Aa
Suboxone
My stepson has been on suboxone since June 2009, still taking same amount. He had a very bad addiction to just about anything he could get his hands on, didn't know any of this until we got a call and he was going to rehab. We are close but lives 8 hrs away, so we were shocked! I don't think this is working he is just addicted to another drug, is this normal, I know everyone is different, just concerned, and you really can't talk to him about it, very defensive, thinks you are accusing him of something, and not at all. We drove out on the weekends to visit him in rehab, and we had meeting on how to handle his situation, still very lost, he needs to get past this demon.
Thank you so much, you made me tear up, cause I know this is where he is headed his Mom and Dad are worried about upsetting him, I would rather him be mad at me and alive, he can get over being mad, but not dead. I don't want to scare you, but he did good on his subs at 1st, but don't know when he started using other stuff, but I guess you tolerance to the subs are no different than lortabs for your pain. I guess he was missing the high. Pray you get off the subs as soon as possible, you seem to have it together. Love talking to you!
Gizmo, if he's been on the Subs and still takes all the other drugs, he has a serious problem. I've only been on the Subs for a week now, but have no cravings to use and am taking the amount that I'm supposed to be.
A person has to WANT to quit, it sure sounds like your stepson is NOT ready to give up his addiction. He reminds me of an acquiantance of mine, a guy I used to work with. 24 years old, had a GREAT job making over 10K a month, but hooked on pills hardcore. Went to rehab twice in the last year, but relapsed as soon as got out. Was at work one day ( worked as Finance manager at a dealership) and ended up taking 150mg of Oxycodone and 4mg Xanax, and began 'nodding' in front of some customers that were in his office to sign paperwork for the car they were buying. 'Nodding' basically means being so high that ya can't keep your eyes open, and your head bobs up and down as you basically 'pass out' a few seconds at a time. Well, he was so messed up that his speech was so slurred that the customers couldn't understand what he was saying. He got fired not too long after that. He bounced around to different jobs. Went on Methadone, but unfortunately kept using other drugs. He began crushing his pills mixing them with water, and using a syringe and needle and began injecting the Oxy into his veins.
Started to do better, got another good job, and then one day last month a friend calls him up from out of town and tells him he has scored a lot of OxyContin pills and would sell some to him very CHEAP. So he goes out of town for an overnight trip to get the Oxy and 'party' with his friend. He stays in guest room, where he mixes his crushed OxyContin and gets it ready to shoot up. He plugs the needle in his arm, hits a vein, and shoots up. He passes out on the floor-where his 'friend' found him 18 hours later. He's now DEAD. He was an "experienced" drug user who said he's NEVER OD, because he 'knew' what he was doing. I guess he didn't.
This is where your stepson is headed. It doesn't take a needle to OD, it can be done by swallowing the pills.
I hope your stepson wakes up and cleans up. It's tragic to see people slipping away that won't listen to reason-even to the voice of reason that's in their head, telling them it's time to change.
My prayer are with you.
A person has to WANT to quit, it sure sounds like your stepson is NOT ready to give up his addiction. He reminds me of an acquiantance of mine, a guy I used to work with. 24 years old, had a GREAT job making over 10K a month, but hooked on pills hardcore. Went to rehab twice in the last year, but relapsed as soon as got out. Was at work one day ( worked as Finance manager at a dealership) and ended up taking 150mg of Oxycodone and 4mg Xanax, and began 'nodding' in front of some customers that were in his office to sign paperwork for the car they were buying. 'Nodding' basically means being so high that ya can't keep your eyes open, and your head bobs up and down as you basically 'pass out' a few seconds at a time. Well, he was so messed up that his speech was so slurred that the customers couldn't understand what he was saying. He got fired not too long after that. He bounced around to different jobs. Went on Methadone, but unfortunately kept using other drugs. He began crushing his pills mixing them with water, and using a syringe and needle and began injecting the Oxy into his veins.
Started to do better, got another good job, and then one day last month a friend calls him up from out of town and tells him he has scored a lot of OxyContin pills and would sell some to him very CHEAP. So he goes out of town for an overnight trip to get the Oxy and 'party' with his friend. He stays in guest room, where he mixes his crushed OxyContin and gets it ready to shoot up. He plugs the needle in his arm, hits a vein, and shoots up. He passes out on the floor-where his 'friend' found him 18 hours later. He's now DEAD. He was an "experienced" drug user who said he's NEVER OD, because he 'knew' what he was doing. I guess he didn't.
This is where your stepson is headed. It doesn't take a needle to OD, it can be done by swallowing the pills.
I hope your stepson wakes up and cleans up. It's tragic to see people slipping away that won't listen to reason-even to the voice of reason that's in their head, telling them it's time to change.
My prayer are with you.
I know 6 weeks wasn't enough, but when he came out, him and his wife joined a church and they went to all kinds of meetings together, but slowly he didn't like the people in the meetings, he wasn't like them. And don't go to church anymore. He was raised in church, but has got far away from his raising! I love my step son, I had nothing to do with his raising, didn't marry his dad until he was an adult, him and his wife married a couple of years after we did. So we are more friends than stepmom and stepson. But I think his drug use comes from being spoiled and thinking everything should be easy, pills make him feel good without him having to work for his happiness, he doesn't know anything about working hard for anything, someone will help, or just give over to him. I just pray he wakes up soon, I am so afraid this will kill him.
Thanks so much for your comments, he doesn't drink alcohol, never cared for it much. But have had him ask and beg for my pills, had him steel my pain meds, right after coming out of the hospital, I had had a spinal fusion between L1 and L2, wasn't suppose to miss a pain pill of muscle relaxer, cause I wouldn't be able to get pain under control, but his addiction was more important. This was with him on the subs. So if it was keeping him from using other drugs, even if he was on it for a while, I wouldn't complain, it's just not working. I just fear he will die, take too much, or get in trouble for steeling. His wife saids she has came home from work, and their 4 year old son would be over his dad, crying cause he couldn't wake him, breaks my heart, for them all. My daughter in law does all she can, trying to keep house going, working lots of hrs, and just trying to make him take his meds right, she is very prideful, but past 6 months all she has done is ask for money from us for, food, and payments, cause money is disappearing. My husband and ex wife, don't want to upset their son, very spoiled child, always handed what he wants. Well I asked did they want to bury him, bail him out of jail, or see him divorced? Well couldn't get through to them, his Mom said she felt it was talking about him behind his back, and would not betray her son. Well 6 months later, he lost his job, for steeling, got arrested, and now his wife is leaving, what's left that I predicted? His wife thinks if they separate he will focus on his self, work on this harder and not have her to be an enabler, but his Mom is worse, just please pray for him.
Thanks Nursegirl!
I believe I may attempt to taper off the Subs in about 6 months- maybe less maybe more. I don't know yet. I have been using for so long- and even before I started using Opiods, I always had a bit of depression and lack of energy. I'm sure it stems from a tough childhood, at least part of it, yet also thoroughly believe that my brain chemicals are off a bit- as in my dopamine and endorphin system not working properly. I know many people are on Anti-depressants, but my thinking is that if Opiates work for depression , why take other types of meds that zone a person out and have much worse side-effects?
So I may be on Sub for a while, and if I have to stay on some sort of Opiod/opiate the rest of my days, I'm ok with that as well. Diabetics have to take Insulin everyday.
Truth is, I never had a problem with Opiates/Opiods unless I ran out of them, and the withdrawals set in. I never OD'd or took so many that I was nodding out- I took them to feel better and get energy. Problem is, I did run out 2 weeks early every month (was getting prescription for back pain-legit), and had to supplement with Kratom and poppy seed tea-and the occasional purchase of pills off the street.
Now if I'd been prescribed twice as many- then I wouldn't have had any problems.
Oh well.
I believe I may attempt to taper off the Subs in about 6 months- maybe less maybe more. I don't know yet. I have been using for so long- and even before I started using Opiods, I always had a bit of depression and lack of energy. I'm sure it stems from a tough childhood, at least part of it, yet also thoroughly believe that my brain chemicals are off a bit- as in my dopamine and endorphin system not working properly. I know many people are on Anti-depressants, but my thinking is that if Opiates work for depression , why take other types of meds that zone a person out and have much worse side-effects?
So I may be on Sub for a while, and if I have to stay on some sort of Opiod/opiate the rest of my days, I'm ok with that as well. Diabetics have to take Insulin everyday.
Truth is, I never had a problem with Opiates/Opiods unless I ran out of them, and the withdrawals set in. I never OD'd or took so many that I was nodding out- I took them to feel better and get energy. Problem is, I did run out 2 weeks early every month (was getting prescription for back pain-legit), and had to supplement with Kratom and poppy seed tea-and the occasional purchase of pills off the street.
Now if I'd been prescribed twice as many- then I wouldn't have had any problems.
Oh well.
I'm glad you guys are working on your recovery, just be very cautious, as usually the people who sing sub's praises the most are the people who are still on it or have never attempted to come off of it, or try recovery without it.
I worked in a sub clinic, so I saw many people be successful on sub, but no doubt, coming off is NOT easy and I saw a lot of people end up "stuck" on it (many years) because they were fearful of coming off, both for the w/ds, and because they felt it helped make them normal. When used as a tool it can be a great part of recovery, but a lot of work needs donw on top of taking the sub every day.
Just keep working your recovery....go to as many meetings as you can, go to therapy, support groups, etc. The people who put a lot of effort into working their recovery are the ones who usually were able to successfully come off.
Also, be cautious with docs who seem to want to keep you on higher than necessary doses for long periods of time. It's normal to be inducted on a higher dose, but there is no reason a doctor should keep a patient on higher doses for a long period of time. It's actually very easy to taper down at the higher doses, so there's no reason that patients shouldn't be encouraged to taper. Just always remember that less sub is more. A little goes a LONG way.
Best of luck to you both, thanks for sharing your story!
I worked in a sub clinic, so I saw many people be successful on sub, but no doubt, coming off is NOT easy and I saw a lot of people end up "stuck" on it (many years) because they were fearful of coming off, both for the w/ds, and because they felt it helped make them normal. When used as a tool it can be a great part of recovery, but a lot of work needs donw on top of taking the sub every day.
Just keep working your recovery....go to as many meetings as you can, go to therapy, support groups, etc. The people who put a lot of effort into working their recovery are the ones who usually were able to successfully come off.
Also, be cautious with docs who seem to want to keep you on higher than necessary doses for long periods of time. It's normal to be inducted on a higher dose, but there is no reason a doctor should keep a patient on higher doses for a long period of time. It's actually very easy to taper down at the higher doses, so there's no reason that patients shouldn't be encouraged to taper. Just always remember that less sub is more. A little goes a LONG way.
Best of luck to you both, thanks for sharing your story!
Agree with DaleGirl. I have recently started a Suboxone Maintanence Therapy program, and it is definitely helping me out.
After another 18 month run on Oxy/Hydro, and anything else I could get my hands on, I went cold turkey with the assistance of a Doctor. I made it clean 16 days, however I still had ZERO energy , felt like I was going to die every time I tried to do anything remotely physical (even washing dishes) , and developed major league depression- even had suicidal thoughts and ideas. When I was 'checking' out my Winchester 30-30, and had loaded it, the thoughts I had scared the hell out of me. I quickly unloaded it, trembling and sweating, and called my buddy to 'help me out'-which he did by coming over with 20 Lortabs. I relapsed- but felt it was better than feeling the way I did and blowing the back of my head off. Saw Doc few days later, told him the story, and got on Suboxone.
I have been using Opiates 14 years now, and OP, have to say if your stepson is going through what I was, he actually may need some opiates as part of his daily life just like a diabetic needs insulin.
However, I have been put on 12mg Suboxone a day-6mg in AM and 6mg in PM. It does not get me 'high' or even the slightest of a buzz, it just makes me feel 'normal' and able to function in my daily activities.
For your stepson to run out of Suboxone indicates a problem. Perhaps he wasn't titrated to a high enough dose. Perhaps he is trading them on the Black Market for full-agonist Opiods like Oxy , hydro, and such. Subs have a ceiling effect of 32mg/day, so I just can't understand him running out unless he's not getting enough or if he's trading them. Well, I guess he may be trying to get high off them too, but I think that's an exercise in futility. Best of luck to him.
After another 18 month run on Oxy/Hydro, and anything else I could get my hands on, I went cold turkey with the assistance of a Doctor. I made it clean 16 days, however I still had ZERO energy , felt like I was going to die every time I tried to do anything remotely physical (even washing dishes) , and developed major league depression- even had suicidal thoughts and ideas. When I was 'checking' out my Winchester 30-30, and had loaded it, the thoughts I had scared the hell out of me. I quickly unloaded it, trembling and sweating, and called my buddy to 'help me out'-which he did by coming over with 20 Lortabs. I relapsed- but felt it was better than feeling the way I did and blowing the back of my head off. Saw Doc few days later, told him the story, and got on Suboxone.
I have been using Opiates 14 years now, and OP, have to say if your stepson is going through what I was, he actually may need some opiates as part of his daily life just like a diabetic needs insulin.
However, I have been put on 12mg Suboxone a day-6mg in AM and 6mg in PM. It does not get me 'high' or even the slightest of a buzz, it just makes me feel 'normal' and able to function in my daily activities.
For your stepson to run out of Suboxone indicates a problem. Perhaps he wasn't titrated to a high enough dose. Perhaps he is trading them on the Black Market for full-agonist Opiods like Oxy , hydro, and such. Subs have a ceiling effect of 32mg/day, so I just can't understand him running out unless he's not getting enough or if he's trading them. Well, I guess he may be trying to get high off them too, but I think that's an exercise in futility. Best of luck to him.
Suboxone and methadone are drugs that can turn lives around. I am currently on 53mg of methadone I am in the process of switching to suboxone a drug that's easier to get off of and is safer in my book. He will be able to live a normal life one with out stealing and lies. My advice is be supportive, most of these drugs require you have help thru their therapists and some have you attend support groups as well. It is commonly refered to as a suboxone program protecal. I say yes this is a good thing you will see his life get better as long as he wants it.
I suspected he might be using other drugs. That is why I asked about the alcohol. If he is running out if his suboxone and taking other pills also he is looking to get high and not working a recovery program. This is the reason why he is still defensive and angry when asked questions about his tapering.
I know how living with an addict can wear you down. My husband is a recovering addict and has now been clean for 3 1/2 years. He had been clean for 11 years when we got married. I didn't know how relapsing then.
His relapse lasted for years. He went on methadone and that was another addiction. Years into it he also began to buy more, eat xanax and drink alcohol. He was angry, always yelling, argumentative, defensive, a liar.
It took such a toil on our marriage and our four children. I didn't know about medhelp, alanon or naranon back then.
After repeatedly asking him to leave for a few years he did. I never worked outside the home and with four children I felt I had no options but to stay.
We were separated for a year. His addiction got worse and he became suicidal. He finally was sick and tired of being sick and tired and went to a Christian rehab. 3 1/2 years later we are all still healing.
I wouldn't wish this on anyone. Please suggest to your dughter in law to attend alanon or naranon. She needs to put some boundaries in place. She could be enabling him and not knowing it or doing it to keep him quiet. I now know that I did.
I am glad that you posted. I am glad that you have been reading on our forum. It helps to know you are not alone in this. Your step son needs to know that his addiction, is ruining his family.
He doesn't feel normal without the meds in him because he is an addict. He doesn't know how to live clean and sober. 6 weeks of rehab isn't enough. Yes he does need more help. He has to want to help himself first.
He should be in counseling and attending support groups. Your daughter in law could or you could call and inform the doctor he is abusing the meds.
I did that my husband was mad as he ll but I didn't care at that point. I had also informed his doctors office not to give him narcotics.
The sub doctor needs to be informed of this. They should be testing his urine to check the levels of suboxone to make sure he is taking it properly. I would suppose they aren't doing that.
Does your daughter in law attend church? Does she have a pastor she can confide in? I know the longer the dark, dirty secret is hiding the darker life
Becomes for all involved. He needs to be exposed.
Much prayers,
Debbie
Keep the faith
There is always hope
I know how living with an addict can wear you down. My husband is a recovering addict and has now been clean for 3 1/2 years. He had been clean for 11 years when we got married. I didn't know how relapsing then.
His relapse lasted for years. He went on methadone and that was another addiction. Years into it he also began to buy more, eat xanax and drink alcohol. He was angry, always yelling, argumentative, defensive, a liar.
It took such a toil on our marriage and our four children. I didn't know about medhelp, alanon or naranon back then.
After repeatedly asking him to leave for a few years he did. I never worked outside the home and with four children I felt I had no options but to stay.
We were separated for a year. His addiction got worse and he became suicidal. He finally was sick and tired of being sick and tired and went to a Christian rehab. 3 1/2 years later we are all still healing.
I wouldn't wish this on anyone. Please suggest to your dughter in law to attend alanon or naranon. She needs to put some boundaries in place. She could be enabling him and not knowing it or doing it to keep him quiet. I now know that I did.
I am glad that you posted. I am glad that you have been reading on our forum. It helps to know you are not alone in this. Your step son needs to know that his addiction, is ruining his family.
He doesn't feel normal without the meds in him because he is an addict. He doesn't know how to live clean and sober. 6 weeks of rehab isn't enough. Yes he does need more help. He has to want to help himself first.
He should be in counseling and attending support groups. Your daughter in law could or you could call and inform the doctor he is abusing the meds.
I did that my husband was mad as he ll but I didn't care at that point. I had also informed his doctors office not to give him narcotics.
The sub doctor needs to be informed of this. They should be testing his urine to check the levels of suboxone to make sure he is taking it properly. I would suppose they aren't doing that.
Does your daughter in law attend church? Does she have a pastor she can confide in? I know the longer the dark, dirty secret is hiding the darker life
Becomes for all involved. He needs to be exposed.
Much prayers,
Debbie
Keep the faith
There is always hope
Thanks for your response, he went to rehab for 6 weeks, and yes that is when he was put on suboxone, now over 4 years later he is still on it, he is 33 years old with a good wife and my wonderful grandson. I think if they even name a taper he freaks, according to our daughter in law, she has been wonderful through all this, but beginning to wear on their marriage! Like I said we went to the meetings while he was at rehab and I saved all the material they gave there and read over it often, we try to be supportive, but he is grown, but sometimes his 4 year old acts older than him! I don't know his dose, but it's pretty good according to his wife who is a nurse. Well here is the big kicker he runs out most times, and either withdrawals or goes and finds meds to make it through it, this happened when we were out there visiting 6 months ago. I am on pain management, since 2008, I have injections but do take meds for flare ups and breakthrough pain, I am hounded for pills every time we visit or they visit, NEVER have ever gave him meds, mine are nothing compared to what he takes, as he reminds me when I tell him I have none. This is no lie cause we make sure we have nothing like that in our house or luggage when we visit, cause of past issues, cause he can be pretty sad! We were there for a week visit, he Gave us every excuse there was for running out, and he was having every pain there was, he ended up going to the dentist and got 20 lortab 10s, ( we try to support and try not to accuse, as we were advised to at his rehab family meetings, cause it can cause him to use) he took all of those pills in a 24 hr period! And then the roller coaster started again, I felt so sorry for his wife, we seen 1st hand what her life is everyday. He needs better help, he saids he don't feel normal without some of these meds in him. I am scared to death for him, and being 8 hrs away its hard to know what is really going on! I just know he needs more help than his family can do, his wife is great, but growing tired! I have been reading on this sight for a while for help, but never posted a question about him until now, y'all are wonderful and help so many,thank y'all so much!
Hello and welcome. How old is your step son? Is he required to attend counseling and/ or support groups along with the suboxone?
Yes many people get on and stay on suboxone for years. It does and can become another addiction. He needs to be sick and tired of being sick and tired. The suboxone is still in control he isn't. Does he live with anyone?
If he hasn't dealt with his demons and why he abused drugs in the first place and is still on the suboxone 4 years later he isn't ready to make the necessary steps to change his life.
Have you attended any alanon or naranon meetings? How long was he in rehab? Was he put on the suboxone in rehab and just never came off of it?
Do you know what dose he is on? Does he drink alcohol?
I understand your concern, worry and frustration.
There is always hope.
Keep the faith,
Debbie
Yes many people get on and stay on suboxone for years. It does and can become another addiction. He needs to be sick and tired of being sick and tired. The suboxone is still in control he isn't. Does he live with anyone?
If he hasn't dealt with his demons and why he abused drugs in the first place and is still on the suboxone 4 years later he isn't ready to make the necessary steps to change his life.
Have you attended any alanon or naranon meetings? How long was he in rehab? Was he put on the suboxone in rehab and just never came off of it?
Do you know what dose he is on? Does he drink alcohol?
I understand your concern, worry and frustration.
There is always hope.
Keep the faith,
Debbie
Hi and Welcome. I seen this over at the "Living with a Addict". So was he put on the Subs for his prior drug use??
If he is in a re-hab they will try to taper him down in there. Once he is through his physical w/d he will have to come back home and have to do a whole new life style change. Addiction is a life time disease and there is no cure. We have to work on Recovery min by min, day by day. He will have to stay away from old stomping grounds or people, places and things that can cause triggers to use. He might want to talk to a Dr to get on a AD med for awhile if he uses for depression. We use for many emotional reason or we like the buzz to get wired up. BUT it is very serious what it can do to the Brain Transmitter and the Receptors. It unbalances the brain to where we are not thinking with a real brain but a drug brain. Try to learn all you can about the "Disease of Addiction" and the "Disease of Addiction and the Pleasure Pathway" Beyond Willpower. He might be watching the videos about this himself at the Treatment center. BUT the biggest thing is that HE has to want this for himself..I sure wish you and him and the rest of the family the best.
Bless
If he is in a re-hab they will try to taper him down in there. Once he is through his physical w/d he will have to come back home and have to do a whole new life style change. Addiction is a life time disease and there is no cure. We have to work on Recovery min by min, day by day. He will have to stay away from old stomping grounds or people, places and things that can cause triggers to use. He might want to talk to a Dr to get on a AD med for awhile if he uses for depression. We use for many emotional reason or we like the buzz to get wired up. BUT it is very serious what it can do to the Brain Transmitter and the Receptors. It unbalances the brain to where we are not thinking with a real brain but a drug brain. Try to learn all you can about the "Disease of Addiction" and the "Disease of Addiction and the Pleasure Pathway" Beyond Willpower. He might be watching the videos about this himself at the Treatment center. BUT the biggest thing is that HE has to want this for himself..I sure wish you and him and the rest of the family the best.
Bless
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