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Does anyone know anything about this health care bill !

Mar 24, 2010 - 63 comments

The lies are just rediculous.  It's not Universal health care.  It's with private insurance companies. Duh...Congress and the President already have the same health care they are now offering all Americans.  

The people that spread this crap are either ignorant or just not interested in the truth. READ THE FREGIN BILL !  AT LEAST TRY AND KNOW WHAT YOUR TALKING ABOUT !

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Avatar universal
by Rory_Nemo, Mar 24, 2010
They don't want to know, they need some reason to hate THIS President. They are racists, and like all racists they lie, make up stuff and stick to it.  Why you ask?  Well basically most racists are cowards, they can come out and say what they really think, then you would hurt their feelings by calling them racists.

That's the really comprehensible part of their reasoning in my mind.   They would rather appear illiterate, ignorant, and totally mindless than appear racist.  

They don't care how stupid they make themselves look as long as they don't have to admit what they really are, bigots and racists.  

They are such patriots that they would rather see America go down, then up with a black President.  

They love America so much that they can not stand to see it sullied with a black President.

All you Tea Partying idiots, how do you like them slogans.  (Did I mention I don't like racists? Okay put that in there.)

Mary, they do not care about the truth, they do not care about looking stupid, all they care about is destroying this President, and if it destroys America, well that's the sacrifice that has to be made.

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by specialmom, Mar 24, 2010
I can honestly tell you that my issues with the healthcare bill have nothing to do with race.  While I didn't vote for Obama there was a time in which I considered it.  As this country was in great turmoil when he made his acceptance speech, I had high hopes fo him and hoped for the best for this country's future.  I still do.  I agree that I have more to learn about this bill and all need to know exactly what is in it and how it will affect them.  Am I illiterate, ignorant and totally mindless for being skeptical?  Am I a racist for not liking some things I know is a part of it? I am different in my beliefs, I guess. I will say that this is a very divisive time in our history and I've not seen that in my adult life.  Our country is really mad at each other-------  so much so that we call each other names that our mother's would wash our mouths out with soap for.  (mine would have anyway).  Anyway, no one listens to anyone when there is such animosity---------  so I'm sure this was a wasted post.  (ps---------  sorry for intruding on your journal.  I did always think these were just for friends until a few days ago and wouldn't have posted here last week.)

Avatar universal
by sterling_silver, Mar 24, 2010
What Rory Said~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Avatar universal
by Rory_Nemo, Mar 24, 2010
No specialmom you are not any of those things if you are skeptical.  

I'm referring to people who use the words "socialist", "fascist", "dictator", "communist", "Muslim", "radical Islamic".  Those people are illiterate, ignorant, and totally mindless,,, and racist.

They obviously don't know what the words actually mean, or don't care.  They never defend the terms they use, never explain them, just repeat them and move on to another word that they are sure to also use incorrectly.  The truth is not what they want to discuss, they want to vent, they are angry, and regardless of what they say they are angry about, the facts lead one to assume that it is race.  If that were not true, then they would be willing to explain why they use a certain word knowing it is in fact the wrong word.

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by allaboutmary, Mar 24, 2010
Specialmom..............As a small business owner you should receive a lot of tax breaks for insuring your employee's.  You really should find out what it's all about before you knock it.

Avatar universal
by teko, Mar 24, 2010
I posted an email describing what takes place this year. I recd it from the white house, it is in my journal if anyone be interested. With that said, it is not something open for debate and the entire bill can be found at that web site. To those who choose to remain ignorant, feel free to do so, as it is pretty obvious to all that they just want the fight. IMO

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by allaboutmary, Mar 24, 2010
Here is a lie getting a lot mileage,,,,,,,,,,
by Rory_Nemo, 2 hours ago
Some people keep harping on the line,,,,, "if this plan is so good why did the Congress and President exempt themselves from it"

They didn't.   They have not.  They can not.

It's a twisted argument that has no basis in reality.  

They are not included, BECAUSE THEY ALREADY HAVE HEALTH CARE.   Duh !!!

The people for this plan have told everyone from the beginning, IF YOU LIKE YOUR PRESENT HEALTH CARE YOU CAN KEEP IT. Duh !!!

This plan is not to make all plans equal. IT'S TO HELP THOSE WHO HAVE NO COVERAGE AND THOSE WHO MIGHT LOSE THEIR COVERAGE Duh !!!!

The Congress and President don't qualify for coverage under this plan,  they DID NOT exempt themselves.  If you like your health care now, you're exempt.  Everyone, not just Congress and the President, is exempt if they like their current coverage. Duh !!!

Next moronic lie please, I'm ready for you

Avatar universal
by lealea66, Mar 24, 2010
Special Mom: As a small business owner....i wish you continued success!! I too, owned my own small business until 8 weeks ago. I rode it and held on as long as i could. Unfortunatly when our current pres. office took office and the economy got soooo bad, the end was inevitable. I could no longer hold on to my life's dream which ran very successfully for almost 5 years until the bottom fell out of this great country's populartion ability to spend $$ as freely on "non luxury" items. I hope these changes with the current HCR bill will work in your favor. Please don't send me HATE posts that our current commander in chief's taking office had nothing to do with my business going belly up....you weren't there, you don't know the facts because you weren't in my shoes and did not experience the heartbreak over 5 years worth of blodd, sweat and tears going down the drain.....just know, it was inevitable and there were not enough months left from now to the end of never to reverse the economy's effect on the bottom line. I am in the South, and it's hit our area of the U.S. very hard...why do you think i had to face the music and get off trammy....NO MORE MONEY to buy my drugs!! lol

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by specialmom, Mar 24, 2010
Of course we will look into the specifics of how it will effect our business but the tax breaks would have to completely offset any cost for it to viable for us to maintain our current level of employees.  We are trying to work out what this really means for us (and our employees)----------  and it is a dollar and cents issue.  This economy has been tough on us and that business is barely scraping by.  Any additional financial pressure and it will fall apart.  I've seen the information being released (yes, I read the White House copy and paste) -----------  still skeptical.  I'll continue to educate myself.  But I will say that while there is anger on the other side it is pretty palpable over here too.  People are allowed to believe and express how they feel with passion but boy that sure ticks others off.  Anyway, this bill would have been better received if it wasn't concocted through wheeling and dealing at the last minute and had gone through the normal procedure to pass such a bill.  Just my random thoughts.  I'll leave you to your journal and thanks for letting me intrude.

Avatar universal
by lealea66, Mar 24, 2010
Special mom....only the first part was to you, the part beginning with "Don't send me Hate posts....." was for the rest of the general posting public who are prolly gonna argue politics with me for which i have no interest at this time, those wounds are still too fresh!! :(   sorry for the confusion, certainly was NOT attacking you sweetie! ....go girl!! : )

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by specialmom, Mar 24, 2010
Lealea66--------  I feel your pain.  CashforKlunkers has about killed us.  I do not complain as that program was meant to help the auto industry---------  but it hurt us badly.  

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by allaboutmary, Mar 24, 2010
The abnormal procedure you speak of was used 22 times by Republicans when they had the majority. So why is it so abnormal now ? If health care was so important to them ............why didn't they even attempt to deal with it ?

Avatar universal
by teko, Mar 24, 2010
I am not real wild about how it was done either, but I can sure understand how and why it happened that way. Anyway on to what is in the Bill? Has anyone bothered to find out

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by allaboutmary, Mar 24, 2010
I am also a small business owner and have been hit very hard. The only reason I remain in business is because I really don't have much overhead. I have no idea why you would say this president caused your business to fail. The economy was headed off the deep end when he took office. Not something you can turn around that quickly.

Avatar universal
by Rory_Nemo, Mar 24, 2010
Normal procedure?  Last minute?  Wheeling and Dealing?

See these are the type of statements that might appear as sound argument. but instead of getting mad a me for pointing out the error in them. Get mad at the people who told you they were good arguments and made sense.

Normal procedure:   This bill was passed using the agreed upon rules of the House and Senate.  Rules that the Republicans and Democrats have used over and over and over again,,, on countless occasions. There is nothing abnormal about them.   Get frustrated at the person who told you they were not normal procedures.

Last minute:  This has been the only thing they've been working on for over a year.  More time has been spent on this bill than on 99% of any legislation in in the U.S Congress that I can remember.  There was nothing last minute about it.  Don't get frustrated at me for pointing that out,, get frustrated at the person who told you it was a good argument to use.

Wheeling and Dealing:  This has always been the norm for American Congress, always since the beginning.  But this actually had more wheeling, and less dealing than most.  There was no compromise from the Republicans what so ever.  Every time they got a concession, they asked for more and more and more, never gave a single one.   Their objective was not compromise, it was defeat and only defeat. They even said so, over and over.  Don't get frustrated with me for pointing this out, get frustrated at the person who told you this argument would make sense.

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by specialmom, Mar 24, 2010
Well see Rory, then I'd have to be mad at myself.  That bill was finished in the eleventh hour or why didn't we see it in its entirety before Sunday?  Why did Stupak stand in front of press and talk about changes made to appease him.  I agree that politics as usual involves wheeling and dealing and my frustration is vented at all of Washington.  As far as this bill being passed like 22 other Republican bills--------  okay. But as you add 22 to 1----------  that is only 23 times making it not the normal procedure.  Again---------  no one has told me to think this way.  It's just little old stupid, illiterate, racist me.  

And as I said, agreed.  I will continue to educate myself as to the contents of the actual bill.  

This bill has been polarizing.  My point was that it would have broader initial acceptance if they had handled it differently.  


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by allaboutmary, Mar 24, 2010
It was not going to be accepted by the opposition..........even if they stood on their head and whistled Dixie. Trust me on that one.  Actually this is more a Republican bill than a Democratic bill. It's has in it almost everything Republicans have suggested the past 10 years.  Most Democrats wanted much, much more.

Avatar universal
by Rory_Nemo, Mar 24, 2010
That is exactly the point I've been trying to point out, it's polarizing.  The bill is not polarizing, the opposition party has made it so.  They don't care about anything except making sure that the Democrats don't do anything that would make them appear successful.  

Eleventh hour changes are part of every single piece of legislation passed,,,, every single one.  You usually don't see it happening because it's so typical and not very interesting to the news outlets.  This bill was available in it's final form from Thursday until Sunday when it was voted on.  I know because I saw it with my own two eyes, and anyone else could have also if they'd cared to look.  

The Bill they voted on Sunday was the same Bill word for word that the Senate passed several months ago, the only thing new was attached House amendments, and again that is always typical, nothing unusual about it.

Stupak did not talk about any changes made to appease him, he talked about discussing with the White House that the Hyde doctrine would be safe guarded with an Executive Signing Order.

If you describe this as not being normal, then would you please tell in what way it was unusual?  Please explain in detail what part of the procedure was unusual.  

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by specialmom, Mar 24, 2010
Okay--------  guess you win.  You have finally convinced me that I AM an illiterate, stupid moran (but I will always disagree with the racist part).  Not sure if it makes me feel any better about how this bill went down though.  

Avatar universal
by sterling_silver, Mar 24, 2010
I might as well throw my 2 cents in.
specialmom~~~I assume you have over 50 employees. If you do, i do feel for you. But, you are going to get an18-22%
tax credit to help pay for the health insurance. I have to pay 50% of my employees health insurance by law. (under 50 employees) So, if you do the numbers, it might not be as bad as you think.
The alternative~~~~~If nothing is done with health insurance, it is going to take down the whole economy. All Democrats and Republicans agree on that. As far as Stupak goes, this is the whole story. I think you just catch bits and pieces.
OK, here goes.......Stupak is in a red district. The Republicans have as many people call him as they can, and say vote no. He says, why, I like the bill. Then they LIE and say it is going to pay for abortions. The congress and the President swear  on their mothers lives that it is not in the bill. That's why he spoke and the President signed a bill today assuring it will not now, and not ever cover abortions.So all Stupak got, was no abortions, which was not there anyway.
How in gods name can anyone blame Obama for their small business going under? I have a small business and it has been bad since the great american bank robbery that took place under Bush's watch. George Bush created the worst economy since the great depression. There was almost a run on the banks. George Bush did the first 800 billion dollar bail out. It should have been more like 1 1/2 trillion, but he knew 800 billion would avoid a depression until he left office.
What did you want Obama to do for your small business? Wave a wand.
And, no one did anything at the last minute. 99% of the bill has been on line to read for 4 months...
I believe this is what Rory is talking about. When people just blurt out the lies that are in the Republican Talking Points.
We know they didn't read anything or look anything up. They just heard it on Fox Noise or Rush Lintball

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by specialmom, Mar 24, 2010
Yes----------  it is so.  I catch things in bits and pieces from this and that and am not as versed as I should be to enter into conversation with such experts.  Point taken.  Thank you. My personal business is small and related to autos.  Cash for Klunkers was an Obama program ------  that has caused grave harm to our business.  But I've never complained about this and still don't.  I understand what he was trying to do and okay, it is not all about me.  But----------  in my case, it is pretty much his program that made our business so vulnerable.  We do  not have 50 employees and we can't afford to pay 50% of one's insurance.  I agree that something needs to be done----------  most do.  But I don't feel a part of this bill in anyway.  Okay------  that's a feeling and that doesn't count.  So shoot---------  this is that bill that no one liked and they couldn't agree on that they just pushed through anyway?  We had a congressman teetering as well in the same position as Stupak.  He's honestly in trouble next election according to our paper.  And remember--------   I don't look anything up so you guys are lucky with the lies you tell me too!!!

Avatar universal
by Rory_Nemo, Mar 24, 2010
specialmom,   that is very unfair,  if you're going to say something is not normal, eleventh hour, last minute, you have to be able to explain what you mean.  Quitting instead of explaining is the same as saying, "that's what I heard, but I can't explain it" or "that's what I think, but I don't know why I think it".

If you throw out an argument, it is respectful to explain how you came to the conclusion.  I ALWAYS include WHY I think a certain thing.  That is the only way you can reach the truth, explain why you think what you think, and ask me to explain why I think what I think if I haven't made my thoughts clear.  That is what debating the issues is. Not trading slogans and random accusations.

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by allaboutmary, Mar 24, 2010
Who told you know one liked this bill ?  FOX news ?   Democrats supported this bill and they have the majority.  I think you meant to say NO Republicans like this bill.

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by allaboutmary, Mar 24, 2010
Now the liars on the other journal are saying that children are not covered for pre-existing conditions.  They just throw what ever lie they feel like out there.......it's insane.

Avatar universal
by teko, Mar 24, 2010
Yup, lies, lies, all lies.  Go back and believe whatever it is you want to believe. Listen to the networks, or whoever you want to. Doesnt bother me at all those who want to see what they see. That is what makes the world go around. Propaganda galore...You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make him drink.


The people that are researching and learning are beginning to like what they see.  I think truly we will see more and more of this as the substance of the bill gets out.

And anyone that is participating in the horrible attacks against the dems for voting for the health bill? I hope they burn in hell.

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by adgal, Mar 24, 2010
I guess I am a really simple person, but does this bill not bring coverage to millions who otherwise would not have it?  Does that not mean lives will be saved?  I am sure the bill is not perfect, but isn't that a great start?  I don't understand why some would be so resistant to that.  What's wrong with helping the poor.  Are their lives not worth just as much as the wealthy?  Again, I know I am simple in my perspective, but it seems like a good thing to me.  Maybe there will be a cost associated, but isn't that better then spending billions to take lives in wars that should never have happened?

Avatar universal
by sterling_silver, Mar 24, 2010
Special Mom............I have some wonderful news for you. If you don't have 50 employees. NOTHING IS GOING TO CHANGE FOR YOU. If anything, your employees might stop bugging you to get them insurance, because they will be able to get it themselves. At the same prices as if you had 100 employees.  

Avatar universal
by teko, Mar 24, 2010
Well they can believe what they hear on the "NEWS", or they can go look in the bill? OH NO, that thought never occurred to them! Suckers.

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by specialmom, Mar 24, 2010
Now are you telling me that the "that's what I heard but I can't explain it" and the  "that's how I feel" argument does not work?  Don't tell my husband that!  

While I know I will be hung from the rafters and my flesh torn off piece by piece---------  here goes.  I am not an expert.  I get my news in various formats.  Current events ---  not my day job.  Clearly I am not good at debate.  None the less, I am interested and try to pay attention.  So--------  my thoughts (that I heard and can not explain)--------  the way this was voted on . . .  it was thrown back to me that the Repubicans did this 22 times, so why not?  Well if that is an argument for normal, okay ---  I guess.  23 times.  Okay.  You said all things come together in the elventh hour in Washington.  Not a fan of Washington and a bill that is leaving many unsettled (and go ahead and say it is just me and other uninformed morons-------  but it is a LOT of people).  I didn't pay as much attention to the bill that they decided to vote on this way -- I will tell you that the change of current in Mass and the set backs that the bill was having---------  I thought that a new one would be drafted.  Now THAT could have been just my own wishful thoughts talking to me but I took it all a little less seriously.  Many did-----  wasn't there a period of time that Dems feared for this bill.  And I say that neither Dems or Repbulicans like this bill Mary because you yourself said that it is not liberal enough for Dems and too much for Republicans.  So pick apart as you will what I've said.  But geez, I thought I threw in the whit flag an hour ago.

I may or may not be back as I have an ailing child and am the official puke cleaner in my home.

PS----  I think the attacks are going both ways and a LOT of people are going to end up in hell.  
PPS---------  as I said, I will educate myself on the contents of the bill.  I just have to get this bitter pill out of my mouth.  


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by specialmom, Mar 24, 2010
Well sterling silver----  that is good news.  So you are telling me nothing is going to change at all.  Can I hold you to that?

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by GA Guy, Mar 24, 2010
You know..debate is what makes this nation what it is. Regardless of the politics involved, this is still the greatest Nation in the world. I'm not going to argue this bill anymore, because it's obvious that many on here can't debate without getting personal. I've just read through these posts..and, all I can say is shame on those who resort to name calling to make a point. Using words like racist and wishing people to hell for disagreeing with you is shameful. I disagree with almost everything that President Obama has done, but I respect him. I genuinely believe that he thinks what he's doing is right for America. I disagree with his politics, but respect him and his office. For me to disagree with him makes me a racist? I'm sorry, but it only makes me an American. I think more of us should strive to be statesmen instead of Democrats or Republicans. This world would surely be a better place for it.

Avatar universal
by Rory_Nemo, Mar 24, 2010
Apparently you didn't read them well enough.  No one said a person is a racist because they disagree with Obama.  I disagree with many things he's done.   What I wrote is that the people who call him socialist, communist, Muslim, Islamic sympathizer are racists. The people who equate him to the Nazis of the 1920's and 30's are racists.

So now you can read over these posts and see it twice.



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by GA Guy, Mar 24, 2010
They don't want to know, they need some reason to hate THIS President. They are racists, and like all racists they lie, make up stuff and stick to it.  Why you ask?  Well basically most racists are cowards, they can come out and say what they really think, then you would hurt their feelings by calling them racists.

Your words.

Avatar universal
by LateAugust, Mar 24, 2010
Very well said   Ga Guy.............   you made the point so very well,   I remember when I disagreed with the Iraq war or other manuvours from Pres Bush,   I was always called a communist, regardless that my father was a WWII vet or both of my brothers served in the very unpopular viet nam war and I thought I could not be more patriatic.....      


Please let us not treat others with disrespect,  the only way I can learn is thru the experience of others.....   and those experiences that are different of what I have known.


ADGAL,  Great post...simple, perhaps.    Insightful and provoking?  Absolutely...  Thank you for simplyfiing

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by GA Guy, Mar 24, 2010
LateAugust...I'm afraid that this debate is so full of bigotry that nobody can really debate the terms. That's why a good Senate cleaning is in order!

Avatar universal
by sterling_silver, Mar 24, 2010
If it has nothing to do with Racism, why have 10 congressmen had their lives threatened. Why have 4 congress office windows been broken with rocks. Why is Sarah Palan posting to re load and has bulls eyes on her face book page.(ok, I don't hunt, cross hairs?) Are you telling me people are doing this because my premiums are going to go up a few bucks.
Noooooo GA Guy is going to say it's because the government is after us. Why is it you didn't mind that Bush stripped you of so many of your rights. Wall Street stole everyone's money. I didn't see any violence when everyones money was stolen. But, a black President is doing good. Very good. Republican stupidity made him look better. Now, your violence is making him look better. AND THE RACISTS ARE COMING OUT OF THE WOOD WORK.
Something I never understood. Why do all racists deny it? What a bunch of pussies.  

Avatar universal
by Rory_Nemo, Mar 24, 2010
Ga, Yep those are my words (at least some of my words) and I stand by them (especially if you include all my words.)

Avatar universal
by sterling_silver, Mar 24, 2010
oh dear god........I just re read my post...........I did not mean to call Ga Guy a racist.......Honest


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by GA Guy, Mar 24, 2010
You can't debate me for something I haven't said. You see, I dislike Bush for the same reasons I dislike Obama. I believe Bush set back Conservative ideals 100 years. I couldn't care less, I'm a Libertarian...so trying to bait me with the "Bush is your God" rhetoric won't work. I truly wish that the worlds problems were as easily described as you make them out to be. You say it has nothing to do with racism..yet your post is full of racist rants about how a Black President is doing good (which explains why his approval numbers are down over 35 percent I guess). The very essence of racism is pointing out someone's color...a trait that you just did. Saying that Obama is being a "good Black President" is the essence of racism. I think we should look in the mirror first before aiming it at someone else.

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by GA Guy, Mar 24, 2010
No sock puppets here, I believe in transparency.

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by specialmom, Mar 24, 2010
Well, I don't care what side of the issue you are on--------  I don't condone violence or racism.  I do live in a conservative area . . .  and we are not a bunch of kooks.  I really don't believe any of our friends or neighbors would tolerate gas lines being cut, rock throwing or racial slurs on their political behalf.  I will say that there are reports of threats coming from the left as well.   And quite frankly, with the tone that many take here-----------  I wouldn't want to stand in front of them when they are holding a rock . . .

Avatar universal
by sterling_silver, Mar 24, 2010
You better check the new polls.  In any case. Everyone knows what they are.
I love the fact that all the racists are going crazy over this.

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by GA Guy, Mar 24, 2010
I agree specialmom LOL I understand passion..but violence is beyond belief. I love debating..and I'm guilty of needling people, but it's all in good fun. The fact is that this crap is coming from both sides...and they both should be ashamed. We all have a vote coming up in November..that's the place to voice yourself. I'm amazed at how may people I debate with on this stuff don't even vote. Now that's shameful!

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by GA Guy, Mar 24, 2010
All polls bump after a media flurry. Kind of like the poll bumps after the State of the Union or National Conventions. They always normalize within a week or so.

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by adgal, Mar 24, 2010
I want to give kudos to Mary for how she is handling this journal.  There are other journals posted out there where if you write an opposing view, someone hits the delete button.  Mary, good for you for letting opposing views stand.  It shows you truly believe what you say!

I am not American, so I am getting my info only through the news.  Actually, not only the US news stations, it's all over the International news.  Even our local papers are talking about the violence and complete and total ignorance taking place over this.  It seems it is primarily the right though. Not hearing much about the left.  And I did watch the debate....only heard one voice screaming things like "baby killer".  Doesn't paint a very nice picture with the international community...if that matters to you.

Avatar universal
by sterling_silver, Mar 24, 2010
Great observation adgal. A few months ago, it looked like the Dem's were going to get crushed in the midterms. Now, it looks like the Republicans are scrambling. They don't know what to do. The Republicans bank on the racist vote. They are shooting themselves in the foot.

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by GA Guy, Mar 24, 2010
Good observations. "The Republicans bank on the racist vote" is a step down on the cognitive ladder from "Your Mama".

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by specialmom, Mar 24, 2010
Well, our international reputation has had issues for a long time.  Honestly, while I couldn't say I don't care about that----  I don't think it is our primary concern right at this minute.   I would never condone violence and think some must be losing their minds to think that would help.  But it does speak to the desperate feeling some have.  I know you don't understand it.  To some, it feels like freedom is being taken away.  Their right to NOT have insurance is gone.  Big deal, right?  But in a country of freedoms--------  some see that as a big deal.  But such actions as those mentioned are not the answer.  No one listens once it gets to name calling let alone crazy actions.  

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by GA Guy, Mar 24, 2010
Yeah, unfortunately, the name calling and violence gets in the way of good debate. It's always the case when individual freedoms come under fire. Hopefully this crap will stop and the voting public can settle the issue.

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by GA Guy, Mar 24, 2010
Oh well I'm off to bed. Feel free to call my Libertarian butt anything you want now :)

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by adgal, Mar 24, 2010
Specialmom, I hear what you are saying.  However, if you look at having to have health insurance as a loss of freedom, what about all the other things you have to pay into.  Are you allowed to be exempt from social insurance or unemployment insurance?  Do you not have to buy car insurance for that matter?  What about taxes?  I suppose all of these things could be considered a loss of freedom.  The reality is that this bill will save lives.  Does it not anger you that you could pay your health insurance premiums for years, then be dropped because you got ill and became "too expensive"?  That doesn't seem fair to me.

Here is what truly confuses me about all the hub around this bill.  Your former president bombed the heck out of another country for no apparant reason. He spent millions or more to do this and cost the US military many lives (sorry, I don't know the numbers).  He put you into debt, almost to the point of another depression.  He did an incredible amount of damage to your reputation internationally. He literally threatened other countries into backing him and joining him in this war, so cost God knows how many more lives internationally. Your new president is far from perfect I am sure.  However, from what I can see, it would seem he is at least trying to do what is in the best interest of the majority.  Yet it is he that is being raked over the coals?  He is called names and the Republicans that backed Bush claim to be patriots? A potential live saving bill creates violence and such anger?  He has received far more death threats then your former president according to what I have heard on the news.  Forgive my confusion, but none of this makes sense. You already have many programs that you pay into through your taxes to serve the less fortunate.  Welfare for one.  I guess I am having a hard time understanding the difference.  To me it would seem this bill was necessary....I just don't hear anyone on the right talking about the fact that people (children included) were dying!  I cannot think of a better way to spend money. It will save lives.  And the time may come for many who are complaining where they will be happy to have that coverage they didn't in the past.  And be very happy that their insurance company could no longer drop them or cap them because they had the audacity to get ill and actually want to collect on all those premiums.  Again, I know I take a simplistic view of things, but where is the common sense?

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by adgal, Mar 25, 2010
Watching CNN and am prompted to make one more comment.  Sarah Palin has posted targets or crosshairs or whatever on her facebook page.  And this is someone that many consider a serious Presidential candidate in the next election...seriously?  I'm sorry, maybe I have no right to comment as a non American, but I am completely and thorougly confused.  What the heck is going on in that party??  The violence is bad enough, but now some of the Republican politicians are doing things to encourage it?  And she might become president?  God help the world if that happens.

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by allaboutmary, Mar 25, 2010
This journal was created to correct some lies being spread in someone else's journal.  We could not debate with these people. They would just delete our posts.

Specialmom,  I give you a lot of credit for posting here and admitting that you weren't completely informed about the health care bill. You seem like a genuine person.  The others that are spreading the lies don't want to debate. It isn't good enough to just spread these lies in their Patriot forum. They had to continuously junk up the side bar with their hatred. So I decide to fight back with the truth in my journal. They think that just continuously repeating the lies will make them true.  I understand many are misinformed as to whats in this health care bill, but these same people have been spewing hatred for Obama personally for a long time.  I have no doubt many of them are, in fact racist. None of them have posted on this journal because racism is impossible to defend.

We might seem a bit angry here, but it doesn't even compare to the anger and hatred on the other journals.

Sorry if I repeated myself. It's 3 in the morning and I haven't had any coffee yet.

Avatar universal
by teko, Mar 25, 2010
Allabout mary, Yeah I saw that too, they heard on the news, no pre existing coverage for children or adults till 2014? LOL, It really would help to just read the bill, wanna take bets on which news channel? READ!

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by allaboutmary, Mar 25, 2010
Copy & paste

It's true there is a fine if you don't buy insurance. But it isn't a $750 fine. It starts with a rather modest $95 fine in 2014 when the exchanges begin, and would increase if the individual refuses to buy insurance, year after year. But why is an individual mandate important? Because if everyone is not in the "pool", then only the old and sick remain, and premiums go up. It's a basic principle of insurance - the young help the old; the sick help the healthy; the good drivers help the bad ones. You simply can't live in society where everyone gets to do exactly what they want all the time. Besides - if you get sick and need health care, even if you can't pay for it, someone else will. So refusing to buy insurance is basically a selfish act

Avatar universal
by teko, Mar 25, 2010
specialmom, even tho we may not agree for whatever reasons, I am glad to see you here.

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by moonpiebaby, Mar 25, 2010
All this is makeing my head hurt...God help us all!!!!

Avatar universal
by Rory_Nemo, Mar 25, 2010
The best advice I could give you,,,,, If it's making your head hurt, avoid it.  And God, if You're not to  busy working on someone's headache,  I'm doing pretty well so You can concentrate on those important issues, like headaches and doom wisher's wishes, and thanks for all You've done for me already.

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by ILADVOCATE, Mar 25, 2010
Yes I agree with the original post that if people have any specific concerns they should read through before commenting on them. This is the summary of it that has links to the entire text itself and specific questions answered about it:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/healthreform/summary

Avatar universal
by LateAugust, Mar 25, 2010
I really don't want to be redundant here regarding this topic,  and repeat myself one more time,   so  what happened with the thread regarding this same subject on the " Addiction- Social Forum"  last night????     Apparently I am the naive one,  I viewed the thread as a constructive debate amongst rational adults... some  a bit emotional, some not...   why was it removed???    Was it not an option for MH to move it to Current Events, In the News  or another Forum??

Sorry Mary to put this/my comment on your journal, however was not sure of where or whom to ask,  and to state how absolutely insane I think it is for a thread to be removed because  we are all not in unison singing "Brother Loves Traveling Salvation Show"....  it would just be nice to be treated as an adult.....    omg   not all will ever be in constant agreement.

I just don't get it.

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by allaboutmary, Mar 25, 2010
I posted some snip-its (on the addiction social) from the health care bill early this morning. Just to try and get some true facts out there. Then came back on a few hours later and it was all gone.  It sure didn't seem that any of the post were to out of line.  I guess we need to end all posts by singing Kumbaya.

Oh, and feel free to post in my journal anytime.  I always enjoy reading your posts. Your always sweet and level-headed.

Avatar universal
by vicki595, Mar 25, 2010
To: LateAugust and Mary~~
Hi~  I noticed the post on the social forum was deleted,as well.  I really didn't find it offensive or feel offended reading it.
There was a healthy,well articulated debate going on...in my opinion.  I did some rooting around and caught up with Rory_Nemo's journal.   The explanation is there as he was contacted by Emily of MH.  So..."Pack up the babies and grab the old ladies" and read his journal.

All the best to everyone~

Vicki

Avatar universal
by vicki595, Mar 25, 2010
OOOPS...not the journal...it's a post on his profile page.  But,the journal is very interesting and a lovely read.   :)

V.

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