Aa
Seems very radical
I am 46 years old, and have been diagnosed with a 2cm complex ovarian cyst, I had a HP4 blood test which was 106. I was then referred to a gyn who has said that I need to have a total hysterectomy with effected ovary removed and both fallopian tubes as well.
This seems like a huge opertion for a query of ovarian cancer, given that my health is good and that I have no symptoms of ovarian cancer. I have thickening of the uterine walls and also calcification of part of uterus. My last pap smear was clear, and have been clear for 20 years.
My question is: is he taking this too far ? I feel he should perform a biopsy whilst I am on the table BEFORE going ahead and performing a total hysterectomy. I can understand if he wants to take the one ovary and the top part of my uterus, but not why he wants to remove the entire uterus and cervix.
This seems like a huge opertion for a query of ovarian cancer, given that my health is good and that I have no symptoms of ovarian cancer. I have thickening of the uterine walls and also calcification of part of uterus. My last pap smear was clear, and have been clear for 20 years.
My question is: is he taking this too far ? I feel he should perform a biopsy whilst I am on the table BEFORE going ahead and performing a total hysterectomy. I can understand if he wants to take the one ovary and the top part of my uterus, but not why he wants to remove the entire uterus and cervix.
Yes, seems radical! I had a similar situation but my complex cyst was larger. I allowed 20 years of history with my gynecologist to cloud my judgment. I wish I had "run like heck" when he mentioned organ removal. I would give big $$$ to have my organs back. Hysterectomy is grossly overused in the U.S. Only 2% are done for a cancer diagnosis. I know Australia has a fairly high rate of unnecessary hysterectomies too.
Many ovarian cysts, even complex ones, resolve on their own. Since yours is so small (2 cm) it would seem reasonable to monitor it. And if it does need to end up being surgically removed, you should not need to lose your ovary if the cyst is non-cancerous. I would definitely be wary of any doctor who says you will likely need to lose your ovary. A doctor with good cystectomy skills can usually remove ovarian cysts and leave enough ovarian tissue for normal ovarian function.
And what is the reason for removing your uterus? My gyn had no reason to remove mine but he did anyway. I am still so sick about this 8 YEARS later.
Here in the U.S. there is a CA125 test for ovarian cancer but it is not accurate at diagnosing ovarian cancer. Is this similar to the HP4 test? Regardless of diagnostic tests, a frozen section done while you are under anesthesia should dictate whether or not the ovary is removed. But the surgical consent forms are typically written to protect the doctor and allow him/her to remove whatever he deems "necessary." I wish I had not signed the consent form as it was written. The frozen section of my cyst was benign but my gynecologist proceeded to remove the rest of my organs anyway. So buyer beware.
Many ovarian cysts, even complex ones, resolve on their own. Since yours is so small (2 cm) it would seem reasonable to monitor it. And if it does need to end up being surgically removed, you should not need to lose your ovary if the cyst is non-cancerous. I would definitely be wary of any doctor who says you will likely need to lose your ovary. A doctor with good cystectomy skills can usually remove ovarian cysts and leave enough ovarian tissue for normal ovarian function.
And what is the reason for removing your uterus? My gyn had no reason to remove mine but he did anyway. I am still so sick about this 8 YEARS later.
Here in the U.S. there is a CA125 test for ovarian cancer but it is not accurate at diagnosing ovarian cancer. Is this similar to the HP4 test? Regardless of diagnostic tests, a frozen section done while you are under anesthesia should dictate whether or not the ovary is removed. But the surgical consent forms are typically written to protect the doctor and allow him/her to remove whatever he deems "necessary." I wish I had not signed the consent form as it was written. The frozen section of my cyst was benign but my gynecologist proceeded to remove the rest of my organs anyway. So buyer beware.
The HP4 is meant to be more accurate the the CA125, but still can throw false/positive results. My result was about 8 point above what they say is normal for a woman of my age in perimenopause - if the result had been over VERY like over 200 (mine was 106), then I would understand his concern.
I'm seeing a different GP this week and getting a referral for another ultrasound (mine was done in September) and getting a referral to another specialist. I have an appointment with my specialist on Monday, and if he point blank refuses to discuss biopsy of right ovary and not performing total hysterectomy - I am open to a partial hysterectomy due to the thickening and calcification, but i see no reason to entirely remove it and my cervix if it's not cancerous, then I will consult the second specialist as to whether I should cancel my surgery.
I'm seeing a different GP this week and getting a referral for another ultrasound (mine was done in September) and getting a referral to another specialist. I have an appointment with my specialist on Monday, and if he point blank refuses to discuss biopsy of right ovary and not performing total hysterectomy - I am open to a partial hysterectomy due to the thickening and calcification, but i see no reason to entirely remove it and my cervix if it's not cancerous, then I will consult the second specialist as to whether I should cancel my surgery.
I have a friend who had the same type of benign complex cyst as I did and her CA125 was well over 1000 (range is 5-35). Her gynecologist removed all her parts too and all he should have removed was the cyst.
A thickened lining is common during perimenopause since you are not consistently ovulating. Only rarely does this thickening cause problems. And even when hyperplasia does develop, it is usually curable with a medication (progestin). If you have fibroids or polyps, they can be difficult to differentiate from the lining itself making the lining appear thicker than it is.
Fibroids are common in women in their 30's and 40's. Since they oftentimes cause no symptoms, many don't even know they have them. The calcification seen on ultrasound could be from fibroids degenerating due to reduced blood supply). This process can also cause pain.
I mistakenly thought my uterus was no longer needed. Boy did I find out otherwise! I miss it as much as (maybe even more than) my ovaries! And the removal of my ovaries caused RAPID AGING so it has been very traumatic and life-altering.
A thickened lining is common during perimenopause since you are not consistently ovulating. Only rarely does this thickening cause problems. And even when hyperplasia does develop, it is usually curable with a medication (progestin). If you have fibroids or polyps, they can be difficult to differentiate from the lining itself making the lining appear thicker than it is.
Fibroids are common in women in their 30's and 40's. Since they oftentimes cause no symptoms, many don't even know they have them. The calcification seen on ultrasound could be from fibroids degenerating due to reduced blood supply). This process can also cause pain.
I mistakenly thought my uterus was no longer needed. Boy did I find out otherwise! I miss it as much as (maybe even more than) my ovaries! And the removal of my ovaries caused RAPID AGING so it has been very traumatic and life-altering.
It's taken me almost 2 months to stop and question what the specialist said - my op is meant to be on December 4, and I'm smacking my head that I have been so slo-o-o-o-w to come to my senses and seek a second opinion.
The specialist is planning on only removing 1 ovary, but now I'm like - I want BOTH my ovaries. I never wanted to lose my cervix, and the more I'm reading about it, the more I DEFINTELY want to keep it. I don't mind losing a bit of my uterus, but I see no point removing all of it.
The specialist is planning on only removing 1 ovary, but now I'm like - I want BOTH my ovaries. I never wanted to lose my cervix, and the more I'm reading about it, the more I DEFINTELY want to keep it. I don't mind losing a bit of my uterus, but I see no point removing all of it.
Why not keep ALL of your uterus? It sounds like there is no proof that it needs to be removed. How thick is the lining? A thickened lining is rarely a problem but if you or your doctor are concerned, an endometrial biopsy should be done. If you do happen to have hyperplasia, medication will usually cure it.
I understand about the second opinion. It is human nature to trust our doctors and we also do not want them knowing that we question their recommendations and authority. My doctor scheduled my surgery for 5 days later and I even cancelled it and HE rescheduled it. I should have said "I will call YOU if/when I decide to proceed!" Instead, I let him "chip away" at me with excuses for why this had to be removed and that had to be removed. It's almost as if I felt indebted to him for his years of good obstetric care. But mostly, the 20 years of trust and respect did me in. In the end, it was all about his financial gain at the expense of my health and well-being. My medical records and subsequent research were eye-opening. I have connected with MANY women with similar stories of unnecessary hysterectomies and oophorectomies.
I understand about the second opinion. It is human nature to trust our doctors and we also do not want them knowing that we question their recommendations and authority. My doctor scheduled my surgery for 5 days later and I even cancelled it and HE rescheduled it. I should have said "I will call YOU if/when I decide to proceed!" Instead, I let him "chip away" at me with excuses for why this had to be removed and that had to be removed. It's almost as if I felt indebted to him for his years of good obstetric care. But mostly, the 20 years of trust and respect did me in. In the end, it was all about his financial gain at the expense of my health and well-being. My medical records and subsequent research were eye-opening. I have connected with MANY women with similar stories of unnecessary hysterectomies and oophorectomies.
My uterus us retroverted and has trouble draining, so after my period there is a really yuck discharge, it seems to be getting worse as I get older.
Since my last post I have booked in for another ultrasound and have rescheduled to see him with the new ultrasound in hand. If the cyst is anything but larger I will be telling him I will cancel the surgery unless he's willing to perform a biopsy on the ovary and that unless the ovary is malignant I want to retain it, AND that my uterus being completely removed is OFF the table. If the cyst is larger or if he refuses to do it my way, then I will be booking myself into see another specialist.
Since my last post I have booked in for another ultrasound and have rescheduled to see him with the new ultrasound in hand. If the cyst is anything but larger I will be telling him I will cancel the surgery unless he's willing to perform a biopsy on the ovary and that unless the ovary is malignant I want to retain it, AND that my uterus being completely removed is OFF the table. If the cyst is larger or if he refuses to do it my way, then I will be booking myself into see another specialist.
That sounds like a safe plan - be sure to make your wishes clear on your surgical consent form; otherwise, it is his word against yours.
I had a retroverted uterus too and almost always had a discharge but no other issues - not sure the discharge was associated with the position of my uterus. My uterus gave me great orgasms and I really miss those. Your discharge will probably go away or lessen with menopause and its hormone changes.
When cysts get to be about 7cm or larger is when there is concern about ovarian torsion. And since you did not mention a predisposition for / family history of ovarian cancer, there is only a remote chance that the cyst is cancerous.
I hope this all occurs as you desire and your surgical recovery goes well (if the cyst does not go away)! Let me know how your appointment goes.
I had a retroverted uterus too and almost always had a discharge but no other issues - not sure the discharge was associated with the position of my uterus. My uterus gave me great orgasms and I really miss those. Your discharge will probably go away or lessen with menopause and its hormone changes.
When cysts get to be about 7cm or larger is when there is concern about ovarian torsion. And since you did not mention a predisposition for / family history of ovarian cancer, there is only a remote chance that the cyst is cancerous.
I hope this all occurs as you desire and your surgical recovery goes well (if the cyst does not go away)! Let me know how your appointment goes.
old-before-my-time Thank you so very much for all your great advice, it's been very reassuring for me to speak with you.
Yes, I'm going to make myself VERY clear and unless I get advice from the hospital that he is changing the procedure I won't be going ahead - of course that will also be dependent on my new ultrasound as well.
No history of any cancer in my family, and I'm very healthy, which makes his reasons for wanting to perform a total hysterectomy even more questionable.
I will certainly keep you update, and, again, thank you for your time and advice xoxo
Yes, I'm going to make myself VERY clear and unless I get advice from the hospital that he is changing the procedure I won't be going ahead - of course that will also be dependent on my new ultrasound as well.
No history of any cancer in my family, and I'm very healthy, which makes his reasons for wanting to perform a total hysterectomy even more questionable.
I will certainly keep you update, and, again, thank you for your time and advice xoxo
Thank you for your kind words! I am so thankful you posted here and I was able to share my story hopefully saving you from the awful effects of female organ removal. I will be waiting to hear the results of your u/s. Big hugs!
I had the ultra sound - my request AND the cyst has resolved.
The specialist suggested that I get another blood test without any surgery, I declined as the blood test is what screwed everything up, instead I suggested that we do biopsies on both ovaries - which he agreed to, and he also suggested a curette, which I am agreeing to, my attitude is 'let's get the all clear on EVERTHING'.
I'm over the moon.
The specialist suggested that I get another blood test without any surgery, I declined as the blood test is what screwed everything up, instead I suggested that we do biopsies on both ovaries - which he agreed to, and he also suggested a curette, which I am agreeing to, my attitude is 'let's get the all clear on EVERTHING'.
I'm over the moon.
Do you have a family history of ovarian cancer hence the reason for wanting your ovaries biopsied even though the cyst is gone? Are you saying they are going to do surgery to remove tissue from your ovaries to biopsy?? I have not heard of this being done.
As far as your lining - Did the u/s show that it is still thickened? Have you ever had a u/s right after your period to see if the lining is being sloughed off? It is normal for the lining to get up to 16mm. An endometrial biopsy is less invasive than a D&C if you are concerned about the thickening possibly being hyperplasia.
As far as your lining - Did the u/s show that it is still thickened? Have you ever had a u/s right after your period to see if the lining is being sloughed off? It is normal for the lining to get up to 16mm. An endometrial biopsy is less invasive than a D&C if you are concerned about the thickening possibly being hyperplasia.
No,no history at all, I'm just ruling everything out. I don't trust the blood test (HP4), and it was the blood test that indicated cancer, so I'm going for the biopsy to completely rule it out.
Yes,I'm having a laparoscopy to get biopsies of the ovaries, I agree it's unusual, but I want to get the all clear, this whole thing has freaked me out, and I won't sleep until I know exactly what is and isn't going on.
I had just finished my cycle - I was thinking the same thing as you, and the endometrium is still thick in places, plus there's calcification, so I want that scraped and examined.
Yes,I'm having a laparoscopy to get biopsies of the ovaries, I agree it's unusual, but I want to get the all clear, this whole thing has freaked me out, and I won't sleep until I know exactly what is and isn't going on.
I had just finished my cycle - I was thinking the same thing as you, and the endometrium is still thick in places, plus there's calcification, so I want that scraped and examined.
Because of this scare and because of how close I came to getting healthy (hopefully) ovaries removed and getting a total hysterectomy - all of which came about because of a scan and a blood test that indicated I was a strong possibility of having a malignant cancer, I want to talk to people and agencies and make them aware just how flawed the testing is, if I can do something - anything to stop women from having unneccessary surgery then i will do it. I want to PROVE how flawed the testing is - so I want to get a complete clearance of cancer and then share these results with Ovarian Cancer Australia, and other women so that they can make informed choices.
I had not thought of that - using the biopsy results (assuming they are negative as will likely be the case) to prove that the HP4 test is not accurate. It would be great if we can stop these gynecologic surgeons from ripping out women's organs unnecessarily. I don't know what the stats are in Australia but in the U.S. 1 in 3 women has a hysterectomy by age 60 and 1 in 2 by age 72 yet only about 2% are done fro a cancer diagnosis. I was just reading a 2009 study that said 78% of women lose healthy ovaries at the time of hysterectomy. My gosh, they would NEVER remove a man's healthy testicles. They would get sued for millions!
I hope your surgery goes well and proves that your sex organs are not a ticking time bomb as many gyns would like us to believe. When is the surgery?
I hope your surgery goes well and proves that your sex organs are not a ticking time bomb as many gyns would like us to believe. When is the surgery?
Thank you xo
I have no idea what the stats are, but I will be researching and finding out. I am reeling with horror thinking of how close I came to having unnecessary surgery to remove what could well be healthy organs - based on nothing more than an imperfect blood test, and an ultrasound, really it's shocking to think about it.
78% GOOD LORD that's appalling, those poor women going through menopause simply because someone thought it would be a good idea to remove them (ovaries). Damn right men would be suing and honestly - women should start threatening the same, this may be what's needed to make surgeons step back and realise that a womans ovaries are her BALLS and she doesn't want to lose them !
Thank you so much, I'm feeling in very good health and am feeling very positive about my surgery - which is next Thursday.
I have no idea what the stats are, but I will be researching and finding out. I am reeling with horror thinking of how close I came to having unnecessary surgery to remove what could well be healthy organs - based on nothing more than an imperfect blood test, and an ultrasound, really it's shocking to think about it.
78% GOOD LORD that's appalling, those poor women going through menopause simply because someone thought it would be a good idea to remove them (ovaries). Damn right men would be suing and honestly - women should start threatening the same, this may be what's needed to make surgeons step back and realise that a womans ovaries are her BALLS and she doesn't want to lose them !
Thank you so much, I'm feeling in very good health and am feeling very positive about my surgery - which is next Thursday.
Unfortunately, "surgical menopause" is a misnomer since it is nothing like menopause. The ovaries of intact women in natural menopause produce hormones into their 80's, mostly testosterone which the body converts to estrogen on an "as needed" basis. To add insult to "injury" there is no FDA approved testosterone "replacement" for women in the U.S. However, hormone "replacement" is also a misnomer since no drug can adequately replace the organs that were removed. And organ removal can disrupt the functioning of the other endocrine glands since the endocrine "system" has been "short circuited."
And then there are all the anatomical and skeletal changes brought on by the removal of the uterus that causes a whole other set of permanent, progressive health and quality of life issues.
As far as lawsuits, it is next to impossible to find lawyers to take these cases and even when they do, it is hard to win. I think the main reason is that female organ removal is so prevalent and most people including lawyers aren't aware of all the harm it causes. And "informed consent" cases are difficult to prove. The most recent win was only because the plaintiff's lawyer discovered some medical records that the doctor had tried to hide.
Just make sure your consent forms clearly state your wishes before you go into pre-op for sedation. Hope all goes well and I will be waiting to hear how you are doing.
And then there are all the anatomical and skeletal changes brought on by the removal of the uterus that causes a whole other set of permanent, progressive health and quality of life issues.
As far as lawsuits, it is next to impossible to find lawyers to take these cases and even when they do, it is hard to win. I think the main reason is that female organ removal is so prevalent and most people including lawyers aren't aware of all the harm it causes. And "informed consent" cases are difficult to prove. The most recent win was only because the plaintiff's lawyer discovered some medical records that the doctor had tried to hide.
Just make sure your consent forms clearly state your wishes before you go into pre-op for sedation. Hope all goes well and I will be waiting to hear how you are doing.
I'm ringing the hospital on Monday to get the surgery update and I'll be discussing it then - I won't be going anywhere near the hospital until I get confirmation about the actual surgery I'm having.
Removal of the ovaries is female castration, really when you get down to it, no man would agree to it without wanting to make damn sure he needed it, I think if more people were aware - as I have just become aware, then there'd be a lot mot kicking and screaming about it.
My BIG problem with having my uterus being removed was the risk of prolapse. I had researched and decided that I wasn't willing to take the risk of prolapse based on 'maybe/could be' cancer.
Removal of the ovaries is female castration, really when you get down to it, no man would agree to it without wanting to make damn sure he needed it, I think if more people were aware - as I have just become aware, then there'd be a lot mot kicking and screaming about it.
My BIG problem with having my uterus being removed was the risk of prolapse. I had researched and decided that I wasn't willing to take the risk of prolapse based on 'maybe/could be' cancer.
All true and yet none of this was mentioned to you when you were told to have your parts removed - same thing that happens here in the U.S. So glad you discovered the truth!
I am glad all looked AOK...hope the pathology confirms! Let me know. Be sure to follow the recovery instructions and take it easy for the recommended time (6 weeks or so?) so that all those internal and external sutures heal properly. I hope you are not in too much pain (thankfully, pain was not an issue for me).
I'm back home and taking it easy, I've only got external stitches and mild cramping from D & C which is under control with good ole paracetemol/
The on duty doctor showed me pics from the surgery - everything looks pink and healthy, only dark spot was from endo - and that was removed.
I figure the pathology will be back next week.
Thank you not only for your concern, but for sharing your story and giving my the necessary food for thought to make me get out there and seek answers.
The on duty doctor showed me pics from the surgery - everything looks pink and healthy, only dark spot was from endo - and that was removed.
I figure the pathology will be back next week.
Thank you not only for your concern, but for sharing your story and giving my the necessary food for thought to make me get out there and seek answers.
Oh I guess the ovarian tissue they took to biopsy shouldn't require much of a recovery. Nor should the D&C so that is good.
I am glad I was able to make a difference. I know people tend to trust their doctors but medical care is big business especially when it comes to hysterectomy and oophorectomy (castration).
I hope your education of other women and agencies about the overuse of hysterectomy and oophorectomy there in Australia makes a difference!
I am glad I was able to make a difference. I know people tend to trust their doctors but medical care is big business especially when it comes to hysterectomy and oophorectomy (castration).
I hope your education of other women and agencies about the overuse of hysterectomy and oophorectomy there in Australia makes a difference!
I plan on it making a difference.
The reaction of the hospital staff to my change in surgery was very telling, they were shocked that I was scheduled for hysterectomy etc and was now just getting biopsies, my gyn. team apart from surgeon was all female, so I hope it had an effect on them and makes them question what they've been taught, as women I imagine it would have had a big impact on them.
The reaction of the hospital staff to my change in surgery was very telling, they were shocked that I was scheduled for hysterectomy etc and was now just getting biopsies, my gyn. team apart from surgeon was all female, so I hope it had an effect on them and makes them question what they've been taught, as women I imagine it would have had a big impact on them.
Have an Answer?
You are reading content posted in the Hysterectomy Community
STDs can't be transmitted by casual contact, like hugging or touching.
Syphilis is an STD that is transmitted by oral, genital and anal sex.
Normal vaginal discharge varies in color, smell, texture and amount.
Bumps in the genital area might be STDs, but are usually not serious.
Chlamydia, an STI, often has no symptoms, but must be treated.
From skin changes to weight loss to unusual bleeding, here are 15 cancer warning signs that women tend to ignore.
