Addiction

[OxyDout]

Well, I have been posting here for a few months now and I have hit what I think it Rock Bottom, or so I hope, my question it how to go about getting things fixed. Over the last 5 days, I have ran up a bill that I can hopefully pay off tonight, but to no surprise it was oxy contin, about 80mg a day.  I sat in my room last night and literally cried myself to sleep, all the lies, the deceipt, the money wasted, it all caught up to me and put me into a major panic attack/depression.  

Every day we come here and post, and lately there has a lot of BS going around and I am one of the idiots contributing to it. I very much agree with Groovy and saying we need to get back to the purpose of this forum, and this is the reason I'm posting. I need advice. I would like to see an addiction doctor but don't know if I have the money. I'm extremely scared and depressed, I need help, so any advice, or info on doctors would be great.  Groovy since your local I was wondering if you knew of anyone.  

Thank you all so much for being here, this is why I love this forum, I can be 100% honest.  And believe me when I say, I want to be clean, I really do, I can't handle this anymore. I'm at the point where it all seems hopeless, worthless.........

[message of love]

Dear Everyone,
I am just on the computer trying to get some info for my brother, who is addicted to crack.  I, myself, have never taken even as much as a puff of a cigarette, but I did want to share something that I truly believe with all my heart can be of MUCH help to each of you. There is a book by a man, Dan Millman, called The Way of the Peaceful Warrior that can make an infinite difference in anyone's lives.  It can be found in the New Age section of just about any bookstore and is about personal growth and personal power.  I haven't met a person yet who hasn't been truly changed to some degree by his books, and I think if you'll read this one, you'll get addicted - no pun intended.  It offers true messages of hope from personal experience, although it is not about drug abuse.  Still, this is the only salvation my brother has found, and he reads all of Dan's books.  He HATED reading before that book, by the way.  (Peaceful Warrior is the one to start with though.)  Best wishes all together.  If you don't believe you're interested in reading it, at least keep it in the back of your mind.  May you each have faith, peace, and courage as you find your way.  Life isn't usually the end result, it's the adventure along the way.

[Sugarbeens]

Hi Witchywoman, its Butterbean.  Had to change my name, forgot my passcode.  It sounds like you are doing great and hanging in there staying clean.  I hope I can do it soon.  I had a facet joint injection or part of one about 5 years ago.  They didn't sedate me at all.  Well while he was beginning to put the needle in , the blood pressure machine went off and my pressure was really low, so they stopped that procedure.  Really scared me!  But, it sounds like they are working for you and I know how difficult the pain is. I am still taking vicodins but I want off. I am just sick of the habit of popping pills everyday, and I take more than perscribed and then go through withdrawal.  So I just think I will learn to deal with my pain some other way.  Bless you and keep up the good workl

[Witchywoman]

No groovy that is not wierd at all. When I was using, toward the end I couldn't get high no matter how much I took. Chasing a high that will never come is what it was.

With you on the bup, the same thing would happen.  Not that I want you to try it, but if you took some hydro a day or so after your last bup, it wouldn't affect you at all since the bup still fills the receptors and creates a cross tolerance. All opiates create cross tolerance as far as I know.

If I'm wrong, someone correct me, but I'm pretty sure this is true.

love,
WW

[angst]

Welcome to the forum.  My name is Ava, and I was a dilaudid addict.  Methadone has been my only reprieve from using the needle.  It is a terrible way to live sometimes.  I don't have to
go to the streets with my money anymore, wait on one of my connections to come through when they had to get high first before they would start selling, or try to hide the $200 or more dollars I spent the day before.  That cycle was one in which I knew I would die.  So the methadone is a better place for me.  You will make it.  After the stomach ills for a week, you will start hurting all over for another week or so.  Then between two weeks to a month, you will feel almost normal.  Hang in there.

[1fortheroad]

i'm curious...when you do use, do you actually get high still?  i got to the point where i could take 20 hydros and not feel that high that i got in the beginning.  i'm not even tempted to take pills because i know i won't get high - is that weird? maybe after all this time (haven't taken a pill since beginning of april), i would feel something, but i'm not going to go there.  i'm sticking with the bup until i can stop that as well.

how your gf handling this now?  is she there for you?  i hope so...hang in there:)

[angst]

you know what you have to do.  my thoughts will be with you.  it is not easy, but you are a strong person.  you can make it through this.  you have given many good advice.  i the best with this doctor.  bedside manner is not everything.  good luck and Blessings,  Ava

[Witchywoman]

Keep on reaching for the light gwh..that is something I've really admired about you. You get knocked down, but you keep getting up again. Just never get up. It takes some people many times of trying. You never fail, ever, unless you give up trying.

You can do this!
love,
WW

[OxyDout]

I wish you the best of luck, I really do. I have been trying to get sober for the las few months, I've gone sober, then used, sober, then used, so on and so forth. I just can't seem to kick it, but I'm starting to realize that each time I use, I like the "high" less and less, and I'm finally realizing that relapsing is really part of the process, so just keep going and know that this will come to an end...... Just make sure YOU end it by your terms........ Good luck, keep it up!!

[timeforachange]

How long have you been sober or trying to get sober? Keep your head up! I am all tears today and I have the feeling I will be everyday for a while! There are so many supportive people here. Try to smile tomorrow is a new day, that is what i keep telling myself. Ill pray for everyone tonight! I havent prayed in a long time. I think this is a good time to start! well I am off to my first NA meeting I found 1 right down the street, wish me luck I need it!
Love Jamie

[OxyDout]

your lucky, over here there $8 a piece.........

I feel like **** today, but I'm determined and I feel good mentally, I really feel a difference in my attitude, I hope I can make it through this...........

[timeforachange]

I posted 30 minutes ago thinking I new what I was doing. Now I am crying thinking maybe I need help to do this. I have a supply of Xanax and a supply of Klonopin on its way. The last thing I want is to get off of 1 addiction and grab another along the way Methadone in NOT a option for me!!!!! I dont have the money to go to rehab. My entire savings is drained thx to the 18 10mg Hydrocodones I was eating a day that cost $4 a pill..You do the math.

Freaking out in Texas

[skipper]

catuf:
thumbs up on quitting smoking. i quit a year ago march 13. i did
not believe i ever did it! god or what ever must have intervened.
i still really miss all the "fun" i had smoking!

keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[CATUF]

Hello All - Hanging in there, reading a lot on here, but with no particular wisdom of my own to add.  I'm on day 7 w/o my "friend" LorTab-10 and day 2 with stopping a 25+ year, 1 pack+/day smoking habit.  I was VERY worried that it was unwise to quit the cigs so early into my latest quit of the LT, but the long promised smoking-quit-date (birthday) arrived and I just couldn't find it in myself to say to my wife and kids, "well, let me get a little further past this drug problem that you were not aware of . . ."  Now I think it may be the best thing I've done -- this non-smoking is an almost all consuming thing.  I've been so busy not-smoking and getting through the every-20-minute panics that I was going to die w/o a cig that staying away from the LT has become almost a non-issue.  I don't mean to say that the importance of it is lost, it's not.  It's like it's a given w/o the prior panic associated with it, all of which is directed instead to the non-smoking.  This is my third serious attempt to quit both (but the first where they overlap).  I REALLY have to quit smoking (certain test results) and I know that if I hit the LT I WILL smoke.  Likewise, I'm thinking that the physicall drain of smoking leaves me more open to wanting the hoped-for lift of the LT.  So, my hope is that these efforts actully work together, each boosting the other.  MY QUESTION IS:  Am I missing something here?  Am I setting myself up for some fall that I'm not seeing and, therefore, not ready to defend against?

CATUF

[Witchywoman]

Kip, thank you for your prayers. I could use 'em right now!
And thank you everyone for the support.  It means a lot.

I woke up today feeling a bit better. The pain level is lower, so maybe these injections will work after all.  A nurse friend of mine told me that it can take a few days for them to take effect. That's not what the Doc told me, but I trust this nurse friend a lot, he's seen a zillion patients have facet joint injections.

You know, my not accepting the oxy script is a wierd thing.  It came out of straight out fear, nothing else.  Fear of getting re-addicted. Last time I was on oxy, I did not abuse it. It was the only time i dind't abuse an opiate, but I didn't know you could crush them. Now that I know that, do I trust myself?  A friend of mine in NA told me I was probably doing the wrong thing, suffering 9+ pain out of fear, rather than taking care of myself medically. I've thought about it a lot.  I guess if the pain stayed at that level for more than a few days, I might take it and have my husband watch me swallow them or something.  I guess at some point we need to trust our recovery and not put ourselves at medical risk by suffering needlessly.  I"m just so scared of ever going back to where I was a year ago.

But, today the pain is better, so I don't think I"ll have to face the question anymore.

thanks all,
WW

[OxyDout]

Thank you all so much, I really got the response I was looking for. So, this what happened yesterday.

I searched and searched and searched. All I came up with was the clinic that Groovy had mentioned in "brighton" for all of you not in mass, anyway, I don't know what to do Groovy, you don't like the doctor, neither do a few of my friends who went, however, there are a couple of people it worked for.  I gave them a call and spoke to them about the process and it seems like a dumb way to go about things. They give you about 6 prescriptions to get off of the opiates....??????? I'm not sure about that. So, last night my brother came to me after I broke down in front of him and he told me "to stop feeling sorry for myself" "don't be so godamn weak, its a ******* pill"!! (tough love) He also said, He had enough hydro to monitor my detox, I started to ask how and why, but he told me not to ask questions and that he will give me a total of 9 the first few days then 6 etc... but he had it all written up....... then he continued to look me straight in the eye and tell me that he hasn't set an example for me, but that he was going to help me get out of this.  He said, don't ever ask me for an extra pill, don't even complain because the minute you do its over.  The point being my brother took all the time and money to get the hydro and write up a detox he got from an addiction Dr......... So, this is my next step.  From there, I'm not sure what to do.  He also just told me he just went through 10 days of hell but stayed clean and if it was the last thing on earth he was going to get me through this.  He said he would be my sponser and that if we had to go to meetings then we would, he said he has all the information.  

That being said, I can't tell you how much I appreciate your help, it was a completely different feeling when my brother told me this last night and then coming into work and seeing all your posts.  Now, if I say I can trust my brother to do his part and that he will definitely not give in to me, do you all think this is a good idea??

[1fortheroad]

i think it will be great if you and your brother can help keep each other clean, plus since he's been thru it, he can be totally able to relate to what you are going to go thru.  

the dr. in brighton i mentioned is a major rip off artist.  he gave me 11, not 6, prescriptions which came to over $100 even with insurance.  most of it, except for a benzo, was stuff i could have easily replaced with over-the-counter stuff...hindsight is 20/20 right?

plus, he was very close minded when it came to alternative routes of detox.  he basically told me if i didn't stick with his plan 100% that he would cut all ties to me.  i tried his "cocktail" for about 1 month, plus spent 4 days inpatient under his supervision.  i also attended his group sessions, which were on the weekends.  if you don't like aa, you would barf over his meetings. even with insurance he charges you money every time you come to his office, and he requires you come ever two days - this was just MY experience.  i couldn't stand him, and then i found out after doing a little research on him that he is not very respected in his field or at st. elizabeth's hospital. aaanyway...i really hope you find success with your new plan.  tapering is very tough for me

i think the key (for me) is to have a good after plan ready with support all around.  if i get bored, i start to think about drugs.  they filled up a lot of time for me...running around and trying to find more.  it's amazing how much time i wasted.  well, i'm rambling now gwh - good luck dude:)

[skipper]

utroque:
welcome to the forum! there will always be room for just one more
addict here. w/d vary in length. get some imodium. it will help
with the runs. don't be afraid to double or even tripple the
dose! unless you are using buprenex, in wich case i'm not sure
iimodium would help.
keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[skipper]

gwh:
i'm happy to hear ya' got a plan! stick with it unless you start
leaving little bloody footprints. if you make,it i promse i will
tell you about the littlembloody footprints!

kep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[skipper]

witchy woman:
for what it is worth my thoughts and prayers are with and of you
today.

keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[OxyDout]

Skipper, just the curiousity about the little bloody footprints is enough to keep me sober, haha, but seriously, thanks for the post, I'm really excited, no, scratch that, I'm not excited at all,  more anxious then anything. I really want to do this, I can make progress, I know I can.  I will keep you all posted.

Groovy, thank you so much, I have to say, your post put a huge smile on my face.  That post you sent was like the first posts we used to have, you know, when we didn't know anything about each other, didn't disagree on different points, we were here, JUST TO HELP OURSELVES, AND EVERYONE ELSE, it felt great to here from you "dude" ha.  Anyway, I agree, I have heard more bad things about this guy from someone who has seen him in the past, so thats definitely a no go.  If in the future I need to see someone, it will not be him.  But thank you so much for making my day, I hope all is well.  Oh, I posted yesterday, its further down on the forum, but I wanted to know how you were doing because with all the conflict in here, and you defending yourself because of dumb comments I made I haven't had the chance to ask how you were doing. so let me know

GWH

[utroque]

I'm into day eight off the Duragesic patch.  After reading a lot of your stories, I feel like a big wuss.  A lucky one, but still a wuss.
A pain clinic started me on Duragesic (25ugh) in 1998 (serious bone/tendon/muscle wackiness from a car accident in '89, broken spinal connectors and accompanying muscle problems from a car accident in '97, diagnosis of post-traumatic fibromyalgia in '98).  I tried it for six days, and it scared the living hell out of me.  The doctor didn't warn me about things like driving on it, or even just walking while on it.  Too strong, too much, I put it away and didn't think about it anymore.  Then the headaches got bad, bad, bad, and worse, and my new doctor persuaded me to try the patch again in 2000.  What do you know, it worked.  The headaches that didn't get smacked by the Duragesic were conveniently swallowed by Darvocet
A few months ago, I realized that I wasn't interested in taking the stuff for the pain anymore.  I was interested in taking the Darvocet at night with my other meds (Zanaflex, Klonopin, Imipramine) because it zonked me out and let me sleep for 12 hours.  Took me two years to figure that out.  Goodbye, warm feeling of chronic pain being effectively controlled.  Hello, cold shivery feeling of addiction.
My doctor tried to talk me out of going off the patch, because fun nighttime zonks aside, it works quite well controlling the pain and letting me live a semi-normal life.  I managed not to stand on a chair and holler "But I'm ADDICTED to the goddamn stuff," largely because that'd be counter-productive and probably scare everyone in the waiting room.  
Anyway, I'm having the really unpleasant sweating, a digestive tract that appears to be trying to exit my body, twitchy legs, trouble sleeping, and a hair-trigger temper.  I'm going to the health food store today to try some of the ingredients listed in the Thomas Recipe.  My big question here is if anyone has any ideas about how long this is going to last - I've heard times given from two weeks to three months.  A timeframe of sorts for when I can be further than twelve feet from a bathroom and when I can stop going through four t-shirts a day would be nice.  Encouraging, even.

[Witchywoman]

Gwh, I think having your brother in your corner like that is a great plan. He sounds like he loves you a lot and having a partner to double team the Dragon is a great idea. Go for it!

Utroque, welcome to the forum.  To answer your question about how long it will take:  The worst is over within 5 days. Honest.
The weeks after the 5 days are challenging due to intense lethargy and sometimes depression. But the sweating, shaking, diarhea, restlessness etc is better by day 4 and much better by day 5. when I went through it took a month before I felt 100% back to normal.
I'll tell you one thing, cut back on the amount of L-Tyrosine after a few days, and even try to lower it before. The dose suggested in the recipe was way way higher than I could tolerate. And L-Tyrosine causes strong diarhea as well. I kept taking high doses of it after the first week and it took a while for me to realize that it was the L-Tyro causing the ongoing diarhea and stomache cramps that lasted so long. As soon as I cut it to 500mg per day the cramps went away.
Just try to hang in there, get as much support as you can, and know that you WILL get through it.  Take it minute by minute if you need to.

Kip, thanks for keeping me in your thoughts. I did have the facet joint injections this morning. Ouch!  Not as bad as the discogram and idet was but still not a cake walk. Nice Doc though.
He gave me a light dose of versed, and I'm not sitting here craving more opiates. He wanted to send me off with a script for oxy, but I turned it down. The versed basically just made it possible for me to stand all those needles getting stuck into my spine. blech. not fun.
The sad news is it probably didn't work. The Doc says I'd feel the effects right away if it was going to give me pain relief. That means that my pain is probably truly discogenic rather than arthritic in orgin.  so next step is another surgery consult. Not looking forward to it, but I"ll at least explore my options.

Have I mentioned chronic pain sucks, and sucks even worse when you are an addict and can't get relief like normal people? lol  Not trying to have a pity party..just venting.

lots of love all..I'm off to nap for the rest of the day.
love,
WW

[lifeisbetter]

Your such an inspiration! I'm so sorry you didn't get the pain relief you had hoped for, but maybe since your an addict it metabolizes differently and any minute its gonna kick in. Addicts do things backwards alot you know!

I am so in awe of you that you could turn down the Oxycontin. That is one of my biggest fears. Right now I don't crave it at all and can't see myself ever wanting to again, but if I actually had it in front of me I don't really know. It used to be just a given that I would because it was uncontrollable. Now I do think things through and that helps so much.

So if you haven't already, give yourself a pat on the back (very gently of course) You deserve to feel pretty darn good about yourself today, pain and all.

[hippy]

hey there , your plan with your brother sounds good.
It'a alway nice to see others on the right track.
Also it was nice to see you and groovy posting back and forth,
when i found this fourm ,back in april/02  . i used to read you and groovys post and it was very helpful to me back then,
I am staying clean thanks to all the help here on the fourm.
and i have been giong to NA meetings every night.
the only hard part in life is work, it is a little tiring,
ive been clean 10 weeks but i don't seem to have all my stamna back.