Where are you Brian? *Open Forum*

[GOD]

Brian- I was concerned that the last time you posted here, you were detoxing with Methadone. Please give us an update! It's been like 4 or 5 days since you have posted.

Everyone try to have a pain-free day!
~~~~Jess~~~~

P.S. this is an OPEN string, so if you have something different to post (any comments or questions) please feel free to write whatever you wish.

[hellbent]

My addiction started with 4 vikes a day. I moved to percs when I found a reliable connect. Then I found Oxycontin. I remember when 1 40mg OC would last me a whole day. Several years later I had to eat 2-3 80's when I woke up in the morning just to feel halfway alive...

I started the klonopins in anticipation of my big "taper". Problem was, I failed over and over again trying to taper off, but like a fool kept purchasing klonopins and eating them. When I finally quit OC's, my benzo habit was pretty serious.

I used to nod off alot. My nice down comforter is swiss chesse from cigarette burns. I also used to wake up with vomit going into my lungs. This happened quite a few times. Life was terrible in many ways, but the sickest thing is that my mind still tells me that I was having fun back then sometimes.

Anyway, I'm as amazed as anyone else that I somehow lived through it. There has to be a god, and grace, cuz I couldn't do that on my own. Thanks for letting me reflect a little. It helps.

[earlygrayce]

you've been on this board a while and the source of much inspiration for a guy like me, even though your addiction was much more severe than mine. so i must thank you for that.

but being on that much oxy and klonopin at the same time(i assume that was through a 12 - 15 hr. day), how did you stay awake. was it just tolerance? i remember taking 6 vikes and a klonopin and barely being able to kepp my eyes open. i would think pure oxy + the benzo would sedate you much more than that small amount of hydro and the benzo.

just curious. like i said, your recovery is an inspiration.
stay well.

[hellbent]

Yea, 800mgs and 10-15mgs klonopin a day. Christ I am glad those days are (for today) behind me. Thanks for asking.

[OxyDout]

I agree, I was taking about 200mg of oxycontin a day, I only used Methadone for 5 days........ I used 2 40mg wafers, that was all I needed since I wasn't taking in as much oxy as you were, I believe you said you were up to 800mg a day, is that right?

[hellbent]

done' helped me immensely as well, for a 21 day detox. Without it, I would have been flopping around like a fish going cold turkey from a ton of Oxycontin. However, people who take less than maybe 100mgs of oxy or hydro should really think twice, in my opinion, about using it, and people who are taking less than 60mgs should not even consider it, unless it's for just a few days.

[OxyDout]

Speaking for myself only, I have had great success with Methadone, I never used it for longer then 5 days, but non the less, I had incredible results, the first couple of times I slipped after the methadone detox but only because I couldn't hack it mentally. Methadone allowed me to detox pain free, there were no withdrawal symptoms..... good luck.

gwh

[hellbent]

No more time for my insignificance? Oh Mrmichael, I'm gonna be shedding tears for days after that one. That just hurts me all to hell.

Quit popping off at people for no reason, and you might get along a little better. Sorry Pal, not everyone will sit idly by as you vent your anger at yourself on them. As far as your advice on methadone being very poor and generally sucking, there were more than 2 people who were on you for it, but it doesn't really matter now. As far as me being a "tough guy" on the internet, what the ****? Don't know where you got the idea that I was trying to be manly or tough or whatever, as I never said anything to that effect. Perhaps hiding behind a keyboard and talking tough is something YOU have a problem with...yes? And perhaps you are projecting **** onto someone else yet again?

I will say that I would have no problem at all walking directly up to you and saying anything I would say here, while looking you straight in the eye. Can you say the same there bud?

[OxyDout]

just wanted to say that aussiebabe and whoever were definitely to say the least "not tactful" they were actually kind of disturbing.

[groovygirl]

Looks like you let him get to you...you shouldn't.  He cannot have an argument without being crude and insulting, so why bother?

[puma]

First to address finished,

Hello, and welcome to this sometimes steamy forum. As you see it doesn't only take a hacker to set the stage for frustration to explode.

I really don't know if your posts were deleted, but I notice whenever I sign on I don't see my posts unless I open the column I responded in previously, then everything is there. I think the data is compressed because of all the usage. I don't know if you tried going into the columns and still were not listed there.

Second, the forum was deleting some people because of the hacking and unfortunately the way threads are set up, innocent posters also were deleted. I have seen your posts before however.

I don't know much about your type of addiction, that is why I observed but remained quiet. I will give any support you need however, I don't think anyone should be left out (swinging in the wind) so to speak. After the onslaught of rage on this threa, I forgot what you asked. I no nothing about Methadone, but alot about alcohol and benzos. Oh, I forgot, Codiene and Ultram as well. How soon we try to forget.LOL

Never mind the arguements, you need to take what is helpful and supportive to your needs and leave the rest for others to read. I hope this helped in some way. I am sorry I don't have a solution to your addiction. I'll read it again and see what I can think of.

The best person to ask would be Hippee, Skipper, and Thomas2 for experience with the hard core opiates and detox. They have more experience under their wings than I do. Please except this as a welcome and keep posting. If your name is deleted again, try droping the question mark, perhaps that confuses the computer, who knows?

Take care a good luck,

Chatahan


P.S.- There must be something in the planetary phase today or something. I woke in a terrible mood and I see a few others woke up that way as well. All in good fun I hope, let's not take things so personally and seriously please. We are all in the same boat or we would not waste our time here. Love to all.

[mrmichael67]

The people who left?  Who, Cleanman and Aussiebabe?  The TWO and ONLY TWO people that jumped on me then?  If that is the way you felt, you should have spoken your peace.  I am sure anyone who is familiar with what happened then could agree that they weren't exactly tactful.  And, that is being very kind.  You have no idea of what I do and I have no more time for your insignifigance.

[mrmichael67]

Notice you said "borderline".  It wasn't an attack.  But, the next post from you sure left nothing to the imagination.

[mrmichael67]

Benzo's and trazadone at the same time for the same thing?  Good advice.

[mrmichael67]

Are you bringing up this Cleanman **** again?  He attacked me out of no where.  I also know quite a bit about methadone.  A lot of people who post here about it have never taken it.  Some have.  If someone doesn't know about it, they shouldn't comment on it.  It serves no useful purpose.  I made a very true statement about you not reading close enough because if you did, you would know there are more than one person.  And you saying there was only one was insulting in itself.  Maybe you should take the "hell" out of your handle because that is all you seem to be.....bent.  This isn't the first time you have flown off the handle at someone and I am sure it won't be the last.  Tough guy!  Wow, it takes some serious balls to talk to someone like that over the internet.

[GOD]

As you can see, nobody has deleted your posts, and MOST of the people here are helpful, and are eager to share their experiences with you. Many would also like YOUR advise when you are ready to give it! Anyway, you described your usage of Vicodin at the level of 10-15 pills per day. That level is about average on this forum... There are many here who take WAY MORE than that, and some who take much less. As Mariposa mentioned in her post to you, Oxy Contin is not necessarily a "Bad" drug. It comes in many different strengths, and is a VERY EFFECTIVE pain-releiver... (IF TAKEN AS DIRECTED) As long as you aren't crushing and/or snorting it or shooting it up your veins, you wjould barely even get "High" while on it. The WHOLE point of this drug's introduction was to stop people from taking 10-20 vicodins per day for pain, when all they were doing was destroying their liver. The problem with Opiates is that to give a patient the same level of pain relief over an extended period, the dosage MUST, unfortunately, be evelvated from time to time. If 15-20 Vicodins "Lets you function" (and that is not a high dose considering the fact that you have been on this medication for 3 years, right?) - in other words, your pain is under control, and you are not "High," Wouldn't you prefer to just take 2 pills per day? One at 8 am, and one at 8pm?
That's what you would be prescribed if you were on Oxy Contin. 1 40Mg in the morning, and one at night. And the benefit would be that you would be giving your liver a rest. The level of Acetamenaphen you're taking in your vicodins is doing almost equivalent damage to your liver as if you had a bad drinking problem.

It is nothing to be ashamed of if you do have a need for an effective medicine for pain control. If it helps you function, that is the WHOLE point of taking a medication. You will remain active and productive in society, not to mention "Better" to be around as you wont be in constant pain! Your attitude will be better...

Anyhow, I hope you consider what Mariposa and I have said in this string!

Hoping ALL have a decent, pain-free night-
~~~~Jess~~~~

P.S. I've had many inquiries regarding my new "Handle" here (Jesse@Medhelp). I would like to note that: NO, I am not on the Medhelp staff. I'm sorry if it has caused any confusion. I changed my JesseSarpy account to the new one because of all the "Fun" around the board lately.

[hellbent]

Hey. I would definitely reccomend coming down in 30 days, or less. Find out if your clinc or wherever can furnish you with some clonodine patches for when you stop. They will lower your blood pressure and help keep anxiety at bay for the first 1-2 weeks. My clinic also gave me 50 trazadones, which are an old-school anti-depressant but help with insomina. I was supposed to take one a day, but took them all in 5 days :( It did help with no sleep.

Finally, some benzos could help, as long as you aren't already taking them, and you only stay on them for 2 weeks or so. 20mgs of valium every night can make the ride easier after you finish with the done'. For now, work on getting through the done' as quickly as you can.

Also make sure to schedule some time off life when you get off the done' Take 2 weeks off of everything if at all possible. This is your life on the line. Short term resposibilities don't mean squat. Get clean no matter what.

[diso]

Thanks for the second reply.  They started me out with 30mg.  I actually felt pretty sick after taking it "woozy" in the head and a little sick to my stomach.  They said it might wear off before I make it in tomorrow but it sounds like if 50mg a day was fine for your 500mg a day habit then 30 should definitely hold me over (if not be too much).  I'm afraid that I am looking a little bit too hard for a painless ride.  I think I will take your advice and work towards a 30 day detox at minimum.  Do you know how long it takes to get into your bone marrow?  I have read that the withdrawal symptonms from methadone can last weeks not the standard 5-7 days for oxys.  Definitely don't want that.  I really wish I could find someplace that would allow me to give Buprenorphine a go.  I don't know who to even call.

Your post reconfirms my fears about methadone.  I DO NOT want to get addicted to it.  I just want off the OCs.  Thanks again for the input.

[hellbent]

And if you've been here awhile you know that this is the second time in the probably 200 posts I've made where I have ever responded with hostility. However, in this case (the case being a completely pointless and dare I say borderline insulting post by mrmicheal), I felt it was warranted, even necessary. I have also held my tongue as he has dispensed suspect medical advice regarding methadone all over this board (the others who stood up to it were driven off the board by his "supporters"), and that pissed me off too. Perhaps I took his completely unnecessary post as an opportunity to hit back a little harder than I needed to. Sorry if I upset anybody, and I'll try to ignore the flamewar that is sure to follow.

[groovygirl]

Why do you attack people like that?  Can't you have a conversation without calling people names? People here disagree all the time, but not many do so with as much hostility as you.  

[hellbent]

Excuse me, but was I even ******* talking to you?

I said that "I HAVE SEEN ONE PERSON...."

Please note the "I HAVE SEEN maybe one person" in that sentence. This is MY EXPERIENCE *******.

The whole point being that 1 Day not feel he/she is in the wrong place. Before you jump down someones throat at least have a goddamn point. Sheesh.

[hellbent]

I began with 50mgs done daily. I was taking 500mgs Oxy daily at this point, and while it seems like I might have needed more done' to match my Oxy done, I felt fine. I blew it maybe 5 times in the 21 days, and took a few OC 40's. I didn't really start feeling bad until I got to 10mgs a day. By 5mgs a day, I wasn't feeling very good.

I am slightly aghast that you are on a 60 day program for your habit. I think it might be dangerous to stay on done' for 60 days. 21 day is a standard detox period. I don't know how long it takes until the stuff gets into your bone marrow (and it does), but 60 days is awhile.

I went down 2-1/2 mgs a day on my detox. I wanted out after 21 days, as I learned how bad done' addiction can be (I learned that it is much harder to get off of done' than oxy, once you have been on done' for awhile.). I had no interest in getting addicted to methadone. The point was to exchange, for a short time, one substance with the other, without developing a full blown horror addiction to the one. What is the point if you are just getting addicted to a substance that is harder to kick than the one you were already on?

I was willing to take some pain, and this is crucial. If you are looking for a free ride out, your expectations are going to put you into methadone maintenance. Keep letting us know how it's going.

[mrmichael67]

One person who is a legitimate pain patient not abusing their meds?  I guess you don't read close enough.  The vast majority are abusers, yes.  But, there are more than one.

[groovygirl]

Hi - I'm sorry I don't have an answer about the deleted posts...don't assume the worst tho.  Today was the first day I saw a post from you, and I answered it right away.  The same would have happened if I had seen your earlier posts.  Let's chalk it up to weird computer flukes shall we?

The real issue is your pain problem.  I think it takes a long time after a habit such as yours to bring your tolerance back down...maybe a year?  Do you have a doctor you can talk with honestly about this?  Oxys are a GREAT pain med if you can take them responsibly.  Plus, you don't have to worry about the acet eating away your liver.  There is also the Duresic (sp?) patch, which is very hard to abuse I think.  I don't know your diagnosis, so I can't say what alternatives would be best for you.

Your best bet would be to talk with your doctor as honestly as possible.  If you are taking huge amounts of vicodin (which you are - I had the same habit, but more like 20+ per day), you are KILLING your liver...seriously.  There are much better alternatives.  

Are you sure you aren't taking the vics for any other reasons than pain?  My habit started from pain, but quickly became just plain addiction...there's tolerance and then there's addiction.  Figuring out what's what is the first step.  It's a hard thing to admit to yourself let alone anyone else.

[Waking up]

I have chronic bach/hip/cocyx ang leg pian. I was taking 30mg of methadone per day. Today my doctor changed my meds to 90mg of
ms-cotin. Can anyone tell me if i will have any wihtdrawls or anything to that effect, i kow that methadone is a lot stronger. any comments woul be greatly appreciated.

                                    waking up.