Aa
Suboxone how hard is it to come off of .
I have seen any in the last week considering suboxone .We have many that are still taking it .I think it would really helpful for many posters trying to research whether it a good chioce for them to hear what people that are now off it have to say .
Did you take it short term or long term? How long if at all did you have WD going off it?.If you had to do it all over would you make the same choice?
Did you take it short term or long term? How long if at all did you have WD going off it?.If you had to do it all over would you make the same choice?
I used it twice. Once I took it for about little over a month and did not taper, and the w.d was 10x's worse then when I went c.t from about 15 80mg oxys a day. Then I tried it again and did another short term treatment, but this time tapered down to about shavings every other day, and the w.d was not too bad. I do not think it should be continued as long term. I don't personally consider someone as physically clean while on sub. And I am NOT saying this in a mean way..I merely mean that physically, your body is dependant on the sub, as well as the previous opiate you were on. The difference is with Sub you aren't acting like an addict and aren't in active addiction where you spike doses, steal, lie, fake pain, dr shop...pretty much all of the above.
I think it is helpful for short term purposes. I mean, I understand the need to use it long term, because people don't want to relapse into their old Drug. But you don't relapse because you are already getting an opiate? I mean, most dont get that. When the sub is stopped, and you don't relapse back to your old Drug or the Sub, then you are clean. Aftercare is a huge part of recovery. Probably the hardest part.
Anyway..Yes. I would use it again. But NOT high amounts and NOT longer then a few weeks...my opinion only...
Lisa
I think it is helpful for short term purposes. I mean, I understand the need to use it long term, because people don't want to relapse into their old Drug. But you don't relapse because you are already getting an opiate? I mean, most dont get that. When the sub is stopped, and you don't relapse back to your old Drug or the Sub, then you are clean. Aftercare is a huge part of recovery. Probably the hardest part.
Anyway..Yes. I would use it again. But NOT high amounts and NOT longer then a few weeks...my opinion only...
Lisa
Thanks Avis for posting the question. Sometimes I fear that I may sound like a broken record with my cautions about taking Sub. I started on Sub and only stayed on it for 21 days. I took my last crumb of Sub 42 days ago and I think I am finally clear of most of the symptoms of W/D. It was pure he11 for the first 2 weeks or so - then got progressively better. I was still having periodic W/D's (tremors/hot/cold/runs, etc) up until two days ago, but now the only problem I have is tiredness. I think I have finally gotten through the rough part. It would have been so much better to continue my taper on Hydros or Percocets and then jumped. Knowledge is power but at the time I got on Sub, I really didn't know any of this horror story. Of course when I was in such agony I began to read posts from others who had the same problem. I know that most people do not look past the first page on the site so every few days there are totally new posts ----- so, I have tried to share my experience with the board so that others may know what I went through. It will be interesting to see how many others respond to this thread. All the best.
OC I am glad you are telling you experience I know there are alot of different opinions and this subject can get heated but I really think that people that are considering going on it need to be aware of the good the bad and the ugly .That way they are making the most informed decisions they can for what is right from them .As long as the thread remains calm it should be very helpful for members .
Yes, thanks Avis. ochooked, I feel the exact same way, but you know what, I don't care.. If I can prevent one preson from going through it, then Ill say it over and over. After a 9 year addiction to anything painkiller, I ended up on suboxone. Was taking anywhere from 20-30 10mg percocet or 7.5mg vicoprofen a day and I needed to quit. I started to research detox facilities because I knew the wd would be bad, had done it many times before and didn't want to go through it alone again. I came across the gov site for suboxone. I was very thrilled to know I could avoid withdrawal and thought it to be a miracle and an answer to my prayers. Saw doctor, told me sub is a relatively new drug which is wonderful and helps addicts avoid withdrawal. Perfect. I started 16mg a day. I tapered down every few months. I was supposed to taper 2 mg/month but I got stuck a few times.. some months tapering even 2mg gave me wd so I talked to the doc who said up the 2mg and try again next month.. eventually almost 2 years later I jumped off at 1mg. At my last dr. visit he promised me little to NO wd at all. I am on day 34 off subs and I am still having wd. The first, I'd say 18 days, were an absolute living nightmare. NOTHING at all like any detox I'd ever been through. All the normal wd stuff - shakes, shivers, fever, goosebumps, aches, pains, stomache issues, RLS, insomnia, headache - but magnified by 100. My legs went numb. I fell a few times because my legs were numb. All very unique to this experience alone. I slumped into a very deep depression and had such a heavy sadness on me, like Ive never experienced not even when my father died. Crying. Literally suicidal. Then panic attacks. Never had one in my life till sub detox. Couldnt breath, catch my breath.. all of a sudden my chest would feel like it was caving in. All unique to this detox experience alone. I too wish I would have just sucked it up 2 yrs ago and went c/t off the painkillers. At day 34 I am a lot better. I am still freezing all the time, I still have goosebumps a lot, I am very tired and I sneeze a lot, but it's getting better. I have heard it referred to as the "suboxone spanking" well to me, its the "suboxone sucker punch".. its a roller coaster - one day, not so bad.. the next.. pretty bad. I too try to share as much as possible without discouraging anyone from wanting to quit. There is use for sub, but its not a miracle. It will not keep you from having withdrawal and there is a GREAT risk that you will suffer more from it.
hey i started taken sub due to the fact that i was doing oxyz intaveinously..and about 5 80mg and 5 30mg ones a day..shootin them mite i add and i took sub for a month and we had a bad hurricane here and when i ran out the dr.s r the pharms here had no elect. so i had to get off and i never had the 1st w/d symptom...i never felt any different....sub is the only reason im clean to this day! it saved my life! and i thank god that i got on the sub treament....but when i got down to my last 10 subs i started to take a 1/2 then a 1/4 then just a crumb..and then none i was off no w/d and have never felt better in my whole life! it was my saving grace!!! so thats my story ms avisg! love ya gurl! and you and my mom make the BEST CLS!!! yall rock on gurl!!
good post....Hopefully good info will be shared and people can ask questions and not be afraid to ask or anyone be afraid to express their opinion....
I am always amazed when I hear good sub stories-and JEALOUS! It is so strange to me that people can have such a vast difference in their experience with it. I am happy to read your post - it truly makes me feel like others who are on it and wanting to come off can indeed have a good experience with it and not have to go through what I did. Great positive story. Thank you putting it out there. There are many people here who are about to drop off the sub and are nervous. I know your post is giving them hope. By reading these posts, they can hope for the best and be prepared for the worst. Take care.
Jenz,
Thanks girl ,I a glad it work so well for you .I know most of the people taper all of the way down to a crumb seem to have a much more smooth time getting off .I have also heard much better experiences with shorter term usage.
I wish OChooked had be as lucky he did short term and had a very bad time of it . It goes to show who everybody's body reacts differently .
Its great to see both positive and negative this is what I wanted to have here.
Thanks girl ,I a glad it work so well for you .I know most of the people taper all of the way down to a crumb seem to have a much more smooth time getting off .I have also heard much better experiences with shorter term usage.
I wish OChooked had be as lucky he did short term and had a very bad time of it . It goes to show who everybody's body reacts differently .
Its great to see both positive and negative this is what I wanted to have here.
I think alot of the reason that people tend to stay on sub long term, is because they actually feel good on the sub, not high but "normal" or what they remember feeling normal is. For me, I felt unstoppable on the sub. I was alert, had energy and had NO desire to go back to Oxy's. I was unaware at the time that I was infact still ingesting partial opaites, just not acting as an addict would. Being that you are no longer paying for drugs off the street, forging scripts, dr.shopping, snorting, shooting up, spiking...counting pills..lying, stealing..pretty much everything we do as addicts. We feel as though because we aren't doing these things we are clean and in recovery. And while I do agree you are in recovery, because you are working towards getting off your DOC and getting clean. I don't really think you are home free yet. To me, you know you are clean, when you can wake up for one full week, get though every day, without taking your DOC and/or the sub.
I have heard of many stories, both good and bad, of people who tapered down to as little as they could and had no w.d other then headaches. And then some who also tapered down to little and had massive w.d. I don't personally believe you can just by-pass w.d. I think that we all want to find a way to do that and its just not possible. But reading Jenz story, I guess it has to be. I believe that the mind sometimes makes your w.d a little harder. Becuase I can remember being in full blown w.d from Oxy's if my dealer was out, and when he would call and say he got them in, I would instantly feel better knowing I was going to get them soon? I mean, I would go from NOT being able to get out from underneath the covers cause I had chills so bad, to getting that call that he had them and being able to get up, get dressed, drive to the bank and go get the pills. So I think some of it, not alot, but some is in your head.
No matter how you slice it, addiction and w.d is just plain horrible. And I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. But I think most are not seeing that the w.d is not the hardest part, its staying clean. I have had my share of relapses and this is the longest I have been clean to date. So I hope I can continue on. There are good days, and bad days. And this forum helps me stay grounded. Aftercare people....its the best way to stay clean.
But this is a good topic and like you said Avis, if we keep it calm and rational, it will be very informative for some people. I think we all get so caught up in our own opinions and what WE think is right, we lose sight of what's important and that's to educate anyone who may not know anything on Sub.
Anyway..my story is above and if anyone has any questions about my story, please feel free to ask.
I have heard of many stories, both good and bad, of people who tapered down to as little as they could and had no w.d other then headaches. And then some who also tapered down to little and had massive w.d. I don't personally believe you can just by-pass w.d. I think that we all want to find a way to do that and its just not possible. But reading Jenz story, I guess it has to be. I believe that the mind sometimes makes your w.d a little harder. Becuase I can remember being in full blown w.d from Oxy's if my dealer was out, and when he would call and say he got them in, I would instantly feel better knowing I was going to get them soon? I mean, I would go from NOT being able to get out from underneath the covers cause I had chills so bad, to getting that call that he had them and being able to get up, get dressed, drive to the bank and go get the pills. So I think some of it, not alot, but some is in your head.
No matter how you slice it, addiction and w.d is just plain horrible. And I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. But I think most are not seeing that the w.d is not the hardest part, its staying clean. I have had my share of relapses and this is the longest I have been clean to date. So I hope I can continue on. There are good days, and bad days. And this forum helps me stay grounded. Aftercare people....its the best way to stay clean.
But this is a good topic and like you said Avis, if we keep it calm and rational, it will be very informative for some people. I think we all get so caught up in our own opinions and what WE think is right, we lose sight of what's important and that's to educate anyone who may not know anything on Sub.
Anyway..my story is above and if anyone has any questions about my story, please feel free to ask.
Day (7) of Sub Withdrawal
I posted this elsewhere but I wanna make sure that anyone thinking about subs as the way out know what I am going through. So if you seen this elsewhere sorry, just ignore it. If not, and you are thinking about Subs talk to your Doctor, do it right and get off them a soon as possible once you start.
I want to proffer my personal experience to others. This is just me.....others might have had a different experience, but in researching this Suboxone/Subutex thing on this site I find similarities between my experience and others.....
AS ALWAYS SEEK A QUALIFIED AND CARING DOCTOR'S CARE NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO!!!!!
I was on and off hydrocodone for about 3 years never more than 2-3 10s a day. In january 07 I tapered and went cold turkey. It lasted about 3 months clean when I got hit with a tremendous amount of stress in my life and found myself working late nights. To keep focused and energized I got back on Hydros. Then in Oct/ Nov. of 2007 I did some research and found out about subutex. I seemed to be a miracle drug!!!!! NO WITHDRAWALS!!!!! NOT TRUE!!!!! Well I didn't know that then. I got on Subutex and it seemed like a miracle drug!!! It worked just as promised! I had an easy time getting off hydros with little or no withdrawal effect. Unfortunately I developed a Subutex habit instead! Almost a year later (September 25, 2008) I decided to quit. I started to taper. I got down to a little less than .5 a day for a week from about 1mg the week before. On October 2, 2008, I jumped off.
The first 4 days were horrible. I mean REALLY horrible. In desperation I found this place, set up an account and started posting. Many of you folks gave me some hope and some tips. But the more I learned about this Sub thing the more I realized I was in for long and rough ride. This Subutex has quite a grip on you (37-hour half-life).
On my Day (6). I rode a bike 7.5 miles this morning at 8:30 am. I have been doing everything I can think of to make this easier nothing really really works completely. I STILL FEEL KINDA BAD ALL OVER AND NOW I HAVE AN EVER-PRESENT HEADACHE. Lots of things work a little,... like:
Exercise
Lots of water
Vitamins
Veggies Fruits
Aminos
Hot baths with scented oils
rest
sex (ENDORPHINS)
IBUFROFEN
dark chocolate
motivating music
crying
But really, this IS BAD. Getting off Hydros was rough but for me after 5 or 6 days I was over the worst of it. Come to think of it it took me 11 days before I was totally okay after hydros!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Wait a minute! There's hope, may on day 11 I will be okay this time too! I hope so....
Problem is,...search this site for subutex withdrawal and you will find that the consensus is that subutex really bites back hard. Its a good way to get off hydros and perhaps other drugs IF AND ONLY IF YOU STICK TO THE THREE WEEK PROGRAM THEN TAPER AND JUMP OFF!!!!! DON'T GET HOOKED ON SUBS!!!!! As always seek out a good Doctor and take his or her advice. Unfortunately, I didn't realize at the time that the Doctor I went to in Vegas was pretty much just a pill-pusher.....or maybe he just doesn't know how rough Subs can be.... but him and his over-tanned and leathery receptionist just kept telling me to tak your time no rush, let your body heal take as many as you need,....etc. I am very angry at this so-called practice. But look, I'm no Doctor... But I really care about others walking down this road. When I had nowhere to go you people gave me solace and courage and some comfort. I feel obliged to share back for others!
On a good note, today is my Day (7) off Subs and I feel pretty good. I've got a tinge of stomache pain but not bad, a lurking headache not quite discernible given 800 mgs of Ibuprofin I took an hour ago and of course cutis anserina (goose bumps). I'm gonna ride a bike today. I'm shooting for 10 miles mostly flat surface and Im gonna try to be productive today.
Good Luck to those of you contemplating the seduction of Subs. Its a powerful thing bu respect it. The horror stories are far less pronounce if you minimize the term of usage. But even after only three weeks I have heard of some bad Wds.
I posted this elsewhere but I wanna make sure that anyone thinking about subs as the way out know what I am going through. So if you seen this elsewhere sorry, just ignore it. If not, and you are thinking about Subs talk to your Doctor, do it right and get off them a soon as possible once you start.
I want to proffer my personal experience to others. This is just me.....others might have had a different experience, but in researching this Suboxone/Subutex thing on this site I find similarities between my experience and others.....
AS ALWAYS SEEK A QUALIFIED AND CARING DOCTOR'S CARE NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO!!!!!
I was on and off hydrocodone for about 3 years never more than 2-3 10s a day. In january 07 I tapered and went cold turkey. It lasted about 3 months clean when I got hit with a tremendous amount of stress in my life and found myself working late nights. To keep focused and energized I got back on Hydros. Then in Oct/ Nov. of 2007 I did some research and found out about subutex. I seemed to be a miracle drug!!!!! NO WITHDRAWALS!!!!! NOT TRUE!!!!! Well I didn't know that then. I got on Subutex and it seemed like a miracle drug!!! It worked just as promised! I had an easy time getting off hydros with little or no withdrawal effect. Unfortunately I developed a Subutex habit instead! Almost a year later (September 25, 2008) I decided to quit. I started to taper. I got down to a little less than .5 a day for a week from about 1mg the week before. On October 2, 2008, I jumped off.
The first 4 days were horrible. I mean REALLY horrible. In desperation I found this place, set up an account and started posting. Many of you folks gave me some hope and some tips. But the more I learned about this Sub thing the more I realized I was in for long and rough ride. This Subutex has quite a grip on you (37-hour half-life).
On my Day (6). I rode a bike 7.5 miles this morning at 8:30 am. I have been doing everything I can think of to make this easier nothing really really works completely. I STILL FEEL KINDA BAD ALL OVER AND NOW I HAVE AN EVER-PRESENT HEADACHE. Lots of things work a little,... like:
Exercise
Lots of water
Vitamins
Veggies Fruits
Aminos
Hot baths with scented oils
rest
sex (ENDORPHINS)
IBUFROFEN
dark chocolate
motivating music
crying
But really, this IS BAD. Getting off Hydros was rough but for me after 5 or 6 days I was over the worst of it. Come to think of it it took me 11 days before I was totally okay after hydros!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Wait a minute! There's hope, may on day 11 I will be okay this time too! I hope so....
Problem is,...search this site for subutex withdrawal and you will find that the consensus is that subutex really bites back hard. Its a good way to get off hydros and perhaps other drugs IF AND ONLY IF YOU STICK TO THE THREE WEEK PROGRAM THEN TAPER AND JUMP OFF!!!!! DON'T GET HOOKED ON SUBS!!!!! As always seek out a good Doctor and take his or her advice. Unfortunately, I didn't realize at the time that the Doctor I went to in Vegas was pretty much just a pill-pusher.....or maybe he just doesn't know how rough Subs can be.... but him and his over-tanned and leathery receptionist just kept telling me to tak your time no rush, let your body heal take as many as you need,....etc. I am very angry at this so-called practice. But look, I'm no Doctor... But I really care about others walking down this road. When I had nowhere to go you people gave me solace and courage and some comfort. I feel obliged to share back for others!
On a good note, today is my Day (7) off Subs and I feel pretty good. I've got a tinge of stomache pain but not bad, a lurking headache not quite discernible given 800 mgs of Ibuprofin I took an hour ago and of course cutis anserina (goose bumps). I'm gonna ride a bike today. I'm shooting for 10 miles mostly flat surface and Im gonna try to be productive today.
Good Luck to those of you contemplating the seduction of Subs. Its a powerful thing bu respect it. The horror stories are far less pronounce if you minimize the term of usage. But even after only three weeks I have heard of some bad Wds.
That was really informative and I pray that people read this. You sound like you are determined and have come a long way. Congrats on getting clean and fighting the demons....awesome...
And also, welcome to the forum...its a great place for suppor, advice and knowledge....
Lisa
And also, welcome to the forum...its a great place for suppor, advice and knowledge....
Lisa
Just the fact that they put you on sub for 2 or 3 hydro's a day is scary .I wish they had a better set of guidelines for use .Thank you for sharing this can help any thinking about using sub .
I'm still on the Suboxone. It's been 8 months now and I flip between 4 -6 mgs per day. And like Liscamdave said..I feel normal, not high. I don't get the high energy from it, maybe a little in the first few months. I should be trying to taper from it, but I have not given any real attempts at it. I think I fear the depression I'll probably experience more than the withdrawal symptoms. I'm also on Cymbalta for depression, which I have been tapering off of. I'm going to switch to Zoloft soon.
Anyway... Would I do the Sub again? Yes, I think I would, of course I haven't gone thru the withdrawals yet. And if I could do it over, I would have at least gotten down to a much lower dose in the first month or so. I have a lot more tapering to do than Mary, who did get way down on her dose early on.
Would I recommend it? I have 2 versions of criteria for recommendation.
1. If you have tried over and over again to get clean, really tried, only to relapse again and again, and your addict behavior is putting your life or your families welfare in serious jeopardy, legally, physically, and financially. You truly believe you have run out of options.
2. Circumstances beyond your control do not allow you the luxury of the down time needed to go thru the worst part of withdrawals and would only need to use it for a week or two. And would not have any major problems dealing with the left over withdrawals after that.
I have certainly come to terms with the fact I'm going to be in for a pretty ruff time when I decide it's time to come off the Sub. I've accepted that.
My biggest regret, (other than getting addicted in the first place) is the last time I got clean. I was clean for 3 months and feeling great except for depression. I tried to wait it out, hoping it would go away. My depression got extremely severe and caused me to relapse. Had I gotten on some anti-depressant before I let it get so bad, I honestly think I would not have relapsed and I wouldn't be on Sub now.
I'm not happy that I'm on Sub...still on it. But this is where I'm at.
I get very concerned when I hear people asking about the depression after the withdrawals. My advise is to get to the doctor and get on an anti-depressant. Even if it's just for a short while. Much better than relapsing or ending up on Sub. Every effort must be exhausted before going the Sub route.
Anyway... Would I do the Sub again? Yes, I think I would, of course I haven't gone thru the withdrawals yet. And if I could do it over, I would have at least gotten down to a much lower dose in the first month or so. I have a lot more tapering to do than Mary, who did get way down on her dose early on.
Would I recommend it? I have 2 versions of criteria for recommendation.
1. If you have tried over and over again to get clean, really tried, only to relapse again and again, and your addict behavior is putting your life or your families welfare in serious jeopardy, legally, physically, and financially. You truly believe you have run out of options.
2. Circumstances beyond your control do not allow you the luxury of the down time needed to go thru the worst part of withdrawals and would only need to use it for a week or two. And would not have any major problems dealing with the left over withdrawals after that.
I have certainly come to terms with the fact I'm going to be in for a pretty ruff time when I decide it's time to come off the Sub. I've accepted that.
My biggest regret, (other than getting addicted in the first place) is the last time I got clean. I was clean for 3 months and feeling great except for depression. I tried to wait it out, hoping it would go away. My depression got extremely severe and caused me to relapse. Had I gotten on some anti-depressant before I let it get so bad, I honestly think I would not have relapsed and I wouldn't be on Sub now.
I'm not happy that I'm on Sub...still on it. But this is where I'm at.
I get very concerned when I hear people asking about the depression after the withdrawals. My advise is to get to the doctor and get on an anti-depressant. Even if it's just for a short while. Much better than relapsing or ending up on Sub. Every effort must be exhausted before going the Sub route.
Great Post......well said and EXACTLY to the point....
Hope you are well honey..
Lisa
Hope you are well honey..
Lisa
I've always been a bit leary about antidepressants as a whole. However, I think you've got it right about post w/d depression. There seems to be much confusion out there regarding depression whether personality types are more suceptible etc. There's not enough info out there about straight up "chemical depression". When your body is depleted for chemical reasons rather than emotional. I've had two experiences with celexa--one horrible one good. The first was celexa and tramadol--prescribed by a doctor that resulted in a very scary experience/hospitalization. The other is when w/d ing from Subutex. My doctor explained to me the chemistry of w/d, serotonin depletion, and how to use celexa as a TOOL to boost levels in order to achieve regeneration and balance. I took the celexa---with nothing else but .05 clonidine at 8pm. 20mg celexa in the AM, with the UNDERSTANDING that I would give it 2 wks to see how i felt, and 4 months total of use. Right at the two week mark, maybe even a few days before, I felt the lifting. After 3 months I had energy, felt clear headed,and began the last month taper. Had no w/d's and have been "emotionally balanced" ever since. that was 2005. the only time I ever felt like the malaise was returning was when I had to take those damn percocet for a fairly painful procedure. But even then, I never felt the urge to overtake, or "get some energy". In fact, In the absence of physical pain, the familiar peak and valley was easily felt but this time didn't "trigger" me. I know some are sensitive to "supportive meds" but I find that to be more of an emotional judgement rather than good science. Same w/subs, have a plan, a time frame, and support and it will be a softer landing.
It's not the mgs only, that matter to a doc&patient choosing sub. It's also the reactions physically, emotionally, and behaviorally that the patient has to his or her meds. I have used sub for breaks between surgeries at what seem to be considered fairly low doses. i was still dependent and addicted, and no way near able to take a month or two or three to detox and w/d. Everybody's different yes, and no one solution will fit all. I guess my point is, Please don't go chewing up 30 more mgs a day because you feel like your "addiction isn't big enough to use Sub." Eventually it will be. We have to take into account everything...not just how many mgs.
My story is very strange, and I'll keep it as short as I can (although my post exceeded the character limit, so it will be a two-parter). I was a pothead. I didn't even like pills. In college, I had experimented with everything here and there, such as a few months on Ecstasy, a few months of trying cocaine, shrooms and acid here and there, marijuana, and a Perc here and there, given to me by the dishwasher at Applebee's to help us work faster. It felt good but it wasn't my thing. I was a daily weed smoker for about 4 years. I smoked every day through college, and the year after I didn't know at the time, but this was self-medicating a whole lot of issues, because as things happened in my life I was already feeling good so I didn't need to deal with them.
Then my parents decided to sell the family home I grew up in, I was accepted as an instructor at a prestigious tennis camp in Maine, and I had an application in to the Master's program at Florida State. A lot of life changes were on the horizon, but I was excited about them. About three weeks before I was set to leave for Maine, I decided to stop smoking pot so I could get in shape (I know... three weeks was NOT enough time, but I was cocky then). THE VERY NEXT DAY, my life changed and has not been right since. I woke up with this horrible feeling that I couldn't explain to anyone. I felt wierd all over my body and I felt like I had to concentrate on my breathing. Have you ever had that? Where you're focused on your breathing? Because then you know that once you start you can't stop. Then the panic attacks came and I took myself to the ER. They ran all kinds of tests, including an EKG, but everything was normal. At one point, I was PRAYING it was hyperthyroidism, because something like that is treatable. I had never been an anxious person, so I didn't chalk it up to anything mental at all. In fact, I had ran out of marijuana many times in the past, and had gone without it for weeks at a time before, and I felt fine.
Friends were making fun of me because "marijuana isn't addictive." Bullsh*t. It had a psychological hold on me, and now that I had it in my head that I didn't want to do it anymore, my body was reacting negatively. Of course, I didn't know any of this at the time, this is all hindsight. So I spent 4 months in complete agony. I couldn't go out with friends, because I was afraid of having a panic attack or some other breathing problem. I couldn't sleep. I was focused on every single body feeling that I had. I would lay in bed, propped up because it was found that I had Acid Reflux and I was hoping that this was what was wrong with me. I would finally drift off to sleep, then wake myself up with a panic attack. I woke up every morning by 7am, and all I could do was go on the computer to the Anxiety Forum that I found back then.
I was in hell, and I couldn't understand why this was happening to me. The worst part was that it was impossible to explain to anyone, and when I tried people just said, "oh you're probably just tired, or stressed." Needless to say, I cancelled tennis camp because there was no way I could have functioned there. I was unemployed so I had my days free to just pine over how I was feeling. Some days I thought that if someone had told me I would feel that way forever, I would surely kill myself. At least I had hope.
So I started taking Xanax here and there, but all that did was make me tired, and I tried Lexapro but that didn't help either. I dealt with it for 3 years. I didn't have any kind of normal life.
Then I had dental surgery, and was prescribed Vicodin. This was the first time since being "afflicted" with this horrible ailment that I would be taking a painkiller. It IMMEDIATELY made me feel normal. I felt like I had years ago, before even smoking weed. The fact that Vicodin made my mind and body feel normal again, proved to me that my affliction was drug related. If there were any other cause, then taking a drug like that wouldn't help, right? So now that I had found what I thought was the perfect medication for my illness, I took one every day. Soon I got used to feeling back to normal. At one time, I was actually angry that I had tried Xanax and Lexapro, because here was this miracle drug. And that's how my addiction began.
After a year, I was up to 3 10mg pills every morning, and 3 at night before bed. I had stolen a stack of scripts from my dentist's office, and perfected her signature, so the flow of pills was not a problem. Then my girlfriend of 4 years found them, and I was done. She threatened to call the dentist, and the pharmacy, if I didn't quit. She also made me flush everything I had, which I did. She didn't know that I had some scripts left in the trunk of my car, but I went three days without the pills. I was a waitress then and working during withdrawal was pure h*ll. My girlfriend took the pills away on Friday. Monday morning I was at Walgreens filling a new script.
Then my parents decided to sell the family home I grew up in, I was accepted as an instructor at a prestigious tennis camp in Maine, and I had an application in to the Master's program at Florida State. A lot of life changes were on the horizon, but I was excited about them. About three weeks before I was set to leave for Maine, I decided to stop smoking pot so I could get in shape (I know... three weeks was NOT enough time, but I was cocky then). THE VERY NEXT DAY, my life changed and has not been right since. I woke up with this horrible feeling that I couldn't explain to anyone. I felt wierd all over my body and I felt like I had to concentrate on my breathing. Have you ever had that? Where you're focused on your breathing? Because then you know that once you start you can't stop. Then the panic attacks came and I took myself to the ER. They ran all kinds of tests, including an EKG, but everything was normal. At one point, I was PRAYING it was hyperthyroidism, because something like that is treatable. I had never been an anxious person, so I didn't chalk it up to anything mental at all. In fact, I had ran out of marijuana many times in the past, and had gone without it for weeks at a time before, and I felt fine.
Friends were making fun of me because "marijuana isn't addictive." Bullsh*t. It had a psychological hold on me, and now that I had it in my head that I didn't want to do it anymore, my body was reacting negatively. Of course, I didn't know any of this at the time, this is all hindsight. So I spent 4 months in complete agony. I couldn't go out with friends, because I was afraid of having a panic attack or some other breathing problem. I couldn't sleep. I was focused on every single body feeling that I had. I would lay in bed, propped up because it was found that I had Acid Reflux and I was hoping that this was what was wrong with me. I would finally drift off to sleep, then wake myself up with a panic attack. I woke up every morning by 7am, and all I could do was go on the computer to the Anxiety Forum that I found back then.
I was in hell, and I couldn't understand why this was happening to me. The worst part was that it was impossible to explain to anyone, and when I tried people just said, "oh you're probably just tired, or stressed." Needless to say, I cancelled tennis camp because there was no way I could have functioned there. I was unemployed so I had my days free to just pine over how I was feeling. Some days I thought that if someone had told me I would feel that way forever, I would surely kill myself. At least I had hope.
So I started taking Xanax here and there, but all that did was make me tired, and I tried Lexapro but that didn't help either. I dealt with it for 3 years. I didn't have any kind of normal life.
Then I had dental surgery, and was prescribed Vicodin. This was the first time since being "afflicted" with this horrible ailment that I would be taking a painkiller. It IMMEDIATELY made me feel normal. I felt like I had years ago, before even smoking weed. The fact that Vicodin made my mind and body feel normal again, proved to me that my affliction was drug related. If there were any other cause, then taking a drug like that wouldn't help, right? So now that I had found what I thought was the perfect medication for my illness, I took one every day. Soon I got used to feeling back to normal. At one time, I was actually angry that I had tried Xanax and Lexapro, because here was this miracle drug. And that's how my addiction began.
After a year, I was up to 3 10mg pills every morning, and 3 at night before bed. I had stolen a stack of scripts from my dentist's office, and perfected her signature, so the flow of pills was not a problem. Then my girlfriend of 4 years found them, and I was done. She threatened to call the dentist, and the pharmacy, if I didn't quit. She also made me flush everything I had, which I did. She didn't know that I had some scripts left in the trunk of my car, but I went three days without the pills. I was a waitress then and working during withdrawal was pure h*ll. My girlfriend took the pills away on Friday. Monday morning I was at Walgreens filling a new script.
Thus began another run with the pills, and I was keeping the bottle under my mattress in our bedroom. I was sleeping there by myself because things weren't good at that time, due to my lying and the pills and a lot of things, so she was sleeping in the guest room. I would say I was on the pills for another 4 months. I walked into my bedroom after a shower one day, and my empty pill bottles were laid out on top of my bed. My heart completely sank. I couldn't go out there and face her the whole day, I just stayed in my room thinking of what to say. When I went out there, I tried to explain how withdrawal feels, and that I need to taper and not quit cold turkey, and that I needed some kind of help. She screamed a lot about my being a liar, and I just kept explaining that I couldn't do it cold turkey. I'll skip a lot of drama here, but this time the pills were taken away the day before starting my new job!!! The first day was easy because it was orientation, and I was pretty much plopped at a desk and left there to explore on my own. The next two days, however, I was supposed to be in training. The first day, I played sick and left early.
It was here that I found out about Suboxone, and read up on it, and then begged my girlfriend to lend me the money to get started. She played a good game, saying why should I help you, you did this to yourself. She finally caved, because I was getting a paycheck in two days anyway, and she took me to the doctor. Incidentally, I was on day 3 of withdrawal, so there was no question about not waiting long enough. The doctor gave me the script, and $310 later I had my Suboxone. I took a 4 mg pill right there in the car, and we drove home. My girlfriend and I layed on the couches in our living room, and I can still remember what it felt like. I was in full withdrawal, shaking and moving all around because I couldn't get comfortable, and that aweful tunnel breathing feeling I get. After 15 minutes, I felt able to lay down and relax, which I did, and then I didn't even notice when it took its full effect. I was just all of a sudden feeling better. I could not believe how much better I felt. Here I was again, finding that miracle drug for my ailment. But no one told me that it wasn't a medication for addiction, but a partial opiate, designed to keep the receptors full.
I will have been on Suboxone for one year on October 29th, and I feel like I have my life back. But I feel like it is a false life. And lately reality has been sinking in that this can't last forever. I want to have children soon, and be pregnant, and I can't be on this medication. It is also becoming quite a burdon, having to wait for ten minutes every morning while the d*mn thing dissolves, and then trying not to gag when brushing my teeth right after. It's becoming redundant, and I am starting to resent it. It would be great if it came in simple pill form, but the process has just taken its toll on me over the past year. The thought of getting off of it doesn't scare me simply because the withdrawals are bad, or because I'll need aftercare. Believe me, if someone told me that they knew for certain that when I go through detox and withdrawal that I will start to feel better... And I don't need to feel "better" like normal people feel, just the way other addicts describe feeling when their withdrawal symptoms go away, then I would gladly embrace the process today. But I feel that when I let go of the opiates, I will have the same issue that I had 4 years ago to go back to, because did that ever really go away? I think I've just been masking it. And that really was the most horrible feeling, and the most horrible time in my life. I CANNOT go back to it, or I will simply not make it. I have the dream job I have always wanted, as a case worker with the State, and I am successful. I don't have the time and energy to go back to a bout of anxiety and depression, and breathing problems like I had before.
Part of me has faith that perhaps this time will be different, if my mindset is different, and if I go to substance abuse counseling. But the other part of me is skeptical, thinking "what can they really do to fix this way that I feel?" I just don't see how it's possible to heal someone's mind when it is this badly damaged. I hate the fact that I ever thought drugs were okay, and I hate my father for being a drug addict and passing the gene down to me, and I hate myself for starting in the first place. So now I am just maintaining myself, and buying time, to figure out what to do. I believe that Suboxone could have saved my life, if I used it as a short term detox method instead of a year-long crutch.
It was here that I found out about Suboxone, and read up on it, and then begged my girlfriend to lend me the money to get started. She played a good game, saying why should I help you, you did this to yourself. She finally caved, because I was getting a paycheck in two days anyway, and she took me to the doctor. Incidentally, I was on day 3 of withdrawal, so there was no question about not waiting long enough. The doctor gave me the script, and $310 later I had my Suboxone. I took a 4 mg pill right there in the car, and we drove home. My girlfriend and I layed on the couches in our living room, and I can still remember what it felt like. I was in full withdrawal, shaking and moving all around because I couldn't get comfortable, and that aweful tunnel breathing feeling I get. After 15 minutes, I felt able to lay down and relax, which I did, and then I didn't even notice when it took its full effect. I was just all of a sudden feeling better. I could not believe how much better I felt. Here I was again, finding that miracle drug for my ailment. But no one told me that it wasn't a medication for addiction, but a partial opiate, designed to keep the receptors full.
I will have been on Suboxone for one year on October 29th, and I feel like I have my life back. But I feel like it is a false life. And lately reality has been sinking in that this can't last forever. I want to have children soon, and be pregnant, and I can't be on this medication. It is also becoming quite a burdon, having to wait for ten minutes every morning while the d*mn thing dissolves, and then trying not to gag when brushing my teeth right after. It's becoming redundant, and I am starting to resent it. It would be great if it came in simple pill form, but the process has just taken its toll on me over the past year. The thought of getting off of it doesn't scare me simply because the withdrawals are bad, or because I'll need aftercare. Believe me, if someone told me that they knew for certain that when I go through detox and withdrawal that I will start to feel better... And I don't need to feel "better" like normal people feel, just the way other addicts describe feeling when their withdrawal symptoms go away, then I would gladly embrace the process today. But I feel that when I let go of the opiates, I will have the same issue that I had 4 years ago to go back to, because did that ever really go away? I think I've just been masking it. And that really was the most horrible feeling, and the most horrible time in my life. I CANNOT go back to it, or I will simply not make it. I have the dream job I have always wanted, as a case worker with the State, and I am successful. I don't have the time and energy to go back to a bout of anxiety and depression, and breathing problems like I had before.
Part of me has faith that perhaps this time will be different, if my mindset is different, and if I go to substance abuse counseling. But the other part of me is skeptical, thinking "what can they really do to fix this way that I feel?" I just don't see how it's possible to heal someone's mind when it is this badly damaged. I hate the fact that I ever thought drugs were okay, and I hate my father for being a drug addict and passing the gene down to me, and I hate myself for starting in the first place. So now I am just maintaining myself, and buying time, to figure out what to do. I believe that Suboxone could have saved my life, if I used it as a short term detox method instead of a year-long crutch.
I have posted before here re my son's successful detox off Methadone using Sub. It was a slow and low taper over a three month period and he had some mild WDs- never missed work. 3 months later he is still completely well.
I think there are lots of experiences out there. I wish that everyone journaled their journey and particulars so we could compare and see if there are any similarities among good experiences vs bad. Sometimes I think we might be comparing apples to oranges. If you are interested in reading MANY good experiences, I recommend Naabt.org. Lots of sub users migrate to that site because of their positive support for sub users.
I think there are lots of experiences out there. I wish that everyone journaled their journey and particulars so we could compare and see if there are any similarities among good experiences vs bad. Sometimes I think we might be comparing apples to oranges. If you are interested in reading MANY good experiences, I recommend Naabt.org. Lots of sub users migrate to that site because of their positive support for sub users.
Pat I am curious are the stories over there all positive or do they have a mix of both ?
just seems...and again...just seems...when someone is sick and tired and ready to be done...they will do it....if sub is in the picture then they will still do it....a methadone addiction...a heroin addiction...an extremely high oxy or hydro addiction.....sub may help..but only if the person is DONE with the whole thing...I do not think sub will sabotage someone who is simply over this whole mess....unless they think it is a safe narcotic..it is not...a person who knows what they r doing can use this effectively but most do not know how to do this and the doctors as of now do not either....Sticky drug...scary drug...and if u dont know what u r doing and u r not dead serious...stay away from it..that is just my opinion which doesnt mean a hill of beans
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