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Nongonaccal Urethritis Transmission

Hello

I'm hoping someone can give me some reasonable advice.  About 6 months back I had oral sex without a condom and then vaginal sex with a condom with a woman I didn't know very well.  Two days later I had unprotected sex with my wife.  3 days after that I began noticing symptoms such as a thin clear discharge (it leaves yellowish stains in my underwear), I have a frequent urge to urinate, occasionally I get a sharp shooting pain in my urethra, and some times the tip of my penis is sensitive.  I never experienced the thick discharge or the burning sensation while urinating.  I went to see my doctor he had gave me Ceftriaxone Sodium (250 mg) shot and then a Doxycyline Hyclate (100 mg) 10 day prescription.  He dignosed me with Urethritis.  He took a urine sample and I was negative for Gonorrhea and Chlamydia.  He also examined my urine for increased white blood cells but that was negative also.  I took the prescription and didn't have sex with my wife for 7 days and finished the prescription.  

6 months later I still have the symptoms described above, but I've read a lot on this form that many times the syptoms stay with people.  My questions are:

1.  Is there a good possibility my wife has NGU due to me having sex with her 2 days after I was exposed and has it just been passed back to me?  When I had sex with her two days after my encounter with another woman I don't remember any symptoms except frequent urge to unrinate.  

2.  Is two days a long enough gestation period to where I could have passed it to my wife?  

I've been worried sick for months now due to the fact that I may have passed it on to her.  We have a 2 year old child and I'm sure if I suggested she get checked, it would open up a can or worms and much suspicion, and I know she will probably leave me.  I know anxiety also causes symptoms to remain, but I'm really worried that NGU is present in both of us, and the mental anguish of not knowing and potentially hurting my wife has driven me to the point  of contemplating suicide.  

I know this whole story does not look good and I know the answer is that I probably passed it onto my wife.  Can any health professionals comment on this regarding the two questions above?  

Thank you
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1318465 tn?1614894302
Hello

1. The chance your wife has an NGU due to having sex with her 2 days after your potential exposure is low.   In fact I would bet money on it that she doesn't have an NGU infection.

Note to answer the second half of your question about passing back to you; you can get NGU from having monogomous sex  some men are prone to gential infections such as NGU.  

2.  The answer is yes, but I doubt you passed anything to her.   The chance of that is minimal, I would nod my head for NGU.

Finally it has been 6 months since, and you  didn't infect her with an NGU infection as she doesn't appear to have any symptoms.   Please try to believe the fact that you did NOT infect her with anything.    Your closing paragraph is incorrect.    
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1318465 tn?1614894302
ah, yes,... I had lost the link to this article but here it is:  Please read it.

http://www.region8ipp.com/Docs/Articles/35538.pdf

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Avatar universal
Thanks for the reply and the link to the article.  I read it but it still does not give me much reassurance.  My wife and I have been together for 11 years and I've not had this issue prior to this inccident, so it does not appear I'm predisposed to genital infections.  

Regarding my wife not having symptoms, isn't it common for females to be asymtematic?  So she could have it, and not show signs?  In addition, if we ever have another child, and she does have NGU, can't there be complications.  

Also, is there an equal chance of a male transmitting NGU to a female and female to male?  Or does one gender typically have a greater probability of contracting NGU?

I'm sorry I'm throwing things out there as if I'm doubting, but I have been researching this for some time and cannot find anything to calm my fears.  I do the best I can to manage my anxiety and live a normal life, but it's difficult.  I hope you understand and don't take my response the wrong way.  
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101028 tn?1419603004
ngu is basically an uti for males.  like some women get them frequently after sex, some males are prone to it after sex, especially oral sex. what is normal flora in the  mouth, isn't always so normal in the urogenital tract.    

is this an issue for your wife? no it is not.

continue to follow up on your symptoms with your provider. at this point a visit to an urologist is probably your best course of action.  have they checked your prostate?  have they done additional cultures?

grace
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Avatar universal
Thanks Grace.  No additional cultures have been done.  Prostate was checked and doc said there doesn't seem to be an issue there.  

I still have the urge to urinate, even after I just went, random stinging or shooting sharp pain the urethra.  Perhaps you're correct and it's time for more follow up with a urologist.  My GP never did a swab test, but did a urine culture.  How reliable is the urine culture in detecting Chlamydia?  Could it have been missed in the first culture my GP did?  I gave them a sample 6 days after my encounter with a potentially infected woman.  I'm a little worried that perhaps they got a false negative.  I've read a lot of about different ways to give samples, but I was not instructed on how to do it, nor did they ask the last time I urinated.  They just sent me in the bathroom with a cup.  I swabed the tip of my penis with a anti bacterial wipe they gave me and then urinated in the cup.  Could this have give a false negative if the anti bacterial mixed with the urine?  
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101028 tn?1419603004
urine testing is fine for chlamydia and gonorrhea testing.
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Avatar universal
NGU - I am in a very similar situation as you.  You can see my interaction with Dr. Hook here:

http://www.medhelp.org/posts/STDs/NGU-or-prostate-or-nerves/show/1467460?personal_page_id=1992223#post_6673973

It started a little over 6 months ago for me. Unprotected oral, protected vaginal sex. Negative testing 2 times for chlamydia/gon.  Many examinations for WBC in urine...all showing none.  Over 1 month of levaquin and a couple of weeks of cipro.

Since my last post there, I am still experiencing the slight discharge a couple of times throughout the day.  I sometimes have frequent urination...though I drink a lot of water because if I don't urinate for a couple of hours the discharge is there.  I also get the odd twinges, discomfort and feeling that something just isn't right.

My urologist won't see me anymore..."there is nothing wrong with you urologically".  This was a week or so ago after yet another UA with no white blood cells detected.  That is my 6th or so. No explanation for the discharge though, other than "sometimes your glands can do that after extended antibiotics".  Not a satisfying answer.

I'm seeing a different urologist, but can't get in for a month.  In the meantime the anxiety has been horrible for months now.  I wake up in the morning and my first thought is NGU.  It really is quite terrible.  I, too, know my wife would leave me and take the kids if I gave her anything.  Please though, put thoughts of suicide away (though I know they've popped up to me too).

I wish there were a way to tell what the heck that discharge is.  I wish I knew that if I did have NGU it would not effect my wife in any way.  I can live with slight discharge I suppose but what do I need to do to *know* these things?

I didn't mean to jump on your thread.  I just wanted you to know that you are not alone in what you are experiencing.
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Avatar universal
Thank you for the link to your interaction with Dr Hook.  In closing, you said you felt comfortable knowing you didn't have NGU after your visit with the urologist.  Has that changed?  Based on your reply to my post, it appears you're still having issues?  

These symptoms we are both having seem manageable, even though at times they can be uncomfortable.  I share your concern, in that I wish I knew what it is exactly that is going on.  I haven't had extensive testing like you've had, just the treatment described above.  Based on my research, it appears these symptoms can linger with the patient for years after a bout of NGU, even though there is no infection present.  However, it is not comforting to know that there is not a lot of information out there on non-gonorrhea, non chlamydia NGU and that I'm still having these symptoms.  It makes it impossible to put your mind at ease and just move on as Dr Hook suggests.  What someone tells you and what you feel and experience are two different things and it's hard to ignore the physical evidence.  

I have a question for you....Has your wife ever expressed that she had any sypmtoms similar to NGU or chlamydia?  I know it can be asymtematic in women, but I also understand it can manifest it's self in very horrible ways.  

I do not begrudge you in any way for jumping on my thread.  I totally appreciate additional information.  Please keep me posted if you find out anything new with your condition.  I also appreciate your words regarding my mental state.  I can see that you also understand how anxiety can grip you and make you do and feel things you normally wouldn't.  After this experience I now know what it's like to be paranoid, however no one else knows except me, so it makes it even more difficult.  People have noticed a change in my mood and persona.  People have commented many times asking if anything is wrong and that I seem different.  Although I try to maintain a normal life, the guilt, worry, anxiety, fear for my wife's health, etc., has piled up and impacted me internally and externally.  I know people will read this and say I should have thought about this before I strayed from my relationship, but the fact is people do things for various reasons and I've already made my mistake, so there is no room for that talk anymore with me.  People can judge me, but it is what it is, and I'm trying to move on with my life but all the factors listed above make it difficult, and maybe that's my punishment for the wrong that I've committed.  Sorry, I didn't mean to turn this into a mental health thread.  
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Avatar universal
You're welcome.

I did feel comfortable about not having NGU for a while.  I stopped looking for discharge as much and there were even a few days where I did not think about it at all.  However, the discharge was still present at times and, as you know, its just about impossible to ignore.  Any attempt to research it only leads back to STDs.  And then, a couple of weeks ago, I had a couple of instances of a split urine stream, a couple of slightly painful urinations (which went away) and then my prostate area started tingling.  It felt like a cell phone vibration.

This is when I submitted my 6th urine sample to my urologist.  It was taken first thing in the morning and with the first of the urine. It came back negative for any sign of infection.  Though I had an appointment with the urologist scheduled for four days later, he told me there is nothing urological going on with you and you should follow up with your PCP.  I was not satisfied with that evaluation and made an appointment for my PCP, though I know he will be no help, for next week.  I also set up an appointment for a different urologist, but can't get in until next month.

I agree that having the symptoms makes it just about impossible to "just move on".

My wife has never told me of any symptoms.  But we have not had sex in quite a while due to my anxiety.  She has had a couple of yeast infections since my exposure, which are probably unconnected but increase my anxiety nonetheless.

To be honest with you, a lot of the time I logically accept that I do not have NGU.  I am not worried at all about chlamydia, for some reason I can accept those negative tests results, especially when combined with Dr. Hook stating in 100s of threads that it is not spread orally.  If I were you, I would stop worrying about chlamydia.  Though, yes, I totally know easier said than done.  Testing for it is really good though, not much chance of false negatives.  

Repeated testing of my urine shows no sign of infection.  Dr. Hook and my first urologist indicate that that is enough evidence to prove NGU. Add on top of that well over a month of levaquin, and it makes logical sense that there is no STD problem. I don't know why I can't accept that, beyond anxiety and the discharge.  The timing of my infidelity and this discharge is just too coincidental to me.

I don't know what it will take to convince me unfortunately.  There must be some test to show just what the discharge is...Cowper's gland fluid? Prostatic fluid?  Plain old mucous? I just can't get an answer to that.

I would also like to be reassured that even if it is NGU that there will be no health effects, or even symptoms in my wife.

Like I said, we're in the same boat.  It sucks...a lot.  I'm always anxious and distracted.  I get very little pleasure out of life, it is *always* in the back of my mind.  I find myself yelling at my kids more, and its just horrible.  My business is suffering too since I can't seem to care enough to return calls, do my work, or whatever.  I can't even make plans with my friends.

Hang in there though, that's all we can do.  I will for sure let you know of anything further that I learn, and I hope you do the same.  I understand you didn't want to make this a mental health thread, but in all reality there's a good chance that is what is going on with both of us.  If it wasn't for the discharge....
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Avatar universal
wow, I know the feelings.  It sounds like you're describing my life.  

I know what you mean about moving on with life and feeling confident that you don't have anything.  You just can't do it when you're still experiencing symptoms.  I know I didn't have these issues prior to my encounter, so it seems there is still something wrong with me.  In addition, everything I'm reading says to continue to see your health care provider if symptoms persist.  

So when you say you haven't had sex in quite a while due to anxiety, is she pressing you as to where and why this anxiety is coming up?  My wife and I had a very active sex life, but now it's difficult for me.  Although I don't have any ED issues, I find I don't have the urge and I don't get the same pleasure because it's in the back of my mind during sex.  

Also, what does your wife say about your repeated trips to the doc?  My wife would wonder what the heck is going on with my health if I went so often.    

Much like you, I do not get much pleasure out of life, my work product has been suffering, etc.  It has been a lonely and miserable  life since I contracted this infection.  Thanks for keeping me informed.  If I find anything I will share it with you as well.  
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Avatar universal
We have never had an extremely active sex life, but yes, she is bringing up sex. A number of years ago I had some prostatitis issues.  Most of my current "problems" can be tied to that.I don't think I can hold out much longer on the sex thing.

Its so odd. Logically, I don't think any infection can hide from 6+ UAs, considering the symptoms being present.  But I can't get any other answers, so frustrating.  Dr. Hook thinks that the UAs are enough, but Dr. Hansfield often says that UAs will often be normal.

I wonder if anyone else has some insight?
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Avatar universal
hmmm.....I've been doing quite bit of research and there seems to be conflicting information.  Dr. Hook and Dr. Hansfield seem to feel there isn't much research out there to determine if nonchlamydia nongonoccal NGU is harmful to a sex partner.  However, there seems to be a lot of research on Ureaplasma and Mycoplasma, which are believed to be the main causes of this infection.  From what I'm reading it's widely believed that these bacteria are just as harmful and can cause complications and adverse health problems in women.  They are also very difficult to kill, therefore extended treatments of antibiotics are usually required or you run the risk of transmitting it to your partner.  So it appears these bacteria or just as dangerous as the chlamydia and gonorrhea type NGU.  

In defense of Dr Hook and Hansfield, they do mention these bacteria and they do say it's best that both partners be treated.  

google nonchlamydia nongonoccal urethritis and you will find a ton of information.  I'm sure you probably already have done this and I'm not trying to increase your anxiety, but perhaps this is the reason we are still experiencing symptoms.  I have only done one round of doxy for 10 days, so maybe I need a longer treatment.  I'm not sure.  

Regarding your UA's, were they testing for the bacteria listed above?  Apparently it's difficult to test for and requires sophisticated testing methods not commonly available, therefore many doctors just treat with antibiotics and do not try to test for these bacteria.  I'm no doctor, just recounting what I've read.  
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Avatar universal
The UAs look for the presence of white blood cells in the urine, an indicator of infection.  They don't look for any specific bacteria.  NGU diagnosis requires the presence of a certain amount of WBCs.  This is why I can sometimes convince myself that I don't have an infection.  I've had at least 6 of these done since December and all were clear.
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Avatar universal
Also, from what I read, both Dr's are not sure that Mycoplasma or Ureaplasma can be acquired through an oral exposure...but they believe it does not occur.
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Avatar universal
This is most comprehensive piece of reading material I've come accross.  It appears these can be acquired from oral exposue.  

http://healthplanet.wordpress.com/category/ureaplasma-infection/
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Avatar universal
Also, is the presence of white blood cells indicative of Mycoplasma or Ureaplasma?  I'm not sure that they can tell if these are present by looking at WBC count.  From what I'm reading, it requires sohpisticated testing to verify if mycoplasma and ureaplasma is present and WNC count does not always give an indication of these being present.  Correct me if I'm wrong.  
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Avatar universal
In addition.....accoding to the link I sent you, mycoplasma is becoming resistant to doxy, which doesn't sound good for me.  
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Avatar universal
Have you considered asking the doctors your questions in the experts forum?
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Avatar universal
As you can see, I'm pretty much driving myself crazy in the process of researching this stuff.  Indeed, it probably adds to my anxiety over the whole situation.  

I had a follow up visit with my doctor some time back and let him know I was having major anxiety issues and I'm probably just being more conscious of the area, but there are symptoms for sure.  He examined me and said everything looks fine and told me my risk of contracting something is low unless there were open sores in the mouth.  But how do you explain the lingering syptoms?  

I haven't asked a question in forum because I don't want the charge to show up on my credit card statement or anything like that.  The wife and I share the finances so she would wonder what's up with the charge.  I know, this sounds like a lame reason, but that's the reason I've resisted.  
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Avatar universal
The internet is full of sometimes misleading information, and much of it tends to be alarmist in regards to STDs.  I stay away from searching the internet and stick to here.  Ironic, I know, considering how I am having trouble accepting what Dr. Hook has told me, but there it is.

I would recommend trying to find a way to ask the doctors here a question, it may help.
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Avatar universal
Yes, some things on the net do tend to be alarmist, that's why I stopped concentrating on a lot of the public information and outreach stuff.  It all assumes NGU of the chlamydia type, which is not what I have.  Therefore the information isn't that relevent.  The link I pasted above is the best thing I've come accross.  Here is another active thread on the topic.  

http://www.medhelp.org/posts/STDs/Need-opinion-on--NGU/show/1515493
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Avatar universal
I guess I'm not totally sure.  It seems to conflict with Dr. Hook in my thread where he states:
"Yes, a negative UA is strong evidence that you do not have NGU."
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Avatar universal
I re-read your post that you've had "Over 1 month of levaquin and a couple of weeks of cipro."  If indeed you have Mycoplasma, then these drugs may not have been effective.  Here is a link on the effectiveness of certain antibiotics against Mycoplasma.  

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/eid/vol12no07/05-1558.htm

I've had Doxy and Azithro treatment and still symptoms are persisting.  The Azithro has helped somewhat, but I still have the urge to urinate, as well as the sharp shooting pain and some clear discharge.  Azithro decreased the sharp shooting pain, but that's it.  I'm trying to get my GP to prescribe Moxifloxacin but he doesn't seem to anxious to help at this point.  I believe he's a little upset that I'm diagnosing myself.  He doesn't feel there is an infection based on the test results, but I've also read a urine WBC count will not reveal if Mycoplasma is present, which Dr. Hansfield has also confirmed many times.  You need a swab test done and specific testing for Mycoplasma.  However, my GP will not go to this length of testing because he think's I'm over reacting.  This is becoming very frustrating, but I'm sure I have a lot more insight than him on the subject of mycoplasma after all the research I've done.  I'm not saying I know more than him, but perhaps I'm a little more up to date on the current studies at this point.  

Perhaps you may want to try a different antibiotic and see if you can get a swab test done.  
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Avatar universal
Have you had intercourse with your wife yet or are you still hesitant?  
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