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Low Dose Immunotherapy
Anyone heard of low dose immunotherapy for treating lyme and co-infections? Specialty Natural Medicine in WA state offers this treatment for lyme. A detailed description is on their website. It's supposed to divert your immune system away from the bacteria. The thinking is that your body's immune response to the bacteria is what is causing your symptoms and that it is fighting a losing battle. It's a new treatment they say it has great success. It's pretty much the opposite of how we have been fighting the disease. However, I'm leary of essentially turning off my immune system towards the bacteria. Anyone try this with success?
If Lyme were an auto-immune disease (in which the body is attacking itself instead of the Lyme bacteria), then the suggested approach might work ... but, as you note, Lyme is a bacterial infection and not an auto-immune disease. Suppressing the immune system would seem to give the bacteria room to run, so I agree with your comments. Please post if you find any additional commentary -- and thanks for noting this.
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I'm doing this treatment for Lyme and Babesia Duncani. My understanding was it was turning my immune system on to kill the bacteria and parasites? Is this not what's going on? I'm feeling much better although its been a year long treatment.
A friend of mine is doing this treatment. It is too early to see results but she is convinced it will work for her. I hope do.
That's interesting your friend is doing low dose immunotherapy. Please let me know if it works for her.
I spoke to my friend briefly abut the immuno therapy. She said she is not doing very well because they can't seem to find her correct doseage.
If I hear more I will keep you updated.
If I hear more I will keep you updated.
I'm hearing great things about this treatment for Lyme disease! The thinking is that Lyme puts one's body into an autoimmune response. My LLND is now treating with it and having amazing results. I'm going to try this myself, starting the end of this month. Dr. Ty Vincent has some videos on Youtube about it.
It's important to start low-dose to AVOID a herx with this treatment. It can be given orally or by subcutaneous injections and is very affordable.
Here is a bit more info on it. Based on all the reading that I've done on this subject, people are having very positive results.
http://www.specialtynaturalmedicine.com/lyme-disease-ldi/
It's important to start low-dose to AVOID a herx with this treatment. It can be given orally or by subcutaneous injections and is very affordable.
Here is a bit more info on it. Based on all the reading that I've done on this subject, people are having very positive results.
http://www.specialtynaturalmedicine.com/lyme-disease-ldi/
I see my LLND next week and she requires a month for me to "prep" prior to starting the LDI. Not sure what that involves yet (perhaps coming off of antimicrobials first). I get my first dose of LDI beginning of July. I'll try and remember to post back on here afterwards. I think the first 2 treatments one can expect slight flares of symptoms and then they're supposed to stabilize, and then totally subside.....
Thanks so much for the good luck wishes. :)
Thanks so much for the good luck wishes. :)
FB started a group on this. Most of the people in the group Skype with the Dr who invented it from Alaska and he sends the shots.
It's not meant to kill the lyme and co's but to increase your immune system to fight it. I don't have the money right now ($600) to start or I would try it.
It had already been done for autoimmune disorders and seems to work. The group members speak highly of the new energy they get. There are naturopaths that do it too. FL doesn't have any which is unfortunate for me.
It's not meant to kill the lyme and co's but to increase your immune system to fight it. I don't have the money right now ($600) to start or I would try it.
It had already been done for autoimmune disorders and seems to work. The group members speak highly of the new energy they get. There are naturopaths that do it too. FL doesn't have any which is unfortunate for me.
I start LDI on Sept 3rd...I pray it works- i have Chronic Lyme Disease and Co infections
Something I don't understand about low-dose immunotherapy in regard to Lyme disease: to my understanding, Lyme disease already suppresses the human immune system.
How would gently encouraging one's immune system (through low dose treatment) be sufficient to ramp up the body's immune system to kill the Lyme?
Would someone explain or send me to materials on that point? Thanks --
How would gently encouraging one's immune system (through low dose treatment) be sufficient to ramp up the body's immune system to kill the Lyme?
Would someone explain or send me to materials on that point? Thanks --
Lymes in fact is a autoimmune disorder it floods the lymphatic system and forms cystic pockets of nasty drilling spirochetes. These spirochetes when matured also form husks that biochemically resemble regular cellular tissue. Most treatments are worthless as they fail to address these issues. You can boost your immune system but if it cant reach the problem whats the point.
To my understanding, 'auto-immunity' is when the body attacks itself instead of attacking (for example) bacterial invaders. Multiple sclerosis and lupus are auto-immune diseases, to name two.
-- National Institutes of Health: "Your body's immune system protects you from disease and infection. But if you have an autoimmune disease, your immune system attacks healthy cells in your body by mistake. Autoimmune diseases can affect many parts of the body. No one is sure what causes autoimmune diseases."
-- Wikipedia: "Autoimmune diseases arise from an abnormal immune response of the body against substances and tissues normally present in the body (autoimmunity)."
-- Healthline [dot] com: "An autoimmune disease develops when your immune system, which defends your body against disease, decides your healthy cells are foreign. As a result, your immune system attacks healthy cells. Depending on the type, an autoimmune disease can affect one or many different types of body tissue."
Separately, from what I read, Lyme bacteria are not easily reached and killed by the human immune system because the bacteria create and hide in slimy shields called 'biofilms', where the immune system cannot reach the bacteria to kill them. The medications given to Lyme patients are generally of two kinds: first, one drug to break through the biofilms where the Lyme bacteria are hiding, and then another drug to then kill the bacteria.
That is why doxycycline is often ineffective in an established Lyme infection: the Lyme bacteria are hiding in the biofilms, where the immune system cannot reach -- hence the need for biofilm-busters so the antibiotics can get to the Lyme bacteria and kill them.
This understanding of how Lyme shields itself from the human immune system (thus requiring antibiotics to break through) is the basis of LLMD approaches to eradicate Lyme in patients.
-- National Institutes of Health: "Your body's immune system protects you from disease and infection. But if you have an autoimmune disease, your immune system attacks healthy cells in your body by mistake. Autoimmune diseases can affect many parts of the body. No one is sure what causes autoimmune diseases."
-- Wikipedia: "Autoimmune diseases arise from an abnormal immune response of the body against substances and tissues normally present in the body (autoimmunity)."
-- Healthline [dot] com: "An autoimmune disease develops when your immune system, which defends your body against disease, decides your healthy cells are foreign. As a result, your immune system attacks healthy cells. Depending on the type, an autoimmune disease can affect one or many different types of body tissue."
Separately, from what I read, Lyme bacteria are not easily reached and killed by the human immune system because the bacteria create and hide in slimy shields called 'biofilms', where the immune system cannot reach the bacteria to kill them. The medications given to Lyme patients are generally of two kinds: first, one drug to break through the biofilms where the Lyme bacteria are hiding, and then another drug to then kill the bacteria.
That is why doxycycline is often ineffective in an established Lyme infection: the Lyme bacteria are hiding in the biofilms, where the immune system cannot reach -- hence the need for biofilm-busters so the antibiotics can get to the Lyme bacteria and kill them.
This understanding of how Lyme shields itself from the human immune system (thus requiring antibiotics to break through) is the basis of LLMD approaches to eradicate Lyme in patients.
PS bottom line: the old-line Lyme docs do not understand the ability of Lyme bacteria to hide in biofilms that are not disturbed by doxycyline, which was the first antibiotic used again Lyme.
If taken VERY early in a Lyme infection, I understand that doxy CAN kill all the Lyme, because early on, the Lyme bacteria have not yet created and inhabited biofilms where the human immune system cannot penetrate.
When docs treat a Lyme patient with 'doxy only', then (1) the treatment generally fails and (2) the continuing symptoms the patient has are the result of continuing infections of still-living-and-reproducing Lyme bacteria. When this failure rate was noticed a few years ago, the clueless docs pivoted to a new story: 'You're cured of Lyme, but your immune system doesn't know it it, so you are continuing to have all the symptoms of Lyme! Good luck!'
That way lies misery, imo.
If taken VERY early in a Lyme infection, I understand that doxy CAN kill all the Lyme, because early on, the Lyme bacteria have not yet created and inhabited biofilms where the human immune system cannot penetrate.
When docs treat a Lyme patient with 'doxy only', then (1) the treatment generally fails and (2) the continuing symptoms the patient has are the result of continuing infections of still-living-and-reproducing Lyme bacteria. When this failure rate was noticed a few years ago, the clueless docs pivoted to a new story: 'You're cured of Lyme, but your immune system doesn't know it it, so you are continuing to have all the symptoms of Lyme! Good luck!'
That way lies misery, imo.
Use Dr. Google to read up more about it Jackie. Also, watch Dr. Ty Vincent's videos on LDI to answer your questions. :)
Someone posted this response from Dr. Vincent on LDI:
" The point is: You don't have to kill the bacteria. Killing off part of your microbial "ecosystem" like that is not possible on a permanent basis; and it is not necessary in order to be well. The real underlying cause of chronic Lyme symptoms is the inappropriate immune response against the bacteria. The bacteria themselves do not cause direct harm to anyone, and therefore do not have to be eradicated (luckily, since that's impossible"). This fact is evidenced by research that routinely shows these bacteria to be present within completely healthy, asymptomatic people (why are't THEY sick too, if this disease is a true "infection'). We shut off the immune inflammatory reaction, and symptoms go away. That has to be maintained with ongoing doses at the right dilution. The heart can be affected by this immune response in some people - like rheumatic fever can, which is triggered by Strep in the throat.
We do not want the reaction to get worse at first (similar to a Herx reaction-which can certainly occur if the dose given is too strong); so the process should be to start at a very weak dilution and work gradually stronger over time to find a dose that gives improvement without an initial flare. I do NOT suggest taking antibiotics or antimicrobial herbs at all, at any point - because that changes the antigenic load and makes it very hard to find the right LDI dose. Plus, it's pointless. I hope that helps."
" The point is: You don't have to kill the bacteria. Killing off part of your microbial "ecosystem" like that is not possible on a permanent basis; and it is not necessary in order to be well. The real underlying cause of chronic Lyme symptoms is the inappropriate immune response against the bacteria. The bacteria themselves do not cause direct harm to anyone, and therefore do not have to be eradicated (luckily, since that's impossible"). This fact is evidenced by research that routinely shows these bacteria to be present within completely healthy, asymptomatic people (why are't THEY sick too, if this disease is a true "infection'). We shut off the immune inflammatory reaction, and symptoms go away. That has to be maintained with ongoing doses at the right dilution. The heart can be affected by this immune response in some people - like rheumatic fever can, which is triggered by Strep in the throat.
We do not want the reaction to get worse at first (similar to a Herx reaction-which can certainly occur if the dose given is too strong); so the process should be to start at a very weak dilution and work gradually stronger over time to find a dose that gives improvement without an initial flare. I do NOT suggest taking antibiotics or antimicrobial herbs at all, at any point - because that changes the antigenic load and makes it very hard to find the right LDI dose. Plus, it's pointless. I hope that helps."
$600 sounds hefty. Our LLND charges her regular $75 office fee and then the LDI doses,( which become less and less often needed as one's immune system starts to respond), are $40 each. The most affordable treatment out there at present. Sorry to hear no one in Florida treats with this yet as most LLMDs and LLNDs are starting to use it due to the high percentage of success reached with it.
Where to begin.
"We shut off the immune inflammatory reaction, and symptoms go away." Uh, if you shut off your immune system activity, nothing will be killing the bacteria. It's like telling the soldiers guarding the castle to go home, and then the enemy will peaceably pack up and go home too.
It is always good to have a healthy immune system, but if the immune system is 'shut off', and if you're not treating with antibiotics, nothing will be killing the bacteria.
How do you prove the assertion that 'most LLMDs and LLNDs are starting to use [this approach]' due to the high percentage of success reached with it'? Define 'most' -- at least 50%, and maybe higher? Where is this conclusion published, with proof?
What is the mechanism that causes 'one's immune system' to 'start to respond'?
"We shut off the immune inflammatory reaction, and symptoms go away." Uh, if you shut off your immune system activity, nothing will be killing the bacteria. It's like telling the soldiers guarding the castle to go home, and then the enemy will peaceably pack up and go home too.
It is always good to have a healthy immune system, but if the immune system is 'shut off', and if you're not treating with antibiotics, nothing will be killing the bacteria.
How do you prove the assertion that 'most LLMDs and LLNDs are starting to use [this approach]' due to the high percentage of success reached with it'? Define 'most' -- at least 50%, and maybe higher? Where is this conclusion published, with proof?
What is the mechanism that causes 'one's immune system' to 'start to respond'?
Jackie, for further info and answers to all of your questions do join the LDI For Lyme Facebook group. Peruse through the Files section of the group, read the threads and comments and look at the long list of LLMDs and LLNDs treating with this. Further, many of us in Canada are being treated by LLNDs and LLMDs (going to US for this) whose names are not even on that list yet, to give you an idea of numbers......not that you really need to be challenging about it, though I know that's your nature. ;)
Further to the above, an article that I read today that alludes more to the inappropriate immune response that one has in the chronic phase of Lyme disease; the basis of LDI treatment:
"Or is the problem due to an abnormal immune response, triggering an autoimmune illness. One example is the development of meat allergies from certain tick bites."
http://www.forbes.com/sites/judystone/2015/09/04/lyme-deaths-from-heart-inflammation-likely-worse-than-we-thought/
Anyway, LDI seems to be a brilliant approach esp for those who cannot take long-term antibiotics or have had no major improvement with long term herbals.
"Or is the problem due to an abnormal immune response, triggering an autoimmune illness. One example is the development of meat allergies from certain tick bites."
http://www.forbes.com/sites/judystone/2015/09/04/lyme-deaths-from-heart-inflammation-likely-worse-than-we-thought/
Anyway, LDI seems to be a brilliant approach esp for those who cannot take long-term antibiotics or have had no major improvement with long term herbals.
Ok, if you're too close-minded to explore this cutting edge treatment for chronic Lyme on a great site full of info/studies and successful results, at least google and view Dr Ty Vincent's Youtube videos which explain this cutting edge treatment. Its not a new concept in that Dr. Shrader and others have been using LDA for allergies, and this similar concept is having great success in chronic Lyme patients. Similar concept is used in C-difficile with great success also.Too many success stories to dismiss this LDI approach. Many of us with the Bb disseminated spirochetes have an inappropriate immune system response. It's the inflammation that our immune system's inappropriate response has, that causes the damage, not the spirochetes themselves. There are many people walking around with Bb spirochetes and are ASYMPTOMATIC, but those who do become symptomatic after the acute phase, have inappropriate responses to the spirochetes. LDI re-establishes immune tolerance and allows Treg cells to "tolerate" the spirochetes and co-infections. I personally think that long-term antibiotics are going to become a thing of the past for treating chronic Lyme.
Another great video with further info and worth the 56 min. watch!
http://www.voiceamerica.com/episode/87271/low-dose-immunotherapy-a-new-healing-tool
Another great video with further info and worth the 56 min. watch!
http://www.voiceamerica.com/episode/87271/low-dose-immunotherapy-a-new-healing-tool
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