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Tramadol & Ultram Recovery Room Part 25

Jan 04, 2010 - 233 comments
Tags:

tramadol

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ultram

,

Recovery

,

Healing

,

withdrawal



Hi and Welcome Tramadol Warriors,

Please come on in and make yourself comfy.

All are welcome.

Love and Healing,
Emily

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946806 tn?1246069369
by Pat_, Jan 04, 2010
Day nine is over, cuz i am going to bed... 8-)

Today was a good day in many ways, got an early am work out in (not the back/hammies), and went to Yoga this evening. However, work was rough and I struggled to find ways to control the leg and lower back pin. I did make it through the day tram free and am now sitting on an icepack. I don't feel any more weirdness or withdrawals, just pain.

Stay Strong!

Avatar universal
by howcouldiknow88, Jan 04, 2010
Congrats Pat! So glad to hear you are feeling well in terms of withdrawal. I'm on day 9 as well, and I'm still feeling some withdrawal :(

Pharma, I bet some of those chronic users are like me. Most probably run out early, but don't get their refill until the circled due date anyway. Because they don't want their supply questioned or discontinued. They think 25 days of bliss is worth the 5 days of hell in this horrible cycle. Or maybe they can always get supplemental tramadol. I never could. Finding tramadol on the street is impossible here. I'm glad I finally decided to end this cycle. Never thought I would. I was the biggest tramadol lover! We were all there at one point I believe.

4leef, hope the return to work is going well.

fred, thanks again for such encouraging wisdom.

Avatar universal
by downinthedumps1968, Jan 05, 2010
To Pat and howcouldiknow,

Big time congrats to both of you!  I kicked vicodin and tramadol a few times over the last 5-6 years on my own, and boy is it rough as hell.

In Dec. 2009, I gave up and entered a detox since I didn't think I could do it on my own anymore.  So, be very proud of what you've done; I wish I could've finished this crap off by myself.

Just like so many people reiterate here, "The easy part is kicking it. Staying off is the hard part."

I want you to succeed in beating the wd's and beyond. For me, it seems like knowing I was a pill popper was humiliating. But being a relapser was worse.

Great work!  Stay strong!


Avatar universal
by chrissie145, Jan 05, 2010
Hi, I havent been on the site for ages - although I keep in touch with good friends I made on here. I have been clean of tramadol since July and clean of Benzo's since August. I write to ask if anyone has experience of diaphragm problems as they come off these drugs. My diaphragm keeps contracting and trying to push 'something' out. It is manifesting as a cough at the moment (for 4 weeks) . My diaphragm seems to be irritated and go inot a sort of spasm and then just push out. It is very distressing and interferes with speaking and eating. The result is that I am becoming even more reclusive as I cant talk to people. I am also losing a lot of weight as I cant eat properly.  I know that there is a plexus of nerves there and wonder if the w/d from the benzo's is now affecting that. Or maybe the drugs have damaged my stomach.

If you see this Emily or Madtram could you advise me please. Or if anyone else has this experience I would be grateful for a few words. I also have gastritis and oesophagitis - so maybe it is connected with this? (And I was diagnosed with M.E. a year ago but was hoping it was just the drugs)

The recovery from benzo w/d is slow and painful and I am permanently exhausted. But I was making progress until this began.

Good luck to you all. This is a great site to be on and I have had so much help and encouragement. I do think that if my problem had stopped at tramadol I would be okay now. I believe it is the benzo w/d that are keeping me ill.

Chrissie

1001199 tn?1288139053
by adamIScool, Jan 05, 2010
The diaphragm thing probably isn't related to the wd, it could however be a sign of something awry with your parasympathetic nervous system ei- the nerves that make you sneeze. If it begins to affect your ability to inhale or exhale then go to the ER post haste.

1103290 tn?1261754965
by gerty411411, Jan 05, 2010
Hey Y'all,

Day 50 is arising!  Thank all of you for your advice and support.

Gerty

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 05, 2010
Hi Everyone- Sorry, I haven't been able to keep up with posts.  I'm still clean.  Need to update my tracker and see how long.  I just turned 30 on December 30th and we went to New Orleans for the weekend.  It was fun and I can't say I even thought about tramadol.  I did have a couple of drinks though, which is unlike me and I ate WAY too much.  Not planning on continuing drinking or eating excessively.  

I'm going to try and start reading from here.  Hope everyone is doing okay!  Jenny

1106880 tn?1260898678
by wantmyselfback, Jan 05, 2010
.Hey Gang!

For the newbies.... welcome.  You ever hear the saying "to each his own?"  Well, of the thousands of posts on here, you need to figure out what works best for you during w/d and also the weeks and month following withdrawal and coping with P.A.W.S.  

Read back the thousands of posts on here.  I like to start with Emily's initial posts and work from there.  It's good reading during your heavy w/d period.  

Hundreds swear by different things, yet there is one ultimate goal:  to make it through the first few days of W/D.  For me, it was xanax during the first few days (but I would STRONGLY not reccommend taking it for more than a few days, as someone mentioned above you need to be wary of picking up another addiction to cope with the loss of tramadol.)  A safer alternative which caught my attention is Trazadone.  Trazadone is a mild anti-depressant which has tremendous sleep properties.  You might want to have that handy at night time if you can talk to your doctor about it (ask him for it for sleep).

The biggest obstacle is getting through those first couple of days.  The thrashing in bed, the agony, the pain and spasms.... let it all out.  

Another thing that got me through the first few days was that 5-hour energy shot.  I think along with a multi-vitamin, b-12, and that I was able to regain some strength.  Oh, and LOTS and LOTS of Gatorade.

As I said before, to each his own.  Some experience horrible w/d that lasts for 4 days, some only 2 days.   Keep in mind, W/D from tramadol does not happen overnight.  It will take at least a full week before you start getting "yourself" back.  

An underlying situation also might be your psychological state.  Depression seems to affect almost everyone while going through w/d.  I was prescribed 10 MG of Lexapro for anxiety for a month, which I finally am off now that it's been about day 24 for me.  Although it takes about 2 weeks for the Lexapro to start working fully, I found it to be quite helpful by day 7 of w/d.  The most important thing you can do is make sure you feel better and do things you enjoy to lighten your mood.  

You can and Will do this, and we're here to help!  Those who have succeeded, and those who are going through it with you.... will all stand together and support you.  Just be strong.


1106880 tn?1260898678
by wantmyselfback, Jan 05, 2010
Just re-posted that since I hate being the last person before a thread gets closed!

Anyways, I've lost count... I think I'm on Day 25 or something.  Let me just tell you, I thought there could possibly be NOTHING WORSE than Tramadol W/D until you eat bad Chinese Food!  I was up sick all night and swore I would have to go to the E.R. because I couldn't keep any fluid down.  But just wanted to let you know that there ARE things worse than Tram W/D, but not many!  

I'm proud of all of those who have joined these threads to get off this drug.  Suprisingly, Like I've mentioned before, I used to take Tramadol to give me the upper edge in a high-functioning job and SWORE that it really did give me the upper hand and was able to multi-task and receive "Exceeds Expectations" on my annual reviews for the past three years.

Funny thing is, that's not the case.  I know I'm still going through P.A.W.S, but the keyword is "acute" withdrawal symptoms.  We are all much better off with Tramadol and it might take a few days of h.e.ll to get through it, but once you make it through the first week, you're going to start to realize you're much better off without it.

The only MIRACLE drug I've found is Ibuprofren to help with my pain.  I had a good friend/doctor tell me that the only people who should be on pain medication is for post-surgery and/or cancer.  800 MG of Ibuprofren he said does the same for pain management as one Vicodin/Percocet, minus the buzz.

The trick is for us who enjoy the "buzz" is that it really isn't worth it.  I'm finding keeping yourself busy and doing things you love gives you a natural buzz that can compensate for a synthetic buzz.

And one last thing, if you go into a Chinese Restaraunt (and I LOVE Chinese food) and they are making Won-Tons with no gloves and the guy keeps wiping his nose with his sleeve.... do yourself a favor and walk out! :)

Stay strong warriors!

701000 tn?1231964233
by 1113, Jan 05, 2010
ok all well it's been awhile since i've posted....  i read almost everyday.. for sure every week.    it's been about 21 days for me now that i haven't taken tram.  first week was rough of course.  i've got to say that the Christmas season reall did help me out because i didn't have time to sit and feel sorry for myself.  

i feel like this time around has been different..  i feel like i've crossed a bridge to a different side of tram feelings.  before i use to like the way i felt on these things and i am sure that i would not be complaining if i had some right now....   but i have really enjoyed just being myself with out any kind of WD thoughts.  Just glad that i can enjoy the evening in peace with myself...  my kids, my WIFE (God i wish i could tell her, but i don't think that i could handle her dissappointment in me).

Lillyval, i sent you a message, becuase i haven't been logged i didn't realize that you sent me a pm about 6MONTHS ago.  Man, what an ******* i felt like when i realized that you tried to talk to me and i didn't respond (please forgive me because i didn't know).


I am going to say this here, becuase i don't know where to go with it....    but this is to my wife Lisa.  if ever one day you stumble across this site and discover my dark secret.  Please forgive me.  Everyday that i thought i was in a better place because if this stupid drug, i was always riddle with Guilt and Disgust on the inside.  It just seemed easier to continue what i was doing then stopping and going through the pain, but now i am so close to the otherside I will continue to march forward and become a better person for it.  

Through God all things are possible,

PJ

1106880 tn?1260898678
by wantmyselfback, Jan 05, 2010
PJ,

Don't be so hard on yourself.  If you look back to I believe Journal #23, I decided to go cold turkey after 10+ a day.  You can read my posts, my emotions, everything I went through... and then something amazing happened.  By the grace of God I accidentally left up this website during day 2 of severe w/d.  

My wife always knew I took tramadol and I primarily touted it as a "non-narcotive pain medication similiar to ibuprofren but 'prescription strength'.  Boy was I living a lie.  

During my days of W/D, I actually lied to everyone and said I had the swine flu.  I would've gotten away with it and possibly felt good about myself, if I hadn't left up this website.

Let me just tell you this, PJ, leaving this website up was possibly the best thing that could ever have happened to me.  Instead of blaming me, being concerned, and all those other fears I had about my wife thinking I was as bad as a heroin addict, something happened:  I had her support.  I couldn't have done it without her.

Think of it this way:  Tramadol is a prescription drug.  It's not something you go to the street corner to purchase to get a "high."  I think it would've definitely been a different story if I was buying heroin off the street corner, but the fact is my wife knew this was prescribed to me (and yes- self-prescribed by those ******* online pharmacies)... but prescribed none-the-less.  

Don't feel guilty for hiding your addiction from your Wife.  Trust me, I was in the same boat.  Would I EVER have admitted it to her?  Absolutely not.  But her finding my posts put things into a totally different perspective.  She knew I was battling a drug that had taken over my body and gave me the support I needed.  Lying about the swine flu could've worked... but I never would have felt the same.

I'm not you PJ, but you might want to come clean with your wife.  It's a hard choice to make, but what I did was told my wife to go back and read the hundreds of posts about Tramadol.  That's all it took for me to get her support.

I'm not saying I'm an angel or completly cured.  Although I am cured of Tramadol, I still battle alcohol and dealing with an addictive personality.  I often wonder (since I'm only 30) if I have to fight for the next 50 years or so these cravings that I have.  I'd like to say I'm young... but I know with my two kids growing up, I need to get my act together.  

People say counseling helps.  AA or NA helps.  My point is, my wife's side of the family seems to be perfect in every sense.  Addiction is a problem, and one thing I find being an addict, is I'm looking for a pill to cure addiction... which I know is leading me down the long road.

Sorry for the rambling, but it just seems like we all have our struggles, our bouts of depression.  I just want to be cured of my addicitive personality... which I'm still trying to figure out how to do that.  I've posted that doing things I enjoy helps... but deep back in my mind there's always the thought that a little buzz of some kind would just make things a little better.

Although I know I'm NEVER going back to Tramadol... I still am faced with an addictive personality... which I seek advice how to cure that... cause we all know how hard it is if you do have an addictive personality.



Avatar universal
by BD12345, Jan 05, 2010
Hi. This is my first time to this site. I put into google, "Detoxing from Tramadol," and this is the first thing that came up and I could not be more grateful. I have been wanting to quit for so long and promised myself I would but I never seemed to go the first 10 hours to start the process, I am now on hour 60 and I feel horrible. But what is more horrible is the secret life I have been living for the last year or so.

About two years, I had an accident and was prescribed tramadol and I loved the way it made me feel. After finding that it was available online, I have proceeded to spent the majority of my and my husbands money on it for the last couple of years. The thing is, I knew I have had a problem with it for a while ago. About six months ago, I tried to tell my husband the whole truth and he got so upset I started to lie and tell him I was telling him about something that happened two years ago, not something that was happening now - MY Horrible Addiction to Tramadol that has taken over my life.

He still will chime in, if we are watching a movie or something, if I ever find you are on those pills again that would be the end of it...you would be out.

That is only the beginning on the story, besides the fact that I take about 25-30 a day, one of the wonderful side effects are seizures. Last year, I had a Grande Mal Seizure in front of my husband and my mother and ended up in the hospital for three days until the doctor told me you have epilepsy and sent me off with some more pills to take.

For about 3 months I still did not think that the seizures and tramadol were connected because I was still getting seizures, about one a week and it did not happen for the year before when I was taking the drug. I finally realized the seizures would only happen when I took VERY large doses of tramadol so I have tried to be careful not to over due it.

So, for the last year my family has thought I had epilepsy, which has been a great cover to spent the last year not being as productive as I could be, but I just cannot function when I am on them or when I am off them-of course. They used to make me want to do a million things and now they make me feel horrible. It is a no win situation and I want to get off them so badly.

After a couple months with my seizures ie I have my addiction "haha under conrtol," still taking 20-30 a day, I am starting a new job, just finished my Masters and I really want to start my life off right and get off of the grip of this horrible pill.

I know I am rambling but the truth is, as much as I want to quit, the only reason it has been 60 hours is because there was a technical problem with my tramadol delivery and it is not coming until tomorrow. I do not know what I am going to do when they come tomorrow. In my mind, I take a couple and use this last prescription to taper myself off but I do not know if I am strong enough.

I am so scared and I need support but I do not know who to turn to for it, I am so glad I found this site. I feel like such a liar with my epilepsy and drugs-what has this drug let me become.



Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 05, 2010
HELLO ALL      thanks for your truth about the brutality of both addiction, addictive behavior and the wicked ride of w/d


Pat and Howcould I ---congrats on your 9 plus days Tram Free!!! What a ride, huh? Want Myself Back- chinese food warning noted and registered as gastronomic disaster for you!!
JC hope work went well
  
I made it through work yesterday AND today...funny thing at 5 1/2 days and back to work I wore LONG UNDERWEAR beneath my uniform.....just ONE of my secrets....scared I would have to go home cause w/d symptoms still VERY rough but less intense and intermittently raging...as opposed to day 1-4 with the CONTINUAL RAGE.....wow
was I sick......still love my heating pad. My perceptions are clearing a bit. I am even noticing when I am having a thought that probably isn't true
I spent YEARS working HARD...GETTING IT DONE....being the strongest, smartest, cleverest
when all along my journey with the yoga and then the tram.......I was being lead to the place where letting go
was FINALLY perceived as the strength and wisdom it truly is

the frank sharing and honest disclosure here on this site is the MOST REFRESHING experience I have had in SO LONG

BD- thanks for telling your story...we are HERE FOR YOU...be sure and read the posts, especially about the 60plus hour withdrawal period of mine and as many others as you can......I read for hours on this site my first 5 days. It provided a miraculous energy and strength toward my devotion to continue OFF THE TRAM there are some things that help in early w/d
mine were:
this site
hot baths
heating pad
prescription for clonidine a blood pressure pill that is non addicting but helps with sweats, anxiety, and assists with sleep.

BLESSINGS TO ALL........STAY STRONG



Avatar universal
by BVD660, Jan 05, 2010
Pharma,  

To answer your question about paragraphs....press 'Enter'.


Rock on warriors!

Avatar universal
by fedupp, Jan 05, 2010
BD and PJ...You both have my heart felt support!!!  One thing I think that needs to be addressed in both cases is the self loathing/shamefulness....you do yourselves and your loved ones no favors by being ashamed and it does the opposite of helping you.  Pick you head up and know that not only are you cared for and supported...you are valuable and able to make decisions for yourself.  This doesn't mean dropping everything and going cold turkey but rather make a plan and get the support you need however you need to do it and do it in your time not time someone else sets for you.  If you want to be free of this monkey on your back you absolutley can do it, you just need to be the one who takes the steps neccessary to do it.  I know that it is much easier to stay the course and put it off, I did it for over 4 years.  I tapered and then jumped off with several pills still left and I did this w/ the help I recieved here!!!  

I have been clean and sober since the 20th of Dec. and it has NOT been easy, I won't lie to you, it sucked and still *****!  I am finallhy getting back to work full time and not quite feeling myself but I know in my heart the longer I go, the better I will feel.

I agree w/want(Doug), there is some cleansing that comes w/ comin' clean to your loved ones.  You might be surprised even if they at first are horrified.  Give them a chance if at all possible and try to trust that no matter what someone elses response is, you are doing what is best for you and staying on the same tram-go-round will reck your life.  With or w/out support you are saving your own life and that is worth whatever it takes.....these are just my thoughts and take em or leave em.  Just know that we all really do care and want to be beside you as you go thru your journeys.  I am so grateful to all who have been there for me!!

Many warm thoughts of support and warrior strength

1155195 tn?1262756085
by JC4504, Jan 05, 2010
Today at noon was a full week.

  I made it through the past two days of work. Yesterday it was a pretty good day. I was taking OTC products all day at work but comfortable enough to work and even lost myself for a few hours when I had to deal with some problems. I think the hardest part was the first couple of hours and getting back into the swing of things after being out and sick.

Today? Not so much. I noticed more anxiety over the past couple of days but today was pretty bad. It is almost as if the physical symptoms are backing off but emotionally I am all over the place. Or it could be that since I am not in as much physical pain so I feel more emotionally. Today at work my heart started racing and I was getting a lot of uncomfortable anxiety. Then I was freaking out over every little thing and slamming things (calmly, I was not going crazy..but STILL bad behaviour)  in my office and I really started thinking that I hate my job so much that I don't think I can work there without being medicated.

LOL...maybe? :) The good thing? I never once thought about taking a Tramadol to fix this but I did think about job hunting. Then I told myself that this might be withdrawal thing so I should probably just try to lay low, keep from making any life altering decisions today and see how I feel next week...or at least tomorrow?

Yesterday seemed to be a turn aorund day for me for the physical symptoms. My stomach is still weird and I am not eating much but overall my pain and aches feel better than when I was taking Tramadol. Weird, huh? I don't get it. When I was taking it, before I got out of bed in the morning,  I had to take 4 ibuprofens and one tramadol. I woke up every day feeling miserable and the medicine was supposed to be helping that. Instead I got worse while I was on it. Instead of localized pain I had aches and flu like symptoms every morning until I got medication in me. I feel pretty stupid now for not realizing what that was.


BD,

I agree with everything 4leef said. Please post of you feel like you need some support!


4leef, Pat, HowCouldI-
Great Job! I am so glad to see you guys still posting and doing great this week.





Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 05, 2010
JC- maybe you could try the clonidine? it REALLY helps with anxiety. I don't know how you feel about confiding with a Doctor and getting a prescription. Clonidine is a well known drug used to support heroin withdrawal symptom which is non habit-forming although quite effective.
I love what you say about 'job hunting'--- I had the same idea!
what I said, above...about beginning to recognize when my thoughts might be a 'little off' (or A Lot) I can see you experiencing too      

things that seem urgent are rarely important
and things that are important are rarely urgent

i think about that sometimes when I want to REACT

I went to the MD today to follow up from my visit at 36hours with MASSIVE anxiety (got clonopine) and then my visit to ER at 4 days with a very strange clawing sensation in my gut that remained continuous for 36 hours  (along with everything else....cold, achy, headache and a strange feeling in my eyeballs like they were being wrung out....yuck) I started on some stomach meds--- you know, zantac and prolisec and this helped me get to work on monday (complete with long undies)
I have spent each of these visits talking about the physical dependence on TRAMADOL and the brutal w/d---  I am seeing not much awareness and I hope my experience is helping these Docs learn

I AGREE JC with your experience of LESS PAIN....yeah yeah yeah   I am still creaky and have those bouts of pain across my upper back that feel like fire...but they seem softer...was the Tram and the w/d WHILE ON IT really that messed up?
I am beginning to think so

feddup- Dec 20th for you......congrats---  that is my hope for me and everyone on this site that are 'early'

NICE WORK WARRIORS............ strength and peace !!!!!!!

Avatar universal
by Withdraun, Jan 05, 2010
I remember reading that tramadol was not addictive, haha. I quit yesterday and I don't think I ever did get to sleep last night and thought I was going to flop right out of my bed. I just read everyones recomendation of taking a week off from work (after I got home from work) and I TOTALLY agree but I can't. As I'm typing this my head is spinning, my stomach is churning, and my limbs are tingling so it looks like another fun night.
WHEN DOES THIS END?

Avatar universal
by kimta, Jan 05, 2010
by kimta, 2 hours ago .by kimta

That crackling and pressure you were, or are feeling is indeed, the Tramadol. I have also experienced it to the point of believing I had infection in my ear because it became painful. I'm not a Doctor, but I doubt it's a tumor.

How amazing that this conversation has gone on so long, I'm really thankful today for having stumbled across it because it helped me calm down. I'm a 42 year old full-time student, (yeah, I finally took the leap and went back.). For Chemical Dependency Counselor no less. Today I had a total meltdown, right in front of the new class I am supposed to be TA'ing for. I'm introducing myself to the new students, but as I begin to speak I find I can hardly breath, I am shaking uncontrollably, and I begin to sweat. Now I am embarrassed and not sure what I should do. I sit down in the chair the Instructor positioned for me. Directly in front of, and facing all the students! I am on display in full panic mode. I try to get myself under control. I almost think I can do it when it starts to happen all over again. I last about 20 minutes before I stand up, and as ungracefully as a drunken sailor, (but one that is afraid for her life), almost walk into the door before I can get through it. Out in the hall my heart is pounding so hard I can hear it. I am mortified. I have just made a complete fool of myself.

For the last 5 1/2 months I have been prescribed Tramadol for bulging disks in all three regions of the spine, moderate to severe stenosis in many of the nerve canals from the spine, and pinched nerves that numb my arms and hands. The disks have migrated to where they are impinging and begining to flatten the spinal cord. It's alot of pain all the time. But I have had substance abuse problems in the past. I spent many years on meth. My doc is obviously leary of prescribing me narcotics. I go through Flexyril, methocarbamol, meloxicam, bottles and bottles of Ibuprofin and a few more I can't spell. They all have adverse reactions for me and I feel NO relief. Throughout these meds I am taking Tramadol here and there. He finally lands on Tramadol as my only option. Because it's non-narcotic and sounds as if the only adverse reaction would be siezures if I were to take too many. It keeps my stomach upset alot but it helps better than anything else so far. I've been taking 180 50mg/month for the last 4 months in a row. I've stuck to the prescribed dosage, 100mg 3x/day. I've run out early by only 2-3 days a couple times due to severely bad days. This last time I ran out 6 days before my scrip was due for refill. In just over 24 hours I was in hell and had to go to the ER. They gave me a shot of Demerol and another scrip for Tramadol to hold me over. That was Sunday morning about 4am and even though I have begun my dosage again, I lost it today. My emotions are... a mess. I was shaking uncontrollably earlier, now it is like a low-grade tremor. Along with the shot I got in the ER, I got some information; Tramadol is NOT NON-narcotic, as I was told. It is an opiate but with an additive to prevent me from feeling the euphoria from it. And I am now in full-blown opiate addiction.

I used Meth for years and suffered the detox many times. I wish that was my problem now. At least you sleep! Before my back problems, I never had any serious psycological episodes, (if you have ever used meth, you know your not completely immune). It was Gabapentin that showed me what they were and how quickly they can escalate. And it was supposed to help me. I had tried opiates but never found them attractive and have certainly never been "sick" from using them. I thought drug addiction was in my past.

Now I feel like I've been lied to. All this time I've been taking Tramadol because I couldn't be trusted with the drugs that would give me the most relief. Tramadol makes me tense, gives me headaches, gives me insomnia and doesn't give me THAT much relief. If I was going to have to go through all of this, I DAMN WELL WOULD HAVE RATHER HAD SOME REAL PAIN RELIEF!

I would like to know if there is anyone still posting on this here and if anyone has done the 1/4 pill less/day route and how they did with it. There are just sooo many posts to read them all. Anyone...  


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Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 05, 2010
Boy...my day was a Seinfeld episode.Started when they called from the nursing home where my elderly mother lives to tell me they sent her by ambulance to the hospital because she said she swallowed a ring.My mom has dementia and does not know what she is saying most of the time.Therefore we do not believe 100% of what she tells us.I thought it was something she imagined or dreamed.(I'm going to try the paragraph)

I was just on my way to work as it happened and the hospital called to say she needed an Xray to see if she really did swallow it.I told them if the Xray exposed a ring to call me at work and I would go to the hospital .

Well.....2 hours later I got a call from the hospital that the Xray showed a ring stuck in her throat and that she needed endoscopy surgery to remove it.I left work and there is a big snowstorm with bad driving.I parked the car in visitors parking $11.00 and went to day surgery.

There is my cute little mom,oblivious to everything wondering why she is there and asking me to look down her throat because it is sore and she does not know why.I told her that she swallowed a ring and that is why her throat is sore.It does not register in her mind and she must have asked me at least a dozen times to look down her throat to see why it is so sore.She was lying on a gurney with her clothes in a bag underneath it.She absolutely refused to take out her teeth and I worried how the surgeon would remove the ring with her teeth still in her mouth.

Anyway...the doctor finally came and we discovered that he is Ukrainian like us and he said hello to her in Ukrainian.Her eyes lit up and she behaved and took out her teeth for him.The procedure took less than 20 minutes and they took out the ring and the doctor gave it to me to look after.

As we were dressing her to go home one the shelf underneath the gurney where her clothes were in a bag,I noticed something black lying there.I though it was a piece of string or something and picked it up.IT WAS SOMEBODY'S THONG.Someone left their thong at the hospital.

We all had a good laugh about the thong and took mom home.She thanked me for visiting her and still has no memory of what happened and all she wanted was a cigarette.

Everything turned out OK,but you have to admit,it was quite funny.

Avatar universal
by kimta, Jan 05, 2010
I brought the post above over from a previous thread that I thought was the end of all of your discussions by mid December. I really thought that there were just too many to read but I just couldn't stop. I have been reading for the last 4 or 5 hours. Hell, I didn't even know what time it was.

I can't believe what I am reading here! I thought Tramadol was a harmless, non-addictive, generally unknown, so-so pain reliever. Now, looking back over the past few months, I realize I was feeling some adverse effects from this crap quite a while ago. Mostly, emotions. On the verge of tears most of the time. I can really relate to all the bad stuff. But I have never felt any of the real "good" feelings from it. I've read that some have felt confident and on top of their game. I haven't even gotten so much as a good warm and fuzzy feeling. Just the difference from wanting to jump out of my skin to the surface of my skin calming. And a little pain relief likened to a higher dose of Ibuprofin. I am hoping that will be what keeps me on a steady taper. The only things that really scares me about getting off this stuff is feeling "sick", and the fact that I DO deal with pain constantly and have no idea what to do for it from this point.

Has anyone that has chronic pain found another alternative that helps but wont lead down another addiction road?

kimta


Avatar universal
by Withdraun, Jan 05, 2010
10:20 PM night #2 I'm not sure if this is withdrawl or the flu or both but It's not good and sleeping tonight is not looking very promissing :(

Avatar universal
by kimta, Jan 05, 2010
I can't imagine trying to do this c/t. The 20 hours I experienced have scared me to death.

Avatar universal
by Samantha_pia, Jan 05, 2010
I am Glad you guys are getting off the drugs, trust me i spent 3 years of my life in hell with a Dr that was happy to give out drugs like confetti at a wedding.

150mg diaizpan a day
60mg natrazipan a day
40mg tamazipan a night
washed down with 70cl of vodka a day.

it only took 6 months to get to that level, and the next 3 years to get off it, sadly it was to late i already ruined my life and almost ended it cutting my neck with a scalpel, lucky for me the blade broke so i didnt sever the jugular only punctured it enough to spray a trail of blood on the walls and shop windows i was walking by, the police found me in an ally way going to sleep.

I just threw away 400 Tramadol, as my Dr thinks anything can be fixed with pills, but he dont understand i can not risk going back to that time 20 years ago

Keep up the hard work, it is well worth it in the end, admitting to yourself that you are hooked on a drug is a major start, but remember its the Dr that got you hooked, and you have to deal with the fall out yourself. its hard, but well worth it.
Sammie x

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by JC4504, Jan 05, 2010
4leef,
I should talk to my doctor about that. The funny thing is that I told him that I was going off of it last week and he never mentioned anything about cutting down or withdrawal. In fact, the only time he has ever expressed concern about usage or withdrawal has been about my ibuprofen use.

He had several conversations with me, in the past few month, about how upping the Tramadol would be better than taking more Ibuprofen and, when/if I cut down my IB,  I might have severe withdrawal headaches and he could set me up on a IV drip for that in his office. So, I think the least he could do for Tramadol w/d would be a RX, right?

  I really do believe that he has my best intentions at heart and just wants me to be out of pain but doesn't understand how this drug works or, at least, worked for me. I am glad that I never felt like I should raise the Tramadol RX over three a day and stuck it out with IB. I think my sleep issues on Tramadol (sleep issues= I could not sleep on it) had a lot to do with that decision so I am very grateful for those now.


Kimta,

Yes, I think a lot of us bought into the whole idea that Tramadol was a safe alternative to a narcotic drug. I refused a narcotic prescription and got Tramadol instead. Considering the physical dependancy and w/d is the same as a narcotic (which is what most people are trying to AVOID when they refuse a narcotic RX) I feel a little lied to. On the other hand I will NEVER take another drug without knowing the pros and cons. I never really read those little pharmacy slips because I felt like they were always worst case scenarios and made people paranoid. Well maybe this whole experience will someday save my life or keep me from going down a worse road because my full trust in Dr.s is over.

I did not taper down because I felt W/D start with that and I just wanted the whole thing to be over with. I tried to go down by 1 pill (from 3  a day) though and, from what I have read, you should cut it by a 1/4 or 1/2.


Withdraun,

The flu is exactly how I described it too! It WILL pass if you stick it out. The worst is the first couple of days. If you read all the posts here you will get some great advice on how to cope with the symptoms and, as wantmyselfback posted earlier, you can figure out what works best for you.


Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 06, 2010
Pharma9, thanks for the laughs. I really needed it. Sorry about your day, though.

Well, finally 3 days completely off the Tramadol after finally widdling down to 1/day or one every other day. Sunday was my last bad day where I almost threw up in church and gave in and took a pill--the chills were bad that day too and I was soooo dizzy and weak I could barely stand up. Of course an hour later...I'm feeling fine. It's been a month of being sick. I had only been on Tramadol for two months for pain in my neck, when I decided to quit taking it because I was feeling better neckwise. That's when I started feeling like I had the flu and worse. A horrible feeling all over like I was going to die and not make it through the day. Funny thing was I finally noticed that whenever I took a pill I would feel somewhat better an hour later. Weird. I was up to 6-8 pills a day and then just stopped and took one when I felt some discomfort. Didn't take me more than a week to realize that this on and off flu was probably related to the pills (so I went searching on the Internet for withdrawal symptoms and was quite surprised to find all of this info when the doc says I shouldn't have any problems with it.) Also, it was very embarrassing that when I got so sick I would also emotionally break down into tears crying at my husband saying I was sure I was dying of something awful and it must be cancer. I feel so stupid now. Sunday my husband started praying for a miracle that I would be able to get off of these without being so sick. I haven't taken a pill since Sunday morning and I haven't had any nausea since then and no chills. So...PRAISE THE LORD!!! Still having the nightsweats and the awful skin crawling episodes, though. I can live with those. But, hey, with all the nausea, I lost 12 pounds in two weeks!!! PRAISE THE LORD FOR THAT TOO!!! LOL. Couldn't stand the thought of eating. Besides, i was having this unexplained terrible pain all through my abdomen.

Well, hang in there everyone. I will be praying for a miracle for you too!

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 06, 2010
Pharma9 - now the Lord of The Ring!

JC- I considered benzodiazepines (ativan, klonopin) for the anxiety but clonidine appeals better because it is not habit forming. Look up opiate w/d and clonidine and present the evidence to your MD if you approve. It has risks you should understand but the anxiety is a direct result of your w/d from a medication that has an antidepressant quality as well as the opiate factors

Kimta and withdraun-

I spent many hours the first few nights reading posts and soaking in the tub. I HAD TO CALL IN SICK even though I REALLY couldn't. The first 4 days are very rough going. There are many suggestions on this post. Pray for help. take it one hour, one minute at a time. there are usually a few bright spots in those early days but they are short. make em sweet. know IT WILL PASS and try to get help as needed---- I NEED ALL THE HELP I CAN GET
we believe in you
and ALL OF US DESERVE TO HEAL
this is one miserable drug
it is hard work getting it out of your system
but one morning, you'll wake up
and look into the unveiled eyes of your old true self
STAY STRONG

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by booba77, Jan 06, 2010
Hello all.  Havent been here in awhile.  Been off the trams since Oct 29th.  Still very depressed, and no energy but I think that is from the depression.  Congrats to all of the new people on.  I did find one tram while cleaning the other day and threw it away without a second glance.  Did take some hydrocodones over the new year break, for which I am horribly ashamed. I feel like a failure.  Everything seems to be falling apart for me and I am falling apart, which cannot happen because I have a 4 year old to raise.  How do I move on and get motivated to be the person I want to be? I dont want to do anything but sleep.

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by Pat_, Jan 06, 2010
Ten days tram free, one day at a time. Work has been okay, I feel pretty much normal again. Having shots in my hamstrings Friday, which will be a huge challenge...I'll face it then, not now.

booba77, hang in there. Beyond the med W/Ds, have you been to a doc for a physical, and/or can you? A lot can make you tired and run down, such as deficiencies, thyroid issues, and other problems. Try not to get down on yourself.

Stay strong tram warriors!!

Avatar universal
by inspiring, Jan 06, 2010
aloha BOOBA  and aloha JENNY,  SOOOOOO glad to hear how you are doing, lots of new people here - all helping each other and a few 'oldies'  Pharma and Fred still helping everyone along.

NEWCOMERS - PLEASE read back old posts and you will get SO much help and info on WD's and how to help yourself thru the first few days of hell

BOOBA  I was thinking of you SO much, hoping everything was OK with you. Very glad you are still clean but worried about your continued lack of energy and depression.  PHARMA  she needs your expert advice

best wishes to all



Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 06, 2010
Booba- Definitely have your thyroid checked.  That was my problem.  Check that before you try anti-depressants, but maybe you should look into a mild AD.  It could be that you were using the tramadol to mask some underlying depression.  If you can see a counselor, that would be good.  

jenny

Avatar universal
by BD12345, Jan 06, 2010
I am so grateful I have found this site. I spent my second night off Tram tossing, turning, feeling like I was going to die and not able to sleep at all. I finally passed out around 5 o'clock only to wake up around 9 still feeling like death. So grateful I do not have to work this week.

The big problem is I am waiting on pins and needles for the Fedex truck to arrive with my new patch of Tram. I really do want to quit but I do not know if the best idea is to slowly get off, which I do not know if I can do it or continue cold turkey since I have already gone this far....

Reading these posts has been so therapeutic so I feel like I am not alone, Ah, how self-centered an addict can be. I just need to keep going because I need my life back without this dependence on the devil Tram. I just heard the door bell ring, time to make up my mind.

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by booba77, Jan 06, 2010
Thanks so much for the posts guys.  I have not had a physical or PAP in iver 4 years, I know, I know.  My daughter has chronic allergies and we have thousands in hospital bills we cant pay now cuz my husband has no insurance, so I wont be going anytime soon.  I probably need something for depression, but would like to have a physical first.  I will check my insurance to see if the bloodwork,etc is covered.  I did clean my car out today, which is major for me.  It is nice to be back. i missed you guys.  I cant go without your support.

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 06, 2010
Booba- Your insurance should cover a physical and/or pap per year.  I think you could ask for the thyroid test and an AD at those visits.  Please go! I hate to nag you, but you know it's important.  I just worry about you self-medicating with hydros if you could stay clean with an AD.

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by 1113, Jan 06, 2010
another day and all seems well so far...  i haven't had to bust out one of those energy shots which i guess is a good thing.  my head feels clear, my mind feels free (at the moment at least), and i just hope to keep on trucking on.

i've got to say i totally agree with people who say that tram is harder to detox then hydro.   a few years back i had some injuries and took some hydros for like 2 months.  i remember having some miserable days, but nothing like this ****.  

i think i am around day 23 now...      

334144 tn?1423248271
by booba77, Jan 06, 2010
I am self medicating no more, but I know it is important to go.  I have no real doctor at all.  The last doc I went to was my OBGYN when I was pregnant.  Time to start looking.  My dad left his hydros on the counter in his bathroom and I took some.  I feel horrible.  They live next door and I am over there all the time.  I did suck up another tram in the vaccuum undeer the seat of my car.  that was liberating.I am trying to pick myself up and pull myself together.  How is everyone else on here?  keeep fighting.  I dont really think about the trams anymore at all.  just the havoc they have wreaked on my life.  Get off of them.  they are bad news.  

Avatar universal
by chrissie145, Jan 06, 2010
Adam, Thanks for taking the time to reply to my post. Good luck to you and everyone on here. I am not sure if I would have made it without this forum. Its amazing how little groups of strangers form to support and encourage one another - and then become close than brothers (and sisters). I have made friends that I believe will last a lifetime. After 5 months off tramadol I believe I would be okay but am battling the lengthy w/d of benzos. I havent had one for 4 months but still have very bad days. It seems that the two drugs together cause an extra element of damage too and this takes some dealing with.

If its any help to anyone, my son came off a huge amount of tramadol in October. He suffered hallucinations as well as all the rest. However he set himself up an exercise and healthy eating regime and has done amazingly. I have heard others talk of running as being theraputic and he has certainly found this so.
God bless
Chrissie

Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 06, 2010
Kimpta-
I hear you.  I am addicted and am wanting to quit so badly.  I take 500mg/day and know its going to be an enormous accomplishment if I can quit and stay clean.  I have gone through W/D after CT and it was the most horrid experience of my life and I know that I can not do it again.  There has to be another way. Possibly by doing it very slowly.  Taking out a half a pill every week? I dont know, I just want off these pills and I'm terrified to go through the HELL again...terrified!!  Maybe we can take the plunge at the same time and touch base about how we're doing. Pick a date and I will do it with you.

Best wishes to everyone in their own struggles.  Keep going, its so admirable to witness so much strength.  

Bode

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by gerty411411, Jan 06, 2010
Hi Y'all,

Today is 51 days since my last tram.. I feel that I occasionally still have severe anxiety and bitchiness.  I also still imtermittantly have insomnia, tramafog and some degree of RLS.  Overall, though, most days are good.  Will these symptoms eventually stop or will I be subject to them forever?

I cant beleive the amount of money, energy and time I wasted over the last 2 years.  I remember driving through a h
orrendous snowstorm to get to the fedex station several times.  Yikes!!!!

Booba, good to hear from you.  I had a rough one over the holidays, too.  I took several of my Dad's lorazapam.  
trust me I looked around for other treats in his medicine cabinet but luckily was thwarted.  Don't be hard on yourself!!!!

Take care all, Gerty























\\\

Avatar universal
by fixn2winawar, Jan 06, 2010
re-lapse is a major part of recovery, i dont like 12 step programs but a relapse can be the trigger that says hey i really do hate this stuff. and thats a good trigger. i cant remember who posted the didnt want to be a relapser and thats a good quality. but that in no way means that if someone did they still are not recovering. a re-lapse starts way before you take the drug, it is a series of thoughts that occur before u take the pill, its relapsed after you induce that pill you want off that is the relapsed. the thoughts that get you to that point is whats technically called a relapse(its a relapse in behavior modification that hasnt took hold yet) so be strong and not so hard on your self if you f,7.* up. its addiction and it didnt develop over nite and wont go away for months to years. but you are clean the day you start stopping. so hold on and we are all ostly babies when it comes to this, so dont be afraid to fall, just fight it w/all your strenght. you can, look at the circle of faith here. YA know what the bible says when 2 like spirits get together for one prayer to come true, just look at how many peep's here are praying the same thing they pray for themselves at night and hopefully the other warriors. FIGHT ON/ GOOD LUCK,And keep the Faith. let me end w/a little prayer, i dont aggree w/alot of it..but... GOD GRANT ME THE COURAGE TO ACCEPT THE THINGS I CANNOT CHANGE, AND THE WISDOM TO CHANGE THE THINGS I CAN...I hate memorized prayer but there is alot of thruth in that , and that prayer helped me make a decsion i didnt want to, but i am going on a M.M.T. its one of those things i can change and we all have different circumstance's/ but we all have a addiction in common. be it physical or physcological.. i think the latter is what makes the w/d so hard. but many prayers, and fight on...

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 07, 2010
8 days off Tram....yeah! I have gotten to work the last 3 days and although my energy is low in the evenings it has gone well. Course here I am posting at 400am......just like day 1-4. whatsupwiththat?  my mind is racing tonight. It is all emotional stuff running through my head. whew! I am TIRED but can't sleep. You guys are always here. What a relief it has been for me to get on line any time day or night and find the outpouring of your support and encouragement. I can't tell you how much it helped me during this very difficult w/d week so far. So now I am probably entering Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome
(did I get that right?)
I have fleeting moments of craving...I am aware that it usually occurs when I am encountering an emotionally demanding moment....I want my Blankey! yep.....my lubricant for emotional pain....my little white friend....wait a minute.....friend you say? Let's take a look at just what kind of friend Tram is........
Tram asks for all of my attention all the time....it won't let me have a relationship with anyone else (even myself!!) It hurts me when I leave it...even when I show up late it starts the pain.....now what kind of a friend is that? I am so happy the relationship is over and I am free .......I don't want to go back to THAT
Good things I am noticing off the Tram? I FEEL MORE AUTHENTIC...much more honest...
the withdrawal so far has been a VERY HUMBLING experience
hey humility is good .....it is the finest Spiritual Currency
FIGHT ON TRAM WARRIORS
God Bless you all !!!!!!  

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 07, 2010
Booba- No worries.  It happens...just don't beat yourself up!

1106880 tn?1260898678
by wantmyselfback, Jan 07, 2010
Hey Warriors!  Glad there are so many newbies here finding that this site is such a relief/blessing!  Pharma- your Seinfeld episode gave me a good chuckle... which I needed!  

One thing that I'm finding is a whole lot more postings than usual, which although is FANTASTIC, a bit frightening that more and more people are realizing the dangers of Tramadol.  I wonder how many of you newbies decided to get off the tramadol as a new year's resolution?

I've been going through a bout of depression, which usually isn't like me, since I've been pretty good since after day 10 of w/d.  Since I'm a male, I can't blame PMS (although my wife probably would beg to differ).  Just one of those ups and down days that I forgot happens when you are free of any addictive drug and just comes like waves for everyone.  Something new for me I guess that I'm going to have to get used to.

I've been off for the past few weeks now using vacation days, and I think that's what's killing me the most.  I've been finding things to keep me busy and I'm finding that is the only thing to try to battle the depression.  When one sits and sulks in their sorrows, it only makes things worse.  

What can bring me instantly in a better mood is knowing I am now 28 days off of Tramadol and would NEVER go back to that drug, even if the doctor told me I needed to take it in order to live... I'd rather die than go through six years of living a lie for a drug that did nothing for me.

Keep reading during your w/d times.  Heck, there's 25 different journals from Emily Post, not including her initial posts about Tramadol.  Reading all those posts could take you through the worst first days of W/D.

I can honestly say, reading and most importantly, POSTING during my w/d and the weeks after was the only thing that made me get through it.

You CAN and WILL succeed.

1106880 tn?1260898678
by wantmyselfback, Jan 07, 2010
BD,

Just read your post.  By now those pills have probably arrived, and you've probably given into the tramadevil.  How many of us on here were in the same boat?  Waiting for our next refill, ordering from those online pharmacies at close to $120 a pop, searching coat pockets, couch coushins, underneath the car seat, or simply waiting/ watching for the FedEx truck to come with those magic pills?

The hardest part to believe is that even while searching through couch coushins or dress coats, etc, or even crawling on the floor, my mind was telling me "just one more."  Think of it this way:  if there was a camera on you during these moments and it was played to people you love, they would be astonished... and so would you.

That is HOW BAD Tramadol controls you.  I remember reading Forget_me_not's post about being in the middle of the night, in a hail storm, searching her car floor for just one pill.  Then it hit me:  I, too did these things.

BD, if you have received your pills, and you have taken them... don't worry.  The thing that concerns me the most is the seizures.  If you read my posts, I was pretty much killing myself taking Tramadol.  I was diagnosed with Hyper-eosinophilic syndrome- a disease which causes eosinophils (which under normal ranges are good to fight off infections- normal being 200-600... I was at 1700) to attack major organs of your body and ultimately can lead to death.  For years, the doctors didn't know what was causing the H.E.S, but I knew it was the Tramadol.  Lo and behold, as soon as I came off Tramadol C/T, I dropped down to 250 and my doctor called and basically called me a "freak of nature" and was "cured" somehow.

BD, Grand Mal Seizures can kill you.  Although I never experienced a seizure while taking Tramadol (although I could've sworn I almost had one a couple of times and had to fight it off- an experience I never want to have again), these are serious.  A couple of journals earlier, I read a post about someone who had a seizure while taking Trams and Driving and ended up in a ditch.  Problem is,  Tramadol isn't considered a drug, so that person managed to not be prosecuted because they passed a drug test.

If you REALLY want to quit, you've come to the right place.  It sounds like your husband is deeply concerned.  I quit cold Turkey off 10+ a day.  WHY?  Because, like you, my FEDEX truck wasn't coming for two more days with my pills.  After making it through 2 days of ABSOLUTE H.E.LL, I decided I never wanted to go back to this devil of a drug.

If you read my posts, about a week later (maybe day 10), the FedEx truck showed up, and my wife watched me drop 180 Tramadol pills down the toilet... which was the most liberating feeling I have ever had.  

I was also doing some research and found that if anyone is taking Flexeril or generic name Cyclobenzaprine, you are at a greater risk of seizures.

We're here to help.  Quitting Cold Turkey is a decision you need to make.  It absolutely was horrid for me going from about 10 a day to none, but although tapering might reduce your w/d symptoms, it will not completely get rid of them.  

In the long run, I'm glad my FedEx guy never showed up while I was waiting anxiously for him to knock on my door... he (along with others here) must be my guardian angel.

Avatar universal
by kimta, Jan 07, 2010
This is such a wonderful thing to see. I wanted to get into the conversatrion with everyone again yesterday but had to run. I wish I were in a position to take some time off school to deal with this, but it's just not possible. I wrote a long email to the instructor of the class that I had the meltdown in front of. I haven't heard back from her yet.

I really wanted some conformation that she understood my situation. But I guess I will just have to show up to find out.

Bodegirl, I began titrating myself off Tramadol as of yesterday. My normal dose is 100mg/3x/day. I cut it down to100mg/2x/day. And I will lessen the dose by only 1/4 pill/week. I definitely feel the difference of the extra 200mg loss. But this way it will take me 16 weeks and not 24 weeks. You, my friend, are absolutely welcome to join me.

Last weekend was my first ever experience of detoxing from an opiate. I KNOW I can't handle c/t. I would never make it. Fortunately for myself I haven't taken Tram in large doses. I read of some of you feeling pleasurable effects from taking it. I have never taken over 150mg at one time and never felt any kind of euphoria from it.

I have had addiction problems in my past, like I noted in a prior post, meth was my drug of choice, for years. I have been clean for almost 2 years now. I NEVER expected that I would have another addiction problem again, EVER. This situation has hit me like a ton of bricks.

I commend the strenght of those of you who go through it c/t. But I worry about you too. I certainly understand the need to take something else to help ease the pain and anxiety. But I have heard horror stories of people self medicating with benzo's, etc. and they are not with us anymore. PLEASE be careful!

I have to get to the school. I hope the anxiety does not come flooding back when I enter that classroom. Shyness and anxiousness are not normal for me. It's hard for me to deal with. My brain and mouth seem to lose their connection and I end up saying stupid things.

I will miss you guys today, you will definately be on my mind.

Wish me luck!

kimta

  



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by Lillyval, Jan 07, 2010
prospero73 - Drugs.com (like medhelp) is paid for with advertising dollars from the drug companies.  They sort their drug reviews with the best ratings first.  If you go back to their tramadol ratings and sort them lowest to highest you will see the horror stories.

Chrissie - it's good to see you here. I hope you recover soon from your medical problems.  You've been through a lot, but you are certainly a strong individual.

JC - don't beat yourself up.  It's all good.  You're here and you're off the tram - that's what's important.

This site is amazing.  Thanks Emily for starting it.  
Keep fighting everyone,
Lilly

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 07, 2010
Kimta- I had issues with anxiety on tramadol too.  It sounds like you basically had a panic attack in front of the class, probably caused by the tramadol.  You could probably just say that it was medication induced and that you're sorry.  I'm sorry that happened to you.

I was taking about the same or less than you.  I only took one pill at a time, but took about 8 a day.  Believe it or not, you're on a pretty high dose...I think.  Not compared with 20 a day though.  I quickly tapered down to 150mg and then stopped.  Tapering for me was worse than afterwards.  The anxiety about coming off is hard.  It was not as bad as I thought.  I didn't have any time off either.  Do you have 3 days in a row where you don't have anything going on?

Also, I take klonopin anyway at night and plan to stop it soon (it's prescribed). It, along with clonidine, helped me sleep! I don't think anyone would have a problem taking klonopin or valium for a few days for sleep.  Under doctor supervision of course.  The benzo problems come with long term use I believe.  I have to taper off them.  Mine were for night terrors.

I have a pretty addictive personality and have had issues with tramadol, alcohol and various other drugs in my lifetime.  Do you go to AA or NA for the past addiction?  I don't, but just curious.  I think many of the people that get addicted to tramadol are addicts already.  Partly because doctors think it is safe to give them...unlike vicodin or other strong painkillers.  It is all relative though.  It certainly doesn't feel like vicodin, but it probably isn't as strong for pain relief either, so not sure it's worth it!

Jenny

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by TheUltramateWarrior, Jan 07, 2010
Good Afternoon/or Good been awake 5 day's and night's straight to all of the new  withdrawing warrior's.
I have been here now and then in the past.
I wanted to stop in once again and salute all that have came and went here.
It is surely a place of training and an oasis of meditation of all thing's needed to overcome the enemy that surely has a wish to literally devour our mind's.
I have withdrawn cold a few time's and had survived only to fall under the spell of my arch enemy once again.
I have to say that it does go by fast,however not at the time you are awake withdrawaling,an hour seems like a day on days 1-7.
I have hopefully defeated Tramadol this time forever as I am clean two weeks now and have just begun sleeping full nights.
I dropped from about 20 or 30 a day cold just about everytime I went off Tramadol and I only noticed the worst of withdrawals the very first time after being on it for 6months.
I had the electric shocks only then and once I went through that after 10 days I was fine.
Now I had went back on and off for about two months maybe 4 times and everytime it was weaker.
So no matter how much you take,I have gathered it will be very bad if you have been on them a long period.
Well anyway the last time's I withdrew,I just got cold and could not sleep for a week,however I had no shocks or serious withdrawal symptom's.
I am done now in my heart and I have destroyed all of my Tramadol past,including my prescription bottle.
So I am glad that I have finally stood up for myself and wish to stay clean forever if I can and will hopefully.
Gather your book's/movie's/hot drinks/coffee/tea/multivitamins/milkthistle/loperamide or Immodium/protein powder and food/flax oil/advil/tylenol/ibuprofen/ and whatever else anybody tells you here.
You will get a workout that is for sure.
Imagine midnight yoga/toss and turn aerobics.
I lost about ten lbs that I had on my gut and at the end of it everytime I had no gut.
I imagine I will get one back someday.
Workout and think positive and be patient.
This is your time to shine.
I salute you all and always will.
Thank you once again.
T.U.W.

Avatar universal
by talljoey, Jan 07, 2010
I am so afraid of what I am reading.  I started out with just 8 pills for a very bad fibromyalgia flare.  Well, my doc gave me a running script for 4 a day in April of last year.  I read the pros and cons and thought, oh heck, this won't happen to me. With fibro there are a lot of people who stress tram for the pain, so a few months ago I ordered some on line.  I was up to 8 a day and am sick as a dog.  I am weaning myself off now, and am down to 5, but I think I am going too fast, since I only started this process January 1.  I don't want to be sick, but I can't eat, I am losing weight, sweat, terrors.  I will try the B and vitamins.  But I think tonight I have to level with my loving husband and tell him the truth, I am addicted.  

Avatar universal
by kimta, Jan 07, 2010
wantmyselfback, I just read your post. I was prescribed cyclobenzaprine at the same time I was prescribed the Tram. I couldn't function on them because they just knocked me out. I even tried to reduce the dosage to half a pill then a quarter pill. I still felt like I was in a fog and felt I was showing signs of depressiveness. Just not my normally positive and cheerful self. After a couple weeks I stopped taking them. I have huge bottles of them.

This last weekend when I started to feel my skin begin to crawl and all the anxiety set in, I took one to help me sleep. It worked the 1st time. But once I woke up from that to find my symptoms not only still with me but getting worse, I took another one trying desperately to get back to sleep. Didn't work. So I added some Tylenol PM to the mix. Once that got into my system I was an incredibly sleepy, wound-up ball of anxiety, but sleep just wouldn't rescue me.

I'm glad I read your post. I probably have nothing to worry about because I never really took them that much. But now I won't even try to make use of them in any way. Not only do they (usually) zonk me out. But they give me this... "feeling", I don't know how to describe it. It's like... well, let's just say that the feeling I get from it is so distinctive that if there were other medications that had Cyclobenzaprine as an included ingrediant, I would be able to tell very quickly. Does that make any sense?

Not to mention that I felt it made my pain worse. The muscles are not the source of my pain. So once my muscles get all nice and relaxed, I feel like my spine is suspended there all by itself, STILL in pain and even more pronounced. Does THAT make any sense?

Thanks wantmyselfback, I'll quit trying to squeeze a benefit out of the Flexyril and leave it alone. Especially through my detox.

I went back to the class today, I began to get anxious the closer I got to the school. This is just crazy because it is so unlike me. I believe it is because I feel embarrassed from Tuesday. I really feel like I want to explain to these people what happened and why. I didn't. I just went in like nothing had happened, expected some wierd looks. Maybe to be "handled" like a patient on a psych ward.

But it turned out OK and I actually got a degree of my confidence back.

  



Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 07, 2010
Does anyone here have an experience taking suboxone to help through withdrawal of Tramadol?  I have heard some positive things.  Just wondering if anyone has any input.  

I feel as though I'm on the brink of jumping, making that leap into detox again. I am almost ready, but not quite. Close though.

Thanks for listening.
Bode

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by wantmyselfback, Jan 07, 2010
I drank tonight.... which I am not proud of. They say that one side effect of quitting any drug is the possibility of picking up something else to cope with your w/d symptoms.  Although I'm 28 days out... I feel like I'm back to day one.  I was prescribed 10 MG Lexapro during my w/d to offset the effects of the tram w/d, but really didn't bother to refill that script since I've come to think that any pill coming from the pharmacist is the devil.  Well, regardless, as much as I like to tout that I've been doing fine, I've been pretty down in the dumps.  My wife came with a sample of Lexapro until my FedEx order comes within the next day or so, in which I lost it.  Is it that easy to get any type of "non-narcotic" drug from the doctors?  I mean, I know it's one thing if she went to our doctor and said "my husband needs a Vicodin sample..." but the fact that she could walk up without my permission and say I needed Lexapro for anxiety has me concerned.  I didn't mean to lash out on her, but is it quite as easy to say to the doc, "my husband ran out of tramadol" and needs something to help him until his script is filled?

What the he.ll?  I'm an addict.   Not proud of it.  Miserable... and not doing well.  I'm only 30... but can't live like this forever.  Maybe AA seems like a good idea.... but I am terrified to death to go.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 07, 2010
Mr.Want..you have been doing so well and I really understand your anxiety and depression.You have been trying to keep  up your spirit and all of ours and have done a good job at it.I somehow feel that deep down inside you are afraid that you can not keep it up.Today I also went to the health food store to buy some whey protein and also bought some 5htp to try.I am not usually a depressed type but thought I would try it and see if it gives me energy.Do not feel a failure if you need a little chemical help with small doses of antidepressant because your body has been through a lot.You have fought a major battle and are winning and will continue to win but do not consider 1 lexapro or even 1/2 lexapro a day cheating because it does not add up to all the antidepressant effects you had from tramadol which was probably way too much.If you are really worried about taking any pharmaceuticals keep up with the b121000mcg daily,vit d 2000U/day b vitamins with zinc and omegas every day.I take them every day and am usually very upbeat.I am taking the whey protein and 5htp as an experiment to see what it does for me.You will know soon if the lexapro helps you stay on track and don't feel like a failure if you need it.You are a strong and wonderful person and are highly regarded by this forum.I still continue to take all those vitamins and haven't had a single craving for opiates.I stll do take advil and extrastrength tylenol.Your wife was trying to help you in the best way she can.Gotta love her...she does not want to see you suffering.

There is another supplement used for depression and anxiety called lithium orotate that is lithium in small doses and helps depression.It is available in health food stores as well.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 07, 2010
I did a bit more reading about lithium orotate and am not sure it is a good idea.I would just stick with B Complex with zinc.Lithium can build up in the body and levels should be checked to prevent toxic levels.Anyone can read about it and make your own decisions.I just don't want to give wrong information to anyone.

Avatar universal
by Withdraun, Jan 08, 2010
WOW, I'm at exactly 90 hours since I have taken one(actually two) of those little white demons and I think I'm through the worst part of the storm. I dont feel great or anything but I'm a LOT better.
It's hard to believe I went cold turkey from 6-10 per day. I did end up taking the rest of the week off from work for my "flu", I really couldnt but I like others have said HAD to.
I want to say thanks to everyone here for all the help, and good luck and be strong to others in my shoes.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 08, 2010
Boy...I am not taking the 5htp again.I took 1 x100mg at 4pm with a cup of coffee and again at bedtime.I had a hard time getting to sleep and when I did had stupid dreams and also a headache.I have never needed an antidepressant in my life and probably did not need the 5htp.Anyways it did not agree with me and goes to show you that one should not mess with brain chemicals if they are not needed.I don't suppose the coffee at 4pm helped either.Those stupid pills cost me $44.00 for a bottle.I have a long day at work today and needed my sleep.

I just took my usual vitamins including zinc and a glass of whey protein and see how today goes..Even natural health products are potent drugs especially for some people.

I hope everyone feels strong today to fight the all important fight and love to all.

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by booba77, Jan 08, 2010
Pharma....the 5 HTP didnt help me either.  It made me feel weird.  I take L Tyrosine and sublingual B daily but still have a lot od the PAWS depression.  I am trying to cope though.  I am proud of everyone on this site.  All journeys are different, but can be made easier with the support of these brave warriors.

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 08, 2010
dearest wantmyselfback-
i have been paying close attention to your posts...your courageous battle...you express your fight so very well.....I have been attending AA mtgs off and on for years...the PRINCIPLES of the program are really quite inspiring and some of my experience has been similar to the feelings I get from others on this site...acceptance, love, compassion for addictions and understanding about how they drive us......the PATH is surrender, acceptance, taking responsibility for the part of my character that fuel the need for drugs and etoh..........it is like they are mySOLUTION for the underlying PROBLEM which is truly my mind, my need to 'feel better' the mountain of emotional pain the wells up inside me and feels like it will rupture me into a milllion little pieces if i am not able to calm it down, dampen it down with drugs, etoh   or fill in the blank....food, sex WHATEVER................you have done an AMAZING job here, with your tram w/d and have been SO HELPFUL to me
God Bless You  

Withdraun- 90 hours from 10 a day..........Great Job  !!!!  

to all .........THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE  STAY STRONG

Avatar universal
by RollerCan, Jan 08, 2010
Earlier in this thread Bodegirl asked about taking Suboxone (and it's progeny) to help with withdrawal.  I would be curious to know as well if anyone has had experience with this method.

I am starting Suboxone treatment on Monday.  I've been on Tramadol for a solid 3 years. I've been Tramadol free now since 12/24 but since that time I've periodically replaced it with other opioids to combat the withdrawal. I will NOT order more Tram and do not want to take the route of replacing it with another drug.  Yet some say taking Suboxone does just that.  Others say Suboxone is a safe an effective method to detox provided other treatment methods are employed as well. It seems to be a treatment that's gaining credibility in the medical community.  Of course, Tramadol has and still is prescribed to help ease the w/d of other so called "stronger" opioids and most of us here recognize the folly in such use.

I have general issues with addiction - Tramadol just so happened to be the drug I settled on because it's relatively easy to acquire. I've found opioids to be, for lack of a better term, the most effective drugs for me so I'm hoping Suboxone can quell my cravings. There's always the threat of addiction/abuse, but medical professionals with a favorable view of the drug argue that only dependence may occur.

I'm also starting acupuncture and will continue with treatment counseling. Hopefully the combination of these treatments will help me get clean. Bodegirl or others - if you're interested I'll keep y'all posted on my progress.

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by booba77, Jan 08, 2010
I did a bit of research on Suboxone before going cold turkey.  It almost seems more addictive than trams from what I have read.  I never tried it though.

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by wantmyselfback, Jan 08, 2010
Thanks for the encouragment 4leef.... I'm going to actually give AA a shot sometime next week.  I have two young ones and don't want them to grow up seeing there father like I was last night (in which I pretty much blacked out past 7:00 PM).   I had my days of drinking in college and after, and would like to say I'm not an alcoholic... but that would be a blatant lie.  Abstaining from alcohol seems to be the only option for me, since I kept telling myself last night that one drink would help settle me down.  That one drink led to a whole pint of Vodka.

So, on that note, I'm going to AA and try to tackle this whole drinking thing.  Although I've been "good" and didn't drink over the holidays or even on New Year's, I can't keep having these "slip-ups" when I get stressed out or feel depressed.  I truly think that is why I took the Tramadol... to aleviate the stress/depression.  

At least I can say that today is OFICIALLY 30 DAYS off of Tramadol!  So yeah on that note!  If I can tackle Tramadol addiction, I have to be able to tackle Alcoholism.  

Thanks for all of your support, encouragment, and strength.  As stated so many times on here, I wouldn't have been able to do w/d and remain 30 days Tram-free without all of your help and support.  So thanks to you all... my angels/warriors.

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by Prospero73, Jan 08, 2010
On suboxone:  my son  was on this between December 07 and Sept. 08, 16mg/day, when he was trying to detox and recover from methadone addiction.  During June-September, the dose was gradually decreased.  In August it was: "2mg 2 tablets sublingually x three days, then 1/2 tablet sublingually x two weeks."  On Sept. 5 he decided to quit altogether, and because of withdrawals he bought 1600 mg of methadone on Sept. 8, took all of it, and was hospitalized with respiratory failure later that night.

As someone remarked, suboxone itself is very addictive, and there is no general agreement on how it should be administered, either in dosage or duration of treatment.  My impression is that it requires a very long taper, just like methadone itself, and probably like tramadol.  In this case, quitting CT was premature.  I hope this is helpful.

Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 08, 2010
RollerCan and Prospero-
Thank you for your input.  I am also interested in accupuncture to help with the addiction and W/D process.  So, I hope that between the two(suboxone and accupuncture) that I will make it through.  I know there are concerns with taking suboxone, but I will need some medication to get me through this. I need the cushion this time around. Ive been addicted for 4 years and take 10 pills a day. It's gonna be a rough ride so I am willing to take the risk with suboxone.  I also cant imagine going through the suffering while caring for 2 young kids, going to work everyday and hiding it from my husband.

Today I gathered all my pills and hid them in one place. This was hope for me. I am ready to take the plunge. I am on the edge of the pool, contemplating, scared  but ready.  I am, again, so grateful that I can share with all of you.  Each and everyone, even the ones who don't write.  I feel like I have so much support and that is HUGE!  Everyone is so brave here. Fighting this battle and helping others along the way.  Its amazing, this place.

One more thing that I must share is that I am planning on divorcing my husband.  I saw a lawyer today and I am moving forward.  I am a little worried that he will tell them that I have taken Tramadol and ordered online, and am a "drug addict"etc., and make me out to be "unfit".  My lawyer said it's unlikely that they will focus much on that since I am a good mother and have a good job and exhibit stability and most importantly, the kids are happy and doing beautifully.  I'm still scared because all I want are my children.  I want them to see their dad, but I want them to live with me.  Sorry to ramble but getting divorced AND getting ready to W/D from Trams is so much to deal with!  So I'm venting I suppose.  My husband has put me down, verbally abused me, taken me for granted, and certainly not loved me for 10 years and I'm ready to be done.  Moving on.  But when he finds out I'm afraid he will kill me!  Or harm me in some way..UGH!  I may have to get a restraining order to help prevent any violence.  Oh lord, I am going through a ton right now.  Can I get off Tram AND start dealing with a divorce?? I hope so.

All of you out there listening.  Keep going because by day 30 you will feel good again and day 45, you will feel great. It may sound like a long time if you're in that first week, but it will happen. You will get yourself back. Your life.  

Best wishes to all.
Bode



Avatar universal
by fedupp, Jan 08, 2010
Bode...i haven't posted in awhile but had to respond to your post.  Do you have to start divorce proceedings now?  The reason I ask is I have so often been advised/counseled to not make huge life changing decisions when going thru something tramatic/distressful such as W/D....this type of w/d certainly counts for huge and life changing.  I just want you to have the strength to handle it all and not overwhelm yourself w/so much at one time.  Then again noone knows what you are going thru except you.

I myself have certainly considered divorce and found that I couldn't deal with both at the same time and things are changing for me now that I am clean(thinkin alittle bit more).  Whatever you decide you like some many of us are marching forward and making huge changes that ultimately say....."I am worth it and I want more and better for myself and family"

Many warm supportive thoughts!!

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 08, 2010
Hi Gang-

well.... it has been 10 1/2 days w/d for me. I start the count 24 hours after my last Tramadol dose of 100mg 12/26 2pm. Funny huh? A date and time I'll probably remember like the birth of a child for God's sakes......wow....addiction is pretty dramatic... consuming and demanding. Overall the worst seems over....pain is improved (the original pain I received the prescription for) it almost seems as though the tramadol made it better, but as my blood levels would get low...made it worst

I am struggling with depression now.....and anxiety........waves of the feelings.....tough going....still taking 1 or 2 clonidine a day (hint ....never take 2 clonidine at a time...cause it's a blood pressure pill and will cause passing out...)
don't worry....yep ....I tried it...hey if one is good why not try two??????
what an idiot
but alas....the brain of an addict is sadly predictable

THANKS TO ALL FOR THE HONEST SHARING IN YOUR BATTLE
STRENGTH AND HOPE ALL YOU BRAVE SOULS!!!!

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 09, 2010
Hi Everyone,
It's still been since Sunday morning since I took my last little white demon or as someone else called it, and I have adopted for my self...the Devil's Pill. So I guess that's 5 1/2 days. I thought I was through it all, when I didn't have the night sweats the night before, but then they came back last night, plus I had my first night of not being able to sleep. Couldn't eat much still today, felt fluish again, but what is really bad is the depression. It just keeps getting worse. As someone else said everything goes through your mind. I'm thinking and feeling I'm such a loser, thinking about every stupid mistake I made in my life, whether it was my fault or not and I can't stop dwelling on it all. And I can't stop crying. I just want to not exist. I keep telling myself it's just the withdrawals, but it's tough. And I'm trying to keep my mind on the Lord and what He would have for me and that He doesn't want me to think this way. He is so amazing and has brought me through so much ugly stuff in my life and I know He will get me through this too. But it's still just so hard to get through this. I keep coming back here and reading everyone's posts, just to keep reminding myself that I'm not going crazy and that you are all going through the same things I am. Why hasn't this stupid pill been taken off the market?

Some have been discussing the Suboxone. I thought about having my doc prescibe it for me to get through this. My daughter is a Pharmacy Tech and said the drug is sooo expensive. About $600 for a 30 day supply and most insurance companies won't pay for it. I figure I would only need a 10 day supply to get through the worst of this. I'm just bound to try to get through this without giving in to going on it.

I'm so tired and just want to go to sleep. But I'm having such a hard time getting warm. What's with that? I don't have the chills anymore, but just can't stay warm and if I do fall asleep, I wake up all sweaty, just drenched. And after a few minutes up, I'm cold again. I just can't seem to maintain an even temp.

Avatar universal
by FinallyFred, Jan 09, 2010
My two cents...

Speaking only for myself:   If anyone of us admits to having been addicted to tramadol (my hand is up), it is a safe bet that we would become addicted to taking any opiate with similar properties.  I am fairly certain that the only drugs I haven't become addicted to YET, are those I haven't tried.

I am also a recovering alcoholic, sober since 6/26/01.   Realisitically, I used both alcohol and later, tramadol, to self medicate myself.  After all (I rationalized), if you had my job, you would self medicate too.  A guy has got to sleep at night, I rationalized.  

When I first began attending regular AA meetings 8 1/2 years ago, there was a great deal of effort made by some to distinguish between the alcoholic and the addict.  Until tramadol, I guess I never saw myself as an addict.   From where I sit today, who really cares whether I classify myself as an addict or an alcoholic?   I am fairly certain that any red blooded addict would become a full blown alcoholic, given half the chance and vice versa.

People like me tend to look for chemical means to "vacate" from reality.   We may have solid arguments for behaving as we do, but  sifted down to the root, people like me want to trade reality for a kinder, softer version of reality.   Zoned, fogged, numbed, buzzed or just plain drunk.  

In order to become sober, we need to reach the point of deciding that "life on life's terms" is enough.   It just has to be.  To reach the point on our own terms of being willing to exchange zoned, fogged, numbed, buzzed or just plain drunk for life on life's terms.   To be willing to feel emotions, to hear other people's words, and to experience life's ebbs and flows while living clean and sober.  It's admittedly a tall order some days for this addict/alcoholic.

Some here are considering suboxone "treatments" to escape their tramadol addictions.  I don't claim to have a great deal of knowledge when it comes to suboxone.  In general however, I think I would share Propero's concerns.

What I know about suboxone is strictly subjective based on hanging around here for 13 months and reading literally thousands of posts.   Over that time, DOZENS of people have declared their intention of using suboxone to "detox" off tramadol.
But of those dozens of people, I can think of only 2-3 who have ever returned here and reported that they had successfully come off BOTH tramadol and eventually suboxone as well.

Want, congratulations on 30 days off tramadol.  YAY!  

Courage, Strength and Love to you all,

fred

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by wantmyselfback, Jan 09, 2010
Thanks Fred.... Your last post hit home.... REALLY, REALLY, REALLY hard.  It is as though you were writing the post for me to read.

I have come to the conclusion (along with the wife and supportive family) that I am going to attend A.A on a regular basis.  I am an alcoholic, and although I thought I was being "good," the one slip up the other night forced me to make a decision:  keep up with my addictive personality and drinking, or lose my family, job, Everything.

I, too, as Fred put it, self-medicated.  Sometimes to "vacate" from reality, sometimes just to make myself feel better.  I thought the Tramadol made me "sane" and countered my addiction to alcohol (as I could go for weeks w/o having a drink on Tramadol).  I was living a lie.

We saw a marriage counselor for the first time yesterday, and although I hope my check bounces on that woman for pretty much making our marriage out to be destined for failure and my life to end up drinking booze in a dumpster, she did hit home that I NEED TO QUIT.  She just did it rather bluntly and made my wife an emotional wreck.

I was brutally honest with her... after all I had been living a lie on Trams for six years hiding my addiction from everyone... even my wife.  Now that I have her support and can tell the truth, I went all out and to be honest, this marriage counselor had no clue what Tramadol was.  I also told her about my slip up.  She wanted me to go to a 30 detox center.  I disagreed.

Anyways, point being... although not a shrink, she did have good things to say.  She said that for over HALF of my LIFE I have been addicted to something... which is true (since I started drinking at 15).  Not only do I have an addictive personality, I am a classic case of your Impulsive disorder as well.  I have to train my brain (which has been hard-wired to accept drugs/alcohol) to deal with (as Fred puts it) "life on life's terms" without the drugs/alcohol.

I look forward to A.A.  I swear by the fact that if I can make it past 30 days off Tramadol, then I can get off the alcohol.  I have too much to lose if I don't straighten out.  Getting off the Trams was not only the best thing for me mentally/physically, but also proved that I CAN and WILL beat ANY ADDICTION.

God willing... we all will.  
Stay Strong (and thanks Fred)

Avatar universal
by sadsi, Jan 09, 2010
Thank Goodness i've found this place - I thought i was alone and I was starting to think...well I was getting rather depressed on my situation.

Apologies in advance if i dont come across as articulate as some in here - I applaud the way many have written and captured the way they feel on this "wonder" - non addicitve drug... cough cough...

Short History. I'm 38 and had a work accident 12 years ago.
9 knee operations over past 12 years - been on Tramal for 8 years to help with the pain. On my 8th operation - i lost the plot - well just hit rock bottom during recovery. Had just had enough of the pain and I tried to end it all. Fortunately, i was found, bleeding quite heavily, but okish. Dr's had me on a **** tail of pain meds(Kapanol+, 800mg Tramal and heavy anti depressants) and i literally had a single day of clarity where I said - enough. Cold turkey off everything. Was unbelievably painful - i moved myself out from my family and went and rented a cheap room. I managed but only just - I was still not the same ole "me" but i was drug free, so i moved back home with my wife and kids.

So here in lies my problem. Because i still have a little bit of pain in the knee - I went back on to the tramal about 12 months ago(so was only drug free for about 6 months in total) I'm No where near the dosage that I was on - but i can see how it's again starting to increase...and there are days where i just take 2 or 3 times what I should, just to have a pain free day now and then and just well....drug out. - and there is the problem - it's an addiction all over again. I can see that now.

The problem is - my wife and to some extent myself, feel i'm a much nicer person on this sick little white pill. I have energy, I communicate better, I'm not depressed at all, I have a lot more confidence when i'm under the "influence"...BUT i know it's time to come off the ride. I told my wife I was going to taper right off over next couple weeks and she wasn't exactly happy about it, which now makes this site sooo much more important to me as I know i'm going to need some support.
So am I making the right decision ? stuffed if I know - i know i get a little agro when i'm in pain, i know i get depressed about being in pain, but I don't even know how bad the pain really is anymore as i've been on on this stuff soo long. I know it MUST be doing my body tremendous harm, but oh how that sickly but somehow relaxed feeling helps me thru the days...nope, it's definately time, 8 years of taking this "wonder" drug - when i used to be a sporty, healthy, confident person who wouldn't touch a drug - even for a headache - OOOHHH - How i hate the way this drug was sold too me...

I told my GP that i was not too get any more scripts other than enough to taper down and she agreed but advised me she would be there if i need her and she'd have the lowest dose, scrpited and ready to pick up, should i get so depressed that i...well can't cope.(50mg capsules)

I'm currently down to 1 x 150mg tab per day(down from 400mg over last month) and i plan on staying at 150 for next 10 days. I'll then cut back to 1 x 100 for 15-20 days and by then, hopefully can  make the jump.

Thanks to Emily for giving me the reads - the insight to seeing that I'm not alone. And thanks to everyone else who has contributed to this site thus far - just reading what some others have been thru, makes me feel like i can also do this....the thought of WD's are quite sickening, the thought of maybe hitting depression again is quite frightening, but the thought of doing nothing and sitting still, taking more and more tramal - inconceivable.

Appreciate any assistance or feedback.
I am not able (willing) to attend local meetings  - frankly i would be too embarassed and the stigma attached regardless of how the problem arrived - remains....

Thanks for letting me share.

SadSi.

Avatar universal
by kimta, Jan 09, 2010
My emotions and thoughts are always racing these days, and I am so easily distracted and irritated that it's hard to put things into words that make sense. If they do make sense, it's because it has taken me hours to produce it. As a full-time student this has been extremely frustrating. An assignment that takes a fellow class-mate minutes to complete can take me a whole day. So bear with me everybody. I don't mean to sound scatter-brained, I just can't help it right now.

SadSi, it is understandable that you, (and your wife), would feel you function better, or are more "likeable" while on Tram. If I were to not have it at all right now my emotions would become, for lack of a better word, raw. Irritability bubbles up, my thought processes are scrambled when I'm on it but out of control when I don't take it. Anxiety multiplied a million times.

It's been my experience though, that any chemical substance taken over time, will eventually turn on you. What relief you feel from your irritibility, the energy it might give you, that will all change. But the addiction to the substance will still be there. So eventually, you find that your taking something that gives you very little benefit, even serious adverse reactions, but you keep taking it to avoid the painful w/d. That's addiction.

The manufacturers of Tramadol claim that those who have addictive tendencies are the people who should be cautious. Bull****! Dependency can happen to anyone. Just search "detoxing from tramadol", people from all over the world are having problems with this drug. The stigma that has been placed on addiction is very harmful itself. It blocks people from seeking the help they should, which is by any means necessary. Having to rely on anything to get through life is no way to live. It's not living at all. It's your own personal prison.

But when there is a condition needing treatment, like pain, what a mess it can become. And if you have already been labeled an addict, it's so hard to ever get real relief because you are not trusted to be able to make logical decisions for yourself. Your motives are always in question.

I'm angry because I was ernestly trying to avoid opiate addiction even when my pain get's so bad the Tramadol gives no relief and I want to go to my doctor and beg for Hydrocodone or something stronger. But I didn't. And I became addicted anyway. With the added bonus of the anti-depressant ingredient that has left me on the verge of tears for the last 4 months and I didn't understand why. Nor could I understand why it was so hard to put my thoughts together long enough to complete homework assignments.

I'm an emotional wreck and STILL in pain. And now I have to detox from Tram and don't know what I'm going to do for pain relief. I was given Hydro's once so far. I just took the Hydro's and not the Tram. I got no relief. Now I understand why. Any narcotic by itself in a "normal" dosage is only going to ease my w/d symptoms before it helps with any pain.

It's very easy to understand why anyone would become so depressed they would feel trapped. I know I can overcome this but am so emotional at times it seems too difficult. I won't give up though. I see my doctor on Monday. I don't trust him, but I'll give him one last chance. He doesn't come up with what I believe to be an "informed" plan of action. I'm looking for another doctor.    



Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 09, 2010
Kimta- I was not told about the antidepressant properties of tramadol when it was prescribed to me for pain. I understand from this site that those anitdepressant properties are part of the pain relief tramadol brings. makes sense because chronic pain certainly causes a depressed mood. coming off an antidepressant AND a drug with 'weak opioid properties" (HA!)
at the same time was HELL for me.......I am glad you feel confident knowing what you want to cover with your MD and have a back up plan if the interaction doesn't go well........

Sadsi-  I think it takes a long time to clear out the 'garbage drug'...... several weeks to months.....are you able to institute some non drug pain and depression treatments while you are doing your w/d? day 1-5 were rough for me wasn't able to do much but roil in misery--- but after that?....planning accupuncture, massage ...(for me) yoga class... meditation and a hike in the woods? whatever brings your heart joy....what does?

ok--- my last tram 12/28 (I said 26 last post) things are going pretty well....feel fragile emotionally...tend toward overreactions in my head and heart...I pray a lot and try to be kind to myself....out of judgement of any kind....hey compassion is key for healing------  mistakes? I've made a million of them....trying to learn  always trying to learn
sounds like we all are
  I think of the story about the monk asked to sum up his life....his reply?
"One mistake after another"  smiling...peaceful....accepting...and kind
  STRENGTH AND LOVE to all you BRAVE WARRIORS
  

Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 09, 2010
Kimpta- Yes, it's a rough time.  I feel your pain even though I'm not there yet.  But I know how your feeling right now and it's terrible. The depression and lack of energy and enthusiasm for life was what killed me.  Along with the sweating and endless, sleepless nights for weeks on end.  The emotional side of W/D has it's own set of demons.  It's terrifying to me.  

This is why I am scared to take the leap and quit.  I want to so badly but am just so so so scared of the awful pain and agony of it.  I wish I could escape all my responsibilities for 2 weeks and just suffer and get it done.  But I can't.  I am secretly on tramadol and am secretly getting off of it. No one knows except for all of you.  My husband is suspicious, but doesn't really know or have proof.  I would have to fake having the flu or something.  This is why I am leaning towards taking Suboxone and then tapering off of that which is much less difficult according to what I've read.  I don't want to replace Tramadol with another drug, but want to cushion my fall so that I can still be a good mom for my children, and care for my home and dogs and cats and be a charasmatic teacher 5 days a week.  And hide the W/D from my husband.  

So that's where I am.  In a way, I envy those already in the W/D stage. You are on you way to freedom. You have to hang in there and it all gets better.  I wish I were at least on my way.  I hope I can start my recovery next week.  I am anxious about it.  Especially since I am leaning towards divorcing my husband at the same time.  I have decided to do one thing at a time and get clean first, then decide wether to go forward with the divorce.

Thanks for listening everyone.

Warm wishes.

Bode

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 09, 2010
Kimta..does nothing relieve your pain at all?Most people have noticed that when the tramadol or opiate withdrawal rebound pain subsides that often otc pain relievers help.I have found that 2 extrastrength tylenil every 4 hours and 2 extrastrength ibuprofen every 4 hours takes away my pain of rheumatoid arthritis.I try to keep the ibuprofen at the least dose possible and the tylenol extra strength max 4000mg/day.I only combine the two during more severe pain.I am in less pain now than I was taking the opiates because of their rebound pain effect.Sometimes combining an antihistamine with  the pain reliever as in percogesic or tylenol pm increases the pain relieving effects of the tylenol.

I really do understand your anger at the tramadol because it is misrepresented as a safe alternative to opiates..which we know it is not.It has more interactions with other drugs than tylenol #3 and probably less pain relief and more difficult to stop.

This drug should be controlled like a narcotic and not prescribed willy nilly to vulnerable people.In fact I believe that everyone is vulnerable to this drug and I advise everyone to avoid it if possible.Most doctors are not aware of the addicting potential of this drug.

We all got through withdrawals with hot baths in epsom salts,tylenol,ibuprofen,warm wraps and any legal way we could.

I hope you and you doctor can find a plan of action and he can't this forum helps everyone.

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by wantmyselfback, Jan 09, 2010
Hi All,

Trust me, it does get better.  Today was a great day.  Full of energy, completely sober (33 days off Tramadol), and loving life.  Spent time with the whole family (extended) and had no complaints, which normally I would never have said out loud.  Normally after a dinner with my crazy family I would've been at least 10 trams deep for the day and possibly about a six pack or more of beer and/ or wine.

But seeing a new me makes me feel good.  Knowing the pain I went through for the W/D was all worth it.  Ibuprofen and Tylenol definitely works completly fine.  

Kitma, just wanted to let you know that the pain really does reduce after the initial w/d.  During my Tram-taking, I often found I would have to take Ibuprofen on top of the Tramadol to reduce the pain.  It might peak for the first few days, but then you'll find that OTC really does work.  After speaking with a doctor about the Tram addiction, I was told that 800 MG Ibuprofen would substantially help better than taking Tramadol.  I'm not a doctor, but I hope that helps.

Stay strong all!

Avatar universal
by newway, Jan 09, 2010
Hi all - it has been a bit since I have posted - but I have tried to keep up with reading the posts.

I am now 30 days tram free.  Never thought it would happen.  Even when I started posting on this site - planning and starting my taper - I never really thought I could break free - 5 years and 25 pills a day -  to nothing??  
I am one of those folks who has an addictive personality.  My Dr did mislead me on the properties of Tram - I was fed the non narcotic line - but as soon as I took it I knew I liked it.
I was nicer, more relaxed, less anxious and depressed, energy - it was great for maybe a year or so. Then it turned - there was never enough pills to get that same feeling back - soon I was taking them by the handful, in debt up to my ears and in a state of constant fog.

Now I am trying to live life day to day tram free - before the holidays I actually started to panic- not sure if I would have enough pills for the trip - forgeting for that moment that I don't need the darn things any more.
Physically I am starting to feel a little better - I had a headache for 20 days that finally subsided, my stomach is still cranky at times and sleep is still very difficult.  The ringing in my ears - which I have had for almost 5 years seems to be coming and going now - which is a good sign.
I am not depressed - but very flat.  I am more content to stay in - and I need to start engaging back into the real world.  I have let a lot of friends slip away, things I used to like to do I have lost interest in - and it seems like a lot of energy to get back into the game.  But I know that I have to push myself a bit to beat the emotional backlash of this drug.
I don't just want this stuff out of my system - I want my life back, and that is going to take some work on my part.

I think recovery and relapse prevention have to be my main focus.  I can convince myself so easily that one pill for really exteme pain won't hurt me.  As long as I don't let it get out of control I will be fine. lol.
I am back to AA - I had stopped going when I realized I was addicted to tram - I felt a bit hypocritical going - but now I know it is the way to maintaining my sobriety.  Like this forum - it gives me the support I need, from people who have been through very similar things.

Hang in there everyone - the withdrawal is not nearly as difficult as living life day to day on this drug.  Going through withdrawal means the fog will lift - your head will clear, you can be free.  

  


Avatar universal
by sadsi, Jan 10, 2010
re my ongoing knee issues - I tried acupuncture, OTC drugs, i've even gone as far as trying some of the softer "illegals". Not good. The acute pain I can deal with with ice packs / heat packs, deeeeeep heat creams etc etc but it's the chonic - nagging, constant pain that drives me to insanity. I'm considering hypnotherapy - not sure i believe in it, but hey - when all else fails...however, this is why the tramal was so effective for a time - it helped the nagging pain...

Has anyone tried hypnotherapyfor withdrawal ? I know a few smokers who have had success with this, and some ppl believe that tobbacco withdrawal is among the worst. ?

I have had a pretty bad day with knee pain (i'm sticking to my step down regardless, still at 150mg )- but even actually feeling the "pain" on such a low dose of tramal is almost...well novel. The ice packs are getting a real work out but hey - my liver and kidneys are not lol. 150 mg and i'm starting to feel the WD's. Getting very irrate at the smllest things, sleep seems impossible - just lie awake in a stupour...but hey - it's still no where near what Cold turkey would be like and yes, been thru it once already - never again, i'm not strong enough.

The local pharmicist gave me some osteo paracetamol tablets to try - basically for arthritic conditions, so will see how they go...I have to be careful from voltaren, aspirins etc as i've got issues with ulcers etc - and yes from the endoscopic report - taking tramal on a empty stomach is almost the only way possible that these ulcers could of developed - yet another side effect not shown on the leaflet.

Only another 4 days to go at 150mg and then i'm dropping another 50 down to 100...i really cant wait to be free from this dependancy, other ppl have already commented on being tied down to somthing - so hey, i can so relate.

Take care everyone. Hang in there. Everytime i look at the next tablet - i'm thinking of the fat cat CEO's of that drug company grinning back at me in a "knowing" manner....

Si.

Avatar universal
by sadsi, Jan 10, 2010
Does anyone know what the strongest OTC pain killer medication is for arthritic type conditions ? I simply cannot believe that Tramal is an OTC drug in New Zealand - that simply blows my mind.

I need something to help with the pain - but i don't want to go to GP and get A to replace B - so it has to be OTC.
thanks
Si

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by wantmyselfback, Jan 10, 2010
Sadsi- Try 600-800 MG Ibuprofen.  Make sure you eat with that, or it will make your stomach growl like crazy and get upset.  The Ibuprofen also is an anti-inflamitory (NSAID) so should help with some of the swelling.  

Mexico also sells Tramadol OTC... which boggles my mind as well.  I wonder how many hopeless people out there are hooked on this drug?  When the wife and I were in Mexico last year, seriously a 12-15 yr old boy was purchasing Tramadol.  I was still on the drug at the time, but wanted to take that pharmacist (or should I say cashier) out back and beat him sensless.  Not a good start for a young child... especially if they can purchase it like tylenol.

Try the Ibuprofen... like I said in previous posts, unless you've undergone surgery or have cancer, Ibuprofen is a good and non-addicting way to alleviate the pain (as said by a doctor/friend).  Just make sure you eat while taking it.

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by wantmyselfback, Jan 10, 2010
I found an interesting site today... The Good Drug Guide.  Talks a lot about addiction/ pain managment, and has a lot of information.  Go to biopsychiatry.com

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 10, 2010
Sadsi- what type of knee issues do you have? If possible I would recommend working with a yoga/physical therapist person. Yoga done right--- for restoration has AMAZING healing potential.
Yoga is also helpful for depression and anxiety.

Neway- you are right! it is more work to stay on the Tram (after the initial w/d) than off. I agree about the energy. I feel so lethargic. I can tell I need to push a bit to get 1/2 the stuff done I used to get done. whatsupwiththat?

must be about day 13......anxiety still aproblem.....saw the movie  UpinThe Air last night........GOOD movie

BE WELL ALL   strength and healing

Avatar universal
by fedupp, Jan 10, 2010
So many great posts and wonderful advice.  I have no doubt that for every issue one person has, another soul has been thru it and has sound warm advice.  Everytime I read new posts about the struggle/decision to stop Tram I have every bit of faith that soon that person will be helping the next person along.  It really is a gift that keeps on giving and I know for me it continues to be a source of comfort and support.

Been off since Dec 20th and yesterday thought I literally was going to die or had a life threatening tumor.  My migrane was so severe I was in ER for 5 hrs and after some relief the migrane came back so bad, I was throwing up constantly.  I prayed and prayed and wondered if this is part of my WD because I usually only have migranes around my monthly cycle.  Today is a new day and I feel week and hung over but much much better.  

Have a strong day warriors!!!

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by Jethro63, Jan 10, 2010
The Tram is HISTORY.  The last one-half was friday night at bedtime.  

Iv been juicin myself up on the Thomas Recipe. Iv been taking daily vitamins for the last 2 months, and holding my tram dose at 1/2 pill in the morning and 1/2 pill at nite.   I started a few weeks ago with St Johns Wort but switched to 5-HTP and am ready to use the T-Lysene in the morning and had an IM B-12 yesterday and again in a week.  I got a Doc on board to help me and he has given me some Atavan and Skelaxin for when my body ties itself in knots.   I have aslo synced all this up with my latest N.U.C.C.A. Chiropractor visit last week with another  scheduled on Saturday.   I also have an appointment on Monday with P/T to set me up with some I/R, TENS, ice packs, jakusee

Been takin Tram every day for at least 3 years.  Up to 3 or 4 a day max.  I can believe you guys taking more than that,  My head would explode.  Tapered down to .25mg 2X a day.  But before i had realized I was hooked on them, had gotten misdiagnosed by an MD and ended up on a morphine drip for 3 days.  Never did curb the pain till she discharged me and resumed my Tram scrip.(on day 6 of my Detox) (-but i aint bitter)

This Chiropractor has helped me get a hold of some of my pain, and I think right now the Tram is causing half of the pain that I am feeling .  The future will tell.


Avatar universal
by sadsi, Jan 10, 2010
To wantmyselfback - I recently had to have an endoscope because i was coughing up small amounts of blood in the mornings. The Dr who did the scope found "quite a few" small ulcers in the stomach. Seeings as though i dont drink, smoke and have a pretty good diet - the only thing he could put the ulcers down too were the tramal being taken on empty stomach ie in the middle of the night or early mornings. As such - i am not allowed to go near NSAID type med's as they will inflame the ulcerations...starts to narrow my field as Ibruforen, Voltaren etc are now out of the picture.

To 4leef - I originally had a severe dislocation, ie put knee cap into near my thigh. Ive had operations, such as patella realignment, open chondro plasties, various screws / bone grafts (9 ops thus far and...)etc. At the moment the patella still doesn't track straight so every extension means the patella clips / grates against the femur causing crunching / grinding pain - at times its not too bad but you can actully hear the crunch other times quite loudly.
The Dr's want to remove the patella but i've spoken with, researched the op and it's not received well - about 50/50 on outcomes and i simply cannot do another 9+ month rehab...it's not the pain so much it's the time and not being able to do things for such a long period whilst you recover that gets really depressing.  

As a 2010 resolution i have started a stretching resume and it's definately making me feel better and the quad with the bad knee is def starting to feel better but the crunching still remains, and that's the prime reason i'm addicted to Tramal - it allows me to do things i wouldn't normally be able too do.

My last physio basically gave up - once the knee gets inflamed and swollen, it then just starts to give way / almost collapses on me. I'm then forced to follow the RICE program, lots and lots of ice to get the swelling under control. The physio was so frustrated because she could hear and feel the crunching constantly, and she couldn't find too many exercises (straight leg lifts aside) that we could use to try and strengthen the muscles around the knee - thus the longer times on rehabs after Ops for me.

However, i know your right with the yoga - if i can get some decent OTC meds an get on a good yoga program, maintain my stretching routines then I might just be able to get this knee covered. But i really need to get free of the tramal and just find out how bad the pain is without tramal in my system - thus the step down i'm doing.

Thanks for advice thus far - i've got a long way too go like so many others here but it's great support.

Keep going everyone - it can, it will happen.

Cheers
Si.


Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 10, 2010
sadsi...You are in a tough spot..not being to take NSAIDS really limits your otc pain relievers.How about topical antiinflammatory creams or lotions.Voltaren makes an otc cream that can be quite effective and maybe combined with tylenol with an antihistamine or muscle relaxant may help a bit.Or even a local anaesthetic like benzocaine combined with the voltaren cream.Glucosamine and MSM can help also.I hope something helps relieve your pain soon.Till those ulcers heal you certainly can not take any NSAIDS at all.I see your point about using otc pain relievers.Who wants to be begging doctors all the time for pain meds if otc pain meds help.

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 10, 2010
sadsi- why not a total knee replacement? NOT that I endorse joint replacements when they can be avoided...I don't!!
I am just wondering, with the severity of your knee issues if this option has been considered.....my first yoga instructor was on the schedule for a knee replacement when she started yoga.....she HEALED it....I know she worked hard at it but she enjoys pain free range of motion, strength and balance in the joint she was troubled with.

I feel depressed today. I read Fred's post about AA and addiction and ...well lately I've been being hard on myself. Here's why
I went to my MD for overwhelming inflammatory pain in my wrists and forearms last winter..he wrote a script for Tramadol. I give this drug at work....I knew it wasn't controlled. Here I was....9 years sober starting a 'pain med' that looked pretty safe to take....then I went off cause of 'brain shocks' yuck and had no withdrawal...but I restarted in July because of osteoarthritis pain and usually took 200mg daily which was my prescribed dose. (funny but the brain shocks didn't happen again) I knew I LIKED it..it not only took the pain away...but I was funnier, cleverer, happier...sort of  The Day I knew I had to Get off this garbage pill was the day I ordered a supply off the internet so I could up my amount beyond what was prescribed...I was 36 hours w/d when it arrived and it went right down the toilet...I told myself I could keep my sober date if I didn't go outside my prescribed amount...

NOW ...even though I didn't drink I feel like I blew my sobriety on this drug....and I am not quite sure how to think about this
and have waves of self mortification...I am not talking about this to anyone except on this thread.....
my partner knows...he has been supportive
I feel great about getting off it....I still have my job in good standing, my family is intact and actually quite healthy-- the w/d was horrendous (as I have said so many times) and the PAWS intermittently CLAW at my psyche
I am tempted to just keep riding through this part of life..putting the days together---- going easy
but I'll admit I am troubled by all this and it floats into my mind often..I feel guilty  



Avatar universal
by sadsi, Jan 10, 2010
Thanks Pharma - i've written some names down that you've mentioned and will approach local chemist. Thank you.

4leef - I am too young for a knee replacement - apparently, they will only consider that if your over 50 years of age, because the knee only has so many cycles before another one has to be done - i'm 37.

Reading thru your posts I find it difficult to read how your beating your self up over your tramal issues - and this goes for everyone as well. Everyone knows the adicction that goes along with pethadine or morpheine. If you had of approached the DR for assistance with your pain and he/she said - hey - let's give you a high dose of Morpheine for the next 6-12 months, then you would of known what you were in for. However, most Dr's, Pharmacists, Neurologists, etc etc etc etc have absolutely NO idea of the addicitive side effects of thsi drug - so how you can you be to blame ? you went to the Dr for help...

After doing a little more research into the way tramal works (i'm one of those ppl, that if i know a lot more about something, it's not so scary..) I am almost horrified to read(be it correct - maybe someone can add their opinion here) that we still don't actually know how this drug actually does what it does. Scientists know what it is, what it's made of and they know the effects to a degree - but they still don't seem to understand "how" it actually interacts with the bodies chemistry. That's one of the reasons that the anti depressant properties were so damn late in coming out (are they out ?) in to the light. The past couple GP's i've spoken too in the past 3 years were still advising me that it was not addicitive, and had no anti depressant qualities so I should keep taking luvox(AD)....My latest GP does have a better understanding but she was the one that started me researching the drug, she was the one that said, it's a synthetic opioid, but we dont really understand it yet...

So if that's actually fact - I fail to see how any of the now "addicted" ppl should take sole responsibility for the problems we now face. Sure we were maybe a little naieve and ill advised - but 99.9% of us went to seek help and assistance, not too seek a high....

Stay strong. Drop the guilt.

Cheers
Si

Avatar universal
by howcouldiknow88, Jan 11, 2010
Hey, everyone. Sorry I haven't been around lately.
Just spent the last 45 minutes reading posts that I have missed and glad to see a couple of new comers.

Just wanted to say that I'm a little over 2 weeks in cold turkey. A lot of the physical symptoms are gone. 4leef, was good to read your updates since we quit just a day apart. Although I'm feeling ok physically (and actually healthier), I'm an emotional mess here lately. I have moments of complete clarity and joy, quickly followed by depressive and negative pensive thoughts. I'm hanging in there, though.

It feels very strange to be off of the tramadol since I had been on it since I was 15. This is an all out emotional war now.

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 11, 2010
Howcould!---Whew! I've been thinking of you and am SO GLAD to read your post!! Great Work!! I like what you say about all out emotional war........yes Hon, I know-----  emotional waves of clarity and peace followed (closely, it seems) by anxiety, impending doom.....whoa   sometimes I just stop, take a deep breath and let the feeling wash over me...and hopefully recede....scary....what if it doesn't?  so far it has and I try not to panic (I am afraid that will cause it to linger)  .....Its like being trapped in a cage with a tiger
    
thanks for your reply Sadsi--I appreciate your encouragement and support!!!!
I thought it might be an age issue ......although they can't factor the TREMENDOUS advances that will come in orthopedic technology in joint replacement....look what has happened in the last 20 years......

BE STRONG WARRIORS

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 11, 2010
Sadsi- Is there an anti-depressant that you can try?  It sounds like they are treating depression with Tramadol, which is unnecessary.  A combo of Anti-inflammatories and an AD might help.  I don’t say this lightly because I’m trying to taper off Effexor right now and it’s hard, but if you need one, they might help!  Maybe you need a different AD.  Also, can you use the topical Voltaren?  I tried hypnosis when I quit smoking and it didn’t help me, but you never know.

Bode- The taper part of coming off trams is the worst.  I really think, based on what I’ve read here, you’re better off pushing through than with subs.  My understanding is that sub is hard to come off of and must also be tapered.  

Pharma- I have noticed since I’ve been clean that ibuprofen does still help my pain.  I take the 800 mg time release one.  I think people, including me, don’t realize that you need to take anti-inflammatory drugs regularly for them to work well.

Newway- I’m glad you’ve gone back to meetings.  I think a lot of alcoholics are prescribed tramadol, so I think you’d find a lot of understanding and maybe you can even help others.

4Leef- I wouldn’t view this as blowing your sobriety.  We can have such an all or nothing view.  You maintained your sobriety from alcohol and you want to keep it that way.  There are grey areas sometimes.  As long as you’re honest with yourself about it, I think it’s okay.

Congrats to everyone who is maintaining their sobriety!

I’m doing okay.  Still clean and down to 75mg of Effexor.  I will drop to 50mg later this week hopefully.  I can’t wait to be free of it, but I know it will be hard towards the end.  Effexor is a great anti-depressant, but you really have to weigh the side effects and withdrawal with how much it helps.

Jenny

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 11, 2010
Thanks Jen -- I am GLAD I didn't drink....wanted to a couple times during early w/d. I am just going to keep going , pray and not decide how I am going to look at this right now...I am just grateful to look in the mirror and know I am not 'fogged' 2day.
I understand that AD are hard to wean....did you start the effexor to help with tram w/d?

Looking at the overall pain issues with tramadol I have to conclude that the Tram made my pain worse, overall. It was highly effective initially. Later it would work to dampen pain after taking the dose but when the dose would wear off the rebound pain as well as the pain during taper were definitely exaggerated pain  ...for me    To all new w/d posters DONT THINK THE PAIN YOU HAVE IS THE REAL PAIN YOU'LL BE LEARNING TO TREAT AND LIVE WITH OFF THE TRAM.....
this is part of the lie and the illusion that fed my fear and kept me stuck........


Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 11, 2010
4leef- I was put on pristiq, which is the new effexor basically, about 6 months before I started to taper the tram.  So no, I wasn't put on it because of it.  In hindsight, maybe I could have worked through my depression or at least I wouldn't have taken such a strong drug.  I didn't really realize that Pristiq was the same as Effexor.  Celexa had made me numb in the past, but I should have tried prozac or something.

I agree my pain is no worse since I stopped.  I have tendonitis now, but originally I took it for back pain and it's not so bad anymore.  When I first herniated the disk, it was awful, but that was years ago and I think it is more healed.

jenny

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by booba77, Jan 11, 2010
Hey guys.  Sometimes I am so proud of my accomplishment, and other times I am so low I just lie in bed avoiding chores, my family, hell, even the pets.  I am waiting to even out and feel more normal.  I dont want to take an AD, but I was on trazadone for years.  dont wanna go back.  Things in my life need to change, but I am struggling with the motivation to make it happen.  But today hasnt been that bad.  Only when I sit and reflect does it really bother me.  I am super proud of being off the trams, but ashamed of the debt I have created in the meantime.  It is time to just get over myself, get off my *** and get moving.  It is easier said than done.  to you new people starting out, it is rough at first, but if you keep posting and asking ? you will be ok.  we are all here for you.  fight on warriors......

Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 11, 2010
Just spoke to an MD about Suboxone and how it works to help with withdrawal.  The part I couldn't believe was when the doctor asked which med I was trying to get off of, she said oh well, I normally only give Suboxone to patients coming off of opiates.  I said, "Tramadol is an opiate!" I said, " It is a synthetic opiate that is highly addictive and extremely painful to W/D from"  She said she would have to do some research because she didn't know much about it.  Scary!!  This is a doctor trained to be very knowledgable on opiate meds...  Am I right?  Tramadol IS an opiate???

Anyway, I made an appointment with another MD who says he is very familiar with Tramadol and it's W/D. So, we'll see.  I may end up doing it in a very slow taper and bagging the suboxone which I will just have to taper off of as well.  BUT, if I go the suboxone route, at least I will be under doctor supervision and I will feel better about the whole thing that way.  Just my feeling.  Either way I do it, I am going to kick it and hope this is the last time I ever have to think about how to get off the evil drug again.

Booba- I know how you feel about feeling ashamed and/or guilty.  I remember coming off of Trams last time and feeling incredible shame.  I think your emotions that were masked by the drug are just right there on the surface and it's painful.  Hang in there- in time things won't seem so bad.  It really does get so much better emotionally too.

Best wishes to all

Bode

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by Pinkmonki, Jan 11, 2010
Today is day 38, what a wild ride this has been!

Christmas was hard, but made it through.  Thank you all for the encouragement through this tough time.  What would I have done without you?  I am please to report that it has now been seven days since my last night sweats.  I can not believe it went on that long.  Thank God I am on the PG&E balanced plan for all of the laundry I was doing and heating of water from all of my baths!  

I am a lot calmer now, but still have instantaneous fits of rage every now and then.  Life with the husband is much better and my cats seem to be a lot happier too.  It's funny, I would rely upon the tramadevil to get more stuff done during the day, but now I look at myself and wonder what was all of the stuff I was trying to get done?  I seem to get more accomplished clean and sober.  I have the moments where my body just stops and it is telling me "hey take a break" and I do, I actually just veg out, then after 20 minutes or so I get up and get more stuff done.

I feel at peace, I am not going to regret taking this drug because it did help at one point in time, but I learned so much from this experience.  The knowledge I've gained about withdrawal, this drug, researching medication, trusting someone with your life, and best of all meeting all you out there with the vast amounts of information that each one brought to the table, it has been worth it.  

The best thing is that our words are out on the WWW to help others.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 11, 2010
Booba...You should be justifiably proud of yourself.You accomplished an enormous task.Look forward not backwards and hold your head high.Instead of feeling guilty about the money you spent,think now of the money you saved and your money problems will somehow get looked after.You have not bought any trams for a long time and have saved money by not buying any.I am very proud of you and am sure you will continue to be a success.You are a good person and we love you.

Avatar universal
by howcouldiknow88, Jan 11, 2010
Was cleaning up a little bit earlier today and pulled down a box my fiance and I used to move our stuff here when we moved a few months back. There are a few tramadol in there. How? I don't know. Round, white pills, by Mylan. Was my favorite generic of tramadol. I didn't flush the pills, but I haven't taken them either. I just kind of stopped cleaning and put them in the bathroom. I am so tempted. But I believe I'm about to flush them, throw them away. Something. Any other time I would feel like I found a hundred dollars. I don't understand how they got there. Maybe I just don't remember how. I feel like they put THEMSELVES there for me to find. Bastards.  

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 11, 2010
Let us know when you flush them, Honey
we believe in you !

Pink- thanks for your words of gratitude about your experience. 90% of our experience is how we choose to look at things, I think. You reminded me of this very important truth. Congrats on your 37 days

Booba, Jetthro, wantmyself, howcouldI, JG, feddup, pharma --thanks for being here, sharing and committing to a life without TRAM . This site has meant the world to me over the last 2 weeks. tomorrow will be 2 weeks for me. I went to an AA meeting today and then a yoga class.....both helped with the emotional waves of depression and anxiety I am experiencing in my PAWS
Bode- you are doing a great job finding your way...exploring what you need. glad you'll be working with a prescriber on the suboxone. That kind of support and accountability will help, I am sure  keep posting, girl!!

Avatar universal
by newway, Jan 11, 2010
How - throw them away - this is not a test, it's your life.  
I know the feeling - many days if I had some in the house I would take them and I am thankful everyday that I do not have any here for those moment of weakness.  
Think of the journey you have been on - why you started it, what these #*#!** pills have done to you - to us.

I am 34 days clean and going through a really bad period.  Low energy, low mood, no sleep and my stomach is acting up again.  I know that the recovery is not going to be linear, and that some days, weeks are going to be tough.  But I am feeling so low and sorry for myself it is really hard to keep the goal in mind.  Why I am doing this.  I keep thinking - I know how to make myself feel better.

That's why I am here- reading the posts, reminding myself why I am doing this.  Reminding myself how much work it is to keep sober and how miserable I was using tram and trying to get off it.


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by Pinkmonki, Jan 11, 2010
How - the pills must go, the past is the past, you have moved on, look at how far you have come!!  

What makes you want to hold on to them?

Flush, flush, flush.........

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by gerty411411, Jan 12, 2010
Hi Y'all,
Pink I stil have intense anxiety and  PMS is horrendous.  I'm going to discuss these issues with my psch this Friday because it's been very hard on my family and the polple I work with.  I also don't like the way I feel and act when I'm in that state.  The rage is particuarily scary.

Thank God I haven't found more than t lying around.  I flushed it because I knew for me the longer I new I had it the greater chance I would take it.  Beleive me I felt a bit of a pang seeing it go but I kept saying "I want to be free".  That's what it boils down to and that is why we are all here.  But when I;m low I sometimes still search but the luck has been with me.  If I find another one I will fluch it , too.

Hope you all have a good day!!

Gerty


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by booba77, Jan 12, 2010
Flush those evil pills.  Thanks everyone for your support.  It all really helps me get through the day.  I couldnt have done this without you.

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by MemphisMark, Jan 12, 2010
Hey Newway your at the 34 day point and still having wd's?  and IMO its not a good idea to keep any pills around

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 12, 2010
Gerty- Good for you talking to your psych.  There are plenty of meds for anxiety.  You don't need to self-medicate with tramadol. :)

Jenny

Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 12, 2010
Emily
Are you there?



334144 tn?1423248271
by booba77, Jan 12, 2010
Gerty~you go girl.  We are proud of you.  I feel full of rage and negativity most of the time, but what I feel isnt really anxiety, more like impatience and frustration with everything.  the worst part is how my behavior and actions affects my 4 year old daughter.  I dont want her to end up like me and my mom, where the glass is always half empty and everything is misery all of the time.  I probably need counseling, but I cannot afford it.

Avatar universal
by patrick11324, Jan 12, 2010
i am trying to get off of tramadol and and vic's is there anyone i can taslk too...the withdrawl are bad...taking vics to help with the withdrawls...yea in know not good....i am ttrying any advice out there..thanks

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by Jethro63, Jan 12, 2010
Listening to all Y'all  I just flushed everyone single one I had.  Almost half a scrip.  AND IT didnt hurt any worse than this excrushiating nerve pain in my right side like Goerge Forman is giving me rib shots.   OUCH OUCH OUCH

The pain level is up on this 3rd/4th day of my detox.  I slep like crap last night as Round #1 with the champ started about 12:30 am. Today is hurting.  Im realizing that Im somewhat dehydrated even though Im pounding the poweraide.  The 5HTP and the T-Lyseen suck the moistier right out of you.  Im trying to find a friend with a tub or I will be hitting the showers very soon.  Hot showers , walking at least a mile a day, 1 or 2 skelakin a day right now and 1mg 3x a day Atavan cause Im screwed in the head.

Iv gotta keep the rib grabs away so I can breath thru all this.  I hope the prize fight is over by thursday as I gotta get back to work.

The Atavan is making me occationally stupid but I dont want to turn into a blubbering pile of jello when the pain starts kicking me in the ***!


..and I had almost forgotten about the screaming/whirring jet enginesblairing in my ears.


Good news!!  Found a friend with a HOT TUB!!!!



You can do it patrick!!!!!


Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 12, 2010
I'm about to stop taking trams for good.  I will take my lay dose at 8:00pm.  I will be in moderate withdrawal when I see my doctor who will be prescribing suboxone to help with the horrendous W/D. I hope she will give me something to help with sleep.  I hve butterflies because Im excited to never look at a tram again.  Those little white evil pills.  Even with Suboxone, I will be suffering.  But at least it will help an I will be able to function as a mom and teacher... I hope.

Patrick, and anyone who wants to talk, I am here.  You can do it, just breathe in 5 seconds, out 10 seconds. You're heart rate will drop and you will calm down.  Emily told me that and it really helped last time I detoxed.  None of the vitamins an other natural rememdies helped me at all. Time.  Try to make the time go by keeping active, as he'd as it is.

Please wish me luck on my journey into detox land...... Here I go......

Best wishes

Bode
  

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by wantmyselfback, Jan 12, 2010
I think Bode said it best... it just takes time.  Hang in there all.  I'm past day 35 and feeling great.  I have some ups and downs... but that's life in a nutshell.  Tram just puts a fog over you so you live each day in that fog only doing the task at hand... not sitting back to stop and smell the roses, take in the fresh air, or LIVE.

Once you make it through the w/d stage, it gets better and better... trust me.  Hang in there all.  You've come to the right place!

-Doug

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by Pinkmonki, Jan 12, 2010
I am excited for everyone of you coming off the tramadevil.  

Days 3-5 I thought I was going to just die, then 10-12 and 17-19 were horrible as well.  BUT, I made it through and you will too.  There is a road ahead of me, but it can be dealt with.

Depending upon your job please be careful.  I ended up getting written up at work, because unknown to me, I mailed some important documents to a client from a different client.  This was on day three of my cold turkey before I ended up going home "sick".  I was out of my mind trying to keep all of my paperwork straight, and detox, and I paid for it.  My manager felt bad about having to write me up because she knows my work ethic and could not understand how I could of done something like this..........she will never know and I will never tell.  So, everyone please be careful!  Use your sick time or vacation time or at the very least only keep one thing one your desk at a time to help with keeping you as focused as possible.  

Everyone here is poised ready to help, listen, and offer all kinds of advice, tips and tricks.

I've put on 7 pounds since coming off the drug, but also I've not been exercising.  I've been eating good wholesome food, but just WAY TOO MUCH and way too frequently.  I would not have it any other way though.  To be off the drugs completely is a fantastic feeling.  

To be able to feel....anything.....is fantastic.

Stay strong and post often, we are in this together!

Avatar universal
by AnnieNYC, Jan 12, 2010
Hi everyone,

I first registered on this site in 2008. I relapsed. A lot. Struggled and finally got clean a little over a year ago. Thank God! I've abused a lot of opiates, but tramadol was the last one, for a period of several years. It was the hardest detox I ever did, and I'm still in the process of getting my life back together. It's so great to be here again and read all your wonderful posts! I am very happy to be part of this community!

Patrick, for what it's worth, I think that using vicodin to get off trams is not such a crazy idea, provided that you take the next step and get off the vics in a timely fashion. Tramadol is a more complex drug than vicodin because of its SSRI properties, though not as strong a pain reliever, and it makes sense to me to take it step by step. Get rid of the trams and then taper off the vics. Just my personal experience.

Have a great night, everyone!

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by Jethro63, Jan 12, 2010
Gonna do a mile on the treadmill.  The hot soak was nice today but my ribs are gonna squeeze.  

Maybe I will get some sleep tonight

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 12, 2010
Hi Everyone-

day 15 done for me. Today was rough going with the ANXIETY! It seems like I feel so fragile. Still losing weight, too. I think I am burning the calories with the anxiety running (today) all day long. It has been coming in waves on previous days but today feels pretty constant. SCARY. I am still using 1 clonidine a day. I believe it helps a bit.
Hang in there everyone....I have been having some good days..but today...not so good
into the hot bath and hopefully to sleep....get to go to work tomorrow..I seem to do better with a more structured day.  I am getting VERY little done around the house..I am trying to just let go and focus on getting this trash out of my system.
Thanks for the Posts Everyone......I am glad we are in this together!!!!

Avatar universal
by howcouldiknow88, Jan 12, 2010
Threw the pills out! Felt very empowering. Still clean! Last dose was December 26th. Still a little tough.

Avatar universal
by Ins0mniac, Jan 13, 2010
I am so grateful for the people commenting on this wonderful thread. I wouldn't wish this suffefring on anyone but it does help to know there are others like me out there.

I'm on day 3 cold (after cutting down to 100mg a day) and there's no point going into detail about how drained, anxious, depressed, sore and unmotivated I am. I live alone and my house is a disgrace. I have just enough energy to change DVDs or TV channels, get a drink or crawl to bed. I want the agony to end so badly.

I still have so many tramadol pills sitting there too. I can't bring myself to through them out. It's such a tortorous pointless horrible drug. I used to be an oxy addict and thought coming off those was death, but Tramadol really is the worst drug of them all. I wish I'd never had one.

Good luck to fellow battlers.



Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 13, 2010
How- Nice Work...yes, I know it is still tough.....having any bright spots? I'd love to hear about them.We are in this together... the freedom IS HERE and the peace will come.....

Insomniac- congrat on day 3 down....2 to go until the continual rage ebbs.....one DVD, one powerade at a time, my friend

STAY STRONG .....the sham of tram is over for us.....................

off to work.....scared the anxiety will 'hit' again today.....going to push through...said my prayers and off I go

Avatar universal
by sadsi, Jan 13, 2010
Hi Guys,

even though i'm only stepping down slowly and not exactly clean (down to 150mg per day) will be 100mg on Sunday coming - I'm still feeling some of the WD effects. I used to have a reasonable about of energy however, now i've started stepping down - i feel like a sloth. Can't get out of bed - but I can't sleep anyways - it's just my energy is gone. Well, i'm not sure it's the energy or simply the motivation to do anything. The kids come in and jump up and down and i can barely get up to interact...

I'm taking a multi Vit + Fish oil - and apart fom the occasion paracetamol - that's the only tabs i want to be swallowing come a months time...

What does everyone do for motivation or energy ? The worse thing is, I know just one extra tab of tramal and id be hopin around like a 21 year old....and it's frustrating knowing this.

Si.

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 13, 2010
Annie- That’s great that you’re back and clean!  I hit day 70 today.  Whether to use vicodin or things like klonopin in withdrawal is a tough call.  I was lucky to already be on klonopin and that helped my sleep.  I’m glad I didn’t have the pain return too much, so I didn’t have to worry about vicodin or other prescription meds.  For short-term use, I would say pain relievers like vicodin are more effective than trams anyway, but the addictive potential is definitely strong.

For those of you that have been watching my AD taper, I’m now at 75mg of Effexor and tomorrow will go to 50mg.  The last drop wasn’t so bad, although I’m tired of feeling draggy.  I gather that the tapers after 75mg are the worst, but we’ll see.  It’s so hard to know if my dragginess is related to my thyroid, the effexor or the tramadol.  Right now, I’m pretty sure it’s the Effexor.

4leef- Are you on the lowest dose of Clonidine?  I wonder if you could take more with doctor’s consent? Or maybe you need Ativan or klonopin.  You could take the lowest dose and only in the most severe cases.  Or just accept that it will pass.  I wish I could lose weight!

WTG Howcouldiknow!

Insomniac- You have to get rid of those pills if you want to stay clean.  I learned that when I quit smoking.  Why would a non-smoker have cigarettes laying around the house?  They wouldn’t.  Likewise with the trams.  It’s not worth it.  Don’t worry about your house…that can wait :).

Si- I felt that way during my taper and that’s why I stopped altogether at 150mg.  It wasn’t worth it.  I pushed through in a few days.  A long taper drags out that feeling.  I’m not a doctor, so not advocating anything, but for me, that low dose only made it worse.

Jenny


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by Lillyval, Jan 13, 2010
For those who have asked, I am posting an exerpt from a message I sent Bode regarding my experience with Suboxone:

I found my doctor by going on the Suboxone website, Suboxone.com.  They have a link to find a doctor in your area on the right hand side of the page.  For me the withdrawal from tramadol was at least 90% less severe than when I did it on my own.  Essentially, it was painless.  I really only experienced tiredness and occaisonally groggyness at the beginning.  I have been completely off of tram now for 3 months (yay!).  I am still on a low dose of sub.  My doctor doesn't want me to go off yet because I have a very long history of substance abuse.  I am able to get clean but then I start to crave opiates and I relapse.  However, i did go 3 days with no sub last month, as I was considering going off it, and I had zero withdrawals.  I also had a friend who went off of it and told me the same thing.  I don't mean to try to sell you on it, but if there is a downside I have yet to experience it.

I think for people unlike me who do not have a long history of substance abuse, the Suboxone is only used to get through the withdrawal period, then there is a very short "maintenence" period of a few weeks, followed by a taper.  This method is used to prevent dependency on Suboxone.  Also, Suboxone providers are supposed to guide the patient into therapy, support groups and any other treatment the patient needs to deal with the addiction.  Sub isn't meant to be a "magic pill".  It's supposed to be one part of a complete treatment program.  (Although I'm finding that some doctors (like our tram doctors) are just prescription writers).

I wish you all the best in whatever way you choose to conquer this evil pill!
Lilly

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by Lillyval, Jan 13, 2010
Also, Fred, I correspond with several people off of the board, and it has been said that people don't feel welcome here after they've admitted that they have gone on Suboxone.  You probably remember a lady who was here a few months ago who posted that she was officially quitting this forum because she felt so judged.  So I guess it's not fair to say that only 2-3 people ever came back to say they have had success with sub.
I, for one, will keep coming back - both to share my experience, strengh and hope and to listen to everyone else.  Fred, your insights on addiction continue to be extremely helpful :)
Thanks,
Lilly

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 13, 2010
Hi Everyone.
Well, 10 days completely off Tramadol and I just caved to taking 1/2 a pill! That may not be much, but the fact that I have taken it at all is killing me. I hate this pill and want nothing more to do with it. The depression this day has been the worst that I have ever experienced in my entire life! And I have been really depressed in my lifetime. But this I can't take. Feeling I am going completely out of my mind and I can't sleep more than maybe 2 hours a night and my mind is going crazy. This is soooo very wrong on so many levels, as they say. I just can't make sense of anything and just feel I will die if this doesn't pass. That horrible nagging pain you feel throughout your stomach area when something horrible has happened. Like someone died or you lost a loved one or you have been deeply deeply hurt. This is so uncool. And now I've upset my son because I didn't think I could make it to his 30th birthday bash. He doesn't know what I'm going through and he probably wouldn't understand. All he knows or thinks is that mom doesn't care enough to go to his party and that is sooo completely far from the truth. I want to be there so bad and should be. But I'm a basket case. I just keep thinking about all the abuse I went through as a child and all the pain I went through with my son's father, and on and on. And I thought I had finally gotten past all of this stuff. I found myself crying out to God telling Him I hated my mother over and over again for everything she had done to me. Everything is coming up and out and I don't want to remember any of this anymore! It's not good, it's not helpful, and it's destroying me and I hope it doesn't destroy my relationship with my son and the rest of the family. Boy I'm rambling. I just hope the 1/2 pill helps soon and I can talk to my son and get this all worked out. And maybe, just maybe, by the grace of God I can go to his party.

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 13, 2010
my partners sister suggested suboxone and I did ask about it when I went to the ER with my stomach problems probably around day 5. I don't think the ER Doc was comfortable working with it. Looking back, I think Lilly's suggestion of finding a Doc in your area who is comfortable working with suboxone might be the best bet for getting it, although I think it is more commonly used these days. In my work I have cared for heroin addicts in w/d and have administered suboxone in a fairly rapid taper with good results...this was in addition to a program of therapeutic value to assist with the other areas of life affected by an addiction. In general they did well.

SI- I went cold turkey after getting down to 100mg daily because I was fairly miserable as I was weaning the Tram and didn't want to string things out interminably.

About the energy? From what I've read here, and am experiencing personally I'd say go easy on yourself. I wasn't able to do much the first 5 days in full w/d. After that it has been variable. Yesterday was very tough. Today was great. My partner encourages me to take it easy on the chores and myself. I have to set priorities and keep them flexible--in case I am having a hard day. Just try to avoid having a hard day and taking that idea out into the future and scaring yourself into thinking "it will be like this for a long time" cause that is not true. There are bright spots and very satisfying moments in these early weeks. Sometimes I read my posts, it is a journal of accomplishment toward a life free of Tram.

I did a yoga class tonight after work. It was masterful and amazing. HARD WORK. very satisfying. I would have to say my thinking today is very good. yeah, I had anxiety (still!!!) and used 2 clonidine today for it. work went well.I made an appointment with my Doc on tues to discuss this anxiety and continued use of the clonidine.....I hope the anxiety eventually goes..just fades away

today, at work as I felt the anxiety rise I logged on to this site and read the latest few posts....it helped me TREMENDOUSLY....I knew I was not alone and felt supported, accepted, encouraged and loved
thanks All for being here....you saved me today from a 'swan dive' into the fear.......................


Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 14, 2010
sierra- do you take an antidepressant? or a mood stabilizer? any meds at all? Did you make it to the party? Would you be willing to get some help for your depression? Don't beat yourself up for the 1/2....you are in emotional crisis. The backlash of w/d from opiate and antidepressant action of Tram biochemically is brutal and will hit everyone a little differently depending on their individual biochemistry. Sounds like you need more support!

Day 17-  very poor nights sleep. probably 4 hours total. oh well....maybe tonight will be better. Off to work...will see what (if any) anxiety awaits, today.........

Insom- I HAD to get rid of the TRAMS......at 430am I don't know if I have the resolve. Commit to NO TRAM..I ran into trouble a few times during w/d and ended up in urgent care and also the emergency room...if I had tram around I probably would have caved...having none and being in deep sh*t forced me to get some help with my out of control symptoms and remain off the garbage  

Avatar universal
by coldnhot45, Jan 14, 2010
I did not realize that there were people who struggled with an addiction to this drug.  I have taken it for years as needed and started 2 months ago taking 2 three times a day. I have taken this and other stronger pain meds for a long time off and on and I have only taken them as I have needed them for severe pain.
I have in fact flushed many pills that were a stronger pain killer than Trammadol because I would get my prescription filled and go so long not taking them that the prescription would expire.
It is not true that prescription pain meds should only be use for post surgery or cancer. High does of Ibuprofen can be effective in some cases but I am not able to take it due to the risk I have for ulcers and other stomach problems. I also do not understand the withdrawals talked about so much here.
There are a lot of chronic illnesses that have varying degrees of pain a long with them.  The pain can sometimes be excruciating, much like post-operative pain.  I know this from my own experience with pain.
I have a neurological disease, a chronic disease, and have a lot of chronic pain as a result of it.  When the pain would come and go for periods of time, I would take either this or another pain medication that is stronger  for a period of time and when my pain would subside I would quite taking it and I never suffered any withdrawals.  It has only been since my pain has become more constant that I have begun taking it regularly 3 times per day. But I have never wanted or needed to take more than prescribed.  Even when I was taking something much stronger taking it more than prescribed  or for any other reason was never an issue for me.  
I have never understand the "high" sometimes people get from prescription pain medications I know that a lot of people do.
Everyone has their problems and things that they struggle with. Addiction is not one of mine. That doesn't mean that I think I am better than someone who does struggle with addiction, I would imagine that's a very hard thing to overcome and I admire anyone who has overcome it or is trying hard to.

There has been research done on the underlying reasons why some people are more prone to struggle with addictions than others and some suggests the possibility that it may be due in part  to a certain part of the brain functioning different. I don't know the details but heard about it on the news, I believe.

It appears from these posts that those of you who feel this drug is so terrible have other addiction problems as well.  

I would just like to say this is not a terrible drug itself. Like a lot of other things, it can be misused, but the misuse of it typically has underlying causes.

Addiction, like any problem, cannot be fully conquered until someone addresses what the root of the problem is.

I hope that I have not offended anyone here by what I have said and I wish all of you success in dealing with what you need to.



Avatar universal
by sadsi, Jan 14, 2010
Hi Coldhoy - I cannot speak for everyone here but it sounds like(tell me if i am readin this wrong) your opportunities to substitute some pain killers for others may of assisted in you staving off dependancy and tolerance.

I get chronic knee pain as a result of an accident and 9 surgical procedures. When i started tramal - I was exactly the same as you. Never needed to take more than prescribed - for a period of about 3-4 months. It was a great drug for me - little side effects, allowed me to live a little more normal.

However, as the months went by - the Tramal didn't continue to negate the pain as it once did. So I thought one more pill on top of the usual and all will be well again... and so it was. And then another month went past and hey - my flippin knee seems to be hurting a lot lately...maybe an extra tablet would fix it...and so it did....and so on...

Don't underestimate the tolerance to tramal that will build up in everyone who regulary takes it. The drug loses it's effectiveness quite quickly once you start exceeding even the smaller amounts at regular intervals and that seems to be the key to a lot of people's dependance. It's not so much as abusing the drug or looking for that "high" - it's just people trying to control their pain and also being misinformed on the drugs...darker qualities.

I for one have never had issues with dependance on anything - i even quit tobacco cold turkey without issue. Tramal on the other hand...this stuff is geart going in - hell coming off...out....

This site is but one. If you search Tramal addicition or similar, you'll find millions of ppl all over the world experiencing similar issues. Makes me wonder what sought of kickbacks some of the GP's were / are getting from prescribing this stuff over more...well conventional, understood drugs.

I am currently stepping down from rather large doses (not as large as some - but i can SOOOOO understand how they get up there) and each step down is difficult and the knee doesn't fair too well at all.

I'll ask you a question - Could you throw all your medications into the bin, and walk away from them for 6 months despite the pain you'd endure ? If you answered 'no' or even had to think about it then hey - you might be closer to addiction than you think.

Cheers and prayers to All.
Si

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 14, 2010
Sierra- I found day 7-10 pretty hard because that's when you start to feel the SNRI part of Tramadol leave you, which causes the depression.  Please don't treat this depression with tramadol.  You can get an actual SNRI or SSRI to treat the depression if you can't push through it.  If you've had depression prior to this, then you probably want to go on something.  Have you talked to a doctor or psychiatrist?  I talked to a couple and didn't find any to be judgemental.

Coldnhot- No one is saying that there is no place for tramadol use.  Vicodin is still used despite being addictive.  I usually took about the same dose you're taking.  The drug does cause dependency and will cause withdrawal when you stop.  You don't need to be addicted.  Also, eventually, it will be ineffective at the same dose.  The difference between Tramadol and Vicodin is that tramadol has SNRI like properties.  That's like Effexor.  These anti-depressants can be very hard to withdraw from.  So, just be careful and aware.  Not everyone gets addicted to everything.

Jenny

Avatar universal
by grandmagirl, Jan 14, 2010
Lets all take a little time today and pray for the people in Haiti. What a awful time they are having.

Peaceful wishes from California

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 14, 2010
Jenny- how is the effexor bump down going for you?

day 18 did not need to take a clonidine today (so far)---- encouraging. I can tell by others' posts that those 'hard days' can hit anytime during the first month...so I am encouraged but trying to be realistic, too



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by Jethro63, Jan 14, 2010
JG525   --im comin up on day 6/7.  The muscle aches and twitches not as bad I expected uptill now but it is mixing with frustration and some depression.The T-Lysene and B-12 is helping with energy and 5htp and melatonin for rest.  Im trying to stay on top of the pain/cramps with skelaxin and 2 or 3 atavan a day.(4 or maybe 5 today---Its kickin my *** today.  Iv had a few actual lucid moments of thought today.

I wanted to be able to return to work tomorow but dont know if I can hang or not.



Avatar universal
by AnnieNYC, Jan 14, 2010
Hi howcouldiknow,

My last dose of trams was December 26, 2008, so we have the same anniversary! And you can get here too. You're doing great. Hang in there. :-)

Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 15, 2010
Lillyval-I have to thank you again for your guidance on Suboxone.  I had my last dose of trams on 1/12 and started suboxone on 1/13 under the guidance of a doctor.  I feel a bit groggy and nauseus at times but other than that, I am doing great.  Virtually no W/D.  I am functioning!!  For me, this is the way to go.

The plan is to do a short maitenance on the suboxone and then taper off.  

All my best to everyone. I'll keep you posted.

Bode



Avatar universal
by Lizzie777, Jan 15, 2010
Hello :O)
I hope everyone is doing really well :O) I read Emily's thread a few years ago and while I didn't doubt her sincerity it still didn't quite sink in with me. But the way she wrote did so thank you so much to Emily and all the kind folk who've carried this on and taken their time to support others as it eventually got me to here :O) I've been on Tramadol for 10 years and a starting dose of 400mg and am currently down to 200mg and will drop to 150mg in a week.

I wondered if anyone else who has done the reduction could help please? :O)

To try to be really quick I was prescribed these with diazepam, voltarol, paracetamol for a herniated disc for which I was eventually hospitalised for as it knocked my bladder out and judging by GP's face I had a funny response in my legs. Had right game as got stuck in an S shape and it took me ages to be able to walk straight - offered an op but refused as only 26. Thankfully sciatica and severe pain got better but I was left with funny legs and feet or so I thought!!! GP sent me to pain specialist who prescribed Amytriptyline who also referred me to a Neurologist who suggested Pregablin or Gabapentin having looked at me and said you're obviously coping! I agree in that as soon as I could I went back to work and I love my job (you can tell I've also read about  'the heart sink patients' as doctors call people whose pain doesn't immediately go and whom they suggest hate work, life etc. I suspect like everyone on here I don't :O) and have also very sadly seen two very close friends fight cancer so I am careful not to moan as I know the same Neurologist could have seen very ill children and adults and plus I hate to cry in public but it was keeping me awake to the point where I felt pretty miserable and  it was affecting my work so I would have rather liked at least a nerve conduction study or something??? actually rather than the Gabapentin to be fair.

Anyway I stayed on a stable dose of Tramadol for a long time but was still getting crawling, vibrating, aching, almost sunburnt feeling legs at night which woke me up. My partner at this time was sadly diagnosed with a chronic illness and needed me to be on top form. So this coupled with Emily, all the great folk on here and listening to one of the best neuroscientists in the world say that unexplainable patient symptoms don't normally mean the patient is mad I decided I just had to either be better or get someone to sort out what was going on. Just before Christmas I started to get a shake in my hands and I draw stuff for a living so this was last straw for me. I thought of Emily and decided I just had to know if its the drugs or not. So! I've ditched the Gabapentin cold turkey in case its that. I have been off that for one month now. I'm down to 1/2 an Amytriptyline and am supplementing with paracetamol for any pain. About 10 days ago my legs went and I thought hurray! but about 4 days ago they came back good and proper and I had about 4 hours sleep and am now having to think quite hard to type due to my hands.

What is bothering me is this? This goes away with temperature drops and markedly gets much worse the hotter it gets - if this was being caused in my head which I have wondered too - how does it wake me as I'm unconscious? and why is it worse with heat? and if its Tramadol why isn't it constant? or is everyone else finding their symptoms come and go? or having trouble with shaking? You can see it so its not in my imagination but again I don't know how to be sure its not mentally created as I will admit that my partner being sick does upset me so I could be stressed but am doing my best to be positive and have a very good life so wouldn't think I should be so freaked that I'm shaking? I've done postgrad study, moved etc and other supposedly stressful things without any trouble? :O) I'm also waiting to see a surgeon as I have something internally which needs fixing - she also pondered the pills (very worrying) but spinal compression of the type I had is also listed as a risk for this? so this is either another bad point for Tramadol or its one in the eye to the mental theory as there's no way I could have made that happen! so then again what about all other docs I've seen if these rotten pills or an under treating of something has meant I'll have to have surgery???

Anyway any help as to how to tease all this stuff apart would be so much appreciated :O) :O) I'm keeping going with the cutting down though as I feel sure it's the only way I can answer this for sure and it can only be good! Also I wondered does anyone know that if its all the Tramadol how soon the shakes and funny legs should take to clear once I'm down to 0mg please? :O)

Best wishes to everyone here :O) Wishing you good health and strength :O)

Avatar universal
by Jill896, Jan 15, 2010
I have ben prescribed Tramadol for nerve pain. What's wrong with it, other than it makes one constipated?!!  I hate it, but the pain I get it's  either that, or something equally bad?   I could  easily stop taking it as I hate it!  I only take 50mg as a last resort, and that's once a day.  Jill

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 15, 2010
glad you have a plan, Bode...as I posted earlier, I have seen weaning from heroin on suboxone and am thinking it would work well with the Tram.

hope howcouldI is doing well out there..........also wantmylife and JG

I was able to make it to work the last 2 days without any clonidine for the anxiety. today is day 19 (i think) OFF THE TRAM depression is much better. my moods are stabilizing and I am beginning to get more energy. sleep is still not great. I go to al anon tomorrow. I have been going for 10 years. it has been so helpful to me. both of my parents were alcoholics (and both of them had one parent who was alcoholic.....and I am sure generations before that....it goes on and on......) anyway...besides being an addict myself, I am also whatdayacallit co dependent?? yeah something like that.....it has been and continues to be very healing for me

I'd like to thank ya'll for your time and energy spent on this site. It helped me and continues to be a bright spot in this journey out of physical and psychological dependence on tramagarbage

off to yoga!
be well, stay strong.....this can be done!!!


  

Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 15, 2010
Coldnhot-
Tramadol is not a bad medication for some people, and the same goes for any opiate.  Medicine can help.  However, for most of us, Tramadol has been terrible.  Many were not aware of all of it's properties and effects it could have on our bodies and brains.  Not just the addictive quality,(and the pain that it actually caused!)  but the terrible time we all have had getting off of it.  

If you stopped taking your regular 300mg/day, you would be in agony within 24 hours...addict or not.  It's awful and that's why we have all come to this place.  To be a support system for eachother.  It's not a place where we are judging how or why someone is addicted to this drug(or any other) or how they choose to come off of it.  We are all here to share and to listen and to ultimately help eachother though our battles.  

Sierra-  
I feel for you.  The depression..it's so so hard.  I have been in that same place.  If I could hug you, I would.  Day 10, I remember being one of the toughest days.  The only thing I can say is taking that 1/2 pill may help slightly for an hour or so, but then what?  If you can hang on for another few days, you will start to notice things getting better.  You will feel less depressed and have more happy moments.  Those moments turn into days....

Lizzie-
The withdrawal from trams is crazy and sometimes there is no rhyme or reason to it.  I did not have shaking but did have everything else.  RLS, sweats, cold and hot at the same time, achey, insomnia, stomache pain, depression...the whole thing.  It fades as your body rids itself of the trams, but is not linear.  Time. Thats the only thing that helps.

As for me, I have chosen to take suboxone to ease my pain of withdrawal so that I can continue working and being a good mom.  My reasons for choosing this route off trams is so that I could avoid some of the physical agony of withdrawal while continuing with my responsibilties of life.  Being that I've experienced w/d from trams before, I knew what to expect and knew I would not be able to function without some help.  I will have to taper off of suboxone in a few weeks and that may or may not be difficult. I am willing to take my chances because I will be under doctor supervision.  That is something I was not under while taking the trams so I feel much better about the process.  

Suboxone helps with the physical w/d of opiates, but tramadol is an unusual opiate because it's synthetic and it has a hidden anti-depressant in it.  So, I will have those demons to battle without any help from sub.  So far, I am doing well. On January 13th, I flushed every single pill I could scrounge up in my house.  I flushed them and oddly enough a few came back up...(taunting me?) Creepy pills!!  Go away! They are gone. No more.

Most importantly, I want to ask how the tram warriors are doing that have been clean for periods of time.  What advice can you give on how you have stayed clean.  We all know the agony of withdrawal and PAWS, but long term...how have you stayed on track?  

Thanks for listening and for all the helpful insight-I am so grateful to you all.  Hang in and keep fighting everyone!

Warm wishes and thoughts

Bode





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by booba77, Jan 15, 2010
Hello.  I was on trams for about 2 years and was up to about 20 per day of the 50mg tablets.  My last tram was October 29, 2009.  I went cold turkey, and it was hell.  The brain zaps, restless legs, aches, pains, and lack of energy were horrible the first 2 weeks.  Now I still don't have all of my energy back, and the PAWS depression is still with me.  I can't really relapse, because I have no credit cards or $ to get trams ever if I wanted to......but I dont want to.  I will never go through that again.  I am still struggling with the person I am tram free.  I am trying to move on with my life and get used to trying to be happy with myself and my life.  I really miss the antidepressant in the trams, i think the lack of it has really put me into a depression.  I think people coming off of lesser doses have had a much easier time.......I hope so anyway.  

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 15, 2010
Thanks, Bode,

Yeah, I did take the 1/2 pill and have been taking just the 1/2 pill/day for the last 3 days. Within an hour of taking that first one I literally felt my chest unraveling and the tension rollllllliing away. My!!! It was like every kink in my body was unravelling. I was still a little depressed, but that intolerable intensity was gone and I haven't felt it since. actually the depression and anxiety has gotten a little better each day. and today I feel pretty peaceful and like no one could rock my boat even if they tried. been able to sleep great the last couple of nights. what a relief. I'm glad just 1/2 a pill is helping. I was taking 6-8 pills a day for a couple of months and when I widdled down to just 1-2 a day I was horribly ill. so having this much of an affect on just 1/2 is wonderful to me. i know others have been taking massive amounts for a long time, so maybe it affects me differently being I wasn't on it as long. but i sure felt sicker than I ever had in my life going off of them, and for so long. it seemed like 6 weeks of being horribly sick--and i saw 2 docs and almost a third trying to figure out what was wrong with me. I had been on lortab elixir for two months after jaw surgery years ago and never had any withdrawal problems with it. I craved it of course, when i ran out and wanted to lie to the doc that i was still in pain just to get more--lol--but didn't. shoot!!! and this time around they were worried about me being on vicodin for more than two weeks! said it was too habit forming so they put me on tramadol. (although the vicodin really didn't help the pain in my neck all that much, the Tramadol did) My husband had some left over oxycodone from surgery he had 6 months back and i tried a couple of them when I was out of the tramadol and waiting for it to get filled, but they didn't help as much as tramadol. plus I noticed i was terribly cranky when they wore off. no thanks!

My son and I were able to work things out and talk through some stuff once I got a good nights sleep and was more mentally stable--lol. I'm sure getting all of that settled is helping me too. Praise God! Anyways, his party is tomorrow and then we have a family thing on Tuesday with him. If I'm still doing ok on the 1/2 pill/day at that point, I will go down to 1/4. gotta be able to wean off these easily at that point, hopefully. I don't want to go through all the sweats, chills and nausea again, but that depression is unbelievable. And, no, I don't really have an understanding family because they haven't been there. but my husband is trying. He brought me flowers home the other day and is giving me lots of hugs.

Thanks again,
Sierra

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 15, 2010
Hi booba,

wow! the end of October and still depressed. that doesn't comfort me much. i've had a lot of bouts with horrible depression in my life. attempted suicide twice--God always keeps me from getting away with it. i guess He's not done with me yet. : )  but the entensity of this depression is way too weird. that gnawing feeling like you're not only dying, but someone already died or you were deeply hurt or worrying about hearing some awful outcome of someone who's gone missing. i'm sure you know what i mean. i was on antidepressants for 14 years and finally got off a year ago. never want to go back. and now this. if i'd only known, i would have said, can we try something else? or just endured the horrible pain i was going through with my neck. i have a bone spur pressing on a nerve and the pain was intolerable. now that the swelling has gone down from the whiplash injury, i really don't feel anything but a light pinching sensation.

Anyways, I will be praying for you that the depression lifts soon. going back to being on just half a pill a day has helped me a lot. so i know i've got to be recovering from the withdrawals. 1/4 pill next week and hopefully i can quit after that.

Have you tried sublingual B12 and other natural stuff to help. i think the b12 helps. at least it helped me to get off of Celexa. but the only brand that helped was TriVita. and i hate that i have to order it online as it's not in the store and it's so expensive. i think the reason it helps more than the others is that it dissolves very slowly under my tongue. takes about an hour. so i think it gets into my blood stream better than the others or store bought brands, which dissolve in secs to mins.

Take care,
Sierra

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 16, 2010
Sierra- it is amazing to me that 1/2 Tram could be helping you so much. What that tells me is how very powerful Tram is. I am glad you worked things out with your son. I know how important that is. AND how much anxiety it can cause when there is conflict in the family. Let us know how the weaning goes........and I hope you enjoy the party!

Booba- long term PAWS is my fear! I am sorry to hear you are still struggling with the depression. Are you sleeping?
Exercising? I hope your depression lifts soon!!!! Do you struggle with anxiety as well?
I am REALLY struggling with anxiety
......I have been up all night and am on  day 19-20 off Tram...  I don't know what to do but realize that some of my concerns in my personal life are a factor....I am seeing that TRAM allowed me to zone-out from some parts of my life that are disturbing to me now that the Tram is gone.....guess it is time to address them if I want to stay clean............
that is my revelation after this all nighter..........  

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by Lillyval, Jan 16, 2010
Sierra -
I think when you go off the 1/2 pill per day it will be much easier than when you stopped the 6-8 pills per day.  Just don't wait too long because soon 1/2 pill won't be enough then you'll be up to 1 and you know how that goes.  

I had a conversation several months ago with someone else on this board who was on Celexa and tramadol at the same time, like I was.  Both of us quit Celexa before quitting tram and wished we had done it the other way around.  That way the Celexa would still have been in our system to help alleviate the severe depression that comes from withdrawal.  

You described your depression as:  " that gnawing feeling like you're not only dying, but someone already died or you were deeply hurt or worrying about hearing some awful outcome of someone who's gone missing."  That sounds like pretty serious depression (I've been there).  I can understand you not wanting to go back on anti-depressants, but please seek medical help if you need it.  Severe depression, as you know, is very dangerous.  We want you safe and well.
Keep us posted,
Lilly

Avatar universal
by chrissie145, Jan 16, 2010
Just a piece of information in the hope that it might help some of you  ( Sierra in particular). In the UK you can get 25mg soluble tramadol tablets.( I'm not sure if they do them in USA.)  This means that if you want to go down to a quarter of a normal tablet (12.5 mg) it is easily done with a pill cutter. Alternatively you can dissolve the tablet in a set amount of liquid - and then with a syringe draw off a ml every few days. This will make the cutting down very slow and hopefully more gentle.

This is what I was advised to do - but by then I had got so sick of it all that I went C/T. I have been clean for 6 months now and am so glad I did it. Unfortunately I had a diazepam habit to deal with and although clean for 5 months - I am still suffering. Its all a bit of a muddle as I have chronic fatigue syndrome (M.E.) too - so not sure what is causing what.

If you cant get 25mg or soluble tablets where you are - maybe the internet will help?!

Keep going all of you. Freedom from tramadol is wonderful. I feel lousy and very weak - BUT - I am not drugged up or living for the next fix. I am trying to get help for the M.E. and then it will all be behind me. Like most of you here - I was given this evil drug for pain by my doctor. When I freaked on trying to stop them I was put back on them and diazepam was added. I am very very angry!!!!!

Another thing that is helping me is a relaxation CD. These have NEVER worked for me in the past. But from the internet I bought one by Glenn Harrold - a hypnostist. (www.hypnosisaudio.com). I even fall asleep whilst listening at times. I hope this info is useful to some of you.

Best wishes
Chrissie

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 16, 2010
4leef, yeah, I remember when I took my first tramadol. it stayed with me for two days! No pain, felt good. and the bottle said 1-4 a day as needed. so i figure after quiting the 1 pill a day and being off tram for 10 days my tolerance had really lowered. that half pill has really had an effect. today after 25 hours since the last one, i had a horrible headache, felt run down and like i just don't want to be bothered by anyone. took the 1/2 about 20 mins ago already starting to feel better. this stupid pill. but at this point i'm grateful. if i can just get through the birthday stuff and be a happy person, i can ease into the withdrawals next week.

Lilly, i know what you mean. I remember when the 1 pill didn't affect me as much anymore and i had to increase the dosage. pretty soon i built a tolerance to the 4 pills a day and gradualy took twice the recommended dose the prescrip said to to relieve the pain. (i had checked online on how much you could safely take a day and i read that was 400mg, so I figured i was safe, but did worry if i was going to have to take more than this if the pain got worse. my liver tends to flare up with certain meds and i didn't want to go there.) i know now that's why i got so sick when i quit the 6-8 pills a day and went down to 1. so now that i'm on the 1/2, i'll try going down to 1/4 mid next week.

Chrissie, thanks for the info. i don't know if i want to deal with making it a liquid, though. : ) i have the 50mg tabs and the last couple that i cut with the pill cutter, cut just fine. i'll see how it goes with cutting 1/4s next week. might be a little interesting trying to get them lined up just right. i just don't want to ask the doc for any more pills as i don't want anymore of them in my house. each time i take one i feel like i'm caving to the devil. thanks again for the info, if it gets tough cutting them, i may just try your idea.

Sierra

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by Gerty411, Jan 16, 2010
Hey Y'all,

I've been off t since 11/9 and have been very depressed for about 2-3 weeks.  I feel like I'm covered by a big black piece of glass and nothing gets in or out.  I saw my psychologist yesterday and told her this.  I don't think she understands about t even though I told her about it.  I'm going to talk with my pcp Monday and see if he will write me a scrip.  It's so hard because I am a MD and I really don't want people to know that I have any problems.  It is such a double edged sword.

The one thing that helps is this site and workng out.  I'm also very much into bellydance and look forward to this season with the troupe and not being zonked on drugs.

Thanks all for the guidance and support.

Gerty

Avatar universal
by howcouldiknow88, Jan 17, 2010
4leef, there have been some bright spots. It's been 21 days and the physical aspect seems to be over. Sometimes I still feel a shudder, but it passes quickly. My mood isn't the best, but I'm getting up everyday and doing my thing!

As far as sierra...don't be too shocked. The first I took tramadol EVER, I took 25mg. Wasn't expecting much, but I felt great. And of course years later that climbed to 4 of em. Excuse me while I push the thought out of my head. Thinking about tramadol and the "good" it did me makes me weak. I don't advise it.

Avatar universal
by howcouldiknow88, Jan 17, 2010
Here's something good about being 21 days off tram...

I feel my memory is better.
I have always been able to remember things from waaaay back, things from my toddler years even. But since I started the tram years ago, I notice I can't remember the most obvious stuff anymore. Seriously, the last 6 Christmas'...I don't remember. Just bits and pieces. And I don't remember where I was on new years all those times, either. Well, likely at home "feeling good". But it's just weird how I don't remember a lot. Memories I won't get back. I never knew tramadol did this to me until recently when I actually remembered a conversation a few days after.

Anyone else get memory loss with tram?

Avatar universal
by sadsi, Jan 17, 2010
I feel so ashamed. I also fell into a severe depression the other day. When i woke up, i had a deep feeling of doom or dread, it was a feeling that was really very scary. I couldn't shake it for the morning and I relented and took double the dose i had steeped down too. Within an hour - the feeling was gone - it's pathetic but that dark feeling actually had me thinking about razors, CO'2, Gas, Gun etc  -  so although I know i've taken a step backwards, i may of well also prevented myself from doing something very irrational...
Am now lying here, all "trammed" in a almost vegetable state....bloody hell this is hard.
Si

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 17, 2010
Si- are you on an antidepressant? If not I hope you consider adding one before you withdraw from the tramadol any further. Lexapro, cymbalta or very low dose effexor would probably be best. What you are experiencing, I believe is the drop in the AD component of the tram....you can wean from the AD some weeks after the tram is out of your system. You did a good job. Suicidal thinking is common in w/d from tram. NOTHING TO FOOL AROUND WITH...very serious and your response was both prudent and understandable. Go easy, be gentle with yourself....you just need more support in your chemistry getting off this nasty and dangerous drug...we are here for you!!!

howcould- GREAT to hear from you!!! I can say that this w/d has been quite 'memorable' and staying clean will probably enhance overall memorable experience as well.....so you say   and I agree Congrats on 21!!

Gerty- I am seeing my pcp on tues. I cannot take AD meds cause I have a distant history of lithium use. So clonodine is my mainstay for the anxiety that 'kicks in' but I also struggle with depression in the PAWS. Exercise does help. So does sleep. So does support and lovingkindness. We are all in this together and even though your MDs might not understand...WE DO
I went to my al anon meeting yesterday. Many people there think highly of me and seek my counsel. Whew- I am thinking--if they only KNEW what a mess I've been....I am only telling very select people from my circle. none of my co workers. I have a license to protect and that is a serious piece in recovery from Tram dependence.......I hope you get some help at your appointment on Mon  let us know
STAY STRONG BRAVE WARRIORS!!!!!

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by Pinkmonki, Jan 17, 2010
Something to think about.......this drug was such a huge part of our lives, we planned events around it, our lives around it, etc.  Something that helped me is coming to terms with the grieving process.  I am having to do this anyway with the loss of my father, but using the information and applying it to the loss of this pill as well has been therapeutic.  Here is a website that I use and I hope it can help: http://www.recover-from-grief.com/stages-of-grief.html

~All the best~ ~Stay strong~

Avatar universal
by Jill896, Jan 17, 2010
I am very interested in reading all your posts and am correct that TRAM means Tramadol?  It isn't an anti-depressant (someone said somwhere here!)  is it?   No wonder I get depressed LOL!  Anti-depressants always make folk miserable. So, as my Tramadol are capsules (50mg) I can't cut them. I will ask my doc for tablets.  Thanks for all your information, Jill

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by fuzzypeach27, Jan 17, 2010
Ha folks

I love the name tramadol warriors.

I lost my memory through codeine.

KEEP FIGHTING !!!

I relate to every post.

x x x x x x x

334144 tn?1423248271
by booba77, Jan 17, 2010
I too suffer with the memory loss.  I feel horrible about all of the wonderful memories I have lost due to the trams.  I know that exercise probably would help with the PAWS, but I dont have much free time to exercise, and I know that is a lame excuse.  I have gained a lot of weight since being off trams, which hasnt done much for my self esteem.  I just want to feel normal again.  I want my house back in order, my life back in order.  I dont want to hear my four year old tell me that I'm mean because I lose my patience so quickly these days.  She deserves better.  I am glad to be free of the tram, but the long term PAWS is really affecting me.  Maybe it is because I came off of such a high dose.  We are all much better off of these horrible meds.  Keep fighting warriors.  We can win this battle.  Keep your chin up.  It has to get better......

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 17, 2010
Sadsi,

I know how you feel. I felt the same way this morning. Seems I'm starting to build tolerance again and I, in no way, want to go back up to a whole pill a day. I was feeling a little down at the party last night and tried so hard not to let it show. I went to the bathroom just to talk to God and try to get myself back in order. Looking into the mirror and seeing my eyes watering and red all I could say was you are not going to cry or be seen like this!!!

I was in a pool of sweat all last night while sleeping and woke up soooo depressed and feeling when is this ever going to end or end me? I needed to get up and go to church and thought, if I go I'll only feel worse just being around everyone while I am feeling this way. I just began to pray, Lord if you want me to go, please help me to get past this. My husband came in and was trying to get me up and I told him how I was feeling and that I didn't think I was going to be able to go to church and he left the room. I knew he was irritated with my depression and that only made it worse because I felt horrible that he was having to deal with depressed old me again. Within a few minutes I started to feel the depression lift and my husband came in. I asked him if he had prayed for me because the depression was gone. He said yes, he had, but mostly it was out of frustration and he apologized. I know he is frustrated with all of what I have been going through, but I told him to try to imagine how I feel putting him through it--it just makes it worse for me knowing that it is not just me that's trying to recover from this, but it affects my family too because I am not myself and they don't understand. I feel so guilty all of the time.

Anyways, I felt the depression lift, got out of bed and was grateful that God had answered my prayer, my husband's or both. I went to church and heard a sermon that totally hit on what I was feeling and going through. God wanted me there and He knew what I needed to hear and I praise Him for that. He is an AWESOME God!

Now I'm just praying that I will be able to cut down to 1/4 pill in a couple of days and not feel totally tempted to take a whole one or more on Tuesday night at the birthday dinner just so that I can be a smiling, cheerful, and pleasant mom to be around.

Sierra

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 17, 2010
Sierra..Have you been taking the vitamins esp b12 1000mcg under the tongue and b complex with zinc and all the others recommended.Have you had your thyroid checked?I see by your age you are at or near menopause age and perhaps some of your depression is hormone related.I know that withdrawing from tramadol can certainly cause severe depression,but maybe some other factors also come into play here.Do have everything checked and get the doctor to prescribe an antidepressant if needed.Lots of love and healing your way.

1106880 tn?1260898678
by wantmyselfback, Jan 17, 2010
Hey All!  Been a few days since I last posted, but wanted to throw out my two cents.

I'm about 40 days clean and free of the Tramadevil.  I think I'm finally getting over the Post Acute Withdrawal Symptoms, but can't be too sure, as I'm sure I'll still have some side effects of the six plus years of using Tramadol for quite some time.

I wanted to let everyone know that there is light at the end of the tunnel.  I've had some good days and bad days, but more good than bad lately.  I feel great, and am happy I'm living a life finally free of the tram-fog.

I applaud all of you making the jump off tramadol.  Trust me, you're doing the right thing and you'll be thanking yourself in no time.  My wife has seen a tremendous difference in my personality, and being honest with her about my whole experience (after living a six year lie) has done wonders for our marriage.

I seriously feel like a new man.  I've started attending AA meetings, and I think they've also done wonders for my self-esteem, confidence, and the ability to remain sober and free of any drug/drink.  It's also a great support group (much like this discussion board had done wonders for me).  I even found a tramadol the other day at work and had no problem flushing it right down the toilet.  Although I do have some instantaneous thoughts about taking one every now and then, I'm beginning to train my mind to block those nasty thoughts out, or at least put things into perspective if I do get a thought.

Keep on pushing warriors!  I never thought I would've been able to rid myself of the tramadevil... but with the help from this group, I was able to.  If I can do it, trust me, anyone can.  

God bless!

1106880 tn?1260898678
by wantmyselfback, Jan 17, 2010
One other thing worth noting:  I am on 10 MG (a small dose) of Lexapro (an anti-depressant).  I really think that getting on this (despite my reluctance after being addicted to a white pill for six plus years) has helped tremendously with the depression/anxiety I had while off of Tramadol.  If you have a doctor you can trust, you might want to consider something like Lexapro which helps with anxiety and depression.  I'm on a six month plan, so hopefully the P.A.W.S will completely subside and I'll be back to my good ol' self.  While I don't feel like I'm on an anti-depressant, I did notice that I when I forgot to take one I did feel down in the dumps, so I can atest that it probably is doing something good.

Just a thought to ponder.  I know depression is a MAJOR factor during w/d and the weeks/months after.  From what I said in the post above, I couldn't be happier, and I wish the same for all of you out there.

I'm so proud of you all! :)

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 17, 2010
Pharma,
Oh, yeah, taking lots of sub B12 (1000mcg twice a day, which includes b6, folate, and biotin), b complex and all the others. also on hormone replacement therapy because i'm premenapausal. I saw two docs when this all started happening. one of them was my gynocologist. he thought for sure i was in menapause because of the night sweats and chills and said it couldn't be the tram withdrawals. but my levels showed i was still premenapausal and on the right hormones. the depression, insomnia and anxiety didn't hit until about day 8 of withdrawal--day 10 was intolerable and i felt out of my mind. i thought i was free and clear of tram until then. i think not having enough family support is also a problem. i'm depressed, but not having that bad problem I was having when i finally caved to taking the 1/2 pill. i just have to hang on to the Lord and trust that I'm gonna make it through this and get off these things. or else I'm gonna have to go back on antidepressants. and i really don't want to do that again. i gained a lot of weight while on Celexa and no matter how I tried to lose it i couldn't while i was on it. when i got off of it a year ago, i lost 45 pounds within 4 months without trying. unless i can find a antidep that can help without causing sleep probs, anxiety or weight gain, i don't want to give in to them. Oh, yeah, my pcp checked my thyroid two weeks ago, along with my vit d levels, thought that was strange. everything was normal. i take 4000 iu vit d/day and 1200mg of calcium because of my age. i didn't find out til i got to the lab that he ordered that test. i could have told i was fine on that one. when i'm not, my nails are crumbling--they're strong and tough right now--lol

So, wantmyselfback,
does the Lexapro cause weight gain? and do you know if it's easy to get off of again? just wondering. I've never heard of it before.

Thanks,
Sierra

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 17, 2010
Sierra..The only antidepressant that does not cause weight gain or sexual problems is wellbutrin..It can cause seizures in seizure prone people and sometime affects sleep if taken late in the day.It is the same drug that is in Zyban,the quitting smoking drug and some former smokers still take 1 a day to keep the cravings away.I see from your vitamins that probably your depression is from tramadol withdrawal.There is another tranquilizer called buspar that takes about 3 to 4 weeks to kick in and also can act as a bit of an antidepressant.Weight gain is a real problem with most psychiatric drugs and can throw the patient into worse depression because of it.

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 17, 2010
Oh, my goodness! I read this site on lexapro: http://www.***********.org/lexapro_side_effects.htm.

Maybe I should just up my omega 3s like suggested. already doing 1200mg fish oil capsules. I've heard brain zaps mentioned here before and now on this other site. What are they? Trying to figure out if i have experienced them before or not.

Sierra

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 17, 2010
Sierra...You could go to a site that says.."withdrawal from effexor....or withdrawal from paxil....or lexapro...or luvox or even amyrtiptyline.....They all have to be discontinued slowly so the brain can produce its own neurotransmitters.They all can cause brain zaps when withdrawing.It takes a long time to withdraw from all antidepressants and should be done slowly .

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 17, 2010
pharma, yeah, i tried wellbutrin when i was trying to go off of celexa. couldn't sleep and quit taking it. i don't know if i can wait for the zyban. i think i'll continue with the taper and see how it goes. Thanks again for the tips. i appreciate you all. : )

hanging in there.
Sierra

Avatar universal
by sadsi, Jan 17, 2010
It really does sound like a mild AD might be the answers to my WD problems i'nm also having. I can deal with the shakes, tiredness, cold / hot, etc etc - but the depression is dangerous and very, very real.

Does anyone know what / how good the OTC Antidepressant is - St Johns Wart ? I seriously dont want to be reliant on seeing a DR, so if St John's wart was adequate to provide at least a small safety net - then i think it would be worth considering.
Anyone tried it for WD ?
Cheers.
Si.

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 17, 2010
Hi Si,
I just remembered that I do have some St. John's Wart around the house. Thanks for the idea, I'm going to try that as well.

You know I've heard it's not as strong as prescription stuff, and it can decrease the effectiveness of the birth control pill if you are on one. For me being on hormone treatment, I'm not sure what it would do.  But if you're on one and don't want to get pregnant, I probably wouldn't take St. Johns. I'd definitely ask the doc first.

Anyone else have any ideas?

Sierra

Avatar universal
by petunia3334, Jan 18, 2010
I'm forty something days clean. I have dealt with depression. What I have found that works for me is exercising.
Everyday that is hard I would go out for a brisk walk or some kind of exercise that pumps my heart and brain. The feeling is amazing after I'm done. I know it's going to be a struggle to get to the other side but the exercising makes it easier.

Good luck,

Petunia











g


Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 18, 2010
Si- It is difficult to know what to do for the AD withdrawal from Tram. The OTC remedies of 5-HTP, SAM-e, St Johns Wort may all provide some benefit. The low dose AD lexapro will probably help also. Very simply--- The serotonin and norepinephrine in the synapse (area between brain cells) get 'sucked up' into the cell as impulses 'fire' across it. Tram and other AD medications interrupt the Serotonin and norep from being drawn into the cell. As they stay 'out' we feel 'better. When the Tram is gone, these little guys are all 'flowing ' into the cells with no interruption and we are left 'starving' for them. It takes TIME for this process to balance back toward a more normal function (this is why weaning is recommended so this process is not slammed upon us but gradually approached). In the meantime ALL EFFORTS are helpful but the suicidal ideation must be addressed seriously. When you are in the black cloud of it---- judgement can easily and understandably become so distorted that suicide seems reasonable.  
Exercise, sleep, prayer and meditation, support and lovingkindness, good nutrition, laughter and joyful experience are all hugely beneficial in addition to any AD and/or supplement use. I'd like to see you consult a health care provider just to have another person in your support network. I understand it can be a problem if you run across someone who doesn't 'get it' --and you should leave that appointment and make another if you experience this--my hope for you is that you will find someone who wants to support you and is compassionate and kind.  They are 'out there' everywhere...but I also understand that we have all had our share of bad experiences with prescriber's......

I guess I am 21 days today. Slept better last 2 nights. Taking mega omega3 lately and still using clonidine 1 a day for anxiety. going to my MD tomorrow. glad of it. I want to review all of this with her....back to work this am. I'd also like to report that my partner and I are going in for our first counseling appointment on wed. this is good for me. I have some areas I need to address in this relationship so I can stay clean.....you know I don't want to 'zone out' to cope...and I am going to need some help talking through these issues with him....we have a lot of strength in our relationship ...I think I need support communicating with him, and probably some help, also...I am glad he is so willing to go and work on things together
that feels very loving to me......
Alright Everyone..I am so proud to be with you in this journey out of H*ll toward healing
FIGHT ON BRAVE WARRIORS


Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 18, 2010
4Leef- Sorry, I haven’t been on for awhile.  I’m at 50mg of Effexor now and doing fine.  About a week after taper, I seem to get some depression, but so far none of the worst withdrawals.

Jethro- I had some leg cramps return recently and have had to take some skelaxin too.  Not sure why they are happening anymore.  I don’t think it’s tramadol.

Lizzie- Have you been checked for Autoimmune diseases?  It sounds like you could have something thyroid or adrenal related, although I was a little unclear.  The leg stuff went away for me quickly.  Max of a week, although for some it lasts longer.  Don’t let doctors tell you that things are psychological or stress related if you really believe they aren’t.  I was told this for a long time and it turned out I had a thyroid autoimmune illness that was causing a lot.  Also, I can relate to the sciatica because my initial injury was to L4-L5 and I had sciatica as well.  I have three nerve shots in my spine and they helped more than anything.

Jill- At that dose, it’s probably fine.

Booba- Have you tried any of the natural anti-depressants?  I’m not too familiar as I use the “unnatural” ones.

Sieera- I stopped a little after Booba and I’m not depressed from the trams anymore.  Of course, I’m on Effexor and trying to stop.  I’ve been able to get down to 50mg of Effexor.  I can understand your hesitation with ADs, but you basically have to treat Tramadol as an AD too.  So, if you’ve experienced withdrawal from Anti-dep. Before, you’ll know the feelings.  It does pass.  That’s the rebound depression.  If we were self-medicating with trams, which many of us were, than there may be depression underneath that we have to deal with.

Lilly- I believe that the Effexor and my klonopin at night really helped with tramadol withdrawal.  Partly because I could sleep!  Now I have to kick those too.  Just to be clear for anyone who doesn’t know, I was already on all of these meds before.  I don’t recommend going on Effexor to help with tram withdrawal at all! Klonopin for a week or so could be a good thing though.

Chrissie- This stuff has all confused my thyroid disorder too (as with your CFS).  Once I’m clear of all the meds, I’ll be able to tell how much more thyroid med I need.

Gerty- Do you mean you are going on an AD? Not a script for tramadol right?

HowcouldIknow- I have found my memory deteriorating in recent years, but not sure which of my meds is causing it.  I’m only 30!

As to the AD discussion, Effexor is most like Tramadol, as it is an SNRI.  I think it’s a good anti-depressant, but I would personally not recommend it unless you were very depressed or unless other Anti-d. had not worked.  I did not gain weight on Effexor, but some do.  It is extremely hard to come off of though, similar to tram and therefore I wouldn’t recommend it to those here.

I have also been on Celexa, which is the old Lexapro and gained weight and felt very numb.  Everything is different for everyone though and I think I was on higher than 10mg.  I have heard that a combo of wellbutrin and Prozac can be very good.  The Prozac works more on the depression and the Wellbutrin cuts the weight and libido issue.

This is just what I’ve read or experienced.  I’m not a medical provider at all.  Please think twice before trying Effexor though.  Happy to talk to anyone about it in PM or here.

Long post!

Jenny

1106880 tn?1260898678
by wantmyselfback, Jan 18, 2010
Just another note about the AD topic.  I have noticed the 10 MG of Lexapro (lowest recommended dose) has been pretty accepting in my body.  I haven't had any of the side effects listed.  Libido is still good, thank the Lord for that one :).  I was originally on 20 MG over the summer (while on the trams- but got off) and let me tell you, I got RIGHT off the stuff because I experienced a lot of the side effects on there.  It very well could have been an overdose of Seratonin as a result of still being on the Trams, but to that note:  if you are on Tramadol, I wouldn't recommend adding an anti-depressant to your routine.

As pharma noted, you need to wean yourself off of Lexapro and any other anti-depressant you are taking.  I forgot to take it with me when I was away for three days and experienced more depression and withdrawal symptoms such as malaise, brain zaps, and anxiety.  HOWEVER, I do think the Lexapro is doing something for me.  I know everyone is different, but I feel wonderful.  It might just be my general outlook on life, or it very well could be the AD.  I don't know.  What I do know is my life is much better without Tramadol.  I couldn't be happier, and I finally feel like I have control over my life again.

My wife no longer worries when leaving the kids with me while she goes out with friends, shopping, etc.  I'm no longer holed into the house and am eager to get out and start living.  

Whatever works for you, I suggest doing.  As for the weight gain, I've been running around like crazy and haven't experienced any weight gain except for the first five healthy pounds I put on after getting off the Tramadol.

Pharma is a pharmacist, so she knows what she's talking about.  For me, I'm willing to test out Lexapro some more, since being on the lowest dose seems to have a good reaction with my body and I don't have any ill-effects.

Stay strong all... and enjoy your day! :)

1106880 tn?1260898678
by wantmyselfback, Jan 18, 2010
Sierra,

Just checked out your website that you provided (I'm assuming you looked at the road back .org).  I would check out a more trusted site.  Everything listed there may or may not be true.  Looks like they might be trying to hype up some ill-effects so you try out their program.  Check out drugs.com webmd or another more trusted site for more info on any AD or other drug.  Sometimes you need to watch those other sites.

Avatar universal
by E_Streete, Jan 18, 2010
I've read thru 1000's of blogs since Wednesday, January 13, 2010 and man oh man! Well here my story. I had gastric bypass surgery May of 2007 and have been doing great with that, but I would have these outrageous stomach pain and I went to the E.R. many 5 times before they stuck the scope down my throat and seen it was a bleeding ulcer. My Gastro. Doctor gave me a script for Tramadol (The little football shaped devil) and told me to take one 50mg pill every 8 hours, so I did. Time went on and I was still taking them, no problem cool, they became a part of my everyday life. Over the past 3 months or so I had take 2 to 2 1/2 pills in the morning and one about 1 p.m., another around 5ish and another around 10ish, give or take a half here or there. Recently I noticed waking up out my sleep, dripping wet from head to toe with sweat, it got so bad about 2 weeks ago my girlfriend got out of bed and give me a towel to dry me off as like I've been swimming in a lake. And Wednesday 1/13/2010, all hell broke loose for me. I was VERY DEPRESSED and nothing cheered me up, I just wanted to shut myself off from the world. So I told my mother what I was feeling so she called my regular P.C.P. and told her what she going on and she asked what meds. was I taken and she told her and BINGO! Football Crack aka Tramadol was the criminal. After she told me that, that was all I needed to hear! My doctor suggested that I tamper myself off but I refused and went cold turkey.
1/14/2010, Day 1: Woke up things were fine, mind fog like normal from taking this stuff for the past 15 to 16 months. Very little energy and just being. I'm not an emotional guy, but boy did I feel like crying my eyes out. All I did was lay in bed and get on the computer to find out as much information about this stuff as possible. Sleeping was IMPOSSIBLE! Probably woke up 10 to 12 times and that's saying a lot, because I've slept thru tornado's, thunder storms, etc., I'm a HEAVY SLEEPER!
1/15/2010, Day 2: After a night of no sleep, I felt like total ****, diarrhea, headache, lazy, sad, alone, scared. But I was like it will be a cold day in hell, pig's would fly and the Cleveland Brown's would have to win a Super Bowl, all this in the same day before a EVER take another one of those pills. So later on that evening my mom took me on a car ride and for some weird reason I felt better. So I decided to take my girlfriend out to dinner, we went out, I felt ok. Came home and took 2 Melatonin to attempt to get some rest...HA! Didn't happen, but it was a tid better than Day 1.
1/16/2010, Day 3: I woke up with all the energy in the world, short lived! My mother and girlfriend took me out. A little more energy then the day before and my mother says she see's the old me coming back out, which made me feel better about myself, still had the diarrhea, lazy, depression on and off, headache probably from lack of sleep and tired. So I went to the store and got some Chamomile Tea and Rapid Sleep PM. I got about 4 hours of straight sleep and then it was on and off until 9am. Maybe got a total of 6 hours and that's a huge maybe.
1/17/2010, Day 4: Woke up with some energy, but felt like the fog was beginning to lift more and more each day. Cleaned up my room, bathroom, kitchen, painted, etc. Still felt foggy but not as much, a lot more clearer moments then in previous days. Diarrhea had calmed itself down and the depression was short lived. Still had the minor headache, most likely a lack of sleep. Did more research and went to Walgreen's and got some Imodium AD (helps with the diarrhea) and 5-HTP (for sleep). Went to sleep and probably got a good 5 hours before waking up on and off but only 3 to 4 times.
1/18/2010, Day 5: Got up and went to keeping myself busy, although it took all the energy I had. I washed the cars and replaced the bumper on one, seems like to took me forever to do it. Energy today, is coming and going, headache is very very mild, spirits remain high, I will overcome this, by any means!!!
I am thankful to have found since a site helps people overcome and guides them to the path of life before Tramadol. We all will overcome this and get our lives back. Everyone don't give up, keep fighting this. I'm going to fight this tooth and nail.
If anyone has a similar story to mine, please post back. Other great tips, take your vitamins, drink protein shakes, exercise and drink lot's of water.

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 18, 2010
Well I bought the 5-HTP, some more St. Johns and omega 3,6,9 gels. at this point my am/pm 7-day pill pack is totally stuffed with all I take--lol. I didn't get the Sam-E as it said it was for joint probs. My glucosmaine/chondroitin/MSM covers that. And I haven't had any aches and pains since last week.

I also found that I had a bottle of 10 mg Fluoxetine (gen Prozac) with pills still in it sitting behnd everything on my nightstand. One of the scrips my doc gave me when wellbutrin didn't work for sleeping and trying to get off Celexa. Was surprised to see the bottle said I still had a refill left on it and it's not expired! Not been quite a year since I took them. I think I only took a months worth when I decided to try going off and trusting just B12. Did fine after that. So...guess I can start on this. altogether it's two months worth. Does anyone know if there is a problem with taking both St. Johns and Prozac at the same time? (Pharma?)

You know it seems pretty ironic that we have to take so many supplements and stuff just to try to counteract the effects of one little devastating pill.

Sierra

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 18, 2010
Sierra- I would recommend either taking the prozac 10mg (fluoxetine) OR the St Johns Wort and 5-HTP.

   I have read wonderful research on the omega's and treatment for both depression and anxiety. I have been taking 5-6 GRAMS a day for the last few days to try to combat the anxiety I have been struggling with. I think it helps. The Book The Omega 3 Connection is a fun read and well written and researched. By Andrew Stoll.

end of day 21
I go to the MD tomorrow. Work went fine today, then off to yoga. getting a class in 3 times this week. YEAH.
Strangely peaceful, amidst the anxiety.  I guess I am thinking it will pass and very well may take up to 4 months to completely resolve. But I visualize it resolving. I am humbled by this w/d experience...it is a GOOD feeling. I feel more open and accepting towards everyone....all out there are muddling through and doing their best to deal with life....figuring out what terms are going to work...and CERTAINLY hitting the wall when things don't work....like getting addicted to Tramagarbage...HEY it seemed like a good idea...then came the consequences and demoralization...such an expensive habit...it took money, time, focus and attention...much energy...it also took the colors, spontaneity and true feeling of connection with others....SO it not only veiled my eyes but brought a curtain down between myself and my loved ones
I enjoy the moments that belong to me NOW....I don't have to share them with a little white pill, anymore--and wonder how much of the experience I should attribute to the drug, and how much I get to keep as mine....NONE of it was truly mine while I was on the TRAM......  
STAY STRONG WARRIORS


Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 18, 2010
I do not recommend combining St.John's wort and 5HTP with any antidepressants.One or the other,not both.Can get serotonin syndrome.I don't suggest taking both StJohn's wort and 5htp either.I personally do believe that the Vit b complex should contain zinc or take zinc daily.I think it helps in stabilizing the mood much like lithium.Anywhere from 25mg to 50 mg Zinc a day.

Sierra...so glad to hear your pain has been eliminated .Mine is also controlled easily with otcs.I even had an abcessed tooth about 6 weeks ago and coped with ibuprofen and tylenol.Why don't you try the St.John's wort and see if it helps.Give it about 3 weeks to work and it may be very subtle.If it does not help then go to the prozac..at least it is only 10mg and also needs about 2 or 3 weeks to kick in.

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 18, 2010
Wow E-Street. Glad your doing so well at day 5. By day 8 the depression, insomnia and anxiety finally kicked in, by day 10 it was unbearable and I caved to taking 1/2 a pill. Still on the 1/2 pill. a little nauseaus, have diarrhea, sweating still at night, but don't feel the awful flu-like symptoms and abdominal pain I had for 6 weeks after coming off of 6-8 trams a day down to 1. I hope to widdle down to 1/4 pill a day on Wednesday and be off a week after that. Praying to God it works, along with all of the supplements, St. Johns Wort and Fluoxetine (anti-deppressant) I'm now taking.

Sounds like you were taking about 5-6 tramadol a day, and a lot longer than I was/am. It's been almost 4 months for me. Two months for neck pain management and 6 weeks of withdrawals coming off all the pills I was taking and down to 1. I saw two doctors trying to figure out what in the world was wrong with me--I thought I had cancer or worse. Sheesh! They couldn't figure it out and were sure it wasn't the tram. I'm just so curious how it affects us all differently and why in the world this stuff is still on the market. If I can just get past the depression, I know I can kick this.

I'm so glad you are doing so well after 5 days. I saw your post in another blog here and responded to it then as well. I really felt for you then with all you are going through and am glad things are going better. I will continue to pray for you.

Hang in there.
Sierra

910168 tn?1262466069
by Lillyval, Jan 18, 2010
I had good luck in the past with 900mg/day standardized St. John's Wort for moderate depression.  It wouldn't be effective for severe depression/suidicidaliy.  Reading the last several days posts really makes it hit home how anti-depressant effects of tram have f**ked up our brains.  I've experienced the memory loss, too.
I wish to God we could get this poison off the market

983592 tn?1249766535
by Gerty411, Jan 19, 2010
I started on 10mg paxil yesterday.  I had taken that years ago and found it helpful.  I wonder if part of my addiction to t was its antidepressent effects.  Of course I enjoyed the buzz, too. Today is day #71 since t. I definately don't ever want to take that drug ever again.  Those pill ****** are still calling me from the pharmaceutical companies.

Continue of warriors!

Gerty

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 19, 2010
Want- glad to hear you are enjoying AA meetings and life !!  you must feel so free now that you have disclosed everything.

Gerty- glad to hear you got a script you feel comfortable using for the depression

Sierra- How are you feeling these days? Have you had anymore of the extremely dark moods?

Lilly- I agree--although many of the pharmaceuticals on the market...can't target health...they chase disease. My issues with Tram is it's classification as an analgesic HA HA HA with a secret AD component .....I am going to write to my legislator about this drug. I am also telling any care providers I can about it. I think it is garbage.

E Street- nice work!!!!!

Pharma- thanks for your recommendations, I feel I learn a lot from you.

JG- effexor taper sounds like it is going well for you...it's a long haul isn't it, Honey....you are doing great  nice work!

STAY STRONG ALL


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by Lillyval, Jan 19, 2010
Below is an article I received today re: chronic pain.  I'm posting it here in the hope it can help someone.
Lilly

FOODS TO AVOID FOR CHRONIC PAIN SUFFERERS

"Limit Sugar as Much as Possible. Increased insulin levels will typically dramatically worsen pain. So you will want to limit all sugars and this would typically include fresh fruit juices. Whole fresh fruit is the preferred method for consuming fruit products.

If you are overweight, have high blood pressure, high cholesterol or diabetes, you will also want to limit grains as much as possible as they are metabolized very similarly to sugar. This would also include organic unprocessed grains. Wheat and gluten grains are the top ones to avoid.

Eat fresh foods. Eating a diet of fresh foods, devoid of preservatives and additives, may ease symptoms triggered by coexisting conditions such as irritable bowel syndrome (IBS).

It’s also a good idea to buy organic food when possible, as it’s best to avoid pesticides and chemicals. However, fresh is best. So if you have to choose between local, fresh, non-organic and organic but wilting – go with fresh, and clean properly.

Avoid caffeine. Fibromyalgia is believed to be linked to an imbalance of brain chemicals that control mood, and it is often linked with inadequate sleep and fatigue. The temptation is to artificially and temporarily eliminate feelings of fatigue with stimulants like caffeine, but this approach does more harm than good in the long run. Though caffeine provides an initial boost of energy, it is no substitute for sleep, and is likely to keep you awake.

Try avoiding nightshade vegetables. Nightshade vegetables like tomatoes, potatoes, and eggplant may trigger arthritis and pain conditions in some people.

Be Careful with Your Fats. Animal based omega-3 fats like DHA and EPA have been touted as a heart-healthy food, and they may help with pain, as well. They can help reduce inflammation and improve brain function. At the same time, you want to eliminate all trans fat and fried foods, as these will promote inflammation.

Use yeast sparingly. Consuming yeast may also contribute to the growth of yeast fungus, which can contribute to pain.

Avoid pasteurized dairy. Many fibromyalgia sufferers have trouble digesting milk and dairy products. However, many find that raw dairy products, especially from grass fed organic sources, are well tolerated.

Cut down on carbs. About 90 percent of fibromyalgia patients have low adrenal functioning, which affects metabolism of carbohydrates and may lead to hypoglycemia.

Avoid aspartame. The artificial sweetener found in some diet sodas and many sugar-free sweets is part of a chemical group called excitotoxins, which activate neurons that can increase your sensitivity to pain.

Avoid additives. Food additives such as monosodium glutamate (MSG) often cause trouble for pain patients. MSG is an excitatory neurotransmitter that may stimulate pain receptors; glutamate levels in spinal fluid have been shown to correlate with pain levels in fibromyalgia patients.

Stay away from junk food. Limit or eliminate fast food, candy, and vending-machine products. In addition to contributing to weight gain and the development of unhealthy eating habits, these diet-wreckers may also irritate your muscles, disrupt your sleep, and compromise your immune system."




334144 tn?1423248271
by booba77, Jan 19, 2010
What the hell can one eat anymore?  Last night I made brown flavorless rice and chicken breast to eat at work this week, with kale and turkey for dinner.  What I want is a big mac with extra sauce.  I know, its terrible.  I have re-read the PAWS info and a m trying to recognize the symptoms and control my thoughts and anger.  I am only taking B12 each day anymore.  Guess the omegas help with depression?  still havent had a checkup.  not going until I can afford to take my kid to the dentist and my dog and cat to the vet.  Pharma~I have been off trams since oct 29, what supplements would help with depression ad maybe weight loss?  i just want OTC of course.  the 5 HTP didnt work for me nor did the valerian.

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 19, 2010
Booba..I don't have an answer about the depression.Maybe whey protein will help produce the neurotransmitters and I believe in BComplex with zinc.
I am also battling weight gain...I lost 8 lb over the summer and its all back on now.I believe that starvation diets do not work and women need at least 1200 calories a day for good weight loss.Drink lots of water.Juice adds calories.I am now counting EVERYTHING I put in my mouth and boy does it add up.A bite here,a cookie there and so on.Time to get serious.
I"ll bet a lot of your depression is because of weight gain...You will lose it soon and you will feel better.
I also want the big mac .....but it aint gonna happen.

Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 19, 2010
Lillyval-
Thanks for posting that. I found it very interesting and helpful!
Bode
P.S. doing well- 1 week, tram free!  YAY!

Best wishes to all

Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 19, 2010
4leef and pharma-
Do you feel that the natural supplements and remedies really help?  They never helped me while in w/d from trams and just wondering your thoughts. (Pharma is a pharmacist(right?) and 4leef is a nurse).

334144 tn?1423248271
by booba77, Jan 19, 2010
Im sure the weight gain doesnt help the depression.  I will try the zinc.  I am on my B vitamins, which help a lot.  Thanks for the help.

Avatar universal
by LeaAnn807, Jan 19, 2010
Hi everyone!  This site has been tremendously helpful to me over the last year, but with that said, and knowing my hatred for "all things tramadol", I still go back to them over and over.  I fail to understand why anyone....ANYONE who knows what kind of withdrawal is coming when the pills run out would keep doing it like I do???  I will get completely over the withdrawal and then go RIGHT back to it, like I had no idea what I would be facing next time.  Like it would magically be different???  Hardly!  It's been the same, or worse, everytime.  I haven't had any for a bit now and am ok, but as I read all of these posts when I was in the throws of withdrawal, the main question I see, and the question I have had myself at times, is "how bad is it?" or "what is the withdrawal like?"  So to put my two cents in and to hopefully help someone who comes along like me, here goes......

During withdrawal you can expect the exact opposite feeling that pills gave you WHEN you first STARTED taking them.  If they sedated you, then you will be restless and anxious.  If they gave you energy, you will have NONE and I mean....NONE!  Like walking in quick sand-none.  If they made you unemotional, you will be come emotional.  If they helped you sleep, get used to a WHILE of insomnia.  If they made you a nicer person, you will be agitated with anyone who looks at you.  If they made you feel warm and fuzzy, then you will lose ALL ability to control your body temperature.  If they constipated you, you will have diarrhea....for awhile!  If they stopped your pain, guess what?  PAIN comes back.....bones, muscles, head, feet....EVERYTHING!  In places you never even had pain to begin with.

There are obviously MANY others, but this will give anyone who needs help a little info on what to expect.  One other thing I learned.  And I am NOT a doctor, but I have a LOAD of experience here.....Benadryl makes RLS or restless anything else worse in some people.  Not good for me in early withdrawal.  Clonidine is a great med for withdrawal, but it can cause that "walking in quick sand" feeling to be worse!!!  More is not necessarily better when it comes to meds for detox!

Thanks for helping me so many times for letting me be a part of helping anyone else!  

Good luck, friends!

TramaHATER!

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 19, 2010
Oh, my! I did so much better today. And...had tons of energy. whipped right through my job in no time at all. what's in that 5-HTP besides been extract? : ) Ialso upped my St. Johns and took the omega 3,6,9 in addition to my usual fish oil which I think is omega 3. Maybe it also had to do with taking one of the generic Prozac. Ok, I won't take both ADs at the same time again (thanks for the info on that Pharma and 4leef--you guys are awesome!). But sure feel great today. I go down to 1/4 tram tomorrow. so I hope things keep improving.

God is awesome and so are you all too! Thanks again for all the suggestions and help.

Sierra

Avatar universal
by Tine77, Jan 19, 2010
my doctor has prescribed me Ryzolt forpain due to withdrawl from a narcotic pain medicine... years ago I took the ultram, 10-15 a day and didnt know when the doctor stopped it that what I went throught was withdrawls but I still remember the spasms and shaking tillthis day.  I wonder has anyone here taken ryzolt and since its supposed to be controlled release tramadol of 300mg, is it as addictive as the shorter acting tramadol?  Thanks for all your help
Tine


Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 19, 2010
Bode--great news!! one week!! I am very happy for you. Free at last, free at last.............

Sierra- there have been some 'good days' for me early on....they were such a reprieve from the tough ones,which seem to come intermittently after day five until ...now (I am at 22) the good moments get stronger and longer...just know if you struggle that it won't last.......take it one hour at a time.....let us know how you sleep tonight..............

Tramhat- LOVED your essay on the Tramadrawal..........yeah!
STAY STRONG ALL  

Avatar universal
by LeaAnn807, Jan 19, 2010
4leef, Thanks...I have LOADS of unfortunate experience!  It never gets any better the next time around!!!  I'm on day 3 and have maybe weathered the worst....I HOPE! : )

Tine, I would say that tram is tram...in ANY form. I have taken both demons, and I didn't like the extended release, because I had less control of it.  Call me a control freak, but I wanted to KNOW how much and when that DEVIL entered my system each time.  I would say that the extended release would be hard for tapering, but I never had the self control to do that.  I was always going to do that the "next" bottle!  It was cold turkey for me each time.  Good luck to you!

Avatar universal
by pharma9, Jan 19, 2010
Bode...I really feel the vitamins help in a subtle way.They strengthen the nervous system and immune system and help us fight better.I tried 5htp and felt awful and have some St,John's wort here but am afraid to try it.I have never been a depressed person so I think i do not need extra serotonin.I certainly think i need the vitamins and omegas and minerals.I think they help me stay healthy and able to resist the few urges I have.
Almost every day I destroy narcotics that people bring back and have watched may trams,oxycontins,percocets and tylenol #3,morphines fizz away in bleach.I am not tempted to take any.

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 19, 2010
Bode- Nothing seemed to help during those first 4 days for me...I really couldn't stomach omegas or much of anything else. I  went out and got some 5HTP, SAMe and St Johns Wort but after the first 24 hours of w/d I didn't really give a rats *ss about anything except making it making it through the day...taking pills didn't seem like anything I was willing to do...when I thought I was going to break into a million pieces from the anxiety (at about 36 hrs) I drove to urgent care and asked for clonidine....remembering the young heroin addicts I had attended in my career, and how they praised it's powers during w/d
(they praised suboxone, too...but that had not occured to me yet)    so I was not very invested in the suppliments day1-5  seemed like trying to put out a raging fire with a dixie cup of water..............................................................
now I am taking mega Omega (ha) 5-6 grams a day, also melatonin for sleep

my visit to my pcp was a disaster ..I thought I'd get a further script for clonodine..I am nowhere NEAR being ready to wean off it. She said 'no' and I could feel her discomfort...(yuck..a drug addict)  euww  THEN she suggested I take a month or two off of work....what planet ???
I won't go back.
..........one of my Docs at work wrote me a script for both clonidine AND vistaril --both non addicting pharmaceuticals to help me deal with this anxiety. I get anxious everyday but only seem to get depressed when I don't sleep or am stressed.. you know the princess and the pea syndrome...pretty fragile here but making it to work every day...getting help..learning who can't be helpful and leaving the empty well when I come across it....there are many 'out there' willing to help
this is one destructive and dangerous pill....Tramadamit
I do not have cravings either..pharma  I am sooo grateful !!!
Bode- hows it going??
STAY STRONG WARRIORS


  


1103290 tn?1261754965
by gerty411411, Jan 20, 2010
Hi Y'all,

I started taking 10 mg of Paxil yesterday and I felt dizzy nauseated and had a wierd feeling in my chest.  I felt like my body was going through wd so the paxil could work.  Is that a crazy scenario or what.  Maybe I''ve really lost my mind.
Hopefully today will be better.  If not I will stop the paxil.

Booba, I want to eat nonstop.  It's terrible . I've gained 8 lbs. Been working out and bellydancing but also been eatint the
cookies at night.  Winter *****.

But we are all tramadol warriors and we will get through this.

Gerty

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 20, 2010
Booba- what methods are you using to work on your thoughts and anger?

Tramahat- you must be 'out of the woods' now....what is your strategy for ongoing cleanliness this time around....you have done very well...they say, with cigarettes and everything else...just KEEP QUITTING...this is YOUR TIME for it to stick...tell us how

Gerty- today should be better with the paxil...if it isn't I wouldn't take it anymore either

STAY STRONG ...ENJOY THIS DAY TRAM_FREE

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 20, 2010
Gerty- I think it takes about a week to adjust to Paxil, at least that's the way it is with Effexor.  Paxil is a pretty strong drug and like Effexor, hard to come off of.  I'm not sure why that gave you it, but maybe it's what you need.  If you continue not to like it, try prozac or lexapro.  Paxil and Effexor are good meds, but have some side effects and are both difficult to stop.  Anyway, sorry, I'm withdrawing from Effexor, so I'm not miss happy about these meds.  10mg is low I think though.

4Leef- The Effexor taper *****.  I'm at 50mg and will be there for a couple of weeks, but it's not really a therapuetic dose, so it's just preventing physical withdrawal for now.  Sorry about your PCP.  Not sure why they wouldn't give more clonidine.  It's pretty safe unless you have issues with BP.

Jenny

Avatar universal
by LeaAnn807, Jan 20, 2010
Well, to answer your question, my strategy has failed miserably so many times that I am trying to find a new one this time.  I have always thought that "remembering" those first 3 or 4 days should do it for me, and honestly, it does for awhile each time. And what has saved me is that I usually only take a weeks worth of tram before having to withdrawal again, making it not as hard as when I had taken it for months like last year.  But I must say that there is always a "payment period" for each time I do that!  It's a horrible few days.  And the insomnia is the WORST.  I have a horrible fear of not sleeping.  I have been dependent on sleeping pills before because of this fear.  That is why during detox I never depend on a benzo to help me.  I would rather have clonidine anyday.  It helps many more of the symptoms and makes it tolerable.  (for me anyway!)

I am out of the woods, as you said.  My fear is going back.  I hate it so bad, but I get so tired of the insomnia.  I need help from everyone here to suggest something to help me stop for GOOD this time. At this point, I am just having trouble regulating body temp and, of course, the dreaded insomnia and some anxiety.....always my reasons for returning to it.  I have found that once I am able, (after the first couple of days) the thing that helps me is to get up, make my bed so I don't get back in it, and move on, no matter how tired I am or how hard it is.  

That is where I am today!  Thanks for your help!

PS.....and I forgot to mention that I still feel somewhat like I'm walking in mud. Maybe not quick sand, but definitely walking in mud, while wearing heavy body armor! (my legs weigh 800 Lbs...I'm sure of it!!)

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 20, 2010
Tramhat-- There is a CD mentioned on this thread....meditation for insomnia you might want to check out. Have you tried melatonin? I am thinking it needs to be used consistently for a few days for better effectiveness...I am taking 6mg every night. I use a heating pad at night(still) are you taking anything else during the day that might be stimulating (coffee, cigs, sudaphed, excedrin migraine?)
what are you doing for exercise? support?....the lack of sleep (for me) causes anxiety and depression which cause viola! lack of sleep......its vicious
I work hard to RELAX my thoughts...as the fear of lack of sleep makes it so hard to sleep!!
course lack of sleep won't kill us...but Tram use just might
I am going to start using vistaril today for anxiety...in addition to the clonindine...who knows? I have a weird reaction to benadryl..it makes me jumpy.....when my partner takes it he is ZONKED for the night....biochemistry is very individual....
I don't think I've ever mentioned the feeling of cold-body freeze which I've had for the entire w/d period so far
I guess thats why I LOVE hot baths, hot yoga classes and my heating pad so much
we went snowshoeing last weekend...my multilayers of attire were almost ridiculous and it was a trudge
but lovely...and helped me sleep well
what brings you joy? what inspires you?
STAY STRONG


Avatar universal
by LeaAnn807, Jan 20, 2010
I have tried melatonin a couple of times.  Of course, when it doesn't give me that "sleeping pill" feeling, I decide that it's worthless and stop!  I don't think it's designed that way.  I drank sleepy tea last night.  I don't do anything that would mess me up during the day except I do drink cokes.  (bad, I know!)  Here's the thing I hate....like Emily says, it's sooooo not linear.  I may sleep well for one or two nights, and then BAAAAM, on the third night only an hour!  Weird how this stuff jacks with your sleep!  I use a heating pad too.  It's priceless to me in early withdrawal.  I have decided that 4 or 5 hours of sleep is pretty good for me.  Lots of people don't NEED 8 hours of sleep...I'm one of them, I guess.  I am at a point that I'm just happy with anything I get.  Relaxing about it helps alot.  You said it best....fear and anxiety about not sleeping just makes it harder.

Please let me know about the vistaril.  I have seen it used in rehab before, but it makes me hyper like Benadryl.  Clonidine makes me sleepy, but I have found that I wake up after about 2 hours everytime I take it at night.  

I have body freeze like you!  My hands and feet are like ICE as I'm typing this!  STRANGE!  I took 3 hot baths yesterday.  It helps so much.

I sooooo need to exercise, but I have trouble walking from one end of my house to another, so how am I supposed to muster up the energy to walk outside???  Can't make myself do it eventhough I KNOW it would help tremendously.  I know I would benefit from it in many ways.  I think it helps mentally also.  Lots of docs recommend it to people in cases of mild depression, not that I buy everything docs say.  A doc also told me that Ambien and Ultram were not addictive.  I call crap-ola on that one!  Bigtime.  I would recommend to anyone who reads this.....always look up medicine that you are given when a doc says the words, "don't worry, this is not addictive!"  If there's a question, LOOK IT UP.  Take NO ONE'S word for it.  It's your life that will be messed up for a long time if you don't.  There's my rant for the day!!!

How many days do you have now?  I want to stay off this junk so bad.  It's soooo not worth the last few days I have had!

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 20, 2010
Tramahater- Have you been to a doctor for thyroid and adrenal fatigue?  I think the cold extremities, sleeplessness, irregular temps are all adrenal fatigue symptoms.  Just wanted to say that.

Avatar universal
by LeaAnn807, Jan 20, 2010
Hi there JG.  I have had all things checked yearly.  I have had a thyroid problem in the past, so it's a regular checking thing for me!  Honestly, this is a withdrawal symptom for me.  I am only on day 4.  In a few days, the cold thing will start to get better.  It has happened to me everytime, but thank you for the advice!  It's just one of the gnarly things I have to cope with but hopefully won't have to do again.  

BTW 4leef, the clonidine will make you cold, and I mean COLD COLD!  WIth the lower BP comes artic-circle insides for me, but it's a trade off I always say.  It's better than the alternative!

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 20, 2010
I have 23 days today....JG- I have seen the w/d from both effexor and paxil....I remember reading a story about an 11 yr old girl trying to get off paxil and having to decrease 1 mg weekly....oh those parents were beside themselves with guilt over the situation.....I agree that lexapro, even good ole prozac are easier to get off of

Tramahat- well...maybe the vistaril will make me jumpy too, I'll let you know....and I am thinking my continued coldness may now be fro the clonidine......ohhhh

Keep Going!!!!!!!

Avatar universal
by LeaAnn807, Jan 20, 2010
23 days out?  Definitely it's from the clonidine then, I'd say.  Again, I'm no doctor, but it makes me freeze, and I am usually hot-natured and from the south, so it's not exactly sub-zero here most of the time!  If I take clonidine, I can get cold in 90 degrees!  It is the drug they give in rehab where I went before, and everyone there was freezing!  The addictionologist said it was first withdrawals and then clonidine that caused it.

A big congrats on the 23 days!  What a trama-trooper!!

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 20, 2010
Thanks!!
Tomorrow I go to my AA meeting then to yoga. I LOVE YOGA. Course, during the Tramadrama I was going 5x weekly, working full time along with everything else....like some kind of super hero....now I get to yoga twice a week. and I'm happy with that...I m really lowering my expectations here and in touch with much humility about this addiction and withdrawal process. I think I set myself apart from others in a lot of ways. I have been fairly satisfied with my relationships in my life and have worked toward deepening them and being healthy and present (yada-yada) but really folks.....I have been 'fogged' and driven in ways that just aren't going to work in my life as I go from this point on. I like AA too. It is a wonderful spiritual approach to life and I need that infused in my thinking. People are really just so cool. We are all just on this journey, learning together what works and what doesn't. I need all the help I can get
and I've decided that 50 mistakes a day is my minimum..........I'd just like to keep making NEW ONES for a change
yeah
STAY BRAVE AND STRONG

Avatar universal
by bodegirl, Jan 20, 2010
Tramahater-I had the samebody temperature issues (freezing but sweating at the same time) through w/d's.  My doctor told me that's very normal to go through.   The insomnia was the absolute worst(I am one of those people that needs the 8 hrs!) and nothing helped exept when I took one of my mom's ambien and I slept ok for one night.  I know that draggy feeling so well too.  I remember wanting to get up and walk sooo badly knowing it may help, biut i just couldn't do it.  Like 4leaf said, lack of sleep then causes anxiety and depression-a viscious cycle!   What a rough thing to go through!  The worst ever.  Hang in there, because remember that it does get better.  Try to make a list of reasons to stay off of Trams. and read it everyday to help you stay off of them.  Maybe that will help?  

4leaf-great going!  23 days is awesome! How is everything else?

Gerty-my doctor recommended trying an AD and she mentioned a bunch of potential side affects like the ones you're having.  She said AD's can be frustrating because first come the side affects and the later come the benifits. The side affects you're having should subside after a week or so.

I am doing well.  8 days tram free!  I am on the lowest possible dose of suboxone and will slowly taper off within the next 3 or 4 weeks. The physical w/d's are not there for me(thank the Lord!!!) and I haven't thought of taking pills in 8 days!  It is a complete relief not worrying about my next dose of tram. or where to hide the pills or when I need to order more.  Not worrying about that has left room for other things...like life!  

Keep on fighting everyone!

Warm wishes,
Bode

Avatar universal
by LeaAnn807, Jan 20, 2010
4Leef, I could probably use something like Yoga.  I have never really known much about it.  And the superhero thing...YES.  Yes, Yes, Yes...me too!  When I took pills, my house would shine like the top of the Chrystler building!  And I could do about 40 hours of work in about a day!  I was a cooking, cleaning nutt!  I hope after the WD is over, I can get the energy to do those things again.  I am usually a pretty energetic person.

Bode, I have taken suboxone before.  I think it's great if it's tapered like you said.  Do NOT wanna stop that stuff all at once!  It helps a lot with cravings in my opinion, because if fills up those empty opiate receptors.....pesky little things that they are!!!  I'm gonna work on that list.  Grateful list, I call it!  And I have a whole bunch of things to fill it up.  I am truly a blessed person in a lot of ways.  Hard to remember that sometimes, so thank you for the reminder!  

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 20, 2010
Gerty,
I hope the Paxil works for you. I think it was the second AD I tried maybe 16 or so years ago (can't remember) and was on it for about 4 months before I had a breakdown and ended up in the looney bin for a week. Paxil gave me horrible mood swings. One day I was elated and the next I was horribly depressed again. After getting out of the hospital my doc sent me to a counselor that works just with ADs and would see me 4 times a year to make sure I was ok on them. Based on all the info I gave her she thought Celexa would be best for me--a new AD out at the time. I tried it and barely had any side effects in the first couple of weeks. Within a few days of taking it my mood stabalized and I stayed on it until about a year ago. Of course I gained 100 pounds in the process. Nasty. My family has always been on the tall boney side and it was very weird for this gal who could never gain weight to gain this amount. My father couldn't get over it. Of course I tried to get off of Celexa for a couple of years and finally did almost a year ago by trying other ADs and sub B12. I think the B12 helped me the most, though. It's great to be free of Celexa. It was funny, though, that no matter how hard I worked out or changed my diet I couldn't lose any of the weight when I was on it. Afterwards, I lost 45 pounds within a few months. Now I'm down another 12. Gradually getting there.

4leef,
23 days -- wooh-hooh!!!! That's awesome. Yeah, the chills went away for me after the first week. So kinda wondering if it might be your Clonidine. I've never been on it, though, so can't say. hey, I didn't have any night sweats last night so that's a good sign. Felt a little down this am when I woke up, but not bad. Took 1/4 pill this morning. We'll see how it goes.

Sierra

1106880 tn?1260898678
by wantmyselfback, Jan 20, 2010
Day 41 for me.... a good day (as usual).  Just wanted to let everyone know that each day gets better and better.  I have all of my energy back (although I still think I was able to multi-task much better on the Trams) and I'm beginning to feel like my old self again - minus the Tramadevil.  It's such a good feeling knowing that I've done something good for myself and have rid myself of the Tramadol forever.  Found one at work the other day and was able to easily flush it without any thoughts whatsoever.  

I'm proud of you all and I think you'll start noticing in due time that you really are "yourself" without the trams, and that feeling like you could never get anything done without them will gradually subside.  I couldn't be happier!

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by Prospero73, Jan 20, 2010
A tip that might help with insomnia: try to stay awake.  I will lie in a comfortable position and look at some nearby object, preferable above eye level so there is a slight sense of strain, trying not to blink too much, and tell myself that I must be vigilant and stay awake at all costs.  What led me to this was long distance driving, where the conditions are similar, and I always start to feel sleepy and have to stop for coffee every hour or so.  

334144 tn?1423248271
by booba77, Jan 20, 2010
Someone asked me what I am doing to combat the anger and impatience.....honestly I am just trying to be less angry and more patient.  I have been tram free for 83 days.  I am starting to think this is just who I am without the trams. I hate admitting that, because I dont like myself this way at all.  

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 20, 2010
Sierra- I had the same problem with Celexa and the weight gain.  I didn't realize until I'd gained a lot and it didn't budge until I stopped it.  I think it's supposed to be better than some others though.  You never know how one will react to an AD.  The common thread is usually weight gain and loss of libido though.  Except, I gather, with Wellbutrin.  I found Effexor to be weight neutral as well, but forget libido!

Booba- I think you're too hard on yourself.  Have you looked into meditation or anything like that?  I've never been able to do it, but it does really help they say.

Jenny

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 20, 2010
Booba,
I don't know. I sure am seeing myself flying off the handle really easily since I've been going through withdrawals. I'm getting so angry so easily and then I end up crying. Everything from people being stupid in traffic, to the garbage man not getting the garbage, I am just not taking it all as well as I used to. Just fumming mad. Tis not like me since I was on the birth control pill years ago. I had to quit taking it as I was becoming the female version of the Incredible Hulk.  Thank God I didn't hurt anyone. Scared them pretty good, though. With what I'm going through right now, just trying real hard to stay away from people until this passes. With God's help I will make it through this. Christ is my savior in everything I go through. Without Him I would never make it through. And I praise Him for leading me to this site. You have all been so helpful. : )

Sierra

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by wantmyselfback, Jan 20, 2010
Agitation with the W/D's is quite normal.  I'm a pretty funny, personable guy, but during my W/D you would've thought I was posessed by the devil.  I would get agitated, yell, even curse out loud (which is totally not like me).  I found that after the first 30 days, I began to get a real calming sense about me.  Booba- just try not to let things get to you.

Avatar universal
by peach46550, Jan 20, 2010
more of a question than comment , what is Tramadol , and will it help vicodan withdrawals ?

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 20, 2010
Lots of activity on the posts today.....it is very important to me to have you all here....you guys are GREAT! I so appreciate the info! Every day when I get to work I end up taking a clonidine for anxiety. whether I start at 7a or 3p I don't really need it until I get here....oh well...I am just going to keep going. my partner and I went to our first counseling session today. there is a lot of strength but many issues we need help talking about----can't believe the amount of relief I feel having some help with this. I told her about the tramadol.....what freedom it is to be out there with this...Guess what? I am not a freak or a bad girl or crazy....I am a person who is learning, wanting to be the best person i can be...I really do--
sometimes I am mistaken and wrong but I am loved by God and all of the people in my life
my biggest problem is realizing when I don't like myself, don't feel competent or secure. it is in that moment I need to petition God's love.....cause my idea about myself is wrong
(I did not know)
Gerty- how did the party go?
Sierra- you are almost to zero and doing great!

Avatar universal
by LeaAnn807, Jan 20, 2010
Peach, please don't use tramadol to get off vicodin.  I don't assume that I have the right to tell anyone what to do, but I can tell you that if you use it to help vicodin WD, then you will soon be using something else to come off the tram.  And THAT will be harder than the vicodin.  I have done both, and I would rather WD from vicodin anyday!  Could you ask your doctor for some Clonidine?  That will help you, and you won't need anything to help you when you're finished with taking it.  It's just a blood pressure med, but helps SO much.  Takes a lot of the symptoms away for me!  Makes it tolerable for sure.

4leef, I am so glad your session was good.  Makes ya feel good to have help, huh??!

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by Lillyval, Jan 20, 2010
Tine - the extended release is just tramadol with a different delivery system.  Yes, you will become addicted to it like you did with the regular tramadol.  It sickens me that your doctor would precribe it for narcotic  withdrawal.  In the opinion of many people here it is WORSE than other opiates like vicodin and oxycodone.  

Peach - don't even think about it -it's a so called "synthetic" opiate with nasty side effects and withdrawals

Gerty - I, too, switched from Paxil to Celexa, but I didn't have any horrible experience with it, it just wasn't right for me.  I have gone off Celexa at least three different times with a 2 to 3 week taper and never experienced any problems with it at all.  So if the Paxil doesn't agree with you don't give up.

Bode - You go girl!

I can't believe am saying this, but I'm actually taking my kids to Disneyworld next week!  My last vacation was during my tramadol taper and I dreaded it like the plague.  Now I'm actually excited!  It is so great to feel like a normal, functioning human being again!  I know you all can do it too!
Lilly

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 21, 2010
Lilly- Disney sounds like fun!

4leef- You said you are taking the clonidine at work only.  Are you unhappy at your job?  Were you unhappy there prior to this?  I'm personally quitting my job soon to work at home and do some volunteer work.  We are not wealthy, but my husband makes enough for us to live on.  I've hated this job for a year, so I know it's not the tram withdrawal, although I'm sure the tram abuse helped me get through it for longer...it's boring!

I'm doing the volunteer work so that eventually I can get into a Master's program for counseling.  I'm excited about this new path!

J

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 21, 2010
Thanks J- a good question. Do I like my job....hmmm....I can say that I am very good at my job but there are parts of it that are burning me out.....sometimes it is so intense (like last night) that the residual for me caused some tensions in my home this morning. I think I will look for some work on the internet today...see some options and explore Thank You!!

I am excited for you...it feels good, doesn't it-- to have a vision for your future work. Something stimulating and challenging and also rewarding!

I would say my work is stimulating and challenging but sometimes not so rewarding....but wait-- there was a glimmer last night of reward--however most of the eve was like walking through peanut butter up to my elbows  ugh!

Booba- I use materials for thought- like meditation books, thought for the day books-ANYTHING to inject an idea of hope in the morning. I might write down a phrase and keep the notecard in my pocket. I would suggest watching the movie What the Bleep do we Know...it talks about thought patterns and brain chemistry (doesn't that sound like fun?) --I loved it and believe it is a well done documentary . I understand struggle with edgy emotions...I have had a lot of stress in my life and struggled also.
Lily- what fun, taking the kids---- free of the Tram...nice work mom!!

Avatar universal
by JG525, Jan 21, 2010
That movie sound interesting 4leef! I'll have to look too.

Work is hard.  It makes up so much of our lives and only 45% of people are satisfied.  Now, there are people like me for whom there is no question...this job is totally unrewarding.  It's complicated when you do get some rewards.  Sometimes it's hard to know if ANY job will be that rewarding.  Just know for me, anything is more rewarding than the current one.

Avatar universal
by LivingnPresent, Jan 22, 2010
hello everyone.i've been reading thru some of these posts ..and i am weeping..it is hard to carry this secret/shame around. no one knows..except my dr. but even he doesnt know the "other" stuff. started with tramadol after back injury 3-4 years ago..increased and i am up to 300mg day. this is not worst of it. i had been taking xanax maybe 3-4 times a year..only used for travel and could keep a bottle for 6 months. started to have trouble sleeping..started increasing the xanax to be able to sleep & come down a bit from the tramadol high ..another addiction now. but there's more..not sure why..i started drinking wine..was periodic wine drinker ..but in past year now drinking wine nightly..no denial here..multiple addictions..im scared to death..not being able to talk about it..makes it worse..rehab is not realistic...not willing to do 12 step program at this point..i also have food addiction but had weight loss surgery 3-1/2 years ago..suffered (as we all have) losses...in family..siblings..small grandson who went thru cancer and treatment...feel like the tramadol helped me get thru all this without completely falling apart  ..though i feel i've been there for my family physically feel like i have not been really emotionally present with them ..i have .small beautiful grandchildren ..im missing a lot..memory suffered..i have to work..feel like i've lost hold of the great job i used to do at work..but have bosses who just continue to support and pay me even tho i am not performing..that adds to my self-loathing..which adds to the vicious cycle.. I too was super woman..so much energy on the tramadol..exercising and doing so much..i think as i increased the xanax and alcohol ..started to lose hold of energy and willingness to exercise..now i sit at this desk (work from home) and im in a state of not caring ..waiting for the day to get to the end so i can drink the wine and go to bed and try to forget it all..i am at risk of losing my job, friends, family, most of all my mind...i dont feel like i can go on..i want my life back..i am 62..so there's not a huge amount of time left..but i want to see these grandchildren grow up. and i want to recover my relationship with my children..i do not have a partner..no room for that when you are an addict. i feel like a total imposter with all the relationships in my life..im a pleaser..so it's important what other people think..but if i isolate with my drugs..and never interact..i dont have to worry about what others think..i live with an elderly parent who is very negative..that excerbates the situation.. being able to say all this here is amazing..im so afraid of people finding out..i manage to pull off that "im ok" whenever i have to be in social settings..but i dont know how much longer i can do this. Please forgive me for this long post..as i said..i've never said any of this to anyone..im so tired of waking up in night gripped with fear about my future or lack of. thank you for listening..i have tried to taper off as others have mentioned..but it doesnt last long.  always so scared when i call in my drug refill..the doc has said to me i need to taper off that they've now realized that tramadol is more addictive than they originally thought (duh) i too feel panic set in if i am traveling and i think i wont have enough..i cannot live like this....Thank you again for listening..some days i dont want to keep going..the only thing that keeps me going is that i would never do anything as i know what it would do to my family..otherwise......probably woudnt be posting.  appreciate any lifelines that can be thrown my way.

Avatar universal
by needinghelpinmi, Jan 22, 2010
hi.  I found this place a few days ago.  I've been addicted for about a year.  i realized it was a problem pretty much right away, but I was living with a very mean husband and it was the only way I could get through an evening with him, so I justified it.  I wanted to keep us together for our children and if I had to be stoned to do it, I would.  Then he got angry and meaner, we fought, and I asked him to move out.  I remember thinkg "good, now I can go off those damn pills" and when I realized I was w/ding, I freaked and started taking them again.  I was afraid I was going to die.  So 9 months later I take about 30 pills a day!!!  3 months ago I ODed and had a seizure, no one knew that it was the Tram, but I did.  I went through a battery of tests for epilepsy etc as I kept my mouth shut about my addiction.  I could not let my future ex husband know or I'd lose the kids.  I don't want to lose the kids.  That is why I HAVE to get clean.  They deserve better than this in a mother.  My stepmom confronted me on xmas day, she knew.  She told me she'd support me if I got my act together but if she found out I was still taking them again later she'd tell my ex because she didn't want my kids to grow up like that.  So she scared the hell out of me.  She is an interfering and opinionated person who drives me up a wall, but I kinow she is serious.  Thing is, I know I want to do this for myself, for my kids, not b/c she found out...a month ago I saw an ad for help getting of Rx pain drugs and wrote in for information.  I talked to my dr about help.  I just never got up the nerve to do it.  The other night, I took too many again and scared myself I was going to have another seizure.  I didn't, but then and there I made myself a promise for me and my kids that I would stop this now.  I used to be a strong, secure, successful person.  I have a great job and I used to be on top of my game.  Now, not so much and my boss has threatened to fire me.  i used to be an involved parent who played with her kids.  Now I'd rather sit and watch tv with them.  I used to be animated and excited and have fun.  Now I just want to lay around and do nothing.  I let my house get messy while I watch movies and take naps on weekends.  So Wednesday I found this board as I was looking for info on wd symptoms.  I've been reading for these couple days now and am motivated.  

I don't want to start wd while my kids are with me.  It will scare them and I won't be able to take care of them.  So I need to wait until next week Thursday.  I'm trying to taper my doses down so I'm not taking 30 a day by that point.

How do you taper?

If you are taking 30 vs 3, will the wd be worse?

I can't take off work.  My boss will kill me if I take anymore time off.  Are the first couple days hardest?  Should I do those on Sat/Sun?  My thought was I wouldn't take any on Thursday and just suffer through work Thurs and Fri, and then let myself fall apart and be sick at home for the weekend...hoping that day 5 (Monday) would be a little better...or I'd do more suffering at work.

Thanks for the help.  I'm so scared.

Avatar universal
by sadsi, Jan 22, 2010
Well for what it's worth to anyone who wants to know - stepping down 50mg's every 3-4 weeks is like trying to win a crap load of battles to take over the war...
I've just jumped from 3 weeks on 150 down to 100 and i've now been awake for over 30 hours...have severe diahorrea and am quite jumpy...it's so difficult knowing that relief is but a reach away...But i shant, I wont...not this time at least.

Good luck everyone - hang in there...from previous step downs, it seems like th first 48 hours is paramount, then WD's start to ease quite quickly at least thats how its been for me from 400mg+ per day...

It's a strange drug - previous to now, when ever i had a bad nights sleep - even zero - i coud take a couple extra tramal and easily get thru of work - it's almost like it had some sought of ampamine quality - anyone else experience this ?

Cheers
Si

Avatar universal
by grandmagirl, Jan 22, 2010
Just a little note for everyone out there reading and just starting...You can all do this..Just start tapering and keep posting and someone will come on and talk with you and help you out...

A wise man who posts here has said a few times  "we didn't google Tramadol  because" it's a wonderful life"

Just take it one day at a time. Before you know it ...you will be posting helping someone else....

If you get a chance google the Star Fish Story...

Peaceful wishes from California



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by wantmyselfback, Jan 22, 2010
Welcome newbies.  Grndma and needinghelp, you've come to the right place.  

Take some time and look up "Emily Post" and check out her journal entries and the thousands who have contributed.  Settle down, and get ready for a crazy couple of days!  If you can't take off needing help, I suggest a taper, but you're going to feel like crap the next couple of weeks while you taper and will start to get anxious knowing you're winding down.  I went cold turkey from about 12-15 a day.  I was fortunate enough to say I had the H1N1 virus and took a week off.  

The first two days are the worst, so I guess maybe starting with your last Pill Friday morning might be the best if you can't take off of work.  

Days 3-7 aren't a picnic either, but you gradually start to feel better and better.  

I'm close to 45 days clean, and feel amazing.  I'm so glad I made this journey, as are my wife and kids.  I was honest with them about a lie I had been hiding for nearly 6 years.  I'm back to my good ol' self and couldn't be happier (although I was prescribed Lexapro as an anti-depressant during w/d and think it was a good idea).

Just hang in there and keep posting.  There's a lot of us here that went through the withdrawal process and know exactly what you're going through.  Just know that by getting off of Tramadol, you are getting your life back.

Read through all of these posts, take notes, and start the journey to a new you.  :)  We're here to help.

You may feel terrible and scared the first few days, but with the help of those on here, you'll know what to expect, and know that each MINUTE you get better and better.

Hang in there... and Welcome!

Avatar universal
by needinghelpinmi, Jan 22, 2010
wanmyselfback - you mentioned lexapro.  my Dr just put me on that about 2 weeks ago.  Why do you think it helped you during wd?  

I'm going to keep tapering and plan to just CT it next weekend.  i'm going to see about getting a long weekend next weekend, somehow.  Make up a lie or something.  I might be able to pull off a lie about the flu or something.  Anyhow, I have my kids this weekend and I don't want to start rihgt now and not be able to care for them.  I can say that I've taken half what I normally would have taken yesterday and today.  Like I said, I was taking a lot.  I actually feel more alert, but I am having some serious aches and pains so I know that my body is looking for more medicine.

Thanks for the words of encouragement.  I'm a little anxious to get this started next weekend.  Excited and nervous.

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by wantmyselfback, Jan 22, 2010
Hi needinghelp - one thing you'll find by reading these posts is that Tramadol also acts as an anti-depressant (possibly one of the reasons people feel so good on them- not like any other opiate "high") so when you come off Tramadol, your brain is basically all out of whack and depression tends to hit as your brain tries to "cope" without the Tramadol.  

I think it took about two weeks before I started feeling the benefits from Lexapro after w/d, but I can honestly say I really don't have any side effects since I'm only on 10 MG a day.  Libido still seems pretty darn good (that tends to be one of the major side-effects) and I'm sleeping good again.  I did notice on 20 MG that I did notice some of the side effects.

I spoke with a good dr. friend and they said if you can't tell you're on it, then keep taking it, so that's what I plan on doing for the next 6 months until I overcome the post acute withdrawal symptoms from the Tramadol.  

I also had been going through a lot during w/d and had a tendency to pick up drinking heavily as a crossover... just be careful of this.  I am now going to AA, and although I consider myself very fortunate to have gone to AA before I ended up like some of the people out there, I now have to really train my brain to rid itself of my addictive personality.

Like I said, the first few days are pretty bad, I'm not going to lie.  You'll have restless leg syndrome, feel so uncomfortable, and your body will tell you it's going through excrutiating pain just to try to trick you into taking more tramadol.  Just stick with it and ride it through.

I took xanax during my w/d (which some strongly suggest NOT doing here) to pretty much knock myself out during the first few days.  I haven't had a problem with crossing over to xanax.  I only took them during my w/d and have some still lying around plus a refill, but never crossed over.  You have to be careful with substituting one drug for another.  I started drinking like I said, but fortunately was able to realize what I was doing and got help.    Others have taken suboxone (sp.?), clonodine, herbal teas, vitamins, etc.  To each his own, I guess.  Whatever can help you get through the first few days.

Just know that you're doing a good thing by getting off the tramadol.  I would continue to take the Lexapro during the w/d's.

Just spend some time during w/d reading through these posts, researching tramadol on Google, and you'll be amazed there are hundreds of people who have gone through a very similar story like yourself.

Hope that helped.  Keep posting!

Avatar universal
by 4leefclover, Jan 23, 2010
Gndma and needing help- Welcome!! Glad you found us!
I agree with wantmyself= friday would be the best c/t day to start and a long weekend( if you can swing it) would serve you best. I say 5 days were the worst for me. I got a prescription for clonidine (a blood pressure pill-non addicting and used for opiate w/d --) helped tremendously with the anxiety and internal restlessness.
w/d from tramadol is complex because it has antidepressant properties as well as opiate...I had strong swings into anxiety (panic) and depression as well as excruciating pain...those pain receptors are screaming for the drug...and NO--
the pain is not your REAL UNDERLYING pain you'll be working with after w/d...but it seems like it
a trick, smoke, mirrors, deception  and emotional cocktail that makes fighting through early w/d difficult...and then to top it all off very little sleep
I got on the post during the long days and nights of early w/d and got support from reading and getting posts from my fellow warriors, here......no matter how you do it...just KNOW YOU CAN
and we are here to help
thanks for your honest sharing...we know the pain of the 'secret life' and how addiction to this drug ravages everything meaningful...it seems like a friend in the beginning...after it gets a 'HOLD" it wrings the essence out of all experience.
keep reading here...make your choices, get support....
STAY STRONG    


Avatar universal
by Texasgal467, Jan 23, 2010
Hello Yall,
I have been "lurking" on this site for a couple weeks.  I can't EVEN tell you have much support this site has been to me in the biggest struggle of my life.  I went cold turkey on Dec 27th.  I had been taking 200-300 mg on and off for 2 years.  Looking back I see clearly now .  When I was agitated or moody in was the Tramadol...I always thought I had a handle bc I waited until 3-4pm to take my tramadol, I loved the energy it gave me.  But it starts to turn on you and when you have a normal life stressor, the Tramadol make it 100x worse...
I didn't have alot of the major physical symptoms i.e. vomiting, nauseau.... Around day 7-10 the EXTREME anxiety and depression kicked in....Now it's day 28 and the depression has greatly improved(started prozac 20mg when i went CT)..
My question is when or will the anxiety go away!?! I was not an overly anxious person before the tram but this is ridiculous...Everyone on this board is a life saver..
Blessings from Texas

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by 12Stepper, Jan 23, 2010
Hi Texasgal, Glad you posted. One of the reasons we keep posting after weeks and weeks without the tram is because the withdrawal is so long and drawn out. The mental effects seem to be the last to go, I'm sorry to say. It is good that you have found an antidepressant that works for you--as that can really be a problem as the weeks go by.

I do recall having acute mental symptoms on and off for about 4 months--but my case was exceptionally long lasting and it might have been drawn out because I was also taking a benzo (ativan) to help me sleep while on the tram. One strange effect of withdrawal from tram specifically is that the mental symptoms hit you sporatically. I remember a good day/bad day routine that lasted for longer than I ever would have thought. I tried to tell my doctor about it but she said the tram was out of my system so nothing could be happening as a result of using it! Ah--the ignorance!!!

I am mainly writing to assure you the any mental symptoms you are having in the upcoming months are a result of the tram. Honestly, I had to treat myself as though I were a patient in a mental ward, getting back into the stream of life very cautiously, a little at a time. I had to add things to my life to help me de-stress such as walking and meditation. It was probably one of the hardest things I've ever done.

Coming to this board every day and realizing that I was not alone helped tremendously--since others were going through the same thing. Then I knew for certain that the mental problems I was having really were residual effects. If you can read up on Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome it is very helpful. I hope you will find on the board the help and support we have.

It sometimes seems like it takes forever for the time to pass to make a full recovery, but it does eventually!!! I finally have 8 months, and I didn't feel whole until 6 months, but it does happen. You just have to be very good to yourself and know that this is the most important thing to do for yourself right now--to recover. Wishing you all the best and welcome to the board.

Strength and courage, Linn

Avatar universal
by Sierra7760, Jan 23, 2010
Hi Everyone,

Well, each day is getting better. First couple of days on the 1/4 tab I was still a little depressed. But have hardly had a twinge of it since. Been keeping real busy too. so i know that helps. We had a nice sunny day today after all the rain we've had lately. so i got out in the backyard and got it all cleaned up. makes me feel good to have that all accomplished. looking out there and seeing the mess was only making me feel worse.

Go off tram completely on Wednesday so hopefully things won't be so bad since i tapered down so much. PLUS...am taking the 5-htp, omegas and St. Johns you all suggested. THANK YOU!!! : )

Welcome to Texasgal, needinghelp and desperategrndma. E_Street are you out there? How are you doing?

Sierra

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by EmilyPost, Jan 24, 2010
This thread is closed.

Please move to Part 26 :)

http://www.medhelp.org/user_journals/show/155528?new_entry=true

Avatar universal
by chessgames56, Jan 30, 2010
Hi all the highest dose of Tramadol I can take now is 37.5 to 50 mg. Any more than that, and I feel terrible anxiety. Withdrawal from this dose involves a day or two of listlessness and mild flu-like symptoms. Since I'm very active and exercise a lot, I sleep about the same with a tab of Tylenol at night. Prior to this, I was on a 3 tab a day habit, still very active but losing weight, which I didn't like. I was definitely addicted. Coming off I felt terrible, like I had the flu. Even though I felt bad, I forced myself to work out. For the next few nights, I hated to go to bed. Restless legs drove me crazy. I have to say, without equivocation, it was the worst symptom of withdrawal. Now I go on and off small doses for indefinite periods when I have a big project to complete and need extra motivation. You see, I am severely hypothyroid, and even on 200 mcg of Thyroxine a day, it's not always enough. Tramadol does not make me sleepy at all, quite the opposite in fact, and helps equalize my energy levels. Perhaps the anxiety at higher doses is a godsend. I read that site on Yahoo that said this drug wasn't addictive, and I do not believe those people took it long enough or at high enough doses to know firsthand; they are just mouthing the official drug-company propaganda. One supplement that may help you here greatly is coenzyme Q-10, It did me. And after you are cold turkey for a day or two, try Saint John's Wart (not before due to the possibly of a serotonin flood). One more thing: exercise, exercise, EXERCISE if you are able. Hope this helps. Best wishes to all.

Avatar universal
by foundviking, Feb 06, 2010
I am considering a class-action suit against Janssen, the makers of Ultram, who claimed their drug was non-addictive and convinced the FDA not to classify their product as an opiate.  If you have any interest in being represented please contact me.  I am working with a law firm out of Florida.  I struggled for eleven years to get this monkey off my back.

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by bayba16, Mar 26, 2010
Hi everyone, new here.  Day 3 for me.  This is hell.  Can barely type this.  WDs from Tram, CT.  Tried to taper down form 50mg x2 daily but suffering anyway, so I threw the rest away.  Day 1 & 2 ok, but night 2 insomnia, tightness in gut, hot and cold, aches, RLS.  Was only on these for 1 1/2 month for back pain.  Doctor said they were safe, HA.
Was able to get a few hours sleep thanks to some Xanax.
Today, very depressed, kinda shaky.
I have some Celexa, how long after stopping the trams is it safe to take SRIs?  Dont want to get serotonin syndrome.  What else should I do?

Thanks for all your help, you are all brave souls.

Avatar universal
by WifeofTramUser, Jul 26, 2010
Hi~

Wanting to ask a question:  My husband has been taking Tramadol for about 5 years.  He gets horrible leg cramps.  When I have read some posting from past years people have mentioned having leg pain.  I am wanting to know if the leg cramping could be from the meds... or if it is what we have been thinking ...from his back surgery he had in May 2005.

I am trying to learn all I can about these meds.  He has chronic pain due to do past physical injuries.  He NEEDS his tram to function.  He is on about 200mg a day.  We are both concerned about the long term effects on his body.

Thank you for sharing.

Avatar universal
by TramFree, Nov 08, 2010
I became addicted to Tramadol about 4 months ago.  I tried tapering it down and I felt like I was coming off heroin, not that I've ever tried herion.  Even a small reduction of 12.5mg (1/4 tablet) generated nasty withdrawal effects, which made me feel like I was going to have a seizure.  I had to stay on 50mg 3x per day until I figured a way to get off this awful stuff.  I did a little research and came across a website www.***********.org (if this gets deleted google "the road back").  This site referred me to www.trbhealth.com and I ordered their Body Calm product along with some other supplements.  I have to say this stuff was an absolute miracle for me because it allowed me to taper off this stuff in 2 weeks, compared to a planned 2-4 month taper.  If Body Calm isn't enough they also make a Body Calm Supreme product that they say is stronger.  

Tonight is my last 12.5mg dose and once I'm sure I'm free of all withdrawal symptoms this stuff is going in the garbage.  Good luck to all who are struggling with this demon.  I hope what I have posted helps!!!

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by rc009, May 29, 2019
is this site still open? Hello?

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