Aa
vicodin withdrawl help
Hi, I am new to this site. I have been using drugs in one form or another since I was an early teen. I am mid-thirties now. Started with pot,coke,acid you get the gist. Well, you would think my rock bottom would have been developing a hole in my septum, but no...I discovered this hole from cocaine abuse and went in for surgery the next month. You can guess what followed. I got off the coke, (couldn't risk ruining my nose forever) and so typical for me, I moved on to the pills. I was perscribed the usual 7.5mg vicodin 25 pills and before they were gone I had stolen some I found in a friends medicine cabinet, and secured a source. It gets worse. I have running prescriptions for adderall, and zanex which are legitimate and I have had for awhile, and I wondered if this could help with getting me off the vicodan. I have also managed to gather a nice stash of valium, coloidipan,I am prescribed ambien also for about 6 years too. These scripts are from only 2 docs. 1 shrink and 1 general. So, to add insult to injury, I did nails for 11 years and recently (may) developed severe pain in my hands. I had an MRI and they discovered I have arithritis in both hands almost bone on bone, and have 2 torn ligimints and 2 areas of torn cartiliage, and tendons that needed to be released. I got my own script for vicoprophen in may and had surgery in october. I want off these pills NOW. I hate them and just want the clarity in my life back. I want to love my husband and child for real again. I am scared to death. Please advise the best method to stop w/o inpatient. Wean or cold turkey?
Thank you for your insight and wisdom. Do you know what you plan to pursue a your career?
I am a health care practitioner, RN, Massage Therapist and Reiki Practitioner. I have dealt with Chronic pain for 23 years since my head took out the side window of my car when I was hit broadside. I have had severe pain since the first time I opened my eyes after the hit and now the damage to my neck has progressed to all the blah blah blah things that happens as your spine ages and nerve sheaths are missing and on and on. Suffice to say that I feel guilt and shame every time I swallow a Vicoprophen to be able to go to work and beat myself up sitting for 6 or 7 hours at a computer, writing, on the phone and somehow they call this nursing, So- I am filing for permanent disability from my job and am seeing the 4th pain management guy in 23 years and they injected me with botox which I am waiting to see if it works. Yes, I feel the pleasure of being pain free when I take the medication and I can get up and start a day that everyone else seems to- a day where you make a cup of coffee without crying or wondering if you can sit and write without your hands going numb and the pain searing through your head, neck and back. When I have surgery, I take a pain pill or 2, ice up and elevate and love the feeling when it no longer hurts and the body has healed itself. Or the headache you get when you have a cold and it is going to go away after you take a nap. But, what do you do about chronic, nagging pain that disables you? You do the best you can, monitor for side effects, don't drink with the meds and pray that you will find a solution to your problem. I pray that the botox will work (it takes 2 weeks to know) and that I can start to wean. But who knows? I have read a lot about suboxone and the receptors and it seems like a good way to get off that 3 day feverish bout, esp if you are like me and take 8-10 doses in 24 hours. My doc has only 4 patients that he prescribes to, as he knows the ramifications but is a good man and wants people to lead the best lives they can.
I will be visiting with you all again if OK, as I will face the weaning part soon. I plan to move out west with my fiancee and don't want to be hitched to a drug that I have to get from a new pharmacy, doc, etc and feel the shame that I feel when I walk out of the store with a bottle so big it can't fit into my purse. And yes, I walk every day, do yoga, lift weights, etc and eat well. I don't drink anymore and just DON"T want to be in pain all the time. So if they grant me disability I will be able to lay flat and decompress my spine when I hurt and not sit at a desk all day with my head pushing down on exposed nerves.
Thank you for listening. You are all so brave and wise. There are many of us out there in the same boat. We didn't ask for this pain or want to take the medication. Keep looking for that great pain management clinic or doctor and keep praying.
Wish me luck, I need it.
zoe
I am a health care practitioner, RN, Massage Therapist and Reiki Practitioner. I have dealt with Chronic pain for 23 years since my head took out the side window of my car when I was hit broadside. I have had severe pain since the first time I opened my eyes after the hit and now the damage to my neck has progressed to all the blah blah blah things that happens as your spine ages and nerve sheaths are missing and on and on. Suffice to say that I feel guilt and shame every time I swallow a Vicoprophen to be able to go to work and beat myself up sitting for 6 or 7 hours at a computer, writing, on the phone and somehow they call this nursing, So- I am filing for permanent disability from my job and am seeing the 4th pain management guy in 23 years and they injected me with botox which I am waiting to see if it works. Yes, I feel the pleasure of being pain free when I take the medication and I can get up and start a day that everyone else seems to- a day where you make a cup of coffee without crying or wondering if you can sit and write without your hands going numb and the pain searing through your head, neck and back. When I have surgery, I take a pain pill or 2, ice up and elevate and love the feeling when it no longer hurts and the body has healed itself. Or the headache you get when you have a cold and it is going to go away after you take a nap. But, what do you do about chronic, nagging pain that disables you? You do the best you can, monitor for side effects, don't drink with the meds and pray that you will find a solution to your problem. I pray that the botox will work (it takes 2 weeks to know) and that I can start to wean. But who knows? I have read a lot about suboxone and the receptors and it seems like a good way to get off that 3 day feverish bout, esp if you are like me and take 8-10 doses in 24 hours. My doc has only 4 patients that he prescribes to, as he knows the ramifications but is a good man and wants people to lead the best lives they can.
I will be visiting with you all again if OK, as I will face the weaning part soon. I plan to move out west with my fiancee and don't want to be hitched to a drug that I have to get from a new pharmacy, doc, etc and feel the shame that I feel when I walk out of the store with a bottle so big it can't fit into my purse. And yes, I walk every day, do yoga, lift weights, etc and eat well. I don't drink anymore and just DON"T want to be in pain all the time. So if they grant me disability I will be able to lay flat and decompress my spine when I hurt and not sit at a desk all day with my head pushing down on exposed nerves.
Thank you for listening. You are all so brave and wise. There are many of us out there in the same boat. We didn't ask for this pain or want to take the medication. Keep looking for that great pain management clinic or doctor and keep praying.
Wish me luck, I need it.
zoe
Futute doc, you make some good (excellent) points. One can be honest without divulging information such as this, particularly information that might twist opinion and ruin reputations.
The main point I meant to make to Monkeyfeet was that the Ativan might help with sleep during the withdrawals. My own doctor is a good man, who I can be honest with, but most aren't.
Future doc, I hope you do become a doc. Then perhaps the world will have a doctor that they can trust. You've a good person.
The main point I meant to make to Monkeyfeet was that the Ativan might help with sleep during the withdrawals. My own doctor is a good man, who I can be honest with, but most aren't.
Future doc, I hope you do become a doc. Then perhaps the world will have a doctor that they can trust. You've a good person.
I would not give the pills to anyone. Especially your doctor. It will put a red flag up and will not do you any good in the future. I would lock the pills up somewhere safe and use them ONLY when you need them. Ativan is one of the protocols to get you through irritable periods during withdrawl, so it will help. No, you won't get addicted to Ativan as long as you use it during the withdrawl phase and then discontinue. Five to seven days is the normal protocol and the hydrocodone should be all out of your system and withdrawl symptoms either gone or almost gone.
Sometimes honesty is NOT the best policy. You have to look out for yourself. Many people are quick to judge and jump to conclusions when it comes to subjects like this. Unless you KNOW your doctor very intimately and trust him/her completely, I would go off the meds alone. You have a good strategy. Another idea would be to just take the hydrocodone as directed for pain (if you really need it.) You can put yourself on what we call a drug holiday once a month and not take any hydrocodone for a couple days. If you can do this, you will continually control the amount of tolerance your body builds up against the opiates. In turn, you will go back to needing less medicine to reach therapeutic levels.
Hope this helps.
Sometimes honesty is NOT the best policy. You have to look out for yourself. Many people are quick to judge and jump to conclusions when it comes to subjects like this. Unless you KNOW your doctor very intimately and trust him/her completely, I would go off the meds alone. You have a good strategy. Another idea would be to just take the hydrocodone as directed for pain (if you really need it.) You can put yourself on what we call a drug holiday once a month and not take any hydrocodone for a couple days. If you can do this, you will continually control the amount of tolerance your body builds up against the opiates. In turn, you will go back to needing less medicine to reach therapeutic levels.
Hope this helps.
Cold Turkey is difficult, can be unhealthy without supervision, and may give you restless nights, until accomplished. Getting sleep may help you feel better during that withdrawal period which seems to be different with each person. As for whether to give the pills back to the doctor, if you trust him/her, perhaps a conversation about it might help you decide about the "pills" and the Ativan.
Guilt plays a big role in these decisions sometimes. For me, I've found that decisions based on how they truly affect my life, not how guilty I feel, usually work best. Guilt is often projected by "other people" but manifested painfully in ourselves.
This board seems to be a good place to "vent" which also helps. I know this doesn't help much, but its my 2 cents worth.
I'm on day one...again. I tried this a few months ago and as you all can see i didn't make it. I got through a few days but it was too much. What i dont know what to do with is the fact i have extra pills. I want off now. I know i'm keeping them around as a safety net, but how should ig et rid of them. Take them to my doc, flush them what?? Any insight will help. I have ativan too. My doc prescribed me that to help me sleep. should i take that to help with the withdrawl. i don't want to get addicted that to that in turn. Thanks
Anna
Anna
Sorry I wasn't able to respond sooner to your question. I wanted to be able to devote the proper time.
What do you do with the pain?
What if you REALLY need the painkillers to be a productive person, or more productive?
GREAT question!
I have an answer, and then something to consider.
My answer is, then you need to take them. It's that simple. If you have chronic pain, you need them and should take a therapeutic dosage to kill or decrease the pain. That is what they are there for.
I couldn't agree with you more that doctors have established a stigma with these drugs in recent years. The reason is our governement. The DEA keeps track and will investigate physicians who treat many patients with "chronic pain."
The physicians, in turn, don't want to even have to deal with these patients. It's sad. Our society is turning into a place where physicians are harrassed if they write too many scripts for too many people, for pain.
I'm talking about the narcotic pain killers that are classified as more dangerous by our government.
Most of the narcotic pain killers that work very well are opiate derivatives. If one takes, or is able to take, one of these painkiller drugs at a therapeutic dosage, experience relief of pain, and continue with this dosage for extended periods of time, there would probably not be many problems, or concerns.
Unfortunately, there is a certain phenomenon that happens when one takes these drugs. It's not every single person, but it is many. It's because of our physiology or body makeup.
I feel you are a very intelligent person and you already know all of this so please forgive me if you know this already. I'll explain for the others that may not.
Our brains have natural endorphin, or opiate receptors sites that bond with natural brain endorphins, or pain killers that are produced by the brain. The pharmaceutical companies have duplicated these molecular structures and found that in therapeutic dosage they kill pain very well.
The problem is, when you take a synthetic opiate over extended periods of time, the opiate brain receptor sites multiply. This is a natural defense mechanism that our body has, as it thinks there is an outside chemical being introduced and it needs to defend itself. When our brains make more of these receptors sites the drug starts losing its effectiveness. Hence, it's time to increase the dosage in order to kill the pain like it did three months ago.
This continues to happen and one will continually need to increase the dosage over months and years.
Physicians have to consider when does it stop?
The physician begins to get very concerned when 120 Vicodin are not doing the job as they did three months ago. Standard medical protocol tells physicians to up the dosage for a therapeutic level, or change medications to a stronger drug. If the drug of choice to begin with is Vicodin, and the dosage is increased over several months, and it no longer works, physicians know that it is normal protocol to switch medications to a stronger drug.
At this time the protocol would be to try a low dosage of perhaps Percocet, or oxycodone. Physicians know that this will probably kill the pain but after three to six months the dosage will need to be increased. Hence this cycle continues until one is needing demeral or morphine shots. Some will need a morphine pump surgically installed.
This does not happen with everyone, but it is very common. It is more common than you might think and physicians have to deal with this on a day-to-day basis. Not only do they have to deal with this and try their best to keep their patients safe and pain-free, but they have to worry about the government stepping in, investigating them, and perhaps trying to put a damper on what they're doing. This further complicates the whole chronic pain syndrome "physician to patient relationship." Physicians simply don't want to have to deal with this.
I hope you get the picture.
What I just spoke of was all therapeutic and what happens to someone who is truly trying to kill pain. Next, consider people with addictive personalities. These people when they are experiencing chronic pain, will take a painkiller, and experience good results, which it should. However they enjoy the side effect of euphoria that comes with it. One might ask what's wrong with that?
There's nothing wrong with that if they are able to control their self and not increase the dosage on their own. However, many of these people will begin to increase their own dosage for the side effect of euphoria. This further speeds up the process of their brain multiplying the receptors sites and then needing a higher dosage, and perhaps a stronger medication before long. There is a difference between drug dependency and being addicted.
One who is self controlled and takes these drugs as directed by a physician, could be dependent on them to remain pain-free or productive. One who is addicted needs these drugs to remain pain-free and keep their emotions at a level that they can handle life.
This further convolutes the way these medications are perceived and used in our society. When you factor in that many are selling these drugs on the street, this further concerns physicians.
This board is for people that are honest with themselves. The people that are addicted to these drugs and need them not only for killing pain, but also for the other affects that help them make it from day-to-day that are perhaps not considered a good thing by physicians. These people have made a personal choice to get off of these meds. These people have chosen not to take these drugs and try to find another way to kill pain without going through this messy cycle. These people also realize it's getting more difficult to find physicians who will use these drugs to kill pain. As I stated, physicians are getting fearful of using them because of their knowledge of what they can do and also what can happen to them.
So there you have it. I'm sorry my response was so long and I certainly do not mean to speak pious.
I hope that by the time I receive my M.D. degree, pharmaceutical companies will find a way to improve pain killers.
The opiate receptors sites that I spoke about in the brain are very complicated. From what I've read there are several different kinds that we know about right now. These opiate receptors sites could be divided into alpha, beta, and gamma sites.
It seems that the popular pain killers that are distributed now, and that can cause problems, target the alpha sites. There are drugs that can target the gamma site, which does not multiply as quickly, if at all. I don't know about the beta sites. I might be incorrect with the specifics, but the idea is correct.
The point is, if the pharmaceutical companies could create a medication that would target one of the receptors cites that do not multiply, we would have a medication that would kill pain effectively and not have as much potential for abuse. In fact, the therapeutic dose found to kill pain in the beginning, would kill pain indefinitely. If this were possible, this drug would be the drug of choice for many cases. I would certainly be on it myself for my chronic back pain.
When I'm a physician, I will certainly prescribe medications as they are intended. If there is a medication that I know about that kills pain effectively and it works in the patient, I will monitor them and continue them on it. That is considered good medicine. However, if I treated one person with chronic pain, monitor them and experienced a good outcome, this patient would probably tell another patient with chronic pain about me. Before long, I would have many people with chronic pain coming to me. Perhaps I could monitor them and treat them with medication to keep them productive and pain under control.
However, as I stated above, there would be a red flag established that I was distributing a higher amount of these pain killers than the national average of physicians in the nation. This would trigger an investigation. Then I would have to ask myself do I really want to deal with this?
The question you pose is very good, but complicated.
It seems that physicians have to make their own decision how to approach these drugs and more importantly, the patient needs to make a decision if they want to remain on the drug and deal with the complications that arise while being on it. There's many things to consider here.
But the person that has been on them, and made a decision to get off of them because they know there is more negatives associated with it than positives, for them personally, will need help. This is where a faith in God comes to play. I did not mean that the medications were tools of the devil. If they are abused, they could be. But I realize that is not the case with everyone.
Sincerely,
future_doc
What do you do with the pain?
What if you REALLY need the painkillers to be a productive person, or more productive?
GREAT question!
I have an answer, and then something to consider.
My answer is, then you need to take them. It's that simple. If you have chronic pain, you need them and should take a therapeutic dosage to kill or decrease the pain. That is what they are there for.
I couldn't agree with you more that doctors have established a stigma with these drugs in recent years. The reason is our governement. The DEA keeps track and will investigate physicians who treat many patients with "chronic pain."
The physicians, in turn, don't want to even have to deal with these patients. It's sad. Our society is turning into a place where physicians are harrassed if they write too many scripts for too many people, for pain.
I'm talking about the narcotic pain killers that are classified as more dangerous by our government.
Most of the narcotic pain killers that work very well are opiate derivatives. If one takes, or is able to take, one of these painkiller drugs at a therapeutic dosage, experience relief of pain, and continue with this dosage for extended periods of time, there would probably not be many problems, or concerns.
Unfortunately, there is a certain phenomenon that happens when one takes these drugs. It's not every single person, but it is many. It's because of our physiology or body makeup.
I feel you are a very intelligent person and you already know all of this so please forgive me if you know this already. I'll explain for the others that may not.
Our brains have natural endorphin, or opiate receptors sites that bond with natural brain endorphins, or pain killers that are produced by the brain. The pharmaceutical companies have duplicated these molecular structures and found that in therapeutic dosage they kill pain very well.
The problem is, when you take a synthetic opiate over extended periods of time, the opiate brain receptor sites multiply. This is a natural defense mechanism that our body has, as it thinks there is an outside chemical being introduced and it needs to defend itself. When our brains make more of these receptors sites the drug starts losing its effectiveness. Hence, it's time to increase the dosage in order to kill the pain like it did three months ago.
This continues to happen and one will continually need to increase the dosage over months and years.
Physicians have to consider when does it stop?
The physician begins to get very concerned when 120 Vicodin are not doing the job as they did three months ago. Standard medical protocol tells physicians to up the dosage for a therapeutic level, or change medications to a stronger drug. If the drug of choice to begin with is Vicodin, and the dosage is increased over several months, and it no longer works, physicians know that it is normal protocol to switch medications to a stronger drug.
At this time the protocol would be to try a low dosage of perhaps Percocet, or oxycodone. Physicians know that this will probably kill the pain but after three to six months the dosage will need to be increased. Hence this cycle continues until one is needing demeral or morphine shots. Some will need a morphine pump surgically installed.
This does not happen with everyone, but it is very common. It is more common than you might think and physicians have to deal with this on a day-to-day basis. Not only do they have to deal with this and try their best to keep their patients safe and pain-free, but they have to worry about the government stepping in, investigating them, and perhaps trying to put a damper on what they're doing. This further complicates the whole chronic pain syndrome "physician to patient relationship." Physicians simply don't want to have to deal with this.
I hope you get the picture.
What I just spoke of was all therapeutic and what happens to someone who is truly trying to kill pain. Next, consider people with addictive personalities. These people when they are experiencing chronic pain, will take a painkiller, and experience good results, which it should. However they enjoy the side effect of euphoria that comes with it. One might ask what's wrong with that?
There's nothing wrong with that if they are able to control their self and not increase the dosage on their own. However, many of these people will begin to increase their own dosage for the side effect of euphoria. This further speeds up the process of their brain multiplying the receptors sites and then needing a higher dosage, and perhaps a stronger medication before long. There is a difference between drug dependency and being addicted.
One who is self controlled and takes these drugs as directed by a physician, could be dependent on them to remain pain-free or productive. One who is addicted needs these drugs to remain pain-free and keep their emotions at a level that they can handle life.
This further convolutes the way these medications are perceived and used in our society. When you factor in that many are selling these drugs on the street, this further concerns physicians.
This board is for people that are honest with themselves. The people that are addicted to these drugs and need them not only for killing pain, but also for the other affects that help them make it from day-to-day that are perhaps not considered a good thing by physicians. These people have made a personal choice to get off of these meds. These people have chosen not to take these drugs and try to find another way to kill pain without going through this messy cycle. These people also realize it's getting more difficult to find physicians who will use these drugs to kill pain. As I stated, physicians are getting fearful of using them because of their knowledge of what they can do and also what can happen to them.
So there you have it. I'm sorry my response was so long and I certainly do not mean to speak pious.
I hope that by the time I receive my M.D. degree, pharmaceutical companies will find a way to improve pain killers.
The opiate receptors sites that I spoke about in the brain are very complicated. From what I've read there are several different kinds that we know about right now. These opiate receptors sites could be divided into alpha, beta, and gamma sites.
It seems that the popular pain killers that are distributed now, and that can cause problems, target the alpha sites. There are drugs that can target the gamma site, which does not multiply as quickly, if at all. I don't know about the beta sites. I might be incorrect with the specifics, but the idea is correct.
The point is, if the pharmaceutical companies could create a medication that would target one of the receptors cites that do not multiply, we would have a medication that would kill pain effectively and not have as much potential for abuse. In fact, the therapeutic dose found to kill pain in the beginning, would kill pain indefinitely. If this were possible, this drug would be the drug of choice for many cases. I would certainly be on it myself for my chronic back pain.
When I'm a physician, I will certainly prescribe medications as they are intended. If there is a medication that I know about that kills pain effectively and it works in the patient, I will monitor them and continue them on it. That is considered good medicine. However, if I treated one person with chronic pain, monitor them and experienced a good outcome, this patient would probably tell another patient with chronic pain about me. Before long, I would have many people with chronic pain coming to me. Perhaps I could monitor them and treat them with medication to keep them productive and pain under control.
However, as I stated above, there would be a red flag established that I was distributing a higher amount of these pain killers than the national average of physicians in the nation. This would trigger an investigation. Then I would have to ask myself do I really want to deal with this?
The question you pose is very good, but complicated.
It seems that physicians have to make their own decision how to approach these drugs and more importantly, the patient needs to make a decision if they want to remain on the drug and deal with the complications that arise while being on it. There's many things to consider here.
But the person that has been on them, and made a decision to get off of them because they know there is more negatives associated with it than positives, for them personally, will need help. This is where a faith in God comes to play. I did not mean that the medications were tools of the devil. If they are abused, they could be. But I realize that is not the case with everyone.
Sincerely,
future_doc
Excellent answer. Thank you. Your answer does help. What better place to get an answer to my question than a board full of others who have felt pain, whether one still takes the pills or not. I appreciate the hospitality and completely respect those who have made the decision to stop.
I see the comments about getting off the pain pills and have a question. What about the pain? Where did the pain go? Perhaps these comments are based on pain that goes away, thus the pills are no longer necessary. In that case, of course. Stop taking them.
Are there not however, some people that have such chronic pain from multiple sources? Relief from this kind of pain may be their only sense of well being, of feeling normal. I see it both ways. I know addiction is "bad", but I've also seen a lot of pain in this world. The resistance of doctors to prescribe medication that would really help causes serious problems contributing to folks dying in severe pain, when the technology exists to help them.
What do you do with the pain, and I mean in a literal sense, chronic pain?
You don't have to have cancer or have been told that you are going to die, to present symptoms of chronic pain.
Sign me: Considering this issue
Are there not however, some people that have such chronic pain from multiple sources? Relief from this kind of pain may be their only sense of well being, of feeling normal. I see it both ways. I know addiction is "bad", but I've also seen a lot of pain in this world. The resistance of doctors to prescribe medication that would really help causes serious problems contributing to folks dying in severe pain, when the technology exists to help them.
What do you do with the pain, and I mean in a literal sense, chronic pain?
You don't have to have cancer or have been told that you are going to die, to present symptoms of chronic pain.
Sign me: Considering this issue
Hi, you pose a good question. I am weaning off the pills and my hands hurt. I have arthritis, pretty bad for my age, and have had 1 surgery, still in pain. I understand about the religous aspect too. I am jewish, and I don't know much about the concept of giving everything up to the lord. as jews, we are taught more about questioning, and studying and not as much about blind faith. I would never claim anyone's religous choices are right or wrong, I just know what works for me. I hope saying blind faith is not offending anyone, Jewish people don't have any type of face for god, so we have a kind of blind faith too. I try not to get too down on my situitation because I have my meds prescribed, and I have a legit. condition, but I do have an addiction not only physically, but mentally too. I will try to deal with the physical pain of my arthritis with non-narcotic meds. Then I will be able to acess better the need i have for pills, did that make sense?
Excuse me for speaking again, before being spoken to, but I am looking for a real answer here. I am a Christian who tries to think "what would Jesus do" when presented with life, its problems and its opportunities. Please try not to oversimplify my question with a "put it in the hands of God" answer. I see this thread going that way. I do not belittle the power of prayer, but often we are left on our own to make the best of what we get. future_doc, it sounds like you have many issues to work with and I hope the best for you. I hope that coming down slowly on the dosage works for you. I'm not sure what you're saying with the comment on men and child abuse, but being abused is no excure to abuse.
Perhaps pain is real and part of what we feel on this earth, whether its a lesson or simply a part of the deal. I watched my Mother die, while my wife and kids took care of both sick parents for several years, until they both passed away. My mother was in pain for years, with broken disks in her back. She was given something strong enough to really work for her, that made her more comfortable, finally but only 3 months before she died.
Literally, where does the pain go when you stop taking the pills? I am assuming that all are getting their pills legally with presctiptions. Any different sourcing is not my affair. I do NOT accept that pain pills are always and in every case, a tool of the devil. If you tell me that they are, then I know I'm in the wrong place seeking help.
Yes it made sense. Perfectly and "real". Thanks for taking my comments the way they were intended. I'm not very good at blind faith either. Right or wrong, I find myself, looking for the historical events and tangible things that prove the existance of whatever I'm interested in. I do believe in the power of God, absolutely. I don't mean to contradict anyones feelings on religion or how faith in God has made them stronger. I respect that.
My question comes from seeing and feeling pain and wondering where that line is between chronic pain and medication. I'm sorry but I don't swallow that these pills are the work of the devil. If you are hurting enough, they can seem to be from Heaven..... I'll be back. I'm not a young man out looking for a good time. I'm 50+ with some life behind me facing my mortality.
I just wanted you both to know I am thinking of you and praying for you today!!
keep me posted on how your doing, ok??
I'm weak, and fight still!
love,
Kissy
keep me posted on how your doing, ok??
I'm weak, and fight still!
love,
Kissy
I am so convinced that your prayers are working. Please feel the power of the LORD through HIS word and prayer. Prayer DOES make things change. Prayer DOES make people change. I can feel all of your prayers!
It seems I can come up with many "excuses" to try and numb myself. My most frequent one is being abused as a child. I somehow think my "numbing" myself instead of following in the footsteps of a perverted stepfather, is somehow justified. But really, it's not.
I'm responsible for myself and my own actions. I have sometimes thought that there are NO good men out there that ought to be left alone with a child. In my own mind, it seems if you line up ten men at random, perhaps eight would be potential child abusers in some way or another. This has so troubled my heart that I have, in the past, told GOD, "I need to be numb because I simply feel TOO MUCH when I'm not numb."
We all have our "reasons." But, like scarlet99 said, any reason that would lead us to a drug, as opposed to running to GOD for help, is a LIE straight from the greatest deceiver. He doesn't even deserve a capital letter, if you ask me.
But you know what?
With all of the rationalization that the deceiver can produce in our minds and create a path for us to take a pill, GOD has also created a path that leads to HIM! And that means the end of THAT path is LOVE, JOY, PEACE and HAPPINESS for us and our families. The deceived path leads to DEATH! That's right, a slow, loss of everything we work for and love. As I sit here at my keyboard, my hands are shaking. I only had one norco today. My mind is telling me you had three yesterday, you can have two today, and that's still progress. There is another voice that is saying, "Be still, and know that I am all you need and I will help you through this." The reason I am able to take only ONE pill today is because of prayer. Your prayers, and mine.
Please!
Feel GOD'S never ending love! I will pray hard for you all. Even Jesus said that there are cases that require prayer. (When his disciples asked him why they weren't able to cast out a demon.) His love and strength will replace your weakness when you think you need to take something. Not only that, but I think if you run to GOD, instead of a chemical, HE will also reward you in a way that is unique only to you. Because like what was already stated, HE knew you before you were ever born.
HE knows what would please your heart. The problem is, or my problem is, GOD'S time is not always on our clock. If you're looking for the reward immediately, you may get the wrong impression that GOD has forgot, or denied you. But HE has his time in mind. And believe me, NO ONE can out give GOD when it comes to TRUE love, happiness, and blessings.
It seems, all of us here have the same temptations and problems. We have felt similar pains and struggles in dealing with these drugs. We all know the RIGHT thing to do. We must strengthen each other through prayer and help hold each other up. That's what a church is for.
Remember, the pain WILL pass.
With love and deep prayer for you all,
future_doc
It seems I can come up with many "excuses" to try and numb myself. My most frequent one is being abused as a child. I somehow think my "numbing" myself instead of following in the footsteps of a perverted stepfather, is somehow justified. But really, it's not.
I'm responsible for myself and my own actions. I have sometimes thought that there are NO good men out there that ought to be left alone with a child. In my own mind, it seems if you line up ten men at random, perhaps eight would be potential child abusers in some way or another. This has so troubled my heart that I have, in the past, told GOD, "I need to be numb because I simply feel TOO MUCH when I'm not numb."
We all have our "reasons." But, like scarlet99 said, any reason that would lead us to a drug, as opposed to running to GOD for help, is a LIE straight from the greatest deceiver. He doesn't even deserve a capital letter, if you ask me.
But you know what?
With all of the rationalization that the deceiver can produce in our minds and create a path for us to take a pill, GOD has also created a path that leads to HIM! And that means the end of THAT path is LOVE, JOY, PEACE and HAPPINESS for us and our families. The deceived path leads to DEATH! That's right, a slow, loss of everything we work for and love. As I sit here at my keyboard, my hands are shaking. I only had one norco today. My mind is telling me you had three yesterday, you can have two today, and that's still progress. There is another voice that is saying, "Be still, and know that I am all you need and I will help you through this." The reason I am able to take only ONE pill today is because of prayer. Your prayers, and mine.
Please!
Feel GOD'S never ending love! I will pray hard for you all. Even Jesus said that there are cases that require prayer. (When his disciples asked him why they weren't able to cast out a demon.) His love and strength will replace your weakness when you think you need to take something. Not only that, but I think if you run to GOD, instead of a chemical, HE will also reward you in a way that is unique only to you. Because like what was already stated, HE knew you before you were ever born.
HE knows what would please your heart. The problem is, or my problem is, GOD'S time is not always on our clock. If you're looking for the reward immediately, you may get the wrong impression that GOD has forgot, or denied you. But HE has his time in mind. And believe me, NO ONE can out give GOD when it comes to TRUE love, happiness, and blessings.
It seems, all of us here have the same temptations and problems. We have felt similar pains and struggles in dealing with these drugs. We all know the RIGHT thing to do. We must strengthen each other through prayer and help hold each other up. That's what a church is for.
Remember, the pain WILL pass.
With love and deep prayer for you all,
future_doc
Hi guys...I don't have time right now to really express myself to you both...but I just couldn't keep from crying through your last posts about God and His love for us...His prescence and the truth of your words just filled the room I'm in, and lifted me up, and I could feel God...tears just streaming down my face.
Thank you for posting your hearts and minds here...I come to this site to get encouragement to keep on walking in sobriety, and into wholeness, and truly, God has used so many of you, on here to give me hope, motivation, and the strength to fight my unhealthy desires...and now, most importantly, your words have turned my eyes, and heart to God. And I know for me, wholeness and what I look for in the drugs, in really in God. And what He has for me...
Sincerely,
Kissy
you all are in my prayers!
Thank you for posting your hearts and minds here...I come to this site to get encouragement to keep on walking in sobriety, and into wholeness, and truly, God has used so many of you, on here to give me hope, motivation, and the strength to fight my unhealthy desires...and now, most importantly, your words have turned my eyes, and heart to God. And I know for me, wholeness and what I look for in the drugs, in really in God. And what He has for me...
Sincerely,
Kissy
you all are in my prayers!
Futuredoc,
WOW that is an awesome testimony!
That voice you hear, the one that tells you God is 'mad at you...' I think you know WHO that is...and he is also known by another name..the DECIEVER...and the deiciever doesn't want any of us to come to God at all....the deciever will try and do whatever he can to pull us away from God, using our own guilt and shame against us, BUT JESUS took all that away on the cross--Jesus took our guilt, shame, our SINS each and every one of them upon Himself, so we have no guilt or shame when we call upon the name of Christ to save us.
Even when we stumble and fall---Jesus is there to pick us up again and dust us off, so we can start over fresh.
You have to figure, NOTHING we can ever do will surprise God...He knows our whole lives before we have ever lived it. He knows we are going to screw up now and again, and He also knows that we come to Him for forgiveness and He is always there to forgive us. He looks at us, and doesn't see our sins...He sees us covered in the righteousness of His Son's blood, shed for us.
Futuredoc, you are a wonderful witness for the Lord, and He will continue to help you and bless you in your fight to get off these pills..you have done so well already...Keep up the good work, and the great witnessing!
:)
Jennifer
WOW that is an awesome testimony!
That voice you hear, the one that tells you God is 'mad at you...' I think you know WHO that is...and he is also known by another name..the DECIEVER...and the deiciever doesn't want any of us to come to God at all....the deciever will try and do whatever he can to pull us away from God, using our own guilt and shame against us, BUT JESUS took all that away on the cross--Jesus took our guilt, shame, our SINS each and every one of them upon Himself, so we have no guilt or shame when we call upon the name of Christ to save us.
Even when we stumble and fall---Jesus is there to pick us up again and dust us off, so we can start over fresh.
You have to figure, NOTHING we can ever do will surprise God...He knows our whole lives before we have ever lived it. He knows we are going to screw up now and again, and He also knows that we come to Him for forgiveness and He is always there to forgive us. He looks at us, and doesn't see our sins...He sees us covered in the righteousness of His Son's blood, shed for us.
Futuredoc, you are a wonderful witness for the Lord, and He will continue to help you and bless you in your fight to get off these pills..you have done so well already...Keep up the good work, and the great witnessing!
:)
Jennifer
Hello,
Thank you for the treasure of the LORD'S word you gave me. I'm down to three norco 10/325 a day now. I was sitting in the doctor's office just yesterday to get some last vaccine shots for medical school. I grabbed the children's Bible Story Book.
I read how GOD prepared the world, hoping Adam would be pleased and love Him in return for the detail in which he prepared the world - for him! Can you imagine GOD hoping to please Adam? WOW! What love! What feeling! Our GOD has feelings!
Then, yes then...
The way the children's story described it made me even forget the irritating woman in the waiting room who kept coughing.
The story said that GOD waited until last to create his most precious belonging. Man. GOD formed him with his own hands. And when it was time for Adam to wake up, it described GOD as hovering over him with his Holy Spirit. Then GOD BREATHED into him. And the child's book said, who knows, GOD may have even kissed him with a holy kiss of life, with tears in his eyes. When Adam open his eyes, he saw the face of GOD looking down at him. "Hello Adam!" I'm your father!
Can you imagine the great love GOD had for him? Can you imagine what Adam felt? God did not let him go without ANYTHING! God's feelings were hurt when Adam was lonesome. He responded with a wife for Adam.
In fact, God so loves mankind that when Satan facilitated the wall of sin between us and GOD. Instead of starting all over, GOD made a plan to correct what Satan had stolen from us. GOD sent his son to fix things. Now, there is NO WALL between us and the LORD anymore.
Think of GOD'S feelings for a moment. He is ALL STRENGTH, ALL KNOWING, AND ALMIGHTY! There is none stronger. But he has feelings. How could I EVER want to hurt such a precious GOD?
Do you think that GOD'S love has changed? NO!
"I Change NOT!" Says the Lord Almighty!
Just think, all that GOD wanted back from Adam, and us, is for us to love him. But Jesus then said, "If you love me, you will obey me."
Immediately, my heart melted. Oh GOD, how could anyone NOT love you?
Then, I begged GOD to hover over me tonight with his HOLY SPIRIT, and BREATH into me. AGAIN! Remove all the wickedness, and replace it with HIM! My heart raced and I felt GOD's presence immediately. OHHH, but will it last? I've felt this before. Repentance. I think I need to repent every day and give up my rights, and ask GOD to take over. Perhaps every minute of the day. It seems there is not a minute that goes by that GOD is not on my mind. My down fall is that a voice tells me, "He's mad at you! So don't go to HIM! You've taken another pill! Forget it! He's tired of your same old story. He's tired of your pathetic, 'George Bailey' pleas to him, just for you to turn around and rebel, and stray from him."
But He's not! GOD is faithful! GOD says if you humble yourself, confess your sins, and turn from them and instead to HIM, you get to start all over! He will forget your wrongs! Thank GOD HIS ways are not our ways. Because I would have given up on me long ago. You see, I know my manipulative ways. I can hide it from mankind. But not from myself or GOD. But I can come to GOD and confess my manipulative ways and ask him to change them. TO change me. To change me from selfish, to selfless. From leading by ego, to leading by faith. The key is, KEEP YOUR EYES AND THOUGHTS FOCUSED ON HIM!
And I looked up into heaven and would have given my right arm to just crawl around on the LORD, like a little child. Embracing, hugging and kissing him. As a child that has been away from a dear parent. Please, never let me go LORD, NEVER! My heart has been committed back to my creator. I know that one day, I WILL kneel at his feet, and kiss the holy ground HE walks on. I wish I could be an angel for him. But I think he made us even more special.
I'm sorry for the sermon.
I just had to share this with you. You all have been on my mind so very much. I think we all have addictive personalities. But the key here is to turn from what Satan has said, is good, to what GOD said, is good.
It is good for us to be sober and ingest every word that comes from his mouth and treasure it for what it is.
He knows our weaknesses and will turn them to strengths! But we must keep our eyes on HIM! There is no other way!
Each of us has to wean, or go off drugs in the way best for the individual.
But plow on! Keep the fight. Your reward is near! Better feelings are on the way! I pray for you all and I bless you all. May GOD keep you, and reward, and comfort you. May he strengthen you, and RENEW YOU!
Sincerely,
Future doc
Thank you for the treasure of the LORD'S word you gave me. I'm down to three norco 10/325 a day now. I was sitting in the doctor's office just yesterday to get some last vaccine shots for medical school. I grabbed the children's Bible Story Book.
I read how GOD prepared the world, hoping Adam would be pleased and love Him in return for the detail in which he prepared the world - for him! Can you imagine GOD hoping to please Adam? WOW! What love! What feeling! Our GOD has feelings!
Then, yes then...
The way the children's story described it made me even forget the irritating woman in the waiting room who kept coughing.
The story said that GOD waited until last to create his most precious belonging. Man. GOD formed him with his own hands. And when it was time for Adam to wake up, it described GOD as hovering over him with his Holy Spirit. Then GOD BREATHED into him. And the child's book said, who knows, GOD may have even kissed him with a holy kiss of life, with tears in his eyes. When Adam open his eyes, he saw the face of GOD looking down at him. "Hello Adam!" I'm your father!
Can you imagine the great love GOD had for him? Can you imagine what Adam felt? God did not let him go without ANYTHING! God's feelings were hurt when Adam was lonesome. He responded with a wife for Adam.
In fact, God so loves mankind that when Satan facilitated the wall of sin between us and GOD. Instead of starting all over, GOD made a plan to correct what Satan had stolen from us. GOD sent his son to fix things. Now, there is NO WALL between us and the LORD anymore.
Think of GOD'S feelings for a moment. He is ALL STRENGTH, ALL KNOWING, AND ALMIGHTY! There is none stronger. But he has feelings. How could I EVER want to hurt such a precious GOD?
Do you think that GOD'S love has changed? NO!
"I Change NOT!" Says the Lord Almighty!
Just think, all that GOD wanted back from Adam, and us, is for us to love him. But Jesus then said, "If you love me, you will obey me."
Immediately, my heart melted. Oh GOD, how could anyone NOT love you?
Then, I begged GOD to hover over me tonight with his HOLY SPIRIT, and BREATH into me. AGAIN! Remove all the wickedness, and replace it with HIM! My heart raced and I felt GOD's presence immediately. OHHH, but will it last? I've felt this before. Repentance. I think I need to repent every day and give up my rights, and ask GOD to take over. Perhaps every minute of the day. It seems there is not a minute that goes by that GOD is not on my mind. My down fall is that a voice tells me, "He's mad at you! So don't go to HIM! You've taken another pill! Forget it! He's tired of your same old story. He's tired of your pathetic, 'George Bailey' pleas to him, just for you to turn around and rebel, and stray from him."
But He's not! GOD is faithful! GOD says if you humble yourself, confess your sins, and turn from them and instead to HIM, you get to start all over! He will forget your wrongs! Thank GOD HIS ways are not our ways. Because I would have given up on me long ago. You see, I know my manipulative ways. I can hide it from mankind. But not from myself or GOD. But I can come to GOD and confess my manipulative ways and ask him to change them. TO change me. To change me from selfish, to selfless. From leading by ego, to leading by faith. The key is, KEEP YOUR EYES AND THOUGHTS FOCUSED ON HIM!
And I looked up into heaven and would have given my right arm to just crawl around on the LORD, like a little child. Embracing, hugging and kissing him. As a child that has been away from a dear parent. Please, never let me go LORD, NEVER! My heart has been committed back to my creator. I know that one day, I WILL kneel at his feet, and kiss the holy ground HE walks on. I wish I could be an angel for him. But I think he made us even more special.
I'm sorry for the sermon.
I just had to share this with you. You all have been on my mind so very much. I think we all have addictive personalities. But the key here is to turn from what Satan has said, is good, to what GOD said, is good.
It is good for us to be sober and ingest every word that comes from his mouth and treasure it for what it is.
He knows our weaknesses and will turn them to strengths! But we must keep our eyes on HIM! There is no other way!
Each of us has to wean, or go off drugs in the way best for the individual.
But plow on! Keep the fight. Your reward is near! Better feelings are on the way! I pray for you all and I bless you all. May GOD keep you, and reward, and comfort you. May he strengthen you, and RENEW YOU!
Sincerely,
Future doc
Hey sweetie!!! I was just thinking about you, and I prayed for you this morning!!
I know how hard this is for you, and keep on giving yourself the grace to be uncomfortable, etc. Just do what you have to do to get through this! I am achey and sweatin', and had feel sick, but definitely I feel better than yesterday!!! Oh yes! I was thinking that if I can do this, I will be feeling normal at Christmas, and be able to enjoy my family, truly!
Cakegirl, be strong! Your greatness isn't from the drugs...it is in you alone, and getting sober will free you to be the person full and beautiful, exciting and deep...your a beautiful child of God created so amazingly! Keep up the good work, and know I am with you in my thoughts and prayers, and I am going through the same thing as you!
Your friend,
Kissy!
I know how hard this is for you, and keep on giving yourself the grace to be uncomfortable, etc. Just do what you have to do to get through this! I am achey and sweatin', and had feel sick, but definitely I feel better than yesterday!!! Oh yes! I was thinking that if I can do this, I will be feeling normal at Christmas, and be able to enjoy my family, truly!
Cakegirl, be strong! Your greatness isn't from the drugs...it is in you alone, and getting sober will free you to be the person full and beautiful, exciting and deep...your a beautiful child of God created so amazingly! Keep up the good work, and know I am with you in my thoughts and prayers, and I am going through the same thing as you!
Your friend,
Kissy!
thanks, I wish I could get away from the computer and actually watch tv. I will be ready for the couch sooner than later. I am happy to hear that your having better and better days. I am proud of you and want to be there too. I am struggling. I will not give up, just having hard time with final break. Afraid of facing life without my crutch, even though that is what is making my life suck in the first place. At least I have hope from all the wonderful success stories I read here, and from my new friends and supporters. thanks talk to you soon
Hi!!! I made it through the day...the best part was the hot shower I took!!
I am here to support you getting off pills, and I just went cold turkey, and I think it sucks badly either way! The sooner you stop for good, the sooner you will feel normal again!! But if you need to slowly stop too, either way your on the road to recovery! Are you getting exersize? I need to do that! I just got naked juice's "superfood" smoothie, and took vitamins!!
I am here with you, and I prayed for you today!
You have so much insight!! I can tell, your a beautiful person!!
Your friend!
Kissy
oh, p.s. go rent your favorite comedy movie...and have fun!!
I am here to support you getting off pills, and I just went cold turkey, and I think it sucks badly either way! The sooner you stop for good, the sooner you will feel normal again!! But if you need to slowly stop too, either way your on the road to recovery! Are you getting exersize? I need to do that! I just got naked juice's "superfood" smoothie, and took vitamins!!
I am here with you, and I prayed for you today!
You have so much insight!! I can tell, your a beautiful person!!
Your friend!
Kissy
oh, p.s. go rent your favorite comedy movie...and have fun!!
how are you doing today? I am still taking less, and still achey. am I not doing myself any favors trying to wean? I feel like this is prolonging the suffering. Are mild aches and mood swings for a long time worse than intense suffering and possible nervous breakdowns for a short time. I don't know anymore. I wish there were an easier way, I am afraid to make the final break. what do you think. I do pray, and it helps, but I think god has his plan, and we must follow this what will be will be. Pray as if everything depended on God, act as if everything depended on you. Those who rise from prayer better people...their prayer is answered.
I meant to put your name on that last post. thought you might add me to your list and you and kissy to mine
Thank you sooooooooooooooooooo much for your kind words!! You made me cry,and what you said is exactly right for all of us!!! I was happy and vibrant before pain meds. I want that life again. I wont give up!
Please always know that your kindess has helped me be stronger, and comforted me during a difficult time! Thank you so sooo much, Cakegirl!
your awesome!!!
In this together!
Kissysissy!!!
Please always know that your kindess has helped me be stronger, and comforted me during a difficult time! Thank you so sooo much, Cakegirl!
your awesome!!!
In this together!
Kissysissy!!!
I came online tonight for help, and I really didn't know what it would be...I want to thank you all for all you wrote, it has helped me push through and I found hope in your comments, and the scripture you wrote in Jerm. brought me to tears, and drew my heart to Gods. I have been off morphine for a couple months now, but I got right onto vicodin, nonstop till just two days ago. I quit. I have been so weak, and it is hard to do everything, and sometimes I wonder if I can ever have a normal active life again. I am in my thirties, and watch all people older than me, with so much energy. I want a healthy life. I have chosen to stay sober. And be here to help encourage others to not let their lives be destroyed, to not loose this gift of life. And I need to not give up, and we all need to be strong and fight for our lives, and take better care of ourselves. I get so scared, because sometimes I am so alone, with out anyone to encourage me. Getting in the shower is so helpful to me. Finding out what brings me/us happiness, besides the meds. to fill our lives with. I want to make it, it is such a hard battle for me. And I want to thank you all for encouraging me to stay sober, and fight this. And live a purpose filled life.
sincerely,
kissysissy
sincerely,
kissysissy
I feel for you so much. I can hear the sorrow in your voice, but remember this: For the most part we were probally happyier when or before we triee drus or whatever we abused. I don't bevieve that happiness is not there. It is waiting for the clouds to clear so it can see and feel you again. The happy, young, free preson that is still inside of us somewhere. I am pissed that i have covered that part of my soul for too long. We need to fight for that. Soulsine.
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