Catalytic anti-bodies?

[Kate]

Has anyone heard of a antibody being developed that consumes cocaine as soon as it enters the body. It is supposed to work continuously over a 30 day period. Meaning no matter how much crack you smoke you won't get high. Sounds too good to be true, huh?

[Off Topic But Need Feedback]

To start off...  Kate- I have heard of something similar to what you describe but I don't know enough to comment on it, Sorry.  It sounds like it would really help lots of people.  

I am a 5 year plus narcotic user.  I have rheumatoid arthritis, degenerative disc disease, fibromyalgia, dual entrapped sciatic nerves ... shall I go on? (lol!).  I am being treated by a specialist.  I get 120 vicodin a month plus 60 10mg oxycontin, 90 soma ,30 1mg ativan and 30 ambien(to sleep).  Needless to say, I do need aggressive pain management.  I found myself double doctoring, getting 90 percoset a month from my primary - each doctor not knowing I was getting double meds.  When I went through 120 vicodin in a little over a week, I got really scared.  Even if I run out of everything - I have ready access to refills.  I realized I must stop this!  I turned all my meds over to my husband and have been only taking my prescribed doses for about 4 days now, using 1/2 tablet of ativan in the late afternoon to quell the bit of anxiety I start to feel.  Today I only took my oxycontin and 2 vicodin.  This is a major cutback for me but I felt really good!  My head is starting to clear and I am starting to feel more motivated.  

I have read every single post on this board over the past week and finally got the guts to post myself.  I am a nurse.  Well, I am a retired nurse because of my disability I am no longer able to work.  Back in May I decided to let all my scripts run out and stop taking anything - oh my god I thought I was going to die.  I told my doctors this and their response was "this is not the time to deal with dependance, your pain management at this time is the main concern, there may come a point in time when we can deal with the dependancy but now is not the time."  

So... now I am trying to justify my dependance/addiction with the words of the people who's care I depend on.  Any feedback?  If I can live on 2 10mg oxy and a couple of vicodin for breakthrough pain and an occasional ativan for anxiety - is this a bad thing?  I do recognize that I need pain control or I am curled up in a stiff useless ball of pain.  Will this be the rest of my life?  I know I can't do what I had begun to do - abuse the drugs by taking them in large doses just to feel good.  That really started to suck, and scare me.  

I would have posted a new thread but the system wouldn't let me.  I am sorry for that and hope you all respond.  I feel I know you all because I can relate deep in my core to all your stories.  I also feel I can help because of my first hand experience and my professional background.  I woke up at 3am with the shakes and diarrhea to beat the band, but what did I do?  I took 2 soma and a bentyl (antispasmodic) to calm my gut down and decided it was time to reach out to you guys.  

Is there a happy medium somewhere between abuse and living comfortably at our prescribed doses?  I just started the oxy and I think so far it's a lifesaver!  I am able to avoid the roller coaster and only take the vicodin for breakthrough agony.  

Any feedback you can give me will be so appreciated.  I look forward to getting to know you guys.  Thanks so much for listening.

OffTopic Blathering Chick :)

[Frankinscense]

You need to take control of your addiction. Only take what you absolutely need to live a normal life. If you cannot take control of your addiction. You might consider methadone or LAAM maintenance. Opiate addicition is a serious and dangerous disease. It times it almost sounds like you are bragging or boasting about the medicines that you take. This a serious and debilatating disease if you let get out of control. The pills that you are taking are morphine substitutes with almost the same addictive properities. Support is not about sugar coating this serious disease. Do the right thing and remember what you learned in nursing school about addictive substances.
Stay Focused and Good Luck,
Doc Dan..

[Deja to Vicodin Girl]

Dan,

Thanks for the reply.  I really didn't mean to come off sounding like I was "bragging or boasting" about the meds I take.  That wasn't my intent at all, I assure you.  I'm sorry if I came off sounding that way.  I was trying to be honest.  I know you are an active participant in this forum and you are a source of great inspiration and support for everyone.  The last thing I want to do here is, well... blather on and sound like an idiot.  Anyway - I do thank you sincerely for your response.  

blathering chick :)

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

It sounds to me that you may have been drug seeking and got scared after taking a month's worth of painkillers in a week. I think anyone except for really hardcore abusers would get concerned. It is good that you are trying to cut down! I let my wife control my meds as I've had problems with abuse in the past. She keeps mine in her safe.
I have some of the medical problems that you have so I know how the pain can get to you. Sometimes it is depressing when you think about the long term aspect of narcotic pain control. I have a niece that has been on narcotics since 1992 for chronic pain and it has really made her life all but unfit. She was in med school when she was involoved in a terrible car accident that caused spinal problems that can't be repaired. She is a legal junkie but I would never trade places with her just so I could have narcotics. Now look who's blathering here!

[Deja to Vicodin Girl]

Chronic pain *is* depressing sometimes.  I'm sorry about your neice, wow.  You aren't blathering! I like to read what you have to say.  I am glad I am not alone in turning my meds over to someone else and having them doled out.  Weird thought I keep having though...  if I continue taking the dose I have been, by the end of the month I am going to have a surplus... then I get my refills - wow -  I keep thinking - when I have a reserve - would it be so bad to play a little for a few days?  I know the answer to that!! It would be VERY bad!!  I guess it's time to start working on the mental aspect of this thing.  Thanks for your input! Stay strong :)

blathering chick - also known as Deja

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

Have you heard the old expression "it's better to have and not need than to need and not have"? Just having the peace of mind that you are not going to run out of meds is important to well being.  My wife has been taking Xanax and Lortab for six years now and always has a surplus. She is not an addict now or has ever gotten into abuse. She is the epitomy of moderation and that's why I can trust her as I do. Why we all can't be this way is a mystery to me! Left to my own devices, I would be in deep sh*t within a month with my addictive personality. Just a thought to ponder.  Be well!

[Deja to Vicodin Girl]

Wow - You are so right about the stress, lack of respect for what we do and the general burn out factor alone that comes with the nursing profession!  Before I had to stop working because of my disease I left patient care and went to work as a technical field support person for a big medical laboratory.  I was on the road visiting doctors and teaching their staff- yadda yadda yadda - needless to say - it was great!  I was also being handed sample meds by the bagful - not so good in retrospect, lol.  "Hey! Need some xanax today?"  Duh!!  

I did something not so honorable yesterday.  My husband hurt his back at work, went to the doctor and was prescribed vicodin ES.  I took ONE last night.  So - my total for yesterday was 2 oxy, one ES and one regular 5.5 (and my 3 soma for the day)...  better than I was a few weeks ago but I shouldn't have taken that ES.  I told him to hide his pills -  I can't be trusted.  So now he has his hidden, mine hidden and he fills my bottle with only my prescribed dose for the day of which there has been left overs in every day for about a week now.  

Boy - I know what you mean about having that relief to look forward to at the end of the day.  I remember coming home so emotionally and physically spent - taking those pills and feeling "normal".  What a way to live, eh?

Would love to chat with you.  Do you have ICQ?  I could give you my email address also.

Deja (aka blathering chick)

[To Trish from Kate]

......Now getting back to the original question. Doc Dan? Tom?
Anyone?

[Frankinscense]

Euphoria is not a healthy state of mind. It is what keeps you addicted to opiates. It is a very unhealthy coping mechanism. There is a term for nurses like you. It is called impaired medical professionals. I have a lot of respect for the nursing profession as a whole,it is a wonderful helping profession. Get a hold of your addiction and get some help. You sound like you are a very intellegent young lady. You need to address your pain and
and addiction problems in a more appropiate manner. You are in the early stages of your addiction get a hold of it before it damages your career. I must say there are more nurses who cope and face the problems without turning to substance abuse. Do the right thing.
Sincerely,
Dan
ps: A good pain/addiction specialist is the way to go.

[Frankinscense]

I have read that there is a vacination being researched to abolish or help with cocaine cravings.
Doc Dan..

[Vicodin Gurrl to Dan]

Hi there, welcome to the forum!  As a nurse myself and also a chronic pain sufferer/addict, I think we will have a lot to offer each other by way of support!  I have met/read about SO MANY other nurses who are also addicts, whether simply due to recreational use or as a result of injuries or both.  I often wonder if there is something inherent in the profession that leads nurses to abuse drugs.  We function day after day in a relentles, high stress profession. If we haven't had the good fortune of learning BEFORE becoming nurses how to cope with stress in productive ways, I believe we are left with almost no other choice but to turn to drugs or alcohol.  Unlike physicians, who function in the same environment that we do, we do not usually receive the necessary respect, support and accolades that they do.  Its damn hard.  There are nights I come home from work feeling so beaten down by my fellow nurses, the demands of my patients and the physicians I work with.  That fact combined with pain and exhaustion leaves me oftentimes thanking God that I have something I can take (ie opiates) to make me feel a little bit of happiness and euphoria at the end of my day...I am looking to get into another area of nursing that will provide me with a work environment that is less "challenging" than the one I am currently in (a high risk specialty area).  Until then, I know I cannot give up the pills.  It's so sad I think.  I work incredibly hard to provide my patients with as pain-free an existance as humanly possible, yet I cannot do the same for myself at this time.  Sorry to rant, I just had to get some things out.  Good luck to you, and hopefully you will post again soon, as I (as well as Im sure everyone else here) am very interested in hearing more about you and how your cut-backs are going!  Peace...

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

Sorry to be butting in here but I think you may be right about the nursing profession.
My mother is a retired RN. She served in the Korean War and retired shortly after the Viet Nam War. One of the reasons she got out of nursing was the disrespect of the younger nurses and doctors. Some days she would come home crying! In the military she had all the respect her rank gave her. After the military she went to work in a private hospital and dreaded going to work each day. Finally, she got out of the profession and now does volunteer work at the VA hospital.
I remember seeing large bottles of Fiorinol with codiene in her medicine cabinet twenty years ago. She was probably using them to cope with life at the time. Today she is totally drug free and happy as a clam!

[Vicodin Gurrl to Dan]

Well, it sounds like you have all of the answers to my problem, eh?  I AM an intelligent woman, in fact, I am one of the top nurses in my specialty, which is quite an accomplishment, especially considering my age...I also graduated AT THE TOP of my class, receiving my Bachelor's degree WHILE working full time AND frequently attending numerous non-mandatory workshops to help to make me the best that I could be in my field.  But guess what?  No one cares...No one gives a flying **** what I have accomplished or how G-d dammned hard I worked.  Guess what I hear??   COMPLAINTS...from the bogus, overconfident, underexperienced TWENTY THREE year old interns and residents with whom I work (because, honestly, according to my superiors, I do THEIR job BETTER than THEY do!).  I sit and wonder WHY.  Why did I BUST my ass to be so thouroughly knowledgable about my field, only to make $60,000/year and have people ***** and COMPLAIN at me all night long?  Then I think about my patients.  I LITERALLY hear AT LEAST once per night that I have helped to make someone's experience in the hospital BETTER than they ever believed it could be. Ah, yes, now I remember the reason for all of my hard work.  So Dan, if I am impaired, so be it.  I am NOT using while at work.  I am NOT diverting drugs from my patients or my employer.  And if a wanting to feel euphoric (not to mention pain free) at the end of my day, please tell me the problem with that.  Have you ever heard the term "victomless crime"?  Think about it.  I have come to this forum for support, and I am truly thankful for those who have supported me.  I will probably get flamed for my next comment, but you, Dan, are not one of them.  Must be wonderful for you to be so upstanding and righteous ("do the right thing").  Im happy just being plain old flawed and addicted ME.  Peace all...

[for Sick and scared/beware of Vicky!!]

Who is Dan anyhow? I rarely post here but read alot of them. He thinks anyone who touches narcs for chronic pain is an addict.
PERIOD! Nothing in between. So if I have a dental abcess and take pain meds I am an addict. I have surgery and post-op I take pain meds......I am an addict? According to Dans Law I am!
Oh well......had to vent.
Amen to you Vic girl. Best rebuttle I have seen yet!!!

Sandy

[Frankinscense]

I made these comments only after talking to doctors who were top doctors that got addicted to opiates much like youself recreationally. One is a personal friend who after several years of dening he had a problem hit rock bottom. THis doctor I am speaking of is now without a license. But he is a director of a methadone clinic and overs inspiration for many opiate addicts like yourself.(and myself) He often speaks of the dangers of medical professionals deluding themselves with the fact that they think they have a handle on their addiction but eventually just a matter of time lose their grip and get treatment. It is unfornunate that soom of these doctors DIE first. He was lucky he says that he got out with only losing his license. He goes on to say he wishes with hindsight that he would have listened to his colleagues and got help early in his addiction. This disease is always progressive and is a killer! I was just giving some caring and friendly advice from one who was where you are now dear.
Sincerely,Doc Dan CDC (Chem. Dep. Couns.)
ps: I am an intern now I must add. But I am working towards a speciality in helping the opiate addicted.

[Deja to Vicodin Girl]

Amen Sistah!

Thank you for saying what most in our profession want to yell out on a daily basis.  Sometimes I believe there is such a double standard! No one would think twice if a sheet metal worker needed pain meds to ease his suffering after a long day of damaging physical labor. Heaven forbid if a medical professional who should "know better" needs the same relief!  How many times have you spent your shift turning a 300lb plus post-op patient every 2 hours? Helping move them on a blanket so the bed can be changed? Helping them out of bed for the first time post abdominal surgery?  Been tossed across the room by an agitated geriatric patient?  We love our patients and take this all in stride but the stress on our bodies can be chronic and severe. Not to mention the mental abuse from those who will eventually leap over us in the salary range and go on to recieve acolades and the "glamour status" - who we are basically training!  

So what if after a 12 hour shift you need pain control?  Thank the powers that be that you are able to be afforded some relief!  Bless you Vicodin Gurll - if I ever need another surgery or hospitalization I pray I am in the care of someone like you.  Stay Strong!!  I, for one, am on YOUR side.

deja

[Frankinscense]

I must say I have nothing bad to say about anyone who takes pain medicine for a legitimate pain. But when one takes pain medicine to achieve euphoria - that is improper and dangerous way  to deal with problems associated with work. If you all are so smart do some research on "euphoric recall". I have been trained in substance abuse. I see the damage this way of thinking does on a daily basis. This type of behaviour may be controllable now to a degree. Check back in four or five years tell me how well you both are doing. People who use opiates recreationally never intend to become addicted to the substanse. But this a PROGRESSIVE DISEASE and no one ever intends to overdose,steal drugs from a patient or narcotic box. I have heard your cries several times by other medical professionals and none thought that they would end up losing their liscense,their job, or a patient die to negligence. If you continue to do this remember there are MANY NURSES who thought they could control there substance abuse and failed. I want you both to do a little
research on opiate abuse and find out what this drug has in store for you if you take it on a daily basis to help coping with your problems. You probably will not do it because you may find out something that you do not like and might have to give up your precious drugs. You both are no different than the professional who goes home after a hard days and injects themselves with heroin. All these drugs are small doses of heroin(or morphine) in a pill. Same drug-same withdrawals. Same drug using mentality. You all do not know it yet,but one day you both may thank me for making you aware of these behaviours. Vicodin(warnings:may be habit forming) The bottle should say,Vicodin(warnings:IS HABIT FORMING)!!!!
Doc Dan (CDC)...
ps:again I have nothing to say about people who take medicine for legitimate pain!!

[for Sick and scared/beware of Vicky!!]

I have a little horror story about my sister. Honest........its about her, not me. That is why I may not be able to elaborate about addiction since I dont know first hand but I will tell the story as I saw it.
She was a nurse at one time. A damn good one too. She suffered from this and that from time to time. A pulled muscle here, a migraine there, working long hard hours busting her butt just like the rest of you nurses do. Anyhow, I am not sure how or why it started but she slowly started to help herself to the narcotics when she thought she could get away with it. This went on for over a year. She must really have known the hows and whens to steal narcotics from the hospital. The bad part is, for all involved, is that I nor my Mom had a clue she was using ANYTHING!!  Until I started wondering why she slept all the time.......even though she worked midnights.....there was no reason to sleep like she slept.  We felt sorry for her because she would "try" to take vacations and after just a day or two of being off for what was supposed to be a 2 week vacation, she would get called back to work. It wasnt until later that I realized she wasnt sleeping at all......She was STONED.  It wasnt until later that I realized she never got called back to work, she OFFERED to take the vaction pay instead of the time off.
SHE WAS GOING THROUGH WITHDRAWLS.  
One night during work she was finally busted. They had it all planned out on how to catch her.  She was taken into a private room and there stood policemen along with reps from the DEA.  Of course at the time she denied everything but there was so much proof that she had been taking everything and anything she could get her hands on that they arrested her on the spot.  My mom just so happened to be director of Human resources at the hospital and that made things really tough for her and her job.
My sister was given another chance and went into rehab for 30 days. That is how long it took her to even come to terms with her addiction.  Meanwhile, the scene at home was horrific.  We tore her bedroom apart, finding tons of empty vials of demerol among other narcotics and bloody syringes under her mattress. We found huge holes in her mattress under the sheets where she had fallen asleep stoned,with a lit cigarette in her hand. We had a locksmith come and open her trunk of her car. There we found 2 trash bags and I dont mean small kitchen garbage bags.....I mean LAWN AND LEAF bags filled with vials of stuff I cannot pronounce.
My sister did everything she could get her hands on. By the time she was caught she was ingecting herself IM with 600 mg of demerol and I am not kidding. The doctors said she should have been DEAD long ago from an overdose. God was with her the whole time.
There is no other explanation why she is still alive today.  She was ok for a while. For about 3 years she was clean. She worked her NA/AA programs and even became a sponser . She really was doing well. She did not lose her license and she went back to work.  
2 years later, she couldnt help but help herself to 2 percocet from work.
That was all it took. They never took their eyes off of her.
To try and make a long story shorter, she pleaded guilty but they gave her a suspended sentence with one year probabtion. She is no longer a nurse by the way. That was by her choice. She still does not trust herself around narcotics. I dont trust her. Her doctors dont trust her. Its a shame.  
I dont know why I wrote this because I have no right to tell anyone on here what to do with their lives but I just wanted to share this story.
We come from a middle-class family. We are just your normal everyday average family and you just never ever know what goes on behind closed doors.
Maybe that is why I am not quick to judge. Just to help.
Hope your still awake here!!  Hey......anyone know who won for Prez yet? LOL

[to Vicodin Gurll]

Dan, you may as well save your breath.  You are trying to help people who such as Vicodin Gurll who don't want help.  Just look at her name "Vicodin Gurll".  She revels in her drug abuse, which is so pathetic, ESPECIALLY coming from a health care professional.  Some logic she has, basically "I'm so stressed and underappreciated at work, so I'm entitled to a little painkiller to make me feel better."  As you know Dan, this is TYPICAL addict mentality.  She and several others on this forum are in total denial about their addiction.  Despite your best efforts to help such people, they use any rationalization they can to continue their drug abuse.  Again, typical addicts.  They misread your posts to say you are against narcotics for legitimate chronic pain, which of course you have clearly stated you are not.  As soon as you try to offer helpful advice to one of them, the other addicts attack you in a pack because your advice threatens their own sense of wellbeing (because they know deep down THEY are just as bad as the one you are trying to help).  To Ms. wonderful nurse Vicodin Gurll:  your life is going to be a pathetic wreck until you change your attitude and learn that happiness will not be found in a painkiller bottle.  Until you do learn that lesson, the path you are on will no doubt lead you to the depths of the addiction as it has done to countless others before you.  Furthermore, if you want to revel in your drug use, why not go to a forum designed for that, such as alt.drugs-hard.  There you will find companions to share drug stories with and fellow addicts who will offer support when you are going through your numerous withdrawals.  Kindly keep this forum to the people who WANT to combat their addictions.  Dan, keep up the good work.  You are about the only voice of sanity here and those of us who are actually trying to recover from this deadly disease are very happy for your support.  Don't let the shouts from the addicts in denial get you down.  Bryce

[Mike P. to Ken]

Hey, I hope you saw my post to you below...Just wanted to make sure...Take care. - Mike

[To "Doc Dan" from Confused]

Just a legit question for those of us who are new to the forum and looking for medical advice...are you a medical doctor? I see you sign your name as "Doc Dan, CDCI" or whatever--which confuses me. I would expect a "Doc Dan, MD." Perhaps the additional initials represent a board-certified specialty after a residency. Is that what you mean by "intern?" I think you give sound advice, however, I'm a little concerned about misrepresentation. Are you a master's degree level counselor, such as, "Doc Dan, MSW." Please, enlighten me. My ignorance could be due to geographical differences in the initials assigned to professional "doctors."

[for Sick and scared/beware of Vicky!!]

You basically said it and I applaud you.  It is addicts like that who get their hands on pain medicine, abuse it then make it virtually impossible for someone that really needs it to obtain it because Doctors are pretty skeptical to believe people because once again......people that abuse it.....like the hydrocodone queen.

[cin91860]

I am the nurse my sister wrote about    everything she wrote is true.  the first time i was not arrested   the 2nd time i was arrested, taken away in front of my small daughter and bound over to the grand jury.  I was given treatment in lieu of conviction.  Thank God.  I also am a chronic pain sufferer.  i don't know where to turn for help   no one trusts me,  understandably so.  I live with back pain hip pain and leg spasms. I am not drug seeking  I have been clean since 1995.  I need help for the pain and people to start trusting me again.  I am not working as a nuse anymore.  I had to get out for my own safety.  we need to come to terms with our addiction but at the same time we don't have to play the martyr.  we are in pain and we need to be helped   real pain untreated can be just as dangerous as our addiction.

cin

[Frankinscense]

Thank you Bryce for your vote of confidence. I need it to keep going. I know the facts and will continue to pass it on to people who will listen.
Thank You,
Dan (licensed chem. dependency  counselor intern >> LCDCI)
Doc Dan is a nickname given to me because of my knowledge of prescription and non prescrition drugs.
>>>>>Cin 91860:
Perhaps you might consider methadone maintenance therapy,MMT.
It offers a legitimate way to obtain pain relief for chronic pain sufferers and gives you peace of mind to tackle problems associated with opiate addiction. It gave me enough peace of mind to continue my education. Read my posts to Tom.(11/08/00)
Best of Luck,
Doc Dan CDCI