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Does anyone have a question
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Does anyone have a question

Hey guys, I was able to post this morning, but I figured I would take this spot and allow anyone and everyone to use it as an open forum to ask questions and not worry about breaking the thread.  So, if you have a question, ask it?? Good luck to all of you and in the words of our own "forum leader"

"Keep an angel on your shoulder"

GWH
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gwh:
i'm too much of an anarchist to be a leader! i just wanna' hang
with you guys and exchange expierence, knowledge, about addiction, and recovery there of.

now lets see recovery....i got up at 3:30 this morning and have yet to "dose with anything today" and feel "mostly ok" ....i hope i've finished with a bup detox any way, as i won't have another day of it...

if one exams past threads, they will notice abcense of leadership  
is definite characteristic of this forum...it does seem to have
it's cycles too!

so anyhow to everyone how about a big "howdy from an old cow town
on the dirty mo. (the one north of another dirty old cow town on
the mo. (hey i'm also living in a former ground zero!)

i'm still cussing the dawn, and everything else unjust and wrong
i just wonder somedays what the ____and does any of this make a
difference to any one else...it can really get to to seem futile.
ya' know all we really have on our side is our ability to change,
and friends who want the same...

keep an angel on your shoulder
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How do you want to change?  You have chronic pain, and will you continue to treat that?  Your wisdom would be a good quality as a leader, if others think we need one.  You express much experience, strength and hope.  As I understand this, you periodically detox, then you will go back to treating your chronic pain, correct?  
It makes sense to me.  You want to give your body and mind a break from the chemicals.  I am stuck on the methadone for a couple of weeks, then I will decrease by 20mg over a month.  I have to do this slowly, as I am working.  Also for my mental health, I think the slower way will probably be most helpful.
I have yet to find my tarot cards.  I will purchase another set as soon as I can afford it.  It should be within a few weeks.
I follow Yung's philosophy of reading for myself.  I think it will be helpful.  I never told you I rekindled a friendship from
my alma mater.  Actually we have been friends since age 3 or 4 years old.  It is long distance but so fulfilling.  I hope all is well with you and I.R.  Good luck and Blessings, Angst
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ava:
one thing bout kip, ain't nobody that hasn't got something i need.
addict's crave and desire to connect with other addicts, using, in
recovery, relapsed...ya know the whole wheel of change. change is
the only "true reality" there is. at this point in my life, i find
i need to draw from friends who want to adapt change....

keep an angel on your shoulder
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Thanks for your wisdom.  I understand people who want change.  Some people bore quite easily.  Transition affects all of us.
I wonder when the drugs no longer satisfy the place in one's life, you have to change.  Not always a choice, sometimes it is.
What is adventageous to me, may not be for everyone else.  I do not like to take anyone along with me on that.   Thanks and best wishes.  Angst
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Hey... I just got back in town from the big M [Minneapolis]-- so I Just got your message from Saturday! How goes the detox? feeling O.K.?
This is the big week, as my Aunt is moving down here from the Minnesota. Got a house by beaver lake.. Pretty nice. She's been weaning down on the Morphine, and hopefully, we'll get her onto Ultram... At least she'll be out of the "Cloud" she's been on for the last year. It's amazing how much of her personality is returning with the reduced dose she's on right now.

By the way, when you detox, do you rotate your Meds when you go back on them? I mean, do you have one month with Oxys, detox, then go to something else?

Anyway, have a great (if not hotter than HELL) day!
and keep the Keeshound on the shoulder!
Jess
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Hi there, Ava!

Glad to see you're doing/feeling O.K.

I just wanted to know how you're going about the reduction of the Methadone Maintenance. It would scare the hell out of me to start the reduction, but I have no experience with Meth withdrawals. The worst I've ever had to deal with is about a week of hell coming down from 30-50 (YES) Ultram per day. I didn't taper, as I didn't have the will not to pop them all into my mouth if I had them! So I had my week of hell with the runs, shakes, depression, etc, etc.. But I found that high doses of 5htp and KavaKava helped me greatly. I wish you the best of luck with your situation, and I'm glad that the Meth saved your life (regarding the Dilaudid addiction)...

Love to you...
Jess
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Hello everyone. Good idea on the open forum. I can ask a couple
of stupid questions and not feel bad. What is antaganist. Also
what is bilingual and one more I see all the time. What is exactly is half-live. I see these words all the time but don't
really know what they are.
Thanks
Tom
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to answer one question, I think you mean "sublingual" and I believe that is a pill which is put under the tongue until disolved, rather then injected. "half-life" I believe is the amount of time a substance stays within your system after the initial intake.  So, thats my take on those 2 terms, "antagonist" I'm not to sure of............... but skipper or someone else can post the answers....................
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Hey, Everyone!

Face it.... WHen we were using, it was FUN. Yes, it took a lot of time making sure we had our supplies, BUT-- it WAS fun. I find myself really bored during the evenings. I've got a great job that keeps me pretty busy during the day, but those HOURS at home sure tick by SLOWLY. I go to 3 or 4 AA meetings per week for something to do, and they DO help keep the Booze and drug cravings away, BUT, does anyone have any other suggestions for things to do for a recovering addict? The constant seeking was a game that took hours per day to play......

Anyone?

Thanks,
Jess
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tom:
bilingual means ability to speak two languages.
sub-lingual means under tounge. i believe both words derive from
the latin "lingus" for tounge

half life in pharmacology half life is the amount of time for 1/2
of the total amount of a specific amount of drug to be metabloized
out of you system. methadone has a long half life. oxycodone a
short.
antagonist....in drugs a substance that Ties up receptors without
activating them. naloxone is a narcotic antaganost that ties up
mu (i believe) receptors. it's value is life saving in an overdose
situation. another antagonist is used like antibuse for opioids. i
believe naltrexone is being used this way

keep an angel on your shoulder
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jess:
if you don't want to be board, then don't!!
3902615
it's too damm hot to put my dog on my shoulder and besides he goes
all Bob Snarlly on me.

keep an angel on your shoulder
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hey gwh , your opening was very clever, on top of that it has been a good reading all thet down.
it is sreaming hot and humid here in philly,
but life is good,
I once read some where " the man who reads is seldom bored"
as we stay clean our life may be boring at first, but then it
get's so busy with responsabilites , that we soon will wish for bordom.
every one is different , and i know some people have sever back
pain that can be life changing.

peace to all, and thanks for being here, we need ya.
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Just got home from work and found message from my sister.  She is frantic because she has to undergo a drug test tomorrow for work and she said she "slipped" and did use an opiate 7-8 days ago.  She swears she has increased her attendence at NA but does not want to lose her job.  Does anybody know if its possible that opiate will show up after this length of time?  She really has been doing well and I would hate to see her lose her job.  Thanks everyone.
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hey anyone:
like i said i just wannna' hang with you guys....so far no opiates
of any kind....i feel "ok"!!! going to see pain psych. tomarrow...

there is something bothering at me....and i can't even put it into
words.....i only hope i get it worked out before tomarrrow. my pain
psych "freebe." tomarow at university med center! i'm real tired of
all this pain clinic/addiction/keep/lid/on............!

keep an angel on your shoulder
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Hi,
I'm new to the forum.  It's taken me a few days to get the courage to write down what I've been going through.  And let me say as everyone else who enters this forum does that your support and respect for each other is very apparent.

I started taking Vicodin about seven...had a root canal, etc., and realized that my addictive personality enjoyed taking them a little too much.  I am an on-again off-again user.  I will go to the doctor for "back pain" (there is some here and there but I don't need drugs for it) and I'm on my way within a couple of hours with a prescription.  Once I realized how easy it was, I took advantage.  Okay...this is the hardest part - the part I've never confessed.  I went through my head the other day of how many pills I've probably taken - not only from prescriptions, but from friends' cabinets.  I think I've stolen pills from just about every friend of mine.  Of course I would always justify it..."well, they're not using them."  "Am I stealing if I take aspirin out of their cabinet?"  Anyway, I guess you could call me a binger.  I have a very addictive personality.  If I get a bottle of Vicodin, it's gone within a few days.  The most I've taken in a day was nine, but I'll throw down a few beers with them too and convince myself I can handle it.  The truth is that I'm tired of counting pills, tired of binging every few months.  
I have a five month old who is the most important thing in my life, and a wonderful husband who knows I've "dabbled" but has no idea to what extent I've stolen, lied and cheated.  
I went on another binge this last month and probably took 60-80 pills within a 30 day period.  I knew I'd feel like **** for three days once I ran out, but I convinced myself I could handle it.  I was even taking it easy this time, trying to limit my intake to three a day once I realized I don't feel the pills after a certain amount.  Funny enough, this was the worst time I've had yet!  I had horrible cramping, two days of the runs, awful depression, basically the flu.  I'm feeling good today (day five), but I just don't want to do this anymore!  Can anyone give me some words of wisdom and encouragement?  Sorry to ramble, but this is the first time I've gotten it all out!

Thanks :)
Lexie 3
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Just checking in with you. How are you? Please keep posting. I'm sorry I haven't responded to your posts. I've been out all week with Strep throat. Yuck..but I didn't use! I really want to see how you did this weekend. Whether your pill free or not, you belong here. Just wanted to let you know I was thinking about you. Hugs
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welcome, i to was addicted to vicidin, and was taken
4 or 5 a day for severe\ pain in rotator cuff s , i two operations, well when the doc stoped the  giving me the pain meds , i continued to take them , i got them on the sreet.
some where in the 2nd year i crossed a line and stsrted to take like 10 to twenty pills a day , i i kept trying to stop, with know sucsess , untill i found this fourm and started to find out what i was going through, and a way out with out going to a rehab or a detox,
i have been clean since good friday around aprial 1 /02
I have been takeing the  receipe, known on the fourm as thoma's receipe
l-tyrosine 500mg 8 tims a day, week 1 after that 4 times a day.
b-6 100 mg 2 times a day
vit. A - C  and e
calsium-magnisum
magnesse
phousphous
copper
a strong multy vitamine
  in the 1st week imoudium for the run,s whitct deplete us of most of our nutreints and add to the pain of withdraswls.

bannas help  a lot with leg spasams and rest less leg syndrome.
gatoraide helps with replaceing lost electrolites.

the best thing about the receipe for me is how it took away the severe depression, from withdrawls.  the depression was a big stumbling block for me during those times i tried to kick on my own.

good luck and keep posting  , i wish you well, and rember you are not alone.


peaxce  -------michael
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thank you! now i have the recipe. i was taking 20 10mg hydrocodone (any or all kinds) plus i was taking about 20 soma at night until my husband died from them. i'm down to aroung 6 hydros aday. thats pretty good for me. i don't have any real pain i'm just an addict. but who knows i may have severe arthrist(spelling?)  i wouldn't know cause i've been taking lots of pills every day for about 3-4 years.
anyway, thank you .  jeanie
p.s. i'm going through some really bad withdrawals right now! i haven't had a puill since yesterday around 2:00pm. but i took around 25 mg of a 100mg moraphine pill last night. it was all i had.
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is this how?   jeanie
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I had to leave right after I posted that question. I didn't have
time to thank ya'll for the response. By the way I did mean
sublingal. Thanks again I see those terms in most of the posts
now I know what they mean.
Tom
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where are you?  i thought you were going to stop lurking and show your face?   come on...you can do it:)
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jeaniec:
yup, ya'got it!
keep an angel on your shoulder
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I still can't believe you go to Richardsons.........but anyway, I went to Dr. Kishores office, YOU WERE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT!! First of all they had the Secretary Nazi, He was this latin American guy who was just so fuckn rude.  He kept telling me to call Blue Cross to get my "PCP" number, I kept asking what for, do I need a referral?? He said no.  The Whole time he was trying to get me to switch my primary/family Dr. to having Dr. Kishore as my Dr. I paid my Co-pay of $15 and never saw the Dr. So I asked for it back, he wouldn't give it to me.  To make a long ugly story short. I got infront of the 2 of them, the secr. and the Nurse Practitioner and told them to go **** themselves, ripped the money out of his hands and then tore up all the paper work I signed, the lady started yelling and out of nowhere I told her a few things........... god, NEVER AGAIN
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jeaniec:
whats up? i told you i'ld check on ya. please post

keep an angel on your shoulder
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Hey Jesse,  I am doing well.  I have not started to really detox.
I got to a level where I am functioning well.  No cravings or using dreams, do looking at arms and feet for good veins to hit, and not thinking about the drug.  I wanted to stay here for a little while.  But in the next couple of weeks I will have to detox down by 10mg/every week or two, until I am down twenty or thirty mg/day.  I plan to take things slow since I am working.
Once I am on 60mg/day or 70mg/day,  I will stay for a month.  Then detox again to 40mg/day or 50mg/day, and that is livable for a little while if I need to stay there for a couple of months.  Then I will probably start detoxing by 5mg/day for a month, etc... until I am off the methadone.
Last time I detoxed, I was not working.  I could do a fast detox.
I could not have worked or left the house a lot except for NA meetings.  The stomach ills are terrible, you have anorexia, and sleep little.  You have muscle spasms (hot baths are great, hot and cold sweats, and the jerks.  It is harder to detox than from dilaudid straight out, but you have a time away from the people, places and things.  You also learn how other people were hurt.  I was killing myself on dilaudid.  I want to complete this program where I will not ever go back to that needle.  I do and will use NA meetings for support.  Thanks for asking.  You are clean right now, right?  Post me back and let me know how it goes with you.   Good luck and Blessings, Ava
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angst:
go slow off methadone...from what i've seen the slower the detox,
the higher successs rate. if you stay tough and on course while having dose reduced, you'll come out equipped when 0 day comes.

i don't know what the **** i'm doing...day 2 off bup and oxy...i
feel physically real good. emotionally i feel somewhat shaky yet.
i see this pain psychologist phd at the med center. i've since
switched pain clinic's for dosing, but stuck on as needed with
this guy.

i have become increasingly aware of this horid price my wife has
had to pay for my pain control. i beilieve somethinged like sucked into the vortex of addiction, etc.

if it wasn't for the pain...i'ld walk me so far down the road from dope and his buddy jones. hell 37 years ago i'ld have put myself to heaven with all the oxy going thru me when i'm on now. 37 years ago i didn't have a wife, stepson, aged parents.....the point is all this dope running thru me....and i've never been so unhappy....

so i'm at the point...i don't have to change, decide...but maybe
i beter look at my options to change. the smart money says to-
marrow i'll come home with hundreds of oxycontin and ir. i really
wish there were other options for pain control. i am not leading
a normal life, and even worse i feel i prevent my wife from lead-
ing one!
(how totally unhipp or hype)

so thats where i'm at horid pain and emotional pain too!! i hope
i figure something out before tomarrow.

did you know that "Dil" in to kill a mocking bird was Truman Cap-
ote? Harper Lee was the first female author in america that de-
manded immediate respect.

keep an angel on your shoulder
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Somebody, please help me...  I posted a message in "Meth any1 else", and I really need someone.  I can't do anything today.  My kids are driving me crazy, my house is a mess, and I'm going nuts.  I don't know what to do...
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I hope you are feeling better.  Welcome to the forum.  You are in withdrawls now.  Why not go all the way and get rid of any hydro's you are taking?  Try the recipe offered on this post.  If it gets to bad, you can go to the ER for a few needed meds for short term use only.  NA or AA can give you the support you need.  People from all walks of life are afflicted with addiction
I hope the best for you.  Keep posting so we will know how you are.  Posting while you are in withdrawls would take your mind from the physical woes.  In this forum is a collection of wonderful advice, support, encouragement and hope.  The group is greater than any one person.  Keep Posting.  Good luck.  Ava
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I read your post, and unfortunately, I think the 3 day detox off of methadone just isn't gonna cut it. you have 2 choices, 1 is to deal with the withdrawal, which I is differen't for everyone, so don't always expect the worst. Or 2, work with more methadone to taper down........... The patch and xanax will help, but do you have enough, and you also need to be careful as xanax is addictive as well.  do you have money to buy whatever you need?? If not, I would just take the step and go through the withdrawals the next few days.............. good luck, keep posting, we will be here.

gwh
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Thank you both for your help.  This message board has helped me get through the last few days.  I'm feeling a lot better each day.  That's my problem - I go through three days of w/d's, go for a month or so without any hydros and then tell myself (or I listen to that little voice that tells me) just to get "one more pill"
Again, this forum has been a huge help.  I can't tell you how nice it is to really relate to everything that everyone has said in the threads.  I feel like I'm not the only one out there with this secret.  When I'm going to the doctor to get some more, I always feel guilty and I know what I'm doing is wrong and not good for me or for my future.  I don't have anymore vicodin left and I have set my mind to saying I just won't do them anymore.  I do have xanax and will use that if I need it.
Thanks so much for your help and inspiring words.  Again, it's nice to know I'm not alone.  I will certainly keep posting and will keep reading to keep my mind set on what I need to do.
Thank you!
L3
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You know that during detox, we go through deep guilt.  It is part
of the detox.  I've never known a person with responsibilities not experience the guilt of what we put others through during our time on the pain control or addiction or both.  I've learned to expect that.  I.R. supports you, right?  With your pain, although you want change, you may have to stay on an opiate for control.  There are spinal blocks, but I do not know if that is even an option for you or the pump which excretes the medication right to the sight of pain.  
I think you know what it takes for you to have any quality of life.  Sometimes we have to compromise.  I hate doing that.  I wish life could allow us to be more pure.  Truth is there more than black and white, gray area is where it all falls.  
Good luck, Kip.  I trust you to make the right decision for you and your family.  Also, few things are forever, if any.
Keep posting.  You are the angel on my shoulder.   Angst
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Welcome to the forum.  Please expand on your problem here in this
area where we are posting.  Maybe we can help.  We will offer the experience strength and hope that we as addicts possess.  There is no better than one addict helping another.  Please post again.   Ava
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Most of us need more support.  Try NA or AA.  In NA, they really try to support one another.  You also get some answers that are hard to take, but you can take it the spirit of love-tough love.
I want you to know that you do not have to do this alone.  We are here in cyberspace.  Keep Posting, but NA is real.  In my home group, we have book study of the basic text and It Works: How and Why twice a week.  So you learn to change people , places, and things.  You also make new acquaintances.  Good luck,
Ava
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Thanks for answering...  I just called my guy.  The physical stuff hasn't even f-ing started yet, and I'm going crazy.  I've gained 50 lbs since I started methadone, and I am so bloated I don't know what to do.  I'm going to try to taper, but that's usually hard for me.  My husband is such a solid citizen, and he swore that if I ever got into anything again (he's known about three times - two of which I didn't really quit) he'd put me in rehab or leave with my kids, so I can't have him help.  When do the physical w/ds start with methadone?  I'm really just fine right now, but waiting.  I dont' have a ton of $$ for more done but I have about 8 fentanyl patches and 100 xanax.  That's not my drug of choice, so I won't have trouble with that.  Can anyone tell me how long til the w/ds start and then really how long the worst 'flu' is???  Thanks soooo much for being here!!!
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usually the withdrawal start almost 48 hours after your last dose, with your high dose it may take longer, for example.  If you took something on sunday night, most likely wed. morning will be the beginning of the worst. That doesn't mean you won't feel any discomfort until wed. that just means it will really kick in as the methadone leaves your system.  I don't remember the post, but I believe you were on a relatively low dose of vicodin daily. Well, comparatively to all of us. Just to let you know, I was taking 160mg of oxycontin a day, or the equivelant with vic's, I used to take vic's all day, up to 20 a day, but I could never get them down, I would choke and throw up, so I stuck with oxys, first chewing them, and then blowing them, never injected anything and I never will, however, I blew 120mg at once a while back.................. so, I'm no expert, but i'm not a novice either............
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I was doing up to 60 7.5 or 10mg. vics a day when I was doing vics...  Most of the time I did about 30.  I've been on meth for about a year, and flucuated in my dose...  sometimes up to 100, but rarely.  Mostly about 30.  How do I taper?  I usually do it once a day, or sometimes every other.  I'm freaked about getting HepB from it.  I said in my other post that it isn't clean...  people get it from the center and hold it in their mouths until they're outside and then spit it into a bottle, so who knows what the hell I might get.  Could I possibly get AIDS that way?  I don't think so, but now that I had HepB, I'm afraid.  I'm pretty freaked about the whole thing, and so pissed that I got myself into this again!!!  I think the psych w/ds are as bad for me as the physical...  any advice?
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A few other things I've been thinking about...  EVERYONE is trying to get me to go to the Doctor because of this weight gain, and I can't tell the doctor the truth (I'm sure it's from the methadone) and so what's the point of going.  If this gets on my inusurance record, my husband's job could be in peril, and he doesn't even know about this time.  I feel like I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place and I just don't know where to even begin to get out.  I want to stop, but I'm such a baby about not feeling good and the psychological addiction is the worst.  Can people get through this without rehab???  Is anyone here?  :(
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Ok, if you get more meth, do not get it that way, thats awful and not worth the risk.  I have never heard of someone taking all the methadone at once, usually throughout the day, so i don't know how that will alter the detox, however, if you were to taper down, you would need to do it over a month, atleast!! so if thats not doable then its time to suck it up and go through the withdrawals for a week and be done with it, fight like hell!! non of us want to be here, you can do this, trust me you can.  And yes, the mental withdrawals are just as bad, but thats why you need to suffer physically, that way you will not want to go through it again, you know?? Anyway, keep it up, keep posting, we will all help, but most of ull, keep your spirit high, and learn to laugh at yourself in a constructive way..........

GWh
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Hi there list people.  I've been readingn the list for the past thrree of four days, and I guess I need to talk about what's going on in my life.  Before you get started, be warned, This is a LONG post!  I'm a pill junkie-- I lost my left leg ibn a car wreck 10 years ago, and have been on one kind of pain-killer, or another (usually a few different kinds at once...) since then.

Right now, I'm being prescribed: 40mg Oxycontin, 6 per day; 5mg Oxy-IR, 8 per day; Vicoprofen, 6 per day; and a few other non-narcotic scripts that don't really do jack, anyway.  Of course, I have three diffenrent doctors writing these scripts for me, since I can't get enough meds from just one doc.  I KNOW that tghis can get me in big trouble, but I just need the damn pills.  I usually go through my 90 oxy's (a month's supply) in about a week (about 10-15 pills per day...) and then work through the IR's, and finally the Vikes, 'till everything is gone.  When I can't get scripts, I go to the city and pick up a few bundles of dope to get me through 'till my next refill.  

I'm NOT trying to kid myself, or anyone else here: I KNOW I'm a junkie.  Even though I hold down a job (a pretty well-paying one, at that) and provide for my wife and daughter, I know that the salad days are gonna end.  I know I can't keep this up forever.  I've been on huge doses of this **** for 10 years, and my body just keeps wanting more and more.  Yeah, I know-- I can keep chasing that high forever, and it will just keep getting more and more elusive-- I know.  But I DON'T take the pills JUST for the high-- they DO help with the pain.  I have something called RSD (Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy) that is so painful-- I really don't know what to do, anymore.  

Three years ago, or so, I came clean to my wife about the pills: Iw as out of pills, and hadn't yet discovered Heroin, and decided that I was goping to check into a Detox to get off the pills for good.  We almost got divorced over the whole thing, but I made it through a 2-week detox.  I got out of there feeling GOOD-- I was determined to stay off the pills for good.  I took my first Vike 3 days after getting out.  Sure, I rationalized that THSI TIME I'd only take the pills the way the Docs prescribed them (one every 4-6 hours) and as soon as I felt the slightest bit "itchy" I'd STOP again.  You guys all know what happened...

So, here's my problem:  I KNOW that I have to stop taking the Oxy and the IR and the Vikes (and especially the freakin' horse) but I don't want to lose my wife, my job, and everything that I've worked so hard for, and hold so dear.  My wife already told me, and I KNOW she means it, that if the pills ever become a problem again, it'll be MY problem alone, since she'll be filing for divorce.  I can't blame her.

I tried to taper myself off the vikes, weaning myself off them slowly.  The only problem with that is that I have no one to hold my pills for me-- I always give myself an extra pill (hell, an extra DOSE) when I ask.  I'm really good to my junkie side, like that.  I'm still taking 4 or 5 doses of 5 pills a day.  I tried yesterday to knock it down to 4 pills per dose, butI only held out for  10 minutes before I popped the extra tab.

What in god's name can I do to control my pain, but also get out of this crazy cycle of destruction that I'm on?  It wasn't this bad untill last year when I discovered both Oxycontin (I was on MS Contin, orally) could be crushed and snorted, and that if I ran out of PRESCRIBED meds, I could go to Newark and buy dope.  I'm so worried that it's futile...

Any suggestions?

Lastleg
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ok, I got a few questions, #1, do you shoot the oxy's or do you blow them?? When you say your buying dope, do you mean heroin, or do you mean something else...?? Its hard to understand exactly what you mean......................  Anyway, you sound like an intelligent guy, and you sound like you have gone ghough a lot, however, are you really serious about stopping?? And how bad is the phyiscal painthe pain that you need to manage through the meds, and be truthful here, don't lie to yourself or us because if you really do need to stay on the meds for the pain, then you should speak to skip, hes great with this stuff.  Anyway, you know just as well as we do, your in for another long trip.  anyway, keep your head up, and stay focused, this will be hard but very much DOABLE!!!!!!!!!!!, but YOU HAVE TO WANT TO TO IT, I mean that.............................

GWH
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Angst, going down 5mg a day on the methadone is way too fast.  You should go down 5 or 10 mg every week or two.
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GWH-- Okay, I've never shot anything up.  The only needles I've ever had have been Demerol in the hospital.  I don't know if I could ever stick myself... I'm kind of a ***** like that.  I crush and snort the oxys.  Yes, the dope I've been buying is heroin.  A "Friend" of mine introduced me to it about 6 months ago, and it "solved" the "problem" of running out of pills.

Thanks for replying-- I DO want to quit, but I'm so afraid that I'm gonna relapse because of the pain.  Even when I went to detox, the doc there told me that I would always need to be on some kind of pain med, and that I needed to work on taking the scripts the way they were prescribed (Like that will EVER be possible fo me) instead of taking them in an "abusive manner."

I know it sounds weird, that I like the high I (try to) get from the pills, but I also need them for my pain.  It's true; but it sounds like I'm blowing smoke up your ass.  You know, If I spent HALF the energy that I spend procuring, planning to procure, seeing doctos, and filling scrpits, working at my job, I'd be the owner of the company.  It drives me crazy..

Thanks,

Lastleg (aka Andy)
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i can relate to your situation,
i did the herion thing when i ran out of pills.
i had real pain when i began with the pills 3 years ago.
at some point my pain got better but my pill intake went through
the roof.
ive been clean for 12 weeks , but looking back , my body seemed to generate pain, and tell me i need more pain killers,
at this point there was no getting high at all , it was just about being able to function, every time i tried to kick
by myself , i went through torture with the with drawls,
the depression was a killer, and the lack of energy was like a endless black hole, the drugs were sucking the life out of me.
i thought i was going to die  sooner or later.

then i found this fourm, i was still useing but i wanted to stop,
i started to read and reread all the post....
i guess it's when reddiness meet oppertuntiy.
thomas's receipe seemd to give me hope , as i began taking it,
it has been getting better since.

peace
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andy:
welcome to the forum,always room for just one more addict in here,
so come on in.

your problem is very near mine. i was a recovering opiate usere and
then neck surgery twice and oxy for rest of life. taking medicine
as perscribed.....it's the most difficult thing you will ever do.

keep posting
keep an angel on your shoulder
kip
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I am in the same boat that you are.  I must take meds or else the pain would be too intense.  I have had two spinal fusions that didn't quite work out.  It is not wierd that you like to get high from your meds.  Who doesn't?  But, if you truly need the meds, then you must be disciplined about taking them properly or else suffer.  There aren't many options available to you.  After running out early time after time again, I finally became sick of it all and somehow managed to get a grip on things.  I am not going to lie to you and say I don't take more than I should at times, because I do.  But, if I don't take them responsibly, my tolerance is just going to go through the roof.  Then, it wouldn't matter if I took them as prescribed or not.  My tolerance would be too high for the prescribed amount to hold me or even touch the pain.  For your own good, try to hold yourself to your prescribed amount.  If you go a little crazy on a certain day, then be prepared to take a little less on the other day.  Do what you must to get through the month.  If the pain is too much without them, then you have no other choice.  Good luck.
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Brickie, first welcome and please know we all understand your fears and everything else you're going through. I've been here several months since I got clean. Haven't posted much the past two weeks because we just moved.
The weight gain is from the pills. I'm a small person and bloated so much (not to mention the sweet cravings) I gained a good 30 pounds. Once you're off the pills, it will leave you quickly. One good thing about detox.
You're afraid of rehab but I think it could be the best thing. Yes, you can detox on your own. But even if you get through it you're going to need help in the form of NA or something similar. This is a disease; I firmly believe that. It might be embarrassing to seek help, but it can give you your life back, your family back, and is worth it. That said, I went to rehab the first time I detoxed. It was really just an inpatient detox for 4 days, but did have meetings. I wasn't ready and went back to using. But those meetings stuck in my head. What I learned was important. Your brain chemistry changes from using and you need to understand all the physical stuff, along with the mental/emotional reasons you're using. There is nothing to be ashamed of in seeking help. But also stick around here and talk it out. That helps, a lot.
You can do this. I got clean off a big hydro habit. It's been three months and I feel great. I remember all I used to do, when I wasn't flying around the house high as a kite or stressing over everything, was lay my ass in bed. Now I get up, cook, clean, act like a normal person. It feels great. I had a great, exciting job that I had to leave not long before I quit using, as part of my general breakdown. I almost lost my family, too. I left it all behind. I'm stronger than I've ever been. I never thought I could live without pills, but now I know I can't live with them. Cravings come and go, but basically I know how much better life is now and I cherish it.
Let us know how you are. If you want to talk, holler my way and we can write. I have three young children and could barely deal with them before; now I'm a normal mom again. I feel like I have my second life. I did it this time with no help, but wouldn't have thought twice about rehab if I could have afforded it. Just a pep talk from someone who's been there.
tracy
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I'm sorry for your pain. My father-in-law lost both legs and suffered terribly. If you will have to take pain meds, you need to be under the care of someone who understand both addiction and pain management. That's what I did when I was still in chronic pain. Have you tried buprenex? For me it was very effective for pain relief and because it is a partial antagonist, whenever I tried to take viks or something similar with it, it didn't work. You can't take too much or it loses effectiveness.
You sound like you've hit bottom. That's a good place to be because you only have one way to go, and that's up. Sounds trite, huh? But it's really true. For many of us, we have to get to that point before we can make lasting changes.
You've overcome major obstacles before, and you've made it through with a good job and I'm sure a wonderful family. You can make it through this. Keep posting and you will find support to grab onto. You can make it to the other side and trust someone who's there - it's a much better place to be. I can't tell you how much better life is without drugs. The funny thing is, when I took something for migraines after being clean, I got physically sick. Literally my stomach hurt and my head felt fuzzy; no good high, it just sucked. Like my brain chemistry had altered again and drugs no longer felt good. I'm thankful! It really helped get the cravings under control. Yes, I still think about those first highs, but I know they're gone for good.
Best of luck and keep posting and please, let us know how you're doing.
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Hi Brickie. My email is down right now so I can't right. I know how you feel about seeking excitement. I did that, too. In fact I had an excitement-junkie's job, which gave me my fix. I miss that. But normal life is much better and you can find other outlets.
It's ironic that you said you think I'm strong. I actually believe that, now. But three months ago when I was in the midst of all this I felt like all the strength had been sucked right out of me and I was a pathetic weakling. Somehow I found a kernel and built on that, though. When I was detoxing and even after, I felt so shitty I couldn't stand myself. I remembed the ten years I spent working 50+ hour weeks while I went to college full-time and tried to raise three babies. I was so strong at the time, I thought I could do anything. Once I'd accomplished that the drugs found me, or I found them, and it was downhill from there. During those dark days of detox I thought I'd lost all that, but actually I found it again and feel better than ever, like I can take on a lot but realistically this time, facing my shortcomings (which are many!). I'm trying to do that and am rebuilding my life.  You can too.
The drugs take your strength, your life, everything. You will find any excuse to keep using until you just can't anymore. I did things I'm horribly ashamed of, but at the same time that's what made me who I am now. Face it and move on. Don't wallow in your mistakes.
The only way to get through this is by making a decision to do it and working at it every day. Even when you feel like ****, which you will. Know that it gets better. We are all proof of that. Days I wanted to die I felt so hopeless, and that was after the detox. Like a pathetic weakling. But here it's less than three months later and I'm a normal person again, who loves life. You can too. Just put one foot in front each step of the way, even when you know how easy it would be to fall back. Do it for your kids, your family, but most of all for yourself. Has to be for yourself.
I wanted so bad to be a good mother again. Felt this tremendous responsibility that was like a noose at times. And I was so inadequate. But those girls loved me through it all, and now I'm giving back to them. You have to decide what's important. Trust me, you'll find excitement in other ways. Let's talk. Email me at ***@**** and I will write back today when my service is back up. Start today and soon you'll be past the worst of this nightmare.
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You're absolutely right it's repulsive!!!  I just try so hard not to think about it, but it makes me want to vomit when I do.  How can something have this much of a hold on me!?  I'm so meticulous with my children, myself, my house...  if you knew me,you'd NEVER think that I could do something so disgusting.  Actually, if you saw me on the street, you'd never guess that I'm an f'ing sewer-living junkie.  How do I even start to find a doctor who would be sympathetic?  And I'm afraid that my husband's insurance co. will find out, and right on down the line...  I have to just stop.  As I mentioned before, I have about 8 fentanyl patches and plenty of xanax.  I'll just have to do it.  Is there *anything* I can do when I get that crazy urge that's so bad I'll do almost anything?  Count to 100?  Watch the clock?  What?  I heard once that you can scream NO in your head...  what else?  How long do those crazed urges last?  What was/is your drug of choice and how long have you been clean, etc.?  What's your story? Thanks SOOO much for being here for me.  And thanks for telling me that it's repulsive.  Now that I've told someone, I sort of can't believe that I"ve been doing that for a YEAR!!!!  WHY, WHY, WHY am I like this???
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Hey, tce37--

What WAS your question? I don't think I ever saw it! Post it again up here, and let's see if it stays.... I think one of my postings got deleted in the past, but I think it's very RARE, and I don't think anyone deleted it on purpose unless it was "Vulgar" or was and advertisement for a "Drug site"... Those are the only type that I know that they delete....

Jess
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lets not jump the gun and be so judgemental, non of us "posters" have the authority, nor the power to delete any question and or post, so it without a doubt was not us, your barking up the wrong tree.  YOU ARE MORE THEN WELCOME TO JOIN US, THE MORE THE MERRIER, PLEASE POST AGAIN, we are eager to help you out.  So what do you say you take back that last post so we can start on the right foot.  With that being said, "welcome to the forum, where there is always room for 1 more junky"  So whats up, how can we help.

GWH
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I"m not clean yet, I have continuously tried to get sober over the last 5 months, I get closer and closer ever time, relapse is par of the process. The key to my progress is, when I fall down, I get up and keep moving forward, refusing to take any drug for a high. When I take something, lets say oxycontin, 40mg pill, I still cut into 4 pieces and swallow only 10mg, so I"m consistently trying to taper off, now I'm finally getting to the end, my tolerance is low, I'm losing the urge to get "high" and I'm too damn determined to go back to the OC's.  Well, my drug of choice are the opiates, most often Oxycontin, I could take anywhere from 120mg a day to 200mg a day, and if I didn't have those i would take as many vicodin as I had, and If I was completely out of opiates, I would find ridalin and or cocaine and keep going with that until I found something.  Then I would take xanax, valium or Klonopin to go to bed................... so I have done many things, of which I'm not proud, but honest.  I refuse to give in this time.  I may stumble, I may relapse but I will sure as hell never go back to buying drugs to get high, I can literally feel my body changing, I don't like the high anymore.  Ive taken too much.  I could blow an 80mg oxy and just get tired.......... my body has had enough.  Well you definitely have enough patches and xanax, your going to have to except 5 days of hell, use the patch and the xanax as needed, basically you should just use the meds to make you sleep through most of the withdrawal, the first 3 or 4 days, then move on from there.  its very hard but DOABLE!!!!!!!!!

GWH
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HI TO WHOM RESPONDED,
I POSTED A LETTER FRIDAY AND IT HAD NO DRUG SELLING AT ALL IT HAD
MY STORY OF WHAT WAS GOING ON IN MY LIFE WITH DRUGS AND I HAD ASKED ABOUT HOW TO DETOX OFF OF THESE PILLS,SO IF THAT OFFENDED
SOMEONE ,WELL SORRY ALTHOUGHT MY STORY IS NOT ANY DIFFERENT
THAN ANY OTHERS THAT I HAVE READ.SECOND I DONT THINK THAT ONE OF THE READERS OR PEOPLE OUT THERE DELETATED MY POST, I DONT KNOW WHO CAN OR WHO CANT, ALTHOUGHT NO BIG DEAL,I WAS JUST WONDERING
WHO MIGHT HAVE DID THIS.BECAUSE I THINK MY ADDICTION IS OUT OF
CONTROL SO LET ME START AGAIN.I AM A 37 YR OLD MALE WHO IS
HOOKED ON OXYS,VICKES,LORSCET BEEN DOING THEM FOR EVER IT
SEEMS 6TO7YRS WELL DO HAVE TO MUCH OF A PROBLEM GETTING THEM
NO MONEY PROBLEM,OR I AM NOT IN ANY TROUBLE WITH THE LAW.
ALTHOUGH MY HEALTH IS STARTING TO GO DOWN HILL,BONES ACHE,STOMACH
PAINS,YOU ALL KNOW WHAT I MEAN ETC,WELL IF ANYBODY WOULD LIKE
TO POST A REPLY,IT WOULD BE HELPFUL,THANKS

JUNE 26 02      2:20 P.M.
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Hey there....

Well.... Detoxing is HELL, and people here have MANY different ways to detox. I'll tell you what helped me... I tried tapering, but that was no good, because as an ADDICT, I have NO CONTROL! So as soon as I started having just LITTLE withdrawel pains, I would pop a few more, so tapering did not work for me... I just had to wait until I was broke and unable to get any stuff, and look HELL in the face for a few days. Prepare yourself to have at least 4-5 days with no responsibilities, and have lots of Immodium, and Gatorade at the bedside. I took large doses of Kaka Kava, and it seems to help out greatly. I still take it daily, but "As directed".... I'm currently "Clean", and happy about it. Funny thing is though, if I'd had an unlimited supply of drugs, and money, I would have taken EVERYTHING to excess until I ended up dead. I KNOW I would have. So I can thank my "Higher Power" that I wasn't as successful in the music industry as a few of my friends have been!

Oh well.. That's how it goes...

Good luck to you, tce37--
Jess
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You have not offended anyone, don't sweat it, although I thought you were going to yell at us because of all the capital letters, haha.  Ok, so your 37, and you have a drug addiction with oxys, vic's perk's and all the rest.  Well you definitely fit in with our crowd.  If you could tell me how long you have been using and what amount, as well as how you take them, that would be great.  If you have already given me all the answers in this last post then forgive me, I forgot.  

Now, down to the issue at hand.  The first question is, do you really want to stop? If you do then you have a couple of choices.  Tapering is one, however, most people don't succeed as they don't have the discipline to take just enough to get by.  The other option is to use the aid of a doctor and slowly taper with his/her help.  The 3rd is to suck it up and go through a week of hell!! Any way you choose will be very difficult.  I myself don't use the recipe but many others find it extremely helpful, if you need the recipe let me know and I will try to post it.

Just so you know, I was taking up to 200mg of oxy a day, or about 20-30 vic's a day. For the last 6 months I have continuously tried to stop, and I have continued to stumble and use every so often, but I just keep going, and I can tell I'm almost there.

So I guess all that can be said is, YOU HAVE TO REALLY WANT TO STOP, you can't be telling yourself "just one my pill", that will be the end of you, you have to want to be sober more then anything in your life.  Stay positive and take the time to realize that the physical pain will soon end, and at the same time learn to appreciate the pain!! What I mean is, remember the pain your going through, don't ever forget it so that the next time you want to use, you can remember the living hell you went through and hopefully make the choice that the 1 more pill isn't worth it.  YOU CAN DO THIS, ITS DOABLE!!!!!! Keep you head up, I'll be here for you.  AND BE SAFE.........I'M SERIOUS!!

GWH
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Hi there,
Yep, sounds like you fit right in with everyone here. Welcome.

It sounds as if you are upset because a post of yours was deleted?  Sometimes that happens here for no apparent reason, and sometimes the people who moderator the forum decide that a post has inappropriate content in it. Honestly though, sometimes posts of mine have disappeared for no apparent reason.

None of the people who post on this board have the power to delete posts. The staff at medhelp do.

I haven't checked to see what got deleted, but maybe you are talking about the thread where someone asked how to pass a urine test? It wouldn't surprise me if that thread got deleted, as I'm guessing the medhelp staff would not find it appropriate to have that on an addiction recovery support forum.

Even if that was you, don't worry about it. Just keep posting and getting help with what we all share in common. There is lots of support here for you if you want. GWH is right, you have to want it really really badly, and make it top priority. It is doable.

love,
WW
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hi,gwh and jesse,
thank you for your posting i feel alot better knowing that i
am not the only one with drug problems,i miss wrote earlier
i dont have a problem getting drugs nor have i stopped.
i feel like sh t period on drugs, and i am sure i will feel worst
once i start detoxing. i took the pills by mouth did not shoot
the oxys,also i been taking alot of pills everyday at least
20 to25 vickes and lorcet 10 to 15 20mg oxys  witcheve4r i have
for that day  today i have lorcet, tomorrow i get 60 oxys.
so that means tonite what ever i have left i will do and get
really high i love the feeling but i need to stop. so if you would like to coach me thru maybe tapper on the oxys please do so
it would mean alot.  thanks


26 june 02  3:30 p.m. cst
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You mentioned that money isn't a problem.  I know that tapering is virtually impossible for many addicts, but it should at least be attempted.  Do you have anyone close to you that could dole them out to you?  You want to be on something long lasting for the taper.  Are all the strengths of oxycontin available on the street?  Actually, you didn't say how you get them.  Either way, doing a taper with vicodin is doable, but difficult.  You would want to use that at the end of the taper.  Basically, you would want to start at your normal dose.  I don't mean take what gets you high, just what keeps you 'normal'.  Stay on that dose for a week.  Then, drop 20mg and stay there for a week.  If you start to feel withdrawal symptoms, up it 10mg.  This is why is asked about the different strengths.  If you can't get them, then you can't do it this way.  But, you would want to drop 20mg a week if you can handle it, 10mg if you can't.  You want to do it this way until you get to 10mg.  From there, the vicodin comes in.  Start with 5mg four times a day for a week.  Then break them in half and take them four times a day.  From there, you could just stop, or take half three times a day, then 2 times a day, then once.  Then stop.  You have been taking these drugs for a long time.  It took a long time for you to get where you are.  In order to taper, it is also going to take awhile.  If you do it this way, you will be as comfortable as possible.  If you can stay disciplined, this will be a hell of a lot better than going cold turkey.  What is your tolerance at now?  How many pills does it take to make you feel just 'normal'?  Just so you know, I am a pain patient.  I am prescribed ms contin for my pain.  And, I am on quite a bit of it.  You can either take the taper plan, or do it the hard way.  If you have tried time and time again with no success, then methadone might be something you might want to look into.
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I just saw that you get 20mg oxycontins.  That is key.  It looks like you would be able to do that taper, as far as getting the meds is concerned.  I will also be here to help you through this.
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Of course, when I say for you to take the oxycontin, I mean swallow it whole!  Do not crush or chew it!  It just defeats the purpose.
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How you doing girl? You need to stop. Today. You might not be able to get HIV (not sure but I don't think so) but you will get something and do you really want to risk it? Do you even enjoy getting high anymore? Is it even "high" or is it just taking to feel normal? At the end I had to take pills just to function. Wasn't fun at all, except on the very rare occasion. You're worried about how you will get past the cravings. You just have to take them as they come. Some will be hell and you might even dream about using. It will consume you. But the thing is, they pass. So if you can tell yourself (I know this sounds trite) that you won't use that day - get through 24 hours. Rethink it the next day, and the next. In other words take it a day at a time. As the weeks pass it gets easier.
About the insurance. I worked for a sheriff's office and used my insurance. That's what it's there for. It's an illness like any other, but in a way a good one because you have control over the outcome. Imagine if you were dying from cancer and someone could tell you a way to stop it. Would you take it? Sure you would. Same thing here, but you actually have that choice.
If you can't do inpatient, find an addiction doctor. Tell me where you live and I'll help you. Mine was a godsend. You could even self-pay to keep it off insurance if you want to. Let me know how you're doing.
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hi people ,I hope you have room for one more addict.Im just a little guy so i should fit in. Just wanted to say to tce37 and brickie that these other wonderful people are right. It is doable and its well worth it.Im 40 and was doing the oxies everday 4 to 8 + 80,s a day or equivelent  with 20S 40S ,vikes percs or methadone what ever i could get my hands on for years. Ive been clean just over a month  and take one day at a time,sometimes one hour at a time.Its hard sometimes but it feels great to be clean. I work in a major auto factory where my drug of choice is always available and some days ita a ******* ***** not to use. But i know the first one will do me in . You have to want to be clean more than anything but it can be done.NA people loved me when i couldnt love myself. So hang in there and if you relapse get up and try again because its so worth it after you ride out the withdraws.good luck, Marty
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hi everyone,
just posting another letter to all that responed to my first
letters,and would like to thank them for there kind thought
for me in my time of living hell.i will try to tamper off
with oxys like mr. mike was talking about and give that an
honest try so that i can get my life back.so to all the other
people out there fighting this addiction hang in there and take
care of yourself,i will keep posting to keep you up to date.
                   thank-you tce37



      26 june 02  5:33 p.m. c.s.t.
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What I meant to express was go down by 5mg/day and stay there for a month or so.   Then drop another 5mg/day and stay there - like from 50 to 45 for a month then from 45 to 40 for a month, etc...   That is maybe too slow, but I sure want to ward off the most of withdrawals as I can while I am working.  I just do not have time to post as often as I used to post.  It is so good to see you back.  You are an asset to this forum.   Ava
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Welcome! As skip says, always room here. Glad to see you're doing so well. Remember how far you've come and how crappy you'll feel if you have to start over. But sounds like you're strong to look it in the face every day and stay clean. Let us know your story, and remember everyone's here for you!
tracy
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New to this kind of forum for questioning...writing in for concern over my mom's taking of oxycontin and percosets for pain.  She has been on them daily for the past 6 months, specific doses I am not sure about. However, I am afraid that she is becoming dependant on the drugs. She had disc replacement surgery Nov. 2001 on L3-L4.  She received a "dropped foot" from the surgery.  Doctors diagnose pain post-surgery as that coming from L5.  I live several states away so it is difficult for me to speak directly with the doctors, she is 63 yrs old.  I see that her personality has changed...she is extremely irritable, very irrational, and appears depressed.  When questioned about the drug use she becomes very defensive.  I took her to a Pain Management doctor that came highly recommended when she was here for a visit in May, but she was unreceptive to any of his suggestions or treatments.  He told her she was on too much pain medication.  What can I do to help my mom?
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One thing you have to know is that not all doctors share the same beliefs.  I am not saying that your mom is not on too much medication.  But, this doctor could be one who is anti-opiate.  Even being a pain management doctor, he still could be.  I have been to pain doctors that only believe in epidural injections and no opioid pain meds.  Each doctor should practice a wide range of treatments.  Not every patient should be on opioid pain medication, but some should.  How much pain is your mom in?  If she is still in pain, this could explain her irritability.  It also could be the meds.  What is her quality of life without the meds?  Don't be alarmed she is on meds every day.  Oxycontin is labeled for every day use.  It provides 'around the clock' coverage for pain.  Pain is treated much more effectively if it is kept away than treated after it has arrived.  How much percocet is she going through?  That would be the big indicator of whether there is a problem or not.  That medication is for breakthrough or incidence pain.  Breakthrough pain is pain that comes about on top of her normal pain.  Incidence pain is pain that comes from physical activity.  Breakthrough pain should be treated as it happens.  Incidence pain can be treated by taking the medication about an hour before doing the physical activity.  Either way, she should not be taking more than 2 or 3 doses of breakthrough medication a day.  Anymore and she should have her oxycontin dose raised.  That is if everything is alright.  If she is abusing the medication, than that is a different story.  Just because she is physically dependant on the medication doesn't mean that she is addicted.  Physical dependence is a 'side effect' of opioid medication therapy.  It is the nature of the beast.  Anyone who takes opioids everyday for an extended period of time will become dependent on the medication.  That can be dealt with when, or if, the time arrives by slowly reducing the dosage over time.  Her being defensive when you ask her about it could be a sign of abuse, but not necessarily.  Find out how much pain she is still in and see if you can find out what the dosages are.  Good luck in that and it is great that you care about your mom the way you do.  I will be available to answer any question you may have.  Take care.
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You sound incredibly strong!!  How many times haven you been through this detox hell?  Half the reason I started doing all of this is because of the energy it gives me.  Now I'm overweight, depressed, SO down on myself, and ashamed.  I'd love to talk to you...  My e-mail is ***@****.  It would be really nice to talk to someone who's in the same situation that I'm in (with kids).  My husband will leave with the kids if he finds out about this time, and I don't have the $$ for rehab anyway.  I have GOT to do this myself...  I have to.  Please write me if you wouldn't mind.  Thanks so much for your reply.

Sara
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so you don't shoot heroin?? or do you? I'm confused because you said you hate needles?? Anyway, thats just a side question, back to the real issue.  Trust me, I know what your going through, and it sucks, REALLY BAD, but it needs to end, it has to, its the inevitable, so why not take into your own hands.  Trust me Skipper is right on this one. You want to be able to choose the time and place where you withdrawal. I was sent to Delaware, out in the boonies for training on a previous job, I was there mon. through thurs. and everyday from 7:30am to 5pm we had to sit in a room, there was only 3 of us total, and listen to some dumbass lecture.  So, everyday after training ( I had the nods everyday) I would go to my hotel room, sweating, squirming, the chills, and pain all over and dread the next morning.  I never got more then 5 minutes of sleep, it was the worst experience of my life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'M TELLING YOU, STOP NOW WHILE YOU CAN!!!!

GWH
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I think you're thinking of someone else's post.  I don't mind needles, but never have done heroin.  I really, really, don't trust myself with that!!  Nope...  just pills and now this methadone juice.  Got more from my guy last night and I wanted to only take a tiny drop but took half instead.   Now i'll try to taper with the rest of it.  I'm just DYING for that bzzzzz.  How do you get over that?????
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I apologize for the confusion, I'm not sure who i was thinking about but back to you.  How much meth did you get? and did you get it the same way?? Let me know how much you have to work with and I will be able to help you out.  Oh, the other thing was, you said you wanted to just take a drop, but you took more??? whats a drop?? I thought it was a wafer, is it liquid, or do you melt it and shoot it?? just curious, but please write back, I WANT to help you.

gwh
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yes, it's liquid.  I got about 70cc, and probably drank 50.  I'll have to get more...  money's getting tight, but I'll figure out something.  I have these HORRIBLE panic attacks about getting HIV or something, so WHY the hell do I keep doing this???  Am I f'ing nuts?  I have had friends, though, that have died of AIDS that I'd shared drinks with and I did'nt get it that way, so do you think I'm ok?  I'm so f'ing not ok...  why can't I just stop this craziness?  It's all so intriguing to a bored housewife and mother...  these clandestine meetings, trying to figure out how to work it all out, and living sort of on the edge.  I've always needed excitement in my life, and since I got married and had children, there isn't a whole lot.  Anyway...  Sunday I drank about 30 and by yesterday late afternoon, I still didn't feel any physical in the w/d sense.  Just emotional.  I have GOT to stop!!!!!  If I die of some disease from one of the junkies at the clinic...  I just can't even think about leaving my children motherless.  What the f is WRONG with me?????  :( :(  Thanks for wanting to help...  as you can see, I need it.
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i thought they were wafers which is why I didn't understand how disgusting it was, but now that I know its liquid, you can NOT keep doing this. No offense but that is repulsive. Although I don't think there is a high chance of becoming HIV positive, there is still the chance............... you never know if someone has a cut in their mouth, you know? Plus I'm assuming the Hep B was given through blood, right?? So be careful, actually don't be careful, just don't do it, and if you have to, then there has to be another way, seriously.  Worst comes to worst, see a doctor, tell him the extent to which you have gone, there has to be someone who is sympathetic to what you have been doing and going throug, but please don't keep doing that.  thats good you didn't feel physical withdrawal at 30 mg, so use a smaller amount, Use as little as possible, and if you feel awful, just bear with it until you have to take more, when you do take more, take the same amount or maybe less, that is the whole point, to feel some pain but make it through without having to feel like your dying........  Good Luck and keep you head on straight...................

GWH
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I LEFT A POST LAST FRIDAY AND NOW ITS GONE WHO DECIDES TO TAKE
THESE OFF, MAN WHAT A DISSAPOINTMENT,I REALLY THOUGHT THAT THIS
WAS TO HELP PEOPLE NOT TO JUDGE THEM,WOW TOTALLY MESSED UP,WELL
I GUESS THAT THERE ARE OTHER PLACES TO GO,I AM SO DISSAPOINTED
TO THINK SOMEBODY HAS THE RIGHT TO PULL MY POST BECAUSE THEY
THINK THEY RUN THE SHOW WOW MAN WELL THANKS FOR NOTHING.
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Hi Dorty. What Mr Michael said is right on; your mom could be just dependant on the meds and defensive about that. Doesn't mean she's addicted. But, I also believe that use of that high amount of opiates causes some personality change, whether you're addicted or not. The medicine itself makes you different. Life is numbed, you become alternately lethargic and buzzed (maybe not so much buzzed if you're not taking more than you should). Irritable. Sounds like she has many things going on. If she is using the pain meds properly and has chronic pain that nothing is going to relieve, this might be side effects she will have to live with and you will have to accept. No one should suffer chronic, intense pain and this may be her best bet. On the other hand, if it is making her life miserable she has to weigh that too. Pain doctors can be lifesavers but I am wary of some now. Mine increased my dose about 10-fold in less than a year, until I was a zombie. He didn't make me an addict; I did that myself. But the easy access with no real education about what was going on enabled me to get there. Still, most people in chronic pain use their meds responsibly. I just wasn't one of them. Best of luck and please let us know how things are going.
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Just wondering how Oxycontin 80's are always available in an auto factory. Kinda blows my mind.

This thing really is becoming epidemic.
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First off Hellbent ,Drugs are like sex or any other addiction.If you can pay to play there will always be some one to take your money.Its really no differnt than  any place else.When you are somewhere where money is around trouble is just around the corner if you seek it. That is why after you get clean it is very important to hang with people who dont use.Ive always had a problem with that before because i didnt want to blow off my friends due to my drug problem.But when your in the wrong space it dosent take much for an addict to think **** it ill use today or just now and then and we all know how the rest of the story goes.Just wanted to thank you tracy for the nice welcome. Im on vacation now and have a little  extra time but i will try to keep up when i go back .Sounds like your doing good,keep fighting the good fight.Marty
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I hear you. I found OC 80's for 14 bucks a pop on the streets, and went on a long run (taking 10-12 a day, chewed). They were relatively cheap, but my habit got to over 150 dollars a day. I took the time to find multiple connections, and had a little white lady in a Benz delivering OC's, dilaudid, klonopin, and anything else I wanted, to my apartment.

Anyway, it's been about 46 days off of everything, and I am just starting to laugh again. The fact that you can always get OC's in an auto plant is humourous. "Here's the wrenches, here's the hand soap, and here's the OC 80's, grab a handful."

I'm sure the drugs aren't sponsored by the plant, and I am sure that the temptation can be tormenting. Hang in there.
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Methadone for pain 10 mgs only for about a month and 1/2.  After I stopped, I felt nausia, sweats, electric impulses preventing me from sleeping, diahhrea, headache and body weakness.  It's really hard for me to get up and move.  I have also gone back to work and try so hard to act like I'm feeling ok, but once I'm off the clock and on my way home, I get really sad and a tear or two will flow.

I haven't touched the med for 11 days and never will again.  I think I will stay away from pain meds because most of them make me sick.  This was sort of a last resort from pain specialist.

I'm not even addicted to it at all.  I don't desire another one ever, it's just that I'm suffering these awful side effects.  Will they ever go away.  It's day eleven and I still feel really weak.  The electric impulses in my eyes and my hands and arms are finally gone!!  But, I have the runs badly and my stomach churns and dull headache.  I've also lost a few pounds.  I wonder if I just got the flu in conjunction with the side affects.  Does anyone know how long this lasts??
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hey hope you feeling and doing better tonight.
the run's will cause a lot of negitive effect's on the body,
because they deplete the body of a lot of important nutrients.
it is suggeested here to take imoduim to stop the runs.
Also the thomas's receipe really helps  you fell a lot better faster.
you can find it posted, down below

l-tyrosine 500 mg 8 times a day week 1 -=----4 a day the flowing weeks
b-6 100 mg 2 times a day
vitamines  C--E--AND A
calsium -magnisum
a strong multy
phousphors
copper
magneese
imoudium for the runs
--------------------------------------------------------

also suggested is bannas for leg spasams and restless leg
gotoraide for lost electrolites  due to the runs
and if you still have any depression aftetr a week
some people recomend 5htp
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Good to know you'll be around, Jeepster. Sometimes it still crosses my mind, but I've been able to resist. Like today, I had a message about a job interview. Haven't been on one in years without my handy dandy opiates. So it occurred to me, jeez, I need one of those to ace the interview! How can I be charming and outgoing and everything else without it? I have to admit, I'm still afraid of that. But I'll never know if I can be that person again if I don't try it, clean. I managed to overcome my natural shyness and do pretty damn well before I was on the drugs; I should be able to do it again. My motto is, if I'm not really feeling positive and self-confident, fake it!, until I am. It's always worked for me in the past and I swear to God it'll work again, without any help from those tempting little pills.
After all that soul-searching it turns out I don't need to worry; the job, which sounded so good over the phone, is pre-selling funeral plots! Not what I want to do. So, I guess this was a test from up above, but I managed to pass and that's what's important!
Sorry to digress here; just needed to get that all out.
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Hi lifeisbetter, just wondering how you're doing. What's up? Write when you get a chance. I'm moved now and doing well. My 3-month anniversary is coming up this weekend! It actually seems like I've been clean much longer, because I feel so damn good. Amazing, huh?
tracy
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congrats on your anniversary - that is HUGE!  you've been so inspirational here, that i bet some people will be experiencing the same because of your posts.

i wish i could be at that point.  i'm almost 3 months with no pills, and i'm down to 1 amp per day of the bup.  i'm very confused as to where to go from here.  i'm not making up migraine pain to use as an excuse to take bup - i have tried everything out there (narcotic and otherwise) to make them manageable, but so far nothing has helped.  altho, even after tapering to the extent i have, i haven't gotten a headache i couldn't handle, so in some ways i feel validated in taking the bup still.  i really feel that if i'd never had a headache, i never would be where i am now.  i had gotten bored with recreational drugs shortly after college, and i don't drink at all.  however, i knew after the first couple pills i took (along with the relief it gave me) i was going to have problems.  i'm pretty sure i was a relatively happy person before all this - i still cannot fathom how things snowballed the way they did.

anyhow, i'm considering consulting a shrink.  i feel like i might have some underlying problems that need to be addressed, before i can truly put this all behind me. why am i writing all this?  i don't know...i must be in a talkative mood.  i've been on the forum since 5 a.m. - in some ways i love being up at this time of the morning...the house is quiet, a cool breeze is coming thru the windows and everything smells so fresh after last night's rain.  take care, and again congrats on your reaching a very tough goal:)

p.s.  does anyone know why opiates make you crave sweets? i've read about people gaining tons of weight from the drugs, and i don't understand that.  i haven't experienced that - thank god. i do crave sweets tho, but i try to work out a lot - i guess that is why i haven't gained the weight.  who needs that problem on top of everything else.
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Tex3, thank you so much for your post in the thread above, that really meant a lot, I just hope I can do this....... with people like you around I will, I'm still in shock when I look at that post, it really means a lot, and it has made me want this even more, so thank you.

Groovy, the first thing I did when i woke up this morning (5:45am) was eat candy, I never do that!!! but I definitely have a sweet tooth since I have been on the drugs. I notice it more when in withdrawal....... what about you.  By the way, how about this weather!!! although yesterday was a mess!!!

In regards to the bup and your headaches, if you have pain issues with headaches, then by all means, you should take whatever works.  Headaches have to be the worst, its awful...... so take care of yourself.

Thanks again to the both of you, tex3, that post was a life saver.

GWH
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i complained ALL winter, because i HATE it.  i have decided that new englanders are all a bunch of crybabies, because they complain about all the seasons.  i have decided if i'm going to continue to live here, i will only complain about one and i picked winter.  i smiled all thru the heatwave, and i kept reminding myself that i was in shorts with bare feet...i was happy.  

i haven't made any decisions about the bup.  i feel guilty continuing to take it, but my doc feels that i should have it on hand for the migraines.  i've tapered to a point that i think is reasonable, so why do i feel guilty?

also...does anyone know why people gain weight on opiates? i keep hearing all about it, but i have no idea what the reasons are.  i used for about 2 years, and i didn't gain weight...will i if i continue with the bup?  is it just inevitable, or is it like when some people get pregnant and they just tell themselves i'm eating for two now (and they really eat for like 10) and put on 65 pounds?  i'm worried now that i hear that people really pack it on that i will end up doing that too...ack!  i don't need that on top of everything else!!
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I love the winter!! and the summer.   Opiates slow down your metabolism which is what someone told me earlier.  It makes sense............ anyway, if you haven't gained any yet, then you won't, so don't worry about it. make sure to take care of yourself when it comes to the pain associated with the headaches...............

GWH
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I am so thankful for your kind, honest words, encouragement and information concerning my mom's use of oxycontin and percoset for chronic pain.  You both have given me a place to begin where before I felt so helpless tackling something which I am not familiar.  I spoke with a cousin who will be traveling thru Florida on Sunday.  She is going to stop and check on my mom and assess the situation.  I trust her judgment and I'll move forward from there.  Now I have a plan and I thank you for both of your help.  I will keep in touch. Sincerely, Dorty
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Thanks groovy, that really meant a lot to me, it truly did. I feel so good and I want to help others get there; maybe it will make this whole hell worthwhile, huh?
About the weight gain - it happened to me in a major way. But it is because I craved sweets and just wanted to munch all the time. I ate about twice my normal amount. Plus I bloated up a lot. My hands were always swollen. If you haven't had the weight gain after two years I think you're not prone to it.
I think you're doing great. A few weeks ago you were struggling to reduce the bup intake at all, and now you're down to one/day? That's wonderful! If you've always had migraines and nothing else helps, you might have to accept that you will need something for it. And bup is better than anything else, I firmly believe. I took it for chronic pain after my first detox, and it worked like a wonder. If my migraines come back bad like they were, that's what I will probably do, although I don't need anything everday since mine are intermittent.

GWH, thanks for the sweet post. You're so honest and I hate to see you struggle with this, but I know you will make it; on the plus side, you will hopefully leave this beast behind while you're still very young, and gain a ton of wisdom to take with you the rest of your life. Hang in there buddy.

By the way, it's 100 degrees here in south Texas. Can't even walk outside without feeling like a ton of bricks are surrounding you. So I envy you New England folks!
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I've always been puzzled when people say then gained weight on opiates.  When I was using, I lost a ton of weight.  That was because I didn't want to eat, since eating meant I'd feel the next batch of pills less. Food interfered with my buzz. God, I was sick!

I do remember that what I did eat took a long time to digest.

I don't know about bup and weight gain, but groovy, if you've not gained weight on it so far, you probably won't.

Don't beat yourself up over still being on it. You've reduced your dose quite a bit.  Give yourself credit for that!
I'm just impressed you've found a doctor willing to prescribe it for you. I have failed to find one willing to give me bup.  I've turned down oxycontin twice from two docs who would give me, a self admitted recovering addict, oxy, but not bup.  I don't get it!

love,
WW
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hi groovy...well here i am...where are u...

thanks for describing my life in a previous post...do people still resent your outspokeness, or have they warmed up to you like i have...oh well, i will spend the weekend eating, smoking pot, sitting by the pool and bbq'ing... despite your urgings for me to stop...i must admit thou, it's fun....4 women are coming over to use the pool tomorrow....

to everyone else who reads this posting, i can tell you that groovy is a pretty hot girl...she is very cute, best described as a heather locklear type, and she is super smart...and she has courage to fight, which besides her body is my favorite part about her. i hope her husband doesnt read this.

anyway, i think a posting like this is good for this place, its kinda funny and lightens the mood, wouldnt you say groovy girl.


oxoxo

smoke stak
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dearest smoke stak - we try not to get too personal here with the physical descriptions and whatnot...but thanks for the compliments:)

now that you've FINALLY signed on, perhaps we can get to the root of your pot problem and get you back on the straight and narrow, huh?  remember - nothing TOO personal because this is a mighty small world we live in, and as it turns out, some of us are in closer proximity than we might have thought...we want to keep this confidential!  my husband may drop by at some point you goof ball...hahah

hey, on another note...is it physically possible that a person with a 15-16 perc a day habit over the past year get off of them without any w/ds???  that's what a fellow addict tried to convince me of today...that he had quit everything sunday and was feeling great.  i tend to think he's still using, but anything is possible right?  i'd love some input on that one. thanks.



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dearest smoke stak - we try not to get too personal here with the physical descriptions and whatnot...but thanks for the compliments:)

now that you've FINALLY signed on, perhaps we can get to the root of your pot problem and get you back on the straight and narrow, huh?  remember - nothing TOO personal because this is a mighty small world we live in, and as it turns out, some of us are in closer proximity than we might have thought...we want to keep this confidential!  my husband may drop by at some point you goof ball...hahah

hey, on another note...is it physically possible that a person with a 15-16 perc a day habit over the past year get off of them without any w/ds???  that's what a fellow addict tried to convince me of today...that he had quit everything sunday and was feeling great.  i tend to think he's still using, but anything is possible right?  i'd love some input on that one. thanks.



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thanks guys for your feedback on the weight issue, and i do feel pretty good about cutting back on the bup, but i'd still love to be completely free of everything - one day at a time...actually sometimes i have to take it one minute/hour at a time to get thru the day.

i hope you all have a great weekend...i'll be here and there throughout....peace.
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I think your friend is using something. No way could you quit that, if using daily, without WD. Although if he quit five days ago, I guess it's possible to feel better by now. My first detox was four days and then I was somewhat okay, but a mental wreck. It's hard to fool a fellow addict.
I take it a minute at a time too, many days. But I'm glad you're feeling better and were able to cut the bup. Even small amounts of that stuff help. I read that it is many, many times stronger than morphine, which is why the doses are so small when injected. I took .3mg amps, 1-4/day.
Hope your admirer takes your advice...and I promise not to mention it again! Have a great weekend; we're going to the lake tomorrow so I won't be around.
tracy
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"my admirer" is one of my oldest, dearest friends who's being silly. he's actually kind of shy and could probably benefit from your's (and everyone's) input - that is, if we could get him to be serious for a minute.

i'm going up to a lake today too...stay cool.
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groovy:
so this is your herb smoking friend you described earlier? he
sounds like a pretty intresting " cat to have in the bag...."

do you see the fun & possibilitys that are open to both of you
here? i hope there is a foundation of strong and devoted friendship that is in place here. let's see...i live with another person who posts here. we've never much hidden the fact that irish rose & kip are not only an item, but husband and wife! i also live (at most) 15 miles north of another regular poster. turns out we both work in simalar fields (that makes him seem dull, when he probably isn't...but how woulde i know, he won't even meet me for coffee. see i do believe he is "on" to how unsaviory i really am (drug addict, & - all around piece of low life dirt-****.

i know of 3 other people who live across a bay from each other, that have never met. i know they all have busy lives, but i could not resist being able to actually meet......but maybe i'm wierd or just plain fay and wrong....

smokestak:
now you mind your p's and q's (what ever the hell they are...). if i am to believe you about what groovy looks like (i suspected as much), i must also remind you that there are componenets of her personality that make her a very "attractive person," in another way!  i would hate to see you, me, or the rest of the forum lose her companionship....so be careful, but be yourself...

by the way smokestack...welcome to the forum! there will always
be room fo "JUST ONE MORE ADDICT" in here, SO COME ON IN!!!

good saturday to everyone, and keep an angel on your shoulder!
kip
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thanks skip - you are a gem:)  i don't like how you put yourself down tho...i could give two craps about the "outside" of you...i know you to be one of the warmest, most generous people around here, but i bet you are just as great on the outside.  don't put yourself down please....remember you hated when one poster called himself loser?  

smoke stak and i are really, really great friends from a long time ago and have seen each other thru many tough times.  i hope he comes back and gets as much out of this forum as i have...come out come out wherever you are...give it a try sweetie...

ok - i gotta run...going out to the lake for the day and what a beautiful day it is.  i hope you all have a good one.
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I need to give you an update.
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angst:
i'm ready for an update. either give to me through the forum or, if
you prefer ***@****

i know work can eat a big hole in your time, and that i presume is
why your posts are somewhat sparse and far and few between. hey
thats ok, i understand, and even if i didn't it would still be ok.
i miss your posts, so full of light and "tough truth." if you post
to my e-mail, let me know, as i have take a "long 5 minute drive to work," to to read my e-mail.
keep an angel on your shoulder
kip
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The shipyard called, I go for the interview Monday morning.   Burning no bridges, I will stay where I am for now, until it is a sure thing with pipefitting.  I thought you'd like to hear, sorry for breaking a thread.  I hope the methadone does not keep me out.  Since it is not included on most UDS.  It depends on how it goes as to whether I let it on that I take methadone.  I will list my asthma meds and xanax.  That will cover the amphetamine and benzodiazapines.  If the methadone comes up, I'll simply tell them that I was afraid of being discriminated against because of the methadone.  Careful choice of words. Not that I am a writer, just tactful.  Any good advice,  you can email me at ***@****.  Sorry for interrupting anything important with my little life.  I have that Angel on my shoulder, Angst.
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I had already written the update before I got your post.  Next time, I have personal problems, I'll email.  Thanks, and let me know if you have any advice.    Angst
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angst:
todays saturday! tomarrows sunday. you hear about the shipyards
on monday...good! you know you will do just fine at the shipyard
interview! don't worry about pissing in bottles....you have been an
addict long enough to go everywhere/anywhere drugs (hydromorphone)
can take you. put some of that existential cool on, and wait for
the results....make it as easy as listening to cannonball Adderly..


hey i'm praying you'll get what you need... beyond that i'm praying
you'll want the things ya' need...

must take nap as i'm going to hear Dave Alvin tonight...

keep an angel on your shoulder
kip
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Hey.... I don't think you're unsavory! You just calm down, now, Ya hear? You know damned well that our industry makes us seem Dull..... But, we are in fact: Sci-Fi Junkies as well as "junkies" of one sort or another. I'd wager 16.2% of my hourly pay for a factor of .356 times our workweek actual hours that 80% of respondants would correctly Identify ME with our line of work other than YOU......

Dare me?!

O.K. Smart Forum.... Skipper has bet me, Jessesarpy, that you guys (The Rest of the Forum), will guess our Mutual Proffesion.

One of the following statements are, indeed, factual about the nature of "Skip/Kip's" line of work shared by the one who calls himself "Jessesarpy"----

A.) Both Skip, and Jessesarpy are professors of Geology on the staff the University of Nebraska, Lincoln.

B.) Both Skip and Jessesarpy are personnel at the I.S. Departments Overseeing a vast computer network.

"A" or "B", which is it?

PLease submit your vote!
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my vote:  a
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i vote "c."
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i really doubt if either, but i'd have to say b.  i do not think you live near the univ of neb.  hey, who knows.  geologists are not necessarily sci fi junkies.  i'm more into the gothic era, and not the snotty nosed kids of today.  i love the romatic era with shelby, byron,etc...
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Well, from kip's email address it looks like he's at a university, but hell I don't know what he does. Have to admit geology does sound pretty dull, but only because I know absolutely nothing about it. So 'fess up, which is it?
Skip, you're too quick and funny to be putting yourself down so stop it, now!
Hope everyone's having a great weekend and those of you detoxing are as comfortable as possible. I went to the lake yesterday, where it proceeded to rain most of the day but we stayed anyway.

Tomorrow's my three month anniversary and it's amazing I feel so much better than I thought I would at this point! Question: I ran out of tyrosone. Do I still need it? Took the last one yesterday, and although I was taking a low dose, I still wonder if it's continued to help with my mental state. Any suggestions, anyone?
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skipper thanks for the kind words, i appreciate your kindness...

groovy...it is sunday night, i wish you would call me...i had a great weekend around the pool...yes, i smoked a bunch of pot, ate way too much, and got a bit more of a tan... its all good thou...am i expected to talk about my "so-called" pot problem here, or can i just tell you how much of a great weekend i had..

lastly groovy, i dont drink, i dont do drugs, i even hate tylenol...so let a single, successful guy have his weed...damn i can remember when you smoked weed, hey wait a minute, i can't remember, weed makes me very forgetful... hehehe

xoxoxo
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you can blow smoke up everyone else's butts, but not mine...hahah

when you feel like you're in a very truthful mood, just let us know.  xo
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Whats up smoke stak, its good to have comic relief, and I agree, I think pot is the one drug that should be excepted. Many people may disagree but seriously, its the one drug that you can leave without a real physical withdrawal and it doesn't interfere the way opiates do.  anyway, good luck I hope all is well

Groovy, sounds like you have a great friendship with Smoke Stak, he sounds like a fun guy. I hope your doing well, and I wasn't going to say anything, but I have to ask, were you at Richardsons this weekend?? I could have swore I saw you..................

Skipper, stop feeding into that negative bullshit...... first and foremost, your a person, not a drug addict, and your a person with extreme warmth and compassion to help others!! And if I were local I would meet up for a cup of coffee whenever you wanted.!!

As a side note, I can't tell you all how much physical activity can help motivate to stay sober.  My brother has helped me by really gearing me towards training in the gym.  Dedicating myself to that will take a lot of time, strength, and mental toughness, but I will do it, I can't wait to move out of the fog and into the clear day, I feel like I"m in a daze......... Point being, get up, get out and move around, it will help, I promise........... Another question was, how many people would meet others within this forum? I'm always curious as to how confidential people like to be.......

I swear this is the last thing, but something that helped my self confidence this weekend........... I get to go to NY in 2 weeks, I got picked for the Abercrombie & Fitch Quarterly magazine!!! too funny, my family is already making fun of me, but anyway, it was a weird kind of boost for my self confidence.

I hope all is well, and please keep posting.

GWH
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No negativity, O.K.?

You are a pretty damned Smart and Compassionate guy the way you reach out to all the Newbies here.... Just because I can't manage my time worth a **** doesn't mean I'm ignoring you! I'm just another junkie like all the rest here... I hope I can get my head together and start living like a HUMAN, because I NEVER have in the past! This whole sobriety thing to new to me, and the Booze and Drugs were there to calm my insecurities and fears, now I'm just having to deal with life on it's OWN terms.. Really F-Ing scary!

The strange thing is that I just want to walk away from my proffession now! Just drop everything and go back to what I REALLY love. [Writing and Playing guitar in local bands] Yes, I was a touring midwestern "Hair-band" 80's era Metal guitarist from the ages of 17-25. It didn't pay enough, so I went to college, and here I am making pretty good money and hating what I do now... Before I was sober, I LOVED my job. Good money to pay for all my Booze and drugs... What could be better? Now it is SO LIMITING! I'm stuck here 10-12 hours per day, and most weekends.... Oh well, just have to work it all out!

So, everybody.... What do Skipper and I do?

Aw, ****, I'd better not say.... Doesn't sound like you want the forum to know! It would spoil the mystery around the persona...

Here's a clue: We both work for an Agency that has a three-letter abbreviation... That's all I'm going to say for now!

Hows your life treating you, Skip?

Jess
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i have to ask...how can you "swear" that you saw me at richardson's when you have no idea what i look like?  no, i wasn't there - we don't go all the time.

i agree about pot, except when it takes over someone's life and makes them numb and unable to move forward.  i think it can stagnate you...you can get so unmotivated.  anyway, i'm glad smoke stak is here...i think he could get a lot out of this place.
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ok, well that definitely got my attention..................so????????????
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you sent me a picture........
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I saw a couple that resembled what I remember in the picture you sent, thats all. I thought it was you, anyway, I guess your right about the weed, it really depends on the severity, but people can definitely become complacent when smoking all the time.......
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Hi gwh. Did you start the meth? Is it working, and did you completely quit the OCs? I know you can do it this time. Let us know when the catalog comes out. You should be really proud! That's great. See, life is taking you in new directions already. Anyway, I'd love to see it. Hang in there, you sound better already. Once the fog is gone, you'll be unstoppable.
tracy
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your awesome!!! always answering my posts, yea, I used meth the last 3 days and then got rid of whatever I had left.  Personally, anything after 3 days is too much, thats my outlook, I don't want to become addicted to the meth, you know??  I figure I will have a couple of days of mild withdrawals and then it will be a mental battle........... Well, I hope all is well. keep posting, PLEASE!!!

gwh
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jess:
when dilbert cartoons aren't funny anymore, i mean when wally is
my role model....well who in their right mind wouldn't want to
just walk away? at my work place, i deal with a constant stream
of primo-donna's (spelling) who's research is always the more im-
portant than anyone else's time. i'm just a grunt with social problems (i aspire to low goals), and a good deal of the time i am treared like an unperson....

lucky for me (and you i hope) we have lives beyond our jobs. when
they asked me in fourth grade what i would probably be doing as
an adult, i saud i would probably have to have a job. when they
asked me, don't you want to have a an exciting job that really
made a difference? i said no, i'ld just rather not have anthing to do with work or "them."

see i really don't mean to sound hostile (sorry if i did) i'm
just depressed. it's monday and 95* out there. and all this
"stuff" that doesn't work, i must deal with right now.

you know i like to think of it as emotionally outgrowing the need
for work. i told my boss that...heasked me if i'ld economically
outgrown the need for a job

keep an angel on your shoulder
kip
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Sheeeeiiit.....

Yes the F-ing heat is depressing.
Do you think any of your state of mind is affected by your detoxing? Are you still on that path for the time being? I think I'm just getting more crazy the more "Sober" I become.

I know what you mean about all the sh*theads who think that their problem is the most important thing at the time.. Hell, the brownshirts at THIS Gov't agency expect us to ask "How high" when they say "jump". We remind them from time to time who's REALLY in control here by taking away Internet priveledges around lunch and the last hour before shift changes when people start getting lazy. Sometimes we create a report of what webpages an individual was happily surfing, and quietly e-mail it to that individual with a question to the effect of, "How does researching (________) help you with your job?"....

Yes... If I were independantly wealthy, I'd quit and become a Monk or something of that nature.... But, REALLY, the heat here is making all of us midwesterners just a bit whacky right now..... Just all a little unbalanced.

Muchos GRANDE deintes!
Jess
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I've posted here before. I got good advice so please lend me some more... I will be facing the board this Friday for my addiction. I took 10-15 5mg vicodin everyday for 1.5 years. They may want me to go to rehab! I have been clean for 50 days, no bad withdrawls, I have been to 5 NA meetings a week for the last 50 days and to 2 group therapy sessions every week for the last 50 days for recoverying Dr.'s. My question is this: Is rehab totally necessary for recovery, or can NA and group therapy  be my rehab?  I will be checking for replys soon.....thanks for your support.
"Take my will and my Life and show me how to live"

Dr.X
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Well I'm not an expert on the subject, but I was always under the impression that rehab was only necessary for those going through withdrawls and to get them through those first few weeks of sobriety. It sounds like you're doing an excellent job with your current regimen and I congratulate you. I would say that you are not a candidate for rehab.
So you are a doctor? Not to sound like a downer, but I couldn't imagine having the access that you have to these drugs. I'd be in big, big trouble. The nursing profession has always interested me, but I will not even think of entering the field because I would not want to be under this kind of temptation day in and day out. Good Luck to you.
Amber
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Congratulations on how well you've done! I don't see what more rehab could have to offer you, other than to satisfy the board's bureaucracy??? But I'm not in the medical profession, so I don't know. I wanted to wish you the best of luck though and say great job, hang in there, you're doing your part. Also post this on the top question from today and you'll get more answers, as many don't check questions down lower. Hang in there and I'll send a prayer your way.
tracy
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Hey Doc,

I realize that this post is probably a little too late and I apologize. My profession now keeps me away from home and e-mail access for sometimes 2 to 3 weeks at a time.

Here is my advice for what it may be worth. If the board decided that rehab was necessary then it was not only for you but for thier purposes. They want to dot thier I's and cross thier T's as well. I hope that all went well with the board. The way that I see it is that rehab is the discovery part, the education part of our addiction if you will. FGor me, it made me understand why things happended the way they did and what precipitated the whole addiction. I came to understand the disease. I was also put in touch with reality and I was helped in setting my goals for the rest of my life.

In short, it was, for me, a necessary course of events to put everything into persepective. The follow-up or after care was to support and build on what the rehab had put in place. I refer to the A.A. and N.A meetings that I attend. It's all good. If it's a stigma issue then that will pass in time. I had to fight that demon as well. I can remember my precious wife telling the group in a meeting in rehab, "We don't belong here, he is not a druggie or dope addict." Boy did that hit home and hard. The truth is, I was and am an addict, a recovering one now with 14 months of sobriety and a lifetime ahead. One day at a time. Although my wife has been and still is very supportive, she cannot sit and watch me post on this forum. She cannot handle the pain of the stories here. For her it only brings back the memories of the extreme pain of watching everything in my illustrious career disappear. I hope and pray that this will pass in time.

From the healing standpoint which I know you understand, think of it as a terminal healing process. Dont read more into that statement than what was said. Take the course of action offered to you or ordered to you and make the best of it. We are all faced with making the best of what we have left in our lives, after the destructiveness  of the addiction, which by most accounts is quite a lot. LIFE IS GOOD AFTER ADDICTION! You will see. Remember, what was or is in the past no matter how recent, is just that, in the past. The rest is ahead. Think of it as having one up on every one else. You know the mistakes and destruction in that area, now take the lessons learned from it and capitalize on what's ahead.

Doc, we are here for you, everyone of us. It truly only gets better. I will continue to pray for you and your family for complete healing and growth. "Eye has not seen nor ear heard nor entered into the heart of man the things that God has prepared for them that love him."

In His Love, JR.

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