Thinking about Suboxtone

[Cannonfodda]

Hi all,
I am scared, really scared. I am taking 4 80mg Oxycontin, 8 30mg Oxycodone 20mg Diazepam, 12mg Zanaflex 20mg Paxil and now I just started taking 100mg Atenolol for high BP. I have been on all kinds of pain meds for 18 years. This current dose 2.5 years.

I have come down to 5 days short on my meds until my next appointment. I have been traveling with work and don't know if I lost some or it was taken from my med cabinet during a New Years party or whatever, but anyhow I don’t know what to do and I can’t do this alone.

I have looked at bupernol or something like that inpatient for 3-5 days then on Suboxtone. The cost for the treatment is $2,700. I know I should do it but I am afraid of the pain and withdrawals and just cutting down today was bad and brought me to this site right now. I had 3 knee surgeries, herniated discs and nerve issues in my back and neck, I had so many epidurals in my neck that it calcified and limited movement. I also don’t want to trade off from one addictive drug to another without the pain relief. If I knew then what I do now, I would have never taken this crap.

I have a wonderful family, great job and I am going crazy with fears of loosing one or both in the next few days.

I am not sure why I am even typing this right now, I suppose no one can understand how I feel accept you all whom I have read through some of the latest posts.
I thought of going to my Dr. and telling him my pills went missing, but I don’t know if he would believe me or not, I am feeling more and more like a drug addict.

You  don’t know me from jack and I don't do much internet posting ,Sometimes I say, I cant live like this, my children deserve better, one day a month to get my scripts taking off work to do so, when I have no pain, I just need them to feel happy. I am depressed and I don’t know what to do. Other times I say no way can I work when I cant lift my head off the pillow in the morning.

When I was put on the Oxys it was like I got my life back, no pain. I could work all day with no problems but now it has caught up with me. I guess you can’t have a pain free life without consequences.

I am sorry if I am jumping around a lot, I am not good at grammer.

[Tuckamore]

It is my nature to trust and I beleive you when you say you just had to take more or some one may have helped themselves. You're right you have no reason to come here looking for guidance and lie.

If you can make them last till your next appointment I think that is your best solution.

Narcotics can change our personalities, as can chronic pain. When we are aware of the fact often we can fight it. My husband pointed out to me a few years ago that I was impatient and "snappy" when my narcotics were increased. I hadn't really noticed it. I made a conscious effort to change and it has not been an issue since. So maybe if your wife can be specific you could work on it.

Narcotics do make most of us more sleepy. I often find myself catching a short nap after supper, 15-20 minutes. I am usually ok after that and up and going again. You may want to give that a try. I am guessing you are making a lot of demands on your pain wracked body, that alone can cause fatigue. Fighting through pain every day is exhausting.  Few ppl can understand that unless they have been there.

Don't be so quick to use the word addiction and label yourself. Your body may be dependant upon the narcotics and it telling you as much...but it is a far cry from addiction. There is a difference. I promise you.

I beleive the majority of us keep our narcotics in a locked box, or locked area or in my case both. I carry only a daily supply on me or near me. The remainder is in a locked metal box behind my locked bedroom door. Even with that precaution I have had my days supply come up "missing" when I have had company. Unfortunately I have pinned it down to always when a close relative brings her fiancee. But I can deal with a day short.

So have a better day and keep in touch.  

[Newpower]

I hope you do ok. Are you planning to stay on the lower dose and taper off?  I take codiene and run short every month. Usually I will taper when I see there are only 10 pills left. But I don't understand why I can't take 4 a day like I'm suppose to. I will double that many days and then I run short. I am on codiene to slow down my gastro tract. I have IBS. I know I have ti stop abusing every month. I know you are following your script unlike myself but I wanted to wish you luck and check on you to see if you get through this.

[troubleinohio]

thanks for the update..I saw your post on the addiction forum, except its on the Social side so hopefully a moderator will move it to the addiction side- way more people see over there, and you will get more replies that way. I hope things work out for you. Keep checking back to the addiction forum too, hopefully they will move the post soon and you will get a lot more help and info.

[Cannonfodda]

I thank you for your response and I will be 5 days short on my Meds. Thats an awful lot. My wife used to work in a Pharmacy and said she heard it all when it comes to narcotic pain meds, (dropped in toilet,Stolen etc) she does not think my Dr. will believe me even though I have a better then most patient relationship with him. They usually drug screen most patience yet I have never been tested.

There is no easy answer for what I am going to do. I have been short on my meds in the past but nothing like this. Some times I have bad days. I travel alot with work and I am constantly putting meds in other bottles, taking an extra night or two when I am on the road and not accounting for them. I am on a high dose as my Dr. told me. So half my script per day can get me through for 3 days if needed. Last night I didnt take 2 80mg Oxys at night, I woke up @ 3:30 and took one and woke up this morning feeling pretty bad.

The pain is not as bad as the craving and thats what scares me. I am addicted for sure. My company is laying people off right now and this could not be a worse time to do this by taking Vacation time with no prior notice. With my job any such meds I take would be frouned upon and because I deal with cash in the banking industry. I am sure I would loose my job. I am fingerprinted and bonded. I deal in banking automation and its a great job 10+ years with this corporation.

I dont want a life of pain, I would not lie about my meds going missing, here I have no reason to lie. I am a good husband and parent but I know the falling asleep at 19:00 every night is a problem and one of the reasons my wife hates these pills. I find myself not intrested in anything anymore. I feel lazy and worn out. My sex drive is next to nill. These are a few reasons my wife hates these pills, she said I used to be fine taking Lorcet 10/1000 5 X a day, but since the Oxys I have changed.

I should of kept my meds in the gun safe and I would not be in this situation right now. Yet maybe I need to get off them and find another approach to my pain management and I believe everything happens for a reason.

I will repost when I decide today which way I will take this. Thanks for the support and information you all have provided.

[seano]

You only have to be in the "beginnings" of withdrawal in order to start taking the suboxone. I think it would be crazy to do it "cold turkey". Being on suboxone will stop all of your physical dependence on opiates, and most, if of not all of your psychological cravings. Like a methadone maintenace program, your dosages will be gradually tapered down. My wife was a heroin addict with a pretty big habit. Suboxone helped her through it. She has tried a methadone program, but it was a real pain to go there everyday in the beginning, as well as the actual length of the program (2+ years!). She was on suboxone for about 6 months or so. She is now opiate free, and still attends AA meetings occasionally. I think an aftercare program (AA meetings, NA meetings, etc.) are a very important part of REALLY giving up opiates forever. Even though I'm on opiates for chronic pain, there isn't a problem with her wanting some of my medication. She used to inject the heroin. My medication has anti-abuse substances built into it, making it impossible to inject the medication (thank God!).  If you really do want to stop, you can do it. Accept and take all the help that is out there. I wish you all the luck in the world.

[Tuckamore]

Hi Cannonfodda,

Welcome to the Pain Mangement Forum. I apologize for being tardy to this discussion. My heart goes out to you.

For what it's worth I think you need to determine if you have true chronic pain or an addiction. Yes sometimes those of us with chronic pain (CP) become addicted but more often than not our pain is simply not controlled effectively. Addiction numbers run lower than you might suspect in chronic pain patients.

Only you know the answer to my question. If you have CP why would you want to live a life in constant immobilizing pain? Which often occurs when pain is untreated. Call your physician and tell him what you have told us. By Monday you will be only 2 or maybe three days short on meds. If this is the first time this has happened to you he/she should be understanding.

If however you find that you are short every month and you are chasing a high than in my opinion it is time for some soul searching. Again I pose the question to you, are you addicted (not dependant) to your medications? If you fear you may be dealing with an abuse issue that it is time to find another approach. If you are experiencing chronic pain than having your wife dispense the medications may be a solution, at least for now.

You choices are tough. I would not want to have to make them. Am I understanding your post correctly? Why would your wife want you off the medications? Did you mean that to be just until your next script or from here on?

Is this an on-going problem? Has is caused family issues before? Are you in danger of losing your job or your family because of a problem with medications? Again these are not questions I am asking you to respond to on this forum. They are questions that in my opinion you should be asking yourself. These are questions that can better tell you where you are with your narcotic usage.

Someone suggested MedHelp's Substance Abuse Forum. Please know that you are always welcome here and I am not trying to send you away. That is not my goal. But I do not want you to miss the insights of the members of the SA Forum. They have much more experience and knowledge in this area than we do on this forum.

I wish I could come up with some great answers for you. I can't. The next few days are going to be tough or tougher. You are reaching out for suggestions and I admire your courage. If you chose to cut down before your next refill you may want to hand your meds to your wife. Your information is correct. The w/d from diazapam can be wicked. What ever you do don't go cold turkey. Seek medical care before that occurs. It can be life threatening.

My best to you. Please keep in close touch with us.

Take care,
Tuck

[Cannonfodda]

Thanks Trouble,
As far as the doses they are pure Oxycodone in 2 forms, 4 80mg time delay and 8 30mg IR instant release for breakthrough pain per day. There is no Tylenol, thats why they changed me to this for concerns of the Acentominifin I was taking for so long. For over 2 years on this dose.
I prolobly have enough to cut down and get me through to the next Dr. appointment but When I try, I convince myself that I will just cut down tomorrow and on and on.
The Dr. I spoke to at the hospital is actually more concerned with detox from Valium which I take 20mg per day. 15+ years.
It is more the mental part of this whole thing, I am scared to death I will fail and do this all to go back and refill my script next week.
My wife is at her end and wants me to make a decesion weather to get through and let her monitor my meds and taper me off or go to inpatient Sub treatment.

I know what the right thing to do is, but what I will do is still at a crossroad because I can stay comftorble for a few more days before I run out and go CT.
Tapering down sux and thats with at least 2 80s and 3-4 30s per day.

[troubleinohio]

PS are you completely out of meds now? Did you taper down at all when you realized you were going to run out early?

[troubleinohio]

please do your homework carefully before jumping on Sub. Research it very thoroughly. For some people it has saved their lives for sure. Mostly people that are so terribly addicted to the other opiates that they had no other choice because they were unable to quit them and were killing their liver with all the acetominophen (tylenol) in them. It sounds like the drugs you are on are mostly pure oxycodone? or does one of them have aceto mixed in? If so how much aceto are you ingesting per day? The 24 hour cap is 4000 mg. anything over that can severely damage your liver. Anyhow, Sub should be a last resort because, yes, you are in effect trading one addiction for another and it is hard to get off of. You will still face WD"s from it as well. There is no way to get off opiates or Sub (sub is an opiate too) without going through WD. You have to suffer at some point in order to get to the other side! So please keep that in mind. You are just prolonging the enivitable when you go on Sub..you cant stay on it forever, and you will have all the classic WD symptoms.  My advice to you is ride it out, right now. Get some Immodium or Pepto for the diarrhea that will come, some OTC Pain reliever of your choice- usually Advil/motrin/ibuprofin is the best, possibly a sleep aid, lots of fluids and vitamins. Take hot baths and use heating pads for the pains and chills. Usually opiate WD is the worst for 3-5 days. SOmetimes longer for some people, and then you phyiscally get much better. Just pretend you have the Flu for those days and then you have to battle the mental cravings. Also some sort of counselling should be considered because you say you now only take them "to be happy". You have to get to the root of problems..why you feel the need to use these drugs to get through life. you have to learn to cope again. Its a long hard process but very worth it.
btw there is an excellent Addiction/Substance Abuse forum here on medhelp, you should go read and post there. You will get lots of great support and advice there.

http://www.medhelp.org/forums/show/77?personal_page_id=352415

[Cannonfodda]

Thanks that eases my nervs but now I wonder another question. Should I go in for 3-5 days on Bupropnol (or however its spelled) then a 6 week Suboxone taper off, or just wait until I feel like chit save me the $2700 for the hospital stay and get it from a Dr. and do outpatient treatment?

Meridith, How long were you on it and was it hard to stop taking it?

[meredithr]

Hi. I just saw your post about Suboxtone.

I've been on it when I was going on horrible withdrawals and it took away EVERY withdrawal symptom I had. I felt normal for the first time in years. Something about that drug takes all the withdrawal symptoms away and you actually feel no effects what so ever of whatever you are coming off of.

So don't be afraid to take it. I've taken it and I would definitely do it again.

I know its farely new and not many know much about it but in my case it did wonders and it kept me out of the hospital so I didn't have to be backed off slowly off my meds.

It really does work.

Hope I helped.