Is Suboxone good for detoxing off of methadone?

[jessica555]

I have been on methadone for 3 years. I had to get on it to transition off of oxy's, fentanyl, & hydros that I had been addicted to for 5 years.  (If I had known what I know now about methadone, I would have never started taking it).  I have titrated myself down from 100mg to 15mg. I have a Dr. who will prescribe suboxone for me to help the transition off of the methadone, but will only do it with the naltroxone in it and after I have detoxed myself off of methadone for 48hrs.  I can NOT imagine going 1 day without my methadone.  How in the heck am I suppose to do this?  Will it really make me that sick if I was not to do the withdraw thing for 2 days before dosing on the suboxone?  And does anyone know how long you really stay dope sick for after getting on the suboxone?  Thanks so much for your time!

Jessica

[ACG]

First of all, im not a drug user but my boyfriend was addicted to oxys so his doctor put him on suboxone to keep him from oxy's. Well his doctor never told him that he would have withdraws from it now we wish he had never got on it. I think his withdraws were worse then withdraws from oxys. I dont know if people go through it different or not but from him hurting so bad, it has made him relapse and it is so hard for us right now. I just dont want you to make the same mistake. Please learn about it first. Thanks AC

[No name22]

I used subutex and it worked great for me! I used it longer than I needed, but I eventually tappered off it and had hardly any w/d's I had my dr. prescribe me clonidine for the hot/cold flashes and I was ok. I guess everyones diffrent, i'd just say try to be on it for as less of time as possible of you do get in it. Some dr.'s may want to keep you on for months, but only you know how much you're body needs.

[ACG]

see thats what im trying to figure out if he just abused them because he liked them to much or something because he had bad withdraws like for 3-4 days. I just dont understand it

[No name22]

Well subutex is diffrent and I know people that use that to get high I did, but I also self medicated... Now with suboxone I got high the 1st time I did it, but other than that not so much, but if I remember correctly (if I didn't get sick) and took more suboxone than I needed it would give me a bit of a high

[Debby317]

I too was on Methadone for pain, when I was supposed to start a new drug I just stopped the day before and didn't know any different. About 2 days later I was feeling something was really wrong By the third day I was in the ER. They gave me Clonidine patches. You have no craving for the drug . The w/d are bad and I'm with you, Had I been informed. Actually we are filing a complaint with DHP just for that reason...had she informed me what I would go threw the get off it then I could have made my decision. It's bad and will be bad for ( 3days was the worst) then it started to get better, U will need something for sleep I was up for 4 1/2 days before I could get hold of someone to call me in something. I when cold turkey and I has told that was the best way to do it. It will take a good 14 days. I'm here if you need to talk through the w/d---that helps too because you think your losing it.
Take Care

[jessica555]

Hi...thanks for your reply.  I was just wondering what you were detoxing off of and how long you had to detox before getting on the suboxone?  They told me to fully detox for 48 hours.  UGGGHH!!!!  I really dont feel like I have it in me to do that and my family is really needing me to.  Any other suggestions for me?  Thanks so much!

[jessica555]

Thanks so much!  I am so scared and dont know what to do.  I really so desperately want to feel normal again w/o having to take anything.  I want off of the methadone so much but I can not get myself to withdraw for even a day.  I also have a clinic that will put me on some benzos and nurse care at a facility here in CO. for about 4-5 days.  Then I thought maybe about getting on the suboxone since you have to be in withdraw before dosing.  But I have even heard that benzos do nothing for someone that is on methadone.  Thanks for letting me know you will be there to talk through the agony if I choose that route.  You are very kind.  

[No name22]

Honestly everyones diffrent some (from what I read) only wait 12 hr's so that would mean take you're last dose b4 you go to bed, I would....I actually self medicated bought them off the st. and I'm not saying you should do this, because some people get really sick (I never knew this) if they take it to soon...But me I took it as soon as I got my first side effect from w/d-ing. I was up to 120mg's of oxy a day and tappered down to 40mg's B4 I started the sub and quit for the final time, believe me i've been trying since May and this is the farthest i've come....If I were you i'd try the sub.

[jessica555]

So if I was dope sick after taking the suboxone......could I take some methadone to cure some of the withdraws, or would that make them only get worse?  

[No name22]

NO, you can't it wouldn't do a thing, but possible make you feel sicker....Suboxone is a opiate blocker meaning you'll have no effect to and opiates....HAve you looked it up?
If you don't wait the full time you may or may not get sick everyones diffrent

Suboxone.com

[wait2long]

switching from meth to sub is extremely hard...took me 5 weeks to get the full effect of the sub because it takes so darn long for the meth to leave your system...it can be done...but its not an easy task if your not dedicated to it...plan on at least 4-6 weeks on the sub until your better...i was only taking 20 mgs daily for 10 months of the methdone...waited 5 full days from last dose of meth before i took my first dose of sub...was still sent into immediate precoptated withdrawls...the next 5 days was pure hell...definately wait until you cant stand the sickness any more before that first dose of sub is taken...transitioning from short acting opiods to sub is a hell of alot easier and quicker results...methadone is tricky, do ALOT  of reading and research...about meth to sub transition...totally different then switching from short acting opiods...  good luck!!!

[notmenow!]

Get a new Dr. as the protocol for transitioning from methadone to suboxone is as follows per The National Alliance of Buprenorphine treatment: It is recommended that patients transitioning from methadone to Buprenorphine slowly taper to 30mg./ day for a least one week. Last dose must be no less than 36 hrs prior to induction and may be 96 hrs hours or more. A minimal score of at least 5 to 6 on the Clinical Opiate Withdrawal Scale (COWS) is recommended, although some physicians prefer scores of 15 or higher. Patients transferring from methadone or another long acting opioid to Buprenorphine may experience discomfort for several days and dysphoria for up to 2 weeks. The goal of induction is to suppress opioid withdrawal as rapidly as possible with adequate doses of Buprenorphine. Failure to may lead patients to use opioids or other medications to alleviate the withdrawal symptoms or may lead to early dropout, To achieve this, some physicians have found out they need to dose as high as 32 mgs. the first day with some methadone to Buprenorphine transfers I myself am a pain management patient my dose is 32mgs. per day broken down to 8mg every 6 hrs I also take Lyrica for nerve pain as well. Once you transfer to suboxone and become stable your dose can be tapered slowly until medication is no longer required. The withdrawal symptoms of suboxone are milder than those experienced with full opioid agonist and can be managed with the doctor's supervision, Jessica when I feel it is time to come off the drug I will do so very slowly like 1 or 2 mgs. per week and if I become uncomfortable or start craving I will let my doctor know everything as I have no intention on returning to the nightmare of oxycontin and norco addiction again if it takes telling on myself then I will do it because I have come to far over the last 7 months.
Truthfully some days I forget to take the full 32mgs as directed. I just had my suboxone refilled on the 10/31 but I have not yet finished the 120 tablets a got on 10/01, and I still have about 15 left over still from October that I have yet to finish before I start on Novembers supply. I have absolutely no craving to get high at all. I can't explain it. Try and get another doctor by going to www.naabt.org order the kit they offer at no charge. It comes with a very informative CD that explains so much about, and the naabt system will find you all physicians by zip code in a mile range you enter. I myself travel 170 miles round trip every 90 days as with this medication you are allowed refills, Schedule III allows from 1 to 5 refills although anything over 2 is unlikely as I think your required to take a U/A every 90 days. Although I have not had one yet in 7 months, But this is the same MD that had me on all the opiates prior to surgery, Well I hoped the info helped and please check out the website. Good Luck to You----------------------NOAH

[jessica555]

Thanks so much for all the info.  I am sooooo scared of the pain from withdrawl.  I have heard too many horror stories of people being sick the first 2 days.  Plus I have to go at least 2 days without my methadone.  I really dont know if I can do this.  Actually I KNOW I can not do this.  Are there any Drs who will prescribe the subutex instead of the suboxone?  I really need to quit this deadly game I am playing for myself and my loving family.  I am such an addict and feel like this is my life.....forever!  I really want out of this hell but I just cant and will not be able to put myself through that much pain. I can not even go through an hour in the morning after I wake up without taking some of my daily dose of methadone.  I can say however I was taking 18 40's mg of oxys at a time (also at the same time washing the coating off and crushing them first)  along with 12 10mg Norcos almost 4-5 times a day.  I did finally stop popping pills but now my addiction lies with when is the next sip of methadone.  Even though I no longer can get high off of anything no matter what the dose.....I still think every time.....maybe this time I will get high and that is what I am scared of living without.  I am so scared of not having that hope of maybe next time I will feel high.  After 5 yrs. of popping pills and 3 yrs. of methadone....I have not been able to get high in over 4 yrs. You would think someone would FINALLY get the darn message.  Thanks for everyones input and kind words during this VERY trying time!!!!  Jessica

[notmenow!]

Girl you are a miracle or you have a guardian angel, You were using over 700mgd of oxycontin per day, Well if you can survive that transition over to methadone it will be a breeze getting on the suboxone, which is the same as subutex except suboxone has 2mgs of naloxone of which 2% gets absorbed into your system, it is there only as a diversion for iv drug users, If it were injected it would put you in withdrawal. But dont worry about it, do you know 1mg of buprenorphine is equal to 50mg of morphine for real, I dont know why you say you have to go without methadone for 2 days its a recommendation but not write in stone, Just make sure they use subutex for induction purposes, In case there are any opiates left on the receptors, But the sub is very strong and will push the opiate off the receptor within 24 hours, As I told you 32mgs for methadone transfers is recommended. How quickly are you coming off the methadone? Good night talk later---------------NOAH

[wait2long]

if you have been on methadone for 3 years, it will take you alot longer than 2 days to even start to feel the withdrawal symptoms from the methadone.  you have a choice...you can continue to stay on the methadone and worry about the withdrawals from it forever...or you can stop the methadone and start the suboxone and free yourself from this addiction that you seem to fear so badly...  it does not matter if you are first prescribed suboxone or subutex for induction, it doesnt matter...either way you will have to experience some discomfort...if you are not willing to let go of your methadone for a few days, so that you can live the addictive free lifestyle that you SEEM to want so badly, then i would have to say your not ready for the change yet, this is up to you...and honestly it doesnt seem to matter what advice you have been given here, if your not ready to experience a few days of discomfort so you can be free, then keep on going as you are, because you can stay on methadone for life if a few days of discomfort scares you that badly..   i am so glad that i stuck with my decision to stop taking methadone and to start the sub...i no longer have that fear that i HAVE to live the lifestyle of a full blown addict for the rest of my life....

YOU CANNOT TAKE METHADONE AND IMMEDIATELY START SUBOXONE OR SUBUTEX!!! THIS CANNOT BE DONE WITH METHADONE UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES!!  TRANSITIONING FROM METH TO SUB IS NOTHING CLOSE TO OR SIMILAR TO A TRANSITION FROM OXIES, VIKES OR PERCS!!.  AND 12 HOURS IS NOT A LONG ENOUGH TIME SPAN BETWEEN THE 2 DRUGS..or you will be more sick than you could ever imagine. if you want to do this then you have to toughen up and know that you will experience some discomfort for a few days...you can do this IF you really want it...plenty of others have successfully done this. but...you have to want this and there is no other way to do it unless your ready for 30+ days of hellish cold turkey???, this is your choice to make. you have been provided with ALOT  of very good information here...also go to   www dot suboxone dot com    and do some research on your own...you can never have too much information... and you do not get high from taking suboxone or subutex either, some have said they feel "funny", but not high...this is not true, and definately 100% not   true if your a methadone patient switching over to the sub...people who claim they get high from it, is because they are also taking benzos along with it, which in some cases is called misuse of the sub...i take benzos , BUT, i make sure to take them at different times so this does not happen...it is a commitment that i made and am sticking to it...and if you want this,,,you can do it too.

the only reason suboxone differs from subutex is that suboxone has naloxone in it..the naloxone will do nothing to you, it is put in there to hinder the ability for IV drug users solely. it is only "activated "if you plan on shooting it into your veins in an attempt to get high ...other than that, this should not be a concern for you...unless you are an IV drug user?  and as far as if you take more than prescribed dose, doesnt metter...sub has what they call a "ceiling effect", which means it can only help you so much...taking more does not give you a different feeling than your prescribed dose...for instance...once you have found your dose (say your dose is 12mgs daily) and you know this is what dose works best for you, then you think "well if i take24mgs, then i will REALLY feel better"  it doesnt work like that...i feel no different at 10mgs, than when i was on the full 32mgs...that is the ceiling effect...
and most likely, if you do decide to do this...you will most likely have to increase your dose to the max amount (32 mgs) for a few weeks to keep combatting the methadone that is left in your system. i was on the full 32 mgs for 5 weeks...taperd down to 10 mgs with NO PROBLEMS where i will stay until i am better emotionally and have my toolbox full and ready to fight the addiction on my own without the sub..

if you have anymore questions about transition from methadone to suboxone...please feel free to e-mail me if you want to speak privately, my e-mail address is in my profile. and i will do what i can to help you with this decision as far as making sure you are informed correctly... IF you decide to do it...i could go on...but i'm tired...i do have more information i could share about my experience, but will have to do so another time...i hope you get the help you deserve...you will not be alone in this if you decide to do it...e-mail me ANYTIME...XXOO

[jessica555]

I DO want this sooo bad!  But I am soooooo scared of the horrible pain...not discomfort, but pain I go thru in withdrawl.  I am not sure what everyone else feels but I feel like I am dying of a HORRIBLE disease and I just want to kill myself during w/d.  It is the worst thing I have EVER experienced!  I really do, do want this so bad but am really scared.  I just wish there was a more HUMANE way to go than to go to hell and back.  I have heard HORROR stories about the suboxone for people that switched from methadone.  I have heard of them being extremely sick that they had boils on their skin from taking scaulding HOT baths and had bowl of vomit etc...etc.  My fear is keeping me from the life I want to live. I just want all of this to be over with......

[wait2long]

those are horror stories...but remember your on a low dose...which is rare...your chances of succeeding with this are greatly improved just because of that alone...stop being scared...we are all afraid of WD's...but its not going to be like what your hearing or expecting...you are thinking the worst, and it is preventing you from getting better...this is the only thing you can do other than cold turkey...and that my friend is a neverending pain you dont want to experience....if you want this...then stop thinking of the "what if's" and just do it...2 -3 days of feeling "a little under the weather" is nothing compared to a lifetime of taking methadone....and like i said before there are things that can be done to help with WD's...

[jessica555]

Thanks for the push!  You are right....I am at such a low dose of methadone....that hopefully my experienc would be a little bit easier.  I have an appt. with the Buprenorphine Dr on next Tues.  I just hope & pray I can keep my appt. and go thru w/it.  I keep saying just let me get a lil' bit lower on my daily dose of methadone, and then it should be that much easier right?  I dunno, some people say as long as you are under 20mg it doesnt matter what mg you are at...its all the same.  So why prolong the agony I am going through now decreasing my dose 5mg every week.  The last 2 months have been pretty bad.  Thanks again!

[wait2long]

1 minute you are so afraid of being sick for 2-3 days to start the sub...and now your going to do a taper? and i think i also read that you have now decided to go cold turkey?  i guess i dont get it...maybe use the sub for a 3-5 week detox?  i am confused to where you are in your decision or what you have decided to do...scared to death of being sick for 2-3 days and now your not afraid of cold turkey?  sorry, i am just confused...either way...i wish you the best in which ever way you decide to do this..and nothing but success to your future in being addiction free...keep on posting and asking...there are alot of very supportive people here who can help you.

[wait2long]

just a suggestion...i think 5 mg reduction per week is too fast...i would do 5 mgs every 4 weeks....then on your last 5 mgs...drop 1 mg every other week...??? just a suggestion.

[jessica555]

Sorry, I never meant I was going to do the cold turkey thing.  I dont have the courage to go through all the pain. I am just tapering off of the methadone....trying to get under 10mg then start the suboxone treatment.  I could NEVER do cold turkey.  I have had to go 1 full day w/o anything and it was the worst HELL I have ever been through.  NEVER again!!!!  Thanks for the support!

[jessica555]

I think you thought because I have to go 48 hrs without any methadone you thought I was going cold turkey.....this is the DRs orders.  He said before I could start the suboxone I had to be in moderate to severe withdrawals.  That really sux!

[KL581]

I was takind 80mg of meth every day and some percocet on top of that, I decided I had enough so I waited 16 hours and took an 8mg of sub.....that didn't work so I took another 8. The bottom line is i've been through some teeible withdrawls but it hasn't been bad. I'm irritable and can't focus and stuff but i'm not laying on the floor pukin It's only been like the third day and I want to go back to getting high cause its easier but I can't I have kids.

[8FTnHOLLOW]

I was on 180mg of methadone and wanted to switch back to suboxone (i originally switched from suboxone to methadone because honestly i got bored with it, yeah, i'm an addict). I got sick of having to drive 45 minutes to daytona to stand in line for 30 minutes every morning with some of the roughest looking people I have ever seen. Plus 14 bucks a day gets expensive, plus 15 dollars in gas, i was spending 29 dollars a day, even though I made it up to four takeouts, which i would just shoot them and be short and have to make like 50 mg work for 2 days anyway. Anyway, i got sick of methadone and went to the dr to get back on suboxone just to get a semi normal life back. Everything I read was you have get down to 30mg or less before even thinking about it so I figured he would write me a script for methadone in decreasing doses (like other dr's have in the past) until 30 then switch. nope. 180mg and he said ok you took your last dose this morning before you came here, wait 72 hours and take up 32mg of the suboxone. ok. I even waited 96 hours and thought i was in the worst withdrawal of my life so I was like **** now or never. BAD IDEA. I went into INSTANT VIOLENT withdrawal for 4 hours rolling around on the ground because i couldn't sit still, having convulsions, throwing up, sweating my *** off but freezing cold, absolutely worse than any withdrawal I've ever had (and I shot 3-4 grams of heroin a day for 2 years) until i called him and he called in 2mg xanax and clonidine. i had to take 10mg of xanax and 4 of the .1mg clonidine to put me to sleep for 6 hours until waking up again to the same withdrawal, so again took the xaxax and clonidine and slept it off until the next morning. The suboxone finally wore off and i was just back to regular withdrawal. The dr said the naloxone should have gotten all of the methadone out since i took 40mg of suboxone trying to just force through it. So the next day I took 24mg of suboxone and it didnt put me in withdrawal but it sure didn't help very much. If i ever go back to methadone (which i probably won't) or to anyone who is at a high dose like I was, my suggestion is either buy enough dope for 3-5 days to get the methadone out of your system or convince your dr to give you subutex, but they are hesitant to since you can inject it and get "high", if you wanna call it that. I dont care if you have been clean for 20 years on methadone, if you're gonna switch to suboxone and your on a super high dose, easiest way to do it is use for a couple days, as bad as that sounds. I went straight from 3-4 grams of dope a day straight to suboxone no problem what so ever. I hope this helps someone not make the HORRIBLE mistake I did.