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HIV risks - Strip club encounters
Dear HIV/STD Forum Answerers/Experts:
Firstly, thank you for all the great service you do and the responses of assurance and education you provide. I am most grateful and sincerely mean this.
Secondly, I have perused at length the forums and read the responses. I am also sort of aware of the response you would be providing. Nevertheless, there is solace and comfort in hearing directly from the experts. The monkey mind is playing bouts of anxiety acrobatics on me and I would like to control/tame it. I have wasted significant periods of life in stress due to this and I know life is too short to worry about such exposures (or hopefully, non-exposures). Also, please forgive me for this verbose post and I thank you in advance for your patience in reading through it completely.
Thirdly, irrespective of my anxiety, I very much appreciate your honest and direct opinion.
Fourthly and lastly: Here is my scenario starting with the basics.
Basics: 34 year old virgin circumcised male from India living there; never drink; have an autoimmune condition due to which I am on TNF suppressants for quite some time; otherwise quite healthy – workout regularly every week and apart from blood pressure, have healthy blood CBC and CMP profiles. Healthy platelet and WBC/Neutrophil counts. Bit low on Testosterone, but no shortage in strength, energy levels, fitness, stamina, or ability to get erection or ejaculate. My only sexually active activities are masturbation (quite often) and visiting strip clubs and getting lapdances. I have never had real sex. Planning to hopefully get married soon.
I travel to the US very often on business and enjoy visiting gentlemen’s club/strip clubs in cities I visit often. I get lap dances and each time per visit to the gentlemen’s club, I get at max 3-5 lapdances per strip club visit (9 to 21) minutes at max each time of lapdancing/grinding/frottage) by which time I have ejaculated. I really do not have a track of the number of times I have visited strip clubs. I am given to understanding through your wonderful posts that these are No Risk/Zero Risk/ Risk Free encounters. I am always clothed – dress pants or jeans with underwear on. And a Shirt/T-**** with a men’s vest inside. My pants have always remained on and so have the zips and the belt.
During my visits, after working late, I have sometimes gone directly to the strip club from work wearing my dress pants (did not get to come to hotel and change into jeans). During these strip club visits (around 5 such visits with thin pants), some of the dress pants I had worn were really not great quality material (i.e. not cotton, thin layer, mostly polyester, not thick like jeans) – got them from Macy’s. I also have always without exception worn a thin cotton underwear beneath my pants (jeans and in these cases thin polyester pants).
Scenarios 1: I do not drink, have a great memory, and do not recall it happening, but if it did happen that my penis when enlarged got out my underwear (if it did, don’t recall, but kindly assume), but stayed behind these mostly polyester pants (92% polyester) during these 5 different lapdances when I wore a thin pant AND suppose the strippers thin thong/panty (these lapdances were in topless only clubs) moved to the side such as to expose their genitals during the grinding/frottage (this could happen as to please me some of the dancers would show their vagina/privates by pulling aside their thong/panty during the dance and then cover it up and again grind) – What would be my risks of STDs or HIV in such a case when if there was only one layer of my thin pant (I firmly believe my underwear was always on and the stripper thong was also on, but kindly assume as indicated in the premise of the question) separating my genitals from that of the dancer’s? Also, if the stripper rubber her teeth along the thin pant covered shaft of my penis (happened once, but I believe then I was in jeans and underwear) for 5-7 seconds (not sucking, just teeth gripping, not biting, and moving along erect shaft).
Scenario 2: I am a novice at sex and have never had it. I have never ever taken my penis out explicitly put it in anybody’s mouth, vagina, or anus. So, I do not know what insertion, dipping, or penetration are aside from theoretical common sense understanding of male and female sexual anatomy through various visualizations and movies. These lap dances are sometimes pretty aggressive (sometimes I sweat). The dancers mainly frottage against my covered genitals and I reciprocate due to the natural sexual tendency to reciprocate the frottage by engaging in undulating back and forth motion. Again suppose my penis came out (unlikely, but suppose please) during these lap dance sessions (around 5 such sessions) of my underwear and was behind my thin polyester pants and suppose the dancer’s panty/thong shifted due to the vigorous movement such that their genital was exposed, it is possible my erect penis could have caused a penetration? The frottage events consisted of rubbing their backside on my pants and their front side (vagina valley (I suppose covered) along my shaft (covered by thin pants)). I think it is natural in that frottage motion for the pant covered penis to stub/poke at the doorway/gateway/opening of the vagina when at the bottom and then glide along the vagina valley up and then down the valley to the vagina value again and stub there and then go back up as part of the gliding - as part of the frottage. Again, I did not do this – i.e. deliberate and explicit pant covered stubbing and poking, but am assuming that vigorous frottage from the dance and me could involve this. What are my risks of STDs or HIV in such scenario if I was covered under these dance sessions by the thin polyester pants (unlikely my penis was out of underwear but kindly assume and kindly assume that the lady’s thong had moved such as to expose their genitals). My penis never got injured/chaffed during these dances, but roughed up yes – from the dances and masturbation. In only one of these sessions, I felt the 2-3 drops of white fluid on top of the pant (not sure if seeped through) – I think from the dancer’s secretions. Other than that, I have not felt much unusual wetness or the dancer’s vaginal fluids on my pant.
Thank you very much for your time and advice. Based on your advice, I will move forward with life and look forward to better things in it while not worrying about such events in the past or future given your general overarching advice of no unprotected sex (anal, vaginal, and oral) and clothed frottage – even if there is only one single thin layer between two people to be zero risk for STDs and HIV.
That said, I greatly appreciate your candid feedback and once again, sorry for taking much of your time.
Firstly, thank you for all the great service you do and the responses of assurance and education you provide. I am most grateful and sincerely mean this.
Secondly, I have perused at length the forums and read the responses. I am also sort of aware of the response you would be providing. Nevertheless, there is solace and comfort in hearing directly from the experts. The monkey mind is playing bouts of anxiety acrobatics on me and I would like to control/tame it. I have wasted significant periods of life in stress due to this and I know life is too short to worry about such exposures (or hopefully, non-exposures). Also, please forgive me for this verbose post and I thank you in advance for your patience in reading through it completely.
Thirdly, irrespective of my anxiety, I very much appreciate your honest and direct opinion.
Fourthly and lastly: Here is my scenario starting with the basics.
Basics: 34 year old virgin circumcised male from India living there; never drink; have an autoimmune condition due to which I am on TNF suppressants for quite some time; otherwise quite healthy – workout regularly every week and apart from blood pressure, have healthy blood CBC and CMP profiles. Healthy platelet and WBC/Neutrophil counts. Bit low on Testosterone, but no shortage in strength, energy levels, fitness, stamina, or ability to get erection or ejaculate. My only sexually active activities are masturbation (quite often) and visiting strip clubs and getting lapdances. I have never had real sex. Planning to hopefully get married soon.
I travel to the US very often on business and enjoy visiting gentlemen’s club/strip clubs in cities I visit often. I get lap dances and each time per visit to the gentlemen’s club, I get at max 3-5 lapdances per strip club visit (9 to 21) minutes at max each time of lapdancing/grinding/frottage) by which time I have ejaculated. I really do not have a track of the number of times I have visited strip clubs. I am given to understanding through your wonderful posts that these are No Risk/Zero Risk/ Risk Free encounters. I am always clothed – dress pants or jeans with underwear on. And a Shirt/T-**** with a men’s vest inside. My pants have always remained on and so have the zips and the belt.
During my visits, after working late, I have sometimes gone directly to the strip club from work wearing my dress pants (did not get to come to hotel and change into jeans). During these strip club visits (around 5 such visits with thin pants), some of the dress pants I had worn were really not great quality material (i.e. not cotton, thin layer, mostly polyester, not thick like jeans) – got them from Macy’s. I also have always without exception worn a thin cotton underwear beneath my pants (jeans and in these cases thin polyester pants).
Scenarios 1: I do not drink, have a great memory, and do not recall it happening, but if it did happen that my penis when enlarged got out my underwear (if it did, don’t recall, but kindly assume), but stayed behind these mostly polyester pants (92% polyester) during these 5 different lapdances when I wore a thin pant AND suppose the strippers thin thong/panty (these lapdances were in topless only clubs) moved to the side such as to expose their genitals during the grinding/frottage (this could happen as to please me some of the dancers would show their vagina/privates by pulling aside their thong/panty during the dance and then cover it up and again grind) – What would be my risks of STDs or HIV in such a case when if there was only one layer of my thin pant (I firmly believe my underwear was always on and the stripper thong was also on, but kindly assume as indicated in the premise of the question) separating my genitals from that of the dancer’s? Also, if the stripper rubber her teeth along the thin pant covered shaft of my penis (happened once, but I believe then I was in jeans and underwear) for 5-7 seconds (not sucking, just teeth gripping, not biting, and moving along erect shaft).
Scenario 2: I am a novice at sex and have never had it. I have never ever taken my penis out explicitly put it in anybody’s mouth, vagina, or anus. So, I do not know what insertion, dipping, or penetration are aside from theoretical common sense understanding of male and female sexual anatomy through various visualizations and movies. These lap dances are sometimes pretty aggressive (sometimes I sweat). The dancers mainly frottage against my covered genitals and I reciprocate due to the natural sexual tendency to reciprocate the frottage by engaging in undulating back and forth motion. Again suppose my penis came out (unlikely, but suppose please) during these lap dance sessions (around 5 such sessions) of my underwear and was behind my thin polyester pants and suppose the dancer’s panty/thong shifted due to the vigorous movement such that their genital was exposed, it is possible my erect penis could have caused a penetration? The frottage events consisted of rubbing their backside on my pants and their front side (vagina valley (I suppose covered) along my shaft (covered by thin pants)). I think it is natural in that frottage motion for the pant covered penis to stub/poke at the doorway/gateway/opening of the vagina when at the bottom and then glide along the vagina valley up and then down the valley to the vagina value again and stub there and then go back up as part of the gliding - as part of the frottage. Again, I did not do this – i.e. deliberate and explicit pant covered stubbing and poking, but am assuming that vigorous frottage from the dance and me could involve this. What are my risks of STDs or HIV in such scenario if I was covered under these dance sessions by the thin polyester pants (unlikely my penis was out of underwear but kindly assume and kindly assume that the lady’s thong had moved such as to expose their genitals). My penis never got injured/chaffed during these dances, but roughed up yes – from the dances and masturbation. In only one of these sessions, I felt the 2-3 drops of white fluid on top of the pant (not sure if seeped through) – I think from the dancer’s secretions. Other than that, I have not felt much unusual wetness or the dancer’s vaginal fluids on my pant.
Thank you very much for your time and advice. Based on your advice, I will move forward with life and look forward to better things in it while not worrying about such events in the past or future given your general overarching advice of no unprotected sex (anal, vaginal, and oral) and clothed frottage – even if there is only one single thin layer between two people to be zero risk for STDs and HIV.
That said, I greatly appreciate your candid feedback and once again, sorry for taking much of your time.
COMMUNITY LEADER
You're asking us to suppose something that simply did not happen. You would know. I'm not going to answer all of those "what if" questions, because they are a figment of your imagination.
As an adult, the only risks for HIV are:
1) having unprotected, penetrative vaginal or anal sex, or
2) sharing IV drug needles with other IV drug users.
Don't do either of those things (except with your wife to be, of course) and you will never have to worry about HIV. You aren't going to get HIV through your pants, or through anything else you do at these strip clubs. There is nothing you can add to your list that would make it a risk for HIV.
As an adult, the only risks for HIV are:
1) having unprotected, penetrative vaginal or anal sex, or
2) sharing IV drug needles with other IV drug users.
Don't do either of those things (except with your wife to be, of course) and you will never have to worry about HIV. You aren't going to get HIV through your pants, or through anything else you do at these strip clubs. There is nothing you can add to your list that would make it a risk for HIV.
3 Comments
You also posed your question in the std forum and it has also been answered, so consider therapy to help you accept germ theory.
Thank you, maam. So, assuming factually, that there was only one layer of thin pants separating my genitals and the dancer's during the frottage lapdance, am I safe to assume those two scenarios I indicated are no risk activities for HIV? I will move on. And, I believe my suppositions are figments of my imagination.
And, by don't do either of those things you mean these two you outlined in your response?
"As an adult, the only risks for HIV are:
1) having unprotected, penetrative vaginal or anal sex, or
2) sharing IV drug needles with other IV drug users. "
I never will or have done #2. And I will do # 1 with only my wife.
I got confused as I also had two scenarios in my initial post and wanted to clarify you were not urging to not engage in those two scenarios. I assume these scenarios are risk free for HIV. Kindly confirm.
And, by don't do either of those things you mean these two you outlined in your response?
"As an adult, the only risks for HIV are:
1) having unprotected, penetrative vaginal or anal sex, or
2) sharing IV drug needles with other IV drug users. "
I never will or have done #2. And I will do # 1 with only my wife.
I got confused as I also had two scenarios in my initial post and wanted to clarify you were not urging to not engage in those two scenarios. I assume these scenarios are risk free for HIV. Kindly confirm.
You also posed your question in the std forum and it has also been answered, so consider therapy to help you accept germ theory.
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