Step Three

[Punkinhead75]

Now that we have come to believe in a Power greater than ourselves, what do we do?  This brings us to step three.

"Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him."

      Taken from the Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions  pg34

In the book the words "as we understood Him" are underlined but I don't know how to do that so this is what we get.  LOL!!

These words are important because they give us the freedom to come to our own conclusion as to what we will believe in.  There doesn't have to be any conforming to what somebody else believes God is.   Once I had an understanding of what I think God is then the first part of step three became the difficult part.  Turning my will over?  Everything?  It isn't something that comes easily for me but I understand at this point that I at least need to be willing.  When there is willingness there is a beginning, and a beginning is all that is needed for my faith to grow.  For me a lot of this has to do with accepting life on life's terms.  Often the right path is laid out for me.  I am grateful for that.  Some things are easier for me to turn over and others are extremely difficult.  Even when I want to let go there is still something inside me that hangs on till very end.  This step required me to practice quite often.

I can honestly say that I don't know Gods will for me before it happens.  I personnally believe that God is in control of everything.  I believe that everything that happens is God's will.  Weather or not I judge it as Good or bad it is still God's will.  Here comes the other way of looking at "as we understood Him."  When my mind is clear and I am "in the moment", meaning that I am seeing things unfold as they happen,  I can be blessed with the ability to understand as they happen.  I hope that makes sense.  LOL!

"made a decision"  was probably the easiest part for me at the time.  I was thoroughly beat up and wanted to change.  I understood that everything I knew, that the very best I could do got me to a point where I was broken.  If I wanted to live I needed to learn a new way.  When I asked God for help He gave me the steps, the fellowship and other drunks and addicts to help.  He let me know that I am to be service minded and be willing to help whenever I am asked.  I try to do that to the best of my ability.

Step three still requires a lot of practice today.  There are things that I want to do but that is just selfish thinking.  God often has other plans.  Thanks for letting me share.

[trdofbeingtrd]

Yes, we do?

I am confused because well, the same reason...........never mind, I am sorry for the interruption in your thread.

[Punkinhead75]

Yes. Why r u confused?

[trdofbeingtrd]

I guess I don't understand the steps like I thought I did. Do we, or do we not claim in the 12 steps program that we are powerless against our "issues" or addictions and ONLY through a higher power can we find peace and sobriety?

[trdofbeingtrd]

Just a tad confused here.

If someone can clear some things up.......I am guessing...........no, I must just be a little mixed up. I could have swore beliefs of any kind are not to be tested on this site.......nah, must be my imagination.

[hellc@mst]

Hey thanks for your reply.  Again, i just wonder if people who follow the 12 steps faithfully are really following the will of their HP or the road map to recovery outlined by Bill W. I think the latter infers that Bill W himself is 'God/HP/whatever. I also find  the inference that Bill W was in direct communication with a HP and was privy to salvation when so many other serious events have been spurned by this understanding of a god( a god who shows special favour to alcoholics/addicts only) a little offensive and heretical.

I have researched the origins of the steps( Oxford Group/ Moral Re Armament)and feel they have their place for people like yourself who are able to glean worthwhile rewards. Me, i struggled with the whole 12 step philosophy and no matter how hard i tried i always had these niggling doubts which prevented me from accessing the serenity ,doled out sparingly ,within the 12 step community. I like to consider these doubts as the internal workings of my own higher power who has afforded me a successful and meaningful independant recovery thus far, along with a modicum of transient serenity.

Again, no dispespect is intended in my post and i doubt we shall ever see eye to eye on this matter but i welcome any opportunity to expose my beliefs to the challenge of an opposing ideology. Its always worthwhile to see if they can weather the ensuing storm.


All the best, Jeremy

[Punkinhead75]

I read your post in the other thread.  Thanks for replying and for clearing things up a bit. I've been thinking about what you said and the question you pose.  I personally don't know how the steps came about. Here's a little more of story to go along with an idea that struck me:

During the time I had asked for help and went to my first mtg I was moved to admit that something was wrong.  At the time I couldn't understand what.  I came to believe in a Power Greater than myself and became willing to get the help I needed.  I manged to get to my parents house.  When they found me sleeping on their couch they asked what was going on.  I explained everything to them.  What I had been doing, how I'd been feeling etc.  This in my eyes was a form of the fourth and fifth steps.  This is about as far as I got in regards to being "moved" to do certain things.

My idea is this:

Perhaps Bill had been "moved" to do these 12 things which he was then able to put into words. So when his will was turned over at step three, and he "organically" or "naturally" followed with an inventory, amends, awakening as a result of turning his will over , he just wrote down what he went through in an effort to help others.

I don't know what would have happened to me if I never saw the 12 steps.  I may not have understood there were more steps to be taken and end up drunk again.  Perhaps the HP that I believe in would have continued to "move" me in much the same fashion he had earlier.  My experience shows me that He got me to see the Steps via the help of another alcoholic.

Thanks!

[Punkinhead75]

Those are good questions.  I needed a dictionary to understand them but good none the less.  LOL.  I don't see the redundancy issue.  I know when I surrendered I knew I was beat.  That is about it.  I didn't realize the full impact of my selfishness and self centeredness until I moved on with the rest of the steps.

In regard to "the will of Bill and others"...they are just sharing what worked for them and many others.  I agree there is more than one way to get and stay sober and that a person should do whatever works for them.  I personally don't judge others based on how they stay sober or what they believe.  So far I haven't seen anything in AA literature that condems those that don't work the steps as they are written.  I'm not saying others won't have an opinion or something to say about it.  The rooms are filled with sick people.  That's why we are there.  LOL.

When I was hurting real bad from drinking I said a prayer and asked God for help.  Within the next few days I was put in touch with a family friend in AA who took me to a mtg.  It was there I was told that if I follow suggestions and work the 12 steps I wouldn't have to drink again.  I've been doing that and it works.   I believe God provided me with a way to stop drinking and have a good life.  I personally can't afford to take all the credit.  That doesn't work for me.  If you can be sober and take all the credit then go for it.

I've seen people with a similar attitude as you and do fine.  I've also seen others have a similar attitude in an effort to avoid the remaining steps. Most have gotten drunk again.

What I try to keep in mind:
  Am I willing to do something different when the way I am doing it stops working?

Take care and thanks for the questions.

[hellc@mst]

Hi. It doesn't matter to me if people want to attribute their hard earned sobriety to the grace of some benevolent Higher Power/God/Religious Dogma/Door Knob/whatever. Me, i am not so humble and prefer to take full credit for the sobriety 'I' have managed to achieve thus far. After all, 'I"must bear full responsibility for any lapses/relapses so why is the reverse not true?

Anyway, this is not the proper platform for me to air my personal grievances with regards to the 12 step treatment paradigm.Thanks for your comments.

Regards jeremy

[trdofbeingtrd]

hehe, I knew someone was an atheist........will the real dawkins please stand up?

No no, I get your point. There is incredible importance in understanding the value of self. I have to give you credit though, not only do you make your points, but you are doing it in a polite and non insulting way.

I won't attempt to answer your questions, what I will do is let you know I have little knowledge of the 12 steps and other such religious N/A or A/A programs.

I do have a question for you sir, if something helps people stay clean and sober, does it matter if what they believe in and what they believe in doing is "real" or not?

Now please, please, for the love of science, don't take what I posted as negative towards you, I am being just as genuine and polite as you are ;-)

[hellc@mst]

Hi ya. i was hoping someone familiar with the steps could answer some quick questions i have with regards to this specifc step.

If i understand this step correctly, i am supposed to surrender my will and my life over to the care of God/HP as i understand Him/Her/It. Suppose i manage to successfully achieve the required state of surrender ~ are'nt the following steps superfluous and redundant? . Are'nt they then the will of Bill W and Co/sponsors/etc and his mates rather than the benevolent wishes of my own personal HP?

Let me explain. If i already surrender my will and my life over to the care of God, does it not stand to reason that the remaining steps( Inventory, amends,spiritual awakening etc) would happen organically, if deemed an appropriate measure ,as decided by my own personal HP. That is, i would do these things regardless ,if that is truely what my HP/God had intended.

If  someone was compelled to eschew the remaing steps in the belief that their higher power considers steps 4-12 redundant, are they still deemed faithfull followers of the dogma espoused in the steps? Does their recovery have as much merit as those who adhere to all 12 steps? Are these people blasphemers/ cheats or dry drunks?

Any help with these questions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Regards Jeremy.

[Punkinhead75]

If u can't remember u will have to thank me each time.  LOL!!  and yes u did.

I'm glad I read this again today.  Lately I have had a strong focus on my will and I have been irritable and discontented.  I think I'm gonna go find a quiet place and ask God to help me "turn it over".

[ang_811]

Did i tell u thanks for bringint he steps up again? Thank u!

I like this one.