HR, please comment. PPC-Thyroid

[copyman]

after researching PPC i see that it is a Soy product. there has been some negative things said about Soy and its effect on the thyroid. since HCV can affect the thyroid would adding Soy further damage it? thanks

[merryBe]

just a couple simple remark here, if PPC could help the liver I'd rather keep an eye on cholesterol and also adjust my throid dose as nessessary since I am hypo and since thyroid meds are and that's better than losing one's liver..

Hyper and hypo are both dangerous, even life threatening without treatment so the blood monitoring is important even though some docs understate the dangers to their patients, seriously understate.

HR's mention of iodine is noteworthy, particularly as it relates to hypo I have some small knowledge. One absolutely needs treatment and monitoring for these disease...and it all depends on why the thyroid is shutting down as to whether what's below will aide you;

because mine was diagnosed as not autoimmune but plainhypo to begin with,
my method was to use a daily capsule of kelp powder (not tablets not much in those) to keep iodine and trace mineral supply up. This method actually returned my thyroid to normal function according to testing for many years, and should not be underestimated for it's preventative benefits.
However, a deficiency is somewhat different than what can cause autoimmune....and of course now they say HCV can be a contributor to all autoimmune stuff......not all autoimmune is strictly definciency related though. Some is genetic, mine was radioactive as well as HCV, myriad causes exist for what triggers and sustains autoimmune response.

This therapy though, the kelp,  did help me, but only worked because part of my equation was having "Northwest hypothyroidism" (local diet in iodine poor soil produces the most cases nationwide due to lack of dietary iodine). However, many locals, and many diets in the states are especially low in iodine, hence hypothyroidism (low) is the most common of the thyroid ailments.
At one time, this was such a health problem here in Oregon that it was made the LAW they add iodine to all the salt,  as this was the easist way to cure all the people. (Everyone uses salt in foods and cooking).....but alas, the health nuts (who didn't do their homework) pissed and moaned and made them remove the iodine claiming the state was trying to poison them and remove their rights. (yeah, the right to be unnessessarily sick)....anyway.... Many people are low on this mineral, more now than ever. Personally, I think the addition of iodine vs. a whole other medication regime was wisdom.

Not sure for the non allergic that the small amount of soy would be problematic
would it HR?
Considering there's so many other sources of soy everyday many don't even know they get...
like in hydrolized protein, corn chips, you name it, unless one has a known soy allergy it hardly seems this small of an amount would present a problem.

[JRenquist]

Seems a bit of a toss-up.  My thyroid died after mistakenly being killed by interferon ( didn't work on the HCV, though).  I do eat a lot of soy, although I have heard that there could possibly be thyroid and other isues with it.  I eat it because (I like it and) I don't eat meat.  I don't NOT eat meat because of health reasons, but  I think that I've read that red meat can be pretty taxing on the liver.  So maybe it balances out?

[copyman]

if i had to pick one to keep it would be the liver. can live without the thyroid but not the liver :-)

[JRenquist]

Copyman- yeah that's true!

HR  I've ordered and gotten the alpha-lipoic acid, reservatol and TMG.  Waited till the weekend to start them. Looking up TMG, though, I see that it helps the body to produce SAM-E.  I already take a lot (800 mgs) of SAM-E a day for depression and I wonder if  the TMG will be safe.  Think I'll wait on that until I hear from someone who knows the answer.  Thanks so much for letting us know about these.  S.

[Hepatitis Researcher]

TMG has been used in very large doses in trials and found to be extremely safe. It is correct, that somebody, that already takes a large dose of SAMe, has less of a need for a methyldonor ( thats what TMG is, for numerous synthetic reactions in the liver).

I metioned TMg before SAme, because it is much cheaper than SAMe and wil produce SAMe naturally in your liver - but maybe not in the high dose range as you take your SAMe. Also needs some folic aid, B12 and B6 to achieve this.
There is no problem in adding the TMG to the SAMe, like in 2x500mg doses, it might still add to the liver protective effects.
It is very important to understand, that these are not stand alone measures. They focus on certain aspects ( like TMG for Methyl groups requiring reactions), but it is difficult to estimate the relative benefits that they will have.

Therefore always this is the hirarchy ( organized by priority) of the approach:

Eating patterns - liver metabolic stress reduction. Many small meals each with fiber embedded slow resorption carbs+30% lean protein+ only healthy fats/oils


Intrestinal health- eubiosis - Glutamine(integrity of intestinal epithelium),prebiotic ( Inulin, Lactulose), Probiotic ( Lactobacillus GG)

Supplements - :
Supporting specific aspects of liver metabolic burden - like TMg, SAMe

Thiol containing compounds: NAC (always with equal mg Vit C),, ALA, Taurine : Build fundamental hepatic/bodywide Glutathione reserve, protect from ox stress toxicities ( like Tylenol)
They also help to block the ox stress dependent stellate cell(fibrogenesis) activation pathways.
Many more functions of course not mentioned here.

PPC: membrane fluidity and functionality


Inhibiting the activation of stellate cells into fiber producing myofibroblasts:

Resveratrol: inhibits with high efficacy  Tumor Growth factor beta - the key player in the activation of fibrogenesis in the liver ( is key activator of improper "wound healing", scar formation (fostering the production of collagen fibvers from transformed stallate cells) inside a parenchymal organ- the liver)

Curcumin : Most effective in blocking the activation of NFKappaB, a nuclear activator of proinflammatory gene expression and also extremely involved in the formation of fiber forming cells in the liver from stellate cells)

Green tea extracts : Same as Curcumin, with less NFKB deactivating capacity, but likely other
complex antiinflammatory benefits.


Overall several key pathways leading to activation of fibrosis will be blocked/reduced in their activity, which will build to a synergistic effect over time. Each of these individual  measures has decent research backup, while all are considered GRAS, but no direct comparison has ever been made so it is hard to estimate the relative contribution.

[merryBe]

I'm glad you posted all this again, as I missed large chuck of info being only diagnosed in June and slow on the uptake, pretty sick.

could you post what you think are good doseage amounts for these again.
I think you did this once, but I lost track of that thread.

thanks HR

BTW, doesn't the green tea act as a stimulant having caffiene in it? Would that be one for those NOT currently on Riba so as to not overstimulate an already pretty agitated system?
I'm only asking because the Riba kept me up a lot at first, once for most of 3 days!
mary