lortab

[Jim]

I've been taking lortab 7.5 for about 3 months. About 8-10 per day. I think I'm going to have to go cold turkey to stop. Will my symptoms be really bad and how long will they last. I'm hoping not too long since i've been taking for so short a time.
Thanks!

[tom to Maryanne]

please read what follows. I hope you're on the forum tonight to see this.

Ater reading the news I posted in another thread on this site, I wrote a representative, director, of the new governing body controlling the accredidation of doctors to treat opiate addiction with agonist/antagonist drugs like buprenorphine, called SAMHSA.

The following is what I said to them -- I apologise for all the borken lines, perhaps your browser can compensate ---
"I am a professional writer for the computer industry living in Orange
> County, California, and have been praying that my government would
> finally provide me with a way to be first detoxed with buprehorphine, then, if that didn't work, treated with methadone or LAAM in what I can only call a more traditional doctor/patient relationship setting.
>All I ask of you is to be directed to a site or listing of private physicians that are or will qualify under this new law to treat opiate addiction with these safe, proven medications.
>
> Any guidance, referrals, or, in the event that I've misunderstood the new law, explanations from you or your staff would be profoundly appreciated. As I'm sure you know, there are millions of Americans who go to work everyday, pay their taxes, raise their children and respect the law who, through some medical misadventure or another, have contracted, and suffer from, the disease of opiate addiction. Many of us have had the disease for so long that nothing short of methadone or LAAM
> maintenance will work for us. I am like many professionals I know who have never bought illegal drugs, but rather have relied on licensed medical professionals for the medications that have allowed us to participate in life, at least outwardly, as normal, law-abiding citizens. To be able to go to my private physician and receive effective treatment, especially with buprenorphine in a normal medical setting would be a blessing from god.

This is his reply:

> Hello [tom]
>
> The new Federal Opioid treatment rules include provisions to increase the flexibility of patient take-home schedules.   Under the new Federa;
rules, which have not yet gone into effect, patients would be eligible for
up to a month's supply of take-home medication after two years in stable
treatment.  This monthly take-home provision requires the program's
medical director to determine that the patient meets certain criteria.  In
some cases, OTPs have indicated an intent to model this like an office
based treatment setting.  One approach could be for you to discuss this
possibility with your treatment program.  State regulations may have to be
considered with this approach.
>
> New Federal legislation enacted October 17, 2000, allows for certain
physicians to prescribe Schedule III, IV, and V, narcotic drug products
for the maintenance or detoxification treatment of narcotic addiction.
There are currently no drug products available for physicians to prescribe under this law.

Did you read that last sentence? Are they mad? They've approved the concept of physicians using Schedule III, IV, V drugs to treat opioid addiction, BUT NO ACTUAL DRUGS HAVE BEEN APPROVED TO BE USED FOR THIS PURPOSE.

Well, lucky me! The concept is soon to become legal, only they neglected to specify the names of any drugs for the doctors to use!

Please tell me, am I losing my mind? Have I forgotten how to interpret the English language?

And how does Dr Gooberman dispense buprenorpin for detox in New Jersey? Is there something special about New Jersey? I don't get it.

Maryanne, I have about 2 weeks before my new job starts. Two weeks in which I could be treated for my addiction. But doctors n California still can't prescribe bup to treat opiate addiction!

In between jobs, I'm afraid I've got to use what Visa cash I have to make sure the rent is payed while I wait for my first check from my new job. I have no money to fly to new Jersy and go to Doctor Gooberman. I'm ******! After all this searching and communicating with all these addiction professionals, and I still can't get help! I am in total dispair. I can't risk a confrontation wih he law and go buy bup in Mexico. I need to get help here in California. What must I do? Can someone reading this message help me? Is my only choice joining the methadone program located next to the county jail in Santa Ana California?

All I want is a chance to clean up using buprenorphine. Why can't I get this in California? Am I asking the wrong people?

Can someone in Southern California who knows of a solution to my problem please respond? Otherwise, I'm thinking I'll have to go to a psych doctor for thousands of dolllars (I've already communicated with one), have him certfy my addicton, then go on methadone. I had such high hopes for buprenorphine. I'm at my witt's end.

[Dreaming87]

Thanks for reading & your response.  It is almost like the "buzz" makes you the person you want to be (which is a fakeout, I know).  I also drink to excess along with my other vices and know the only way to get out of the hole is to NOT DO IT!!  I give myself lectures nightly and end up giving in to my mind.   I think I really need inpatient treatment but that is simply not an option.  Anyway, hopefully I am helping myself somewhat by realizing the situation.  Thanks again.

[Patrice]

Hi Tom,
First of all, hope all is forgiven from last week!!!!!  I need to tell you, I was on the bup/nalxon treatment for 5 weeks.  It NEVER took the cravings away, and in fact made me sick, and so constipated, no matter how many stool sofeners I took, along with peridium (sp) I still couldnt go without an enema.  I finally relented, listened to Dan and went on MMT.  If you are thinking about the bup/naloxn treatment, I hope it will work for you, but with your history, I wish you the best.  I am only saying this, because I care and I know you are an addict just like me..  Think about it, PLEASE!!!!!  Maybe I will run into you at the AA conferance in Fresno in March

Take Care

Patrice

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

Yeah, I have done the inpatient thing twice and as soon as I got free of the hospital, I scored more meds.  Sure they get you physically detoxed and provide a lot of education about the addiction process but all the knowledge in the world doesn't help when it comes to craving.  All these well meaning experts tell us things like, quit drinking, quit smoking, quit eating, quit sex, et al.  How to do all this "quitting" is the big mystery in my life.  Quit craving opiates?  You might as well tell me to quit having the common cold!  

I've found that hanging out with people who have been successful in recovery is essential. We simply cannot recover on our own and, as you say, "I end up giving in to my own mind".  I'm far from perfect myself and left to my own devices I would not be alive today.  We do have the ability to change our ways of thinking, however.  Just remember that your present ways have gotten you to this point in your life, and you are realizing the situation as you have said. Where you go from this point is up to you, and you do need some outside help to start making the right choices for yourself.  J.B.

[tom to Patrice]

consider the other night forgotten. You had a right to defend NA since it's worked so well for you. I was speaking from a very retricted experience with NA (boy, did I pick the wrong meetings!). I wound up finding a more do-able, and compehensible program through AA. My main point was that addicts should be agressive about trying different meetings and, in a way, ruthless about returning to the meetings that, for what ever reason, wind up helping them the most. I've got to tell you, Patrice, the NA meets I attended COULDN'T have been like the ones you spoke of. Anyway, it works when you work it, right?

I'm beginning to think that methadone might well turn out to be "the shortest distance between two points." I find it scary, that's all. I've been, more or less, a lone wolf getting, using, going to jail alone. I find the thought of just walking in and sitting down at a table fills me with dread.

I also have to find a doctor to certify my addiction first, and I absolutely won't do that to the kind, compassinate doc that has helped me maintain myself these last few years on plain old Darvon. (It's been years since I actually felt "high"). Everything I take now is just to keep going another day, then another, etc.

Getting a certification from this doc might very well ruin his career, and this man, Patrice, however "careless" he might be in prescribing drugs for me, is an absolute saint who I'd rather go to jail for than harm in any way. So, I'm waiting for a reply from a psychiatrist who recenty offered to certify me. That will be the first step and I know I will have to do it soon.

I'll check in and let you know how I do. It's just that Maryanne's story was so encouraging, I thought, before accepting the finality of methadone, why not at least try the bup?

Take care. All my best to you and your reovery.
tom

[Marie to Tom]

Tom,
Bup is available in Portland,Oregon at OHSU. Perhaps you could call and see what you find out. The pain clinic uses it. Hope this helps.