Aa
vitamin/mineral deficiencies
does anyone know if there are any particular vitamin/mineral deficiencies to look out for with lyme?
the only one I know is possibly magnesium.
Agreed, definitely talk to your doctor(s) before deciding what to do.
I DO go sit in the sun for a bit when I can, and I feel better afterward, so either Marshall's theory is wrong overall, or the theory is wrong for me (but not necessarily for others) .
It may well be that the Vit D thing working or not depends on what kind of bug(s) one has. So much not known ...
What I have not seen is any statement by any MD anywhere (please forward data if you have it!) as to WHY there are people including me with such terribly low Vit D levels. That's why I didn't wolf down the big amounts the nonLLMD gave me...there has to be a reason why my levels are low.
I DO go sit in the sun for a bit when I can, and I feel better afterward, so either Marshall's theory is wrong overall, or the theory is wrong for me (but not necessarily for others) .
It may well be that the Vit D thing working or not depends on what kind of bug(s) one has. So much not known ...
What I have not seen is any statement by any MD anywhere (please forward data if you have it!) as to WHY there are people including me with such terribly low Vit D levels. That's why I didn't wolf down the big amounts the nonLLMD gave me...there has to be a reason why my levels are low.
Personally, I don't buy it. I looked into it before and discussed it with my LLMD. And from my own experience (or what's most important to me, hehe) I do better supplementing D.
But there are others who say it makes them feel worse, so caution may be key here.
I also have avoided the huge doses of D. Perhaps a reasonable approach to this is to get tested. If you are low, start with a small dose supplement (I started with just 400 IU) and see how you do. I'm now up to 1000 IU bid, and am waiting for my latest blood work. Of course, always ask your doctor too.
But there are others who say it makes them feel worse, so caution may be key here.
I also have avoided the huge doses of D. Perhaps a reasonable approach to this is to get tested. If you are low, start with a small dose supplement (I started with just 400 IU) and see how you do. I'm now up to 1000 IU bid, and am waiting for my latest blood work. Of course, always ask your doctor too.
Wow, that is very interesting... Guess maybe I'll hold back on taking thoes D supplements! :)
Re Vitamin D --
Taking Vitamin D supplements is surrounded by some controversy. I'm just now doing some reading that applies to it ... the general theme is that having low Vitamin D is a symptom and result of Lyme activity, and by supplementing, the Lyme bugs are strengthened and fed. I just got and am reading a book by Bryan Rosner called The Top 10 Lyme Disease Treatments and will give a brief review of it when I'm done reading, and he talks about Vit D.
I was told I had very low Vit D before I was finally diagnosed with Lyme, and I resisted taking huge doses of Vit D, because it just didn't make sense to me: I'd rather go sit in the sun and make my own Vit D. (There is a HUGE medhelp forum on Vitamin D and if you want to read posts by some very ill people who have been sick for a long long time, that's the place to go. Makes the bunch of us here sound almost healthy.)
The short story from the Rosner book (and other places) is: Vitamin D is not actually a 'vitamin' like Vitamin C -- it was misnamed long ago. Vitamins are necessary in the diet to have good health and are gotten through food intake, but Vit D is not normally gotten through food, only through exposure of the skin to sunlight. Rosner's book says Lyme bacteria and cell wall deficient (CWD) bacteria interfere with the body's balance of converting Vit D to a usable form called 1,25-D, by causing *too much* conversion from D to 1,25-D, which in turn suppresses the immune system and keeps your body from killing the bacteria. Therefore the more Vit D you take when you are sick with Lyme/CWD, the more 1,25-D the bugs can create and the more they suppress your immune system and produce inflammation and keep themselves alive.
Okay, I'm not sure I buy this theory, which is why I'm reading up on it. There is a Dr in So.Calif. named Trevor Marshall who has invented something called the 'Marshall Protocol', which has a point of view that you stay OUT of the sun and don't take Vit D (among other actions) in order to cure Lyme/CWD infections. I looked at their website a year or so ago and found it a bit cult-like but keep running across mentions of it, like in this Rosner book (which I find very wordy).
Drs insist that everyone take a bunch of Vit D, and with Vit D added to milk and all sorts of foods, it's hard to avoid -- never mind avoiding sunlight. One of my very nice and highly trained (nonLLMD) Drs insisted that I must 'refill' my empty tank of Vit D with 50,000 IU pills, which made no common sense to me, so I didn't do it -- I said I'd go sit in the sun instead. Those folks over on the medhelp Vitamin D forum keep taking tons of Vit D and so far I keep reading it's not working for them, their levels drop back immediately upon ceasing intake of it, and they are still sick as dogs and don't know why. Bottom line: taking Vit D might not be as good as the drs think.
Usual apologies for the looong post. My review of the Rosner book will follow eventually.
Taking Vitamin D supplements is surrounded by some controversy. I'm just now doing some reading that applies to it ... the general theme is that having low Vitamin D is a symptom and result of Lyme activity, and by supplementing, the Lyme bugs are strengthened and fed. I just got and am reading a book by Bryan Rosner called The Top 10 Lyme Disease Treatments and will give a brief review of it when I'm done reading, and he talks about Vit D.
I was told I had very low Vit D before I was finally diagnosed with Lyme, and I resisted taking huge doses of Vit D, because it just didn't make sense to me: I'd rather go sit in the sun and make my own Vit D. (There is a HUGE medhelp forum on Vitamin D and if you want to read posts by some very ill people who have been sick for a long long time, that's the place to go. Makes the bunch of us here sound almost healthy.)
The short story from the Rosner book (and other places) is: Vitamin D is not actually a 'vitamin' like Vitamin C -- it was misnamed long ago. Vitamins are necessary in the diet to have good health and are gotten through food intake, but Vit D is not normally gotten through food, only through exposure of the skin to sunlight. Rosner's book says Lyme bacteria and cell wall deficient (CWD) bacteria interfere with the body's balance of converting Vit D to a usable form called 1,25-D, by causing *too much* conversion from D to 1,25-D, which in turn suppresses the immune system and keeps your body from killing the bacteria. Therefore the more Vit D you take when you are sick with Lyme/CWD, the more 1,25-D the bugs can create and the more they suppress your immune system and produce inflammation and keep themselves alive.
Okay, I'm not sure I buy this theory, which is why I'm reading up on it. There is a Dr in So.Calif. named Trevor Marshall who has invented something called the 'Marshall Protocol', which has a point of view that you stay OUT of the sun and don't take Vit D (among other actions) in order to cure Lyme/CWD infections. I looked at their website a year or so ago and found it a bit cult-like but keep running across mentions of it, like in this Rosner book (which I find very wordy).
Drs insist that everyone take a bunch of Vit D, and with Vit D added to milk and all sorts of foods, it's hard to avoid -- never mind avoiding sunlight. One of my very nice and highly trained (nonLLMD) Drs insisted that I must 'refill' my empty tank of Vit D with 50,000 IU pills, which made no common sense to me, so I didn't do it -- I said I'd go sit in the sun instead. Those folks over on the medhelp Vitamin D forum keep taking tons of Vit D and so far I keep reading it's not working for them, their levels drop back immediately upon ceasing intake of it, and they are still sick as dogs and don't know why. Bottom line: taking Vit D might not be as good as the drs think.
Usual apologies for the looong post. My review of the Rosner book will follow eventually.
yup I heard about the vit D insufficiency so am taking it, B12 I find hard to take as wonko has said,maybe I will try sublingual .. good thread I have wondered what to ask my health food store to get for me..
Vitamin D.
This is a common deficiency in the general population. There are also theories that chronic infection can further suppress vitamin D levels.
Few foods are a good source of D. You can get it from the sun or from supplements, I've head D3 gel tabs are the best but I just take a cheap grocery store brand.
B12
Vitamin B12 deficiency can cause a lot of sensory symptoms such as tingling and pins and needles. I'm not sure if it is associated with Lyme per say, but it should be ruled out as a mimic.
B12 is not easily absorbed if digested. If you have a significant deficiency, you may get shots. Otherwise, a sub-lingual form (you place it under the tongue and let it dissolve) is good.
I am sure there are others, but those are the two big ones of which I know.
This is a common deficiency in the general population. There are also theories that chronic infection can further suppress vitamin D levels.
Few foods are a good source of D. You can get it from the sun or from supplements, I've head D3 gel tabs are the best but I just take a cheap grocery store brand.
B12
Vitamin B12 deficiency can cause a lot of sensory symptoms such as tingling and pins and needles. I'm not sure if it is associated with Lyme per say, but it should be ruled out as a mimic.
B12 is not easily absorbed if digested. If you have a significant deficiency, you may get shots. Otherwise, a sub-lingual form (you place it under the tongue and let it dissolve) is good.
I am sure there are others, but those are the two big ones of which I know.
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