Aa
Detoxing off methadone and switch to Suboxone. How long do you have to stay on sub b4 starting detox from that?
I'm getting pretty close to the 30mg mark on Methadone and want to jump to Suboxone, then finish my detox on that. I do not want to do any sort of maintanence on sub, just finish my detox. Has anyone done this, and if so, how long did you have to stay on Sub, before starting the detox off of that? If I stay on methadone, @ this dose it's gonna be another year on this crap if I don't want to kill myself with the w/drawals of detoxing too fast. Plus, I hate the drive EVERY day. If you're on ANY psych meds at my clinic, prescribed or not, you don't get takehomes, and I'm tired of driving in the snow every winter.
I'd like to do something like the 21 day detox. Maybe even drag it out to a month on the low doses. Sounds a lot better than another year, (that would make it 10yrs if I stay). I understand the most important thing is to walk off on a very low dose, (1/4mg).
I'd also like to hear peoples experiences of doing this, like, what dose did you start at when switching from methadone to sub? I know everyones different, but if I could get some #'s, I'd have a general idea of what it's gonna cost me. I know the dr's initial fee plus the by-weekly fee to see him, but I don't know how much the med will cost until I get an idea of my daily dose.
Thanks, in advance.
I'd like to do something like the 21 day detox. Maybe even drag it out to a month on the low doses. Sounds a lot better than another year, (that would make it 10yrs if I stay). I understand the most important thing is to walk off on a very low dose, (1/4mg).
I'd also like to hear peoples experiences of doing this, like, what dose did you start at when switching from methadone to sub? I know everyones different, but if I could get some #'s, I'd have a general idea of what it's gonna cost me. I know the dr's initial fee plus the by-weekly fee to see him, but I don't know how much the med will cost until I get an idea of my daily dose.
Thanks, in advance.
I thank you for caring, and you are right, I do need, and have a psychitrist and a psychologist I see monthly. It is good to be able to get stuff off your chest. My only "problem" with NA or AA is that after going to 4 different towns, and using their meetings, it just seemed to me that there was a lot of reminissing(sp), talking about all the things they did when they were either high or drunk, then at the end of the meeting they would remind you not to use. All that did for me was start thinking of who I can call to get whatever drug they were just talking about in the meeting.
I need to be as far away from that as possible. The longer I don't think about using, the more room it leaves in my head for healthy things. I can spend that energy actually doing something rewarding like, putting on my running shoes and going for a run in the woods, or relaxing on the golf course, etc. I know they work for some people, but for me I don't need to be reminded of it. In fact, the only time drugs would come up is when I went to those meetings, which I don't need, but again, you are right, we need to find the root cause of our addiction, then work on that, which I have been for the better part of 3 years with people I finally trust. This site would be the place for me to offer and recieve advice w/out going to a meeting. That way no one is going to keep talking about the night that such and such happened, and I can't get away from it w/out walking out on someone talking. I was raised with SOME manners,lol.
I need to be as far away from that as possible. The longer I don't think about using, the more room it leaves in my head for healthy things. I can spend that energy actually doing something rewarding like, putting on my running shoes and going for a run in the woods, or relaxing on the golf course, etc. I know they work for some people, but for me I don't need to be reminded of it. In fact, the only time drugs would come up is when I went to those meetings, which I don't need, but again, you are right, we need to find the root cause of our addiction, then work on that, which I have been for the better part of 3 years with people I finally trust. This site would be the place for me to offer and recieve advice w/out going to a meeting. That way no one is going to keep talking about the night that such and such happened, and I can't get away from it w/out walking out on someone talking. I was raised with SOME manners,lol.
Steve~ You are right...the forum is a safe place and you can be yourself here. BUT,I
need to warn you that it is only an adjunct to proper recovery treatment. It would be wrong of me to let this go so I'm going to tell you now: You need some kind of aftercare. I promise you. We all need it. It doesn't have to be NA. It can be one to one therapy.We
need to get to the reason why we used because it gets pretty vague down the road.We
begin to feel omnipotent and that "just one" is okay.
Of course,it's up to you. I just had to warn you,okay? Think about it and maybe ask others what they've done.
Vicki
need to warn you that it is only an adjunct to proper recovery treatment. It would be wrong of me to let this go so I'm going to tell you now: You need some kind of aftercare. I promise you. We all need it. It doesn't have to be NA. It can be one to one therapy.We
need to get to the reason why we used because it gets pretty vague down the road.We
begin to feel omnipotent and that "just one" is okay.
Of course,it's up to you. I just had to warn you,okay? Think about it and maybe ask others what they've done.
Vicki
Vicci and Henry, thank you so much.
Massave props to both of you. I can't thank you enough for your info. It gives me the definitive decision to go onto Suboxone. As I said before, when I got down to 30mg, I pretty much had drs. knocking at my door, so I'm hopeful I can find a dr. that prescribes the generic subutex, which I have heard of. If not, it still will be cheaper and less painful than detoxing down to a dose of methadone that I can jump off from.
I honestly don't think I will ever have a desire to use an opiate again. I have way too many memories of standing outside in a noreaster w/10 degree weather, or the clinic opening up late, so I lose overtime @ work, spending my Christmas morning at the clinic, waiting for my dose, etc. Plus the $ and pain/sickness of detoxing. Coming on this site is enough of a NA type of setting for me. I feel I can say or ask questions I most likely would not ask. Unfortunately with my anxiety, when I did go to a NA or AA meeting, I kinda sat in the back and more or less just listened. Here, there feels like no judgement is being fallen onto me, I'm just another addict looking for help.
And Henry, if I heard the news correct tonight, we will be bringing back our soldiers at the end of the month. I hope that was right, for you and every soldier over there. Nevermind the help on this site, I thank you from the bottom of my heart that you do what you do overseas. Without people like you, I wouldn't have the luxury of being at home, on the internet. So you just remember to keep your head down. I want to make sure you are able to post here again, SOON. Good luck over there, and thank you both again.
Steve
Massave props to both of you. I can't thank you enough for your info. It gives me the definitive decision to go onto Suboxone. As I said before, when I got down to 30mg, I pretty much had drs. knocking at my door, so I'm hopeful I can find a dr. that prescribes the generic subutex, which I have heard of. If not, it still will be cheaper and less painful than detoxing down to a dose of methadone that I can jump off from.
I honestly don't think I will ever have a desire to use an opiate again. I have way too many memories of standing outside in a noreaster w/10 degree weather, or the clinic opening up late, so I lose overtime @ work, spending my Christmas morning at the clinic, waiting for my dose, etc. Plus the $ and pain/sickness of detoxing. Coming on this site is enough of a NA type of setting for me. I feel I can say or ask questions I most likely would not ask. Unfortunately with my anxiety, when I did go to a NA or AA meeting, I kinda sat in the back and more or less just listened. Here, there feels like no judgement is being fallen onto me, I'm just another addict looking for help.
And Henry, if I heard the news correct tonight, we will be bringing back our soldiers at the end of the month. I hope that was right, for you and every soldier over there. Nevermind the help on this site, I thank you from the bottom of my heart that you do what you do overseas. Without people like you, I wouldn't have the luxury of being at home, on the internet. So you just remember to keep your head down. I want to make sure you are able to post here again, SOON. Good luck over there, and thank you both again.
Steve
Thanks Henry. You ALWAYS come through when I give you a shout. I think your post will help Steve very much. Take care with our soldiers!!! Big hug to you!!
I also forgot to add- Regarding the medication cost.
Suboxone was running me about $600-700 a month for the meds on the 2mg tablets when I was at 12mgs a day.
If you can get the doc to write you a script for subutex, there is a generic form available now for the 8mg tablets. Most pharmacies stock it for around $3 a pill. Still costly, but substantially cheaper as opposed to name brand sub, or even methadone!
Suboxone should be available in a generic soon, but the pharm companies are having a hard time getting the naloxone in the generic form to dissolve complately.
There is also in the works a Buprenorphine strip, similair to those listerine strips. This is a little far out, but more info should be available soon.
And then there is the Probuphine Implant. A lot of controversy on this one, and not an option I could reccomend in good faith!
Henry
Suboxone was running me about $600-700 a month for the meds on the 2mg tablets when I was at 12mgs a day.
If you can get the doc to write you a script for subutex, there is a generic form available now for the 8mg tablets. Most pharmacies stock it for around $3 a pill. Still costly, but substantially cheaper as opposed to name brand sub, or even methadone!
Suboxone should be available in a generic soon, but the pharm companies are having a hard time getting the naloxone in the generic form to dissolve complately.
There is also in the works a Buprenorphine strip, similair to those listerine strips. This is a little far out, but more info should be available soon.
And then there is the Probuphine Implant. A lot of controversy on this one, and not an option I could reccomend in good faith!
Henry
Hey Steve,
I seem to always post these notoriously long posts, so bear with me here. :-P
It sounds like you have done your homework... smart move. Educate yourself as much as possible as the one downfall with sub, is the uneducated doctors giving misinformation and false hope.
I was on MMT for over 7 years at doses well over 300mgs daily. I had a hell of a time coming off even after tapering low, and knew I needed another option, hence my switch to sub.
My docs policy was to decrease to a dose of 30mgs of methadone or lower to being suboxone induction. So you are good to go there. You will also have to start withdrawals before inducing onto the sub, but Im sure you already know this too. I personally waited 72 hours, but I have found that you only need to be in mild to moderate withdrawals before inducing, no need to cause unnecessary suffering. Use the clinical opiate withdrawal scale to guage your wd stage.
I began my sub treatment at 16mgs. Might be overkill, might not, but thats what worked for me. I found I was quickly able to decrease my dose with no discomfort at all after about 3 weeks.
I stayed on sub treatment for 2 years, but that was only because I wasnt truly ready to quit everything. I worked a strong recovery program while in sub treatment, and I truly believe this was the key to my success. Meetings, counseling, the works. The dual approach to treatment is what sub was designed for!
I stopped sub at 3mgs over 80 days ago and am doing great. The wd wasnt fun, but it was completely tolerable. I continued working, got up and did my daily routine every day... The wd's did last longer than other opiates, but compared to methadone were substantially milder and shorter. With methadone wd I was SICK SICK SICK!!! Couldnt get out of bed, puking, the works. With sub wd, you just kinda feel like hell- but not sick.
I would say the insomnia lasted the longest which started to get better at around the 30 day mark. After the first 10 days of detox, I was beginning to see improvements daily.
I dont regret my decision to switch to suboxone at all... I feel great today.
Im sure I left some stuff out of this post, as I am just exhausted. (Just came off a long flight) Im in Kuwait for the next few days, but feel free to shoot me a PM if you have any questions that I can help you out with!
Henry
I seem to always post these notoriously long posts, so bear with me here. :-P
It sounds like you have done your homework... smart move. Educate yourself as much as possible as the one downfall with sub, is the uneducated doctors giving misinformation and false hope.
I was on MMT for over 7 years at doses well over 300mgs daily. I had a hell of a time coming off even after tapering low, and knew I needed another option, hence my switch to sub.
My docs policy was to decrease to a dose of 30mgs of methadone or lower to being suboxone induction. So you are good to go there. You will also have to start withdrawals before inducing onto the sub, but Im sure you already know this too. I personally waited 72 hours, but I have found that you only need to be in mild to moderate withdrawals before inducing, no need to cause unnecessary suffering. Use the clinical opiate withdrawal scale to guage your wd stage.
I began my sub treatment at 16mgs. Might be overkill, might not, but thats what worked for me. I found I was quickly able to decrease my dose with no discomfort at all after about 3 weeks.
I stayed on sub treatment for 2 years, but that was only because I wasnt truly ready to quit everything. I worked a strong recovery program while in sub treatment, and I truly believe this was the key to my success. Meetings, counseling, the works. The dual approach to treatment is what sub was designed for!
I stopped sub at 3mgs over 80 days ago and am doing great. The wd wasnt fun, but it was completely tolerable. I continued working, got up and did my daily routine every day... The wd's did last longer than other opiates, but compared to methadone were substantially milder and shorter. With methadone wd I was SICK SICK SICK!!! Couldnt get out of bed, puking, the works. With sub wd, you just kinda feel like hell- but not sick.
I would say the insomnia lasted the longest which started to get better at around the 30 day mark. After the first 10 days of detox, I was beginning to see improvements daily.
I dont regret my decision to switch to suboxone at all... I feel great today.
Im sure I left some stuff out of this post, as I am just exhausted. (Just came off a long flight) Im in Kuwait for the next few days, but feel free to shoot me a PM if you have any questions that I can help you out with!
Henry
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