Burning nerve endings for back relief HELP?

Hello,

My pain radiates from under my right shoulder blade, to under my rib cage in front.  Hurts worse when I sit.  Tried a block but it didnt work.  Now they want to do some sort of nerve burning on T6-10.  Has any one ever had this done?

What should I expect?

Thank YOu

[Shellshocker]

Hi Brucer, I'm also going for the nerve burning for back pain relief from my pain management doc.  I had one diagnostic block done which only lasted about 5 mins (I actually think I was pain free durring that time due to all the happy drugs they had given me),  I am scheduled for diagnostic test number 2 on the 3rd of next month.  Now per my doc they have to do atleast 2-3 diagnostic blocks before they decide if burning will work. Has your doc done more then one test yet?

[mike1105]

BRUCE-- I HAD THIS.  I AM FINE NOW.  I BELIEVE THIS COMES FROM MUSCLE SPASM of  muscles under and around the scapula, specifially the serratus muscle and perhaps other scapular stabilizers. The fix for me was heat, trigger point/myofascial release, and then stretching the tight muscles with constant attention to posture correction. I also did plenty of mid back exercises to stenghten the rhomboids and my core. I worked on myself for 1 hour at a time, 3 times per day for 2-3 months before i got relief. Muscles have a stubborn memory. This is why massage feels great for an hour, and then the muscles go back to where they were and start hurting again. If you have forward head posture, or hunched posture from computer use, for example, you can develop something called Upper Crossed Syndrome which basically means a short tight group of muscles and a weak group of counter muscles are out of balance. This can wreak havoc on the upper torso, cause neck pain, arm symptoms, shoulder problems etc. I had the pain under and around the scapula and the tingling and burning under and around my nipple, and on my side. Gone.
You might want to Get a book by Clair Davies called the "trigger point manual" and go to town. I cant tell you not to have your nerves "burnt" but I certainly can tell you that if it was me I wouldn't do that in a million years.  I would bet my last dollar you are suffering from either an overuse injury or a muscle imbalance of some sort.tretments for both are similar. Look up Upper and Lower Crossed Syndrome on the internet.

[Brucergoldberg]

thank you.  Im going to see a chiropractor again tomorrow and then will decide.  DId you have any back pain?  or mainly front?

[lissavalenz]

Hi Bruce  I had radio frequency nerve ablation done on my neck, mid-back and lower-back due to a broken back and several other smaller injuries along my spine that cause me a lot of pain.  Yes, they do have to do two sets of diagnostics, but it's for insurance purposes.  Leave it to insurance to make them do something twice!  Yeah, but the happy juice is good. Right!  Anyway, the radio frequency burns off the nerves and it does work......after a while.  My husband had it done also for his lower back and he was fine right away.  I, on the other hand, went through a month of burning pain and then I suddenly felt perfect.  I woke up one morning and it was all worth it.  I know its hard to believe, but it's true.  All I have to say is, make sure that you have pain killers for the month afterwards, just in case.  Word to the wise.

[Brucergoldberg]

I had it done yesterday.  When I came out of the procedure i felt like I had a knife stuck in my back next to my lung.  I was begging for morphine.   I went home and slept about 4 hours.  I woke up and felt OK, not as bad as before.  The rest of my day yesterday was ok.  Then this morning I wake up and my back hurts all over.  Not just where they did it, but the opposite side as well.  Sheer misery..  Went back to the Dr. today and told her what was going on.  She told me that it will take 3 weeks for the pain to go away.  I am in chronic pain now.  I hope this works..  ANyone else?

[Connie716]

I  went through all the shots every other month to try to stop the pain in my left arm and neck. They did not work. Had the first nerve block test done. I woke up in such pain they kept injecting me with pain meds. I thought I was paralized couldn't move for awhile. went home after 2.5 hours swore never do that again. Went through that and still in pain ended up having 3 disc fusion been almost a year and having severe headaches and pain still there. I just want to feel nornal again and I can't see it :(

[Brucergoldberg]

hey everyone...  quick update.  my burning of the back nerves was a great success..  no more back pain!  i can tell it would flare up and hurt, but since the nerves are gone i feel no pain.  good luck

[lissavalenz]

That's great news Bruce!  I guess your nerves in your back are just like mine....they don't like to die quietly.  Mine went out kicking and screaming just like yours did.  I'm glad that you are feeling better and are able to get some relief from the procedure.

Best of luck in the future,

LissaValenz

[graceg1962]

My 18 year old son is having his nerves in his lumbar section of his back burned on 2/8/11.  He has had PT, 5 epidurals, 2 nerve blocks & has taken so many narcotics & muscle relaxers it is unreal.  His Neurosurgeon does not want to do a back fusion yet because he is still growing.  So his pain management dr is doing the burning of the nerves for now.  The 2 blocks did VERY LITTLE for his back pain but, did stop the pain that had gone to his left leg.  How long does it take to recover from this procedure?  He has been homebound since Oct 20th, 2010 &origionaly hurt it 3 years ago playing football.  He has Spondylosis & Spondylolisthesis & a burging disc.  As a mother I am very worried about everything that the drs do to his back but, I can't stand to see him suffer like he has been doing & I'm afraid of him becoming adicted to the pain killers.  Please let me know ANYTHING that you know about this procedure & it's recovery time plus anything you know about spinal fusion.  Thank you!

[Brucergoldberg]

grace,   send me a private message and you can call me.  DOnt worry, its a simple procedure.  SOre for 2 days and then the pain goes away.  I do not get any pain there anymore and its been 3 months now.  The first one i had lasted 4 months.  This one should last further.  also check with the insurance to make sure its all covered.  mine tried to stick me with the anethesia bill..   said it wasnt necessary.  

Its a 'cold water rhizotomy"  if you want to look it up.  I didnt even need the pain meds they gave me for afterwards.  

BRuce

[atonicat]

I had the RFA done on my left lumbar spine at four levels on the 7th of this month. The procedure itself is no different than the epidurals or blocks except they are burning nerves (the actually burning does not hurt as they numb the nerves first). The night I had it done and the next morning my back burned a little but nothing a heating pad could not fix. I did not take any pain medication at all. My back pain now is the same as before the procedure but it could take a few weeks to start working. Normally they give you steroids to help boost the process as well.

I just want to say that RFA is not a solution. It's only temporary and if it's successful than he may need to get them every few months depending on how long they work. Success rates are also different for everyone. He could get 100% relief or none. It's impossible to predict how much relief it will bring.

[Brucergoldberg]

TRUE....  it doesnt work on everyone.  but it did work on me :)

[PPNH]

The reason this trigger point is so excruciatingly painful when activated is because it is wedged between two bones, the rib and the scapula.

[PPNH]

I'm a masseuse who has been in private practice for 23 years and I know your problem well - it's common and I know the pain can be excruciating. First let me explain what's going on, where, and what you can do to relieve the pain. It's really quite simple.

What you have is called an active trigger point. The reason it's difficult to get at is because it's located in the serratus posterior superior muscle and the trigger point is under the shoulder blade.

If you have a masseuse work on this problem you must lay on your side so your arm hangs forward so your scapula (shoulder blade) moves out of the way. You can relieve the pain yourself by laying on a tennis or golf ball while you lay on your back on the floor with your knees bent. Your arm must be positioned across your chest so your shoulder blade moves out of the way. Place the balls underneath the sore spot and let your body weight add the pressure.

I shared my knowledge on this specific problem in another blog and people responded with great enthusiasm. Many had been in pain for years and had been to numerous specialists and had all the tests but to no avail. But when they targeted the active trigger point with tennis balls the relief was immediate. Some people stood against the wall and applied the tennis balls and one person did it in the shower. Moist heat (the most penetrating)  is a good idea and in my practice I use a moist heating pad with a damp face cloth.

Remember to place your arm across your body to move the shoulder blade out of the way.

[Brucergoldberg]

Ppnh, where are you located?

[PPNH]

I'm in California.

[avondalemom]

my son is going in today to have the nerves burnt.  The insurance wont pay for pain meds so they said he has to do it without.  Is this procedure painful?
He is almost 18 and was hit by a car when he was 13. the guy who hit him ran but my son has been in major pain every since.

We are extrremely nervous about the procedure.

[Brucergoldberg]

they wont pay for the pain meds???  you mean during the procedure?  YES you cannot have this done without being put out.  Its a rhizotomy??  

[nsx_mark]

I went golfing the other day and woke up the next morning with the burning upper back and a weird sunburn like sensation on my left arm, back and chest..It has been three days and it is still there...unfortunately it is a 3 day weekend and my chiro/masseuse are not open..I just tried the ball technique with one of my kids jumbo super balls and it felt great...Thanks for the advise, hopefully this horrible pain will go away soon...

BTW, I'm in Temecula Ca, any masseuse recommendations???

[PPNH]

Thank you. I'm glad it felt great. I'm sorry I don't know any masseuses in Temecula but I recommend you use golf balls for a more focused approach. I'm sorry you're suffering. Please don't give up trying to heal yourself - you can do it.

Good luck !

[Brucergoldberg]

mine was from being hypothryoid.  Confusing, but at the time i had no idea why i had such horrible back pain.  Turns out it was from the beginning of the end of my thyroid.

[PPNH]

I'm not convinced your problem was due to a hypothyroid condition but I would need to know more information. The reason I am not convinced is because your pain pattern was so specific to having an aggravated trigger point in your serratus posterior superior muscle and when you wrote that the pain was made worse when you sit I suspect you were leaning back against the chair which squeezes the active trigger point between the rib and shoulder blade. Ouch!

But I guess we'll know for sure if the pain should ever return once your thyroid is successfully treated.

Nonetheless, I'm glad you're feeling better and I wish you the best of health.

[PPNH]

I'm changing my course. There is a possibility that your trigger point was activated by your thyroid condition. I think that is what you may have been implying.

[Amylynn23]

I had my left side s2-l5 burned I keep getting trigger points that hurt so bad, and it has been a week now and it has continued to get worse ever single day. I have no clue what to do next all I know is I want a 2 ND opinion, I can't bend, cross my legs, pick up my kids or even lay comfortably in bed, any suggestions what could help.

[PPNH]

Oh, how tough! Here is a start.

If you can't cross your legs your gluteus minimum muscle is responsible.

If you can't bend forward, roll over in bed or if you have difficulty climbing stairs, getting out of a chair and standing hurts the quadratus lumborum muscles is responsible. Let's hope you don't suffer from allergies and that you don't have a cold because sneezing and coughing can be extremely painful. As you have already discovered, there is no position in which you are comfortable and the pain makes it difficult to move.

Get yourself a lumbar support, tennis balls, a moist heating pad and a damp face cloth. Treat your gluteus minimus when you are laying on your side and place a king size pillow between your legs when you are in bed.

[PPNH]

If you have activated  trigger points in your quaratus lumborim muscles it is not unusual for the gluteus minimus muscle to become involved because this muscle lies in the same pain reference zone.

To stretch the left quadratus lumborum muscle when you are lying on your side bring your arm up over head to pull up the rib cage. Place a pillow under your waist. Swing your left leg in front and and let it hang off the bed. Have your husband gently push back against your chest

Then place your left leg behind you (dangling off the bed). Your arm is stretched above in front of your head to pull up the rib cage. Ask your husband to apply gentle pressure on your upper body that is aimed up and forward.  Your bottom leg stays bent on the table.

The idea is to separate the last ribs from the crest of the ilium where this muscle attaches.

A lumbar support should be used only at the start of pain as long time use will weaken your muscles.

Good luck !

[kyle91]

Im going to have this procedure done i went for the first diagnostic shots second ones are in a couple days i hope this works I'm 28 and an auto mechanic cant do my job with this pain,. And have spent alot money on facet joint injections and trigger point injections. I'm prayin this works I need my life back. Is this procedure pricy.

[Brucergoldberg]

worked great for me.  relatively painless.   tell your doc that you want drugs within seconds of waking up from the procedure.  Tell them you want morphine within 3 feet of the bed when they wake you up.  

[AmyJo724]

Hi, I have been very active in High School doing a lot of sports and now i have been having lower back pain and pain on my left side from my lower back to my shoulder for about 11 years now and have been to several doctors and all of them but one hasnt believed me (b/c im 28 now) the one ive been going to now is doing a lot more but they gave me a steroidal epidural and that didnt help, they have me on an anti inflammatory and a muscle relaxer and it isnt helping at all...they did talk about burning nerves in my lower back and i am so scared its going to hurt..they had to give me xanax for the epidural b/c i hate needles..my question is..does it hurt that bad and is there anything they can do besides burning the nerves to relieve the pain? (if it isnt 100% effective) i am tired of dealing with this back pain (i have a very active 2 year old that i cant play with) i know i should just "suck it up" and get the procedure done with the burning of nerves but i dont want to do it and put myself through the anxiety of it if it isnt going to work. Thanks.

[Brucergoldberg]

you are in Belle chasse?    Yeah ya right baby!!    I am from algiers originally.  My best childhood friend had a restaurant in Belle chase for 40 years Tom and Jerrys.  Do you know the Hodnetts?

anyways, the procedure is a piece of cake.  If you are having such back pain, the procedure is in and out.  You have it done and go home.  Then for the next couple of days you gradually feel better.  It sounds a lot worse than it is.  When my Doctor told me about it, my next question was "how soon can we do it".  The hardest part was the first couple hours after surgery, i have not had back pain since.   bruce

[shipdog7]

After exhausting the epidural shots for lower back pain I had the Radiofrequency Rhizotomy procedure done. Both sides. It took away the horrible nerve pain. Pain that wouldn't allow me to stand upright. Much less walk. After three weeks I still have pain in my right buttocks. I can't stand for more than a few minutes without pain which feels like it is coming from the lower back area. Maybe arthritis? I was diagnosed with degenerative disk disease at one point in time. The neurosurgeon twice reviewed my MRI's and said I didn't need disk surgery. Any advice would be very welcomed.

[PPNH]

I'm sorry to hear that you are suffering.

If you are having difficulty standing upright your rectus abdominis muscle and/or the and psoas muscles are spasming. These muscles act as flexors - they bend you forwards.

The Cobra position in yoga is an excellent stretch for the abdomens rectus muscle. Just make sure that you are doing it correctly. Your pelvis must stay firm on the floor and your arms must be positioned under your shoulders.  

Years ago when I first started my massage practice I had a new client who came in bent over. He could not stand up straight. He told me he experienced pain in his lower back so those were the muscles I massaged. After the massage when he got up to leave I saw that he was still bent over. What I had done didn't help. I went running to my books and I spoke to someone whose husband had the exact same problem and this is what I learned.

The problem was his is psoas muscles were spasming. And this is the cure. Lay on your back with your knees bent. Keeping the soles of your feet together and your knees bent let your knees fall apart. Place pillows under the outside of your knees so that when you feel a gentle stretch you can relax into that position. The husband in question stayed in this position for 20 minutes then got off the table and walked away like nothing had happened.

Good luck!

[hemyinspain]

I would bet you possibly have a CSF leak causing your headaches.  I hope this is not the case as getting a diagnosis of this is extremely difficult.  I dont know where you are located but if you are in the US I would recommend you go to visit Dr. Linda Gray.  She is amazing at finding and fixing CSF leaks following spinal surgery and spontaneous spinal CSF leaks.  I have what I believe a CSF leak following spinal surgery and two repair surgeries to fix the leak.  I am pretty sure I am still leaking.  I am now about to go in to have the nerves to my coccyx burnt, I am not sure what this proceedure is exactly and have no idea what to expect.  I also now have 4 further disc protrusions and severe back and leg pain with loss of feeling and burning sensation in my right leg.

[Brucergoldberg]

a fellow thyroid friend of mine had a csf leak.   very rare thing, very hard to diagnose..  but they fixed her..