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Is this mind over matter?
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Is this mind over matter?

I'm now missing my 2nd day of work b/c of no lortabs left. I need to get through the w/d part before facing reality again, but no way in the world can i put myself into a hospital (which is probably what i need to do). I hope to God that I can face going in tomorrow. Thankfully, I have a great friend at work who knows exactly what I'm going through. Funny thing is with this LT addiction, I'm trying to convince myself that it's just a mental addiction. I once took a pill out of my purse and put it in my pocket,and forgot to take it. Wouldn't you know that 20-30 min. later, I felt a little High??!! I wish somehow that i could pop a tic-tac and mentally think it was an LT. That was just a one time event, but right then and there is when I realized that just the "thought" of taking one gets me a little rush. Yesterday I took 2, and I have one left, which I will probably take today,I'm guessing. That's a big cut from the usual 6 to 9 that i take a day. I can't taper at all. Yeah, so I made 3 LTs last 2 days, but that's not the appropriate way to taper. Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks!
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If you're not in medical danger (like seizure) I would just quit; to me, tapering (and going from 8 to 2 is more than just tapering) is very painful - I mean that literally.  You have to constantly exercise self-control and that's pretty damn hard once the w/d really sets in.  So you have this incredibly strong person (an addict??) holding it for you.  Hmmm.

Why drag it out? 8 to 2 is making you sick right?  My guess is that as soon as the 2 wear off you will be sick until you take the next 2 the next day.  So you're going to feel sick until you completely quit and get it over with.

I hope I don't sound judgemental. I don't mean to at all.  If I had a friend who would give me some, I don't think I could turn it down.  (That reminds me, how can she honestly be an addict and give her pills away.  I would NEVER do that if I was using.  I would lie and say I was out, too. Duh.)

But I feel better this afternoon than I did this morning.  Honestly.  And I'm thinking it's only going to get better from here.  Can you say that about tapering?
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I reread my post and don't like the preachy tone of it.  I just want to say that I am talking only about tapering versus cold turkey.  Like Pixi said (she's obviously nicer than me) it's your decision, no hating ourselves (or others).
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I went out for theraflu but decided against it because it has antihistimine and decongestant and both of those have given me terrible RLS before.

But here's the funny part:  I feel embarrased looking for all this "recipe" stuff.  I'm thinking, why is this more embarrrassing than the things I did to get drugs?  Doesn't that seem ironic.

Now here's something I feel guilty about:  I had a few close-calls in traffic.  I must have had these before and not been aware of it.  And with a child in the backseat.  It can be hard not to hate myself for some of the chances I've taken.  I don't; I just wanted to get it off my chest.

Here's a good thing about being clean:  I was sociable with people and afterwards I wasn't asking myself if I had acted like an idiot.  Tomorow I have a teacher conference and I am thrilled that I don't have to hope she doesn't notice my eyes.

Thanks
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Avatar_n_tn
No need to regret sounding preacher like. I know that the cold turkey thing is probably a better choice, but the thought of never having a lortab again could send me spinning into orbit mentally. I don't know if i'm ready to deal with that now with the other issues I have going on in life. But i appreciate your input. This site was a blessing for me. Good luck to all on your next day w/out. I'm not sure what i'm going to do now. Taper or not? That is the question.
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Sorry you cant take the theraflu,it really helps me although I dont even need it tonight.You already sound so much better.I know what you mean,when I asked the pharmacist about tyrosine, he acted like I was asking for oxy or something.Must have been my guilty concience.Keep up the good work.We can all do this together.
To everyone else,Thank You,Thank You Thank You.You are all an inspiration whether you are using or not.

There is a beautiful site that i go to when I feel up,down or in between It has meditative applets with soothing music among other things.Just type in Ishaahs inspirations.I hope everyone has a peaceful night.
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Hello. I'm new here; found the site thru a google search for "quitting hydrocodone". And what a nice place it is! It's great to find some tangible evidence that I'm not the only one with shakes, aches, cramps, fatigue, blah. I'm finishing up day 2 of CT, coming off prolly 60-100mg of hydro a day for about a year and a half. I'd been thinking about getting off it for a while now...but something (usually a fresh scrip) always came up. Oh, it started out so innocently! Whee! A friend of mine, who has a shady doctor, was prescribed Lortab 10's pretty much whenever for a bad back. And one day, I'm all like, "yo, can I have a couple of those?"

The **** just sneaks up, man. We'd go grocery shopping, and I'd pop a couple. They made everything so...interesting! No more than two at a time, four in a day, max. Back then, my tolerance was nice and low, and if I took more, I'd be hurling like mad. Eventually, you discover that if you take some Dramamine along with your pills, it cuts the vertigo and nausea to nil without killing the "wow!" of it all. Then, for a while, it becomes a normal part of your life. The "dude!...I'm ****** up!" part goes away, and being high is just a part of your daily routine. You wake up everyday, dose yourself, and go to work. Repeat dosage when some work-related incident pisses you off. Frusturation melts away. You do your job, you do it well, you make the tall dollars, you're high as **** the whole time, and *nobody knows!*

I think hydrocodone stuck me because it's the only thing I've ever tried (and I'd been looking for years, believe me) that would **** me up enough to make life tolerable, without ******* me up so much that I was unable to function effectively. Benzos? Can't think straight. Speed? Gotta sleep sometime! Pot? Waaay too much paranoia. The pills, though, man, they were absolutely perfect. Specially once you graduate to the hand-compounded 15/100 capsules. (I live in a small town that has a pharmacy that actually still makes its own pills).

Anyhow, eventually, for whatever reason, the supply isn't as steady, I've started to run out for more than a day at a time, and the **** I think about when I'm out begins to get kinda creepy! Your heart starts to race when you walk past a pharmacy. Those lucky, lucky techs! Gawd, if I worked there, I'd be in heaven. Maybe I could stick it up...

You know, **** like that. Not really serious, but enough to make you shiver and ask yourself, "am I...an addict?"

Hell yes. And I'm one of the lucky ones, judging from some of the habits I've read about on this board. Some of the battles that have been fought and won by the residents here make my w/d look like a walk in the park. And knowing that others have the strength to fight and crush demons far bigger than mine gives *me* strength.

God, I'm tired. I feel like HELL. I need to go to bed, but the thought of waking up and heading to work without...you know...just beats me down like a ton of bricks. If I sleep, the the morning will come too soon. This SUCKS, sweet merciful **** this ******* sucks.

But anyhow. Sorry for carrying on, I'm usually quite shy. Thanks for reading, thanks for the support, and here's hoping I can get to a place where I can start giving back to this neat-o community.

-c
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Avatar_n_tn
Well you said a mouth full.Welcome to our little part of
cyberspace.We are all addicts of some kind as you can tell.
Come join the fun.Life is only beginning for you,that is once that little demon,mindfuckingames start to hit ya!Sounds like you know it all to well.Post as often and as long as you like,hell they can't get rid of me here.Remember to just post where you like.There isn't enough threads for everyone to post their own,so just break in one and tell us all about that nasty Hydro habit you have.I only say that because I to have been down
this road before.Once again,welcome.
                               bmac
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Day 2 was way worse than day 3 which I am finishing now.  Today has been up and down but all in all, much better than yesterday.  There's tons of w/d advice here and the things I've tried have helped alot: vitamins (recipe), long hot showers (I don't have a tub), and at night (only at night) I'm taking benzos.

BTW, how do you totally chem-free people sleep at night during your first few days???  The restlessness drives me nuts until I take enough other stuff to pass out.
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Crunch. WOW what a post. Couldn't be more right on with the "ideal" drug.
I thought the same way. Wow, I can get f^%#$% and go to work, go shopping, ect. No problem, its prescribed, and I am in pain. Then you take more, more......

You will find alot of support and answers here. Way to JUMP right in. Your post pretty much summed it up for alot of people.
Chezz
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To you question. WE DONT.
Just jokin around. Withdrawls are different for everybody. I haven't had it at all this time. No going back now.

I remember a couple years ago when it happened(RLS). I was up all night, legs still going in the morning. Try to walk to make em feel better. Nothing helped. And the whole time I had no idea it had anything to do with the medicine. When I didn't have any more pain, I just stopped taking them. I didn't know about w/ds or anything.

I hope it gets better for you.
Chezz
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Keep thinking that it is mental.Because the physical part will past and you will be left with the mental addiction we all have/had.As for the pill in the pocket.I remember going to the RX and just paying for them,I felt that buzz.Take a couple and before they hit my stomach I was mentally high already.That's that mindgame thing I have talked about before.It is so true that
addiction is 99% mental and 1% physical.You know that a week of physically feeling bad will go away especially when you use the
Famous Thomas recipe.That will give you back the vitamins and
minerals your body needs.When the mental thing gets to you
come here and tell us,cry,scream,yell,do what you need to
get better.That's why we are all here.You are not alone.
Welcome to addiction!!!It sux sometimes but it can teach you
something also.
                         bmac
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So are you saying that the mental part will never go away? Dear God, then I'll go write up a prescription now and stay on them for crying out loud!! I'm nothing but a bundle of nerves right now, and the thought of facing work tomorrow w/out them is making it worse. I guess it's the anticipation of getting on w/out them. I feel like i need to just do it,and stop thinking about how bad i may feel. Maybe it won't be that bad, but so far I haven't had too bad of the physical w/d, just the pacing of my apartment, and bouncing knee while sitting here typing. Hey, what is that recipe that everyone is talking about? I was looking through a bunch of comments, but i couldn't find it. Thanks for replying bmac!
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No the mental part won't last forever.I am on day 41 and the mental part is now to a minimum.As for the recipe it is listed below by hippy under the post the recipe plus sept 30.It will
help more than you can ever know.It gives you back your HEALTH.Something drug abuse steals from you.If you still can't find it,ask for it someone will list it again.It gets listed atleast once a week.I bought all of it at my local GNC store
and it was $29.00 total.Get it and start it now.It will help with
that mental **** as well as the physical.Also hot baths,walks
anything to get your body and mind off of addiction.
Hippy,Skipper and JSmith02 are the ones that led me to the recipe and it works.Hang tuff and don't let your mind tell you you can't do this.I am a very weak person and I beat this
so you can't be any weaker than I was.When things get tuff,post.
As many times and as long of a post as necessary.We are here to help you.You are not alone for a minute.Find that recipe.
                              bmac
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How I feel for you. I tried this weekend to stop, well I was out of Pills (that would be Norco's) My last one was on Friday morning, I was taking about 1000 to 1200 mgs. a day. By Sunday I was in the ER I told them what I had done, What they did was horrible, The gave me a shot of morphine and sent my body into a whirl, the Dr. had no clue, he then prescribed me twenty Norco's and told me to get help. I will tell you the withdrawls are horrible, I could not take it, I have an appt with my P.C. Dr. today hopefully she will help. I have read this forum for the past month and it has given me the courage to stop. I know I can do it, I was even thinking of a Detox center. Thanks for letting me get this out. Wish me luck!!
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Good luck to you Laura. The more that I am reading this, the more I see that my addiction isn't as bad as many others out there, and I just need to bite the bullet and get this shitty thing over with. I'm sorry that you had a bad experience at the ER. What are Norcos anyway? I really am feeling like I am going to end up getting more lortabs today, and I just want to be done with them already!! I want to be back to the person I was before I ever started using them. I'm 30 yrs old, and I know I could have a great future,but these are controlling ,my every move. I should do what you're doing, and go to my PCP, but I work at the medical facility that my Dr. is at, and I don't want my co-workers to see the diagnosis listed in the computer as some sort of drug dependency.  Feeling a little trapped at this moment, but with all the support on here, I'm thinking that I can do this. Good luck again, and thanks for responding.

Steph
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I am on day 3. I have done this before but it is worse this time.  I still had the RLS last night.  I took 1mg of xanax and a trazadone and then slept but had a hard time getting up this morning to get my daughter to school.  Now I'd like to go back to bed but am trying not to.

I am totally alone - no one knows.

In the past, the mental part did really get much, much better.  I just enjoyed the clarity so much.  But then something always happens to trigger severe pain (bad discs) and I can't resist some pain relief, which always goes too far...

I have never been to a detox place, but know people who have.  I am skeptical that they are somewhat just out for money.  People seem to go back over and over again.  If insurance pays or you can afford it, maybe it's easier that way.  But I just see people relapse just as much as those who do it at home.  Just my .02.

Does the recipe really work for the RLS?  That is my worst problem right now.

Thanks for listening.  I hope some one will reply.
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Thanks for the Wish, trust me I need it. Norco's are a hydrocodone 10mg's/325 pain killer, i graduated to them because the vicodin 5/500 gave me headaches. Be careful on the Lortabs, even though you feel you have it under control, taking even 3 a day for an extended amount of time can cause sddiction with bad w/d's.  I know how you feel, it has taken me two years before I told my husband, who has never had any controlled substance in his life. He wants me to get help, but in this little town you have to BEG. Be honest with you PC He/she can help. and you should do it soon. once your all the way gone, it amazing how manipulative  one can be. Good luck to you Steph, and keep me posted.

Laura
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Laura, I am happy that you are finally seeking help from us and your doctors to get off the pills. Like you, I had a habit the size of Texas, I was taking over 1000 mg of oxycodone a day, which is even stronger than Norco! With a big habit like we have, we should be in the care of a doctor while withdrawing. There are plenty of good doctors out there who understand this disease and the process of withdrawing from painkillers, and can really help us by giving us meds and monitoring our progress. Also, we then feel we are accountable to someone other than ourselves and the wonderful people on this forum to go through with it, and get clean. Even though I don't post that often, people like BMAC and Synderella and Jessesarpy and others have really been an inspiration to me. People are out there struggling with the same things you are, feeling lonely and alienated. Don't rush recovery, take it at your own speed. Don't expect to feel perfect the day you decide to stop, but just hang in there for the process. Sobriety is a wonderful goal to strive for, and unlike Norcos which take everything and give less and less euphoria, sobriety is the gift that keeps on giving. We no longer have to live secretely, ashamed of punishing our bodies and our souls and the souls of everyone around us, and no matter what happens, you are taking the first step by coming here. Congratulations!
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For me day 3 and 4 are the true hump of the physical stuff, so take heart you are at the worst of it now it will only get better and that is the turth!!!

Jsmith02 gave me some good advice once on the leg thing.  Try taking  calcium (sp).  I am not sure exactly why this works, but it worked for me, and I looked like I was trying to be a rocket at night in bed.  Also, you have probably noticed that your legs seem to hurt.  The best thing during this time of your w/d is to take HOT baths or HOT showers.  Don't knock it until you have tried it, I can not over state how much better you feel during and after.  Once you are past the bad part of the physical stuff, then I added just some small leg exercises at night.  

Just think you are not going to feel any worse physically than you are right now, and I take it you are not using right now, so if you can make it through the worst part, I believe you will have the strengh to go on ... Your victory is certain just the date has yet to be set...

God Bless
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You sound better yourself!I hope so.Being straight is a wonderful thing.The body is a great thing,it heals it's self.
Given time that is!Let us know how you are too.

Laura 34,
The first steps are the hardest to deal with,The physical part ends in a week or two.The mental part is up yo you.If ever I or
anyone here can help you,post on any thread.Because of the limits on new threads we must just post where we can.Don't be afraid to say the things that you need to say.What you are going thru hurts mentally and physically.We know this,we are either going thru it or have gone thru it.There is nothing you could say that hasn't already been said before here.So post on and
keep us informed on your journey!!
                      bmac
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This thread has been very inspiring today.

I did take a long hot shower and it helped for a bit.  And I went to the store and got some of the vitamins (including calcium).  I'm drinking tea to try to stay warm.

But I STILL FEEL LIKE S$%@!

I need to make some business calls and stuff but I just can't.  I can't even open my e-mail.

Day 3 was never this bad before.

Is it because of the other stuff I took last night?  1mg xanax (I don't use this all the time) and trazadone.  I've got klonapin; should I try that tonight instead?

I also took Wellbutrin today. And plain tylenol and advil.

Do you can see, I'm taking everything EXCEPT the thing I really want.
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The rls is the worst part of all this.The theraflu really seems to help me if I take it at night after the most important thing (a hot bath) This is day 4 and I am feeling better this afternoon than I did this morning.Every hour is better .I keep thinking about all of the things I can do now that I couldnt do while using.I was always afraid to leave town,for fear I would run out of pills..always afraid to run out no matter how many I had.Always afraid in general.Try to think of all the good things that will come from your decision to stop.Keep posting,it helps to get it out.

pixi
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You and I must be just sitting with our computers doing our withdrawl (withdrawal) and not much else today, huh;-)
Dammit, I forgot to get theraflu when I went out.  If I can make it out again, I will get some.
I do think of the the things that are better without narcs.  One really good thing is my vision is SO much better.  This might not be an issue for those under age 40 but it's huge for me.  While using, I can barely see at all in low light.  On the other hand, I got a good look at myself in the mirror this morning and it wasn't pretty, as they say.
Thanks for the encouragement.  I hope my day 4 will be better, like yours.
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I think we're all at the puter going through the w/d thing. As i read more and more, I am seeing that I AM going to get through this. Coming to this forum is the very best thing that i ever could have done. You are all so very understanding and supportive. I'd love to exchange emails sometime if you'd like. Tomorrow is day 3, and I'm feeling 100% better right now than I did this morning. It's a LOT to do with coming here. But, tomorrow is also back to reality....back to work. I was lucky enough to have understand co-workers that allowed me to have the past 2 days off. That will be the real test. I have a couple back-up lortabs around the corner from my office if i need them tomorrow, but i'm very connfident that i won't (at this moment, at least). Think of how great we are all going to feel when we don't have to worry about where the next pill is, and will we have enough to get through the day or week ? It's HELL....actually living my life around my next refill, and planning out how long it will last me. Then the depression of taking a pill and realizing...****, that's one less pill that I have now. It really messes with the mind, aye? Well, i'm on here while i'm in some sort of a natural high, and don't ask me how,but a lot has to do with support and knowing i'm not alone. Take care all and hope the next day is better!

Steph
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Reading your post really brings back to me what day 3 and 4 were actually like.  I am not a very strong person sometimes so If I can make I know you two will.  I wish there was some way to reach out and make it better faster.  I know hearing how great things are going to be sometimes sounds hollow when you feel like hell, but in less than 24-48 hours you will start to get the first taste of life again.  All I can say is that if I can do anything just ask, and say one last time you are closer to the end than the beginning - hang in there - you are waiting for yourself just around the corner...

Rob
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You said 'you are waiting for yourself just around the corner'.
Man I know that feeling.You are soooo right.As the light at the end on the tunnel starts getting brighter,you finally see yourself standing there waiting on yourself.That makes alot of sense to me.Good post!!
                            bmac
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Im not an expert on quitting,I just wanted to tell you not to feel like a failure.Everyone has to quit when they are ready.You know better than anyone whether you can stick to a taper.I really couldnt do that myself.You should do whatever is best for you and not feel ashamed.Keep posting,it will give you strength and courage.I hope someone with more knowledge than me will answer your question.Dont ever let the slipups cost you your desire and will to quit.

pixi
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I don't know if cold turkey is a better choice, I just think that in the long run, it's less pain.  For me tapering put me in constant pain, so that seems like a waste of the pills.  You have to do it so, so gradually if you don't want it to be painful.  I know your addict friend is helping you, so maybe that will make it easier, but aren't you already sick?

I just don't have the wearwithall to open a full bottle (that alone is so thrilling) and say I'm only going to take x number of these today.  Well, I might say that, but I wouldn't stick to it.

Isn't tapering going to cause you to play these tortuous mind games for longer than it would take to do a cold turkey w/d?

Another option might be to taper till the weekend or whenever your next 2 days off are and then do it.

Beleive me, I'm not trying to push you.
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OK, here's the deal...I've taken 2 pills today, and 2 yesterday. I'm thinking that's still a huge improvement from 7,8,or 9 a day,right??!! I'm feeling a little like a failure, but I know that I can do it. Tell me if this is the right thing to do or not. My friend,who is also addicted,but not ready to quit yet, said she'll give me 2 a day, so that i don't go throught such bad w/d. After 2 weeks, it will lessen down to 1/day. After I've licked the whole dilemna, she swears she will start quitting (oxymoron,right?). I'm just wondreing if that's a good idea or not. Should I just stop cold turkey? Someone please share some advice. Thanks
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Thank you all for your support.Just reading the posts of others is what finally gave me the courage to quit this viscious cycle.All of you should feel good knowing how many people you are helping here.How is that for a natural high?This evening I finally know I am going to make it.To those who havent reached day 4 yet.This is the aha i can do it day!So hang in hang on and i'll keep praying for us all.Thanks again,I think this place saved my sanity......
PS
If day 4 is not the aha day,wait till day 5 or whatever it takes.Im going to call day 4 hump day lol and i am truly laughing for the first time in days!

pixi
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Wow crunch....I felt like I was reading my own life on this screen here. I'm a pretty big LT user as well, but again, seeing what other people have had to struggle with, my situation is nothing. SO, is this mind over matter? I've asked the ? a 1,000 times today. Now it's 2:30 and i still can't sleep. have to get up at 4:30 to be to work by 6.....terrified of doing it. I know that i'll end up taking 2 pills at work, there's no way i can imagine getting trough the day. I'll take cincee's advice and try not taking at all on the weekend. My mind is racing in every direction imaginable tonight. Insomnia sooooo bad. I'll have to start taking a sleep aid, but I don't want to get another addiction to those either. We'll see what happens. Welcome to our addict community. I'm new too, but i feel right at home here. Good luck with your fight crunch.

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I used Bonine while self detoxing from alcohol. It is an over the counter travel sickness med that really makes me sleep. I still would wake up frequently during the night even in spite of taking so much Klonopin each day. I at least got some hours of sleep. Otherwise I would not have slept at all.

Bonine I believe is stonger than Dramamine a similar anti-nausea, anti-vertigo drug. Watch out for the benzos for sleep as they are additive for many people and some of the most dangerous drugs to detox from without in-patient care. That's unavaiable here, and expensive wherever it is offered.

chatahan
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Thanks for the kind words... I know that you are further along on the clean time than I.  I am 29 days now.  I am going to try and ask you a few questions about dealing with things (such as doctors) during recovery.  I want to keep everything positive, and not to suggest in any way that being finally free is not a truely great feeling.  It is just that there are things that I have to deal with that are challanges almost everyday.

I know this is rambling, and I will try to put a better question out soon...

Rob
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Your post was awesome.  It was very well-written, descriptive to a "T", and was a true representation of addiction, in a nutshell.  I'll give you an A all the way... I hope you keep posting and sharing 'cause it's helpful for you and for us.  Welcome!!!
         Peaz

P.S. By the way--I was one of those "lucky, lucky techs" and it WAS  fabulous for over two years, unfortunately.  The inevitable **** hit the fan, and here I am.  The only lucky  aspect now is that I'm in recovery and not in jail.
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Ask on.I am only ahead of you because I started sooner.
If you need, here's my email.
             ***@****
                                 bmac
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Greetings All,
I have been lurking in this forum for about a month.  What a
great discovery and believe me, I need it.

Crunch, your post was almost like a carbon copy of the last
four years of my life.  I am so embarrased and feel like such a loser, yet I am not.  I am young, everyone tells me I am gorgeous, and I have a great family and high paying professional
job.  I say this not to blow my own horn but because deep inside
I know I am a junkie and I have a different mental picture of what that is, and it is not at all attractive or successful.  I
have never had issues with alcohol, have tried pot and coke(but
this was back when I was very young and it did nothing for me so
I never did it again).  There were some catalysts that I feel brought this to the surface, although the blame lies totally in
me.  My 16 year old son passed away April 14, 2002.  The horror
of that experience is uncommunicable but we are coping.  He had
health issues that required constant care from my husband and myself.  We adored our son and always will but the pressures mounted, at least I felt that way, as one of the caregivers.  My
son hurt his leg and had a prescription for LT and he could not take them due to vomiting.  There they were and I thought one night - "You know, I am exausted and this says it may cause drowsiness.  If the Dr. didn't feel it was too strong for him then I think I'll just take a couple and see if I can get a good nights sleep."  Well, the euphoria was such that slowly I would take one in the daytime and then two, and so on, all the while I was never walking around in a drug induced haze.  I finally felt GREAT again and had the energy to do all that I needed to do and smile while I was doing it.  What a lift.  Get up, go to work, come home, wife it, Mom it, take care of my son's health issues,
and be involved in my other sons activities.  EVERYTHING had a
warm glow around it and I felt a joy I had not felt in I could not remember when.  Well, everything goes along and over time the stress gets greater and the tolerance gets higher, and you all know the drill.  It is never really an issue to get an RX from a doctor if you have back, head, etc. pain.  But after loosing my son I really plummeted because now it takes alot more to give me that feeling of warm fuzziness.  About 100 mg
a day.  And let me add, if you met me you would NEVER know this was going on.  I am working, always have, running a home, taking care of my appearance, etc.  I just have to get up, take dose,
start the day, and the rest is history.  The feeling of joy when I open a new bottle - I thought I was the only nut who felt that
way.  I can't think of ANYTHING I would rather get as a gift than some extras.  "Would you like a million dollars or a bottle of 1000 10's.  I'd take then 10"s and never blink an eye and I
PROMISE you I would not give one away.  The panic when I run out, the depression, the worrying about my next RX, the feeling of envy as I pass a pharmacy, looking in peoples cabinets when I am a guest in their home and taking any if I find them.....it goes on and on.  I have shared this with no one but felt I would
be respected in here.  I hope I am right because just typing this is making me want to vomit.  It's the oddest thing, innocently you start out trying to get a little boost and before you know it there isn't even a boost anymore, now I just need them to feel like I felt normally - before I ever started taking them.  I went to my Dr. a couple of weeks ago and she gave me my last RX with 3 refills.  I told her that I would not be back in for a year and she does not phone in refills.  I am going to finish these and go cold turkey.  I know I sound like a wuss but I cannot do it when I have refills.  I just can't - period.  I want to get out of this vise grip.  Everything I do revolves around if I have them.  Can't leave town w/o them, can't go out with friends, etc, etc, because I think I won't have a good time.
I hate to wake up when I know I don't have them and I almost dread taking them because I am 1 pill closer to being out.  I
appreciate you all listening.  Your stories have inspired me.  I know I will get through this as I have gotten thru alot.  Do you know when I realized this thing was a monster?  After my son died and my heart was crushed beyond belief and as the days and weeks went by I found myself waking up with the horror of being out of pills hitting me before the horror of being without my son, who I adored.  Just saying that sentence has opened a flood gate of tears because it would appear that I feel a pill is more
important than my son and God knows I do not.  Maybe only a true addict can understand.  I still am amazed that I am able to fool
people but that cannot go on forever.  Please give me some guidance.  Love and respect to you all....I really do understand
everything you all have posted.
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I am truly sorry about your son.I know how that can change life.I too lost my stepdaughter to a terrible death and now I have her daughter and I and my wife are raising her as our daughter.My wife went thru all you have said about your having to deal with life after such an experience and I really feel for you.It is the hardest thing to deal with,the losing of a child.
No one could ever understand until they walk in those shoes.
As for your habit,You can beat it and you know that.But it won't
be easy.But because of what you have been thru nothing will ever be as hard as that.Just keep posting and let it all out.We will
be here for you whenever you need someone  .Welcome.              Bmac
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I am sorry about you son. I am speachless. I can't imagine the pain. It is almost too much for me.
You will find support, answers, and compassion here. I hope you will keep posting.....Its the 1st step.
Chezz
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First an most importantly do not beat yourself up over this.  You have been through a lot, which means that you are a strong person.  

You are not alone in your situation: I am a middle aged man with a wife at home a daughter in private school and a good job.  I was also hoplessly addicted for 3+ years ( I have been off the tussonex for over 29 days now).  You go along nobody knows in fact I raised my income significantly during this time. There are a few milestones that are hard to miss.  The first is the day you finally admit to yourself that you have a monkey on your back ( I named my Mr. Gingles since we were going to be spending so much close and personal time together).  I can't speak for anyone else, but that was not even close to the day I decided to stop, but a good chunck of ole self esteem takes a hike.  I continued on unabaited (sp) for another year.  Then the next big milestone hit.  I'm going to stop, I am a grown man, how bad can it be.. By day 3 of the w/d I would have hacked up a lung in a doctors office to get the script.  Then I began a fun journey all on my own because I was to afraid to tell anybody.  That was a roller coaster of Kick the habit...habit kicks me...kick the habit..habit kicks me.  This is when the last remaining bit of my self esteem decided to pack up an go.  The last milestone is a very personal one: something or someone makes you decide to say enough.  

For me I was lucky, I told my family about the problem and they didn't leave in fact they have been very supportive.  I found this fourm which was/is invaluable in dealing with every aspect of addiction from using/withdrawls/recovery.  I also started seeing a phycologist who handles substance abuse issues.  Please believe me I just wanted you to know that you are NOT ALONE.  The fact that you are here says alot about where you are and where you want to be. There are people here who know tons more than I on the subject of tapering.  I could never taper.  Since you have some refills you could taper and It will help the w/d's, but like I said I could no more taper than pull a rabbit out of my butt.  I am willing to help in whatever way I can.  I wanted to show you how similar our situations are.  I think you want help, please let someone -- anyone help share the enormous burden.  I will pray for you in whatever you decide to do.

Rob
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I could never imagine your pain. You are very welcome here. We all share a common thread... addiction that covers more deeply rooted problems. I still have no idea what I have been hiding from while I abused Lorcet. You actually may be one step ahead of many of us. I am a little over 5 days clean at a simular usage level to your hydro. After reading the threads on this site for a couple of months I asked my wife to throw away my last script of 10/650... more than 50 pills. If you want to get clean you will find awesome support on this site. It is a tough, emotional rollercoaster getting clean. I hope you have support from friends and family. Good luck to you...
Goldenbear
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Welcome to the forum. It is funny how similar your story is to many others' on this forum, that they had never been involved in any type of drug abuse or any deviance whatsoever until they picked up their first vicodin or lortab. Growing up in New York City, I was introduced to drugs and addiction before I really even got started in life. So many of my friends became addicts so young, at sixteen and seventeen, and to drugs like heroin and crystal methamphetamine. Friends of mine whose parents had no idea how to love them or take care of them. Who let their kids loose in New York City at eleven years old. For me, my father was a crack addict, and I knew I had the addictive gene. Even when I went to boarding school, and studied and kept on the straight and narrow, I always knew that my curiosity would get the best of me. All I thought I wanted from life was to come to Hollywood, get a great high-paying job with a producer, and live the life of the rich and snobby. When I came out here, and my dreams came true, I became so alienated and despondant that I turned to opiates. Vicodin and oxycontin were prescribed to me as often as I wanted by a "psychiatrist to the stars". He just gave me whatever I wanted. Finally, I found something to fill that great big hole inside me. I could get loaded all the time, and work and deal with the superficial actors and directors whom I couldn't stand normally. It was like I had been gone all my life and I just came home. I moved on to heroin and dilaudid, and my habit reached the out-of-control phase. And now, finally taking steps to get clean, I have my pride back, and my life back, but that hole is also back. No matter what I do, exercise, women, sports, TV, movies whatever, nothing fills that hole quite like the opiates. And I love to get high. An addict to my marrow. But in the end, at 22 years old, I can't waste anymore time. You can't get high forever. And in the end, you are just delaying living your life. It will still be there when you come back. So whether you decide to quit cold turkey now, or after your three refills, you still have to go through the pain, and learn how to live again. We all have problems living. Drugs are not the problem, they are only a symptom. A symptom of a disorder that makes it harder for us to accept life on its own terms. But don't be afraid to learn...its worth it.
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Just reading your post nearly brought me to tears.I have a 13yr old son and cant imagine the horror of losing a child.Dont ever think that you cared about hydro more than your son.Those little pills reach out and demand our every waking thought to the exclusion of everyone and everyone else.I too have been through countless medicine cabinets looking for those devils,always feeling guilty after i used all of someone elses meds.shame doesnt even begin to describe what I felt!Today is 5 days without for me.It's been hard but I want to like myself again.you have made the first step sharing your secret here.I havent been here long but the support Ive gotten has made really been the major factor in my success so far.I will be praying for you and hoping you yake that leap soon.

pixi
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For what it's worth...

May I make a statement here...

YOU created that life; and although it was lost so tragically, the soul lives on and watches you. He sees YOUR pain with this addiction to the Hydros. You are NOT alone. Your addiction may, or may not continue- however HIS love does continue, and GOD's love for you goes ON and ON. You see this forum isn't just a bunch of "Junkies"-- OUR COMPASSION IS THE SUM of that that does EXPRESS the HIGHER POWER'S love for you.

You will start to see that You and I (All of us) ARE that power, and it can bring healing to you.

Breathless prayer
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Hey Doll---If there ws any way I could crash through the computer and give you a hug, I would.... I can relate to SO much of your post; the successful, efficient,"have-it-all together" facade that has fooled so many people for so long...NO ONE--no friends, family or co-workers knew of my addiction, which made it all the harder to 'fess up about it.  So I ask you--is there anyone you can unload this on? Your spouse, best friend, or someone? You need love and support, and you need to get out from under the grueling burden of secrecy that haunts you.  I cannot even imagine what it is like to lose a child.  I feel so badly for you.  I know you took the best care of him that you could, so you need not feel guilty about that.  No one is judging you, so try not to be so hard on yourself. Love yourself enough to try and put the drugs down for good.  You have come to the right place!!  We will take you under our wings and guide you the whole way.   Please post more and let us help you come up w/ a plan.  Hang in there.    Peaz
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just a test
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Sorry about the test, tried posting like four times and kept getting errors....Anyway.
Amazing, I knew I wasnt the only one but geez, there are alot of us. Anyway, seems like all of us started in about the same place except for the last few post (again, sorry about your loss). I to am a young professional sharing most, maybe all of your WD symptoms. This is truly a vicious cycle but so much fun its hard to let go. Deep down you know its not right but oh how easy it is to get through the day and then sail through the evening. My work seems to benefit, my relationship, and quality of life is great. My only fear is that one day I will get cutoff and then where will I be (Maybe for the best). I know this is a patient to patient thread so I am hoping for some advice. My doc continues to Rx me every 21 days or so for 100 count norco. He mentioned something about a triplicket form. Does this mean that he will give me a script without having to call each time? At which point does the doctor patient interegation end (He makes me feel like a drug addict each time I see him). Secondly, he prescribed Neurontin, what is this stuff? Does it get you high or is it a placebo? Cheers all
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Sorry to kill your buzz as you put it. But it sounds like your doc has already cut you off. Neurontin is an anti-depresant as far as I remember.
Hopefully someone will have more info tomorrow.
Chezz
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neuronton is med they give to seizure pateints.I used it for two months before I had surgery.Pain docs find it helps kill pain and it is safe as far as I know.It did help with me for awhile.I was taking norco's and neuronton also.I will give you alittle advice if I may.If you are taking 100 norco's every 21 days you have a problem.That is alot of hydro and tylenol.Even though it only contains 325 mgs of tyl that is alot of it.Liver damage from accessive use will kill you.Doctors will keep on prescribing narcotics to you as long as you act under their rules.That's how the make their money but I guess you already know this.You are going down a road you will regret unless you
do some about taking so much norco.100 every 21 days is way too much hydro,don't ever just stop cold turkey from such a habit.
Maybe that's why your doc put you on neuronton.If he intends to cut you off,you need to start tapering now.Don't set yourself up for a terrible time my friend,that is a hell of alot of norco's
Believe me I know about this drug,I was on it for 3 years and had that endless supply.Be careful.
                             bmac
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Thank you all so much for your kind and loving words.  The acceptance literally "hugged" me from the screen.  I went to
church last night-for those of you who don't know that is a
very common practice here in the deep south-and I asked God to
please help lead me toward the best way to emancipate myself
from this hell.  I could not wait to get here this morning to
see what the response to my post would be.  I could not have
been more encouraged.  I know this is just the begining but at
least it is a step towards a future without this noose around
my neck.  I will post some more of my deepest feelings when I
get a break later today, I just had to put a quick one out to
you guys to say thank you and let you know that I have not felt
this positive in a LONG time.  Please do pray for me and I will
pray for all of you.  Much love and respect to each of you.
Cat(That's my real name).
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Yea it's not so bad when you say 5 aday.I use to get 90 a month and I thought it wasn't so bad either.I think what I should have said was do you take as directed or do you abuse them?
I took 8 aday for 3 months and switched to oxycotin for awhile.
That was scarey because you can really abuse those.Well I hope you stay good with whatever you do.It's a mindgame anyway,
                      peace,
                        bmac
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Funny you should say that, I actually called my doc and told him I was taking the higher dosage, his response... Ah thats not that bad. Dont worry about it. Crazy how easy they can make it. 100 pills over a 20 day period is only 5 a day. Is that really something to be concerned about? I feel that if I wanted to quit I could, in fact I stopped all together for about a week just to test. Day 1-3 was hard but after that no problems. Exercising and hot tubs truly help. thanks for the advice
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md, I agree. I was pretty surprised too. that 50mg aday. Not too bad.

Something in your post earlier made me think your doc might cut you off.

The triplekit is a form they have to use to prescribe Schedule 2 narcotics. One goes to the DEA. They keep tabs on that stuff. She/he might be getting nervous or just tired of the "pill count". In other words, how many they are prescribing a month total.
Chezz
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One question: If you're the hydro queen, and I'm the hydro king, why haven't we met?

I guess you can take both comfort and horror from the fact that your story is about as normal and predictable as they come.

If you're resolved to quit, you've got two choices: addiction specialist (recommend you keep him off your med insurance, though) or self-detox. If you use an addiction guy, you're detox may be easier. But as I said, keep his name off your insurance records and use a different pharmacy or pharmacy chain. Once his name is on your pharmacy records, you won't be able to use them for controlled drugs again. Same caution with insurance: Having substance abuse treatment on your record can affect a lot of things down the line. For example, many if not all states will deny you long term disability (possibly any disability) if you've been treated for substance abuse in the last 10 years.

Self-detox is a lot more confidential. If you're trying to quit for the first time, your chances for lasting success, to be honest, are slim. And remember, you already cut yourself off at your current doc's. You may need another one. Some addicts think that by confessing to everyone in sight, they're making it more likely they will successfully quit. Rarely is this so. It just means you'll be forced underground if you relapse.

Also, you sound like the kind of person who would get strength and reassurance at an AA meeting. It will help you to meet and be accepted by people just like you (read us, O Queen). The spiritual side of AA will work for you, too, me thinks. I recommend AA over NA. NA can be pretty hardcore in several respects. You may get an unwed mother begging you for a place to stay, or an NA zealot that want's to beat the **** out of you for saying something off the party line. AA is, frankly, more coherent, more optimistic. Besides, most drunks also pop anything they can get their hands on, so you're in the right place afterall.

For what it's worth, here's a do-it-yourself recipe for home opiate detox (The Home Game of Hydro Addiction). Sorry for any extraneous question marks, the system translates Word doc apostrophes into ?'s. Good luck. If you want, I can be reached at ***@****.

Thomas

Thomas Detox Recipe

This recipe is designed for cold turkey opiate detox. It assumes that you can get about 5 to 7 days away from your job or household responsibilities during which you can sleep, veg and act as miserable as you feel. Opiate WD mimics the symptoms of the common flu, so, if you need a smokescreen, hide behind a bad case of the flu.

If you can't take time off to detox, I recommend you follow a taper regimen using your drug of choice or suitable alternate -- the slower the taper, the better.

You'll need:

1. Valium (or another benzodiazepine such as Klonopin, Librium, Ativan or Xanax). Of these, Valium and Klonopin are best suited for tapering since they come in tablet form. Librium is also an excellent detox benzo, but comes in capsules, making it hard to taper the dose. Ativan or Xanax should only be used if you can't get one of the others.

2. Imodium (immodium) (over the counter, any drug or grocery store).

3. L-Tyrosine (500 mg caps) from the health food store.

4. Strong wide-spectrum mineral supplement with at least 100% RDA of Zinc, Phosphorus, Copper and Magnesium.

5. Vitamin B6 caps.

6. Access to hot baths or a Jacuzzi (or hot showers if that's all that's available).

How to use the recipe:

Begin your detox with regular doses of Valium (or alternate benzo). Start with a dose high enough to produce sleep. Before you use any benzo, make sure you're aware of how often it can be safely taken. Different benzos have different dosing schedules. Taper your Valium dosage down after each day. The goal is to get through day 4, after which the worst WD symptoms will subside. You shouldn't need the Valium after day 4 or 5.

During detox, hit the hot bath or Jacuzzi as often as you need to for muscle aches. Don't underestimate the effectiveness of hot soaks. Spend the entire time, if necessary, in a hot bath. This simple method will alleviate what is for many the worst opiate WD symptom.

Use the Imodium (immodium) aggressively to stop the runs. Take as much as you need, as often as you need it. Don't take it, however, if you don't need it.

At the end of the fourth day, you should be waking up from the Valium and experiencing the beginnings of the opiate WD malaise. Upon rising (empty stomach), take the L-Tyrosine. Try 2000 mgs, and scale up or down, depending on how you feel. You can take up to 4,000 mgs. Take the L-Tyrosine with B6 to help absorption. Wait about one hour before eating breakfast. The L-Tyrosine will give you a surge of physical and mental energy that will help counteract the malaise. You may continue to take it each morning for as long as it helps. If you find it gives you the "coffee jitters," consider lowering the dosage or discontinuing it altogether. Occasionally, L-Tyrosine can cause the runs. Unlike the runs from opiate WD, however, this effect of L-Tyrosine is mild and normally does not return after the first hour. Lowering the dosage may help.

With breakfast, take the mineral supplement.

As soon as you can force yourself to, get some mild exercise such as walking, cycling, swimming, etc. This will be hard at first, but will make you feel considerably better.

PLEASE NOTE: If you have any medical complications, first check with your doctor before detoxing to verify that this regimen is safe for you.
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Well, the script says up to 4 a day or as needed. The problem is that I take them for Pain and for Recreation. Stopped for two days and let me tell you it was hell. Is there anything you can recommend to ease the WD symtoms (symptoms) until the physical portion is over with. I think I will be able to  handle the mental part....
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