this is a post I'd written on another forum and I was sent here.i thought I would copy and paste as it contains a bit more detail about their problems.
my eldest is 9.he was born at term.normal delivery with no complications.i took him home 12 hours later.he was a perfect text book baby apart from being clumsy and having asthma(controlled with inhalers) until he started nursery at 3.
I started to notice he struggled to retain information eg recognising letters/numbers, he has poor pencil grip, his handwriting is awful and he struggles with fine motor skills.he can not ride a bike and struggles with ball skills.he is not very interested in physical activities and prefers to be in his own company or on a one to one basis with adults although he does mix with peers.he finds making friends difficult and can ramble on about a subject of intrest for long periods or time.he doesn't consider people's unwillingness to be in a conversation,their opinions or emotions and will often interrupt people already engaged in a conversation or activity.he is diagnosed with hyper mobility and dyslexia.
I raised concerns but was told it was early days and he would soon pick up.his memory is fantastic and he absorbs all information like a sponge especially with subjects that intrest him.maths, science and computers really are his strong points.his ability exceeds those of his peers but he is not meeting that ability on paper!he also gets confused with remembering more than one verbal instruction at a time.he has a very wide vocab but does use language very literally.
my middle son is 4 and has just started full time school.he was also born at term and developed really well with no indicators of any problems.he was a very alert baby and has never needed a lot of sleep to be full of beans.his physical development has always matched development milestones but his speech and language is delayed and he is having therapy for this without much real improvement.i started to be concerned by his speech and language and understanding around 12-18 months of age.
my son is always active from swinging his legs or playing with his fingers while sitting to jumping up and down to running in circles.he is impulsive, has a short attention span, poor appertite, restless sleep with regular waking, constant tossing and turning while asleep and has issues with not having my attention constantly.he can be destructive, desruptive, has a very short fuse and has a fiery temper.he can have violent tempers which I can't always explain.he will hurt himself and others and almost seems to gain release/pleasure from doing so.he also has issues with leaving me, does not like strangers to come into our home, can need a lot of physical contact (kisses and hugs) and verbal reassurance ( I'm your big boy arnt I? and love you are two things you hear from him very often) but is selective about times he will allow in one within his physical space. he likes to stick to routines at bedtime etc, likes to be told the next 2/3 things we are going to do,follow the same routes to school etc and can get adgetated / upset or angry if this doesn't happen.he likes to feel in control of his surroundings and people in them at all times.he always has bits of plastic, toys etc in his mouth and likes to carry small toys that fit in the palm of his hand especially when he's feeling anxiety.he shows very little if any awareness of danger or consequences.
school is a different matter though.he almost regresses into himself, doesn't mix with peers very well, prefers adult company, soils himself 2-3 times a week, is very tactile with adults ( needs to be hugged or touching a piece of their clothing) , is finding learning to read, write and recognise/ memorise letters/ numbers etc difficult.he displays no aggressive or disruptive behaviours at all!other than his speech and language delay the school do not see that he has problems.
my youngest son is 2 and was born at term with no complications.he has asthma but is otherwise healthy.he quite early on displayed signs of delays in physical development, understanding of language and intended use of toys etc and speech and language.he functions at approx 6-12 months behind in all areas.at 15 months his speech and social skills totally vanished!we are almost back to the point we were at then.
he has an abnormally high pain tolerance, aggressive outbursts towards himself others and physical objects when tired, scared, angry or frustrated.he never seems to feel full and will constantly eat if allowed to.he is very selective about what foods he will eat.he doesn't like the feel of grass,sand or anything slimy or sticky.he also puts small unedible objects in his mouth a lot.
he does not mix with children very well and does not like to be in unfamiliar surroundings or around unfamiliar people and will avert eye contact with people he doesn't know or is unsure of.he can get can get really upset/angry in this situation.he can play along side but not actually with other children.on times in his own world absorbed in a repetitive activity.he can also be extremely possessive of certain toys and belongings. he makes grunting noises as a means of communication and screams a lot. if you ask him a question he mostly just repeats it back to you or if it has options he just says the last one.if you ask him the same question straight after but swap the options around he will again repeat the last one which could be totally different!
he has recognised delays and receives support through play therapies and is awaiting speech and language therapy.
I'm at my wits end and do not know where to turn for help!are my sons conditions connected and what could cause these problems?please help me!!??
I am trying to get a feeling for the diagnosis that you have been getting. Are you in the United States or another country? If you are in another country, which one is it. I was also curious if you speak two languages at home or if the kids go to school where a different language is spoken then the one at home.
It does sound like your younger child is getting or will be getting the therapies he might need. But losing his speech skills, etc. at 15 months is weird. Did something different happen in your household then? Did he get sick? Did his playmate (your 4 year old) go off to school? Was he at home then or with another caregiver?
Actually, your 4 year old is doing a lot of things that we have seen posted here. Many of which are typical things a 4 year old will do, especially when a younger child is present. Its the middle child trying to get attention thing. The fact that the school - so far- seems to see no problem would indicate he fits in the range of the normal school kid. But how long has he been going to the school (do the teachers really have a feel for him yet).
For your eldest, the hyper mobility could explain his struggles with motor skills. I suggest you google hyper mobility because it is something that should not be ignored in children. Dyslexia is really a very general term. When was it diagnosed and has it gotten any better? Many times something like ADHD or ADD is the reason for the problem. And once again, a lot of what he does is not untypical for a 9 year old. I would certainly listen to what the schools have to say about him. Do his teachers complain about him not following directions or not paying attention in class? Does he take a long time to do him homework?
It probably would be a good idea for you to take the time to scroll through some of the other posts on this forum to see how other kids of the same age are acting and look at the advice given. Also, you have not said much about your home life as that also has an effect of the kids. Are they in day care or someone elses care during the day? What do or did the younger kids do during the day? Do they get to play with other kids on the weekends?
Finally, I think a good resource for you will be their teachers. The teachers get to see a lot of kids and they know what is normal or not. In some cases, I do think you are expecting more of your boys then you should (development wise) and a teacher will be a very good person to ask about that. Hope some of this helps.
Thank you for your reply.im in the uk.we only speak English and my boys attend an English mainstream school.nothing happened in our home life at the time of my youngest sons regression.my 4 y/o only started full time school this september so is still finding his feet at the moment.the longer he is there the more he is starting to show his behaviour problems.i also have custody of my 3 y/o nephew and have done since he was 6 months old (just 2 weeks before my 4 y/o's 1st birthday) he has always had to share my time which is why we can't understand why he struggles with this.
I have looked into hyper mobility and am currently fighting to get him therapy with an occupational therapist.my eldest's school reports and parent teacher meetings have the same concerns raised every time but its only June 2011 that his dyslexia was diagnosed and his hyper mobility was diagnosed in September this year.i haven't seen any improvement since diagnosis other than his reading age has improved from 7 and 1 month to 7 and 11 months.add is a possibility for my 9 y/o but it hasn't been looked into as the school were positive that he was suffering with dyspraxia also known as dcd.he does find verbal instructions difficult to follow and is daydreamy and as I say so laid back if he was any more laid back he would be horizontal.homework is an extremely slow and painful task.he struggles with English especially so gets extra English homework to help but this is extremely difficult for him!
I have looked through the forum and talked to other parents with children in my sons class.i find a lot of his behaviours can be normal it's just that his are so much more extreme than other children his age.
Our home life is secure and I am a SAHM.we have a large extended family and have a lot of play dates and days out etc.as much as we can.
All 3 of my sons are recognised to have delays/difficulties in their development but after 6 years so far of trying to get my eldest son support and still not having a full diagnosis I don't want my other sons to end up in the same position.
I noticed you said in the ADHD forum that you and your husband split about 6 months ago. That can make a big difference in a child's life even with a large extended family. Are you still separated? And didn't the separation occur about the time of your youngest sons regression?
I looked up dyspraxia and that could explain a lot -"Dyspraxics may have other difficulties that are not due to dyspraxia itself but often co-exist with it. This is sometimes referred to as comorbidity. Dyspraxics may have characteristics of dyslexia (difficulty with reading and spelling), dyscalculia (difficulty with mathematics), dysgraphia (an inability to write neatly and/or draw), autism spectrum disorder or ADHD (poor attention span and impulsive behaviour). However, they are unlikely to have problems in all of these areas. The pattern of difficulty varies widely from person to person, and it is important to understand that a major weakness for one dyspraxic can be a strength or gift for another. For example, while some dyspraxics have difficulty with reading and spelling due to an overlap with dyslexia, or numeracy due to an overlap with dyscalculia, others may have brilliant reading and spelling or mathematical abilities. Some estimates show that up to 50% of dyspraxics have ADHD."
Has the dyspraxics been officially diagnosed by a doctor? Or was this just something a teacher said he might have?
I do have several (well a bunch) of ideas to help you. It will take some time to put together. Your last information was very helpful. Please get back to me on my recent questions.
Hi there. I talked about praxis in my post on the pediatric forum. My son has issues with praxis. He's not fully dyspraxic but struggles with it. It can involve things like organizing thought let alone performing a task.
Dyspraxia is part of the sensory system and is part of executive function of the brain. An occupational therapist treats works on this issue when kids struggle with it. It will be involved in what appears to be cognitive ability, speech and anything fine or gross motor related.
We are still separated and he has very little contact with the boys!this affects my 4 y/o greatly!his his behaviour problems are now a lot more noticeable as they have escalated as a result!the separation was after the regression and his improvement has been in the last month as life has settled to our new normal.there was no argument etc at home around the time of my sons regression.he just up and left one day with no warning at all.he says he can't cope with the boys behaviours/delays etc.it was a condition the senco (special educational needs co ordinator ) and myself both strongly felt he had but the school paediatrician is not willing to agree but hasn't looked at what could be his problem.it fits my sons problems along with the dyslexia dysgraphia and add.
I have just read your other comment.spd isn't a condition I'd ever heard about.i have just looked at the checklist and basic explanation and it does fit all 3 of my children!!!!each child in different ways and to different ways.i think it's 100% a possibility and something I will discuss withe the senco! This is my problem though, between them my sons possibly fit with spd, asd,add,ADHD,odd?this is why it confuses me but I don't know who to turn to next?
Well, it can definatey be tricky to know exactly what is going on because the thing is, some of these issues can be comorbid or be happening at the same time. Often sensory integration disorder is secondary to asd, ad/hd, etc.
However, my son's primary issue has been sensory integration disorder,. Treating that has really put him on the right course.
Sensory and ad/hd look simiar at times and sensory is often confused for ad/hd. This the one thing I really caution parents to make sure that it is not sensory before an ad/hd diagnosis because medication is given for ad/hd and not sensory.
In my area (in the United States)-- you can call occupational therapists and see where the areas are that they focus on. I found a short list of OT's that specialize in sensory and put my son on a wait list. We were in within 1.5 months. It made all the difference in the word for my son.
The thing is, with three, this will be some work on you now. But the key is to teach them to do what they need to do for their nervous system reguation on their own so that eventually, it does not fall on you to set up a way for them to get the nevous system work they need.
On that site that you were on, SPD, there is a list of what they call 'heavy work'. This is a place to start. These are activities that work on the nervous system to regulate it. Incorporate as much of that into your kids day as possible to start. let me know if you have any questions. Peace
here in the uk we can't access any services without a referral from a professional :-( my eldest two are in full time school so the school needs to refer to the schools pead who then refers on to any services they feel they need which the school has to fund which is why I feel they don't like to do it!my youngest is in the assessment process as my health visitor saw my reasons for concern by doing monthly home visits.you then go before a panel of drs and they decide if they have issues that need looking at more (which they did) you then go onto play therapies and get reviewed by the panel 6-12 months later.they could then give diagnosis using the observations from the therapies (which is rare unless extremely severe) or refer back to play therapy for a further 6-12 months if the issues are still a concern (which could take my son to school age and throw him into the same awful process as my eldest two) or discharge if they feel he has no concerning issues.its such a long process with no one actually wanting to commit to diagnosis the majority of parents feel alone in their concerns and give up.i guess there is only so many times you can feel deflated by being passed on with no answers without doubting yourself.thankyou for your advice!it has helped me find a new energy to fight longer and not give up! :-) xx
Ok, lets see if some of this will help you.
First, you are really dealing with a fairly difficult situation (even if you don't realize it) is having 3 boys between 2 and 4 years old. That is called - you never get to take your eyes off anything they do. Its a crazy age. Compound that with their (or some of their) problems and its even more difficult. I really think that the key word for you is going to be structure. These kids need a lot of structure. The eldest so he can get his homework done in peace. The youngest so that their behavior will change while it is still easier to change. And along with all of this is the need to give them the attention they also need. I do think that your 4 year old is really experiencing being kind of left out. He is the oldest of the 3 youngest and I suspect that the two younger ones are getting more of your attention (which is very understandable). I know you said you have a large extended family, but are any of them around at night to help you with the kids? If its just you, then you are going to need to (for a few years) really plan out your time. I think that large white boards with time frames, etc are going to be needed. And most importantly, somehow giving them individually your personal attention.
One thing that will help is a set of books aimed at the 4 to 7 year old crowd. They are meant to be read aloud to them (great night time stuff). The books help kids with issues, give them strategies and vocabulary to use. A good example is the "When I feel Angry" from the Way I Feel series. It can be found here - http://www.amazon.com/When-Feel-Angry-Way-Books/dp/0807588970/ref=pd_sim_b_5 and if you scroll down you will find other suggestions.
As for your 4 year old. Lots of things going on. But the fact that apparently he can control himself at school would indicate that what he is doing at home is his way to gain a bit of attention for himself (very understandable given the competition he has). You need to change his way of getting attention. The second he gets "he can be destructive, desruptive, has a very short fuse and has a fiery temper.he can have violent tempers." He must go to a short timeout. The rule is that when he starts a tantrum - he gets a short timeout. And the timeout does not start until the tantrum stops. He will go nuts for a while. Just keep repeating - "as soon as you choose to stop your tantrum, the timeout will start and 2 min later you can ..." Do not try to reason with him or talk with him while he is yelling. You are just playing into his hands.
Essentially, the rules for behavior modification are that there must be immediate, short, consistent consequences. Do not expect overnight miracles. It has taken him awhile to get to this point and it will take a while to relearn control. But he will. Do realize that a lot of what he is doing is probably attention getting, but he has to learn the proper way to do so. And if you let him continue his ways, it will only get much, much worse. Also, you mentioned his restless sleep with regular waking, constant tossing and turning. Kids who don't get a good nights sleep have very difficult days. Tons of studies have shown this. You might see if he has some form of sleep apnea, but ADHD can also cause this. You might want to look into giving him some melatonin before bedtime.
Finally he does exhibit some pretty classic ADHD symptoms. Just as your 9 year old shows signs of ADD. Kind of makes me wonder about your ex. His response to them is not unusual for someone with AD/HD. Anyway, working with ADHD kids is different than with regular kids. Here is a good site for symptoms of ADHD. http://www.help4adhd.org/en/about/what/WWK1. If this looks possible, then the book I recommend the most is "The ADD/ ADHD Answer book," by Susan Ashley.
Your 9 year old has all of the classic ADD signs. Doesn't mean that he has it, but it means that it must be checked out. The tough thing is that even in the states its hard to diagnosis, because many of the kids are smart and quiet. And frankly my experience with the UK is not good for something like this. This is a very good site for ADD - http://www.help4adhd.org/en/about/what/WWK8. Its the same as the earlier site, but emphasis on ADD. Print it out and take it into your school special ed person if you think it fits. And Ashleys book will also be helpful too.
For your two year old. Well, most kids of that age have mommy all to them selves. Obviously he can't (have I told you that you are amazing dealing with all of this!). There are some things he can't be allowed to do - aggressive outbursts - and other things that are fairly normal for his age. I think I will have to see how he does over the next year of so. But the developmental help he is getting is important.
To sum it up - You are in a huge undertaking. Just the effort you have taken to write all of this up shows how much you care. This will take more effort on your part. As I said at the start - structure is going to be very important in your house. As well as somehow finding the time to make everyone feel kind of equal. Which is tough if they do have SIDS or ADHD or ADD cause that effects how they feel about themselves.
Keep posting. Buts lets try and focus on one kid at a time.
And speaking of focus, I would probably focus most on your 4 year old for the time being. Best wishes.
Everyday is full of constant problems,tantrums and meltdowns!i have 16/18 hours days and a son who wakes a lot!as you can imagine that is very exhausting physically and mentally! My house has a strick routine as it just simply does not work any other way!my sister comes over 3 nights a week for contact with my nephew but does muck in and help with all of the boys and the house.i try to use this time to do homework/therapy/one to one time.it obviously doesn't give them long each but it's all I can manage at the moment.i think it would be a good idea to visualise the routine for everyone to see though.an asd has been suggested for my sons by the school special ed teacher.i think since I have raised my concerns with a whole hearted 'there is something wrong with my boys and it needs to be looked at' that she has taken more notice/interest.from the little she has said and a bit of research I think she's suggesting Asperger's syndrome.i use the cool down technique on my 4 y/o.its just a safe area where he stays until he calms down and is ready to apologise.i think it's made a difference since I've started it.sleep apnea is something ill look into.i hadn't thought about a sleep disorder to be honest.i have looked at add and ADHD and both boys have all symptoms which really shocked me.what shocked me even more was to realise I had all of the add symptoms also!my ex has all ADHD and odd symptoms and has done since being a young child.i have a meeting on Thursday to discuss the boys needs and my concerns in more detail.my 4y/o teacher did call me in this afternoon though to express her concern at the fact he doesn't mix with peers and will play alongside them but not actually with them!fingers crossed they are starting to take notice now!!!!
Today has been a rather tough day.i talked to my 4 y/o teacher on Monday about the meeting that I am having tomorrow in the school with the head teacher and senco and asked if she had any concerns with his interaction with peers etc she told me no at the time.today I was called into the school in the middle of the day to changed my son as he had soiled himself for the third day in a row! (Which he is not doing at home!) while I was there she said he does not mix very well, prefers the company of the staff,he is selective as to what play/educational tasks/activities he will willingly take part in and that he is showing a stubborn side to himself this week.he says he likes school and can't explain why he is doing these things.what do you think these new things mean?im also worried about the meeting!i have some opinions that I need to make clear but don't want to get their backs up or step on toes!!how do you think I should approach it all??!!
In regards to him soiling himself. Lots of times in schools, the little kids don't want to go to the bathroom when the big kids are in there - or a lot of kids in there. Consequently accidents happen. His teacher should let him go during class time and should tell him its ok to ask. Sounds like his potty schedule has changed? Has his diet changed? Ask his teacher how the other kids play with him. In other words, due they ask him to play or do they avoid him? If they are avoiding him, they would not be unusual if he has ADHD. A child with ADHD (until they mature and get some control) are difficult to play with. It sounds like the school is interested in getting him tested?
Not sure what opinions you have that you want to share. I am assuming that this is about your 9 year old? I always find it best to stick to factual things if possible. I would print out the ADD symptom sheet and show them where he fits on that. Then ask if they see the same things. Ask what you can do to help them. Try really hard not to step on toes as these are probably the only people (it sounds like) that can help. Don't talk much about what has not been done, but talk about what can be done to help your son. I can get you more information if you need it. Let me know what happens or if you have any more questions.
only his class uses the toilet.he went only 15 minutes before today and asked to go while he was waiting for me to get there to change him.his diet is the same.it is very limited and has been for about 2 years now.ill ask her.i don't think she had taken any notice until I directly asked the question.i am truly hoping so!!!!it is about both my 9 y/o & 4 y/o and my concerns with their development.do you think I should consider Aspergers/asd or stick with ad/hd ? they are my only hope and in 13 months they will be for my youngest son also!its vital i get this right!its my first and prob my last chance for another year at least!!what should the areas of my concern be that I express the most clearly?!every little helps if you wouldn't mind helping me I'd be so great full!!this is so important to my sons futures (I think/hope)
Generally, Aspergers is noticed earlier in kids. While ADD is not noticed until grades began to suffer or the child has become so anxious about his inability to do things that the other kids can- he begans to withdraw. From what you have mentioned, I would go with ADD. And your family history would also indicate this.
Your main area of concern is to get an accurate diagnosis of what is going on. Only then can things be done to help correct the problem. And there is a lot that schools can do to help with things like ADD. This site is very, very good with ideas to help. http://helpguide.org/mental/adhd_add_teaching_strategies.htm This site also has a lot of very good ideas for the parent to use to help their child with school.
And from the same site is another (slightly differently stated) list of symptoms - http://helpguide.org/mental/adhd_add_signs_symptoms.htm
There is a lot of very good points in this site. Take the time to read it carefully. Heck, print it out and take it with you. Use it to make the point that this is a possibility for your children.
Keep in touch. Best wishes!!
thankyou.i agree with add for my 9 y/o.my 4 y/o matches ADHD but as hes not displaying the behaviours in school I don't think they will accept it.i shall print off the information and highlight the valid symptoms for each child. I've just messages you also some family history details.thankyou so much for your time and advice!
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