Riba rage? Any remedies for this? Please help--I have kids.

[Algernon]

Week 8/24. I screamed at my kids last night (they're only 8 and 10--they're good kids who just act like kids).  I'm swearing at the dog.  I'm even angry with the fish--they have to be FED.

I tried a couple of anti-depressants and they made me feel really depressed, mentally and physically.  I don't really feel "depressed" even now.  I'm just way irritable.  

Any advice?  Is there a magic bullet (one that doesn't involve an actual gun...)?  Drugs for this?  I'm doing this treatment FOR my kids, not to traumatize them for life.

[FlGuy]

Thanks for finding both of those.  The second is as thought- provoking as the first.  Words to live by...

[GoofyDad]

For the wondering few, here's the quote from G. K. Chesterton:

[Algernon]

I went out for a little swim (thank you, Procrit) and to buy a truckload of sparkling water (gotta have variety in water...) and came home to this amazing series of exchanges.  I truly appreciate all the suggestions and have already begun to pursue several (e.g., truckload of water--thanks FlGuy).

One phone call and my doc immediately wrote an RX for the clonazepam (thanks Kalios and congrats on seeing your LAST week of treatment arrive!). Apparently, they prescribe this for their patients a lot.

I completely agree that we have to do all the we can to control angry impulses but the Riba really does seem to frazzle the fuses.  My kids aren't used to hearing adults yell and I'm not used to yelling.  I appreciate the advice to actually explain that the drugs are playing a role.  They know I'm on treatment but I've really tried to play down how much it (and, especially, that evil anemia) affects my life.  

Thank you to all of you.  I have lots of friends and family but you guys provide a kind of support that can't found elsewhere.  Solidarity.

[Algernon]

Beagle, I had that metal mouth a couple of days and it's creepy.  I read that lemon drops help but I never tried it.

NYgirl, amommy: helps to know I ain't the only one.  I have to confess that I haven't thought at all about the "compounds" that got me into this situation more than 25 years ago--until recently.  I think that some of them would help to reduce this rage...

[Algernon]

Kalio-You're a fellow 3a, right?  What week are you on?

Which anti-anxiety drugs do most people use?  Do those drugs work right away?

[FlGuy]

You AND your kids need to understand that it's the meds.  It's fairly easy to fly off the handle. Once, I jumped all over my son for wiping his nose on his t-shirt. Like you said, it's just kids doing kid stuff.
I have a suggestion.  You need to increase your intake of water during tx.  When you are about to light into someone, try to stop the reflexive action and convince yourself that you will jump into their stuff after you take a drink of water. Go get the water and take a slug. By the time you wipe your chin (probably with your t-shirt) you may have calmed down a bit.  If the reflex gets the better of you, apolgize later.  If you rage with your kids, allow them to 'fine' you with a gift, a favor or cash.  Even though the meds sometimes do the talking it comes from our mouths and we need to be responsible. Sometimes, if you feel you're about to boil over, just stay clear of the folks you don't want to hurt.

[amommy]

Hey there Mr. Beagle!  Thanks for asking about me.  #7 is done, and I am awaiting #8 on Thursday.  Everything is ok.  I feel so gloom and doom that all I can muster is an 'ok" especially knowing that I am one of the lucky ones who is clear at the moment, and I have livable sides.  However, tx is still managing to take it's toll on me.  Oh well, this too shall pass!  We will all get through it and hopefully every single person in here will get SVR!!!!  
How are you holding up?  Are your blood counts hanging in there?  Are you in NY right now or elsewhere?  I'm full of questions today! I'd love an update when you have a few!  Are you a geno 2, I cannot recall.  If so, are you doing 24 weeks?  
Hope you are having a wonderful day today!

[HepCinLA]

FLguy gave great advice about drinking water!!  I find I'm much more cranky and short of patience with my two kids if I'm  dehydrated or not getting enough water in my system.

Please don't give up on the AD's.  It takes a while for your body to get used to AD's, until then you may feel really weird (as if you're in a fog or a bubble).  But once your body acclimates then you'll feel calmer.

[NYgirl]

I too had a HUGE problem with grogginess when I went on the ADs and decided to go off them for a few days - big mistake. I went STRAIGHT back on as I really almost got suicidal.  After a while my body got used to them and it's not big deal now.

I take them at night when it's time for bed...and I'm not groggy in any way that I can't handle.

PS Decided NOT to get a PCR before week 24......since I decided to go until them and then see the results I didn't want to bum myself out if it came down to it.  I figure I will do what I am supposed to for the next three weeks and then see if it worked or I have to switch to Infergen trials.  I am hoping it worked still!  Of course I would have to extend treatment for a long time to come...and I am tired of thinking of THAT ;-)

Glad to hear you are doing so well! It's impossible to believe you did 7 already!

[Mister beagle bailey]

Hi,

Soon we all will be SVR.  Glad your sx's are livable, just remember what's at the end of this wild ride of a life time.  I'm geno 2B and 24 weeks of tx w/ 17 left. Will get my PCR at week #12, if I get one at 4 weeks my insurance will not pay for the 12 week PCR and my dr. felt the 12 is better in my case.

Are you geno 1?  Did you see that cuteus was geno 1 and had been cleared over a year, that is hope for all.  

Let me know how you are doing.

    The Beagle

[omyst]

algernon, I know how you feel, I have a beautiful 12 year old daughter and sometimes I get angry at the drop of a hat. Later I feel so guilty.

nygirl, fellow riba-road warrior, A few times on the road I have also got a bit crazy, even with my daughter in the car. No excuse for that.

I have found a few things that help me

Listening to some soothing music helps me. I really like Lorenna McKennit and Clannad. I always bring them when I drive anywhere.
I have purchased a few CDs from this site.  
http://www.realmusic.com/.

Sometimes I go to a secret spot to be by myself and visualise all garbage draining out of my head.

The Phoenix rises out of its own ashes.

[GoofyDad]

I pretty much agree with FLguy - nice post.

I have the impulse to fly off these days, though I'm pretty much able to keep it in check. My worst day is Sat AM, leading up to my shot. I know it, so I exercise extra caution.  

Avoiding the prospect of additional meds, I work on the two obvious things I can conrtol: (1) My influence over the environment that's pissing me off, (2) Control over my reactions to the situation.

(1) I've found some anoyoing things my son does, and I've realized they are always anoying, so I'm working with him on stopping them. Like when he's bored, he might walk around and around in circles, which can be very distracting. I'll be trying to talk to his Mom, or maybe fixing the VCR for him, and it drives me nuts. More than it should. But, I've decided that this is just annoying behavior anytime, with no redeaming value, and so I'm working with him to stop it. It's a small thing, but it's in the kid's interest to learn some self control too. I'm stricter about noise in the house too, which I think I always should have been.

(2) Self restraint. Just because I get irritated gives me no reason to react in unacceptable ways. I'm sure child and spousal abusers get angry too, but that's no justification for abusive  behavior. Some people get angrier than others, but they are still expected to conform to society's standards of behavior. The greater our emotions, the greater our responsibility to govern our own behavior.  

On tx we can get angrier than we were previously accustomed to. I sure do anyway. Means I have to clamp down tighter on my emotions. It's hard, but I see it as my responsibility. I'm the one with the problem, and I'm the one with the solution. It stands to reason that I'm the one who needs to implement it.

My two cents.

[GoofyDad]

Just re-read my post above and I don't mean to come off as harsh or unsympathetic. Just wanted to point out that I found my solution to this particular problem lies within. Not easy to find among all the debris and clutter, and harder to grab onto than a greased pig, but none-the-less it was in there.

[Forseegood]

Really nice thread and well thought out posts...really liked your post Goof...cause even though I'm not on tx, and yes, God knows what I'll be like then...so I try to be sympathetic and I realize I don't have that perspective now...

I still think we need to take "personal responsibilty" for our own actions and blend that with a sympathy and compassion for ourselves as well, no matter how terrible we feel....if that makes any sense to anyone...I really needed to read this because I've been pretty icky feeling lately and I'm surprising myself cause I'm turning into this other person that I don't even know...the hep c alone not to mention menopause ain't always the best thing for one's mood and attitude...

but doing nothing to help the situation and just having an  attitude of "letting other people deal with me" will not help anything, myself or anybody else....

I find it weird that I want to just unleash on people I care about the most...my particular "personal peeve" is people who ask me too many questions, especially if I've just answered them and that's what a 16 year old kid will do...and yeah, it's not fair that I feel this way cause I sure don't want to...but this is the hand I was dealt and I have to play it the best I can, which means working on my own mood and attitude extra, extra hard, harder then people who don't have these afflictions...what else can I do?

If it means anti-depressants and talk therapy and/or books and passages that I read, comedy DVD's, tapes I listen to, meditation, exercise and gardening...and any and all the things I can do for myself that will make my situation better...because I can't afford to do this to people I care about all the time....although....when it's just too much for me, hopefully, they'll realize it's the disease and whatever...And they will be compassionate and understanding towards me once in awhile as well....

[Forseegood]

Just like to add that I've been suffering with depression for as long as I can remember...I remember being depressed when I was 10...my father is a depressive so it's prob genetic...but I still do these things to counter-act it and it really helps...when I say it's my "personal responsibility" I don't mean to say that I don't feel for depressives or depression, being one myself...this is a disease just like diabetes and we didn't ask for this...I just mean that's even though it's extra-hard, it behooves us to be pro-active in helping ourselves, it's just that much more important for a depressed person...and of course if that means anti-d medication, by all means do so....

[GoofyDad]

I was not discussing depresion per se. Infact, in a number of posts I have stated I don't think people should avoid ADs if they will derive benefit from them.

What I was discussiing is outward rage and anger, directed to others. That, I believe, is something we can control. Would anyone here start screaming at a pastor giving sermon in open church? I imagine not. They control their reactions to anger then, and I feel that same control can and should be excercised at other times too.

[Forseegood]

Once again, I think there is a mis-communication here and we all basically agree, I just think that Goof just meant that you have to try and take all the "inner strength" you can muster to help yourself and your loved ones during this trial...that's not to say that it all depends on "inner strenth"...of course you need your loved ones to know that it's not really "you" it's the meds talking, this is not about blaming yourself for not doing "right"....and of course sometimes there will be a situation where NOT anything you do for yourself will help...not anything...and they need to know this will/might happen and just understand that for what it is...

But for the most part, we need to do what we can because if youre not as pro-active as you can be to help yourself, you feel even worse...believe me I know since I have suffered from depression and and I used to suffer suicidal ideation...

We still need to do everything we can on our end to help ourselves as well, (and I know we won't always be able to, but we gotta try) whether that involves taking the anti-d meds, taking a deep breath...whatever....no one can do this but ourselves and that's the point I was making about personal responsibility...sorry if I'm trying to explain what somebody else was trying to say...Goof might forgive me...

I know a guy who is dying of liver cancer and he wasn't able to qualify for a transplant, he's got maybe months or weeks to live...and he still tries to do these things cause he wants his last days to be as joyful as they can be under the circumstances...he says he's much better for it and he's very spritual, etc...now not everyone could do this under these circumstances and I sure wouldn't blame them for it, we all react differently...he just says he's way better off trying to make the best of it, whether he ultimately can or not....

[NYgirl]

I just meant that when it comes to the rage...no amount of inner strength on God's green earth can help me.  It's not a strength type of thing ---- it's more a mental breakdown of frustration I think that causes us to SNAP or LASH OUT.

I find that the rage is much more THAT (snapping or lashing out) than a real "rage".  A real rage hasa slow boil to it but what happens with this medication is sort of like a short circuit in the brain...something explodes little tiny neutrons or WHATEVER they are called and bam!

Sort of like getting hit with lightning in your brain - MELTDOWN!

I completely understand about having "inner strength" though - I just feel with this whacko bs...it doesn't matter. By the time I realize I SHOULD be having that strength or drinking that water....it's too late.  It's over.

That's just with me though most likely - it's spontaneous not really a reaction. BAM!

Deb

[Mister beagle bailey]

How are you?  Was just asking about you yesterday, after not seeing you after your shot this week.  You and I both did #7, so how do you feel?  I'm having this metal taste in my mouth and can't get rid of it.  I'm even having a problem drinking water.

Does any one get the metal taste and if so what can I do for it?

    The Beagle

[GoofyDad]

FLguy, OMG, I thought you were talking about today's quote, that Hemmingway brain-twister (uh-ho - maybe you were???). But I think you're talking about one that says a stiffly delivered apology is a second insult, and how the injured party deserves to be healed. Am I right? I like that one too - I've thought about framing it and hanging it up somewhere.

Forsee, You can speak for me anytime - you do a better job than I do anyway. And I can always tell you how you *should* think, if you get it wrong, LOL.

I feel there's precious little control I have over this disease and the effects of its treatment. How I react to others is one area that is within my control. Just sharing what works for me, for other folks it's obviously going to be different. Best wishes to all.  

[cuteus]

goofy, your post clearly expresses that we can still have some control over our emotions by learning new behaviors, if necessary.  We are not talking about Mental illness per sae, but even during that time, we have to take responsibility for our condition, by accepting that it exists, that is affecting our daily functioning in society and by seeking intervention, if needed, and lastly, by engaging actively in recovering our health(going to therapist, taking medication, and behavior modification).
If anyone goes to the website of NARSAD, you can read that medication has as much effect in improving mental health as does "talk therapy" in a one on one situation. A combination of both is ideal in many situations, unfortunately, many drs and patients find it more convenient and cost effective to just pop a pill and forgo the therapy and behavior modification experience.  
Goof. you have adjusted to the riba induced changes by defining the moments and the triggers in your life, and by controlling the things you can control, by well thought out techniques that are working for you.  I think it might work for most, if there is no severe mental illness involved.  There is also a theory that the chemical changes in the brain is like the chicken and the egg theory. Drs don't know which came first.  An external event generates a severe emotional response that then generates a chemical change that then generates an emotional response, and a cycle is started.  
I think I also learned to avoid the triggers at work, with my bf, and to some extent out on the road. But I was already pretty ragy before tx, during tx, let's just say it is a miracle I am still alive.  A lot of the rage was because I was not giving myself enough time on the road and that stressed me out. That was something I have control over and change. If I chose not to, the outcome was my responsibility.  
There are always morons on the road, but it was not my job to erradicate them from the world.
Learn the triggers, and devise a plan of action if you have certain reactions.  I know how hard it can be to do so. I was not immune to it.

[beamishboy]

great thought provoking thread..good to hear such positive responses to evil stimuli-HEP C& riba..We are really growing thru this damnable treatmnt-and( ahhh the "good" meds are finally kickin in)-Thanks one& all for sharing your thots&experiences riding the evil vrus into the ground!!!!!!!

[goldyn]

I take ativan for anxiety its helps when i get to that point I have 5 kids if im feeling like everytime i turn around something is not right, everyone is doing everything wrong,and im having to do to much and im on all these meds......well i take a time out take my pill and go outside and sit in a chair by myself until i can start breathing clearer...I take 1mg twice a day if i need to it helps with sleep also , it an antianxiety drug so it helps right away.

[sindog]

Hi, I also take Clonazepam, 1 MG 3 times a day. It does make me a little drowsy, but seems not to bother me during the day, but helps me sleep at night. I was perscribed this by my dr for anxiety (riba rage). My dr explained to me that this is a light weight anti anxiety drug. She explained that really, anti depressants work differently for different symptoms. Some, like lexapro work better for depression, others like Zantax (?is that what it's called) work better on anxiety. Clonazepam works wonders for me and the side effects during the day are barely noticable. This happened after an hour long load arguement on the phone, at work, with Qwest over a $5 charge, that was correct anyway. My co-workers complained.