Withdrawel Kit / Open Forum

[DubeMechanic]

Howdy all

Hope you all are doing OK (so far as an addict can be). Ive found a lot of inspiration here, THANK YOU.

I know there are several schools or thought on stopping this crazy cycle of addiction: Cold Turkey and Taper. Also some folks recommend taking other drugs to help out the WD symptoms, others dont.

Well, Im slowely creating a "WD Kit," I have a bucketload of Wellbutrin, about 5 klonopines and a few Ativans and am saving them up for the Big Day. Every week I get a few more and am actually surprised I havent taken them just for the buzz. A month ago I would of eaten them as soon as I got them. Guess I want out of this nightmare BAD.. Im also slowly collecting up the Thomas Recipie stuff.

Im currently on Duragesic 100mg patches and plan on switching to oral morphine, tapering over a couple weeks till Im down to about 25 mg morphine/day, then going CT

My question is this: What dosages of these (klonopine etc) are recommended? The _last_ thing I want is to wind up addicted to something else so I figure 5 or 6 days tops taking the other meds.

When tapering Ive heard that you should take as much as makes you comfortable (...riiiiight...) but I doubt that would work for me. I plan on doing this over a couple weeks at most. I should save the Klonopine till after Ive taken my last morphine? Anyone else gone this route?

Thanks for any help.

DM

[hippy]

TAKE 1 KLONEPPIN AT NIGHT TO HELP YOU SLEEP
YEAS I AGREE WITH YOYR COMMENTS ABOUT THE FOURM
very nice , keep posting
peace!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Goldenbear]

There are different dosages for Klonopin. My Doctor has been helping me get off of Lorcet. I am 210lbs and my dosage for Klonopin is 1 - 0.5mg tablet for anxiety or at bedtime to sleep.
Goldenbear

[athena]

I wish i had been smart enough to have a wd kit on hand.CT was hard but doable.(Is that a word?)lolI don't know a lot about Klonopin but from what I read here,the wd's from it is worse than opiates...you sound very determined though so I'm sure you can do it.I wii keep you in my thoughts and prayers.

pixi

[DubeMechanic]

Thanks for the input.

Id like to actually try to sleep through the first couple days of WD, I plan on taking a few days off from work when I hit the CT part. Ill probably add Somas to the kit, enough to knock me out for those first couple days.

Is that all you use the Klonopine for? Sleep? I dont need to take 1 in the morning or anything?

I too hope Chezz hurries back and is OK. My prayers are definately with him.

Cloudy and overcast here and in the 70s (100 miles west of Boston Ma). Where are you Mr Sun? Been listening to Joan Baez "Rejoice in the Sun" from _Slient Running_, can you tell? Heh.. also listened to "these arent my pants" that someone mentioned the other day. Lol is is pretty funny..

Well I dont have a definate date to start tapering although for the last 2 weeks Ive been doing the minimum I need to feel OK.. I suppose in that way its a start, I was only doing more and more till then.

DM

[CinCee]

Morning, guys.  Day 7 and almost not counting!

Flexeril worked better for me than Klono, as far as cutting through the restlessness.

Watch out for the Wellbutrin, it can exacerbate the jitters.  I did take it during the day, but looking back I don't think I would.  The worst part about the restlessness is being unable to sleep.  Wellbutrin can pop your eyes wide open.  No matter how tired you are.

I would have gotten the whole recipe ahead of time, adding GABA for calming at night, and milk thistle for liver detox.

Also get some bananas so they will be ripe when you need them. lol

[luvgordo24]

Everyone!!!  I have posted here a few times but mostly lurk, I don't know if any of you remember me or not.

I must share my Buprenorphine experiences with all of you struggling to get off opiates.  This is a miracle drug for me!!

I have been struggling for 3+ years trying to get off of Vicodin, T3, Percocet, Cough syrup - anything I can get my hands on - and no luck.  The after effects and WD were always so bad I would give in and go back to using.  The Thomas recipe (my version) and A/D's helped my mood but I could never stop because I just NEVER FELT NORMAL AGAIN.

I have a friend who has been taking Bup for some time, buying it from overseas pharms.  My friend sent me ten tablets to try and I LOVED it.  Bup tablets are not available here yet except in drug abuse clinics, only the injectable form can be prescibed for pain right now.

My doc has been treating me for fibromyalgia which was brought on by the WD and use of the opiates.  He would still give me Vikes and Ultrams and I was only allowed a few a day and I was MISERABLE still, totally depressed.  I went to him and told him how well the Bup was and talked him into prescribing me the home injections.

I would HIGHLY recommend this drug to ANYONE that has been struggling with this addiction like I have.  I have felt better taking this drug than I have in at least 2 years.  I take injections twice a day.  Each .3 mg dose lasts 12 hours.  I have pain relief with no fatigue - I have tons of energy.  This drug has anitdepressant qualities as well and I wake up with a sense of well being that I haven't experienced in years.  I don't wake up feeling "hung over" anymore from the pills, and I actually look forward to getting out of bed!

This drug does not make you "high" you just feel good.  It is hard to explain unless you have tried it.  I don't feel sweaty towards the end to the drug cycle like I do with the pills, I can't feel it "coming down" like with the other pills.  I have gone 18 hours between doses and dont feel anxious or like I am beginning to WD.

So now that I feel COMPLETELY normal again, I feel like I can get back into the work force, get a normal routine again, start exercising again and in about 6 months start tapering off the Bup and others (FYI:  I am also on Zoloft 100mg, Vioxx 25 mg)

Life hasn't looked this good in a long time!!!

If you want to try this here are some things to tell your doc to make him see what an attractive drug this is from his side of it too: (And all this is true!)

1.  Buprenex (Buprenorphine) injections are only a Schedule IV.
2.  Bup is a partial antagonist, so you cannot abuse other opiate agonist drugs like vikes when you are on it or it will kick you into withdrawal. (Trust me, you wont want to anyway)
3.  Bup has a "ceiling" effect so you dont have "the more you take the better you feel" effects.
4.  One injection lasts 6-12 hours so no up and down pain coverage between pills.
5.  It was studied at the U of Iowa and given to patients who did not respond to to other conventional A/D's and was very effective. If you do a search on it you will find the report on the net.
6.  It is being used in other countries and being tested in the US for treating opiate addicts in the same fashion as methadone.
7.  When tapering off of this drug you have either VERY mild or NO WD whatsoever.

Please give this a shot if you can, it has been a godsend to me!

If anyone has any other questions please email me at ***@****.

[CinCee]

How much does it cost you?

[groovygirl]

i'm so glad you have found relief with bup, however, you can experience VERY severe withdrawal from it...i know first hand.  i have been taking bup for over six months now, and i have tried and tried to get off it to no avail.  even tho more doesn't mean better with bup, it still feel the need to take more...the addict in me tells me to.  it will become a schedule 2 drug once it is available in the u.s. for detox.  in europe, since it is readily available, they are finding more and more people becoming addicted to it.  it is even being sold on the street for $18/amp!

so, don't believe everything you here about it...it is nothing to mess around with.

i do agree with everything you said about how it makes you feel...i feel absolutely wonderful as well.

[CinCee]

I am dissapointed to hear this.  I am doing great clean for 7 days, but I am looking for a viable plan for what came become debilatating pain.  This is how I always relapse and get stuck again.

[Wardman]

Klonopin is a great drug for anxiety.  I have never had an affinity for Benzos, I was always able to take prescribed dose and not take more.  I took one a night for quite a few months and I never experienced any WD when I stopped.  However, I was on xanax for a while.  I only took that as wellone or 2 a night almost every night for 8 months.  When I stopped taking that drug, I thought I was going to go out of my mind.  It was brutal.  I had never abused it and it never really did anything for me.
   In summary, if you are going to use a Benzo for WD, I definitely recommend klonopin over xanax.  However, be reallt careful and use only as needed.
   I am getting ready to go through WD again I think starting Monday.  I hate the way I feel on pills and I hate the way I feel without them.  I am currently taking about 80mgs of hydrocodone a day.  I can't wait to have a month behind me. I ALWAYS feel much better when I am not using and I look foward again to a drug free life. I have never tried hard drugs, I don't drink. it's just these damn pills.  I have seen my life change on them.  I am antisocial, I do not go out with my friends ever anymore.  I feel awful, especially when I wake up.  I feel so unhealthy.   The major problem I get with WD is that awful dread feeling and the " I am useless" feeling.  The physical stuff I will suffer through,  it's the mind symptoms I hate.

[60rambler]

my boyfriend is 7 days clean and not feeling any better after cold turkey. using heroin 2 times a day, smoking for 3 months.
he is not using any support drugs, just stopped. when will he feel better? i keep urging liquids but he has no appetite and is eating poorly. he also is working while doing this so he is run
down. i know he is working to keep his mind off of it, but is this good? I am sober so I dont know - can anyone help me, what can I do to help him?  PS He detoxed before on the klonodine
method and vows never to do it again (2 yrs ago)

[athena]

We will be here for you come monday.Its not easy but with someone to help you, you'll make it through the w/d.The mental S*** takes a little longer but a positive attitude and people who understand what your going through,you'll make it.The hardest part for me was the decision to quit.It's day 8 for me and those hydros are still calling my name.

pixi

[athena]

I really don't know anything about heroin but all addictions are similar.He's lucky to have someone who cares and wants to help.Each day should get easier though.Someone with better answers than me will prob. answer your post.I think it's a little slow around here today.

pixi

[CATUF]

Don't listen to them calling you, they are like the Seirenes singing to the sailors of ancient Greece:

"You will come to the Seirenes first of all; they bewitch any mortal who approaches them. If a man in ignorance draws too close and catches their music, he will never return to fine wife and little children near him and to see their joy at his homecoming; the high clear tones of the Seirenes will bewitch him. They sit in a meadow; men

[athena]

I really like that.It fits right in to what a lot of us are going through.What is odessy?Is it a book?

pixi

[puma]

Konopin is usually given in doses of 0.5 mg, 1.0 mg or 2.0 mg.

For seizures the dosage is always much higher, I am taking 2.0 mg four times a day. It all depends on the seizure synrome and side effects from  other anti-seizure drugs. A seizure can kill you. Most other w/d will not but may make you feel like dying.

Most people I have seen at mental health clinic take 0.5 mg or 1.0 mg at bedtime for sleep only, or if they are schizo or whatever they may add it at that low dose in addition to their anti-psychotic drug.

FYI- I have only heard of alcohol induced myalgia. You may have had extra pain similar to fibro due to detox, but detox is not the cause of the real disease, a virus is. I have had it since I lived in the cold climate and got Mononucleosis(EB VIRUS) at the age of 14. Back then Docs thought there was no such disease only mental somatic S*&%@. I would have died had I remained in the cold weather, so I moved to south Florida. Not enough wind and still too cold in winter, so I moved to Typhoon Alley in the West Pacific. I did Typhoon forecasting for almost 18 years and then the company was bought out and I lost the job, they shut down the news program. Now I only do outdoor work such as lawn maintenance and hauling stuff etc. It greatly flares the pain though, that is why I went back onto the Ultram instead of only Advil or Motrin when IAt least there is always a way to make money legally. No drug can make me feel higher than standing in the eyewall of a Super-Typhoon, holding onto something of course, than any drugs. I also have Lupus though so I need the Konopin and Ultram.

[puma]

Sorry about the double posting. My computer took a glitch, probably saying I am babbling.

I was supposed to add before it posted itself that there is no unemployment comp here only wellfare and foodstamps neither of which they would give me because I have assets, a house, pickup and Florida land. So the SSI was my only route but Now that I quit drinking again and have no cravings I have been working sideline for about two months, that's after I cleaned up the mess from the two typhoons that trashed my trees and such in July. Glad you are all having a great day, It is nice and sunny here, about 85 deg. We have a Low brewing southeast though so I will be eagerly waiting. My ole chasing buddy will probably show up here sometime in October when your hurricane season usally shuts down. You have had some exceptions to the mid Oct. rule but not the seven years I resided there.

Oh, BTW Bmac my chaser friend had low back surgery for severe pain, he could not even walk at the time, he laid in then backseat to chase some hurricane I can't remember the name. Anyhow he said he felt a million times better after the surgery. He never got hooked on the meds either, I guess he doesn't have that addiction gene we all have.

Bmac says (roll tide roll), my slogan has always been (see you under the eyewall!) For most addicts a hurricane can become a burden however if you forget to stock up your meds or detox remedies, not to mention the pain in the butt when the lights go out and no computer to plunk on. We have generators in most places here so even the stongest of typhoons is not too bad other than no power for weeks sometimes. Most homeowners buy small generators for TV and fridge and some lights however. I can feel that energy southeast, that must be why I am babbling so much. I had better cut this off now.

Good luck to all of you and hope things get better each day.

Chatahan

[bmac]

Thanks for the comment.My back surgery was a God send for me.It's been 10 years since I had it and it has relieves all that siatic pain.My problem mostly is the knees.They both will have to be replaced and the right one will be this month.
Did I understand you are on SSI? How long did it take to get your first check?Just wondering about that.
Well get back when you can!
                                 peace,
                                  bmac

[CinCee]

It was me who posted about "These are not my pants".  Did you find the whole rock opera?  My household is hooked on it.

[hippy]

hope you are feeling and doing good today.
sorry to hear about you upcoming knee surgery.
i had bothe shoulders done, very painful.right after i had the second one done ' i wished i did not have it done it hurt so much.
i was talking to aa freind of min a 45 year old woman
and she just got both her knee done, i asked herwhy she got them done at the same time, she said to me , if i got one done i would
not have gotten the second one done, ya know it wade sense to me.
i understand the pain involved. she ounds crazy but it makes sense.

peace!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bmac]

I ask the doc whay he wouldn't do both at the same time and he said it wasn't the way he does things.I bet it's because He wouldn't make as much money if he did them at the same time.
My opinion only!Yes I am alot better and I am going to get thru it without being addicted this time.This time I have alot of people to back me up,everyone here!
                      thanks
                       bmac

[puma]

Hello Bmac, I am glad to hear your back is doing well. I heard the modern knee surgery is pretty good now-a-days but still you will definately need physical therapy and find the right doc.

I was extremely lucky as far as payments go, I had just had a historectomy, and was just coming out of antistesia. I heard this man screaming down the hall just as my A.A. Sponsor strolled in. I asked her who's screaming. She said they were tying someone down and that was in seizures. I heard a guard say "We'll really make this one suffer tonight." I got totally peed off and grabbed my rolling IV and rolled it down to that room since I heard the man rambling incoherently but twice mentioning booze, needing a drink. When I got to the room, four guards were tying him down. Several of his family members were there and said he was there 48 hours and they don't know what is wrong with him.

I assumed he got arrested for DUI and within 24 hours of w/d had a seizure in jail so they brought him to the ER and admitted him.

I demanded to the nurses to call his doctor immediately since he was clearly in the heigth of the DT's, a life threatening situation. I told the nurse to tell the doc to give him Ativan or Klonopion for the w/d's. I even offered some of my Klonopin but the family said know, because they were cautious. The nurse  apparently did call the doc and gave him an injection of Ativan and he fell fast asleep. He's running for Senetor here in November. This was 1 1/2 years ago. He supposedly is clean now accoring to his brother. His brother came to my room to thank me and even still calls today for help since he and his other brothers are all alcoholics.

I went to sign up for SSI when I lost my last job due to seizures and went to get SSI since all other assistance failed. I was already almost two years sober and I still was told it could be as long as six months!!! I panicked because I was worried about losing my house. Only three weeks later the check arrived, ONE DAY AFTER I relapsed!!!! Crash and Burn. I already had all the necesarry tests that they would have required for proof of my illnesses so they did not need to go through all the rigamaroll of seeing their doc. In fact one of the specialists I used was their main doc! It was from the lord up above, a sort of miracle. It definately saved my butt. I can still work sideline as well, in fact they encourage any work but if I top what they pay each month, then they cut it off.

Sorry for babbling. I kinda got off the topic about the DT's guy. That was another time I applied for immediate tax rebate and the diretor of the tax place at the time is directly related to that family so I received that check in three days!! Almost unheard of here. Many are still waiting for their 1999 rebates.

Well I better stop for now, I hope you luck with your knee surgery, I'll be praying for you. (see you under the eyewall!!!!)

Chatahan

[hippy]

my aunt is in charge of okaying ssi checks here in philly
she has been working for ss for years , she knows all the tricks people play, my father her brother is in aa 37 years and she has helpr hundreds of aa people get hooked up with ssi.
any way the point is if ya need any help with all that i can get you her email , if you run into any snags.
peace
michael glad your ok

[bmac]

Don't ever worry  about babbling,it gives us info and I like the conversation these days.
The reason I ask about the SSI,I have been on Soc.Sec.Disablity
since my back surgery in 1991.Well actually it took 2 years before they approved me.I did go back to work in 1999 but Had the knee collapse a year later and was put right back on it.They called it a failed work attemt.It isn't enough to live off of but they do pay my child support,I have two sons 16 and 13
from a previous marriage.I play in bands here in my home town and have made some extra money but they check my out so much it's not worth getting caught,yea right.lol.I,m a bass player.
Well thanks for the info.I have never talked to anyone else that
has received disablity before and that's what the questions were about.As for the knee,the new one is called a mini-knee.Last
20 years or so.As for my doc he is very good.My wife is a nurse and works in the operating room and knows them all and I chose the best one.He uses the least amount of narcotics and the most physical rehab.Well thanks again and take it easy.
                                  bmac