First ob appt., doc stressing unlikeliness of another VBAC

[LosingMyMindInGA]

OK, so I had my first OB appt today.  It was with a doc I've never been too.  I'm not sure I'll be going back.  First, they did the pee test which of course was positive.  But with all the blood they drew they didn't order a BETA HCG??!?!  That aside....the doc gave me this long song and dance about some paper the ACOG put our a couple years ago stressing the risks of VBAC etc.  Doc said her Husband (also obgyn in her practice) is the one who does the deliveries so I would have to talk to him about VBAC.  He said he would TRY to work with me on it but couldn't gaurantee, especially if I went into labor during a time another DOC was on call.  WTF???  I've had FOUR successful VBACS, my c-section was over 13 years ago.  I have had NO complications, short labors and even one of my VBACS was an induction.  I told DH that I am NOT have an elective c-section.  If I show up at the hospital and they tell me I have to have one, I'll say no thanks and come home and have the kid myself.  

One of the downsides to smalltown life...not a lot of options.  My other two avenus are to a) go back to my old doc.  He let me do VBAC no problem.  The only thing I didn't like about his practice was that you always felt a little rushed, but other than that everything was great.  OR b) I can try and find a midwife, but I don't know where to begin or if there are even any around here.  I also don't know if my insurance and medicaid (if it's approved) will cover one.  

I REFUSE to be forced into major surgery becuase of some insurance risk catagory.  This just makes me so freaking mad.  I could maybe understand them associating higher risks with someone who had never done a VBAC or had and had complications...but come on...FOUR successful VBACS...this is ridiculous.

Anyway, doc was gonna do a quick ultrasound but the settings on her machine had been screwed up and she couldn't see anything.  She was gonna have the ultrasound tech do it, but the lady had just left for lunch so they scheduled me for 21st for one.  I still have an appt with my old doc for monday.  I may just reschedule that appt for a little further out and just transfer back to him.  

I am SOOOOO freakin mad right now.  

[LosingMyMindInGA]

Thanks....If I have to I will drive the 45 mins to an hour to Warner Robins or Macon to see someone there who will....they have bigger, higher risk hospitals there that are more likely to allow a VBAC.  I have also finally found atleast ONE midwife there as well....so if all else fails I'll go that route.  

One thing that really concerns me though is this healthcare bill the senate is "behind closed doors" with.  There's no telling WHAT is in there that will affect those of us who are pregnant or TTC.

[Victoria01]

I really hope you do find a doc that will do the VBAC. I have never had a c-section, but I do know that vaginal birth is less stressful on mom and baby and since you have already had 4 VBACs, then I really don't understand (except for the stupid government and insurance stuff) why it would be a problem this time. Good luck and I really hope you can get what you want without having to force the issue. :)

[LosingMyMindInGA]

LauraB:  Just a side note, I do understand your point and I'm not trying to argue either, just throwing out my side of it.  I DO agree that our government is too involved in EVERYTHING and this new healthcare bill is only going to make things that much worse.  

30something13:  I agree completely.  It's just stupid

Ashelen:  The midwife thing is out of the question...there aren't any within a hundred miles of me that I have found thusfar.  I know I have the right to refuse the c-section and I have the right to refuse to sign any paper work and the hospital can not refuse me care becuase it's partially goverment funded.  If it comes down to it that is what I will do.  

I am going to keep my appt with my old ob on monday and see waht he says.  When he did my last vbac everyone was surprised becuase they all said that NONE of the docs around here did them.  But i don't think most women are as pushy and persistant as i am LOL.  IF for some reason he will not agree to it then I have a doc in the next county that has potential so I will go see her.  I have also considered the waiting as long as i can to go in, which i usually do anyway....more comfortable to labor at home :)  I'll let everyone know what the doc says monday

[LosingMyMindInGA]

I DO understand the flip side and I know all about the malpractice insurance and everything else.  I AM sympathetic to that....but it does NOT mean I have to be OK With them wanting to CUT ME OPEN for NO reason at all.  I AM upset with the docs...but i know in most cases their hands are tied....but I don't see most of the DOCS out there fighting against the ACOG's insanely strict restrictions on things or the insurance companies outrageous premiums.  Rather than fight it so that their patients can receive the best care possible...they sit back and take it and just eliminate certain services so they don't have to worry with it.  

[Ashelen]

I just want to chip in that although I had an OB (whom I wasn't crazy about) I only had a pulse monitor on my finger because I have tachycardia and the epidural in my spine....there were no other monitors strapped to me...and I was allowed to push as I felt the need. The nurses and even the doctor were very adamant about me pushing as I felt it was right. When I pushed the last few times the doctor kept saying "when you feel it's right, push, I'm right here, I'm not going anywhere, and we'll have this baby soon if you keep pushing so well!" but not once did he say "push now!" Anyway....

that being said, I do believe doctors make the wrong call because they're too focused on legalities and politics. It's always best to research your OB's c-section rates vs. vaginal deliveries, and if you get a percentage comparison lower than that of the national average, you've probably found a good OB. if it's equal or higher than the national average and you're not high risk, you may want to find another OB before you end up with an unnecessary c-section.

LosingMyMindInGA::::: I really hope you find a doctor who can do this for you. It's absolutely ridiculous that they won't let you Vbac after success and time....but doctors are scared now, and admitted a vbac does carry risks. I'm still hoping that they come to their senses though, because a successful VBAC is far safer than a c-section, even though it initially carries more risks. You could always wait until the labor is too far progressed before rushing in (sit in the car and wait LOL) so they dont have time for a c-section....but that's a really bad idea LOL. Or you could look for a midwife who specializes in VBACS? I dunno but good luck!

[LauraB78]

I wasn't trying to debate, and not to be rude, but I cannot understand half of what you wrote due to misspellings.. It was just MY opinion.. And blame the big & growing government if you want to place blame. Our government is too involved in EVERYTHING!

[30something13]

medicain si nothing but practice so of course you will have insurance and risk all dr's know this going in! They make it harder on themselves when they allow the hospital and insurance and government in the name of statistics and money for medicain and science dictate waht is best for us!

[30something13]

thought I would add that I am not against dr's at all! I beleive in them when it is medically nessisary. I had a c-section done by emergency to save my baby as she was not moving or breathing. She was born three days after my water broke and I was in the hospital at 30 weeks along. They tried to keep her in as long as they could. She went to moving to not miving in 20 min. They had jsut unhooked me from the fetla monitor. That is a good reason to have a surgeon! But it si wrong to have one to be forced when it can harm you and your baby! You should not have pity and say "Oh well theyhave it hard too so I will shut my mouth and understand and just play along and hope my baby comes out OK and I can still have children" I do not think so!

[30something13]

Actually it has nothing to do with statues!!! It is hospital by hospital and dr by dr decision and as surgeons the addministrator stes to them what the hospital will allow!

The US ranks country #41 out of like 60 som countries. SOrry not to have the exact number but the US us FAR behind other countries in the safty of labor and delivery and hias a very high death rate for mother and baby becasue of what they choose to do! They are unsafe and they make their decisions based on politics! They are surgeons not delivering dr's! birth is natural not medical! Labor and delievery rooms are not equiped for a natural birth! Lots make you stay in bed and that will slow labor down and also make it harder on the mother! They strap all kinds of UNNESSISARY devices to you that are not nessisary! They will cath you to make you stay in bed. They tell you how to push and when instead of allowing your body call the shots! There is only one side to hear on this and that is the side of safty!!!! The dr's do not do what is safe most of the time. MArk that there are some good dr's out there and they love to deliever babies and really make the difference but they are far inbetween and it si up to us mothers to learn and stand up for our rights and safty of us and our babies!

[LauraB78]

I understand you are frustrated, but I actually have 2 close friends that are physicians. One is an OB, and one is a GP, but he does deliver babies when needed.You would possibly be a little more understanding of some of the statutes if you were the PHYSICIAN having to deal with insurances and malpractice worries. You would throw up if you knew the expense of malpractice insurance, and in our OVERLY litigious society with MANY people robbing the state and being on unnecessary aid, the statutes have become what they are almost 100% due to frivolous law suits. I am hoping your Dr. that performed your other VBAC wil make an exception for you, I am not trying to argue with you, I am just explaining that there is a flip side to this situation. Take a look around, even more closely at some of those that partcipate on here, and you will see that our insurance companies, government funding, and Doctors have NO choice but to protect themselves because it seems today's society has a real sense of "entitlement." It used to be horrible medical accidents (any accidents, really) would happen and people would understand and try to move on in the face of tragedy and adversity, but now if there in (G-d forbid) any type of incident of ANY kind, people sue.. I think that is why so many rules are changing, because society forces it to. Anyway, that is just my opinion, and I wish you nothing but the best of luck. And please, please don't take this the wrong way. I DO believe in your case a VBAC would be a great option, and I hope that happens for you!

[LosingMyMindInGA]

Well the lady from the hospital here called me back.  She said that the hospital doesn't have a "ban" so to speak on the VBACS but no physicians around here would do them.  I mentioned that my doctor induced me and I had a vbac in 08 and she was like "oh really?".   I made the comment that I understood it was an insurance thinga nd she was like "oh no it's not, it's that we're not a high risk facility"  WHATEVER.  But basically she said the hospital doesn't have an official ban on, that they HAVE done them (her exampled was someone coming in too far into labor to do one) but they prefer not to.  I'm going to keep my appt with my old doc that I have scheduled for Monday.  When I called I talked to the lady who answered, probably a receptionist.  While his OFFICIAL policy may be no VBACS, I'm HOPING he will make an exception for me since he has already done one for me.  I guess we will see monday.  If he says no I will be checking with the doctor in the next county.    this really blows!!!!   I just may be making DH take a crash course in delivering a baby LOL

[LosingMyMindInGA]

it's not just my doc, it's ALL docs around here.

[Michele, Katy, TX]

Hey Girl, I didn't read all of the responses, but VBACs are becoming more and more common; especially since you have had 4!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Geez!!!!!!!!!!!!!  I have watched a TON of labor and delivery shows on Discovery Health and I always hear the same thing no matter what doctor.  It depends on what type of cut you had w/ you c-section.  Most of the people that are not candidates for VBACs are those who had CS many years ago because they used to do the cut vertically but now do it horizontally.  You probably already know all of this, I am just agreeing w/ you in that your doctor is an idiot!!!

[LosingMyMindInGA]

Exactly.  It's bull crap.  I understand there are situations where a VBAC is more risky than a repeate section.  But in my situation it's NOT.  My c-section was done by a low-transverse incision which has a significantly lower risk for rupture,  it will have been 14 years since I had mine by the time this one comes.  I have had 4 successful vbacs, it's just ridiculous to think that I don't have any other options.  

I can tell you right now I am going to push, fight, kick, scream and make a HUGE scene if I have to I REFUSE to have an unnecessary surgery.

[UmYusra]

OMG this is like saying don't have more children or else be prepared and accept c-section as the only option avaliable. I'm just  SPEECHLESS !!!!

[LosingMyMindInGA]

No i had an overall good experience with my c-section, as well as could have been expected.  The reasons I am against ELECTIVE, UNNECESSARY c-sections are becuase a) becuase they ARE considered major surgery there are higher risks of infection, placental issues in the future, need for hysterectomy, risks of the doctor cutting your bladder, risks of future infertility, the list goes on and those are just for the mother.  There are increased risks for the infant: doctor accidently cutting the infant, respiratory issues and several others.  b) I don't believe any woman should be FORCED into anything simply because some "Association" and "insurance companies" out there say its a malpractice risk.  I also don't believe in women being forced into something simply to pad a doctors pockets (c-sections cost more) or make it convenient for the doctors schedule.  I also think it's unethical for doctors to make up stuff to put in peoples charts to make it LOOK like they needed a c-section when in reality they didn't.  

C-sections require a much longer recovery period. It's a heckuva lot more painful.  With vaginal birth the pain (unless you have a bad tear or other complications) goes away almost instantly after completing the birthing process.  With a c-section the pain remains.  

At this point there is ABSOLUTELY NO MEDICAL reason for me to be required to have an elective c-section.  It has been almost 14 years since the one i had, my body heals well from everything.  I have had FOUR extremely successful VBACS without a SINGLE complication.  Of those VBACS 2 were with epidurals, 1 was natural and 1 was induced with pitocin and had an epidural.  Obviously my body has proved the risks are extremely minimal in my case...no more so than that of the general population giving birth vaginally.

This country has the HIGHEST c-section rate in the WORLD.  Doctors are cutting women more and more for stupid reasons: keeping insurance premiums down, making their schedule easier, becuase c-sections don't take as long as labor, and even becuase some women would rather have the convenience of a "scheduled" delivery.   I just think it's WRONG to take away a womans options without any medical necessity.  

[LauraB78]

I feel for you & your situation. I just wanted to let you know there are NO doctors anywhere in my area that will perform VBAC's either. VBAC's are sort-of a touchy subject, and because of the risks, past successes or not, I think they will be a thing of the past in the upcoming years? I understand a c-section is major surgery, but it is also pretty routine. Why are you so against a c-section? Did you have a bad experience with yours?

[LosingMyMindInGA]

Martika:  you summed it up "these doctors are idiots"

So I check out the ICAN website.  I know that I can refuse a c-section and that they can't refuse to treat me if i won't sign something.  This hospital accepts medicaid which makes it partially state funded.  Therefore they can NOT turn me away regardless.  BUT there's nothing stopping them from making my stay h-e-ll.  I mean, yeah, I could turn around and file a complaint...but it won't take away the stress and anxiety while i'm in labor.  

I called my old ob's office and askeda bout their VBAC policy and was told "they won't do them at the hospital here"  According to ICAN the hospital in the next county (about 35 mins away) does allow them and there's an obgyn down there that has actually coauthored a paper on assessing the risks for VBAC.  I'm going to be calling them today.  I hate to have to drive so far but, well gotta do what ya gotta do.  

I even checked into midwives....not a single one that I can find less than a hundred miles from here.  I told DH that if I opted for a home birth it would be just me and him lol.  I did call the hospital here becuase I wanted to confirm what the ICAN and the docs office said, but the Director of Womens Services didn't answer, I left a message.  

This is just ridiculous that it's so hard for a woman to find decent prenatal care.  Think about those who don't KNOW any better and assume that the doc is always right.  

When I had the c-section with my first it was MEDICALLY NECESSARY for her survival.  I was over due, she was breech, there was NO fluid, she suffered from IUGR (growth retardation-full term and only 4 lbs 15 oz) and as they were prepping me her heart rate dropped.  I dont' regret THAT c-section but I REFUSE to have someone force me into another one that isn't medically necessary, nor will I allow someone to feed me some B.S. to make it SOUND like I need one.  I can be a real you know what and these docs have NO idea who they are dealing with.  There is a Navy Lieutenant that was stationed in Portsmouth Virginia that knows just how much of a you know what I CAN be.  I told him off so bad he wouldn't come back and see me, he sent someone else.  (long story)

[martikadragoon]

even thought my OB's didn't encourage VBAC I was told that they couldn't FORCE me to have another csection and If I wanted a VBAC they would have to do it.

IMO... if they won't do a VBAC they have to refer you to a doctor who will do a vbac and part of their oath of a doctor was "first do no harm".... and in your case after having 4 successful VBACS another csection would be doing harm and would mean little to no chance for any future vbacs.....
Those doctors are idiots.

[30something13]

One thing is that under NO cercumstance do you have to sign anything at your dr's office or hospital and they are not allowed to threaten you for not doing so! In the US no dr can say he will not treat you unless he has found you a new dr that your insurance excepts and you except. Also if you get to the hospital and you are in active labor they are not allowed to give you a c-section unless medically nessisary. That is some of the laws but you know how it is.  

I recently moved to the mountians and the dr's here ar not that good and I was told they had a VBAC ban at the hospital by me. I started to go to another dr then had problems and she owuld not see me then I went to the er by me and saw the only OB dr here. He told me that he does do VBACs and has no problem with them! Horray!

I hope you find a dr that you like and trust! You do not need to go through this stress when you are pregnant!!! ANd if you have to go further to get peace of mind it just might be worth it! If you go into labor and feel the baby coming and can not get to the other hospital then at least you know they will not ahve your records till it is too late and you can VBAC.

[Melka76]

Thank you!

[LosingMyMindInGA]

It really depends on where you are and the doctor you have.  Many doctors nowadays for legal and financial reasons will not perform a VBAC after ONE c-section, let alone 2 or more.  You need to find out from your doctor and your hospital what their policies are.  The website that was suggested above (Ican-online. org) has a LOT of information on VBACS and VBACS after multiple c-sections.

[Melka76]

Question - I wanted to do a VBAC with my son - but he nothing progressed and I am very tiny in the hip/birth canal area and they were scared that even if they induced he would not fit.  I did an elective Csection at 39 weeks.  I want to do a vaginal devilvery but they are saying after 2 csections vbac is not safe.. any thoughts?

[LosingMyMindInGA]

According to ICAN-online the hospital in my area has a defacto ban.  ICAN called the hospital in January 2009 which was 5 months after I had my VBAC there.  They stated that there are no doctors who will perform VBACS.  When asked what would happen if a woman showed up in labor and refused a c-section they replied that she would have to sign a waiver stating she accepts ALL risks and will not hold the hospital, doctors or other staff responsible for ANYTHING.  In other words...as ICAN put it....those defective stitches are becuase YOU CHOSE to have a vaginal birth.  GIVE ME A BREAK.  Looks like I may be looking into driving an hour to see a doc and give birth.  SHEESH!