Pharmacy's refusal

[Dee]

After my surgery wed. the Dr. gave my husband an rx of vicodin, he took it to costco to fill it after he brought me home and the Pharmacist told him i had just filled an rx for norco a few days before and he didnt want to fill the vicodin rx. My husband yelled and the Pharmacist said he would fill it but he wouldnt refill it. Is he allowed to do that? DeeDee

[jason6876]

Doctors don't work to police so-called "bad" pharmacists.  In fact, the system is designed to work in quite the opposite manner.  If a pharmacist treats his/her patients unfairly, it is usually due to some character flaw on his/her behalf.  Your "one call" to the doctor will most likely not solve any of your problems.  I've actually had patients try this and what usually happens is that the doctor (or his/her representative) will call the pharmacy, ask what's going wrong with the prescription, and usually in the will end up complaining about the patient.  I've always been of the school of thought that you get more flies with honey than with vinegar.  In the future, I suggest that you try this approach.  You might find that you will have made your life (and the pharmacist's) a little bit easier and happier.

[jason6876]

I think you should know before I begin that I actually am a pharmacist.  I've only read a few of the posts on this forum, but I must say that some of you don't quite grasp the way the healthcare system in the United States works.  First, no pharmacist wants to see a patient in pain.  Of all the healthcare professionals, pharmacists are generally some of the more sympathetic that you may encounter.  Second, pharmacists are under a great deal of scrutiny from both federal and state governments when it comes to the dispensing of controlled substances (such as those mentioned here that are being used for pain).  The problem is that these substances are very often easily abused by patients whether or not that is the original intention.  That being said, it is only natural that a pharmacist will attempt to verify the authenticity of some of these prescriptions.  After all, his or her initials will be on that prescription.  Today, pharmacy students have to go through six years of rigorous schooling in order to get a doctorate to practice pharmacy.  It is not likely that they are willing to throw that away by not being cautious in their practices.  Many times, insurances are too blame when it comes to rejections for early refills of controlled substances containing the same active ingredient as something you may have just received.  Insurance companies are to blame for many patients' woes when it comes to healthcare.  

Now, as far as doctors are concerned, I can't say that brushing off a patient's pain or concerns is something remotely acceptable.  However, I can sympathize by telling you that many doctors are reluctant to prescribe certain potent pain medications because they are under similar scrutiny as pharmacists.  No physician wants the "Dr. Feelgood" reputation.  However, both pharmacists and physicians make it a goal of their practice to relieve the pain and suffering of those they serve.  I hate to be slightly coarse with you folks, but neither of us are there just to give people the stuff for which they are looking.  If we are ever under inspection we have to be able to justify everything we do and, often times, one can't simply say, "Well, the patient told me they were in pain," and have it be an acceptable excuse.  I am sorry to hear that there are those of you out there whose pain is uncontrolled.  It must be a terrible cross that you all have to bear and I deeply sympathize with you -- but at the same time, you must also understand that we have a duty to practice our respective professions to the best of our ethical and legal responsibilities.

[spook]

"Nobody" can abuse a drug ,it is impossible,what you can do, if you want, is to abuse yourself, using drugs as the mechanism,that is why drug laws regarding abuse and addiction are flawed as they do not address the issue and that is `abuse of self`,not "drugs".
If a drug addict has their supply permanently terminated are they cured?,does prohibition address the human side of the issue?,does prohibition cause more problems than it cures?.
Will humans ever awake from their nightmare of ignorance?.
Will the sun eventually vaporize Planet earth?
What are we really fighting for?.
What is life for anyway?.
Who am "I"?.
If anybody else also knows the answers to the above you have my sympathy,we can only hope and PRAY it is in human nature not to destroy ourselves.

[spook]

In Australia ALL of the Pharmacies are like country ones(actually it is just one big country town),I like Australia,it has a good future in the right hands.
N.B>Pathological relulctance to dispense Opioids has now been recogised by Psychiatrists as an illness,it seems to occur as a result of Government Propagander and armed robberies,many chemists are reluctant to seek help for this Pathology.
Like if I needed to refill a scipt early,I could say,I am going to a place(holiday/work whatever) where there is no Pharmacies and they go-"like cool","here you are", "sign here","have fun".

[Francoise]

When I injured (and damn near killed) myself, I was put on oxycontin. I deliberately sought out a privately-owned, small, pharmacy in a very small little town about 20 miles from where I live. Yes, it's a little bit of a pain in the ass, but I've never had a problem in getting my prescription filled. No lectures. No comparisons with cancer patients or any of that kind of paternalist, uncalled for nonsense. I avoid the chains at all cost. Couldn't get me in an Ekert's, Costco, Wal-Mart, CVS, or any of those guys. These folks at the no-name pharmacy know me by name, know what I'm taking and why, and actually give a damn about how I'm doing and what my prognosis is.

Try it, you'll like it. Even if you have to drive an hour to get to your teeny tiny pharmacy - you'll get your medication.

[spook]

I read the 10 commandments And felt that they apply without saying,I already obeyed them without(before) reading them,although,
I stole some minor things as an adolesent(mars bar etc),it was accompanied by quilt and had lust without love.As I say again I have a mechanism to bring BIG BROTHER to its knees,only I fear for my life,with what I know Of the Hypocrasy and corruption inherent in that system of social control and the double agents within these structures,first of all the people of this world must unite and infiltrate all GOVT dept then the take over will proceed fatality free.The leader will collect up his flock and lead them to safety.I am not the leader only the messenger.Be patient.

[spook]

Your points are valid and correct.My point is according to my ><?`illicit` drug use patterns and Psychiatric Diagnosis and Prognosis,I am neither "abusing" nor "Addicted" to the drugs (or never will be) I "occassionally"(when I feel like it) use,those being :LSD,CANNABIS,HEROIN,ALCOHOL,BENZODIAZEPINES,COCAINE(not- CRACK),2-CB,Methylamphetamine,Multitude of Opioid Derivatives.[(note I do not use MDMA(XTC) because it is Neurotoxic-(serotonin)].
Yet I am Morally Correct(read the 10 commandments,n.b. not that I subscribe in it absolutely,I require around 16 commandments to exist in MY Moral Paradigm) in my use of them although legally incorrect,following this logic,if the real purpose of Criminalizing These Pleasure and insight inducing drugs is because they are Addictive and can be Abused,then cleary for ME anyway I am denied my `~Basic Human Right~` to alter my Level of Consciousness and Cognitive/emotive STATE.
I could challenge the very laws of prohibition,with Psychiatric evidence that the LAWS are defective and Discriminatory and Are Materialist Autocratic mechanisms of Social control and manipulation.

[spook]

CORRECTION Disregard Above!!!!
Your points are valid and correct.My point is according to my?`illicit` drug use patterns and Psychiatric Diagnosis and Prognosis,I am neither "abusing" nor "Addicted" to the drugs (or never will be) I "occassionally"(when I feel like it) use,those being :LSD,CANNABIS,HEROIN,ALCOHOL,BENZODIAZEPINES,COCAINE(not- CRACK),2-CB,Methylamphetamine,Multitude of Opioid Derivatives.[(note I do not use MDMA(XTC) because it is Neurotoxic-(serotonin)].
Yet I am Morally Correct(read the 10 commandments,n.b. not that I subscribe in it absolutely,I require around 16 commandments to exist in MY Moral Paradigm) in my use of them although legally incorrect,following this logic,if the real purpose of Criminalizing These Pleasure and insight inducing drugs is because they are Addictive and can be Abused,then cleary for ME anyway I am denied my `~Basic Human Right~` to alter my Level of Consciousness and Cognitive/emotive STATE.
I could challenge the very laws of prohibition,with Psychiatric evidence that the LAWS are defective and Discriminatory and Are Materialist Autocratic mechanisms of Social control and manipulation.

[PS >>>>Annie]

.......I agree......I think>>>????  Ya know.......that's BIG GOVERNMENT.  Although I am, for the most part...For most laws...Our twisted way of thinking often get's inbetween logical medicine and other aspects of life.  Take the O tolerance in public schools for ex.....A child was expelled for bringing Tylenol to school for headaches he/she was having.  You see, O tolerance.  A child was expelled and set up for public scrutiny,all because he kissed a girl on the cheek..he was charged w/ sexual harassment.
Here we go again w/ O tolerance.  The Bible says in the end times man will call good..evil and evil..good.  This is what has taken place for years now.  Oh and by the way...We are living in the "grace-age"...Not under the law which includes the 10 commandments.  But you mainly, believe in the old Testament...right?  The 10 commandments are good guidlines...simple and matter of fact.   Oh here I go again.  Cant' help it.  My biblical beliefs and my societal bashing.  LOL

Your Friend,

Annie

[PS >>>>Annie]

.....I'm sure it's not our intent to bash all pharmacist, but I do believe...a majority do take the power trip a little too serious.  One call to the doctor should clear up any misconceptions.  And...I do mean one call!  
I have heard horror stories also.  One of our employee's relatives is a pharmacist, and talks bad about the patients all the time.  People over-hear this.  THIS PROBLEM IS A REALITY!

Annie

Ps....I dare one of them to deny my medications...with all the problems I have.  Look out!  Pain gives life to great vengeance...lol

[susie44718]

i had an eye surgery done in 1995 and have had chronic pain in the eye socket ever since.  i have been to countless doctors and no one can figure out why i am having pain.  finally i started seeing a wonderful dr at a pain managment clinic.  i take oxycontin 10 mg 3 x's day, 1-2 vicodin 3 x's day, celebrex 200 mg 2 x's day, inderal 40 mg 1 x day.  i also have narcolepsy that started in my early 20's so i have to take 2 dexedrine 15 mg 2 x's day.  vicodin is a controlled substance and oxy and dexedrine are both narcotics.  i just wanted you to know that i understand all the pain and frustration you feel.
i also have worked in a pharmacy in ohio as a tech for the past 7 years.  i wanted to tell you that yes, the pharmacist does have the right to refuse to fill any prescription.  this is not because he/she just doesn't want to fill them or just want to be evil--they have a license to protect just like a doctor.  they had to go to school for 5 years and continue to do credit work every year to obtain the license so they are not going to chance loosing it, just like the doctors.  there are also very strick laws they have to follow and the state board of pharmacy does come in and do audits on the rx's we've filled.  there are many people who do not need the meds, but take them to get high or sell them.  that is why there are so many guidelines to follow...because of these types of people.  there have also been times when the pharmacist questions the doseage or flling it too soon and the patient has been taking the wrong amount and didn't know it.  this could cause problems for the patient so the pharmacist is just interested and concerned with their well-being.  ususally the only customers we wonder about are the ones who go to many different doctors for the same drug and go to different pharmacies.  if a doctor or pharmacy finds out about someone illegally getting prescriptions, they are required to report them to the state board and then they start a hot-line where we call 5 pharmacies, then each one of them call 5 diff pharmacies, and so on.  it is also reported to the area doctors.  but if a person does take may dif meds that are controlled or narcotics and they are from the same doctors office, then they are not questioned.  sometimes if we question a customer about their meds, they get angry and start yelling, but it is usually not to accuse them of anything, but just to make sure they are not harming their selves. many pain pills are not very kind to your liver and other internal organs.  if the pharmacist was rude to your husband, i think you or he should say something--especially if it is your regular pharmacy. just talk to your pharmacist so they know your situation--why your take so many meds, why sometimes you need them early, or anything like that. really the pharmacist is there to help you. they might even have some suggestions about your meds to help you.  there are just so many dishonest people today that they do sometimes have to use their judgement and question people.  i understand the patients point of view because i have to take so many meds myself, but i also understand the point of view from the other side of the counter.
if i can help with any other pharmacy questions, just let me know. :)
susie

[susie44718]

i've worked as a pharmacy tech for the past 7+ years and i can't believe that a phamacy refused to fill your rx of vicotuss!! i know it is just liquid vicodin and you had the tabs filled earlier, but i just can't believe they wouldn't fill it.  obiously you were sick because you got an antibiotic.  did your insurance company reject the claim or did the pharmacist just refuse to fill it?  that is just stupid of the pharmacist.  do you stil go to that place?

[cindi]

I appreciate you input, but I can tell you some horror stories about thes pharmacists at CVS and Rite Aid.  They are all terrible.  CVS gave me the trouble .  I have to get going to work but I'll jump on later and then I can elaborate some    take care    cindi

[PS >>>>Annie]

......Do you agree with this documentation???  Although some of the criteria may be accurate, Chronic pain advocates are developing new perspectives to the contrary.  Are you familiar with the Pain Patients Bill of Rights??  Advocates are trying to make the medical community aware of the differences between tolerance levels,physical dependancy, and addiction.  I am pretty sure you are up to date on this.  It's just seems as though this documentation weighs far on the side of the old way of thinking, if you will.  I do aggree that "drug-seekers"(as one might call it) do exhibit these tendencies.  I beleive each case is different.  It can be quite an undertaking for physicians to become judge and jury.... who should be treated w/ opiate pain medication, and who should not, and the laws are always a factor.  Although the wheels of progress are moving ever so slowly...we are trying to move in the right direction where all of this is concerned.  I am still quite naive, eventhough, I have been thrown into this fish bowl for over 8 years...I still have much to learn and much to catch up on.  I am only 32.

Thank you for your time,

Annie  (:

[spook]

<b>Criteria for Substance Dependence Diagnosis
How can we tell if someone is "ABUSING" or "addicted" to drugs?
</b>
Diagnostic and Statistical Manual - IV(Psychiatrists Reference Manual)
A maladaptive pattern of substance use leading to clinically significant impairment or distress as manifested by three (or more) of the following, occurring at any time in the same 12-month period:

1.Substance is often taken in larger amounts or over longer period than intended


2.Persistent desire or unsuccessful efforts to cut down or control substance use


3.A great deal of time is spent in activities necessary to obtain the substance (e.g., visiting multiple doctors or driving long distances), use the substance (e.g., chain smoking), or recover from its effects


4.Important social, occupational, or recreational activities given up or reduced because of substance abuse


5.Continued substance use despite knowledge of having a persistent or recurrent psychological, or physical problem that is caused or exacerbated by use of the substance


6.Tolerance, as defined by either:
need for read amounts of the substance in order to achieve intoxication or desired effect; or
markedly diminished effect with continued use of the same amount



7.Withdrawal, as manifested by either:
characteristic withdrawal syndrome for the substance; or
the same (or closely related) substance is taken to relieve or avoid withdrawal symptoms



<B>International Classification of Diseases - 10</B>
[ICD-10 research criteria differ from the clinical diagnostic quidelines listed here.] Three or more of the following must have been experienced or exhibited at some time during the previous year:

1.Difficulties in controlling substance-taking behavior in terms of its onset, termination, or levels of use


2.A strong desire or sense of compulsion to take the substance


3.Progressive neglect of alternative pleasures or interests because of psychoactive substance use, increased amount of time necessary to obtain or take the substance or to recover from its effects


4.Persisting with substance use despite clear evidence of overtly harmful consequences, depressive mood states consequent to heavy use, or drug related impairment of cognitive functioning


5.Evidence of tolerance, such that increased doses of the psychoactive substance are required in order to achieve effects originally produced by lower doses


6.A physiological withdrawal state when substance use has ceased or been reduced, as evidence by: the characteristic withdrawal syndrome for the substance; or use of the same (or a closely related) substance with the intention of relieving or avoiding withdrawal symptoms

[spook]

If people want to abuse drugs that is their business,not Politicians,Doctors,Chemists and Police Officers,Who the hell do you people think you are DICTATING what another Human does with THEIR life?.Just because you can PLAY god does not mean you are.This is real life not a text book,this is OUR lives,your jails will overflow,your hospitals will bulge at the seems,people will kill themselves and each other,all because of a word,nothing more or less just the word "ABUSE",well you people have abused your power to long,expect a big change soon.
Maybe it is time we released our information to the public about the names of these PROMINENT people who also abuse drugs,we?--(PRAY)-- have got the records,data bases are not secure,all have been hacked,the games over.It was a boring game anyway.

[spook]

I usually just come back later with a sawn off shot gun and a ski mask and sun glasses, works every time,although sometimes they give me more PAINKILLERS than I NEED.

[spook]

Daily Doses of 400mg of Morphine have been required within starting Analgesic therapy,everybody is different,if a doctor does not know this,you have to forgive their ignorance,maybe they were away on the day they taught that at medical school/University.Find a REAL Doctor.Some would not know if their arse was on fire,next time a doctor,gives you a hard time regarding Pain relief,tell them you have a hemorrhoid problem,and fart in their face when they are examining you,makes me feel better anyway.
Also walk out without paying.

[cindi]

So nice to see you are doing better,  Yout a poet and didn't know it.  Talk to you soon   Love cindi

[PS >>>>Annie]

Thank you for keeping me in your prayers.  The pain is much better.  I saw that you posted under my responses about my surgury on another thread.  This whole ordeal upsets me, but you know my spiritual beliefs....I have to believe that my pain will make me stronger.....and it has.  I have to beleive (like Tom), laws will change.  Maybe I will be an instrument in this change...one day.  Well who knows.  Wish I could sit here longer, but hurts a bit.. to sit....Hey, look a tacky rhyme. lmao
K.I.T.
Annie (:

[cindi]

Hi Annie,  I hope you are doing better. I have been thinking about you and my prayers are with you.  I am just so upset about all this pharmacy ****.  I did by the way report that pharmacist.  They said things like yeah well, We can check out the complaint yada yada yada.  They acted as though I was just another addict making waves because I couldn't get my drugs.  I too get the "looks" when I get scripts for something and these pharmacists are nothing but arrogant, egotistical, uncompassionate people with a severe God like syndrome.  I feel like contacting the media.  How is your pain?  Is it easing up any?  I sure hope so.    talk to you soon    take care,  love cindi

[PS >>>>Annie]

Well as I told Joec...It's day #4.  I had a successful surgury, and I know all to well, it's due in part to all the prayers I have received from caring people such as yourself.  Although, I had some really bad days, I made it through.  I was in severe pain when coming out of the anestesia.  The doctor had some difficulty removing the hardware, because the tools are not used anymore for that particular piece.  It's outdated, because medicine makes fast advancements in this area.  I'm trying to keep my spirits up, but each time I go through something like this, I feel the life slowly draining out of me.  God has kept me here for a purpose I'm sure.  Well, now I will need all the support I can get, because I've been on so much medication, I know there will be severe withdrawals ahead.  Eventhough I do suffer from chronic pain daily, my doctors do not prescribe pain meds freely.  He did make me aware that future surgurys were ahead, but this has bought me some time.  Dee Dee, thanks for your prayer.  You have no idea what it meant.

Annie

[PS >>>>Annie]

I think I can safely say, "I relate."  I am on day 4 of recouperation from surgury.  I was in severe pain upon awakening from the anestesia, and still have pain.  I was coaching my husband about pharmacy protocal.  Can you believe, what we have to go through.  
I tried tapering from my meds today, and found myself extremely tired and nauseaus.  I guess I am an official addict now, or as common opinion would see it.  I hope the procedure works for you.
I know how hard it can be to cope w/ life and pain all in the same time frame.  Good luck w/ your recovery.

Annie

[to doc dan from joe]

I was involved in a car accident several yrs ago, the pain started in my shoulder the next day and has never left except for a few brief periods.  Fortunatley the pain specialist that I found is trying to do something about it, i had a proceedure done yesterday called an ablation.  This involves "burning" the nerve off with radio waves, so once the nerve dies off (in about 2 weeks) the pain sensation should go away.  Hurts like hell right now but its a small price to pay to be pain free for ever not just a temporary fix.  Then comes the fun part, detox from all the pain meds that I've had to take.  Luckily I don't have an addictive personality and don't think it will be too hard to go through withdrawal, had to do it once before when I had a 2 week period of no pain after getting a botox injection.  Just remember being sick like a dog for about a week and no cravings for my meds.