liver shut down

[Daughter-in-law]

Hi,
This is my first time using this forum, so I hope I'm doing the right thing! My mother-in-law has pancreatic cancer. She was diagnosed almost two years ago.  She's been told her liver is being scarred by the chemo, and the cancer has spread to her liver some.  About a week ago she started getting jaundiced.  Her liver count gets higher each week.  I just want to know what we can expect.  Does this mean her liver might be shutting down?Does anyone know what kinds of symptoms would occur if the liver is shutting down? I realize this isn't medical advice, but I don't know how else to find the info. She doesn't ask the doctor questions because she doesn't want to know the answers.  
Thanks!

[imkindly]

Her blood tests would be the main indication of if her liver is failing or not.
Specifically:
Her ALBUMIN would drop too low.
Her Bilirubin would rise.
Her PT (Prothrombin Time) would rise.

Keep an eye on her albumin.

[Daughter-in-law]

Thank you. I am going to see if my sister-in-law can find out about the numbers. She is taking my mother-in-law to an appointment with the liver doctor Wednesday.  We all feel so clueless and if you don't know what to ask they don't necessarily tell you!

[groupmaster]

She should do liver cleanse, or she may die soon ...
It is serious as it can get, humans can not live without liver ...


Find more info here:
<a href=http://www.curezone.com/forums/forum.asp?ForumID=4>Liver Cleanse</a> and <a href=http://www.curezone.com/cleanse/>Here</a>

Good luck
Liza~

[imkindly]

your message: "do this...or she may die soon ..."
Is about as crass as it gets.

Scaring someone into using your "alternative" **** is pretty LOW.

[imkindly]

If you've never heard of "liver cleanses" and people like "Hulda Clark", you may want to take a quick look at this

http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Cancer/clark.html

It's just one, of many pages written about her.
You can read it yourself and form your own opinion.
Lots of legal troubles there.

[groupmaster]

I have seen that page. My opinion: He really don't know what he is talking about. He never tried that therapy.
That man talk bad about every single alt med thearpy.
Can you trust to his judgment ?


There is a difference between me and Dr.Barett (quackwatch)

I tried Hulda's therapy, and I am cured from multiple food allergies (in only 4 months), after parasites cleanse and after 8 liver cleanses.


Doctors have been unable to cure me in 20 years.


I read hundreds of stories of people who did eactly the same.
You can read it too, on that web site I  posted link to.

On the other side, you or Dr.Stephen Barett (quackwatch) never tried liver cleanse.

How can you judge something you have no clue about?

Try it, and then talk with me! OK!

All I am asking you is to dring olive oil and lemon juice. It's not some strange herbal mesicine. It's not rocket science!


And, when it comes to liver, it is is one of the most common factor causing death in patients who are undergoing chemo therapy for cancer. Can you die as a consequence of liver shut down?  Yes!


So, yes, people (few hundreds) die every day from chemo side efects!


Liza~

[imkindly]

No offense, but you sound uneducated.

[groupmaster]

Uneducated!?

Why that?

[Daughter-in-law]

My mother-in-law was diagnosed with the pancreatic cancer almost 2 years ago. It was inoperable and she has lived 1 1/2 years longer than expected. I don't mean to sound like we've given up, but the cancer has spread to her liver. I am not seeking any cures anymore. I'm just looking for information to have some idea what to expect next.  She has become weak and a bit jaundiced.  (Although I saw her last night and it wasn't as bad as I had expected.) She won't accept how sick she is, so she isn't very forthcoming with information or her family's access to the doctor.  She was told in November she should start hospice. She refused and has continued chemo. The doctors keep telling her she can stop when she wants. She doesn't want to. It's just hard not having answers to our many questions!!

[pikamom]

Why is it when someone is really suffering that you "quacks" come out of the wall? OLIVE OIL and LEMON JUICE are NOT GOING TO CURE ADVANCED CANCER! Don't you know what you do to people when you suggest such STUPID things??? A dear friend of mine died of breast cancer a couple of years ago and she got so much of that. It made me SO ANGRY. I can see her yet sitting there in the last days swallowing bizzare concotions, jumping on her trampoline, eating all cold, raw food, and taking ice cold showers...all offered to her as THE CURE. You're kind of people are CRUEL. Think about what you're doing.

[pikamom]

When your mother in law is ready, I'd suggest hospice. They are wonderful and can make the last days better. They tell you exactly what to look for and what to expect, help you with the whole process of death. As for what I know about liver failure, I've worked in nursing homes and taken care of dying people, and there's usually not much pain. It more tiredness and gradual increased sleeping until coma. Morphine can be given if there's pain. There can be some confusion.

[Lynn28]

And you know who you are. You have SUCH nerve coming on here and telling people that if they don't try what you suggest, than they'll die. You shouldn't be cleansing ANYTHING unless it's under a doctors supervision. Those are major organs and shouldn't be messed around with. ESPECIALLY when there's a disease going on that clearly needs or is undergoing medical attention. Perhaps that is why you haven't been cured in 20yrs. I had a patient that nearly killed herself by trying to cleanse a vital organ WITHOUT the direction of a medical PROFFESIONAL. That you clearly aren't. Furthermore, I'd watch what you suggest and say to people. Your words could be taken further out of context and fall into the hands of someone you woudn't like..... Authority.

[Daughter-in-law]

Thank you for your kind words.  My mother-in-law refused hospice in the fall when she was sick with multiple infections. She sort of "bounced back" after the holidays, but now she is slowly getting weaker, sleepier, and eating less.  I am frustrated as an in-law because I don't feel like I have the right to "butt in" too much, yet I want answers too.  I am very close to my mother-in-law (Dorothy).  But when I spoke to my sister-in-law this evening about asking questions tomorrow when they see the liver doctor, she seemed very uncomfortable.  Both of my sister-in-laws are also not very assertive about insisting she at least accept some aide care.  They are going crazy trying to have someone there almost 24 hours a day.  My husband is a little more interested in pushing for extra care, but I don't think assertive enough.  Meanwhile I feel guilty if I am not there as often as they are.  I don't know if hospice is something the family can insist on if the patient refuses it.

[maxie24]

To GroupMaster, how tacky can you get, you probably have this poor soul scared to death. I intend to contact this forum and report your actions.

[Catalina]

Hi, one thing you might have her try is Milk Thistle.  It is suppose to be really good for the liver.  I know pancreatic cancer is wicked but maybe this would help her liver for awhile.

[pikamom]

When to get hospice is something the patient and family should decide on together. Many people resist it because it symbolizes the end of the battle. But hospice really can ease the burden and offer comfort. I've never known anyone who was sorry they had it. My uncle just died over the weekend, in fact I need to log off the computer and get ready for his funeral, and he was in a hospice center. You can have hospice in your home or you can go to a center. Some people go to the center until they get their pain under control and then return home. My uncle was there around 2 weeks, and at the end when they were telling the family it could be a day or two, a nurse NEVER left his side. Even when the family was in the room, the nurse was still there. It helps to relieve the fear. There is someone familiar with the process to help the patient and family with everything from physical to emotional. Hospice can administer drugs that you couldn't have unless you were in the hospital. They are really good at predicting when the time gets close. My uncle had colon cancer that spread to liver, brain, lungs, bones. He really didn't have too much suffering until the last day or so, mostly tired. I would encourage you to talk to your family about hospice. It doesn't necessarily mean death is going to be next week or next month...some people are in it for a year. I'd say if the doctor suggested hospice, he thinks there is less than a year left. Usually metasticized cancer to the liver goes fast, around 6 months.

[Daughter-in-law]

I'm very sorry to hear about your uncle. My mother-in-law actually got fairly "good" news today. The jaundice apparently is caused by a problem with the tubing that is draining her bile right now.  She's going in tomorrow for some procedure to try to fix it. The bad news is that she's been in repeatedly to try to make this work right and it never does. I don't really know what's different about tomorrow's procedure. She is getting weaker, though. Do you find different doctors all have different answers?! I guess no one is ready to push for hospice right now, but I've heard nothing but good things about it.  The other good news is that she's not really in a lot of pain.  
Thank you again!

[oscarbug]

Sorry about your Uncle, but thanks for posting about his experience. My beloved Aunt was diagnosed in Dec. with cancer of unknown primary origin that has metasticized to her spine, lungs, liver and now two new tumors in her colon. They only found the cancer because the spinal tumor has left her paralyzed from the waist down. She went through three rounds of chemo, found out about the new tumors, then they told her about a different chemo for the colon tumors............ they told her there was a fifteen percent chance it would prolong her life. I don't know the point of treating the colon especially when her liver is involved.

My husband and I take care of her and I came here looking for a clue about what to watch for regarding her symptoms. She doesn't seem to be in much pain, she does have joint pain, I don't know how much that may come from the paralysis, or if it's caused by soemthing else. The chemo has destroyed her appetite, she is losing weight and grows more tired everyday. We have talked about Hospice and will contact them when she is ready. Her grandson is getting married in June, I'm sure she will continue chemo until then. I know she doesn't have much time left, I just want to make sure she is comfortable. Thanks

[Snakie]

A related discussion, Are there any long-term effects after a Liver Transplant? was started.