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Naked grinding with vaginal secretions
Hi,
I engaged in a naked frottage session with a Philippine CSW on Nov. 20 and it lasted for about 10-15 mins. The penis head came into contact with the lips several times thereby exposing my urethra from the vaginal fluids. I'm pretty sure that there was no penetration as I know how it feels going inside/inside a woman's genitalia. I’m also circumcised btw. However, the vagina was really wet from the session. I believed that this was a low-risk activity but then the symptoms came.
Nov. 24 (Day 4): I suddenly had a low grade fever with headache and a throat which hurts a bit. I thought it was nothing. I started to lose appetite too. Since then, I always feel fatigued.
Nov. 26 (Day 6): I woke up in the middle of the night drenched with sweat.
Nov. 27 (Day 7): Fever broke. However, I start to notice rash in my arms, legs and chest. Face wasn’t involved and they don’t itch.
Nov. 28 (Day 8): I had myself checked by an Internal Medicine Doctor. Upon checking of the rash, she thinks that it’s either dengue or german measles based on how the rashes look. She requested for a CBC for a baseline. Results were WBC: 3.2, Neutrophils: 65%, Lymphocytes: 35%, Platelets: 197. I also lost 9lbs in just a week without even trying. She scheduled for a CBC and Dengue test for the day after.
Nov. 29 (Day 9): I wasn’t able to see my doctor so I just texted her results of the tests. WBC: 3.7, Neutrophils:66%, Lymphocytes:34%, Plateletes:207. Dengue Antibody Test was also Negative. She just told me to rest it up and no tests were done for Measles.
Nov. 30 (Day ten): I noticed a white coating on my tongue and my mouth feels dry since then. Rashes cleared on their own without any peeling.
Dec. 1(Day 11): I started to feel a tingling sensation in my fingers and toes which lasted for 3 days.
Dec. 5(Day 15): I lost another 7lbs. I just lost 16lbs in 2 weeks without even trying. I saw on research that weight loss is the most specific symptom for Acute HIV along with oral ulcers though I didn't have any oral ulcer.
Until now, there are occasional bouts of malaise without fever.
My Concerns are:
(1) The reasoning that HIV is not found in the lips of vagina is flawed as the secretions by bartholin’s gland were not actually studied. If you can please show a link to the peer-reviewed document where you base this argument, I’d like to read that.
Even Doc. Hansfield of Medhelp said that:
“Actually, I don't agree with that reasoning. First, I'm not sure that the HIV content of lubricating secretions from the Barthonlin and Skene's glands actually has been studied. Certainly if there were inflammation of those glands, as is common in STDs, those fluids almost certainly would contain HIV -- and HIV might be there all the time anyway. Second, there is no way to separate cervical secretions from lubricating fluid. Cervical secretions are produced continually by most women, and I would not assume that fluids near the vaginal opening come only from sexual lubrication; undoubtedly they usually (always?) include cervical secretions.”
HIV is not just found in cervical fluids but also in vaginal fluids though not as much as in the cervical fluid as presented by this research:
Detection of HIV DNA in cervical and vaginal secretions. Prevalence and correlates among women in Nairobi, Kenya. Clemetson DB1, Moss GB, Willerford DM, Hensel M, Emonyi W, Holmes KK, Plummer F, Ndinya-Achola J, Roberts PL, Hillier S, et al.
http://jid.oxfordjournals.org/content/178/4/983.full.pdf
(2) I also think that frottage with secretion hasn’t been studied well. Add to the fact that there are fewer women that has HIV and most heterosexual act always end up in oral, vaginal and anal sex.
I now think that I am infected with the virus though I haven’t tested yet as I don’t want to spoil the New Year with loneliness. I’m planning on testing after the 3 month mark or by the end of February.
I still hope that I don’t have the virus although symptoms and timing are stacked against my favour. I just want to hear some encouraging words from the admins and to answer the 2 concerns above. I still want to believe that I’m free from this dreaded disease as I don’t think I have the same courage as you guys have here. I admire you for the courage you have despite the disease and stigma attached with it.
Don’t worry, I won’t bombard the forum like the other worried wells(though I may be a worried well too). If there are people who are experiencing the same, please share to me your experiences. I won’t post in the thread until I get checked on March
I engaged in a naked frottage session with a Philippine CSW on Nov. 20 and it lasted for about 10-15 mins. The penis head came into contact with the lips several times thereby exposing my urethra from the vaginal fluids. I'm pretty sure that there was no penetration as I know how it feels going inside/inside a woman's genitalia. I’m also circumcised btw. However, the vagina was really wet from the session. I believed that this was a low-risk activity but then the symptoms came.
Nov. 24 (Day 4): I suddenly had a low grade fever with headache and a throat which hurts a bit. I thought it was nothing. I started to lose appetite too. Since then, I always feel fatigued.
Nov. 26 (Day 6): I woke up in the middle of the night drenched with sweat.
Nov. 27 (Day 7): Fever broke. However, I start to notice rash in my arms, legs and chest. Face wasn’t involved and they don’t itch.
Nov. 28 (Day 8): I had myself checked by an Internal Medicine Doctor. Upon checking of the rash, she thinks that it’s either dengue or german measles based on how the rashes look. She requested for a CBC for a baseline. Results were WBC: 3.2, Neutrophils: 65%, Lymphocytes: 35%, Platelets: 197. I also lost 9lbs in just a week without even trying. She scheduled for a CBC and Dengue test for the day after.
Nov. 29 (Day 9): I wasn’t able to see my doctor so I just texted her results of the tests. WBC: 3.7, Neutrophils:66%, Lymphocytes:34%, Plateletes:207. Dengue Antibody Test was also Negative. She just told me to rest it up and no tests were done for Measles.
Nov. 30 (Day ten): I noticed a white coating on my tongue and my mouth feels dry since then. Rashes cleared on their own without any peeling.
Dec. 1(Day 11): I started to feel a tingling sensation in my fingers and toes which lasted for 3 days.
Dec. 5(Day 15): I lost another 7lbs. I just lost 16lbs in 2 weeks without even trying. I saw on research that weight loss is the most specific symptom for Acute HIV along with oral ulcers though I didn't have any oral ulcer.
Until now, there are occasional bouts of malaise without fever.
My Concerns are:
(1) The reasoning that HIV is not found in the lips of vagina is flawed as the secretions by bartholin’s gland were not actually studied. If you can please show a link to the peer-reviewed document where you base this argument, I’d like to read that.
Even Doc. Hansfield of Medhelp said that:
“Actually, I don't agree with that reasoning. First, I'm not sure that the HIV content of lubricating secretions from the Barthonlin and Skene's glands actually has been studied. Certainly if there were inflammation of those glands, as is common in STDs, those fluids almost certainly would contain HIV -- and HIV might be there all the time anyway. Second, there is no way to separate cervical secretions from lubricating fluid. Cervical secretions are produced continually by most women, and I would not assume that fluids near the vaginal opening come only from sexual lubrication; undoubtedly they usually (always?) include cervical secretions.”
HIV is not just found in cervical fluids but also in vaginal fluids though not as much as in the cervical fluid as presented by this research:
Detection of HIV DNA in cervical and vaginal secretions. Prevalence and correlates among women in Nairobi, Kenya. Clemetson DB1, Moss GB, Willerford DM, Hensel M, Emonyi W, Holmes KK, Plummer F, Ndinya-Achola J, Roberts PL, Hillier S, et al.
http://jid.oxfordjournals.org/content/178/4/983.full.pdf
(2) I also think that frottage with secretion hasn’t been studied well. Add to the fact that there are fewer women that has HIV and most heterosexual act always end up in oral, vaginal and anal sex.
I now think that I am infected with the virus though I haven’t tested yet as I don’t want to spoil the New Year with loneliness. I’m planning on testing after the 3 month mark or by the end of February.
I still hope that I don’t have the virus although symptoms and timing are stacked against my favour. I just want to hear some encouraging words from the admins and to answer the 2 concerns above. I still want to believe that I’m free from this dreaded disease as I don’t think I have the same courage as you guys have here. I admire you for the courage you have despite the disease and stigma attached with it.
Don’t worry, I won’t bombard the forum like the other worried wells(though I may be a worried well too). If there are people who are experiencing the same, please share to me your experiences. I won’t post in the thread until I get checked on March
You never had a risk and never needed testing.
How can you`say that the overall picture doesn't suggest HIV? Also, I didn't tell the doctor about my sexual exposure. That's why she didn't suspect HIV. But I lost a lot of weight. I'm still scared and waiting for the 12 weeks before I get tested.
You are way overthinking this. You can analyze (maybe with emphasis on "anal"!) all the theoretical and biological data you wish. The important fact is that the busiest HIV/AIDS clinics never see infected patients whose only possible exposures were body rubbing, hand-genital contact, or other non-penetrating sex.
Some of your symptoms are consistent with a new HIV infection, but the overall picture doesn't reallly suggest HIV -- and your doctor apparently didn't suspect it or would have done HIV tests when you first sought care.
Just get tested for HIV. If this sort of contact is your only potential exposure, you can count on a negative result. You don't need to wait until 3 months. The 3rd generation antibody tests are virtually 100% accurate by 6-8 weeks, and it's 4 weeks for the duo test (for antibody plus p24 antigen).
Best wishes and happy new year.
Some of your symptoms are consistent with a new HIV infection, but the overall picture doesn't reallly suggest HIV -- and your doctor apparently didn't suspect it or would have done HIV tests when you first sought care.
Just get tested for HIV. If this sort of contact is your only potential exposure, you can count on a negative result. You don't need to wait until 3 months. The 3rd generation antibody tests are virtually 100% accurate by 6-8 weeks, and it's 4 weeks for the duo test (for antibody plus p24 antigen).
Best wishes and happy new year.
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