it gets.

If you have someone you trust, tell them.  If you choose not to tell anyone, you may want to consider telling people around you that you have the flu.  You will need some time to be sick if that is at all possible.

Give yourself extraordinary latitude, and make yourself do the basic things you must do to survive.  There may be days when you have to force yourself to eat.  Do it…small quantities.  You may have to force yourself to breathe, to drink, to shower and go to the bathroom.  Do it.  You may have to force yourself to read these posts.  Do it.  You’ll find you are not alone.

Be ready to coach your body and your mind through the ravages of tramadol withdrawal.  YOU are in charge now, not the drug.

There is no magic bullet, but here are some things that really helped me:

Food (specifically water and protein).  Your body will revolt and you may lose your appetite or have severe nausea.  Make yourself eat wholesome foods that are reasonably high in protein.  Also, make yourself drink water.  Your body knows how to survive, but its processes are so messed up from the poison that it may seem like you cannot carry on biologically once the supply stops.  Water and protein, and foods like bananas and baked potatoes that are high in potassium, helped me tremendously in retrospect.  There were days when the physical pain and fatigue were so bad I couldn’t lift myself from the sofa, and after I ate, I noticed an improvement, sometimes dramatic.  Things to try: Slim-fast bars or shakes with protein (you will most likely notice a decrease in appetite for a little while), water, Ensure or other nutritional supplements, and honey (a spoonful at a time) to combat the malaise.  Again, there is no magic bullet, but these things helped me considerably.

Hot showers. This may seem too simple to be true, but it worked wonders for my back and leg pain, which were excruciating. Some days I showered three or four times.  The warm water really helped.

Arm/leg wraps.  If the aches in your arms become unbearable, try wrapping them with an ace bandage or other binding.  Light pressure helps relieve the pain (and chills).

Advil liqui-gels.  It didn’t always help, but there were times when it did.  You will need all the help you can get when the body aches come around.  The good news: those aches are now temporary, not perpetual as they were when you were taking the poison.  As of today, you can look forward to a day in the near future when it will STOP!

Exercise.  Before the poison ravaged my life, I was a runner and was pretty fit.  The medicine created so much physical pain that I had to stop.  From day one off the poison I forced myself to walk.  It was tough.  Some days I couldn’t do it.  Some days I still find it very difficult.  I recall during days 7 and 8, trying to walk and being unable to carry myself more than a hundred FEET.  I had to wear a sweater and a jacket in 80-degree heat.  When that happened, I thanked God that I made it a hundred feet, and I tried again the next day.  And the next day.  And now here I am.  Yesterday I walked briskly more than a mile (even jogged a bit) and couldn’t have felt better if I had run a marathon.  I keep telling myself that my physical strength will return, and I will be able to rebuild myself in time.  

First things first.

Hot tea.  Like many of us, you may have persistent insomnia in coming days.  Hot tea and warm baths help.  At least I could lie in bed and feel somewhat relaxed if I wasn’t sleeping.  Eventually the insomnia will abate, and you will sleep better than you have in a long time.  Expect that the insomnia might happen, and that way, if it does, you won’t be so upset by it.  Grab some magazines or movies.  Sleep when you can.  If you are plagued too much, try Benadryl or even Ambien to help you through the initial WD period.  Your brain is healing.  Know that the insomnia is temporary and you will sleep soon!

Anger.  This one always gets mixed reviews. I don’t think indulging anger is a good thing in general.  For me, though, my anger at the drug, at myself for becoming dependent on it, was a major factor in my ability to break free.  It motivated me to push through the horrific pain and depression that came with going off the poison cold turkey.  It was the only way I could do it.  The anger was the momentum that got me through the first week, after which sheer determination took over.  I was prepared to stand against this monster even if it killed me.  Sometimes I thought it would.  But here I am, strong and clear-minded and determined to share my story.  Let that be encouraging to you, too.

This is the best analogy I can come up with.  You have two choices, only one of which is really a choice: you can keep trying to dance with this monster, or you can turn and walk away from it into the scary unknown of life without it.  I know all too well the fear in that decision.  It feels like running into a dark and scary forest alone at night.  If you “choose” to keep dancing you will be destroyed, both physically and emotionally.  The perpetual withdrawal will continue and you will feel more and more unwell.  If you choose to turn and walk away, you are choosing life and healing.

Your cognitive processes are distorted right now.  That frightening forest is only partly real.  Mostly it is an illusion created by the drug as a way to make you afraid to walk away.  

Personal observations.  I had forgotten what it felt like to feel myself.  I didn’t realize how much I had forgotten.  I had forgotten what it feels like to be interested in living – in the sights and smells and tactile experiences and emotions of life.  One lovely effect of this drug is that it numbs you to pretty much any and all pain (initially, at least), but it also cuts you off from most everything good, too.  Once you begin to feel yourself again, you will be shocked how much of you is still there.  You will be surprised how strong you can be.  You are an expert in living in withdrawal, you just don’t realize it.  You already have an idea what to expect.  WD is going to be terrible.  So is life if you keep taking the poison.  It has turned on you, too, and that is why you are here.  You feel weak and afraid and defeated.  But YOU are stronger than you believe you are.  

Have you ever survived something you thought you couldn’t survive?  A horrible illness?  The death of someone you love?  Traumas, accidents, tragedies?  Do you think of those events now and feel SURE you couldn’t get through them without the poison?  Well, you DID get through them.  You have proven you are a survivor.  You can get through this, too.

Here is part what I experienced, and you might, too:

Pain.  You know this already.  It is going to be tough.  It will be physically and emotionally excruciating.  You may experience terrible arm, leg and/or back pain, as well as horrible headaches and abdominal pain.  It is your body revolting against the poison and breaking free.  This is the forest.  Have you ever broken a bone? Ever had a serious illness?  Then you know what to expect.  Push on!  You can and will get through it.  It’s temporary!

Depression/suicidal thoughts. This is probably the hardest to deal with.  Tramadol really alters the chemical environment in your brain in profound ways (ways I don’t pretend to understand) – thus the antidepressant effects most of us have come to love, then hate.  When the drug turns on you, there is no way out except to get away from it.  I remember day three, lying in the bathroom floor in a fetal position, crying and praying I would die.  The forest.  It’s normal!  You are healing, even then.  When the drug screams at you that nobody can help you, that nobody will understand, that you would be better off dead – remember these words.  I was there, too.  And so were many others.  The drug is screaming lies at you in the effort to get you to take just one pill.  Be smart.  Bookmark the posts here that speak to you, and come back to them when the lies are resonating in your head.  As of today, this, too, will pass!

High blood pressure.  This is a real danger for some of us.  The last time I went to the doctor to get a refill of poison, my blood pressure was very high (baseline for me is normal to low).  I had run out the day before.  Just keep check on it, particularly if you have high BP to start with.

Since I turned away from this poison, I have experienced myself, my life, in small ways and for the first time in years.  I am amazed at how much of me remained under the veil of tramadol, hidden away under layers of fear and anxiety.  I have learned so much about myself.  I still love playing my guitar, reading, being outdoors, talking to people. I want to exercise and eat healthy foods and sleep at night and get up in the morning.  I want to walk and breathe fresh air and feel the sun and the cold and everything else.  The haze is gone.  What remains is strikingly beautiful, although not perfect.  It is good.

Last night my three-year old niece crawled up into my lap and asked me to tell her a story.  We sat in the swing on the porch under a quilt in the cold fall air, and this crystallized in my mind: I am not chilling or shaking.  I am sitting under a blanket in regular clothes, my legs aren’t aching, and my back isn’t hurting.  A 36-lb child in my lap doesn’t hurt.  She laid her head on my chest and I could smell the cool air in her hair.  It had been years since I was that alive, that present in my life.  Tears welled.  How much of my life would I have lost?  Who can say.  I was not one of the lucky ones.  I had to make my own luck.

And I am only at day 29.  It gets even better than this?  That is humbling.  I will take whatever it is.

I have had MANY hard days and will have many more.  That is a deal I gladly accept.  I have also had some really good days, and those days give me hope.  They are the reason I know I will, in time, get through all of this.  For me, days one through twelve were very tough.  Days 13 through 20 were up and down, but things got better overall, gradually but steadily.  Days 21 and 22 I was actually free of leg pain for two consecutive days.  That was a miracle!  The fatigue is still very hard, but some days are better and I hold on to that.  Each good moment is a miracle, and I will treasure those good moments until they become good days, good weeks.  Until I measure them in seasons or years.

Today I can say that I have had three consecutive Very Good Days, meaning no major leg or back pain, no crying jags, no depression and I have slept.  That is so incredible.

This is really a long introduction, isn’t it?  

At this moment it doesn’t really matter why you started taking the poison.  What matters is choosing right now to walk away.  To bury it and leave it there.  This fight is one of the most important you will ever undertake.  Let go of the blame and the shame and let the fight in you take over.  You want to be free or you wouldn’t be here.
Your fear at day one is a healthy reminder that you are up against a vicious enemy, one that will destroy you if you allow it to.  Understand that we are ALL terrified at day one.  We all fear that we won’t get through it.  

Here, I am reaching out my hand to you, from my day 29, asking you to join all of us who are beating this poison a day at a time.  

I am asking you to let those of us here help you get through day 1 and all the days that follow.  It’s going to be hard, but not nearly as hard as choosing to let it keep destroying you.

The forest turns out to be way more beautiful than you can imagine.  When the scales are removed from your eyes, the world becomes beautiful again.  There is life beyond the fear you feel right now.  Believe that and muster up your courage.  It gets so much better than what you are experiencing right now.

I hope you will take my hand and take that first step.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Booba I do not watch Degrassi but I know it is a good show for teens to watch.Produced in Toronto and very good.Keep us informed.We care

1059641 tn?1277525976
by forget_me_not, Oct 30, 2009
Make that 29 days, not 27!

Tramafog moment.

blessings...

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 30, 2009
Wow, it has been busy in here. THAT IS AWESOME!!! I am taking a break from cleaning my house. Now I just hope I can pull it together to get up from here again. Just found out my father-in-law isn't coming until tomorrow so I have through the evening to finish. I kinda slowed my pace down when I found out he wouldn't be here tonight. My friends are either going to be here very very late tonight or tomorrow before 1pm sometime to go to the fall festival with us. I wish they would have let me in advance that their plans on when they were coming had changed a little bit. I thought it was set in stone plans and I did all this fretting and stressing for nothing. Oh well..I am happy I have more time to straighten up and maybe even a little ME time. I swear the more I clean the more I realize how much I have allowed things to go unattended to around here. I am so frustrated with myself. My house used to stay spotless and now I feel it is just a wreck. I am not like "Kate Gosslin" anal about my house, but I do like things in order and right now they are very far from that.

While I was cleaning I was thinking about those of you tapering. I don't see how you do it. I have admiration for anyone who can get off this stuff but to know it is in the house and have the willpower not to just eat them is amazing to me. I just wanted to give Kudos!!!

I got my refill notification from my trusty online pharmacy this afternoon. I deleted and spammed it just to make myself feel strong. They will be calling Monday morning, though. I am gonna block the number. I can say no but I just don't even want to be tempted or bothered.

I don't know if I posted this already but I missed the Halloween festival downtown. My husband took the kids without me. I couldn't go. I am in so much pain with this UTI and the w/d's and I didn't feel like mingling with the public. As the day has gone by I am feeling worse but this is completely the UTI making it so bad. I know the w/d's are there and kicking my butt too, but the UTI is just really starting to get to me. I got antibiotics and have already started them. Maybe I can go to the fall festival tomorrow without suffering too much. I have a lowgrade temp that I can't break and my eyes are still burning. Not to mention the flippin pain is insane.

Okay...time for me to crank the music up and get somewhat motivated. I am keeping my new friends (YOU GUYS) in my thoughts. I appreciate each and every one of you! Think my mood calls for some Pink and Lady Gaga! LOL..

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Fgn..That was ..that was...I am speechless..What can I say.Your story is so real..Everything you said is so true and all I can say is BRAVO...

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 30, 2009
Good night everyone..I gots to go to bed.Keep fighting the good fight all.

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 30, 2009
Fmn...That was absolutely an amazing post.

I made it here to this statement twice and burst into tears. I had to come back to continue reading:
"Be ready to coach your body and your mind through the ravages of tramadol withdrawal.  YOU are in charge now, not the drug."

I haven't allowed myself to really, I mean really break down yet. The crying and sobbing actually felt therapeutic. I had not even looked at it in such an empowering way before reading your post. I am in control again! I feel like I need to read it again. Your post really gave me alot of hope and I am sure it has for all who've read it. Thank you for posting it.

I have gone back and read some of my posts and felt so silly at how I would write that I felt decent in the morning and then I would see a post from me just a couple hours later saying how bad I felt. Then I stopped and realized that I am sure we are all pretty much experiencing the same thing. Some days feeling decent all day, some days feeling crappy all days and some days it is minute to minute.

As of this moment I think I am having the worst time yet. I know it has alot to do with the UTI but it has alot to do with withdrawals. I am very anxious and kinda a little panicky feeling. My heart is racing and I can't stand that feeling. I can't sit still but I don't want to do anything productive. NOTHING IS HELPING WITH ANY OF MY SYMPTOMS. I still don't want the pills so that is the only thing I am feeling positive about. I do not want them. I don't want them because I simply can't go through this again and I won't.

I don't know if I am going to clean anymore tonight. I am honestly in no condition to do this right now. Everyone will understand and probably not even notice the things with my house that I have noticed today. Even if they did they wouldn't love me any less because my baseboards are dirty or my ceiling fans have dust bunnies all over them.

I may not be able to post over the weekend with everything going on but I will try. I know I am going to NEED to post so I am going to try.

Keep fighting guys!!!!!

1059641 tn?1277525976
by forget_me_not, Oct 30, 2009
Notsosunny, I remember how I would feel sort-of-good for a while, and then, out of the blue, it was like I had been knocked through the pavement again.  It was, literally, minute to minute for me.  I knew it was going to be the battle of my life and it has been.  

It was as though I had to lie down in front of this monster and say, "ok, here you go...do whatever you will while I am down but I AM leaving you behind...and dying is the only thing that will stop me!"  I meant it.  Eventually the monster got sick of terrorizing me and it wandered off.  And the peace I have now is beyond all language.  

The act of surrendering to the misery, embracing it and just letting it run its course, was important for me.  I accepted each moment knowing IT WOULD PASS, and it did.  

It didn't make it any easier, but it made it possible.

There are so few words for the misery this stuff causes.

again, so humbled to be here...

blessings,
~fmn

599071 tn?1300072302
by madtram, Oct 30, 2009
FMN, journal extracts are so valuable to post as they capture the tiny & the great realities of this process.  As Fred has often prompted, if you can manage, journal away.  I never did & although the general sense of horror remains quite vivid even now, the details of how I felt & the recovery milestones are now very hazy.

Our tramadol encyclopedia is a great resource but there is such a variety of periods of use; dose levels; underlying illnesses; physical fitness etc that while some experiences will be similar, many will be very different.   Positive expectations based on the posts of others are reinforcing to a point but can also weigh you down if you start to think that there must be something else wrong with you or that you are the one with no strength of character to speak of.   In the early days I posted that I felt like a weak-willed whimp because others were talking of daily exercise & I could barely make it from the bed to the loo.  Day 9 for some will be the equivalent of day 20 for others.  Some are concerned with dust bunnies; others consider trading their most loved possession for a decent sleep.

The one sure thing is that every single one of you will recover & have so much more to look forward to.  You can expect this.  For those in early recovery, it probably won't be tomorrow but by reference to a total life time, it will happen any day now.

Here's my periodic supplement tip.  For anxiety & panic, the only supplement that I can positively say made a difference for me was huge doses of the b vitamin extract, Inositol.  It promotes cellular & liver detoxification & may help to clear the tram more quickly.  I took 8 gram doses twice a day in the early days then dropped to once a day.  I had no anxiety or restless legs at all, the only thing it didn't help was the fatigue.  Inositol has been studied and there is no toxicity or reported side effects at these high doses so it's worth a try.

Sunny, please don't mess around with UTIs, they can spread to your kidneys which would be so much what you don't need right now.  Get yourself to the clinic for antibiotics, (trust me I'm a med student, lol).  But seriously, please go.

Happy halloween.

M

Avatar universal
by FinallyFred, Oct 31, 2009
Hello Warriors!

So many postive and REAL posts at the moment.   So many postive encouraging things from people who have been through the war and come out the other side to tell about it. (Hillbilly, Dave, FMN, etc.)  

Listen to madtram. She's um...the closest thing to a real doctor we may have, who understands things related to tram withdrawal.    She's fought this battle her self,  done considerable research, and she cares enough to stick around to give back.   Tap her.  I know that I did and her advice got me through the dog days of withdrawal many dark days.

As Michelle aka madtram mentioned, I have been preaching the gospel of journaling for a long time.    Few begin to journal, but I keep preaching it nonetheless.   Check out the entry FMN pulled out and posted today.  That was comprehensive and absolutely beautiful FMN.   So why journal you ask?

1.  Measures YOUR progress.   Contemporaneous journal entries (those written in real time as we go through something) offer the journalist a look back on where they have been and where they have come to.     As moments turn into days, it is entirely natural that on bad days (TM) we feel as though we have traveled no distance at all.  But by being able to reflect back on contemporaneous journal entries we have written, what we just might see - is progress.   That's a beautiful thing.   And you will hopefully never have another (fill in the day 1, 2, 3, etc.) again, so best get started NOW.  

2.  Service to Others.   Contemporaneous journaling serves as a historic reference for others coming after you. I do hope you realize that we are ALL on the cutting edge of defeating this thing. All pilgrams struggling to find our own ways out.  Many of you going through acute withdrawal RIGHT NOW have discovered something that looking back, was critical to my own recovery.   Service to others through encouragement.  So many of you guys are doing this right now like mad nutkins, even when you yourself are feeling no better than the next person - this seems to get us outside of  ourselves.  Go to your own profile page and start making journal entries.  I promise you that somone, will one day discover what you have written and it may just make the difference for THAT person's recovery.   That mission/sense of service to others get's us out side our own tramadol problems.

Each of our stories is some what unique, though so sadly the same.   But my theory is that if enough people arrive here and tell THEIR stories, someone will come after you, read YOUR story, and they will be able to identify with your story as if it were their own.   As though they could have written it from the beginning.   Somehow I get excited about that notion.

3.  Reinforces the focus.    

4.  Serves to distract.   As with excercize or watching old movies, things we can do to distract ourselves is powerfully helpful.  tic tock tic tock tic tock.

Nobody has mentioned this in a while, but the reality is that recovery from this drug is not necessarily linear.   Every new day isn't necessarily going to be better than the day before.  Sometimes recovery takes us a few steps forward and then we find ourselves facing a harder day.

Consider the reckless abandon with which we gobbled this drug down, in many cases for years and years - sometimes praying  that it would "do it's worst to/for us".  Maybe I am the only person here who used/abused the drug this way, but some how...I don't think so.  

I have never been much of "the guy" to offer the technical explanations on this site.  Most of my posts simply deal with what it was like for me before, what happened to enable me to get free, and what it's like now.   But they tell me that tramadol messes with our brain receptors.   Personally, I have never seen my "receptors", but I sure as heck damaged them through prolonged tramadol use.   Maybe one of you new folks can explain to me what a brain receptor is?   And then maybe someone could explain how long it takes those abused receptors to get healthy again?   All this stuff is WAY above my pay grade.

This much I know.   For over six years, I badly abused those brain receptors.  Early on, I calculated that my abuse and my best efforts to succeed in breaking the string of daily failings totaled more than 2,190 days.   When I arrived here on that very first day my win loss record with this drug was hopelessly sad, 0 wins - 2,190 losses to be exact.  

But when I arrived here I discovered HOPE.  I saw that POSSIBILITY could just maybe replace IMPOSSIBILITY.   And from my very first post, I declared by faith, that this place just might save my life.   I somehow felt that if I did what others had done, I might get what they had gotten.  

Having had that magical moment of clarity, I remember proudly declaring after 24 hours OFF this drug that my win - loss record stood at  1 win - 2,190 losses.   Pathetic really, but for me, I saw it as a start and that meant that my past losses no longer had to dictate my win today.  

I just took out a calculator.  Today, my win - loss record stands at 330 wins - 2,190 loses.   With that record, I still couldn't get a coaching job with U6 girls soccer. LOL.   But let it serve as a reminder that yesterday's losses with this drug NEED not determine our success at this moment.  

Yeppers, recovery isn't linear.   Some days are harder than others.  But what choice do we really have?   The only thing I know is that every moment I manage to put between myself and the last lovely little white pill gives those precious damaged brain receptors and my body in general another tiny moment adjust to life without this synthetic opiate.  

Booba,  I am pulling for you.   It will be tough this weekend, but by the middle of next week you will so gald you endured the temporary HELL for your long term health and well being.     You will sleep again one day soon.  And oh yeah, neurologic shooting/stabbing pain aka RLS can and does continue during the day as well as at night.   In my case, it was more like RBS, "restless body syndrome".   The good news is that it won't last forever.  

Keep taking those bathes with epson salt.   I took SIX BATHS one night as I jumped in and out of bed trying to sleep. "Nope, sleep isn't coming  time either" and back into the tub I would drag myself.   I had so many wet towels on the bathroom floor, it looked like a Chinese Laundry.   It was almost comical if it wasn't so desperate making.  But these things will pass.  I promise.

Courage, Strength and Love to all going through this right now.   fred

Avatar universal
by hanginin, Oct 31, 2009
Good morning. Thanks for all the great and heartfelt posts. This is truly a rough ride but it can be done. I'm on day 9 today and I feel better every day. I think that we all need to realize that there are going to be tough times every day even the good one;s and we just have to work thru them. Good luck and keep strong everyone

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 31, 2009
Good morning everyone.You are right hanginin,this is a rough ride but not only can it be done ...it must be done.Congrats on day 9 and tomorrow it will be day 10.I'm off to work now and wish everyone a good day.Will check in when I get back from work.

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by GreatWhite, Oct 31, 2009
hey guys, all ur posts are awesome. Had a horrible time getting to sleep last night. Like i said i am going away this weekend and starting my taper at the same time so I had only taken one pill the entire day from 630am to 930pm when i took one more hoping this would cure my RBS. It didnt and i was so pissed off. I was cursing that damn drug and promised myself not to take another one even if i didnt sleep at all. But in the end the pill won and i took one more and it still didnt even do anything to ease the RBS. So i just fought through it and eventually fell asleep, not sure when, but woke up about 3 hours later and tossed and turned all night. So here iam at 830am and have not yet taken one yet. I am mad at myself, yes, but i also realize that I am going to go CT on these things in just 3 days and even though it is going to be the hardest thing I ever did, I cannot wait to get through it. I cannot wait to get to day 9 and day 10 and day 11.............  so wish me luck this wekkend as i will be battling my own inner demons and trying to have a good time at a wedding at the same time. If i had my choice id be here with you guys going CT right next to booba. But that can wait a few more days. commitments are commitments. god bless you all and i will talk to you guys on sunday night most likely. \
chris

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by forget_me_not, Oct 31, 2009
Madtram, Fred... you are so right on -- there is no way to correlate my day 12 with anyone else's day 12, and in fact, I experienced that very discouragement in moments when I would see that someone else was doing so much better than I was at a particular day.  I hope that my journal will reflect MY experience, which is just a single case in a universe of very unique and different cases.  No two experiences are alike.  It definitely helped me, though, when I couldn't get up off the couch, to read others' experiences who were having better days.

I kept little notes throughout the first four weeks or so.  Wanted to be able to share my recovery process if it might ever be able to help someone else get through it, too.

The process is definitely not linear.  But over time, if you connect the dots behind you, there will be a lot of distance between you and the poison.  Better days are coming...guess that's my point.  Hang in there!

8 weeks clean today.  Wow.  I treasure knowing that I do not have to live at the mercy of tramadol ever again.  One night last week I had a dream that I was hospitalized, and the staff gave tram to me without my knowledge.  I woke up torn to pieces emotionally, knowing that I would have to go through this all over again.  I guess it's time to ask my doctor to update my medical records.  I have a new allergy.

Happy Halloween, Happy Saturday, Warriors... fight on.

~fmn

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by booba77, Oct 31, 2009
yesterday wasnt as bad as I thought it would be and today didnt start so bad, but is now progressively worsening.  noysosunny~i kniw what u mean about not keeping up with things while on tram.  my house is scary.  i would torchit if i could. what happened to me? it used to really matter to me.  i have a 4 year old for the love of god. i could barely dind clothes for her cuz they are in a huge pile. not put away, but clean. very inspiring posts all.  i am gonna try to sleep.  only day 2?

1059641 tn?1277525976
by forget_me_not, Oct 31, 2009
Hang on, booba... we were there, too.  It gets better!

Rest when you can, and give yourself room to heal.  This is the most difficult thing many of us will ever do.  I promise you this:  It gets BETTER.

push on...
~fmn

Avatar universal
by Hillbilly47, Oct 31, 2009
Booba:  it may feel like only day 2, but it is in reality thousands of minutes.  Thousands of minutes you have put between yourself and tramadol.  Each of those minutes is a fragment of your life you are getting back.  Each of those minutes is an investment in the rest of your child's (and your) life.

Think of it this way:  you're running away from something scary.  Every step you take is one more step between you and the monster.  Each minute is a step.  Focus on the next step only.  Don't think of any future or past steps.  One day soon, you won't feel its hot breath on your neck any longer and you'll be able to slow down enough to think.  At that moment, you'll be amazed at how many steps (minutes) you went and you'll actually look forward to the future steps.  

Avatar universal
by twanghead, Oct 31, 2009
Hello to all,

Thank you all so much .....for all the encouraging words and sharing all your info on getting rid of this drug.

I am 5 days off ....or is that out. It's been awhile ride. Very mild in comparsion to others!

I came across this forum accidentally last night. All I can say is ....wow! and thanks. God Bless all!


Happy Halloween to all.

me

Avatar universal
by twanghead, Oct 31, 2009
Make that a "Wild Ride" !

I'll edit much better before I send!

Avatar universal
by notsosunny, Oct 31, 2009
Hey Guys..I haven't had time to read everyone's posts but I will. Today has been maddening. I have struggled to make it through. The UTI symptoms seem to be a little better. Thank God. I made it to the Festival with my kids, but barely. We didn't stay as long as the kids wanted..I just literally couldn't. Where I live it is still close to 95 degrees. I was sweating so bad it was embarrassing but was having cold chills at the same time. I didn't even want to talk to anyone. I went incognito with a hat and huge shades on. LOL...Anyway, we stayed about 2 hours. At the last minute I have decided to be Marilyn Monroe instead of a Naughty Nurse tonight for the costume party, which I am back to dreading. Never finished cleaning my house but explained to my father-in-law I was in withdrawals. He was very understanding and actually told me he would clean it for me when he is here. My friends who were coming called me this morning and told me they were having car problems and couldn't make it... Bullcrap!!!!! However, I was actually relieved to hear it, but I am a little irritated that they made these plans and then just totally waited until the very very last minute to change them. Less for me to deal with. So...I am about to begin the task of dressing the kids for Halloween and that I am looking forward to. Ok guys...Don't let my misery discourage anyone. Alot of my issues are the UTI and the fact that I am allowing the depression and anxiety get to me. IT WILL GET BETTER, THOUGH. It has to!

Happy Halloween Everyone and Stay strong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Oct 31, 2009
Notsosunny,your misery is not discouraging us because you are showing progress by still continuing to function despite your misery.I would call that definite progress and once the antibiotics kick in you will be even better than now.and a little strongerAn infection weakens your body and you have a double whammy of being sick as well as withdrawal.My hat goes off to you that you are even standing on your feet.You are coping amazingly well.Kudos to you.It was a fun day at work today and all the dispensary was dressed up for Halloween.The customers were in good spirits and  teased me because I was dressed in a Queen costume.I have been there since the store opened in 1977 and they said the queen costume was very fitting.I agreed of course.Twanghead welcome to the board and I knew what you meant when you typed awhile ride.You can see from most of the posts that it certainly is a wild ride and we are here to listen and help anyone out that asks.Congrats on 5 days off...that is wonderful

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by forget_me_not, Oct 31, 2009
Notsosunny, please post here ANYTIME you feel like it, regardless how you are feeling.  Your posts aren't discouraging at all.  In fact, even though I still hate the thought of anyone else going through that dark and scary time, it was actually helpful to me to read honest posts like yours.  It was comforting to know I wasn't the only one who had gone through such dire misery.

We are here to support you through good times and bad.  If you can't be honest here, we aren't worth much to you.  :-)

We are all proud of you for hanging in there.  Fight on...and know that better days are just around the corner.

~fmn

Avatar universal
by hanginin, Oct 31, 2009
Hey guys. I'm not feeling to great either notsosunny on day nine but I still feel 1 million times better that that first couple of days and I am not going to forget that. Tomorrow is day 10 and I know with everyone's help I am going to make it. Thanks again for the support and keep fighting the good fight.
hanginin

Avatar universal
by JG525, Oct 31, 2009
I've been enjoying all of the posts.  We went to a county fair tonight and it was great! It felt good to walk around.  Normally, I would have loaded up on T, but today I stuck to my taper and was fine.  I actually feel awesome from walking.  I always do.  I wish I could recall that feeling prior to exercise more :).

I'm really looking forward to stopping next week.  Anxious, but excited.  I know it will be hell at first, but I just have to push through somehow.  I have a yoga retreat next Saturday and I hope I feel well enough for it because I think it could help.  I've never done an all day one before.  Hopefully, the flu like symptoms won't be raging, as it wouldn't be nice for everyone around me to think I have H1N1.

Getting through work will be the hardest part.  Tomorrow, I'm switching to the ER.  I'll have one per day, which will be tough.  Ugh.  

Hang in there everyone! Booba- hope you're okay.

Jenny

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Nov 01, 2009
Good morning everyone.JG I think a yoga retreat is a good place to be during withdrawal because you will be doing relaxing exercises and using your body wisely.You are right that everyone will think you have H1N1 but you can say you have a bad cold.If you are among people sometimes you suppress the bad things and just concentrate on getting thru the day.I worked long and busy hours thru my withdrawal and was able to slug thru the day blaming my sneezing etc on a cold.I was snappy a couple of times but managed to contain myself.That was just a little over 6 weeks ago and now I feel quite normal and experiencing much less pain.That rebound pain it a b...,but once it is gone life is so much better.I know you can quit the tramadol because you quit other addicting stuff.I also quit smoking about 26 years ago and used the same mindset.I have to emphasize that I think it was easier for me because I was only addicted to codeine,not tramadol.I have rheumatoid arthritis and am thinking of taking yoga for exercise.Best of luck to everyone.Also for hanginin...you have reached day 10...just think ,before you know it you will be clean 2 weeks and so on and so on and so on.

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by EmilyPost, Nov 01, 2009
Good Morning

This thread is closed.

Please move to;

http://www.medhelp.org/user_journals/show/133507

Avatar universal
by JG525, Nov 01, 2009
Thanks Pharma- I agree about the yoga retreat being a good place for me.  It'll give me something positive to focus on.  There are two main yoga sessions that involve the other people and a lot of the rest is individual activity, so should be fine.   I hope to at least go to part. I will be on day 2.5 or 3 then, so I expect that to be one of the worst.

Jenny

Avatar universal
by sososo, Nov 01, 2009
hi
i have been following this on and off for a few years.  i also take tramadol plus alcohol and i feel i have complete control of it.  as  far as my pain is concerned, sleeping at night. RLS,  etc.  
As most of u guys had said this drug does make you feel great without being sleepy.  I added the alcohol (VERY little 1/2 pint or so) and it really has helped me.

so if this is such a bad drug (including alcohol)  i can not figure why i should stop.

Avatar universal
by janesweet, Nov 02, 2009
I have been in my head all day (so far) getting nothing accomplished but did go to a (parent teacher meeting).  This will be day one for me (god willing)...I am scared of what is to come,  I realized tapering was not an option for me.  I bought all the stuff for the Thomas recipe (except bought B6 not B12).  I know a lot of you went c/t and I have some other stuff to take the edge off.  Getting off of narcotics is a BIG Bummer.  For those of you on a rather large dose of Tram how long did it take for you to feel somewhat back to normal?  I hope tomorrow I wil be on day two!

I am most nervous about people writing about seizures going c/t.  I have never had one and have gotten off of other narcs as well.  I wish I did not read that because that is my latest obsession (or excuse) not to stop.  I believe some people may be more prone to this disorder than others.  So, please do not write to me about seizures!!!!!!!  

One day at a time I can handle this.  Like a lot of the other women on here I feel such gratitude for my kids and husband and am full of shame for being a pill junkie for the past year.  I want my life back!!!!!!!

sososo,
I would consider that you are on this site for a reason.  I do not think drinking with tramadol is suggested and perhaps you won't get addicted.  If I could use and have control I wouldn't stop either but I have zero control over this drug!  I am curious why you are reading these posts.....

Jane


Avatar universal
by Rossignold, Nov 03, 2009
Hello all! New user here! I want to point it, I just hit my week mark and feel GREAT!!!!

I ran across this site when I was WD'ing earlier in the week! I have currently  hit the 1 week mark as of today! I used for about a year and a half, typical BS, the doc said it's non addictive etc etc you know the deal! Miracle drug for a while, til its gone eh?!

Of course I found out how to order it online, big trouble there! My dad was also into painkillers, he has 90 norco a month and looks for other pills to buy when they are out, I showed him tramadol, and he also ordered his own supply. I could write a novel here but I will try to keep it short! Basically if one of us was out, to save the other from WD, we would keep each other supplied. I guess we felt we could keep ordering it, so we wouldn't have to worry about withdrawal... you know how it is, when you have your trams, not a worry in the world right? Well not for me at least, I could be diagnosed with cancer and if I have my trams, no big deal. Well this past month, we have had a money sink, and could neither afford to buy any more trams! How sickening is this, ONE DAY I TOOK 43 50mg TRAMADOL!!!!! That's how bad I was, I would say on average though a 1000mg-1250mg A DAY habit. I could go through 180 in 5-7 days easy.

THIS IS HOW I GOT OFF TRAMADOL WITHOUT TOO BAD OF WD EFFECTS - I had been stressin so hard, the WD is the worst ever. I took other drugs to help with the withdrawal and man does it sure help! Tramadol is different than an normal opiate so taking n opiate during tram withdrawal well basically, YOU DONT WITHDRAWAL! At least the physical part. The first few days and a couple days of coming way down I had BIG depression. Better than both though right?! This is what drugs I took and what day, mind you this is day 7 for me of tram free!

Day -3 - Yes 2 days before not taking any tram, I knew the supply was almost out, I took 15 instead of normal 20-25, pretty depressed, VERY STRESSED!!!
Day -2 - 6 Tramadol - 300mg, this day was horrible also, wow 300mg is my morning dose right when I wake up. No WD just depression. pretty bad....
Day -1 - MY LAST 2 TRAMADOL - Woke up and took em, found one more 50mg in pocket later. This was the WORST DAY, super depression just knowing what I was in for. I bought 8 percocet for the night took em from dinner time, by 8pn-9pm they were gone I was about crying.
Day 1 - I bought some Morphine for the first couple days, guess what, no withdrawal!!! NONE! Little Depression, not bad at all!!!!!
Day 2- Morphine! no physical withdrawal, depression which is gettin better every day.
Day 3 - One last morphine pill, took in morning, I was depressed all day, but still no WD, why?
Day 4 - No pills.... i'm still not WD, why? Im a littler depressed. Got a 5mg hydrocodone around dinner, did nothing.
Day 5 - I found some more morphine to combat depression, 90mg through the day, not a bad day.
Day 6 (Yesterday) - Very good day!!! Hittin the gym again, I didn't take a single pill! Very happy!
Day 7 - Thats today, for the first time I could not sleep for a darn. I prob woke up every 10 mins. O well I will go to the gym when it opens at 6am in 15 minutes and i'm sure i'll feel better!

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So that's a summary basically, yeah I have suffered MINOR WD effects throughout the week, temperature spikes, and MINOR RLS at night. I have gone through withdrawal before and this is 10% of what I went through when I did it compltely cold turkey. Most nights I got some Xanax to help me sleep. The weird thing is that I haven't had the runs one time. I feel like I am in the clear only a week in, I feel good this morning, my worst night of sleep... The 3 days of weeening down were the worst by far, I wanted to cry at random times.

HAS ANYONE ELSE USED OPTIATES TO COME OFF OF TRAMADOL? IT WORKED FOR ME!

Of course it's not like i'm completely beaten this. I have bad back pain, tram got rid of that. Obviously I can't sleep as well either.

I'm gonna head to the gym, and questions I will check this site periodically, but I want to say only a week in and I feel AMAZINGLY better, I am not a slave to that POS pill!!!! I do not mean to make it sound easy, it is not easy at all! Keep at it, every day gets better and better. We can all do it. Sounds corny, but if I can anyone can, tramadol was my LIFE!

~Rossignold

Avatar universal
by Rossignold, Nov 03, 2009
Just got done with a nice workout and feel great! Still slight temperature spikes, when I was running I was sweating while cold, which *****, but they slight effects are getting slighter every day! My back is KILLING me though! Not sure how to help with that, I took 2 excedrin's and 2 ibuprofen this mornin so I can't take any more til at LEAST lunch time. Long uphill battle but you gotta stay positive or you will make it even harder on yourself!

How's everyone else doing today?

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by 12Stepper, Nov 03, 2009
Rossignold, the thread has moved to a new page, as it does when the current one gets too long. Click on the link by EmilyPost a few posts above or go to the top of the page and click next. Welcome to the site, see you on the next page. Linn

Avatar universal
by srvblooze, Nov 05, 2009
I'm on day 25 now after stopping Tramadol "cold turkey". I put quotations around that phrase because it's not as though I didn't have some prescription help from my Doctor. I don't crave Tramadol and I'm not looking to replace them with alcohol (my favorite before Tram) or other painkillers. I've been on the treadmill for an hour most days and I'm finally over my candy bar cravings for the most part.

The only thing lingering now is withdrawal insomnia. My doctor has given me revolving types of sleep aids so that I don't become dependent upon any one of them but my brain seems to figure out a way around all of them after the first night. So far mind has figured out a way to get around Valium, Imovane, Sinequan and something else that I'm forgetting right now.

Still, if THIS is as bad as it is getting now? I consider myself very, very lucky. And I'll be patient. I have read on here that it takes some time - sometimes measured in many months - for sleep to normalize.

Thanks everyone. Onward and upward.

Avatar universal
by JG525, Nov 05, 2009
srvblooze- The thread has moved to the next one.  I doubled my usual klonopin dose last night, plus meletonin and valerian and it seemed to work. J

Avatar universal
by Callisto919, Nov 07, 2009
Hiya Guys,
I've been t-free for more than 2 months now and have just recently changed my job from a lot of driving (150 miles a day) to a lot of walking (5 miles a day). I have a crumbling lower lumbar so, walking that much was angony. I went back to my GP to find a solution to the problem, and guess what.........
She advised me the best painkiller to take was Tramadol, which I have now 200 of, sitting on my kitchen worktop and I'm going through hell at the moment, there they are, I'm in severe pain, but do I dare take any of them?  The last time I stopped taking Tramadol I was in W/D for over 2 weeks, got depressed and ill. Has anyone here got any sensible advise? I really would apreciate it,
thanks so much
Callisto919

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by madtram, Nov 07, 2009
Oh Callisto, the biggest frustration with the effective pain control question is that the "what not to takes" outweigh the good ideas.  Also everyone's pain threshold is individual, I still can't imagine a level of pain sufficient to induce me to take tramadol if nothing else was available but I am not in your painful shoes.

What I have found sufficient for my torn rotator cuffs is a combination of celebrex; the amino acid d-phenylalanine & the very occasional, (once or twice a month), single dose of 10mgs of codeine, (available here OTC).

I assume you have explored all useful physical therapy; surgery type options.  I know jobs are rare as hens teeth at present, but maybe even a different job that didn't require the walking would be worth considering.

I hope you find a tramadol-free solution.

Avatar universal
by Callisto919, Nov 07, 2009
Yup Madtram,
thanks for replying
I had accupunture, ultra sound therapies, epidurals and there was talk of performing a fusion, I really REALLY don't want to kick of back where I started, I'm already on the highest codeine dosage pescribed (30/500 8 a day)
You're sort of reeling drugs of, as though they're available with a snap of your finger, but I don't think my GP is going to give me any of the mention medication.
I have made up my mind though, just got back from the toilet, where various capsules are still floating, slowly disintegrating.
Well done to me!!
Thanks Madtram
Strength and Power yo all
Callisto

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by Gerty411, Nov 09, 2009
hi y'all

I relapsed--bad.  I can't stand the guilt of failing.  I have to get of this drug or i will either die or ruin everyones life around or both.  Today is the start of my taper.  I'm shaky  and irritable and scared.

Gerty

983592 tn?1249766535
by Gerty411, Nov 09, 2009
hi again you all,

I'm a bit more able to think now.   I was on t for about 2 years. I started taking because I have an addictive personality and I discovered i could get t on the internet.  Before I was able to control my desire for narcotics simply because they were very hard to acquire.  

I tapered off of t and stopped the end of August.  I don't know what made me order but I did after 1 month tram-free.  I quickly escalated to 15-20 50mg pills/day and began to drink very heavily.  I also spent thousands of dollars on various things.  I feel part of my relapse was depression.

I must get off this fecalent drug.  

I miss you all (nancy/fred/chrissie ]

Gerty

Avatar universal
by hockeymom1355, Nov 11, 2009
Hi everyone, I thought I'd share my story to add to the proof of how addicting this drug is.  Three months ago I had my Rotator Cuff repaired.  Doc gave me oxycodone (5 mg) and hydrocodone (2mg) right after surgery.  After about a week on the oxy, I tried to switch to just Advil during the day.  Big mistake.  Having no experience with drugs, I didn't realize I was withdrawing.  So, I tapered off the oxy, down to at night only and occasional other use (long car rides, mainly).   Started the hydrocodone when the oxy ran out,mainly for nights and also occasional other uses, as pain dictated, but was generally just one dose at night.  At my 2 month visit, I mentioned to my doc that I still needed the night dose to sleep due to pain. He switched me to Tramadol.  I didn't ask questions, I figured he knew best.  Dosage was 50 mg once a day.  I never exceeded that.  I was on the Tramadol for two weeks when I no longer needed it for pain at night.  I've been three days without and, though I never had daytime symptoms, the nights were tough with insomnia, night sweats,and feeling like I was going to jump out of my skin.    I'm now on Advil only, as needed, though I must admit that I've been tempted the last day or two to take a Tramadol because of pain.  Reading everyone's accounts, and knowing that I would need to go through another withdrawal, has changed my mind.  I don't know if  my story is one of addiction to narcotics as I did take them daily in varying doses for almost 3 months, or if it's what two weeks of Tramadol can do.  Maybe both.  Scares the *&%% out of me that these drugs can have such a profound effect after such short duration of use.  I've read what some of you have gone through after years of use and my heart goes out to you.  I have great admiration for your struggles.  I'm going to go flush the rest of my Tramadol down the toilet.  I can guarantee you that I will have a much more intelligent dialogue with doctors about painkillers from now on, whether for myself or my family members.

Best wishes to everyone in your

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by wantmyselfback, Nov 13, 2009
I am starting my story today.  Like the hundreds (if not thousands) of people who have shared their story, I too am a victim of Tramadol.  Long story short, had a Galbladder that wasn't flushing properly, and for three years, my doctor said NOTHING was wrong, but continued to give me tramadol, because as he put it:  "This drug isn't addictive and it won't cause any problems that are associated with Vicodin or Percocet."  Had I known that was not the case, I would've told him I'd rather eat 1000 MG's of Ibuproferen and suffer the risk of a bleeding ulcer.  This was five years ago.  Since had my Galbladder removed, needed knee surgery as a result of a torn meniscus - again - my doctor bragged himself on not prescribing me "narcotics," so eventually just gave me a year round prescription for 180 (50 Mg) tabs a month.  Needless to say, almost ALL of these pills were gone by the end of the month.  Started in the early years with reccommended dosage, then up until recently, was taking upwards of 8-10 pills a day.  As a result of a torn rotator cuff, I need surgery again.  I now have a new doctor and told him about my tramadol addiction and how I had to take more and more to make myself able to function and work in a high-functioning marketing world.
He told me to take myself off the tramadol, which doesn't help, as I have tried REPEATEDLY to quit, only to feel like my body was shutting down after a day or two.  Gave up after day three and started taking it again.

I have to commend EmilyPost for her heroic efforts to keep this post alive.  I'm not sure if anyone knows how long these posts have been going, but she truly is inspirational and should win the upcoming HERO award for CNN.  Her story has touched me, and I know I can do this, slowly but surely.  

As I'm not ready to quit cold turkey (tried it AGAIN the past two days- but couldn't bear it anymore), I am going to start a gradual decrease in dosage and will seek help from my new doctor, who has recommended a combination of Lexapro and Xanax as a way to basically dope myself up enough to make it through the four day- seven day severe withdrawal symptoms.  I'm not ready for that just yet.  I am still coming down from as many as 10 pills a day (total of 500 MG) as little as last week.  

I am going to start my journey today by reducing my intake gradually and will keep everyone posted.  If I can be like Emily, I CAN DO THIS.  I too thought that I needed Tramadol to be able to function, and to make myself more spunky and outgoing.  Days I didn't start off with my two in the morning as soon as I woke up, I already started to feel worse.

One other thing as a side note, since taking Tramadol SIX years ago, every year I got my bloodwork done, my Eosinophil count was off the charts (1700 was my average count)  Normal range is like 300-600.  Three things cause for elevated Eosinophils- allergies (which I have one- but now am starting to think I have an allergy to Tramadol with no visible side-effects), Cancer- such as non-hodkins lymphoma, or a symptom called Hyper-Eosinophilic Syndrome, in which they have No clue what is causing it.  As a result of many stressful visits to CANCER CENTERS and doctors (not to mention causing my wife to have a near heart attack because she lost her mother to cancer), they ruled out Cancer and Allergies and basically said they have no clue what is causing my high eosinophil count.  What's the bad news?  High eosinophils are like a double-edged sword.  They fight off infection but can also attack the heart and lungs, leading to higher chances of stroke or heart attacks.  I also plan to see if it is the Tramadol.  The weirdest thing is, despite the risk of DEATH later on, I still "NEED" tramadol.  Without it, I feel like I am at a complete loss to have my body function.  

Although I do have some pain in my shoulder as a result of a bike accident, there is NO NEED for the tramadol, and although I constantly tell myself this, my body tells me otherwise.  I'm coming out today!  I'm feeling good!  And I know, as a result of the THOUSANDs of posts on here, I too, can overcome this terrible addiction and withdrawal.  

This is DAY ONE:  11/13/09.  I plan to gradually reduce my count to zero by 12/13/09.  ONE MONTH.  I ask for your prayers and help during this difficult month, FOLLOWED by the WEEK OF WITHDRAWAL HELL I am almost certain to get again.  I just can't do it cold turkey... at all.

I appreciate your support, and Emily, if you are still out there.... your words are most valuable to me.  I thank you for being a true advocate and having such a powerful and uplifting experience.

Let's do this! :)

Avatar universal
by cspcvn, Dec 13, 2009
Hi all

I have been taking tramadol for about a year for 2 bulging discs. I started on 50mg then 100 then 150 and now 200 , I stopped taking them at one stage and my husband ended up putting me on his own personal suicide watch. O ended up on them again when i awoke one night with severe pain....

The last week or so i have been experiencing a crackling and pressure feeling on he right side of my head above my ear. It is the most freaky thing ever and i am really frightened. I was planning on quitting smoking tomorrow and now that i am so scared of this feeling i was contemplating going cold turkey from both... not such a smart idea i guess....

Please... has anyone else experienced anything like this and could it be the tramadol?  Im thinking brain tumors and stuff right now and am really in a state of panic......  Im a mum of 3 and im really really scared....

Avatar universal
by kimta, Jan 05, 2010
by kimta

That crackling and pressure you were, or are feeling is indeed, the Tramadol. I have also experienced it to the point of believing I had infection in my ear because it became painful. I'm not a Doctor, but I doubt it's a tumor.

How amazing that this conversation has gone on so long, I'm really thankful today for having stumbled across it because it helped me calm down. I'm a 42 year old full-time student, (yeah, I finally took the leap and went back.). For Chemical Dependency Counselor no less. Today I had a total meltdown, right in front of the new class I am supposed to be TA'ing for. I'm introducing myself to the new students, but as I begin to speak I find I can hardly breath, I am shaking uncontrollably, and I begin to sweat. Now I am embarrassed and not sure what I should do. I sit down in the chair the Instructor positioned for me. Directly in front of, and facing all the students! I am on display in full panic mode. I try to get myself under control. I almost think I can do it when it starts to happen all over again. I last about 20 minutes before I stand up, and as ungracefully as a drunken sailor, (but one that is afraid for her life), almost walk into the door before I can get through it. Out in the hall my heart is pounding so hard I can hear it. I am mortified. I have just made a complete fool of myself.

For the last 5 1/2 months I have been prescribed Tramadol for bulging disks in all three regions of the spine, moderate to severe stenosis in many of the nerve canals from the spine, and pinched nerves that numb my arms and hands. The disks have migrated to where they are impinging and begining to flatten the spinal cord. It's alot of pain all the time. But I have had substance abuse problems in the past. I spent many years on meth. My doc is obviously leary of prescribing me narcotics. I go through Flexyril, methocarbamol, meloxicam, bottles and bottles of Ibuprofin and a few more I can't spell. They all have adverse reactions for me and I feel NO relief. Throughout these meds I am taking Tramadol here and there. He finally lands on Tramadol as my only option. Because it's non-narcotic and sounds as if the only adverse reaction would be siezures if I were to take too many. It keeps my stomach upset alot but it helps better than anything else so far. I've been taking 180 50mg/month for the last 4 months in a row. I've stuck to the prescribed dosage, 100mg 3x/day. I've run out early by only 2-3 days a couple times due to severely bad days. This last time I ran out 6 days before my scrip was due for refill. In just over 24 hours I was in hell and had to go to the ER. They gave me a shot of Demerol and another scrip for Tramadol to hold me over. That was Sunday morning about 4am and even though I have begun my dosage again, I lost it today. My emotions are... a mess. I was shaking uncontrollably earlier, now it is like a low-grade tremor. Along with the shot I got in the ER, I got some information; Tramadol is NOT NON-narcotic, as I was told. It is an opiate but with an additive to prevent me from feeling the euphoria from it. And I am now in full-blown opiate addiction.

I used Meth for years and suffered the detox many times. I wish that was my problem now. At least you sleep! Before my back problems, I never had any serious psycological episodes, (if you have ever used meth, you know your not completely immune). It was Gabapentin that showed me what they were and how quickly they can escalate. And it was supposed to help me. I had tried opiates but never found them attractive and have certainly never been "sick" from using them. I thought drug addiction was in my past.

Now I feel like I've been lied to. All this time I've been taking Tramadol because I couldn't be trusted with the drugs that would give me the most relief. Tramadol makes me tense, gives me headaches, gives me insomnia and doesn't give me THAT much relief. If I was going to have to go through all of this, I DAMN WELL WOULD HAVE RATHER HAD SOME REAL PAIN RELIEF!

I would like to know if there is anyone still posting on this here and if anyone has done the 1/4 pill less/day route and how they did with it. There are just sooo many posts to read them all. Anyone...  

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by evanrude, Mar 10, 2010
*******reposting here after noticing several "let's move here" links; this seems to be the most-recent page?*******

hello, all.  echoing many others, i've come across this site/journal in quiet desperation; i am posting this quick post to determine whether i'm posting in the correct area.  i'm on about 400mg tramadol/day for five years--the maximum daily dosage--and am very depressed, lethargic, and just...in a severe malaise.  i've tapered to this amount over a month.  i know what i am in for after reading posts here--and from mini-withdrawals i've experienced over the years.  the worst part, for me, is the stomach pain, cramping, and stomach-"nervousness."  it's as if the tramadol has masked some kind of severe peptic ulcer, though i realize it's most certainly just a part of the withdrawal hell.  i'll close here, in case i'm posting on an old thread.  if i'm in the right place, will someone kindly let me know?  the "good" news is that i am unemployed, so i have *time* to do this without the incredible burden of having to function at work, which i can't imagine doing.  i am waiting for my next unemployment cheque to pay for some rxs i have waiting (clonazepam, prozac, soma), which i've taken for many, many, many years (clonazepam prn, prozac 40mg/day, though i became so lax about taking it when on tramadol, that i'd all but stopped it after being on it for 14 years).

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by cleobaby74, Mar 17, 2010
Hi guys, since you all seem to be so very knowledgable, I thought I would ask you about this.... (I found your room through a nonrelated search).  I am was recently prescribed 100mg Tramadol a day and even more recently, Clonazepam.  I have chrnoci head pain, neck pain, and recurrent small strokes as well as seizures and neuro probs tha are still getting worked on getting DX'ed.  I was taking Tylenol 4 before the Tramadol but I told the doctor I didn't like it because it made me feel kidn of "icky" and but that could have just been coincidental.  I still take it for spikes.  Anyway,  The tram plus clonazepam is actually helping my pain more than anything in a long time (plus it's the forst time i have take it on a maintenenace basis) and the clonazepam is a great muscle relaxer.  I REALLY do not want to get addicted to anything and aside from coffee and cigs, never have.  What can you tell me that is really bad about tramadaol?  Any suggestions for someone who feels they actually need some help (this is the frist  time in a long time pain hasn't ruled my life).  I have slipping cognition problems and worsening TIA's so I cant take ANYTHING that might risk making that worse and I want to be on a good regimen, be done with it and worry about more important crud.  ANyway, any advice a[[reciated.  Thanks!

Avatar universal
by missmelanie25, Aug 23, 2010
Wow, i have spent all morning reading all of these posts and it has helped me in my mind tremendously. I am 25 years old, have two little kids and the love of my life i have back after losing him over and over again, life is great on the fact that i have everything that i could ask for in a family, but over the past three years i have been STRUGGLING with pain meds, mostly vicodin, then i would take the tramadol when i ran out of vicodin, id get 120 pills and they would last me two weeks instead of a month, then it turned into about 8 days instead of a month, i went to rehab because i got so SICK AND TIRED OF BEING SICK AND TIRED, you know what i mean, the withdrawals really are just plain HELL, and for someone who hasnt been there, you cant even begin to explain the pain you feel inside, whether its vicodin or tramadol, they are both one of the tools of the devil to steal kill and destroy you, and they will if you dont get away from them and stay away, in the Bible somewhere it says to stay away from sorcery and witchcraft. i looked up and sorcery and witchcraft in the dictionary and one of the definitions of it says pharmaceuticals. and the more i think about that the more it makes sense. Any mood altering substance is going to eventually lead me to misery and loneliness. Bc i cant just take what im prescribed, i take it till i feel how i want to feel. But anyways, i went to rehab about 6 months ago, and two months after i got out i wound up right back where i started except worse because i felt so shameful and depressed even more so because of a severe feeling of dispair and utter failure, but then i got through those withdrawals, then i started taking tramadol because i figured that its not my drug of choice but it might keep me sane, because i got past the withdrawals but after the withdrawals go away about ten days of not bein able to function physically from then on i couldnt STAND it because i feel so over anxious and just plain psychotic as hell on the inside and depressed and cant find joy in anything, so i started taking those again four or five a day and today i have just ran out and told myself THIS IS IT< ENOUGH IS ENOUGH, i cant take this anymore, always searching trying to find ways to feel right, just get these ******* withdrawals over with and people will just have to deal with me being a depressed mess for however long it takes to get myself back, my grandma told me even if you have to crawl for a while youll make it honey, and that got me thinking, because i would rather be crawling towards happiness and the life i DESERVE than running towards my destruction and misery and making everyone in my path miserable. i am such a sweet and meek and gentle country girl thats who i am, i dont talk much, ive been hurt ALOT and here in the past 3 years ive made a MESS out of my life using drugs to mask my heartbreaks, i dont want to be who these drugs have turned me into, i seen this little poem the other day, it says, watch your thoughts for they become actions, watch your actions for they become habits, watch your habits for they become your character, watch your character it becomes your destiny. i thought that was kind of a good thing for me to hear, Anyways, im on Day 1 for the 100th time and hopefully the last time of my life, this addiction has to die so i can live. I feel like crap and cant stop crying and goin to the bathroom and my head feels like a bowling ball so heavy and clouded and ive got the sweaty dirty feeling and cold hot cold hot, and not to mention an exxagerated feeling of despair and loneliness and my boyfriend sleeps on the couch every night, maybe i snore i dunno lol, but that makes me even more lonely i just want to be held tight, but then again when i feel like this i dont want to be touched when im tryin to sleep, but then again im extremely what do you call it... horny, lol when im withdrawing but not a damn thing i can do about it because your so sick that you dont even feel like having sex unless you can just lay there, lol, anyways, im glad i stumbled across this website, its good to see people in support of eachother going through the same thing, because it surely is straight up hell, and it helps to read about others going through the same thing when you feel so lonely you dont know what to do with yourself, yeah ive done written a book, but maybe i said somethin in here to help someone else out, i hope so, :) Good bye for now
Mel

Avatar universal
by Redbone1975, Nov 02, 2011
Took tramadol for 4+ years and took 400 to 500 mgs a day EVERYDAY!!! stopped cold turkey two days ago and i feel like im going to die. Plus i have to go to work feeling like a dead man walking. My symptoms are brain "zaps" , insomnia, tossing and turning in bed, feeling hot/cold, hot/cold. This ***** because i dont know how long this will last. I dont even feel like getting up to go to the bathroom...now thats bad! O well, i did this to myself and now im paying the price! Im doing this the most for my wife and kids because for the last 4 years my family was tramadol and not themmm:'''(

RED  

Avatar universal
by turkeytrotter, Nov 22, 2011
Hi I am a transplant recipient of 20 years. I have back/hip pain; I started taking Aleve and that worked just fine, take one a day and I could function just fine without hurting. When I told my doc this, he told me to stop that day because it could hurt my kidneys. So, I told him he had to give me something that I could take because I couldn't live in pain and he put me on Ultram. I've been on it since 08; the weird thing is, it worked WONDERS the first year and little by little Its lost its effect.

I think it doesn't work 80% of the time but I still take it in hopes of not having pain. My dose is 50mg every 8 hrs. I've noticed the last two times I've ran out, I've gotten what I assumed was a bad cold and never thought about it. This time, I took my last dose Friday and woke up Saturday feeling ill again like I was coming down with a cold.

I've had chills, sweats, my body aches, I'm sneezing constantly...been doing this for now 4 days. Today I woke up feeling somewhat human so decided to TRY to run...barely ran a mile but felt good to be doing something after being confined to my bed.

Is what I'm going through a stupid cold or WD? I've been on Morphine and other strong pain meds before from surgeries and never had any type of WD that I remember. If I am WD, then how long will it be before I completely have my energy back and stop aching. Its confusing because I don't know if this aching is my normal thing or from this....

Thanks for any input!

Avatar universal
by quittram, Jan 02, 2012
I have taking trams for about 10years do to my back pain, all prescribed by the doctor. I started with a low dose and for the last 3-4years I took 300mg tram along with THREE 800mg Motrin’s  PER DAY. It is literarily painful to quit. I started yesterday; I took 75mg along with 800mg Motrin in the morning and today 50mg tram with 800mg Motrin. I don’t feel too bad, I was in bed all day yesterday looking at this site and how encouraging is to here from all this people that have gone or going through the same thing. I am tired of living like this, its not me that’s living is the meds that messed me up BIG TIME!!!!!  physically and mentally. I can’t wait to get over this, but I’m worried that I still have to take something for my back, I wonder what I can take if the Motrin doesn’t to the job. I don’t want to take any more narcotics.
I wish you all a successful journey, and hope we can all make it.


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